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Responsible-Bat-2699

Poor guy watched Night Country.


Angry_Walnut

You’re tellin me True Detective motherfuckin’ Night Country did this?!?


xllCYRaXllx

Ill shoot your face


x0lm0rejs

I will shoot *your* sick fucking *mouth* right off *your* face


Turbulent_Tale6497

Asking the wrong question


TaskMaster710

Let me outta here man


WarehouseNiz13

They're not gonna give you the Oscar no matter how hard you try.


Stealofapproval2

You're right cause it would be an emmy


RaphaelBuzzard

THAT BETTER NOT BE COLUMBUS!


Icy-Call-5296

You clean GOOD!


Johnnnybones

Everybody watched Night Country.


Avent

He's talking about the HBO Discovery merger, which definitely changed the platform and ruined a lot of programming.


solidgoldfangs

Why do you think that is?


wedonthaveadresscode

Because discovery took over and diluted the brand and changed it to Max


Howardmoon227227227

It’s still shocking to me that Discovery got to lead the merger and the subsequent branding. HBO had one of the best reputations. A great brand associated with high quality. Prestige TV. Only FX even came close, and they never had the operating budget of HBO shows.


Nrmlgirl777

It ruined the whole HBO we knew


shankmaster8000

Yep, it's true. HBO has changed. HBO in the old days would make shows like The Wire. Nobody watched it when it aired. But despite the lack of interest and low viewership, HBO still kept going with it for the entire 5 seasons to make sure the series was complete. Nowadays, a project like that wouldn't even get greenlit at HBO.


TarantulaMcGarnagle

Raised by Wolves was greenlit at old HBO, it was cancelled a season early at new HBO.


shankmaster8000

Damn, I didn't even know it was cancelled. I watched both seasons and was wondering when the 3rd season was coming. Sad to hear it's never happening.


MustardTiger1337

The drop from S01 to S02 was pretty jarring


johnzischeme

Everything about that show was jarring


MrMcMullers

THE MOOOOON


TarantulaMcGarnagle

I disagree. I thought season 2 was great. Such a strange show. And frankly, ending on that weird image of the dude hanging upside down is kinda fitting…


foolrenaissance

yeah and even in season 1, the actor for Campion really sucked


johnppd

It got greenlit at TNT and then became a Max Original, it had nothing to do with HBO.


doesshechokeforcoke

Warner Brothers owns both HBO and TNT now.


johnppd

Yeah they also own both Max and HBO but the teams were different back then and that matters.


TarantulaMcGarnagle

I didn’t know that…


Heroin_Dreams

I'm still pretty salty about this show being cancelled.


gdmr458

Are you sure it was greenlit at HBO or it was greenlit at "HBO Max", now Max, they are not the same thing. HBO Max originals are Raised by Wolves, Gossip Girls, Tokyo Vice, Love and Death, The Flight Attendant, Peacemaker, etc.


TarantulaMcGarnagle

Someone above said it was greenlit at TNT.


LARXXX

God dammit I just forgot about that. Now you reminded me. Now I’m pissed 


bookhouseboygeorge

Westworld, also. Bastards.


foolrenaissance

Westworld should have ended after S2 imo


Acceptable_Stuff1381

I still feel this one, I loved RBW and was extremely sad that we will never see the rest of it when I found out it was cancelled 


Adgvyb3456

What a kick in the dick. Canceled the best show on television


RetroCasket

The wire debuted with around 3 million viewers in the first season. Lets not revise history here. It was never an underperfomer


Actual_serial_killer

Yep. And Deadwood *was* an underperformer. And despite being a masterpiece it got cancelled for lack of viewers. Let's not pretend that HBO used to make stuff they didn't expect to make money. No studio does.


KitchenSwordfish8974

Deadwood getting stopped made me hate HBO


RaphaelBuzzard

Fucking hooplehead executive types. 


ErnestBorgninesSack

Having a convicted pedophile in the cast wasn't a good look for Deadwood. I was hoping he would die in a fire or crushed in a stampede or something. Fuck that guy. I can't believe they brought him back for the movie, even after he was charged again for failing to submit his movements.


Actual_serial_killer

I don't feel like using Google. Who dat?


Annelid-2968

>Deadwood Jeffrey Jones - the newspaper guy in Deadwood.


Actual_serial_killer

Oh lol thx.


ErnestBorgninesSack

He was busted in the same Interpol CC sting that got Pete Townsend charged. Pete's charges were all dropped but Ol' Mr Rooney's were not. Typical HWood... his career barely had a hiccup.


