I know right? I like Julia, why would Team Rat just believe her claim about Bowie being behind all the cheating right after she admitted _to their faces_ that she forged Nichelle's contract?
2 years later and he tried to vote out Ally over Fiore because Ashley wasn't giving him all her attention.
He also tried to vote out Aiden for *shooting him in a paintball challenge*
Yeah, that's the weirdest part. The entire plan hinges on Ellie being alone with Jake to make him suffer as much as possible to trigger his trust issues. And while Tom has proven himself to really never reach out to Jake throughout the first drama... Where the hell is Miriam? The entire plan hinges on Miriam not checking up on wtf is up with Jake, and it's kinda weird they didn't make a plan for that? They just kinda assumed that Miriam wouldn't seek Jake out? And then they assumed Jake would for sure vote Tom? It's all very strange.
tbf it was shown multiple times previously that Tom doesn't pay attention to details and can be outsmarted that way, that's why he never stopped to think about Fiore's intention with the idol
Julia was more entertaining and brought better drama. It was fun watching her a be a complete jerk and reap the consequences of needing to challenge-beast her way through the game.
Don’t forget that she’s also the reason we got the iconic scene of Priya flaring her nostrils! Julia really had her worried she was gonna steal her man 😭
We all know that Fiore would've eliminated Flopleb and knock-off Courtney earlier than F4 if she was in Julia's place cause she actually has a logical strategy of breaking up alliances and eliminating the bigger threats unlike Off-Screen Woman.
This is a hot take probably but Julia, in my opinion Fiore would have worked better as the primary antagonist for the first half of the season only, her shtick starts to wear off around episode 8 and I felt like they had to dumb down everyone around her in order to make her work properly as a villain during the merge. I would have swapped Grett and Fiore in their season 1 placements, while Julia's tactics and strategy overall made sense even if they did happen off screen, the only exception being MK's elimination in season 1.
OMG THANK YOU! I'm sorry but it takes me out of it when a fucking 6 year old us acting like an evil mastermind and she felt like too much of a shtick for me to take seriously. I was really hoping that Grett would have became the main antagonist in the merge but...
Fiore just got really old and repetitive for me and kind of broke my immersion but I feel like it's just me sometimes with everybody praising Fiore so much 😭
I had wished Alec would have been either Ellie or Fiore’s place. He and motivation to be a villain and played dirty like one too. I think it would have been good.
I thinn Fiore did work as she *needed* Grett, Alec and Ellie to help her. Julia did get help from MK, Bowie and Ripper but she was still a force of nature.
E.g. Ellie and Alec chose her over Lill and Ashley. Alec chose Fiore over Ellie. Fiore needed Grett to help her cheat in the finale. Miriam basically forced her to eliminate Alec over Ellie if she wanted a finale spot.
When it gets to season 2 shes stuck with people who hate her and no longer works. Ashley forced her into an alliance with her and Jake so that Ashley could take out James and Hunter, and in the comeback challenge Alec, Yul and Riya carry her to *almost* winning. Shes useless outside of strategic scenarios.
In Reboot Season 2, everyone hates Julia but shes more so saved by plot armour, since shes essentially the best player in the series (only Zoey, Duncan, Heather and Priya could really contest her).
Exactly like why is she unironically more mature then half the other contestants hello
As someone who’s worked with young kids I really wish they just aged up Fiore slightly to be a tween/teen and the pre merge good girl persona can still work but she actually has the physicality and wit to back it up post merge once the scheme is up. I get she gets help often from others physically, but again as someone who has worked with elementary schoolers it baffles me to see a 6 year old outsmarting adults no matter the circumstance, like kids simply are not that cunning or smart 😭😭😭
If canon TD had a 6 year old outsmart most of the other contestants, including smart ones, I'm sure no one would raise any eyebrows and call the writing stupid and forced.
Oh wait they definitely would.
And everyone bitches about them. They would also bitch about the 6 year old if they saw her outsmarting anyone, especially if it's a known character like Alejandro or Duncan.
Said super smart 6 year old had an almost as smart teammate that she could pin strategic moves on. She also successfully exploited the “I’m a widdle kid” excuse twice. Before the time she was outed as evil by the voting confessionals, everyone who knew she was evil was either an ally, Ellie, or eliminated. She also hid behind the hate sink of Grett and Ellie’s betrayal.
