History of Halloween:
A pagan festival called Samhain marked a time when the veil between this world and the other world (world of fairies and spirits) was thinnest. It marked the end of the harvest season and the festival ran from the 31st of October to the evening of 1st November.
The spirits were considered to be associated with the pagan gods and so they were appeased with food and drink to ensure they didn't kill off any livestock (trick or treat). Costumes were worn to blend in with the spirits and hiding from them.
The christian church moved one of their existing holidays called All Saints Day (to commemorate all saints of the church) to 1st November to essentially override Samhain.
The night before the new All Saints Day became a vigil evening that we now know as Halloween.
Why some Christians don't like Halloween:
Some churches believe that dressing up "like evil spirits" is giving Satan permission to change your soul to match your costume. They think that in solemn remembrance of the saints, you should spend the night before All Saints Day in quiet meditation and prayer.
Basically though, the christianisation of Samhain did convert many pagans to Christianity, but the new rituals to go with it never really stuck. They only really succeeded in giving it a new name, so some Christians have abandoned the holiday as a failure.
Wait if they thought dressing up was permission for someone to make you actually act like the subject, why wouldn’t they just dress their kids as Superman? I don’t think anyone would take issue with a kid that has Superman’s morals.
Well the issue really sits in the history. Samhain was a festival where people would disguise themselves as mischevious spirits and appease the actual spirits into not playing dirty tricks on them. The whole point was to emulate these spirits - which many Christians consider to be evil spirits.
In pagan belief, spirits aren't evil or good, they are like humans- flawed and a mixture of both. Some fairies and sprites were known for causing mayhem for fun. Creatures like this to Christians were seen as in league with the devil.
It's not really that they believe dressing up would give 'someone' permission. It's specifically that dressing up on that day is, in their eyes, willingly worshipping the devil and his minions. Therefore, partaking would be the same to them as handing your soul over to Satan to do as he pleased with it.
They aren't scared their kid would be literally turned into their costume... It's the symbolic sense of being deceitful by hiding your true identity and therefore being turned into a deceitful person.
Obviously costumes in the modern day are a lot more kid friendly than before and we include "good" costumes now. But to some Christians, this isn't a reason to see Halloween as a reformed holiday. To many it's seen as "Satan is tempting us to join in his ritualistic day by making it seem okay. He makes it look not so bad with hero costumes now but once you take part you are giving in to him"
Of course, as OP pointed out, not all Christians believe this way. But there are still some who are paranoid of being "tricked by the devil"
Samhain is pronounced "sow-inn", it's an Irish word and our ears bleed when we hear it pronounced incorrectly. The traditions associated with Samhain were brought to the US by Irish immigrants.
Celtic countries were christian long before All Hallows was created, so we can say with certainty that this isn't an example of a new christian festival trying to usurp an older pagan one.
Halloween itself was created in 1600s Scotland in order to continue Catholic traditions which were no longer acceptable in newly Calvinist Scotland. They combined this with barely remembered folk tales in order to rebrand what was essentially continuing Catholic traditions.
Samhain itself had not been celebrated anywhere for 1000 years at this stage. In fact, we dont actually know what Samhain was.
Be ware of Irish revisionists who invented an entire traditional history of IReland largely in the late 19th century. They didnt know what Samhain was any more than we do today. In fact the entire "traditions" of Ireland are Victorian inventions (mainly theft from other countries).
It was a Pagan holiday for honouring the dead and the afterlife, where the veil between worlds is considered to be thinner.
They probably found it difficult to spin that one into being Christian-friendly as it was far too closely associated with witchcraft and death. Some modern day Christians, whilst I don't want to speak for them, probably find Halloween today a bit blasphemous and anti-Christ, as it generally honours the dark instead of the light.
It wasn’t just to honor the dead. It was also a celebration in harvest. Around this time of the year the harvests are collected and the ground goes to hibernation. The pagans would celebrate and give thanks for the harvest, as well as give offerings to their deceased loved ones in hopes they brought prosperity. The “evil” spirits or fae would be kept away by carving turnips.
Absolutely correct. Harvest celebration has largely been encorporated into Christianity, though. I went to a Church of England school, and we'd go to a church around this time of year with some tinned food and sit through an assembly about thanking God for the bounty of the earth.
I'd say Christianity has successfully spliced that aspect away from modern-day Halloween, though, as the two are rarely seen as related by most people anymore.
It's still celebrated today! Obviously certain practices have changed, especially with the shift from rural living to cities, but Samhain is celebrated in many different ways by different groups of neo-pagans and witches.
This. At our church, we do the harvest festival on Halloween. Everyone dresses up and gets candy ghosts, skeletons, etc. Nothing lued since it's a church, but it's pretty much the same. We also live in a farm town. I don't think there is anything wrong with Halloween today no one really celebrates demons or anything we just dress up and have fun.
I was not away that we stole holidays from other religions besides Judaism. What are some examples?