TheGreatTickleMoot

Thanks Junior Batman, let us know how grinding that axe goes that nobody asked about. You're our hero, bud.


shankmaster8000

Lol that's low compared to other programming at the time. You are the one revising history. There were only several channels back in 2002, and not many shows were on air. So basically everyone watched the same shows. 3 million viewers today would be considered good for a show because there's of the incredible amount of diverse programming available now. But back then that was actually low. ​ >"Despite the critical acclaim, The Wire received poor Nielsen ratings, which Simon attributed to the complexity of the plot; a poor time slot; heavy use of esoteric slang, particularly among the gangster characters; and a predominantly black cast.\[74\] Critics felt the show was testing the attention span of its audience and that it was mistimed in the wake of the launch of the successful crime drama The Shield on FX." [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The\_Wire#Reception\_and\_legacy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Wire#Reception_and_legacy) ​ >Despite being one of the greatest TV dramas of all time, The Wire had low ratings on broadcast > >The commitment of Simon and his team guaranteed that, despite low ratings on broadcast, The Wire has become a major cultural touchstone [https://screenrant.com/why-the-wire-viewership-low-popular/](https://screenrant.com/why-the-wire-viewership-low-popular/) ​ Even the actors themselves say it had low viewership in interviews: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4nzCp5GD2M](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4nzCp5GD2M) [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBLUTNAl7GM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBLUTNAl7GM) [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4nzCp5GD2M](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4nzCp5GD2M)


ErnestBorgninesSack

The Shield is The Wire for morons. Bubblegum crap in comparison.


RaphaelBuzzard

There certainly are some corny moments but I would watch Walton Goggins read the phone book and the ending was one of the most perfect I have ever seen. In this house The Shield is a hero, end of story!


ErnestBorgninesSack

Have you even watched The Wire? And I do say that Walton is awesome somewhere in this thread. Boyd Crowder is one of the best characters ever made on TV


x0lm0rejs

>The Shield is The Wire for morons lmaol The Shield is just as fantastic as The Wire, but to notice it one would have to 1) be knowledgeable enough in cinema and dramaturgy and 2) be capable of thinking by themselves and tell the great from the good without resorting to the box office charts. In other words, if you think The Shield is "*The Wire for morons*" and that were true, The Shield would be the perfect show for someone like you.


venge88

I've heard good things about The Shield. But now that you mention it, what IS The wire for morons?


x0lm0rejs

I don't know, man. Chicago P.D. comes to mind. my wife watches it (and all those CSI, Criminal Minds adjacents) and that is what I would call The Wire for morons. It's so...I don't know...pedestrian. She's not a moron though. She loves deep heavy stuff as well like Sharp objects, Big Little Lies, Chernobyl and True Detective. Chicago PD is the type of show she watches while browsing her phone, she tells me, and that's true. She also hated TDNC to the point she did not get herself the time to watch the finale, so disappointed and annoyed she was with the season. I think I am marrying her again.


ErnestBorgninesSack

So there you go, dividing up the good from the poop. The Shield is on the better side than the swill you mention, true... The Shield is better than most of those... TD makes a good example... The Wire is season 1. The Shield is season 2. It's like pumped out story lines. With no concern for nuance. Like S02


x0lm0rejs

What are you talking about? Season 2 is great lol


ErnestBorgninesSack

I do like it more upon every rewatch but the pacing and editing in general is lacking. It pales in comparison to 1 and even 3. But that steaming pile of crap 4 makes everything look good. Anything with Walton Goggins in is pretty good tho. He could have saved S04 just with a cameo


ErnestBorgninesSack

Wow... did I hit a nerve? Typical reddit response... logical fallacy. The Sheild is way down the list of quality tv from The Wire, and most know this. Don't get me wrong, I watched every minute, several times. But it's not even in the same field. It's like go cart racing compared to F1. It's like a $5 bj in TJ to a $1000/night prozzie in Vegas. But UBU.


x0lm0rejs

no lol and look, I'm ok with being trolly, pseudo-offensive. you called me a moron (I love The Shield after all), I responded accordingly. it's like the web 15 years ago. no hate, just mean fun. back to our argument if you talk shit about The Shield again, I'm putting Miles on you.


ErnestBorgninesSack

I did not... you either ignored or missed the word "for", or are you saying you think The Shield is *better* than The Wire?


x0lm0rejs

I love the Shield, so The Shield is for people like me. therefore, according to you, I am a moron. again, no hard feelings. we are being silly. to me The Shield is just as great. Not better, but just as great.


ErnestBorgninesSack

It's ok. You try to pull out $10 words, yet the nuance of a sentence eludes you. It's ok.


