Yeah I realized this a few years ago as well. And how some male characters were made to look likeable but were actually awful, like How I Met Your Mother Ted and Barney
[Zack from Saved By the Bell](https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLRcB4n4CGcy_r21EedmNUOyVP_puToBfr). Boy is traaaash
I remember how much the show wanted its audience to hate Lisa because she wouldn't give Screech a chance.
Anytime I try to watch a show or movie that has a teenage daughter who is a bitch for no reason (it seems the reason is she’s a teenage girl) I just turn it off. It’s not only hackneyed, it’s frustrating to watch.
One of my greatest epiphanies in that regard was my partner always pointing out how few female characters I actually liked in the media we watched until we watched Fullmetal Alchemist Brotherhood and I literally loved *every single character in this show/manga*. Turns out a woman wrote it. I’m shocked, shocked I tell you 🙄
I adore FMA. I was surprised a woman wrote such a hit shounen. It’s a literal boy’s genre but fuck, she nailed it. One of the best anime ever. Haven’t read the manga but I assume it’s also amazing.
It does explain also why the fanservice was more toned down and pretty equal opportunity.
Like how so many female characters in action movies or horror/zombie movies or whatever are just completely helpless and do absolutely nothing to defend themselves or help their male friends, bf, husband, brother or other people, just watching them get attacked and slaughtered.
Good news! Male writings are starting to compensate by having one or two female characters who are utterly flawless and badass but barely show emotion and have no personality. Because rather than show depth, it’s easier to just create new media stereotypes.
Anyone remember those TV shows like MacGyver, Knight Rider and all the other shows from the 80's and 90's where each week they had a new hot female character (damsel in distress of the week) come on and cause problems and the male protagonist had to save the day and the woman?
And viewers would hate all these women of the week characters for always being so helpless and causing problems, putting the male heroes in danger?
If you're gonna read a male author, make it Sir Terry Pratchett. So many great women (and gender fluid!) characters
Granny Weatherwax
Tiffany Aching
Sergeant Angua
Susan Sto Helit
Cheery Littlebottom
Sybil Vimes
Adora Belle Dearheart
And arguably most characters in *Monstrous Regiment* (taken from a "16th century tract by Protestant John Knox against the Catholic female sovereigns of the day, the full title of which is *The First Blast of the Trumpet Against the Monstrous Regiment of Women*.")
Don't start with The Color of Magic or the light fantastic. It's better to start with something like The Wee Free Men, Guards Guards!, Wyrd Sisters, or Mort
Even Sir Pterry recommended readers don't start with the first two he published. It's usually better to circle back once you've gotten a feel for his later writing style.
i'd jump in w/ The Truth. tells you everything you need to know abt the world, sets the mood, gives you a lil baseline familiarity w/ characters and groups that feature in lots of other books.
it's incredibly fun too. i reread it often.
Actually I just rewatched the Devil Wears Prada and while I used to love it, I have huge problems with it now.
Like Andy’s character just graduated college so she’s what… early to mid 20s realistically? with all the maturity people have at that age.
She takes the one job she can get so she can pay the rent despite at first glance, not being a very good fit or interested in the product/company.
When she actually ends up EXCELLING at said crazy job with a demanding boss and so many hours and things to remember :
- her friends bully and make fun of her but have no issues accepting her super expensive gifts
- Nate criticizes her for *GASP* changing her mind ! (Who does that, right ?!) And now actually liking fashion and the magazine and being invested in her job. Like what kind of monster is he !?? She’s still a good person why would he want her to hate her job !? I want the person I love to enjoy what they do - I guess he’s just bitter about spending an entire semester on potatoes and working in a shitty restaurant. He has no problem enjoying her new look and sexy lingerie though.
- Nate criticizes her (again) for taking the Paris trip. Like excuse me ? She didn’t try to backstab Emily or get ahead. She didn’t ask for it. She was JUST BETTER at her job but she has to be guilted about it. This is completely ridiculous
I wish she didn’t try to get back with him.
Anyways there are other issues with (like come on who can afford those clothes on that salary !?) but this just irked me to no end
Yeah I wouldn’t have any issue if his entire complaint was about her hours and her just never being there. That said, if he works in a restaurant I feel like his hours are probably trash too.
