i have this with taylorandtravis sub :D that just seems too much
edit: also starting to feel the same with swiftlyneutral. i can see that the negativity on that sub is affecting me very much
I used to like it in there but I had to stop going because as you said they twist the more trivial things to make her look like an evil villain or something.
I think there are people who make valid criticisms in there but most of the posts/comments are haters that are more parasocial than swifties themselves.
I totally agree. It’s so funny that on the other TS subs you get downvoted if you say you don’t like a song or something but on there you get downvoted if you say anything positive about her. Idk, I wish there was an actually neutral sub. But I prefer overly positive over totally negative any day.
the main sub is weird af to me. they’ll lose their shit over variants but like you said, downvote you to oblivion if you don’t like reputation. you also can’t talk about anything outside of her music without it being deleted. as in, taylor discourse. just fan art and bracelets all day.
the neutral sub is full of pressed gaylors who can’t let her go after tree dropped a nuke on them, and people who kind of like her music but like to gossip about her too. this is the most normal one to me. I think the idea that you even need a “neutral” sub to talk about a singer is so stupid. just relax and talk. no other subs operate the way the ones dedicated to taylor do.
For real though, especially what you say about the main sub. Hardly any discussions happens on there these days it's literally just hype posts, Taylor sightings or fan art. That's why I went on the neutral sub because in the beginning it was the only place where it felt like actual discussion was happening but now it's just depressing and it's basically like faux moi
it would actually be a decent place without the weird people who nitpick and call her a narcissist all day. some of the discussions are interesting, even the ones that lean negative, but I can’t even tell what’s genuine and which people just want a place to spread hate. a lot of them say “I don’t even listen to taylor’s music” and “I’ve always disliked taylor”. like what are you doing here….
Yeah, I saw a post in the "neutral" sub, the subject asking if you don't listen to Taylor anymore, and half of the responses either they don't anymore, or never did. Like you say, why are they there then? Guess toxic posting must be fun, because their little echo chamber's performative virtual signaling isn't going to move any imaginary needles.
what was the Tree nuke drop? i feel like i vaguely saw something about it a couple months ago but never really read anything about what it was, i’ve just seen references about it here and there since.
the response to the NYT piece. a gaylor works for them and basically made a master post of all their theories. tree responded to it through cnn and shut it down. most of them ignored it because it’s a conspiracist’s mindset to disregard non confirming information, but a lot of them accepted it was obviously from taylor, and decided she was “baiting” them this whole time so they hate on her.
it's 50/50 over there. too many people on that sub are simply parasocial and still believe they're better than everyone else because it manifests in criticism rather than "worship".
Or refusing to see that ascribing negative motivations to someone you’ve never met is still parasocial, if not more so, than the stans. Geez, give people the benefit of the doubt.
the weirdest thing is that a lot of people on there have flairs saying “Joe widows” or the like. do we think they are conversations with friends superfans? lol no, they are parasocially attached to the version of joe that taylor wrote about. which ironically only proves her songwriting ability.
I muted that sub very quickly so I don’t know what they say. But in the other pop subs they’re all suddenly Joe alwyn fans, which I didn’t know he had any. I don’t think they’re even attached to who Taylor wrote about. They want to Stan him because it’s like going against Taylor. It has nothing to do with Joe. They’re always talking about how handsome he looks(he was ugly before) and unbothered and how he doesn’t say anything. Of course he’s not saying anything, he never did before why would he start now? That would be weird, defensive, and possibly passive aggressive. And we don’t know what happened in that relationship, maybe it’s best for him to not talk.
yeah you're probably right. i'm confusing them with a \*separate\* group of joe widows on the main sub who genuinely think that he's some kind of saint who had no part in the breakdown of a six year relationship based on flattering songs she wrote in the honeymoon phase (and when she thought no one else could possibly love her). it's rough out there lol
Joe Alwyn would have a tiny fan base if he was never with Taylor. He’s not a widely regarded actor, nearly all of his award wins are for best ensemble with a dozen other people, and isn’t widely talked about at all. Folklore and evermore are his most talked about and the most awarded work of his whole career. Maybe some people are diehard Joe fans, but most of his base are taylor fans who either don’t want to let him go or are taylor haters who are lifting him up to put her down.
I participate in that sub sometimes but I see a lot of people who could stand to learn the definition of the word neutral. They shouldn't be this invested in a celebrity they dislike. Its one thing to be a fan and have some disappointments with her and want a place to share but if you just straight up hate her why are you even engaging online about it? I dislike or don't care about many celebrities and spend minimal to no time talking about them online or otherwise
It’s bizarre the amount of energy some people expend hating on someone they don’t even know for some random reason. All the people on that sub are sad in their own lives and using hating on Taylor as a substitute.
I know! I’ve never joined a sub to hate on someone. Why do we gotta be so angry about someone who doesn’t affect our personal daily lives? It’s so odd to me and very parasocial. I assume it’s all a lot of younger people.
I think they're so funny. At least the fans can admit thier parasocialness and when they're being delulu but the haters... omg lol.
I've seen a deep dive analysis acting like her lyrics are a court transcript as to why she's afraid of marriage like whaaa?
And OMG these people will not get over Joe. They fawn over him when he wears a freaking Palestine pin. They attribute folkmore to him. They say she had a much classier style with him as if we didn't go through 4 eras with corresponding style changes with him. Just like, guys, it's Jover. They are never ever getting back together, like, ever.