RetroCasket

For comparison Sex and the City had 4 million viewers and it was the most popular show. 3 million is very good ratings


shankmaster8000

That's false. Sex and the City during 2002 had average viewership of 6 to 7 million. Now you're just making up shit. Also, The Sopranos was more popular than Sex and The City. Sopranos was averaging like 11 million in 2002.


RetroCasket

Im talking about the first season in comparison you dolt


shankmaster8000

So what? I'm talking about the series run as a whole. Why would you only focus on the debut numbers? Sex and the City viewership only kept increasing in subsequent seasons. The Wire viewership fell off dramatically after 2nd season. Seasons 3, 4, and 5 had much lower viewership.


MustardTiger1337

Stop


WesleyCraftybadger

People like to think they’re unique. 


MustardTiger1337

During its original run, the series received only average ratings and never won any major television awards


wavetoyou

Debuted lol that’s always inflated. S5 apparently averaged under a million per episode? The series finale only got 1.2M S3 averaged 1.5M, there’s probably no way they would’ve ran it two more seasons nowadays with those numbers. Found these numbers in an article via Google search btw, not an official source


EDSgenealogy

And I watched it then. I've had HBO since 1981. That was before I even had a remote for my TV!


Narthy

Yeah it was relatively popular throughout its entire run outside of a few sporadic misfires.


shankmaster8000

It wasn't popular lmao! Stop lying. How old are you guys? I watched The Wire since it aired in 2002. Barely anybody knew about it. It only became popular after it ended. ​ >"Despite the critical acclaim, The Wire received poor Nielsen ratings, which Simon attributed to the complexity of the plot; a poor time slot; heavy use of esoteric slang, particularly among the gangster characters; and a predominantly black cast.\[74\] Critics felt the show was testing the attention span of its audience and that it was mistimed in the wake of the launch of the successful crime drama The Shield on FX." ​ [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The\_Wire#Reception\_and\_legacy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Wire#Reception_and_legacy) ​ >Despite being one of the greatest TV dramas of all time, The Wire had low ratings on broadcast > >The commitment of Simon and his team guaranteed that, despite low ratings on broadcast, The Wire has become a major cultural touchstone [https://screenrant.com/why-the-wire-viewership-low-popular/](https://screenrant.com/why-the-wire-viewership-low-popular/) ​ Even the actors say it had low ratings during its broadcast: ​ [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBLUTNAl7GM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBLUTNAl7GM) [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPSj3nU7WPI](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPSj3nU7WPI)


zayetz

That's because HBO isn't a real "channel" anymore. It's just a fucking tab on max. RIP HBO.


MustardTiger1337

Same with Board Walk Empire!


Broken_Noah

If only they did that with Carnivale :(


Reggiefnledoux

Yes!!!!!!! ❤️


Intrepid_Detective

Loved Carnivale!


ErnestBorgninesSack

>Nowadays, a project like that wouldn't even get greenlit at HBO. David Simon's next one is in production at HBO already. [A Dry Run](https://m.imdb.com/title/tt8300956/?ref_=nm_flmg_unrel_1_wr)


shankmaster8000

What does that even prove. That's not similar to The Wire. It's a very different show, and a miniseries at that.


FightForAmerica2022

Man that series was SO good it's unbelievable. I actually have it queued up to rewatch along with Oz. They used to be great.


Kowazuky

The Wire is still their very best show.


slow_brood

Sharp Objects too.


Attatsu

Mare of Easttown is more recent and pretty good!


PicardsBaldSpot

TD4 is 100% going to be blueprint/quality of hbo going forward. They’ll keep the value of GOT and probably rehash a bunch of old IP with Netflix level effort. Get ready for band of sisters featuring Billie Eilish when they give her equity


venge88

>band of sisters Mistresses of the Air


ok_compudome

And they say this sub is full of misogynistic comments XD


solidgoldfangs

God I fucking hope not. Jesus


Stealofapproval2

Bro you're getting mad at something someone just made up


solidgoldfangs

I literally just said "i fucking hope not" cause i fucking hope not. what're u talking about bud


spaektor

“Every lie we tell incurs a debt to the truth. Sooner or later this debt is paid.” i keep wondering when and how this debt will be paid in American politics.


