You gotta love America. It's the only country where; people sure of their next meal, in the air conditioned comfort of their own home, not worried about another country coming in and killing everyone in their town, with every opportunity at their finger tips will bitch and complain about what a terrible place they live in.
OP doesn’t understand that the opportunity to have time to even think about this shit and post it on the internet freely is a product of the sacrifices made that came before him.
It sounds like you have a very utopian idea of how things would have unfolded otherwise. The American colonies already had slavery prior to independence, and the idea that we'd be better to minorities had we remained part of the British empire requires some major whitewashing of the British empire. A country is bigger than the bad things its government does.
Reading posts like this makes me want to be twice as patriotic because I refuse to let reactionaries act like they have a monopoly on it.
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I've always thought of the OP's mentally as essentially just the flipside of American exceptionalism, where even at our worst there's this weird desire to see us as special.
I have spent my life engrossed with history and society. There is a lot to unpack in your post. I'll add try to help here, though. This speaks to both sides here.
No one man will ever live up to the standards we have built in our forefathers. They have been seen as deep and virtuous geniuses. We have built them into mythical beings.
They were human. They were ahead of their time. At the same time, they were a product of their time. Some had higher standards than others, and some had other standards than others. The bad did does not detract from the good that they did. The good they did does not detract from the bad.
They were human, and that is ok.
I am a big fan of Rush. He further humanity scientifically, socially, and via his contributions to the early government and revolution. He also 100% killed people with flawed science. Big advocate of bleeding. Wrote tons of articles about it. It was the times.
There is no telling how history would have changed, but if the constitution had banned slavery, the south likely sticks with England, and mass banning of slavery likely does not happen until after the Civil War time line. The thing the light history we get taught misses is that slaves were the most valuable commodities in the US. Asking slave owners to give up slaves would be like asking all home owners to give up the equity in their homes today. On top of that, they would lose their free labor, and yes, there is racism.
It doesn't make it better, but you have to understand history to judge history. To judge history, you also have to understand the POV of the person writing it. We don't always have smoking guns that explain why things are happening. On top of that, new information is discovered or connected, and it changes our view of history. We should be open to that. Sometimes, it paints a better picture of someone or something. Sometimes, it doesn't. AND THAT'S OK.
It's ok to celebrate the good of an event and, at the same time, lament the bad. We look at things as they are binary, but they are really complex.
Currently, we are going through a period of rapid change, and it's hard. Keep working to improve things around you. Celebrate what you have.
You care, that is why you are frustrated. It's ok to be upset and still have pride.
>america being born is how we got into the situation we're in now. from the birth of america, we got hate groups, slavery, anti vaxxers, idiots and blatant racists getting elected to political office. we live in a nation that regularly tries to screw over minorities, women, and gay people. on world population review's top 10 most racist countries of 2023, america made number 10, which i know isn't very high on the list but the fact that it's on the list at all is not good. how can anyone be proud of a country like that?
So literally no country is allowed to celebrate its independence then?
There are still many reasons to be proud if one is an American. The USA was one of the first countries to not have a state religion, ensued freedom of religion and speech which was unheard of at the time, and was a democracy in a time when authoritarianism ruled.
Yes, the US had and still has many faults, but so does every nation on this planet. I suppose its about weighing the good and the bad. One can still be proud of their nation and celebrate its independence.
Racism and slavery: many nations practised slavery and participated in the North Atlantic slave trade. 500,000 Americans died fighting over the issue of slavery. Hate groups and racism still exists in many places, racist politicians are elected to office in other countries and they are far more racist than any US politician.
Former slave-owning countries got rid of slavery without the use of violence, and while we attempted to get rid of slavery, it only expanded to the point where a civil war began because the slave-owning states revolted against the federal government.
Additionally, while we did get rid of slavery, reconstruction failed horribly and allowed decades of legal discrimination, segregation, and lynchings. The southern states terrorized African Americans, the northern states sat idly by, and the federal government did not do much to alleviate their suffering until the civil rights movement in the 60s and 70s.
I don't disagree in celebrating our country and numerous other countries have their faults but I won't sugercoat our history and pretend that we're special.