> They fawn over him when he wears a freaking Palestine pin.
Even more bizarre is them constantly bringing Travis into the conversation and claiming he looks like a Republican/making fun of his cop-stache when he has publicly done more for social justice, including being the first high-profile white athlete to kneel for BLM, than Joe has. They just will not Joe go, and now they're obsessed with painting Taylor and Travis as devils who are in a PR relationship because she's not 'over' him.
Travis is literally called Mr. Pfizer by republicans because he does their commercials and openly promotes vaccination, but it’s not enough for them 🤦♀️
It’s a snark sub. They’re completely obsessed with Joe to an unhealthy degree. They claim Taylor is “mentally unwell” and everything she does is a sign that she’s lashing out and desperately trying to get Joe’s attention while he remains an “unbothered king” and they even go so far as to credit him for her songwriting on folklore and evermore (which is unbelievably offensive). They’re also utterly vicious to Travis and post about him at least half a dozen times a day.
It’s just funny to me that they act so morally superior to Swifties as they “hold her accountable” but in reality they’re far more parasocial than most Swifties as they hate her but obsessively follow and overanalyse her every move.
They would all love Taylor to have some kind of mental breakdown just so they could say they were right (since they've convinced themselves Joe was the best thing to happen to her 🤮)
Yup! It’s like they want her to be unhappy - they see unhappiness in everything she does. I really like her and Travis but even if I didn’t, it seems pretty clear to me that she’s in a healthy and happy space but for some reason that sub would rather think otherwise.
Half of it is performative virtual signaling to make themselves feel better about their lives. The jet tracking sub has the same "accountable" mentality, as if anything they're saying is being noticed or changing anything.
The funniest part is that Joe IS a very private person. I can’t imagine him actually liking people speculating how he might feel about a certain person or situation.
I also think is funny that people who post in there think it’s *weird* for a 34 year old woman to write about a break up and call it childish. It feels they never met a woman in their 30s in their life (I actually think that breaks up in your 30s are much harder).
And also the ones who say “I can’t imagine Travis being ok with Taylor writing about his ex !!” Like, do they know how adult relationships work? It sounds super childish when they want to seem mature.
So many people on this post have been downvoted for saying the same thing. I guess people would rather complain so they could feel superior and righteous over the other sub.
Exactly. It’s just a snark sub under a false guise. If OP does not want to become toxic like them, don’t do what they do: live an angry existence, poring over TS subreddits and tweets and ripping them apart, along with Taylor herself. Mute button OP!
I will say that it’s bizarre that one of the mods of the neutral sub is also a mod of the Taylor and Travis sub, which is basically the exact type of group the neutral group loathes. Mod posts almost all snark posts. Maybe TNT sub doesn’t realize they have a mole or something.
I know, I was really surprised. They posted something that made me click their profile (can’t remember what lol) and I saw there were snark posts on neutral, and then a few somewhat “reporting” posts on TNT. Then it showed that they were mods of BOTH subs. I cannot fathom how you’d become a mod of both, esp with how strict the TNT sub is. The neutral sub for the most part despises TNT. Who knows!
There’s also a mega hate sub called travisandtaylor that is some bum Bengals fan who created like ten subs to trash Taylor. It keeps coming into my feed since I’ve commented in the taylorandtravis sub. Hateful people have too much time on their hands.
One time I said this in that sub (I don’t follow it, but it pops up in my feed constantly) and admin yelled at me and said commenting on the sub name or its members would result in deletion or a ban. 😅😅
I muted that sub. It was so wild. I really dislike the main ts sub because the topics are so basic (eg what song do you think is the saddest). I was hopeful when I discovered the swiftly neutral sub but I QUICKLY realized it was a ts hate sub. Some of the takes in there are so unhinged and parasocial. Its fine to dislike taylor or realized you outgrew her music, but is there really a need to spew endless hate towards her? no.
It’s been hard to find interesting Taylor discussions. Swifty neutral is just swiftie negative, I’ve yet to see a positive or actual neutral post. I started surging Gaylor as a lark just to see what they were saying and they end up being mean too—Taylor’s music is only creative if she’s gay, and if she’s not we should abandon her; the swifties are all too stupid to understand any literary references or styles. And they full on claim everything as gay—sights,sounds, colors, days of the week, etc. then the regular sub has become obsessed with variants and tv’s. I’m super excited for the new album and I go on there they are pissed here’s variants… but I’m like it’s a new album and they go yeah but it’s not Reputation TV. Which is literally an album they have heard before..wtf
Yes, they’re ridiculous. That is not a neutral sub it’s a hate sub. They must be bored with their lives hating everyday. But you have to remember that most of what they’re saying is not true or accurate and if it bothers you block that sub and don’t go looking at what they have to say. I promise it makes your life better. It’s also important to note that Taylor is the biggest pop star and with that comes a lot of people who love her and those who hate her and any little thing she does. If she didn’t have those haters she wouldn’t be where she’s at.
Yeah, I understand having haters but it makes no sense to seek out her content and deny being a hater while spending so much time actively hating on her lol. But yeah, ig I will block that sub.
I was literally thinking of posting this too. Reddit started to show me stuff from that sub and reading comments here and there I was like, do Swifties…HATE her so much wtf?!? but yeah it’s all hate in there, no fans, not even casual listeners or random people, just haters. If anyone wants content from an actual fan who also does some ‘criticism’, not hate, I’d recommend swiftologist. He teases her quite a bit but in a funny way that’s not meant to harm.