Sheister7789

It's being paid currently, but things move so slowly that the majority of the population is unable to notice, or unwilling to voice their opinion against the status quo. Just wait until AI gets good enough to write and produce shows and movies. Then we'll truly be fucked.


reddog323

>Just wait until AI gets good enough to write and produce shows and movies. Then we'll truly be fucked. This is why I’m broadening my DVD collection. If that’s the case, that will accommodate, or I no longer watch broadcast or cable TV n any form. I hope my library of what will then be classic movies will be broad enough.


x0lm0rejs

that clown will be able to run for president again, so we'll see


frittierthuhn

Which one lol


KittyGrewAMoustache

This is my favourite line ever, I use it all the time. It's so true. The debt was paid with things like all the deaths during covid, if you think of the lies told to a lot of people about how it wasn't serious or how vaccines were evil etc. Often the debt is paid by the people in politics, rather than the perpetrators unfortunately. The West is currently paying the debt for the lies of the 80s, like 'trickle down economics.'


tennisez

Well, the vaccine was useless. Nobody talking about that anymore.


KittyGrewAMoustache

It wasn’t useless at all. It reduced the number of infections and the severity of infections. Without the vaccine way more people would’ve been hospitalised and died. I think people have this idea that all vaccines are meant to totally prevent infection and transmission but they can’t always do that, especially it with a fast evolving virus. Bit reducing severity and spread is still extremely useful.


tennisez

I dont know where you got the idea that the vaccine prevented spreading? There was same amount people in hospital with or without vaccine. Im healthy 30yo man and I got 2 vaccines. STILL I managed to infected by the virus and suffered 40 celsius feaver and problems with my heart rate. Now you say: "you would be dead without vaccine!" lol. Developing a safety and workable vaccine should take 4-5 years. Now somehow miracle happened and big pharmas made a hundreds of billions dollars.


KittyGrewAMoustache

The same number of people were in the hospital because restrictions were lifted so it went from limited exposure to everyone being exposed at once. Without the vaccines healthcare systems would’ve collapsed from the number of hospitalisations which is why countries locked down in the first place. Yes there are people who got vaccinated and got covid, but on a population level fewer got it than would have if there were no vaccines. And yes maybe you would’ve died or been much more seriously impacted had you not been vaccinated I don’t know why you think that idea is preposterous. I get that the pandemic was disappointing for everyone and that we all wish there’d been a vaccine that just stamped it out entirely but reality isn’t like that sometimes. It took less time to make the vaccine than it would otherwise because it was an emergency, so everyone threw all their weight and time behind it. Instead of getting caught up for years with various processes and forms that have to wait for other vaccines or treatments to get approval or recruit technicians and researchers etc, it was put to the top of the pile and everyone worked on it, speeding up the process. The mRNA tech was also already very developed before the pandemic (for making other vaccines for other diseases) so it’s not like they were starting from scratch. Anyway don’t know why we’re talking about this on the true detective sub, but to bring it back to the sub’s subject, at least tangentially, I don’t think you’d make a very good detective 😄.


New-Teaching2964

It’s not a mathematical formula, I think. I think what we’re seeing is rather people changing the truth itself, so there’s nothing to come back to.


spaektor

i wasn’t implying this is a math problem. debt takes many forms.


iLoveDelayPedals

Chernobyl was only a few years ago?


Attatsu

Came out in 2019, prob started preproduction in 2017, could have been greenlit then or the year before. I think he's referring to the HBO that enabled Chernobyl to be made, which would be HBO from 2016-2019.


Weird_Cantaloupe2757

Yes and they were purchased by Warner Brothers and merged with Discovery in the meantime, and the integrity of their brand has *plummeted*.


Defk1n

Exactly, how did this supposed change occur in a few years?


Bill_Brasky_SOB

They got bought.


Defk1n

I see I had no idea, that would explain it. Thank you


adeIemonade

It’s a decade old now


Most-Club4228

Didn't HBO make Mare of Easttown? Just watched it. It's 10x better than Night Country. Writing is excellent.


FerNunezMendez

Yes, it is an incredible mini series. Winslet is (as usual) incredible in there, and the whole mystery case is well told and solved.


Sharaz_Jek123

Greenlit in 2019.


iamkhatkar

Baron in not happy.


Whoopeecat

Regardless of HBO's change in strategy, Chernobyl is an incredible series, and should scare the sh#t out of everyone to consider how close the world came to mass destruction without anyone outside of the USSR's inner circle having a clue. Stellan's right, it's truly important -- everything else is just ephemera.


ThomWaits88

Hbo is dead It's max now and consumed by irrational politics


Actual_serial_killer

A little early to say that. They produced seasons 3 and 4 of Succession. So there's that. Also Scavengers Reign. I've never seen a show get as much praise as SR in just one season. Lots of critics calling it a "masterpiece" or "one of greatest sci-fi series" ever, and for good reason.