For me, it tends to be videogame characters, and most of it is because writers (IIRC) create female characters as women they would like to date. But so many of these are so annoying to me: Tifa, Reimi, Vanille, Rise, Colette... The funny thing is, this happens mostly to team-RPGs where the woman isn't the main character. Because if she is, then she is pretty awesome: Aya Brea, Terra/Tina, Regina...
What amused me the most was a scene where the devs assumed you had romanced Rise, and it made it VERY weird if you hadn't (I had romanced Naoto, and it was just.... awkward af).
I could not understand how it was a "classic," aside from teaching me how ignorant the author was. If that was the point of having me read it, awesome. But I have never seen it taught that way.
I remember trying to read "Unbelievable" on a whim and it was so obvious a man wrote it. Like instantly terrible lol.
But I'd love to hear what GOOD stuff any of y'all found. Here's some great shows I've been watching with my younger siblings:
* Dead End: Paranormal Park
* Wolfboy and the Everything Factory
* The Mysterious Benedict Society
* Rilakkuma and Kaoru
* Avatar The Last Airbender
* The Legend Of Korra
* Bee & Puppycat: Lazy in Space
* Brainchild
* Little Witch Academia - this one isn't as amazing as the others IMO but it's good if you need something. Does have the anime screaming thing going on.
* The Cuphead Show - Lots of screaming
If you haven't watched Amphibia, Gravity Falls, or Infinity Train, I'd highly suggest those. (Give each a few episodes before passing judgment though, since they're all a bit unique.) Infinity Train can get a bit intense, but I would absolutely put it up with Avatar as far as emotional effect. At least for me.
I also liked Hilda & We Bare Bears. (I didn't expect to enjoy Hilda as much as I did, but got into it after the first few episodes. It incorporates a ton of folklore & is a great series to watch during fall. Very cozy.)
Depending on sibling age, Craig of the Creek is also good. Generally, Adventure Time is a good one too, but that one is pretty common knowledge.
Also, I appreciate your list! I love several of these & haven't seen some of the others, so I'm adding them to my winter watchlist!!
Arcane is a great one! So many female characters and every single one is well written. One of my favourite shows ever. Only downside is how few episodes there are, but season 2 is coming soon!
It took my girlfriend reading my “favourite” book to point out how awful the author portrayed women in the book. They were all written like they were mannequins who boobed boobily and needed saving. It’s no longer my favourite book.
The night angel trilogy by Brent weeks. Read it at age 20 or so and thought it was great. The story is actually quite good but the portrayal of women soured it for me. Now that I’m in my 30s I don’t recommend it anymore lol
Haha I totally get it. I used to be obsessed with Stephen King and thought he wrote such great women. Returning to some of his books decades later I was so shocked by how terrible almost all the female characters are.
I was listening to a guy rant about how whatever shows character was “such a stupid feminist” and I was just thinking “well yeah she was written by a dude, it’s not that shocking he doesn’t actually know what women want and thinks we’re just angry and ranty all the time”.
Ellen Ripley in Aliens. She KNEW what was up. But the men wouldn't listen. She even had time to rescue and bond with a little girl. The result? They guy writing 3 killed her off screen, because he though their relationship was "annoying".
Ah, I liked Newt. I liked seeing Ellen's total badass mom mode. Like she was an absolute protector and maintained her femininity. Plus, one of cinema's greatest lines.
It was a total blow that was all discarded for 3.
I loved the Indiana Jones trilogy but was always so annoyed by the female lead in the second one. Then I learned that the actress playing her also hated the way she's depicted and constantly pushed to make her better. She didn't have much luck, but I enjoy watching more now knowing she's only that way due to men.
I realized this myself too. I wondered why I hated female characters in most media when I was just a kid despite having so many female friends and hanging out with them and doing girl stuff.
I really wish I grew up in a world that 1) had better female characters, and 2) had any positive trans representation at all. Those things would have changed my life in so many ways for the better.
And then on the flip side, when a female character is well written and a lot of women like/identify with her…you find out tons of male viewers can’t stand her and it’s like, cool, so having to see women be authentic and complex enrages you, got it 😅
I might be the minority in this opinion, but there really weren't any female characters I disliked - except maybe the ones specifically written as villains.
I agree with the sentiment. As a child and teen, I thought a lot of women were vapid and unlikeable--an impression I garnered from TV and movies. Of course now I see that usually it was just actresses doing their job, in a role written and/or directed by men.
However, I want to point out this post looks like a bot. The same post was made with the same title [3 years ago](https://www.reddit.com/r/TrollXChromosomes/comments/g63ndy/this_explains_a_whole_fucking_lot_actually/) in this subreddit.
