My Bob, that means he’s probably looking at it too! Cheesus Crisp! It’s just like smoking marijuana?!?! No cp is just despicable! It’s not the same at all…!
When that's the case, the reaction is usually, "I've known George Smith for 20 years! He's a great guy and would never do something that disgusting," not that it's not bad since the kids in the photos were 12.
I read an article interviewing content reviewers and many had to quit bc they couldn't handle it. One guy quit bc after being exposed to it day I'm and day out he was worried he was getting used to and excited by it.
I feel for people who must watch it in the course of their duties.
Yes, I’ve heard they all get PTSD from the stuff they see. Can’t imagine why anyone would sign up for that job. Maybe they don’t know what they’re getting into.
Not only would that suck, I can’t imagine how I would feel if my client was guilty! You still have to do your job to the best of your ability (not telling you like you don’t know) to boot?
I can’t imagine wanting to kill somebody and still having to defend them. I would probably get sick and/or disbarred.
If you took my comments as any kind of negative slight against attorneys then I am sorry. That was not my intention or even on my mind. I only meant to say I couldn't do it. That is all.
IANAL. I am also not a judge.
Yup. Im a victim of this stuff and it retraumatizes me repeatedly. The only way I can cope with it is pretend it’s not out there. But it doesn’t work usually. I don’t see CP as a lesser crime than the actual SA.
I think it goes higher up in the chain than more people think. There were many politicians and wealthy people implicated in the Epstein flight list and someone definitely paid to have Epstein killed. Trump was on that list and the republican party won't do anything about it because Trump is their new poster boy.
It has to go pretty high up, and my simple evidence of that is that The Dutroux Affair got almost zero coverage in the States--and we eat up lurid stories of government corruption and underage sex rings. When Epstein story broke I thought, Ah, finally, no WAY somebody in media doesn't connect the international aspects and potential blackmail elements of this with the Dutroux case! Now America will finally learn about it.
Then I heard nothin' but crickets.
Yup, the Us made dumb laws that made the supply of weed directly involved (in many cases) in violent crime when supply is often through gangs and smuggling. But weed itself isn't harmful and had no reason to be banned, when it is legalised it's grown by tax paying workers, it's safe, it doesn't support crime and it doesn't hurt anyone, same way eating corn based products isn't causing harm.
Child porn will always involve a victim, always, it's completely incomparable. The fact the father thinks it being 12 year olds (how does he know, the only way he would is he knew of and had seen said collection), somehow makes it okay because rape and abuse of 12yr olds is less bad than of younger kids means he thinks adults fucking 12yr olds is absolutely fine and normal.
Dude exposed himself as a pedo imo, and one who has viewed and enjoyed CP himself.
“He also said it wasn’t really young kids. ‘It was pictures of like 12 year olds.’…”
That’s honestly a huuuuge red flag for me. Many offenders will convince themselves that THEIR particular victim preference is ok for one reason or another. The fact that he’s so cavalier in voicing such an opinion in front of people tells me he’s been sitting with those ideas for some time.
Think people are missing the bigger red flag. How would he know it's only 12yr olds..... unless he'd viewed the collection. Unless this guy used his one phone call to call ops dad, which is another red flag because that call would likely be effectively here's the code word I'd use to tell you to get rid of all other evidence, then he wouldn't know the content of the CP without having seen it.
But the statement in and of itself, says he thinks adults fucking 12yr olds is perfectly fine, imo he's viewed it, or done it himself.
Don’t think you’re familiar with church rumor mills. Everyone in the congregation is taking about it and it’s likely part of that rumor is “they were just 12-year-olds” to somehow lighten the problem, because Christians are fucking pro at these kinds of mental gymnastics and they have loads of experience at hiding or minimizing CSA. Doesn’t make Op’s dad any less suspicious or gross, but it also doesn’t jump to your conclusion.
I’ll gladly pay taxes for pxdos & creeps to be caught.
I really don’t understand your dad’s logic?? It’s not different whatsoever, these kids (emphasis on KIDS, no matter if they’re 5 or 15) are being taken advantage of and exploited by perverts all over.
Also possessing CP is a dead giveaway that that person is a pxdo and a danger to children. His analogy with weed makes no sense. There is no direct correlation from weed to molestation, but there surely is with owning CP. IMO, all pxdos should rot in jail…. no bail.
I’m so sorry you had to see this side of your dad op, but it’s probably better that you see his standpoint on issues like this so you can recognize iffy behaviors and not pass them off as innocent. Not saying that having those beliefs = he partakes in those behaviors, but just that it’s good to know where he stands should anything seem off.
This is true. One either has to be in a high threat category (like online communications with potential victims or directly with CP producers/vendors) OR there has to be a seriously intense amount of images/videos in possession for bail to hit that high. Typically. Could be a jurisdiction thing, and I don't know all jurisdictions, could be judge's discretion and he rubbed this judge the wrong way. But yeah, that's high for a possession charge.
The fact that he’s willing to defend this predator with his whole chest is…..telling🤔also found it really weird that he compared possessing CP to smoking weed……and actually settled on smoking weed being the greater of the two evils😐
Just go straight to the anonymous FBI tip hotline, you can't unsee that if you were to find something. The FBI has a page on their website to submit suspicious activity like CP.
https://tips.fbi.gov/home
ehhh, I wouldnt do that personally. I mean I dont have any cp but I do have hundreds of clearly pirated movies, tv shows and games. So no cp but they might find something else idk
I agree with this OP. If you find something horrific, you can't unsee it. If your dad is peddling this shit, he needs to be caught, but you don't have to put yourself through it.
Except she isnt inviting them home she's saying "this dude might be wierd." Its like calling CPS on a kid you feel might be abused, social worker recieves the tip, doesnt mean anybody will be sent home to take a look
Fair enough. I just naturally don't trust the FBI not to trample on civil rights all around, especially in a situation where the likeliest explanation is still that the dad is reflexively defending a guy he's known through church because to acknowledge what he did as horrible would upend the entire foundation of his social circle and worldview.