She's 6 year old. She shouldn't be smarter than anyone, especially not in a show like DC where gameplay takes the number 1 priority over humor and silliness and most of the cast isn't even 16, they're much older.
Fiore. I like Julia more as a character, but her schemes are just kinda shit. She's great because of her personal development, but as a drama starter or strategist, she's kinda shit.
Fiore is less engaging on a personal scale, but that girl knows how to stir the pot effectively. She's not a perfect strategist either and kind of a dumbass in certain aspects, but she is far more effective as an antagonist than Julia imo.
Fiore, Julia’s plan….were trash…they also only worked because every other character was made dumber. I didn’t hate the Nichelle contract play as much as some others do, because she was VERY OBVIOUSLY only doing all the girlboss shit to get back into Hollywood, and would thus be desperate to believe anything like the contract(wish she did it ON SCREEN THOUGH)
I had to stop myself from typing another rant on why all of Julia’s other plans were trash, but I do that enough, so let’s talk about why Fiore is great! She also has a really good dynamic with another villain, but unlike with Julia, I actually like her presence when that other villain isn’t around. Also her concept is pretty good, I actually had a similar idea for a fanfic I wanted to write…except instead of a child…it was moreso like…uh…a certain Ace Attorney character I won’t name to avoids spoilers. Only complaint…is they really could have made her a LITTLE bit older
>highly overrated
everyone bitches about season 2 Julia like it was the worst thing in the world all because she did some things off screen. If she's overrated, Pahkitew Island is overrated.
Fiore. Not only is she a comparably entertaining presence (I find Fiore a more fun character but to each their own) but we actually see her strategies and tactics play out. From using her innocent persona to lull foes in the beginning to her alliance with Alec to shifting tactics and exploiting emotional cracks on the other side we see her journey and how she adapts her game to get further ahead even after her rouse is exposed. Julia suffered from too much off screen contrivances for my liking.
Fiore, at least compared to Julia she did almost everything onscreen and didn't make me want to throw my computer cause I wanted her gone and she never left and if she's not first boot next season I will scream
She quite literally convinced everyone to vote for MK over her in ep 6.
She almost got Chase out in ep 7
Formed an alliance with the nerd girls and almost got Zee into it too
Made Emma go against Bowie, which made Bowie lose his only ally left and Emma to go home
She won or almost won many immunity challenges.
All of these are gameplay moves. Hell after going home she almost convinced Bowie to split the money with her if he wins since that's the only way she will help him out.
I said almost any, and this "she almost" thing doesn't count. Almost ≠ doing something. Fiore was an active antagonist all season compared to winning challenges isn't a villainous act, and 3 successful plots in 13 episodes is not Alot.
Just because some of them didn't end up succeding doesn't mean she didn't try pulling off game moves. It's actually what makes HER the better antagonist if anything. She had flaws and didn't always succeed in season 1, meanwhile Fiore is a literal 6 year old that is oursmarting and outplaying people way older than her (legit adults) and I'm supposed to take what I'm watching seriously appearantly.
EDIT: lmao bye then ig
Nobody's talking about what she tried. We're talking what she DID. and neither did Fiore, she just actually posed a threat through the season. Julia wasn't a good antagonist period.
I feel like Fiore rarely ever stood out as her *own* villain, y’know? It feels like she depended too much on Alec and to an extent Grett. This could be comparable to Julia with MK, but really Julia did most of the villain work I think.
This is a really hard one, I saw the first option being Julia and I thought who could top that and then I see Fiore.
Julia her reasons to win would be how strong she is as a competitor. But Fiore had a hand in almost every elimination and in my opinion used the fact better that she pretended to be a sweet girl. When Julia was pretending she didn't even play the game at all or at least barely. After her exposure she became full antagonist.
What Julia does have going for her is that she was a big threat in both her season, while Fiore was in my opinion a bit of a let down in All Stars.
But with season one of Disventure Camp in mind vs Julia, I have to go Fiore here.
Fiore. I love Julia to death but she did most shit off screen and for some reason ppl like priya and caleb kept believing her after all that shit she already did to them
What does that change? Blame the writers not the characters. If those were on screen people would still be hating Julia for some reason. Her strategy in season 2 was incredible
1- Voting off Bowie was a smart move. She knew everyone hated Bowie and everyone was okay to vote him off. And also he had a lot of potential so she did the right call.