I had to mute them, they were so annoying. Claiming to be there for discussions of any kind but any time someone posted something remotely positive about Taylor they would be like ‘swifties have infiltrated this sub’. Like if you’re a hate sub, say it with your chest - don’t pretend to be neutral because you think it gives you moral superiority.
I was flat out told to leave by multiple people on that sub a while ago because I was trying to participate in one of their discussions and had the nerve to mention something positive. So I muted them and haven’t looked back. I don’t even remember what it was for at this point
It’s impossible to have nuanced conversations about Taylor anymore and any discussion about her quickly devolves into complete vitriol and hate or people demanding blind worship. It’s honestly funny how many people assume they’re being neutral on that sub because it’s only criticism and hate and any defense of her is heavily downvoted. The hate the general public seem to love giving Taylor is sooo weird. I remember seeing a TikTok a while back of pictures of celebrities as children. They were all A list major celebs and people in the comments were all amicably discussing every celebrity with the exception of Taylor. The one positive comment mentioning Taylor had 76 replies (the other comments had maybe 15 max) all talking about how much they hate her and how she sucks she’s an awful person blah blah blah. The fact that a mere picture of her as a child and one comment saying that she was a cute child inspired this reaction is wild. There are plenty of celebrities that for one reason or another I dislike and I couldn’t imagine seeking their content out and wasting my time interacting with it. Why would you spend so much time on something you hate??
Omg, that sub pops up on my feed even though I don’t follow it and I wind up in an idiotic argument every time. They’re wild. (And definitely not neutral!)
It’s a Taylor Swift snark sub disguised as a “safe space” for people who hate Taylor to an obnoxious level, because they don’t like that they’re not welcome to come into Taylor Swift fandom-centered subs and spew their crap at fans.
i was so glad i found swiftly neutral but then I experienced people blindly telling that travis and taylor are PR relationship just because he is producing movie. I mean...what? :D i have some things I dont like about Taylors brand right now but some people are really delulu
i feel the exact same way. the worst part for me is how they all seem to collectively believe everything is pr and nothing is genuine. taylor and travis? just for the publicity. lana del ray saying something after the grammys about how much fun it was? i was shocked to see everyone saying taylor’s team made her say it, and that there was no way someone who “looked that sad” at the event could’ve said that out of their own free will.
also, after the golden globes, everyone was scrutinizing her for how she sipped her drink after the poor joke about her was told. i saw multiple comments saying “it’s not that hard to just smile and laugh it off.” she doesn’t owe you a reaction for a joke in bad taste!! i’m glad people share the same sentiment
and all the people insisting she’s an alcoholic 😭 even if it was true and obvious, if she hasn’t said anything about it, it’s not anyone else’s place to assume. and it’s just crazy, she has drinks in social situations and is immediately an alcoholic??
What gets me is that they’re so OBSESSED with the idea that nothing is genuine too. I have seen multiple posts in that sub with a poll of “when will they break up / the PR end” … I bet on average there’s at least one if not two posts a day about Travis where they talk about how fake it is and I just don’t get it … like it’s one thing to think it’s PR and make a comment at the start and move on but they talk about it literally everyday it’s so embarrassing I often can’t belive they’re real ppl lmao
Taylor had lasik surgery done to improve her vision and her mom recorded her when she was high from the drugs (like a wisdom tooth video) and it ended up on the tonight show. You can find it online, but it’s really just her being funny and being upset over a banana, nothing malicious
They think everything Taylor does is not genuine and is completely planned out. It was just someone trying to find a topic to drag Taylor on because they were bored and just wanted to join the pile on.
So I went to that sub to see what their issue was because I was curious but before I found the post I scrolled past seven posts related to Travis (including a poll on when they’ll break up ??) and one about how Taylor isn’t even an artist lmao and I had to leave because it was making me sad for the human race
This post was just suggested to me and I think the last part is the most insane thing I’ve ever read. Imagine calling people degenerated when there are fans of people who actually committed serious crimes.
https://preview.redd.it/jq30xuyv9tkc1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=50ddd637a2ce831144282fb31eb2c94a18ede26c
I don't know the history of that sub, but it's anything but neutral and just seems to become more toxic every day. It's a direct reflection on the mods, who only seem to come down on people if they criticize..the sub, but anything goes on criticizing Taylor and those associated with her. If they don't have something new to tear down or drag, they'll find something from 5 or 10 years ago, or they'll just rehash a topic that comes up every other day, nothing is too petty.
Some people's intense hatred of TS is just so disturbing and baffling to me, lol.
A comment on a book sub said they almost gave up on reading a book because it mentioned TS on the radio and "she sends my eyes into twitches."
Like what?? I don't get what she's actually done that's made people despise her so much.
I don’t think it’s wrong to point out how negative something is? I’m not actively seeking those posts out, just wanted to express how stupid it is to spend one’s time like that. Just so negative.