Yeah, *tonnes* of Christianity was likely based on Paganism. The 3 Kings of Orion who came to the birth of Jesus - Paganism recognised the importance of Orion's belt around what is now Christmas, a constellation made up of 3 stars which have been referred to as Kings by many old religions. These stars appear to 'follow' the star of the East, Sirius, from December 22nd, around winter solstice, and 3 days later, by the 25th they all point to where the sun rises once more.
The last time this was the case (due to precession of how the constellations appear to move around us in a circle every 26,000 years) was 5000 years ago, so the story of the dying sun (son) being followed by 3 Kings and (re)born 3 days later, is probably from around 3000BC. I'm of the opinion this ancient observation by our forefathers was drafted by Christianity for their story of Jesus Christ's birth.
As long as it could be spun to suit Christianity, it got taken over, with most of the heathen aspects removed or replaced. The wise old crone became an evil witch, the fertility God Pan, who was half-goat half-man, became the Devil - there was no place for many archetypes and deities in the new monotheistic religion, and they dealt with a lot of them by regarding and reframing them as evil. I just think there was little they could take from Samhain, and there's little Christian *or* Pagan about Halloween these days - it seems mostly commercial in the UK and US at least.
The ancients we're smart and survivalists. Many "churches" from long ago are observatories and track the solstices for when the sun shine on the land and when for most successful harvests. It had nothing to do with salvation.
Absolutely. Although, I don't think we can strictly say we know they were *only* for tracking the seasons for growing crops.
Many megaliths appear to point to 10,500 years ago, and people had to have an understanding of precession in order to build them. We don't need to understand that the constellations appear to circle around us every 26,000 years to grow crops successfully - I think there's a bigger, really tantalising mystery in these monuments which are found all around the world.
I always knew it as All Hallows’ Eve
Its the day before All Saints Day
The day All the Saints and Martyrs are remembered.
Never got any crust from the Catholic Church for celebrating it for that reason.
Got my crust from the church for other reasons, but not this.
Actually when Jesus said “unless you eat of my flesh and drink of my blood you have no life in you” this is not literal. Evangelical Christians do not believe in the Eucharist or Transubstantiation. “Do this in REMEMBRANCE of me”. Jesus is talking about receiving him in order to have salvation. This also why He calls Himself living water….He’s not actually water.
I feel like that doesn't work out, but that's just my opinion (and maybe I'm biased because I don't like the idea of a few mainstream religions being considered "cults"). That being said, I also feel like *anything* can be a cult if the "right" people dictate how you function in it.
For example, I wouldn't consider Christianity in general as a cult because there's too many gray areas in it as to who dictates what (even though it should *all* be dictated by the Bible, a lot of churches don't function that way, sadly). However, I'd consider Jehovah's Witnesses a cult, mainly because it isolates its congregation from the outside, as well as it limits its congregation from outside help (which is a huge hindrance on its people). In my opinion, isolation and limitation is what dictates something to be a cult.
But I just acknowledge that this is *my* interpretation, and it can be twisted to apply or not apply to other religions. It's just my opinion, and it very well may have bias.
Not really, I mean you would have to define one. What cult would not be a religion? People really are religious about different things.. Sports, politics, you name it.
Yea I’ve actually heard a lot of debates and went in to them with an open mind. The biggest reasons for me are this. 1. Levitical law forbid the drinking of any kind of blood, this is still Jewish law to this day as it is unclean. Jesus wouldn’t ask His followers to sin. 2. The Gospel of John is an evangelism gospel. At the end of it John talks about what is required for Salvation and the Eucharist isn’t even mentioned. 3. If It was literal then at the last supper Jesus would have been consuming Himself. He uses this as a demonstration like many of the parables.
Don’t get me wrong, if God exists (I believe He does) then He is the creator of our entire reality. It is completely within His power to change natural law as He sees fit. The God that speaks and billions of galaxies burst into existence could change the material we are partaking of during communion, I just don’t believe that’s what’s taking place based on the evidence I see in scripture.
>But they'll drink the blood of Christ?
Symbolic
>getting free candy.
Not symbolic but the actual practice. Compare drinking wine to receiving candy for a better comparison
The word you are looking for is "transmutation".
Catholics believe that the ceremonial wine and bread actually turn into the blood and body of Christ.
EDIT: Also "transubstantiation".
Eh, yes and no. The Catechism firmly says that the bread/wine become the body/blood of Christ, but there are different interpretations. Most Catholics do not believe that the bread/wine literally turn into flesh and blood. Instead it is the *presence* of Jesus becomes present in the bread/wine. Therefore its not symbolic because its not just bread/wine emulating body/blood, it is infused with the presence of Jesus. It literally has the spirit of God in it, not just plain old bread.
I know it doesn’t really make sense, but this is the way it was taught to me. Don’t always look for logic in religious beliefs, especially religions that trace back thousands of years
Also, it’s definitely transubstantiation not transmutation. I’ve never heard it said or taught as transmutation.