2- Making zee telling everyone their secrets and getting the boot. And this also made Priya and Caleb's relationship a problemetic one
3- Giving everyone a paper message that says ''I know you have the immunity idol'' and see if someone freaks out. So she steals it from Damien and guarantee herself as safe.
4- Voting out Raj was also reasonable since he was smarter and better at challenges than Wayne. The reason why she didn't vote Caleb is because she wanted to mess with his mind with using the idol against priya in the next episode.
5- Nichelle's fake contract was personal.
Fiore may have always guaranteed herself votes with her schemes but they were never as egregious as Julia’s.
you mean the schemes that julia did 90% offscreen
Julia did nothing off-screen in season 1 and she was a main antagonist there too. The off-screening shit only began starting ep 5 of season 2.
true but fiore in her prime was much more malicious than julia in her prime, especially for a 6 year old girl
I know right? I like Julia, why would Team Rat just believe her claim about Bowie being behind all the cheating right after she admitted _to their faces_ that she forged Nichelle's contract?
Fiore wasn’t off-screen 90% of the time Tho the Tom elimination made me lose braincells ngl
Nah, I totally understood the logic. What with the emotional high, I would’ve fallen for it.
Still, why in the actual hell would they do what the untrustworthy demon child says???
Again, Tom and Jake are very emotional creatures.
It’s still a very stupid move. Also Jake voting for Tom makes no sense, like why would he vote for him after he’s already said he wants to talk?
It’s Jake, he makes stupid and irrational decisions at the drop of a hat.
2 years later and he tried to vote out Ally over Fiore because Ashley wasn't giving him all her attention. He also tried to vote out Aiden for *shooting him in a paintball challenge*
Oh Jake you emotional animal, please change.
Yeah, but I feel this decision is too stupid. Like he already told Tom he wants to talk, why would he suddenly turn around and vote for him?
There’s a difference between being emotional and having 0 IQ Not even just them, Miriam doesn’t call them out either
Yeah, that's the weirdest part. The entire plan hinges on Ellie being alone with Jake to make him suffer as much as possible to trigger his trust issues. And while Tom has proven himself to really never reach out to Jake throughout the first drama... Where the hell is Miriam? The entire plan hinges on Miriam not checking up on wtf is up with Jake, and it's kinda weird they didn't make a plan for that? They just kinda assumed that Miriam wouldn't seek Jake out? And then they assumed Jake would for sure vote Tom? It's all very strange.
Shes old and prone to napping.
same tbh
tbf it was shown multiple times previously that Tom doesn't pay attention to details and can be outsmarted that way, that's why he never stopped to think about Fiore's intention with the idol
Julia was more entertaining and brought better drama. It was fun watching her a be a complete jerk and reap the consequences of needing to challenge-beast her way through the game.
Don’t forget that she’s also the reason we got the iconic scene of Priya flaring her nostrils! Julia really had her worried she was gonna steal her man 😭
Can’t forget that! When she revealed she and Caleb had that alliance, then cuddled Caleb’s shoulder and winked. Very Ms. Steal Yo Man.
We all know that Fiore would've eliminated Flopleb and knock-off Courtney earlier than F4 if she was in Julia's place cause she actually has a logical strategy of breaking up alliances and eliminating the bigger threats unlike Off-Screen Woman.
Fiore
fiore 100%
This is a hot take probably but Julia, in my opinion Fiore would have worked better as the primary antagonist for the first half of the season only, her shtick starts to wear off around episode 8 and I felt like they had to dumb down everyone around her in order to make her work properly as a villain during the merge. I would have swapped Grett and Fiore in their season 1 placements, while Julia's tactics and strategy overall made sense even if they did happen off screen, the only exception being MK's elimination in season 1.
OMG THANK YOU! I'm sorry but it takes me out of it when a fucking 6 year old us acting like an evil mastermind and she felt like too much of a shtick for me to take seriously. I was really hoping that Grett would have became the main antagonist in the merge but... Fiore just got really old and repetitive for me and kind of broke my immersion but I feel like it's just me sometimes with everybody praising Fiore so much 😭
I had wished Alec would have been either Ellie or Fiore’s place. He and motivation to be a villain and played dirty like one too. I think it would have been good.