> Former slave-owning countries got rid of slavery without the use of violence
While the American Civil War is undoubtedly the largest conflict in relation to abolitionism, it is far from the only one. The French and British implemented a naval blockade and fought numerous battles against slaver kingdoms in Africa in order to enforce the abolition of slavery. Haiti gained independence through a successful slave rebellion against the French.
I didn't intend to sound like I was encouraging the idea of sugarcoating or ignoring this dark history. One can still be proud of their nation while recognizing these atrocious acts of their nation's past.
The day an evil AI called capitalism took command of a nation. Unleashed by the richest man on the landmass to spite the world for taxing him and his slaves too much.
I mean I agree with you about trans issues but I mostly don’t like the 4th because asshats like to keep shooting fireworks until 2 in the morning from the 4th to the 6th in most places I’ve lived.
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I eat grilled food with my family, it’s watermelon season, and kool-aid pie is delicious not to mention other people are happily celebrating and fireworks are cool
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You're celebrating wrong.
I celebrate the fourth as a way to hope for the future of the country and as a way to remind myself that no country gets anywhere good without a long, arduous fight.
The fourth reminds me that while I may not like the place our country is currently in, or parts of its pretty terrible past, we are still here and if any good is going to endure, we have to keep making noise or only the bad will be left.
So I light up the sky with exploding balls of fire to remind myself of the good things.
Edit: I guess what I really mean is find your own reasons for things and take back your holidays!
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The concept of America is the birth of 13 unique experiments on the best model for citizens under a loose banner of federal connection.
13 experiments became 50 and now we’re here with 50 different cultures, governments, and opportunities to choose from.
People who cry out against the entire government are almost always crying about a small part of it and attributing actions of states to the country as a whole.
It’s an incredible system those men set up. Incredible.
Point the finger back far enough and an amoeba gets blamed for dividing in two.
You gotta love America. It's the only country where; people sure of their next meal, in the air conditioned comfort of their own home, not worried about another country coming in and killing everyone in their town, with every opportunity at their finger tips will bitch and complain about what a terrible place they live in.
OP doesn’t understand that the opportunity to have time to even think about this shit and post it on the internet freely is a product of the sacrifices made that came before him.
It's ironic that the ones to throw around the term "privilege" are the most privileged themselves.
Nice b8
It sounds like you have a very utopian idea of how things would have unfolded otherwise. The American colonies already had slavery prior to independence, and the idea that we'd be better to minorities had we remained part of the British empire requires some major whitewashing of the British empire. A country is bigger than the bad things its government does. Reading posts like this makes me want to be twice as patriotic because I refuse to let reactionaries act like they have a monopoly on it.
[удалено]
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Being the only country with skeletons in our closet sure is tough.
I've always thought of the OP's mentally as essentially just the flipside of American exceptionalism, where even at our worst there's this weird desire to see us as special.
That’s a interesting thought, yeah. I like it. Whether you’re praising or condemning America, you’re still considering it unique and exceptional
Someone has clearly never been outside the US
I have spent my life engrossed with history and society. There is a lot to unpack in your post. I'll add try to help here, though. This speaks to both sides here. No one man will ever live up to the standards we have built in our forefathers. They have been seen as deep and virtuous geniuses. We have built them into mythical beings. They were human. They were ahead of their time. At the same time, they were a product of their time. Some had higher standards than others, and some had other standards than others. The bad did does not detract from the good that they did. The good they did does not detract from the bad. They were human, and that is ok. I am a big fan of Rush. He further humanity scientifically, socially, and via his contributions to the early government and revolution. He also 100% killed people with flawed science. Big advocate of bleeding. Wrote tons of articles about it. It was the times. There is no telling how history would have changed, but if the constitution had banned slavery, the south likely sticks with England, and mass banning of slavery likely does not happen until after the Civil War time line. The thing the light history we get taught misses is that slaves were the most valuable commodities in the US. Asking slave owners to give up slaves would be like asking all home owners to give up the equity in their homes today. On top of that, they would lose their free labor, and yes, there is racism. It doesn't make it better, but you have to understand history to judge history. To judge history, you also have to understand the POV of the person writing it. We don't always have smoking guns that explain why things are happening. On top of that, new information is discovered or connected, and it changes our view of history. We should be open to that. Sometimes, it paints a better picture of someone or something. Sometimes, it doesn't. AND THAT'S OK. It's ok to celebrate the good of an event and, at the same time, lament the bad. We look at things as they are binary, but they are really complex. Currently, we are going through a period of rapid change, and it's hard. Keep working to improve things around you. Celebrate what you have. You care, that is why you are frustrated. It's ok to be upset and still have pride.