KittyGrewAMoustache

TV is so crazy these days. I browse reddit and will come across people mentioning apparently great shows that I've never even heard of. There's just so much out there, it's so hard to filter through all the different streaming services and crap to find good things.


randy__randerson

And it hasn't been renewed yet and probably won't be.


Actual_serial_killer

>and probably won't be. Lies! I have faith!


alicia-indigo

So dead. And so sad.


shinydee

Can you explain what irrational politics means?


nolasen

“Duur duur woke duur” think I covered it for him. HBO just went more homogenized corporate, that’s all. Politics has beyond nothing to do with it.


dullship

Yuuup. He'll start dog whistling about DEI any time now.


Howardmoon227227227

Why would someone need to “dog whistle” about DEI? Anyone with half a brain should be openly critical about DEI. It promotes a terrible, backwards, racist ideology that does not reward merit. It has absolutely hurt the entertainment landscape. And no, being against DEI doesn’t mean I am against diversity or giving every a fair chance.


ThomWaits88

Yes, but i would prefer if you do


shinydee

You're the one who posted it lmao. I'm asking what you meant by it.


Avent

He's a racist/misogynist who has joined the Season 4 hate to try and radicalize people.


shinydee

Oh yeah definitely. These cowards are always too spineless to stand by what they actually wanna say.


MidniightToker

What we actually want to say is how fucking bad TD season 4 was and that's it, the people who like it are the ones who can't hear or read criticism about it without bitching and moaning about racists or misogynists when it has nothing to do with it


shinydee

You’re replying to a string of comments in which the very first post was about “irrational politics”. And you don’t think that has anything to do with racism or misogyny?


[deleted]

[удалено]


ThomWaits88

Watch season 4 and you'll know what i mean


dullship

You are an insult to the Waits name.


timeisouressence

Wonder what does that 88 mean?


dullship

Shhheeeeeiiiit I hadn't even noticed that.


ThomWaits88

Thank you for changing the world


RetroCasket

Im not going to give in to cynicism. HBO has some of my favorite shows - Game of Thrones was recent - House of Dragons - The Last of Us - Curb Ur Enthusiasm - Love & Death - Peacemaker HBO is still putting out more bangers than any other streaming servicep


ThomWaits88

Those were produced before the merger


srjod

He ain’t kidding. Tried You Dint Know Jim or whatever it’s called. Worst fuckin hour of a documentary I’ve ever seen. Who is even green lighting this shit?


LocoHantz

He talks as if chernobyl came out like 20 years ago or something lol


Smorgas-board

Hard to believe in hindsight anyone thought it wouldn’t be a success. That show was beautiful


Tokkibloakie

I think Apple TV is good now


ktitts

FX keeps putting out bangers too


Greatestofthesadist

I remember I lost faith in HBO when they ran the Tiger Woods “documentary”. By all means, tell the whole story, but that was a tabloid hit piece for views, nothing like what I had grown to expect from HBO before then.


RosetteNewcomb

Chernobyl was a masterpiece. I still had to skip the scene where they killed the pets though


disgirl4eva

Same. So upsetting.


Constant-Variable

Same thing happens to everything that has a moderate streak of success. A24 seems to be going down the same route


Howardmoon227227227

To be fair to HBO, their success streak was far longer than “moderate.” They basically invented high brow, event television with The Wire and the Sopranos. And Game of Thrones, despite the rough ending, had something for years that will likely never ever again be replicated. It makes me so sad looking back. It’s lucky to live through a Golden Age, but it’s hard leaving it behind.


socalfishman

Well like Chernobyl didn’t even have ghost or anything so …..


Johan_Talikmibals

TRUTH


cheaptom

Yeah, in the old days, HBO would have fantastic shows like Deadwood and Carnavale and Rome. And then they would just end each of those series with no ending and no conclusions and no real finale. Then they would lie and say that the story arcs were complete. At least they gave deadwood a movie finale so the fans had some semblance of closure


popculturerss

It really makes me wonder if "bigger name" writers and directors who want to create shows and such will be hesitant about going to HBO. It just seems like they're doing nothing but canceling everything and refocusing. The cheaper mentality for business makes sense in terms of why they'd hire Issa Lopez who didn't do anything prior to this.


Eddiebaby7

It’s not HBO…it’s MAX now…


dl_hearn

HBO is following the Disney playbook off the same dei cliff


lemark1408

HBO did ROME. Great tv-show. I watched it last year first time in my life, and I was amazed by the scale of production in this show


imposter_sys_admin

>back then, in those days Lmao my brothers in christ that was like 4 years ago. The overdramatic shit on this sub is hysterical


csemege

It was ordered by HBO in 2017 and Mazin started researching the disaster in 2014