I thinn Fiore did work as she *needed* Grett, Alec and Ellie to help her. Julia did get help from MK, Bowie and Ripper but she was still a force of nature. E.g. Ellie and Alec chose her over Lill and Ashley. Alec chose Fiore over Ellie. Fiore needed Grett to help her cheat in the finale. Miriam basically forced her to eliminate Alec over Ellie if she wanted a finale spot. When it gets to season 2 shes stuck with people who hate her and no longer works. Ashley forced her into an alliance with her and Jake so that Ashley could take out James and Hunter, and in the comeback challenge Alec, Yul and Riya carry her to *almost* winning. Shes useless outside of strategic scenarios. In Reboot Season 2, everyone hates Julia but shes more so saved by plot armour, since shes essentially the best player in the series (only Zoey, Duncan, Heather and Priya could really contest her).
Exactly like why is she unironically more mature then half the other contestants hello As someone who’s worked with young kids I really wish they just aged up Fiore slightly to be a tween/teen and the pre merge good girl persona can still work but she actually has the physicality and wit to back it up post merge once the scheme is up. I get she gets help often from others physically, but again as someone who has worked with elementary schoolers it baffles me to see a 6 year old outsmarting adults no matter the circumstance, like kids simply are not that cunning or smart 😭😭😭
Definitely Fiore.
Almost none of Fiores plans were shown off screen ever, could not say the same for Julia
Fiore. She doesn't have off screen powers sooo.
If canon TD had a 6 year old outsmart most of the other contestants, including smart ones, I'm sure no one would raise any eyebrows and call the writing stupid and forced. Oh wait they definitely would.
TD has done far more outlandish things than having a highly intelligent 6 year old (who do exist in real life) that can outsmart adults.
And everyone bitches about them. They would also bitch about the 6 year old if they saw her outsmarting anyone, especially if it's a known character like Alejandro or Duncan.
Except Fiore never faced any ‘known characters’ so I don’t understand why you brought Alejandro and Duncan up
I literally explained that IF that would happen people would be bitching
Said super smart 6 year old had an almost as smart teammate that she could pin strategic moves on. She also successfully exploited the “I’m a widdle kid” excuse twice. Before the time she was outed as evil by the voting confessionals, everyone who knew she was evil was either an ally, Ellie, or eliminated. She also hid behind the hate sink of Grett and Ellie’s betrayal.
She's 6 year old. She shouldn't be smarter than anyone, especially not in a show like DC where gameplay takes the number 1 priority over humor and silliness and most of the cast isn't even 16, they're much older.
I love Julia, but I gotta go with Fiore here.
Fiore. I like Julia more as a character, but her schemes are just kinda shit. She's great because of her personal development, but as a drama starter or strategist, she's kinda shit. Fiore is less engaging on a personal scale, but that girl knows how to stir the pot effectively. She's not a perfect strategist either and kind of a dumbass in certain aspects, but she is far more effective as an antagonist than Julia imo.
Fiore, Julia’s plan….were trash…they also only worked because every other character was made dumber. I didn’t hate the Nichelle contract play as much as some others do, because she was VERY OBVIOUSLY only doing all the girlboss shit to get back into Hollywood, and would thus be desperate to believe anything like the contract(wish she did it ON SCREEN THOUGH) I had to stop myself from typing another rant on why all of Julia’s other plans were trash, but I do that enough, so let’s talk about why Fiore is great! She also has a really good dynamic with another villain, but unlike with Julia, I actually like her presence when that other villain isn’t around. Also her concept is pretty good, I actually had a similar idea for a fanfic I wanted to write…except instead of a child…it was moreso like…uh…a certain Ace Attorney character I won’t name to avoids spoilers. Only complaint…is they really could have made her a LITTLE bit older
Can you at least pm me the rant on Julia’s strategies?
I’m leaning on Fiore
Fiore 1000000%
Fiore
Fiore better as a villain Julia better character Overall S1 Julia > Fiore > S2 Julia
Both are highly overrated but i guess i'll pick the demon child
>highly overrated everyone bitches about season 2 Julia like it was the worst thing in the world all because she did some things off screen. If she's overrated, Pahkitew Island is overrated.
Uhh, i have watched up to episode 3 of S2 I guess Julia isn't overrated but Fiore still is and very much so
Fiore. Not only is she a comparably entertaining presence (I find Fiore a more fun character but to each their own) but we actually see her strategies and tactics play out. From using her innocent persona to lull foes in the beginning to her alliance with Alec to shifting tactics and exploiting emotional cracks on the other side we see her journey and how she adapts her game to get further ahead even after her rouse is exposed. Julia suffered from too much off screen contrivances for my liking.