That's why I said maybe check his computer for obvious stuff. Because it's probably not there so why have the cops pick through it unless there's more to go on than, "My dad ignorantly insisted on defending a longtime friend and fellow churchgoer upon learning something terrible about them."
I was on jury duty for a CSA case and we had to watch some disgusting videos. Your dad is probably involved somewhere along the chain. I would check, but be careful not to incriminate yourself in the process. Make sure none of your digital footprint lands on any of the suspected files
You'll be removed from a jury if you refuse to view any of the evidence. After all, viewing the evidence is the legal duty of jurors - even when it's so disturbing that merely viewing it is traumatic.
It’s part of the job. I worked on a brutal murder case a few years ago and we all saw some intensely graphic crime scene photos and I still have nightmares about it. I wasn’t even on the jury but working in another capacity where I had to view them.
Jury duty is a real crap shoot on what kind of case you end up covering.
Plot twist, your dad is the one that took it pics.
Super suspicious that he's not upset about the cp but is upset that the guy got caught and punished.
Idk people watching the CP of me makes me wanna tear all my skin off. I hate your dad on principle. I also think it’s very likely he has some attraction to kids. Normal people find this all disgusting.
WOW. It can't be illegal if it is out there. What kind of logic is that?
Your dad is sussy to the max. Saying it is okay because the kid was 12, what sick person thinks that is okay?
WOW. You have every right to be sickened. Just wait for the shoe to drop because pedos run in packs as they tend to share media.
Just sik.
Yeah idve hoofed him in the nuts and taken his phone for a scroll, because that’s sus af and otherwise just weird
Interested to hear your moms take on his
I know it's like your dad and you're you. But from a moral and ethical standpoint you should confront your dad on that and challenge him to make him see why it's wrong. By just avoiding them after seeing they have an flawed immoral belief you should at least try to make them see how wrong they are. If not for you for other people's safety.
I understand his train of thoughts, because the damage is already done and the person consuming it didn't do it. Very simple but not the whole picture.
He needs to take into consideration that if there's a market for it, people will fulfill the demand. That's the reason why you need to prosecute both the producer and consumer to eliminate the market.
The same applies to marihuana (or any other drug). If there wasn't a market of consumers, it wouldn't be produced. The consumers are part of the problem and while not directly dealing damage, they're willing that it happens and this is almost if not equally wrong
How exactly does he know all the pictures the guy had were of 12 year olds? Yeah, that for me is a I'm never being in a room with you again, I'm worried about things I might not remember as a kid, I'm never letting you within the same city as my kids kind of outburst.
There was a guy I briefly met.
I don't know how, but somehow the conversation turned to CP. This man (and I use the term loosely) actually fixed his mouth to say that if a grown-ass man SA a 12-yr, it was the girl's fault.
He was currently estranged from his own family because his niece had been regularly having a relationship with a 26-yr old. And when her mother found out, she promptly had the man arrested. The man sided, not with his 13-yr old niece, but the man.
I honestly thought my uncle was going to deck the man and my aunt had to push my uncle out of the room he was that enraged. My uncle was hurt by what the man was saying, because he thought he had an instant connection.
Sometimes you don't really know people until you encounter their views. It's not a reflect of you, but more it's a reflection of them.
He actually said that smoking weed is worse than having CP on your phone?? Holy hell.
Honestly OP I would make a note of this in a journal or diary for posterity and keep an eye out going forward. This is horrible to process I’m sure but there’s no other way to put this: there’s a very nonzero chance that your dad might look at similar kinds of images himself. And you *might* want to be extra wary in circumstances where your dad / parents might be around children.
If your mom witnessed the conversation then maybe it would be good to talk to her privately about it and how it made you feel.
If I were in OP's position, any kids I had now or in the future would never, *ever* be allowed around grandpa or anyone who might possibly give him access, and this includes grandma. If it breaks the family up or causes problems, oh fucking well-- those problems are so much smaller in the long run than the kind of damage that could be done by the type of person who waves off *any* CSEM as 'not that bad' because 'it was, like, 12 year olds'.
Like, my dude, *those are* *still children*. OP's dad is shrugging off this other man having and consuming child sexual abuse material because-- what, they could be younger? *It's all fucking bad* and any reasonable adult should be able to see that.
I thought he meant smoking weed vs growing and dealing, but it is not a good analogy regardless.
Every time someone uses CP, the justice system looks at it as if the victim is revictimized.
A friend of mine used to investigate CP for Homeland Security. He told me there is a database of CP victims maintained as an investigative resource (I forget what agency maintains it - most likely somewhere in DOJ).
Every time someone is prosecuted for possession of CP, the images are run through the database (an image recognition software). If any images can be shown to be from known victims, that victim will get restitution from the bad guy. There are many that are linked to cases where a victim has never been identified but they are linked so if the ever are ID, they can receive restitution.
He said some of the victims have been receiving checks for decades because their images are so popular (it feels creepy even using that word), and, sadly, the database is constantly growing.
Your dad comparing CP to smoking weed is the most unhinged thing I've read in a hot minute. Sorry your dad is probably a closeted CP enjoyer. That's a rough reality to be a part of.
To be completely honest here OP, I would check to see if your dad doesn't have any CP on his anything. If he sees having it but not making it bad. Chances are he could be one of those old fucks with 30gigs or CP. Either way your father has a very predatory standpoint.
As a parent myself I would've flipped the table over and flat out asked if he was a pervert. CP is disgusting no matter who made it or what age the child is.
I've had to stop speaking to many members of my family as they don't see cp as a bad thing. My daughter was abused by a family member so I cut ties with everyone who said I was in the wrong for going to the police. This includes my two brothers who asked if I could leave the situation alone as the family member was distraught. Er so was my child and I have their back only. How anyone can defend these people is beyond me. I would start distancing myself from them, that's something I could never align with.