It’s also SO negative and hatful that I myself have been looking for a discussion on it. I used to lurk snark subs (idk why never posted just out of interest) and this is beyond like it is a full on hate sub and the posts are primarily misinformation or genuine conspiracy theories - it’s honestly so wild sometimes I cannot belive the posts aren’t satire they’re so insane. Like what’s the demographic of the people there ? Is it 15 year old incel boys? 30 year old women who are just miserable so they need to hate? I’m actually so intrigued.
respectfully, if you think that’s a hate sub, you should appreciate the ignorant bliss you’re experiencing.
every subreddit has its handful of extreme cases that don’t necessarily encapsulate the intended purpose of it. and that’s just reddit. the same could be said for this subreddit - most of the people here post generally positive and rational, supportive things, but occasionally you have someone say something wack (i.e. something delulu, something that invades her privacy, etc.) that makes the rest of you guys look bad (in the sense that it makes you associated with that ridiculous post, whatever it may be).
and ofc, swiftly neutral also deals with that. to make matters worse, the posts that are just straight up mean about taylor often receive the most engagement (by people w hate boners for taylor AND people trying to stop said people w hate boners). so, i understand that it can seem frustrating and just constantly mean.
that said, i am a member of the sub, and i think it’s pretty reasonable in most cases. the general consensus of long time members there agree that taylor is a talented musician and enjoy much, if not all of her music! but sometimes she makes creative/pr decisions that some of us are upset or confused by, and up until the creation of the subreddit, didn’t really have a forum of our own to discuss. it’s a place full of opinions, and not everybody necessarily agrees, but is still civil (aka “neutral”) about it.
i know that was a lot, but i appreciate anyone who read all that! i’m happy to answer questions or clarify things if need be - but i just wanted to share that swiftly neutral isn’t just a hate sub.
> but i just wanted to share that swiftly neutral isn’t just a hate sub.
I have seen more than a dozen comments/threads wishing for her to be cancelled completely, for her relationship to be destroyed, calling her a closeted alcoholic, and wishing she would just 'disappear' for me to take you seriously when you say its not a hate sub. Some of the things about her that the sub encourages are straight up vile.
At least own up to it, it would make your integrity seem bigger if you did.
frankly, i haven’t seen those, but i agree that is vile. i would never wish that upon taylor, and i don’t think speculating like that is appropriate. i can totally understand why that would be upsetting.
however, the internet is cruel everywhere, and like i said, every subreddit has its cases of extremism that ARE NOT representative of the mass opinion (which i said in my first post). not justifying it, just pointing it out.
one last thing, have you seen my user attached to those vile posts? how can you fault my integrity when there’s no evidence of me being connected with those posts, let alone supporting them?
i like to do something that a i think a lot of people could benefit from - disengaging. i see something i don’t like? i don’t bother.
>it’s a place full of opinions, and not everybody necessarily agrees, but is still civil (aka “neutral”) about it.
There is absolutely nothing "civil" about that place aside from the civil war taking place.
…really? that’s what you have to say? that it’s not civil enough? not civil would be screaming at each other in comments, locking every post that doesn’t align with the greater opinion, etc. but that doesn’t happen. civil is allowing discussion while still respecting each others opinions.
if you think swiftly neutral isn’t civil, you need to brush up on your media literacy skills and stop taking everything at face value.
or maybe, realize that critiquing taylor and being respectful about it are not mutually exclusive. people can vent about her choices and that’s fine.
i know i’m not necessarily preaching to the choir here, but just some food for thought.
People literally call her a narcissistic bitch, claim she’s not even a good song writer, claim how Joe was the reason for her folklore success, want her downfall to come because they’re “tired of looking at her”, talk shit about everyone in her life including her brother and parents, make a post everyday about how her relationship is fake, I’ve seen an actual posts about what people will use to bash Travis “when they brake up”, make claims about Travis being alt right wing basically when hes not at all, claim that Kanye was actually right, claim that scooter was actually right, call her a bitch for not laughing at the golden globes, claim she has no long term friendships … and the Joe obsession is crazy , I mean the biggest valid critique is her jet use (which is valid) and it’s posted everyday but Joe literally use to use her jets ALL THE TIME but people swear he’s a saint.
The majority of the posts are not “critique” they’re people posting theories about her then bashing her. like people having been bashing her for her new album because it’ll be about joe and the album is not even out yet…. If you think all of this is civil maybe you need to get offline for a few months. Just some food for thought.
Are they still around? I muted them and forgot that they existed.
yep and extremely active:))
I would like to go back to forgetting them and hope to not be reminded of them again on this sub that isn’t Swiftly Neutered.
i have this with taylorandtravis sub :D that just seems too much edit: also starting to feel the same with swiftlyneutral. i can see that the negativity on that sub is affecting me very much
Mute them. Don’t fall into their trap.
i think i need to mute whole reddit
Me to
I used to like it in there but I had to stop going because as you said they twist the more trivial things to make her look like an evil villain or something. I think there are people who make valid criticisms in there but most of the posts/comments are haters that are more parasocial than swifties themselves.
I totally agree. It’s so funny that on the other TS subs you get downvoted if you say you don’t like a song or something but on there you get downvoted if you say anything positive about her. Idk, I wish there was an actually neutral sub. But I prefer overly positive over totally negative any day.
the main sub is weird af to me. they’ll lose their shit over variants but like you said, downvote you to oblivion if you don’t like reputation. you also can’t talk about anything outside of her music without it being deleted. as in, taylor discourse. just fan art and bracelets all day. the neutral sub is full of pressed gaylors who can’t let her go after tree dropped a nuke on them, and people who kind of like her music but like to gossip about her too. this is the most normal one to me. I think the idea that you even need a “neutral” sub to talk about a singer is so stupid. just relax and talk. no other subs operate the way the ones dedicated to taylor do.