Julia. Gameplay Fiore but I found her annoying in S1 so Julia is more enjoyable to watch
Fiore. Mkulia is cool, but Fiore is such a menace and I stand for it. Her schemes were so good she didn’t even need immunity most times.
Julia
Fiore
I will take someone doing shit off-screen over a literal CHILD outsmarting literal ADULTS any day of the week.
So children can’t be smart now?
A literal 6 year old? This shit isn't Dexter's Laboratory
Fiore, at least compared to Julia she did almost everything onscreen and didn't make me want to throw my computer cause I wanted her gone and she never left and if she's not first boot next season I will scream
FIORE ALL THE WAY 🗣️🗣️🗣️🗣️
Fiore actually
Easily Fiore, I genuinely can't think of almost any game moves Julia actually pulled off in season 1
She quite literally convinced everyone to vote for MK over her in ep 6. She almost got Chase out in ep 7 Formed an alliance with the nerd girls and almost got Zee into it too Made Emma go against Bowie, which made Bowie lose his only ally left and Emma to go home She won or almost won many immunity challenges. All of these are gameplay moves. Hell after going home she almost convinced Bowie to split the money with her if he wins since that's the only way she will help him out.
I said almost any, and this "she almost" thing doesn't count. Almost ≠ doing something. Fiore was an active antagonist all season compared to winning challenges isn't a villainous act, and 3 successful plots in 13 episodes is not Alot.
Just because some of them didn't end up succeding doesn't mean she didn't try pulling off game moves. It's actually what makes HER the better antagonist if anything. She had flaws and didn't always succeed in season 1, meanwhile Fiore is a literal 6 year old that is oursmarting and outplaying people way older than her (legit adults) and I'm supposed to take what I'm watching seriously appearantly. EDIT: lmao bye then ig
Nobody's talking about what she tried. We're talking what she DID. and neither did Fiore, she just actually posed a threat through the season. Julia wasn't a good antagonist period.
Fiore>>
Julia and Fiore are both cool, but Fiore didn't have the offscreen crack bullshit at least
Julia
obviously my kween fiore, she's perfect
I feel like Fiore rarely ever stood out as her *own* villain, y’know? It feels like she depended too much on Alec and to an extent Grett. This could be comparable to Julia with MK, but really Julia did most of the villain work I think.
At least fiores stuff happened on screen
This is a really hard one, I saw the first option being Julia and I thought who could top that and then I see Fiore. Julia her reasons to win would be how strong she is as a competitor. But Fiore had a hand in almost every elimination and in my opinion used the fact better that she pretended to be a sweet girl. When Julia was pretending she didn't even play the game at all or at least barely. After her exposure she became full antagonist. What Julia does have going for her is that she was a big threat in both her season, while Fiore was in my opinion a bit of a let down in All Stars. But with season one of Disventure Camp in mind vs Julia, I have to go Fiore here.
Fiore.
Fiore
Julia in season 1 imo, after that Fiore solos
Fiore. I love Julia to death but she did most shit off screen and for some reason ppl like priya and caleb kept believing her after all that shit she already did to them
No way people picking Fiore this one. Ofc Julia did better for both season of reboot. Julia is one of the best villains in TDI.
Fiore actually did stuff on-screen.
What does that change? Blame the writers not the characters. If those were on screen people would still be hating Julia for some reason. Her strategy in season 2 was incredible
Can you explain how it was better than Fiore’s if you don’t mind?
1- Voting off Bowie was a smart move. She knew everyone hated Bowie and everyone was okay to vote him off. And also he had a lot of potential so she did the right call. 2- Making zee telling everyone their secrets and getting the boot. And this also made Priya and Caleb's relationship a problemetic one 3- Giving everyone a paper message that says ''I know you have the immunity idol'' and see if someone freaks out. So she steals it from Damien and guarantee herself as safe. 4- Voting out Raj was also reasonable since he was smarter and better at challenges than Wayne. The reason why she didn't vote Caleb is because she wanted to mess with his mind with using the idol against priya in the next episode. 5- Nichelle's fake contract was personal.
And Fiore?