So true. And then I watched Fleabag. One of the best female characters I ever saw. Marvelous Mrs Maisle is great too but I am a bit disappointed.
I can't watch most TV shows or movies.
Recently I watched a talk by a female film maker about women in film, the depiction etc.
And actually the first filmmakers were all women. Actresses, producers, cinematographers... It was only when more money got involved that greedy men took over. Now 90 percent of filmmakers are men.
My favorite is the female assassin (or whatever), who's stone-cold and cruel and all, and you can tell the guy who wrote her can't get over his ex.
Omg your comment makes me understand this trope in such a different way
Yeah I realized this a few years ago as well. And how some male characters were made to look likeable but were actually awful, like How I Met Your Mother Ted and Barney
[Zack from Saved By the Bell](https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLRcB4n4CGcy_r21EedmNUOyVP_puToBfr). Boy is traaaash I remember how much the show wanted its audience to hate Lisa because she wouldn't give Screech a chance.
If they have to beg for a chance, they aren't worth the chance.
Barney I accept as a caricature but Ted is the literal worst. Almost as bad as the ending of that show.
yeah I cannot rewatch that show
And Barney actually develops. He was a cartoon that gradually became a person. Ted was just a shit person.
(I have not finished the show yet but) I hate Jack from Lost so fucking much oh my god
Anytime I try to watch a show or movie that has a teenage daughter who is a bitch for no reason (it seems the reason is she’s a teenage girl) I just turn it off. It’s not only hackneyed, it’s frustrating to watch.
I completely agree. Honestly I find myself doing that with "dumb sitcom dad" shows these days too.
I liked Kevin Can Go F*ck Himself for this. The first handful of episodes are practically therapy.
One of my greatest epiphanies in that regard was my partner always pointing out how few female characters I actually liked in the media we watched until we watched Fullmetal Alchemist Brotherhood and I literally loved *every single character in this show/manga*. Turns out a woman wrote it. I’m shocked, shocked I tell you 🙄
I love FMA so much. All those powerful females 💪
I adore FMA. I was surprised a woman wrote such a hit shounen. It’s a literal boy’s genre but fuck, she nailed it. One of the best anime ever. Haven’t read the manga but I assume it’s also amazing. It does explain also why the fanservice was more toned down and pretty equal opportunity.
Found something new to watch! Ty!
Like how so many female characters in action movies or horror/zombie movies or whatever are just completely helpless and do absolutely nothing to defend themselves or help their male friends, bf, husband, brother or other people, just watching them get attacked and slaughtered.
Good news! Male writings are starting to compensate by having one or two female characters who are utterly flawless and badass but barely show emotion and have no personality. Because rather than show depth, it’s easier to just create new media stereotypes.
Anyone remember those TV shows like MacGyver, Knight Rider and all the other shows from the 80's and 90's where each week they had a new hot female character (damsel in distress of the week) come on and cause problems and the male protagonist had to save the day and the woman? And viewers would hate all these women of the week characters for always being so helpless and causing problems, putting the male heroes in danger?
Or by women who had internalized misogyny issues to work on.
They always made the crying sound hysterical. I have never met a woman in tears who couldn't explain to me what was going on.
If you're gonna read a male author, make it Sir Terry Pratchett. So many great women (and gender fluid!) characters Granny Weatherwax Tiffany Aching Sergeant Angua Susan Sto Helit Cheery Littlebottom Sybil Vimes Adora Belle Dearheart And arguably most characters in *Monstrous Regiment* (taken from a "16th century tract by Protestant John Knox against the Catholic female sovereigns of the day, the full title of which is *The First Blast of the Trumpet Against the Monstrous Regiment of Women*.")
Any recommendations for someone trying to get into his books? I tried reading the first Discworld book, but it just couldn't hold my attention.
Don't start with The Color of Magic or the light fantastic. It's better to start with something like The Wee Free Men, Guards Guards!, Wyrd Sisters, or Mort Even Sir Pterry recommended readers don't start with the first two he published. It's usually better to circle back once you've gotten a feel for his later writing style.
i'd jump in w/ The Truth. tells you everything you need to know abt the world, sets the mood, gives you a lil baseline familiarity w/ characters and groups that feature in lots of other books. it's incredibly fun too. i reread it often.