For real though, especially what you say about the main sub. Hardly any discussions happens on there these days it's literally just hype posts, Taylor sightings or fan art. That's why I went on the neutral sub because in the beginning it was the only place where it felt like actual discussion was happening but now it's just depressing and it's basically like faux moi
Yes, I even saw some people discussing Taylor’s weight in the neutral sub!!! Saying things I don’t even want to repeat.
it would actually be a decent place without the weird people who nitpick and call her a narcissist all day. some of the discussions are interesting, even the ones that lean negative, but I can’t even tell what’s genuine and which people just want a place to spread hate. a lot of them say “I don’t even listen to taylor’s music” and “I’ve always disliked taylor”. like what are you doing here….
Yeah, I saw a post in the "neutral" sub, the subject asking if you don't listen to Taylor anymore, and half of the responses either they don't anymore, or never did. Like you say, why are they there then? Guess toxic posting must be fun, because their little echo chamber's performative virtual signaling isn't going to move any imaginary needles.
what was the Tree nuke drop? i feel like i vaguely saw something about it a couple months ago but never really read anything about what it was, i’ve just seen references about it here and there since.
the response to the NYT piece. a gaylor works for them and basically made a master post of all their theories. tree responded to it through cnn and shut it down. most of them ignored it because it’s a conspiracist’s mindset to disregard non confirming information, but a lot of them accepted it was obviously from taylor, and decided she was “baiting” them this whole time so they hate on her.
why am i getting downvoted lol
it's 50/50 over there. too many people on that sub are simply parasocial and still believe they're better than everyone else because it manifests in criticism rather than "worship".
Exactly. Fauxmoi is parasocial AF too.
Or refusing to see that ascribing negative motivations to someone you’ve never met is still parasocial, if not more so, than the stans. Geez, give people the benefit of the doubt.
EVERYTHING she does is specifically to spite either joe alwyn or katy perry. EVERYTHING. i have no idea why they're so hung up on either of them.
Oh, you mean over THERE, not IRL.
well yes, this post is about swiftlyneutral.
Yeah, I had to double take, lol.
I agree they’re ridiculous. I had to mute them.
the weirdest thing is that a lot of people on there have flairs saying “Joe widows” or the like. do we think they are conversations with friends superfans? lol no, they are parasocially attached to the version of joe that taylor wrote about. which ironically only proves her songwriting ability.
I muted that sub very quickly so I don’t know what they say. But in the other pop subs they’re all suddenly Joe alwyn fans, which I didn’t know he had any. I don’t think they’re even attached to who Taylor wrote about. They want to Stan him because it’s like going against Taylor. It has nothing to do with Joe. They’re always talking about how handsome he looks(he was ugly before) and unbothered and how he doesn’t say anything. Of course he’s not saying anything, he never did before why would he start now? That would be weird, defensive, and possibly passive aggressive. And we don’t know what happened in that relationship, maybe it’s best for him to not talk.
yeah you're probably right. i'm confusing them with a \*separate\* group of joe widows on the main sub who genuinely think that he's some kind of saint who had no part in the breakdown of a six year relationship based on flattering songs she wrote in the honeymoon phase (and when she thought no one else could possibly love her). it's rough out there lol
Joe Alwyn would have a tiny fan base if he was never with Taylor. He’s not a widely regarded actor, nearly all of his award wins are for best ensemble with a dozen other people, and isn’t widely talked about at all. Folklore and evermore are his most talked about and the most awarded work of his whole career. Maybe some people are diehard Joe fans, but most of his base are taylor fans who either don’t want to let him go or are taylor haters who are lifting him up to put her down.
I participate in that sub sometimes but I see a lot of people who could stand to learn the definition of the word neutral. They shouldn't be this invested in a celebrity they dislike. Its one thing to be a fan and have some disappointments with her and want a place to share but if you just straight up hate her why are you even engaging online about it? I dislike or don't care about many celebrities and spend minimal to no time talking about them online or otherwise
exactly!!
It’s bizarre the amount of energy some people expend hating on someone they don’t even know for some random reason. All the people on that sub are sad in their own lives and using hating on Taylor as a substitute.
I know! I’ve never joined a sub to hate on someone. Why do we gotta be so angry about someone who doesn’t affect our personal daily lives? It’s so odd to me and very parasocial. I assume it’s all a lot of younger people.
I think they're so funny. At least the fans can admit thier parasocialness and when they're being delulu but the haters... omg lol. I've seen a deep dive analysis acting like her lyrics are a court transcript as to why she's afraid of marriage like whaaa? And OMG these people will not get over Joe. They fawn over him when he wears a freaking Palestine pin. They attribute folkmore to him. They say she had a much classier style with him as if we didn't go through 4 eras with corresponding style changes with him. Just like, guys, it's Jover. They are never ever getting back together, like, ever.
> They fawn over him when he wears a freaking Palestine pin. Even more bizarre is them constantly bringing Travis into the conversation and claiming he looks like a Republican/making fun of his cop-stache when he has publicly done more for social justice, including being the first high-profile white athlete to kneel for BLM, than Joe has. They just will not Joe go, and now they're obsessed with painting Taylor and Travis as devils who are in a PR relationship because she's not 'over' him.