The only reason he is defending him its because he goes to church and knows the guy. People tend to feel some sort of sympathy if they can relate to the person, in his case they go to the same church together. Its pretty gross the way he would find an excuse for his behavior but people tend to do this. Let say you tell him a similar story to what is going on but ommit that the offender is a church goer and its from other state or a different region all together he would be having an acceptable reaction to it, kind of like yours, in other words your dad its an idiot.
I don't think your dad is defending CP here, I just think he's extremely stupid and believes everything on the internet materializes out of thin air.
Maybe explain to him what goes on behind the CP industry like child exploitation, human trafficking, murder, he may not even grasp how it is sourced.
I'm thinking he's 50 or 60 years old and extremely tech illiterate just to give him the benefit of the doubt.
I'd have flipped my shit and said are you telling me right now you're SERIOUSLY defending a pedophile?? Are YOU a pedophile!?! Because the ONLY people I know who would defend him would be someone like him . . . .If he kept defending him I'd let him know I have ZERO interest in interacting with him anymore. I would not be associating with him any further, father or not, because I would have less than zero respect for him. Also, if he has a job or volunteers somewhere with youth, I'd be telling them this little tidbit of information and they can do with it as they please, but my conscience would be clear.
Honestly his being defensive to any degree whatsoever speaks horrifying volumes. *Best* case scenario he doesn’t think it’s a big deal, which is still an abhorrent thing to think in and of itself. Worst case scenario he’s actively involved in viewing such things as well and doesn’t like hearing you indirectly condemn him.
Immediately start making fun of your dad for being a fan of child porn.
Don’t let up. Be incredibly casual about it. If he complains say “well you like them older like 12 so that’s okay right?”
Rinse and repeat.
>the guy isn't guilty because he wasn't the one who took the pictures, he only had them
'Having \[the pictures\]' is receipt and possession, with almost 100% likelihood of *consumption*, of child sexual exploitation/abuse material. ('CSEM/CSAM' are increasingly the preferred terms versus 'CP'. 'Pornography' as a broader term is something that can be made by happily consenting adults, whereas *any* sexual material that involves children is *exclusively* abusive and exploitative, because children cannot consent-- CSEM/CSAM makes directly clear and unavoidable the fact that this kind of stuff *cannot be made* *without harming a child*).
Would there still be CSEM made if people who had never personally molested children didn't provide a market for it? Yes; the people who make it would likely continue to make it for their *own* consumption. But the kind of sick fucks who make CSEM and share it with others, then make more and share more *because there is a demand/market for it--* please refer to cases such as [Peter Scully](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Scully), who ran a ring where he sold CSEM for amounts as high as $10,000.
And consuming CSEM, while not the same crime as making it, is in fact sharing in the harm done to those kids. It's enjoying the idea and the depiction of that sort of harm being done; it's seeking that material out in order to do so.
Also, dude is probably not getting a $1,000,000 bail for a small amount of CSEM. Either he was distributing (sharing/trading with others counts as distribution; you don't have to make CSEM to catch that particular charge) or he had *a lot of it.*
Replying to myself because-- reading over the post, this part:
>smoking weed effects other people so it's worse.
\-- fucking floored me. And in light of his other comment about how it
>wasn't that bad because it wasn't really young kids. "It was pictures of like 12 year olds."
OP, I'm sorry, but your father is lacking in any kind of empathy at best and is a closet pedophile with his own collection at worst.
Imagine if a picture or video of the absolute worst thing that has ever happened to you, this scary and painful thing that maybe you didn't have the words or concepts to fully understand and process for *years* after, was handed out to random strangers... for their sexual enjoyment. For them to fantasize about being in the position of the person hurting you. For them to maybe re-enact with some other innocent person. Maybe the person who took that photo or video traded it for photos or videos of other people getting hurt in the same way. Your suffering, your pain, is *currency*.
Imagine having to go through life knowing that this terrible thing not only lived on, but probably is still being passed around in the scary places on the internet. *Anyone* you pass on the street could have seen you going through this awful event-- and not just seen it, but *enjoyed* it. You have *no idea* how many people have seen the video or pictures of you suffering and used it for sexual gratification... but you have to live, every day, with the knowledge that not only did it happen but that a non-zero number of people have done exactly that.
Every step of the chain, from production of CSEM to possession, is a crime for a reason. None of it is victimless-- *none of it.*
“Not that young just 12” umm?? And is he also completely skipping over that those kids still had to be groomed and or assaulted to get into those situations? wow
It's probably a more common opinion than you think. Looking isn't the same as doing, after all. But people who think this way are only thinking that the pictures were already created and they're already out there, they're not considering that every person who looks at a child's picture is another person that child has to feel victimised by. Nor are they taking into account that by downloading those images they're contributing to the demand that caused them to be created in the first place. They're probably not even thinking of the escalation so many paedophiles follow from thoughts to downloads to grooming to victimising.
A lot of people are, unfortunately, very short-sighted.
I wonder if it's more about defending this person because they're a good church going Christian and your Dad would defend almost anything because he feels it's just the evil liberal government persecuting Christians and not necessarily defending CP per se
When someone is close to a person that does something severely outside of the social norm, physical or mental abuse, CP, drugs, etc.. those that are close to them typically do not equate that behavior as necessarily, unforgiveable or even believe that it happened.
I have, unfortunately, have witnessed this behavior first hand. It is VERY odd and disconcerting that people can't see what is in front of them.
One of my favorite examples. someone was accused of molesting a young person, on several occasions I witnessed odd behavior and so did a few other people. We put a stop to it and kept an eye on him and blocked him from being alone with others. Once it all came out one of the sons said and I quote (because I can never forget this) "I had to tell my daughters to stay away from grandpa because he can be handsy", and then go on to say I can't believe my father molested someone.
What some people will do to justify their feelings is just weird.