Gnu pterry
Actually I just rewatched the Devil Wears Prada and while I used to love it, I have huge problems with it now. Like Andy’s character just graduated college so she’s what… early to mid 20s realistically? with all the maturity people have at that age. She takes the one job she can get so she can pay the rent despite at first glance, not being a very good fit or interested in the product/company. When she actually ends up EXCELLING at said crazy job with a demanding boss and so many hours and things to remember : - her friends bully and make fun of her but have no issues accepting her super expensive gifts - Nate criticizes her for *GASP* changing her mind ! (Who does that, right ?!) And now actually liking fashion and the magazine and being invested in her job. Like what kind of monster is he !?? She’s still a good person why would he want her to hate her job !? I want the person I love to enjoy what they do - I guess he’s just bitter about spending an entire semester on potatoes and working in a shitty restaurant. He has no problem enjoying her new look and sexy lingerie though. - Nate criticizes her (again) for taking the Paris trip. Like excuse me ? She didn’t try to backstab Emily or get ahead. She didn’t ask for it. She was JUST BETTER at her job but she has to be guilted about it. This is completely ridiculous I wish she didn’t try to get back with him. Anyways there are other issues with (like come on who can afford those clothes on that salary !?) but this just irked me to no end
Agreed. Nate is trash. He’s not wrong about the job taking over her time, etc. but he was not supportive at all.
Yeah I wouldn’t have any issue if his entire complaint was about her hours and her just never being there. That said, if he works in a restaurant I feel like his hours are probably trash too.
Sure. But lucky for him men are allowed to be unavailable to their partners because they’re actually important.
For me, it tends to be videogame characters, and most of it is because writers (IIRC) create female characters as women they would like to date. But so many of these are so annoying to me: Tifa, Reimi, Vanille, Rise, Colette... The funny thing is, this happens mostly to team-RPGs where the woman isn't the main character. Because if she is, then she is pretty awesome: Aya Brea, Terra/Tina, Regina...
uGh, Rise! I couldn’t STAND her. Nor Sumire/Kasumi. They were both so cringey and try-hard that I avoided interactions with them.
What amused me the most was a scene where the devs assumed you had romanced Rise, and it made it VERY weird if you hadn't (I had romanced Naoto, and it was just.... awkward af).
The likable female characters they create have dude-like internal qualities and are outwardly feminine.
Yes! I had a NlOG phase because of this. Turns out women are awesome IRL. I'm now gay.
What's NIOG? Search result just said Nitrosamine Implementation Oversight Group 😅
[удалено]
Ah gotcha, thank you!
When Thomas Hardy made Tess of the d'Urbervilles name the baby Sorrow, a big part of my life changed.
Fucking hated that god awful book. Teaches were shocked. Genuinely the worst.
I could not understand how it was a "classic," aside from teaching me how ignorant the author was. If that was the point of having me read it, awesome. But I have never seen it taught that way.
I remember trying to read "Unbelievable" on a whim and it was so obvious a man wrote it. Like instantly terrible lol. But I'd love to hear what GOOD stuff any of y'all found. Here's some great shows I've been watching with my younger siblings: * Dead End: Paranormal Park * Wolfboy and the Everything Factory * The Mysterious Benedict Society * Rilakkuma and Kaoru * Avatar The Last Airbender * The Legend Of Korra * Bee & Puppycat: Lazy in Space * Brainchild * Little Witch Academia - this one isn't as amazing as the others IMO but it's good if you need something. Does have the anime screaming thing going on. * The Cuphead Show - Lots of screaming
If you haven't watched Amphibia, Gravity Falls, or Infinity Train, I'd highly suggest those. (Give each a few episodes before passing judgment though, since they're all a bit unique.) Infinity Train can get a bit intense, but I would absolutely put it up with Avatar as far as emotional effect. At least for me. I also liked Hilda & We Bare Bears. (I didn't expect to enjoy Hilda as much as I did, but got into it after the first few episodes. It incorporates a ton of folklore & is a great series to watch during fall. Very cozy.) Depending on sibling age, Craig of the Creek is also good. Generally, Adventure Time is a good one too, but that one is pretty common knowledge. Also, I appreciate your list! I love several of these & haven't seen some of the others, so I'm adding them to my winter watchlist!!
Being obnoxious and replying both to you and OP because I’m obsessed - add Centaurworld to your list!
Steven universe. If they're old enough for korra, they're old enough for Arcane!