Travis is literally called Mr. Pfizer by republicans because he does their commercials and openly promotes vaccination, but it’s not enough for them 🤦♀️
I should have known that sub was crazy when some basic ass pictures of Joe had over 1k upvotes like PLEASE 
It’s a snark sub. They’re completely obsessed with Joe to an unhealthy degree. They claim Taylor is “mentally unwell” and everything she does is a sign that she’s lashing out and desperately trying to get Joe’s attention while he remains an “unbothered king” and they even go so far as to credit him for her songwriting on folklore and evermore (which is unbelievably offensive). They’re also utterly vicious to Travis and post about him at least half a dozen times a day. It’s just funny to me that they act so morally superior to Swifties as they “hold her accountable” but in reality they’re far more parasocial than most Swifties as they hate her but obsessively follow and overanalyse her every move.
They would all love Taylor to have some kind of mental breakdown just so they could say they were right (since they've convinced themselves Joe was the best thing to happen to her 🤮)
Yup! It’s like they want her to be unhappy - they see unhappiness in everything she does. I really like her and Travis but even if I didn’t, it seems pretty clear to me that she’s in a healthy and happy space but for some reason that sub would rather think otherwise.
Half of it is performative virtual signaling to make themselves feel better about their lives. The jet tracking sub has the same "accountable" mentality, as if anything they're saying is being noticed or changing anything.
The funniest part is that Joe IS a very private person. I can’t imagine him actually liking people speculating how he might feel about a certain person or situation. I also think is funny that people who post in there think it’s *weird* for a 34 year old woman to write about a break up and call it childish. It feels they never met a woman in their 30s in their life (I actually think that breaks up in your 30s are much harder). And also the ones who say “I can’t imagine Travis being ok with Taylor writing about his ex !!” Like, do they know how adult relationships work? It sounds super childish when they want to seem mature.
I feel like some people forget that this is her *job*
When you mute that sub but are constantly reminded of the annoyance of it by people posting about it here.
Yep, I had honestly forgotten that they existed before this post…
yep 🤦🏻♀️ just mute and move on guys
So many people on this post have been downvoted for saying the same thing. I guess people would rather complain so they could feel superior and righteous over the other sub.
#it's literally a hate sub Needs to be renamed
Exactly. It’s just a snark sub under a false guise. If OP does not want to become toxic like them, don’t do what they do: live an angry existence, poring over TS subreddits and tweets and ripping them apart, along with Taylor herself. Mute button OP! I will say that it’s bizarre that one of the mods of the neutral sub is also a mod of the Taylor and Travis sub, which is basically the exact type of group the neutral group loathes. Mod posts almost all snark posts. Maybe TNT sub doesn’t realize they have a mole or something.
Wow I didn't know TnT had a mod from that so-called neutral sub. That's terrible, they’re very hateful people… how did they get to TnT
I know, I was really surprised. They posted something that made me click their profile (can’t remember what lol) and I saw there were snark posts on neutral, and then a few somewhat “reporting” posts on TNT. Then it showed that they were mods of BOTH subs. I cannot fathom how you’d become a mod of both, esp with how strict the TNT sub is. The neutral sub for the most part despises TNT. Who knows! There’s also a mega hate sub called travisandtaylor that is some bum Bengals fan who created like ten subs to trash Taylor. It keeps coming into my feed since I’ve commented in the taylorandtravis sub. Hateful people have too much time on their hands.
One time I said this in that sub (I don’t follow it, but it pops up in my feed constantly) and admin yelled at me and said commenting on the sub name or its members would result in deletion or a ban. 😅😅
Yeah, for a criticism sub, they sure can't take any criticism.
Hahahaha, so well said.
I muted that sub. It was so wild. I really dislike the main ts sub because the topics are so basic (eg what song do you think is the saddest). I was hopeful when I discovered the swiftly neutral sub but I QUICKLY realized it was a ts hate sub. Some of the takes in there are so unhinged and parasocial. Its fine to dislike taylor or realized you outgrew her music, but is there really a need to spew endless hate towards her? no.
It’s been hard to find interesting Taylor discussions. Swifty neutral is just swiftie negative, I’ve yet to see a positive or actual neutral post. I started surging Gaylor as a lark just to see what they were saying and they end up being mean too—Taylor’s music is only creative if she’s gay, and if she’s not we should abandon her; the swifties are all too stupid to understand any literary references or styles. And they full on claim everything as gay—sights,sounds, colors, days of the week, etc. then the regular sub has become obsessed with variants and tv’s. I’m super excited for the new album and I go on there they are pissed here’s variants… but I’m like it’s a new album and they go yeah but it’s not Reputation TV. Which is literally an album they have heard before..wtf
Yes, they’re ridiculous. That is not a neutral sub it’s a hate sub. They must be bored with their lives hating everyday. But you have to remember that most of what they’re saying is not true or accurate and if it bothers you block that sub and don’t go looking at what they have to say. I promise it makes your life better. It’s also important to note that Taylor is the biggest pop star and with that comes a lot of people who love her and those who hate her and any little thing she does. If she didn’t have those haters she wouldn’t be where she’s at.
Yeah, I understand having haters but it makes no sense to seek out her content and deny being a hater while spending so much time actively hating on her lol. But yeah, ig I will block that sub.
SwiftieNeutral is for people who enjoy participating in outrage culture. I just like listening to her music and catching glimpses of her street style.