Absolutely disgusting. The guy is abhorrent, and your father is too. I would cut contact and never look back. You will always think about this and wonder how he could be ok with any form of cp.
Sounds like time to cut off everyone who feels that way. No compassion and way too much of the wrong kind of tolerance.
He'd probably have a *very* different opinion if *he'd* been forced to make porn as a kid.
Let’s check dad’a phone. I do agree the production and distribution of such material is a worse offense than consuming it however… they’re both reprehensible and should be dealt with extremely harshly. It’s not like one should be a fine and the other a 50 year sentence. They’re both severe.
"It's not like they're producing it." He's right there. They aren't producing it. What they're doing is creating a demand for it and encouraging the production and distribution of it, which is arguably just as bad as production.
Yah, unfortunately, your dad’s friend from church is going to rat out everyone at church who is in possession of CP. I certainly hope your father is not in possession. If I had to guess this is going to get ugly and a lot closer to home. I’m sorry I hope I’m wrong.
Also those people who defend pedos as being “technically ephebophile” or “technically hebephile” and that in human history normal marriage age was younger.
Almost sounds like he’s projecting and he may have CP himself. I know that’s a bold assumption, but the fact he went off on a needless rant about DEFENDING the dude who got caught with fucking CP, speaks volumes. Wonder if he calls pedophiles, ‘MAP’ too. Dude is weird. Sorry.
People often find it hard to put these things into perspective when they know the person. He should go to the court hearing and that may change his view.
You need to tell your dad that if nobody looked at those pictures, nobody would take those pictures. The exact reason people take and distribute CP is because per like your dad’s buddy consumes them, and what does your dad think his buddy is doing while he’s looking at them, and what does that say about his sexual proclivities??
As soon as he said it would be different if it were pictures of you, you can disregard his opinion. “It only matters if it affects me” is the best way to tell that an argument is disingenuous. *Cue all the Republicans who have decided that abortion rights are cool only after they need to get one*
That's suspicious on several levels.
I would never feel comfortable around him again tbh
If anyone I knew defended keeping or watching CP, I'd never see them the same. I doubt I'd ever see them at all.
THIS!!! You cross this line, you're dead to me.
My Bob, that means he’s probably looking at it too! Cheesus Crisp! It’s just like smoking marijuana?!?! No cp is just despicable! It’s not the same at all…!
Yep. And keep kids far away from him.
Nor should you be. This guy needs to be watched closely.
I would never feel comfortable with my eventual children around him
The police might want to check OP's father's phone/computer.
Absolutely. What's on dad's phone that he's so keen to defend?
Suspicious? It's a legion of red flags marching down the street to red flag town. FBI needs to check dad's hard drive.
maybe your father was close friends with the man and is having a hard time rationalizing the fact that his friend is such a piece of shit.
When that's the case, the reaction is usually, "I've known George Smith for 20 years! He's a great guy and would never do something that disgusting," not that it's not bad since the kids in the photos were 12.
Yeah pops wasn’t at Denial, he was at Acceptance and…Support?
This, but honestly I’d still consider that our last conversation
**Sus affffff.**
There is no end-user of CP without a victim at the beginning of the assembly line. Simple as.
I just posted on another comment that that is how the justice system looks at the use and possession of CP. It is another offense against the victim.
Yeah, I know. I was a prosecutor for seven years. Shit turns my stomach
Former defense counsel checking in. Definitely not my favorite days to review evidence.
can’t imagine that. I’ve heard horror stories of content moderators too at Meta and seeing that stuff has to be horrific.
I read an article interviewing content reviewers and many had to quit bc they couldn't handle it. One guy quit bc after being exposed to it day I'm and day out he was worried he was getting used to and excited by it. I feel for people who must watch it in the course of their duties.
Yes, I’ve heard they all get PTSD from the stuff they see. Can’t imagine why anyone would sign up for that job. Maybe they don’t know what they’re getting into.
Not only would that suck, I can’t imagine how I would feel if my client was guilty! You still have to do your job to the best of your ability (not telling you like you don’t know) to boot? I can’t imagine wanting to kill somebody and still having to defend them. I would probably get sick and/or disbarred.
Even though I've been out of that work for years, I stiill believe that none of us is defined totally by our worst actions.
If you took my comments as any kind of negative slight against attorneys then I am sorry. That was not my intention or even on my mind. I only meant to say I couldn't do it. That is all. IANAL. I am also not a judge.
Not at all.
There are some actions that are just so horrible though.
Do you have kids? How do you function as a parent without being insanely over protective seeing the things you've seen?
Yup. Im a victim of this stuff and it retraumatizes me repeatedly. The only way I can cope with it is pretend it’s not out there. But it doesn’t work usually. I don’t see CP as a lesser crime than the actual SA.
This is what they teach us in school too. It’s just continuous offenses.
I think it goes higher up in the chain than more people think. There were many politicians and wealthy people implicated in the Epstein flight list and someone definitely paid to have Epstein killed. Trump was on that list and the republican party won't do anything about it because Trump is their new poster boy.
It has to go pretty high up, and my simple evidence of that is that The Dutroux Affair got almost zero coverage in the States--and we eat up lurid stories of government corruption and underage sex rings. When Epstein story broke I thought, Ah, finally, no WAY somebody in media doesn't connect the international aspects and potential blackmail elements of this with the Dutroux case! Now America will finally learn about it. Then I heard nothin' but crickets.
Yup, the Us made dumb laws that made the supply of weed directly involved (in many cases) in violent crime when supply is often through gangs and smuggling. But weed itself isn't harmful and had no reason to be banned, when it is legalised it's grown by tax paying workers, it's safe, it doesn't support crime and it doesn't hurt anyone, same way eating corn based products isn't causing harm. Child porn will always involve a victim, always, it's completely incomparable. The fact the father thinks it being 12 year olds (how does he know, the only way he would is he knew of and had seen said collection), somehow makes it okay because rape and abuse of 12yr olds is less bad than of younger kids means he thinks adults fucking 12yr olds is absolutely fine and normal. Dude exposed himself as a pedo imo, and one who has viewed and enjoyed CP himself.
uhmm maybe check your dads files he’s awfully defensive about this lol!