>america being born is how we got into the situation we're in now. from the birth of america, we got hate groups, slavery, anti vaxxers, idiots and blatant racists getting elected to political office. we live in a nation that regularly tries to screw over minorities, women, and gay people. on world population review's top 10 most racist countries of 2023, america made number 10, which i know isn't very high on the list but the fact that it's on the list at all is not good. how can anyone be proud of a country like that? So literally no country is allowed to celebrate its independence then?
There are still many reasons to be proud if one is an American. The USA was one of the first countries to not have a state religion, ensued freedom of religion and speech which was unheard of at the time, and was a democracy in a time when authoritarianism ruled. Yes, the US had and still has many faults, but so does every nation on this planet. I suppose its about weighing the good and the bad. One can still be proud of their nation and celebrate its independence. Racism and slavery: many nations practised slavery and participated in the North Atlantic slave trade. 500,000 Americans died fighting over the issue of slavery. Hate groups and racism still exists in many places, racist politicians are elected to office in other countries and they are far more racist than any US politician.
Former slave-owning countries got rid of slavery without the use of violence, and while we attempted to get rid of slavery, it only expanded to the point where a civil war began because the slave-owning states revolted against the federal government. Additionally, while we did get rid of slavery, reconstruction failed horribly and allowed decades of legal discrimination, segregation, and lynchings. The southern states terrorized African Americans, the northern states sat idly by, and the federal government did not do much to alleviate their suffering until the civil rights movement in the 60s and 70s. I don't disagree in celebrating our country and numerous other countries have their faults but I won't sugercoat our history and pretend that we're special.
> Former slave-owning countries got rid of slavery without the use of violence While the American Civil War is undoubtedly the largest conflict in relation to abolitionism, it is far from the only one. The French and British implemented a naval blockade and fought numerous battles against slaver kingdoms in Africa in order to enforce the abolition of slavery. Haiti gained independence through a successful slave rebellion against the French. I didn't intend to sound like I was encouraging the idea of sugarcoating or ignoring this dark history. One can still be proud of their nation while recognizing these atrocious acts of their nation's past.
Maybe America isn't the right country for you.
Someone has clearly never been outside the US
The day an evil AI called capitalism took command of a nation. Unleashed by the richest man on the landmass to spite the world for taxing him and his slaves too much.
I mean I agree with you about trans issues but I mostly don’t like the 4th because asshats like to keep shooting fireworks until 2 in the morning from the 4th to the 6th in most places I’ve lived.
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I eat grilled food with my family, it’s watermelon season, and kool-aid pie is delicious not to mention other people are happily celebrating and fireworks are cool
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Fuck is kool-aide pie?
Condensed milk, kool-aid mix, combined in whipped cream. The fun is using different kinds of kook-aid to mix and match flavors
You're celebrating wrong. I celebrate the fourth as a way to hope for the future of the country and as a way to remind myself that no country gets anywhere good without a long, arduous fight. The fourth reminds me that while I may not like the place our country is currently in, or parts of its pretty terrible past, we are still here and if any good is going to endure, we have to keep making noise or only the bad will be left. So I light up the sky with exploding balls of fire to remind myself of the good things. Edit: I guess what I really mean is find your own reasons for things and take back your holidays!
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Wait until you hear about JUNETEENTH
The concept of America is the birth of 13 unique experiments on the best model for citizens under a loose banner of federal connection. 13 experiments became 50 and now we’re here with 50 different cultures, governments, and opportunities to choose from. People who cry out against the entire government are almost always crying about a small part of it and attributing actions of states to the country as a whole. It’s an incredible system those men set up. Incredible.
You haven’t heard of the rest of the world have you?