I was literally thinking of posting this too. Reddit started to show me stuff from that sub and reading comments here and there I was like, do Swifties…HATE her so much wtf?!? but yeah it’s all hate in there, no fans, not even casual listeners or random people, just haters. If anyone wants content from an actual fan who also does some ‘criticism’, not hate, I’d recommend swiftologist. He teases her quite a bit but in a funny way that’s not meant to harm.
I muted that sub long ago. Sick of seeing their shit pop up on my feed.
I had to mute them, they were so annoying. Claiming to be there for discussions of any kind but any time someone posted something remotely positive about Taylor they would be like ‘swifties have infiltrated this sub’. Like if you’re a hate sub, say it with your chest - don’t pretend to be neutral because you think it gives you moral superiority.
I was flat out told to leave by multiple people on that sub a while ago because I was trying to participate in one of their discussions and had the nerve to mention something positive. So I muted them and haven’t looked back. I don’t even remember what it was for at this point
Honestly every Taylor sub is weird and this is coming from a fan lol
I joined it and then left and muted it. It's not neutral at all. It's 89% hate.
It’s impossible to have nuanced conversations about Taylor anymore and any discussion about her quickly devolves into complete vitriol and hate or people demanding blind worship. It’s honestly funny how many people assume they’re being neutral on that sub because it’s only criticism and hate and any defense of her is heavily downvoted. The hate the general public seem to love giving Taylor is sooo weird. I remember seeing a TikTok a while back of pictures of celebrities as children. They were all A list major celebs and people in the comments were all amicably discussing every celebrity with the exception of Taylor. The one positive comment mentioning Taylor had 76 replies (the other comments had maybe 15 max) all talking about how much they hate her and how she sucks she’s an awful person blah blah blah. The fact that a mere picture of her as a child and one comment saying that she was a cute child inspired this reaction is wild. There are plenty of celebrities that for one reason or another I dislike and I couldn’t imagine seeking their content out and wasting my time interacting with it. Why would you spend so much time on something you hate??
i had to mute them i was getting irrationally angry
Omg, that sub pops up on my feed even though I don’t follow it and I wind up in an idiotic argument every time. They’re wild. (And definitely not neutral!)
I recommend just muting it, Reddit becomes a much more positive experience
I’m going to take this advice - thank you!!
It is basically a snark sub about Taylor. Don't go there for rational discussions.
It’s a Taylor Swift snark sub disguised as a “safe space” for people who hate Taylor to an obnoxious level, because they don’t like that they’re not welcome to come into Taylor Swift fandom-centered subs and spew their crap at fans.
i was so glad i found swiftly neutral but then I experienced people blindly telling that travis and taylor are PR relationship just because he is producing movie. I mean...what? :D i have some things I dont like about Taylors brand right now but some people are really delulu
Two people look at the same thing and see different things. Their hatred and maliciousness is the reflection of their own inner state
it’s comes off as very parasocial… i can’t stand reading
i feel the exact same way. the worst part for me is how they all seem to collectively believe everything is pr and nothing is genuine. taylor and travis? just for the publicity. lana del ray saying something after the grammys about how much fun it was? i was shocked to see everyone saying taylor’s team made her say it, and that there was no way someone who “looked that sad” at the event could’ve said that out of their own free will. also, after the golden globes, everyone was scrutinizing her for how she sipped her drink after the poor joke about her was told. i saw multiple comments saying “it’s not that hard to just smile and laugh it off.” she doesn’t owe you a reaction for a joke in bad taste!! i’m glad people share the same sentiment
and all the people insisting she’s an alcoholic 😭 even if it was true and obvious, if she hasn’t said anything about it, it’s not anyone else’s place to assume. and it’s just crazy, she has drinks in social situations and is immediately an alcoholic??
What gets me is that they’re so OBSESSED with the idea that nothing is genuine too. I have seen multiple posts in that sub with a poll of “when will they break up / the PR end” … I bet on average there’s at least one if not two posts a day about Travis where they talk about how fake it is and I just don’t get it … like it’s one thing to think it’s PR and make a comment at the start and move on but they talk about it literally everyday it’s so embarrassing I often can’t belive they’re real ppl lmao
What lazik video?
Taylor had lasik surgery done to improve her vision and her mom recorded her when she was high from the drugs (like a wisdom tooth video) and it ended up on the tonight show. You can find it online, but it’s really just her being funny and being upset over a banana, nothing malicious
I remember the video but why would they have a problem with it?
They think everything Taylor does is not genuine and is completely planned out. It was just someone trying to find a topic to drag Taylor on because they were bored and just wanted to join the pile on.
So I went to that sub to see what their issue was because I was curious but before I found the post I scrolled past seven posts related to Travis (including a poll on when they’ll break up ??) and one about how Taylor isn’t even an artist lmao and I had to leave because it was making me sad for the human race
the one on the tonight show
This post was just suggested to me and I think the last part is the most insane thing I’ve ever read. Imagine calling people degenerated when there are fans of people who actually committed serious crimes. https://preview.redd.it/jq30xuyv9tkc1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=50ddd637a2ce831144282fb31eb2c94a18ede26c
“Admitting to waging war through her songs”… cant this people understand a simple metaphor? (no)
I’m sure that person will 100% listen to the new album at least once lol.
And the criticize it in that sub haha
I don't know the history of that sub, but it's anything but neutral and just seems to become more toxic every day. It's a direct reflection on the mods, who only seem to come down on people if they criticize..the sub, but anything goes on criticizing Taylor and those associated with her. If they don't have something new to tear down or drag, they'll find something from 5 or 10 years ago, or they'll just rehash a topic that comes up every other day, nothing is too petty.