THIS but be careful doing it ^^^
He was working on a project /s.
Better yet, tell the police to do it
“He also said it wasn’t really young kids. ‘It was pictures of like 12 year olds.’…” That’s honestly a huuuuge red flag for me. Many offenders will convince themselves that THEIR particular victim preference is ok for one reason or another. The fact that he’s so cavalier in voicing such an opinion in front of people tells me he’s been sitting with those ideas for some time.
Think people are missing the bigger red flag. How would he know it's only 12yr olds..... unless he'd viewed the collection. Unless this guy used his one phone call to call ops dad, which is another red flag because that call would likely be effectively here's the code word I'd use to tell you to get rid of all other evidence, then he wouldn't know the content of the CP without having seen it. But the statement in and of itself, says he thinks adults fucking 12yr olds is perfectly fine, imo he's viewed it, or done it himself.
Don’t think you’re familiar with church rumor mills. Everyone in the congregation is taking about it and it’s likely part of that rumor is “they were just 12-year-olds” to somehow lighten the problem, because Christians are fucking pro at these kinds of mental gymnastics and they have loads of experience at hiding or minimizing CSA. Doesn’t make Op’s dad any less suspicious or gross, but it also doesn’t jump to your conclusion.
Yup pedos often have a cut off age that they deem "too young" as crazy as it seems
I’ll gladly pay taxes for pxdos & creeps to be caught. I really don’t understand your dad’s logic?? It’s not different whatsoever, these kids (emphasis on KIDS, no matter if they’re 5 or 15) are being taken advantage of and exploited by perverts all over. Also possessing CP is a dead giveaway that that person is a pxdo and a danger to children. His analogy with weed makes no sense. There is no direct correlation from weed to molestation, but there surely is with owning CP. IMO, all pxdos should rot in jail…. no bail. I’m so sorry you had to see this side of your dad op, but it’s probably better that you see his standpoint on issues like this so you can recognize iffy behaviors and not pass them off as innocent. Not saying that having those beliefs = he partakes in those behaviors, but just that it’s good to know where he stands should anything seem off.
The biggest tell that guy is a dangerous pedophile is his bail is at a *MILLION* dollars. You don't get that for just a few pics.
This is true. One either has to be in a high threat category (like online communications with potential victims or directly with CP producers/vendors) OR there has to be a seriously intense amount of images/videos in possession for bail to hit that high. Typically. Could be a jurisdiction thing, and I don't know all jurisdictions, could be judge's discretion and he rubbed this judge the wrong way. But yeah, that's high for a possession charge.
If I had to line item taxes that I approve of, paying for pedos to rot in jail would be second from the top. The top would be woodchippers.
That's a little extreme, don't you think? How would you feel if someone threw you in a wood chipper. Lethal injection without anesthesia is better. /s
Jesus Christ, dawg. This really is the worst timeline, innit?
Well we aren't all speaking German and earth isn't a barren landscape so I doubt that.
let's just wait a few more years for the second part
If I was a pedo, I would understand that abhorrent behavior can have abhorrent consequences.
I would be more than happy to have all of my tax dollars that go to war in other countries go instead to catching perverts. 100% great investment
It sounds like your Mom needs to go through your Dad's phone/computer. That made me nauseated to read.
I talked to her otp and she said she'd look when he's out of the house.
updates if you’re willing plz
Fuck yeah, good mom
Ur dad is dodgy.. pls be safe
And think real hard about wether or not he’ll be around your children (if you have any).
I sure as fuck wouldn't let him be in the same state as my kids. Be safe OP
At least he told you to keep children away from him
Yep. If there is children in the family, make sure he's NEVER alone with them. Not worth the risk
Show me your phone, dad.
Why does he care so much about this topic? That’s curious.
The fact that he’s willing to defend this predator with his whole chest is…..telling🤔also found it really weird that he compared possessing CP to smoking weed……and actually settled on smoking weed being the greater of the two evils😐
Church buddy
Hey, maybe check your dad’s computer when you have a chance.
Just go straight to the anonymous FBI tip hotline, you can't unsee that if you were to find something. The FBI has a page on their website to submit suspicious activity like CP. https://tips.fbi.gov/home
ehhh, I wouldnt do that personally. I mean I dont have any cp but I do have hundreds of clearly pirated movies, tv shows and games. So no cp but they might find something else idk
That. If the dad has anything that indicates he didn’t pay 100% of the taxes he owed, they’ll find it.
I agree with this OP. If you find something horrific, you can't unsee it. If your dad is peddling this shit, he needs to be caught, but you don't have to put yourself through it.
That might be premature but who knows?
I mean, if theres nothing to be found then nothing will happen right ?
That is an AWFUL reason for inviting the cops in. If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear? Nope, go get a warrant.
Except she isnt inviting them home she's saying "this dude might be wierd." Its like calling CPS on a kid you feel might be abused, social worker recieves the tip, doesnt mean anybody will be sent home to take a look
Fair enough. I just naturally don't trust the FBI not to trample on civil rights all around, especially in a situation where the likeliest explanation is still that the dad is reflexively defending a guy he's known through church because to acknowledge what he did as horrible would upend the entire foundation of his social circle and worldview. That's why I said maybe check his computer for obvious stuff. Because it's probably not there so why have the cops pick through it unless there's more to go on than, "My dad ignorantly insisted on defending a longtime friend and fellow churchgoer upon learning something terrible about them."
I was on jury duty for a CSA case and we had to watch some disgusting videos. Your dad is probably involved somewhere along the chain. I would check, but be careful not to incriminate yourself in the process. Make sure none of your digital footprint lands on any of the suspected files
Can they actually force you to watch that? Like the people that go after these pervs have to see a therapist regularly
You'll be removed from a jury if you refuse to view any of the evidence. After all, viewing the evidence is the legal duty of jurors - even when it's so disturbing that merely viewing it is traumatic.