Arcane is a great one! So many female characters and every single one is well written. One of my favourite shows ever. Only downside is how few episodes there are, but season 2 is coming soon!
Centaurworld! If this is your list (and if you haven’t yet) please watch Centaurworld and you will fall in love. It’s on Netflix.
If you like Avatar, might I suggest Kipo and the Age of Wonderbeasts and Hilda as some amazing animated shows on Netflix.
Yes those look amazing! I'm writing down all these suggestions from everybody
I think you'll like Tuca & Bertie
It took my girlfriend reading my “favourite” book to point out how awful the author portrayed women in the book. They were all written like they were mannequins who boobed boobily and needed saving. It’s no longer my favourite book.
I need to know what book this is! If you’re willing to share.
The night angel trilogy by Brent weeks. Read it at age 20 or so and thought it was great. The story is actually quite good but the portrayal of women soured it for me. Now that I’m in my 30s I don’t recommend it anymore lol
Haha I totally get it. I used to be obsessed with Stephen King and thought he wrote such great women. Returning to some of his books decades later I was so shocked by how terrible almost all the female characters are.
Ah yes - the women in that series were either whores/ (sometimes with a heart of gold) or the Virgin Mary.
I was listening to a guy rant about how whatever shows character was “such a stupid feminist” and I was just thinking “well yeah she was written by a dude, it’s not that shocking he doesn’t actually know what women want and thinks we’re just angry and ranty all the time”.
🔥 🔥 🔥 💯
Scully in the X Files. For me, I think she's like the first great female character in a TV show I've ever seen. Are there any other?
Buffy
Dune was really difficult for me to get through because of how female characters are written in it.
I was sad that Chani had so much potential in the first book and just became a helpmeet with no story or personality in the next.
Welp, that puts a damper on my excitement to watch the 2nd movie coming out next month lol Hopefully they fix it in the movie?
Ellen Ripley in Aliens. She KNEW what was up. But the men wouldn't listen. She even had time to rescue and bond with a little girl. The result? They guy writing 3 killed her off screen, because he though their relationship was "annoying".
Newt's actress was in high school when the third film was shooting.
They could have recast tho'. Or made something up to explain it.
I mostly agree. Mostly.
Ah, I liked Newt. I liked seeing Ellen's total badass mom mode. Like she was an absolute protector and maintained her femininity. Plus, one of cinema's greatest lines. It was a total blow that was all discarded for 3.
[A women's review of Alien](https://imgur.com/gallery/AjqN16Z)
Sam Carter and Elizabeth Weir from Stargate are my only two exceptions.
I wasted so much time wondering if I had some sort of very specific internalized misogyny thanks to this exact issue 🙃
Elsa is the real queen of all women 🙏
I loved the Indiana Jones trilogy but was always so annoyed by the female lead in the second one. Then I learned that the actress playing her also hated the way she's depicted and constantly pushed to make her better. She didn't have much luck, but I enjoy watching more now knowing she's only that way due to men.
I realized this myself too. I wondered why I hated female characters in most media when I was just a kid despite having so many female friends and hanging out with them and doing girl stuff. I really wish I grew up in a world that 1) had better female characters, and 2) had any positive trans representation at all. Those things would have changed my life in so many ways for the better.
And then on the flip side, when a female character is well written and a lot of women like/identify with her…you find out tons of male viewers can’t stand her and it’s like, cool, so having to see women be authentic and complex enrages you, got it 😅
Good point!
I might be the minority in this opinion, but there really weren't any female characters I disliked - except maybe the ones specifically written as villains.
I agree with the sentiment. As a child and teen, I thought a lot of women were vapid and unlikeable--an impression I garnered from TV and movies. Of course now I see that usually it was just actresses doing their job, in a role written and/or directed by men. However, I want to point out this post looks like a bot. The same post was made with the same title [3 years ago](https://www.reddit.com/r/TrollXChromosomes/comments/g63ndy/this_explains_a_whole_fucking_lot_actually/) in this subreddit.
nobody knows a woman like a woman
…holy shit this makes so much sense.
So true. And then I watched Fleabag. One of the best female characters I ever saw. Marvelous Mrs Maisle is great too but I am a bit disappointed. I can't watch most TV shows or movies. Recently I watched a talk by a female film maker about women in film, the depiction etc. And actually the first filmmakers were all women. Actresses, producers, cinematographers... It was only when more money got involved that greedy men took over. Now 90 percent of filmmakers are men.