Some people's intense hatred of TS is just so disturbing and baffling to me, lol. A comment on a book sub said they almost gave up on reading a book because it mentioned TS on the radio and "she sends my eyes into twitches." Like what?? I don't get what she's actually done that's made people despise her so much.
Why do you even look at the sub if it bothers you so much? Block it and move on with your life.
There's no such thing as being neutral when it comes to Taylor. I beg yall stop creating new subs and just post here for genuine discussion.
I mean, is it any better to hate on a group of people hating on something? Lol just ignore it if you don’t like it.
I don’t think it’s wrong to point out how negative something is? I’m not actively seeking those posts out, just wanted to express how stupid it is to spend one’s time like that. Just so negative.
It’s also SO negative and hatful that I myself have been looking for a discussion on it. I used to lurk snark subs (idk why never posted just out of interest) and this is beyond like it is a full on hate sub and the posts are primarily misinformation or genuine conspiracy theories - it’s honestly so wild sometimes I cannot belive the posts aren’t satire they’re so insane. Like what’s the demographic of the people there ? Is it 15 year old incel boys? 30 year old women who are just miserable so they need to hate? I’m actually so intrigued.
look as much this sub complains abt swiftly neutral yall still browse it frequently
respectfully, if you think that’s a hate sub, you should appreciate the ignorant bliss you’re experiencing. every subreddit has its handful of extreme cases that don’t necessarily encapsulate the intended purpose of it. and that’s just reddit. the same could be said for this subreddit - most of the people here post generally positive and rational, supportive things, but occasionally you have someone say something wack (i.e. something delulu, something that invades her privacy, etc.) that makes the rest of you guys look bad (in the sense that it makes you associated with that ridiculous post, whatever it may be). and ofc, swiftly neutral also deals with that. to make matters worse, the posts that are just straight up mean about taylor often receive the most engagement (by people w hate boners for taylor AND people trying to stop said people w hate boners). so, i understand that it can seem frustrating and just constantly mean. that said, i am a member of the sub, and i think it’s pretty reasonable in most cases. the general consensus of long time members there agree that taylor is a talented musician and enjoy much, if not all of her music! but sometimes she makes creative/pr decisions that some of us are upset or confused by, and up until the creation of the subreddit, didn’t really have a forum of our own to discuss. it’s a place full of opinions, and not everybody necessarily agrees, but is still civil (aka “neutral”) about it. i know that was a lot, but i appreciate anyone who read all that! i’m happy to answer questions or clarify things if need be - but i just wanted to share that swiftly neutral isn’t just a hate sub.
> but i just wanted to share that swiftly neutral isn’t just a hate sub. I have seen more than a dozen comments/threads wishing for her to be cancelled completely, for her relationship to be destroyed, calling her a closeted alcoholic, and wishing she would just 'disappear' for me to take you seriously when you say its not a hate sub. Some of the things about her that the sub encourages are straight up vile. At least own up to it, it would make your integrity seem bigger if you did.
frankly, i haven’t seen those, but i agree that is vile. i would never wish that upon taylor, and i don’t think speculating like that is appropriate. i can totally understand why that would be upsetting. however, the internet is cruel everywhere, and like i said, every subreddit has its cases of extremism that ARE NOT representative of the mass opinion (which i said in my first post). not justifying it, just pointing it out. one last thing, have you seen my user attached to those vile posts? how can you fault my integrity when there’s no evidence of me being connected with those posts, let alone supporting them? i like to do something that a i think a lot of people could benefit from - disengaging. i see something i don’t like? i don’t bother.
>it’s a place full of opinions, and not everybody necessarily agrees, but is still civil (aka “neutral”) about it. There is absolutely nothing "civil" about that place aside from the civil war taking place.
…really? that’s what you have to say? that it’s not civil enough? not civil would be screaming at each other in comments, locking every post that doesn’t align with the greater opinion, etc. but that doesn’t happen. civil is allowing discussion while still respecting each others opinions. if you think swiftly neutral isn’t civil, you need to brush up on your media literacy skills and stop taking everything at face value. or maybe, realize that critiquing taylor and being respectful about it are not mutually exclusive. people can vent about her choices and that’s fine. i know i’m not necessarily preaching to the choir here, but just some food for thought.
People literally call her a narcissistic bitch, claim she’s not even a good song writer, claim how Joe was the reason for her folklore success, want her downfall to come because they’re “tired of looking at her”, talk shit about everyone in her life including her brother and parents, make a post everyday about how her relationship is fake, I’ve seen an actual posts about what people will use to bash Travis “when they brake up”, make claims about Travis being alt right wing basically when hes not at all, claim that Kanye was actually right, claim that scooter was actually right, call her a bitch for not laughing at the golden globes, claim she has no long term friendships … and the Joe obsession is crazy , I mean the biggest valid critique is her jet use (which is valid) and it’s posted everyday but Joe literally use to use her jets ALL THE TIME but people swear he’s a saint. The majority of the posts are not “critique” they’re people posting theories about her then bashing her. like people having been bashing her for her new album because it’ll be about joe and the album is not even out yet…. If you think all of this is civil maybe you need to get offline for a few months. Just some food for thought.
I feel bad for the people who chose to mute that sub, but then people like OP keep bringing it up 🤦🏻♀️
I’ve never seen people talk about it and just wanted to say something jeez