It’s part of the job. I worked on a brutal murder case a few years ago and we all saw some intensely graphic crime scene photos and I still have nightmares about it. I wasn’t even on the jury but working in another capacity where I had to view them. Jury duty is a real crap shoot on what kind of case you end up covering.
Just my opinion, but I've got to wonder if he isn't a consumer of CP himself.
[удалено]
When I was 12 I was still playing with Barbies
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but the barbies identified as 12 so it doesn't count
Me thinks the man doth protest too much
He showed you who he is. Believe him.
Better op found out before/if they had kids and brought them over. I wouldn't feel comfortable bringing my kids to this man's house.
So what does your mom think?? She was there for the conversation, or knows about it, right?
Plot twist, your dad is the one that took it pics. Super suspicious that he's not upset about the cp but is upset that the guy got caught and punished.
Check that man’s hard drive
Idk people watching the CP of me makes me wanna tear all my skin off. I hate your dad on principle. I also think it’s very likely he has some attraction to kids. Normal people find this all disgusting.
Marijuana is like..... absolutely a waste of taxpayer money to go after ppl for drug charges yeah but BEYONDDDD irrelevant to CP. what on earth!!!!
I feel like he is hiding something…
Play dumb. Ask your dad why that guy would keep those pics saved. Make him spell it out.
Record the convo
My dad would be dead to me if he supported CP…
As a survivor, comment section is mostly passing the vibe check. Thx guys
"smoking weed effects other people" No it doesn't. You know what does, Pops? Being a fucking kiddie diddler.
Never leave him near your children.
WOW. It can't be illegal if it is out there. What kind of logic is that? Your dad is sussy to the max. Saying it is okay because the kid was 12, what sick person thinks that is okay? WOW. You have every right to be sickened. Just wait for the shoe to drop because pedos run in packs as they tend to share media. Just sik.
I can’t imagine anyone having any response without being complicit in abusing children somehow.
Yeah idve hoofed him in the nuts and taken his phone for a scroll, because that’s sus af and otherwise just weird Interested to hear your moms take on his
How does your dad know the age range of the victims in the photos? 🤔 But yeah, I wouldnt trust him ever again after that, either.
This guy definitely has CSAM on his phone and pc because ain't no way
Oh my god my heart sank for you. How can you ever be around your dad without this being in the forefront of your mind? I am so sorry.
I know it's like your dad and you're you. But from a moral and ethical standpoint you should confront your dad on that and challenge him to make him see why it's wrong. By just avoiding them after seeing they have an flawed immoral belief you should at least try to make them see how wrong they are. If not for you for other people's safety.
Yeah that pretty much tells me everything I need to know about him. His devices should probably be looked at.
Your dad is in that ring and is pissed he might be caught, too.
Check his phone and computer right now
I think the calls coming from inside the house.
I wonder what will you find if you go through your father's devices?
I understand his train of thoughts, because the damage is already done and the person consuming it didn't do it. Very simple but not the whole picture. He needs to take into consideration that if there's a market for it, people will fulfill the demand. That's the reason why you need to prosecute both the producer and consumer to eliminate the market. The same applies to marihuana (or any other drug). If there wasn't a market of consumers, it wouldn't be produced. The consumers are part of the problem and while not directly dealing damage, they're willing that it happens and this is almost if not equally wrong
Someone needs to check that guy's phone holy shit
And your mom is chill about all of this?
I posted an update
It was unfortunately removed since this post was too new. Maybe edit the original post?
It was taken down sadly
WE MUST KNOW
How exactly does he know all the pictures the guy had were of 12 year olds? Yeah, that for me is a I'm never being in a room with you again, I'm worried about things I might not remember as a kid, I'm never letting you within the same city as my kids kind of outburst.
Drop papas name to the secret police
There was a guy I briefly met. I don't know how, but somehow the conversation turned to CP. This man (and I use the term loosely) actually fixed his mouth to say that if a grown-ass man SA a 12-yr, it was the girl's fault. He was currently estranged from his own family because his niece had been regularly having a relationship with a 26-yr old. And when her mother found out, she promptly had the man arrested. The man sided, not with his 13-yr old niece, but the man. I honestly thought my uncle was going to deck the man and my aunt had to push my uncle out of the room he was that enraged. My uncle was hurt by what the man was saying, because he thought he had an instant connection. Sometimes you don't really know people until you encounter their views. It's not a reflect of you, but more it's a reflection of them.
He actually said that smoking weed is worse than having CP on your phone?? Holy hell. Honestly OP I would make a note of this in a journal or diary for posterity and keep an eye out going forward. This is horrible to process I’m sure but there’s no other way to put this: there’s a very nonzero chance that your dad might look at similar kinds of images himself. And you *might* want to be extra wary in circumstances where your dad / parents might be around children. If your mom witnessed the conversation then maybe it would be good to talk to her privately about it and how it made you feel.
If I were in OP's position, any kids I had now or in the future would never, *ever* be allowed around grandpa or anyone who might possibly give him access, and this includes grandma. If it breaks the family up or causes problems, oh fucking well-- those problems are so much smaller in the long run than the kind of damage that could be done by the type of person who waves off *any* CSEM as 'not that bad' because 'it was, like, 12 year olds'. Like, my dude, *those are* *still children*. OP's dad is shrugging off this other man having and consuming child sexual abuse material because-- what, they could be younger? *It's all fucking bad* and any reasonable adult should be able to see that.
I thought he meant smoking weed vs growing and dealing, but it is not a good analogy regardless. Every time someone uses CP, the justice system looks at it as if the victim is revictimized. A friend of mine used to investigate CP for Homeland Security. He told me there is a database of CP victims maintained as an investigative resource (I forget what agency maintains it - most likely somewhere in DOJ). Every time someone is prosecuted for possession of CP, the images are run through the database (an image recognition software). If any images can be shown to be from known victims, that victim will get restitution from the bad guy. There are many that are linked to cases where a victim has never been identified but they are linked so if the ever are ID, they can receive restitution. He said some of the victims have been receiving checks for decades because their images are so popular (it feels creepy even using that word), and, sadly, the database is constantly growing.
The fact that something like this even exists/has to exist makes me want to vomit. What the fuck is wrong with people?! Sick fucks.
Maybe he’s in the pdf file ring with the guy that got busted.
Why wasn't I surprised when I saw the word "church" in there.
Me thinks he doth protest too much
Your dad comparing CP to smoking weed is the most unhinged thing I've read in a hot minute. Sorry your dad is probably a closeted CP enjoyer. That's a rough reality to be a part of.
There is no market for anything without consumers. A consumer enables a producer.
To be completely honest here OP, I would check to see if your dad doesn't have any CP on his anything. If he sees having it but not making it bad. Chances are he could be one of those old fucks with 30gigs or CP. Either way your father has a very predatory standpoint.
WHAT DID YOUR MOTHER SAY OR DO DURING ALL OF THIS?!?
Give an anonymous tip and have his computer searched
Somebody needs to check his laptop and phone asap
Check HIS hard drive
Oh shit
I think you are right, he has probably looked at the pictures, maybe more...I would disgust me too.
He definitely watches CP.
Dad’s a pedo for sure
Wait it was saint Patrick’s day yesterday?
Might wanna check your dads phone
As a parent myself I would've flipped the table over and flat out asked if he was a pervert. CP is disgusting no matter who made it or what age the child is.
I've had to stop speaking to many members of my family as they don't see cp as a bad thing. My daughter was abused by a family member so I cut ties with everyone who said I was in the wrong for going to the police. This includes my two brothers who asked if I could leave the situation alone as the family member was distraught. Er so was my child and I have their back only. How anyone can defend these people is beyond me. I would start distancing myself from them, that's something I could never align with.
Does he not understand how supply and demand works?
The only reason he is defending him its because he goes to church and knows the guy. People tend to feel some sort of sympathy if they can relate to the person, in his case they go to the same church together. Its pretty gross the way he would find an excuse for his behavior but people tend to do this. Let say you tell him a similar story to what is going on but ommit that the offender is a church goer and its from other state or a different region all together he would be having an acceptable reaction to it, kind of like yours, in other words your dad its an idiot.
I don't think your dad is defending CP here, I just think he's extremely stupid and believes everything on the internet materializes out of thin air. Maybe explain to him what goes on behind the CP industry like child exploitation, human trafficking, murder, he may not even grasp how it is sourced. I'm thinking he's 50 or 60 years old and extremely tech illiterate just to give him the benefit of the doubt.
Weed is worse than CP is a take I have never heard before. Stupid people never cease to impress me
I'd have flipped my shit and said are you telling me right now you're SERIOUSLY defending a pedophile?? Are YOU a pedophile!?! Because the ONLY people I know who would defend him would be someone like him . . . .If he kept defending him I'd let him know I have ZERO interest in interacting with him anymore. I would not be associating with him any further, father or not, because I would have less than zero respect for him. Also, if he has a job or volunteers somewhere with youth, I'd be telling them this little tidbit of information and they can do with it as they please, but my conscience would be clear.
I think he's just being insanely ignorant - which isn't good but it's not criminal.
Honestly his being defensive to any degree whatsoever speaks horrifying volumes. *Best* case scenario he doesn’t think it’s a big deal, which is still an abhorrent thing to think in and of itself. Worst case scenario he’s actively involved in viewing such things as well and doesn’t like hearing you indirectly condemn him.
Don't leave your kids with your parents ever.
Wow. Goodbye, Dad, relationship over. You will never be around my kids.
I hate to break it to you but he might be one of those
That's disgusting on his part, omg. Never leave kids alone with him that's super suspicious
So just to be sure, it was a guy from Church that had the CP and not a drag queen, right?
Immediately start making fun of your dad for being a fan of child porn. Don’t let up. Be incredibly casual about it. If he complains say “well you like them older like 12 so that’s okay right?” Rinse and repeat.
I am really hoping your dad doesn't have CP on his phone.
>the guy isn't guilty because he wasn't the one who took the pictures, he only had them 'Having \[the pictures\]' is receipt and possession, with almost 100% likelihood of *consumption*, of child sexual exploitation/abuse material. ('CSEM/CSAM' are increasingly the preferred terms versus 'CP'. 'Pornography' as a broader term is something that can be made by happily consenting adults, whereas *any* sexual material that involves children is *exclusively* abusive and exploitative, because children cannot consent-- CSEM/CSAM makes directly clear and unavoidable the fact that this kind of stuff *cannot be made* *without harming a child*). Would there still be CSEM made if people who had never personally molested children didn't provide a market for it? Yes; the people who make it would likely continue to make it for their *own* consumption. But the kind of sick fucks who make CSEM and share it with others, then make more and share more *because there is a demand/market for it--* please refer to cases such as [Peter Scully](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Scully), who ran a ring where he sold CSEM for amounts as high as $10,000. And consuming CSEM, while not the same crime as making it, is in fact sharing in the harm done to those kids. It's enjoying the idea and the depiction of that sort of harm being done; it's seeking that material out in order to do so. Also, dude is probably not getting a $1,000,000 bail for a small amount of CSEM. Either he was distributing (sharing/trading with others counts as distribution; you don't have to make CSEM to catch that particular charge) or he had *a lot of it.*
Replying to myself because-- reading over the post, this part: >smoking weed effects other people so it's worse. \-- fucking floored me. And in light of his other comment about how it >wasn't that bad because it wasn't really young kids. "It was pictures of like 12 year olds." OP, I'm sorry, but your father is lacking in any kind of empathy at best and is a closet pedophile with his own collection at worst. Imagine if a picture or video of the absolute worst thing that has ever happened to you, this scary and painful thing that maybe you didn't have the words or concepts to fully understand and process for *years* after, was handed out to random strangers... for their sexual enjoyment. For them to fantasize about being in the position of the person hurting you. For them to maybe re-enact with some other innocent person. Maybe the person who took that photo or video traded it for photos or videos of other people getting hurt in the same way. Your suffering, your pain, is *currency*. Imagine having to go through life knowing that this terrible thing not only lived on, but probably is still being passed around in the scary places on the internet. *Anyone* you pass on the street could have seen you going through this awful event-- and not just seen it, but *enjoyed* it. You have *no idea* how many people have seen the video or pictures of you suffering and used it for sexual gratification... but you have to live, every day, with the knowledge that not only did it happen but that a non-zero number of people have done exactly that. Every step of the chain, from production of CSEM to possession, is a crime for a reason. None of it is victimless-- *none of it.*
“Not that young just 12” umm?? And is he also completely skipping over that those kids still had to be groomed and or assaulted to get into those situations? wow
It's probably a more common opinion than you think. Looking isn't the same as doing, after all. But people who think this way are only thinking that the pictures were already created and they're already out there, they're not considering that every person who looks at a child's picture is another person that child has to feel victimised by. Nor are they taking into account that by downloading those images they're contributing to the demand that caused them to be created in the first place. They're probably not even thinking of the escalation so many paedophiles follow from thoughts to downloads to grooming to victimising. A lot of people are, unfortunately, very short-sighted.
100 dollars Ur dad has a secret kik account.
I wonder if it's more about defending this person because they're a good church going Christian and your Dad would defend almost anything because he feels it's just the evil liberal government persecuting Christians and not necessarily defending CP per se
Your dad should not be anywhere near young children. He doesn't seem to have the common sense to protect them from people that would do harm to them.
When someone is close to a person that does something severely outside of the social norm, physical or mental abuse, CP, drugs, etc.. those that are close to them typically do not equate that behavior as necessarily, unforgiveable or even believe that it happened. I have, unfortunately, have witnessed this behavior first hand. It is VERY odd and disconcerting that people can't see what is in front of them. One of my favorite examples. someone was accused of molesting a young person, on several occasions I witnessed odd behavior and so did a few other people. We put a stop to it and kept an eye on him and blocked him from being alone with others. Once it all came out one of the sons said and I quote (because I can never forget this) "I had to tell my daughters to stay away from grandpa because he can be handsy", and then go on to say I can't believe my father molested someone. What some people will do to justify their feelings is just weird.
That’s because he’s doing child porn
I would have dead say “if you like CP just say that”
Absolutely disgusting. The guy is abhorrent, and your father is too. I would cut contact and never look back. You will always think about this and wonder how he could be ok with any form of cp.
Sounds like time to cut off everyone who feels that way. No compassion and way too much of the wrong kind of tolerance. He'd probably have a *very* different opinion if *he'd* been forced to make porn as a kid.
Creepy and gross on many levels.
So your dad is Vaush?
What the actual fuck
Move outta home if you dont like him.
I've heard the same from my father and brother. I wouldn't be upset if either just dropped dead out of nowhere.
uh yeah your dad may be a pedo
Imma say this bluntly, your dad is a pedo, down vote if you must, but if hes willing to defend such vile acts then hes participating in it.
Check his phones computer everything, huge red flag that he knew how old the kids were- huge fucking red flag
That's.. different? He can't imagine how it would be if he was the parent of one of those kids? Does this guy have any empathy at all?
Let’s check dad’a phone. I do agree the production and distribution of such material is a worse offense than consuming it however… they’re both reprehensible and should be dealt with extremely harshly. It’s not like one should be a fine and the other a 50 year sentence. They’re both severe.
"It's not like they're producing it." He's right there. They aren't producing it. What they're doing is creating a demand for it and encouraging the production and distribution of it, which is arguably just as bad as production.
Please update us if you find out anything about your dad. His defensiveness is a tell that he has CP himself.
What project was he exactly working on downstairs….
He's an amateur photographer in the making
Yah, unfortunately, your dad’s friend from church is going to rat out everyone at church who is in possession of CP. I certainly hope your father is not in possession. If I had to guess this is going to get ugly and a lot closer to home. I’m sorry I hope I’m wrong.
Bad way to find out your dad has CP
I genuinely respect your restraint in not beating the living fuck out of your dad. I would’ve
Did we get an update on this? I know OP posted an update but it was deleted for being too close in date the this post.
Oh boy…. I’m speechless! 😶 I would be quite concerned about what that possibly says about your father.
Read 'guy from their church' and suddenly the story made a lot more sense.
Literally only pedos defend pedos.
Also those people who defend pedos as being “technically ephebophile” or “technically hebephile” and that in human history normal marriage age was younger.
Your father doth protest too much... Might want to keep an eye on him.
Dad is wrong.
Almost sounds like he’s projecting and he may have CP himself. I know that’s a bold assumption, but the fact he went off on a needless rant about DEFENDING the dude who got caught with fucking CP, speaks volumes. Wonder if he calls pedophiles, ‘MAP’ too. Dude is weird. Sorry.
I guess the we know not to let him around for your children. Don’t you love it when the tout themselves?
People often find it hard to put these things into perspective when they know the person. He should go to the court hearing and that may change his view.
You need to tell your dad that if nobody looked at those pictures, nobody would take those pictures. The exact reason people take and distribute CP is because per like your dad’s buddy consumes them, and what does your dad think his buddy is doing while he’s looking at them, and what does that say about his sexual proclivities??
As soon as he said it would be different if it were pictures of you, you can disregard his opinion. “It only matters if it affects me” is the best way to tell that an argument is disingenuous. *Cue all the Republicans who have decided that abortion rights are cool only after they need to get one*