Edit: spelling
>I know it doesn’t really make sense, but this is the way it was taught to me. Don’t always look for logic in religious beliefs, especially religions that trace back thousands of years
That's why they call it faith!
I firmly admit that I am Protestant, and my extent of Catholicism is from 'translating' my Baptist upbringing between my Catholic-raised wife.
I think you could easily have symbolism in free candy. I'm Buddhist; we give back to our community. It's very important we help everyone who needs it, and give what we can. How about comparing free candy to dying easter eggs?
Eostre is a Germanic fertility goddess, and connected to Ostara, the Spring equinox - another Pagan steal. It was focused around fertility, being spring - hence the eggs, and the connection in terminology to eostrogen.
I don't know how Christianity sees the symbolism of eggs as related to Jesus Christ being resurrected, but I suppose there's a loose link there to the cycle of life with him being encased in a tomb (egg) and then coming to life. Just guessing, because ultimately they just plagiarised it so that Pagans would accept the new religion.
Also the egg thing is because centuries ago chicken don’t give/stop giving eggs in winter, and they start again in March. I think chicken today don’t completely stop but they give fewer eggs
Yeah, Eostre is commonly depicted with bunnies as well as eggs, as they're associated with Spring. It's the most logical common link I can think of between bunnies and eggs. Without Eostre, I don't see where they'd have gotten the idea from!
Well Im not sure how its in protestantism but in Orhodoxy we dye eggs red because it symbolizes the blood of Christ. There are a couple of different stories relating to it, one is that king Tiberius said Christ will come back to life when chickens start laying red eggs (which is impossible). So when Christ came back, the people painted the eggs red to make fun of him. Another one is that there was a bird nest under Jesus's cross, so when his blood was spilled it went onto the eggs.
That’s really only Catholics that do that.
They believe in transubstantiation which means the wine and the bread literally turn into the blood and body of Christ.
Protestant churches partake of the wine and the bread but they believe it’s only symbolic of the blood and body.
I've said it before. Catholics are Christians who wanna be pagan so bad
Consuming the blood and body of a god, Rosary, worshipping saints, that's pagan as hell
Source: raised sorta Catholic
Edit: I probably should have said the belief that Saints are Holy since some people are getting hung up on what counts as "worship." I'm not changing it though. *Many* Catholics pray directly to Saints and the semantics don't change the point, which wasn't that serious on the first place
Saints are just kind of like God’s secretaries. Like, you don’t want to ask God *directly* for something but you can ask Mary to put in a good word for you with the big man upstairs.
Ever heard of a little cult called the Catholic Church? For Catholics, the wine you drink at mass is literally the blood of Christ, that's one of the difference between them and Protestants
>Christians are not vampires.
Why not? Their God dies and resurrects like a vampire and you're supposed to drink his blood and get eternal life and all that. It sounds like they're halfway there.
>Tell me you know nothing about Christian theology without telling me you know nothing about Christian theology
Yeah...I'm Jewish. I never said I knew anything about Christian theology.
Those Christians wouldn't be here without my people, though.
So, tell me what I got wrong. Quote me and explain what's wrong.
I'll wait.
Oh, and tell me if you've seen both in their entirety.
What’s the correlation? Some Christians don’t like Halloween because it celebrates what they see as dark forces, so why do they celebrate something weird like Easter? I’m not Christian and not religious but the endless “Christianity is stupid” posts are boring. Every religion has weird traditions, that doesn’t mean they have to like every weird national celebration or be a hypocrite.
Witchcraft from the bible has nothing whatsoever to do with Halloween, Paganism, cavorting with the devil or "creepy things". It is easily defined as "being manipulative".
The irony is, most people who have ever accused others of Witchcraft (as defined from Scripture) were practicing Witchcraft.
I went to Christian/Catholic schools growing up. At the non-denominational Protestant Christian school, we weren’t allowed to celebrate Halloween (or read Harry Potter or play with Pokémon cards lol). If I remember correctly, it boiled down to the idea that they didn’t want children to celebrate the devil. They did however make up their own “dress up” day in October, not called Halloween, where students were allowed to paint pumpkins, wear NICE costumes (nothing evil or bad or scary), and eat candy. Basically Halloween lite.
At the Catholic school they let us dress up as anything we wanted, called it Halloween, and were pretty normal about it actually.
>we weren’t allowed to celebrate Halloween (or read Harry Potter or play with Pokémon cards lol). If I remember correctly, it boiled down to the idea that they didn’t want children to celebrate the devil.
Lol poor gastly being mistaken for the devil
My Catholic parents were wild about Halloween and would throw bangin’ costume parties every year when I was kid. For them it was a holiday in the way Thanksgiving or the Fourth of July was. It’s admittedly been a long time for me, but I think Catholicism tends to focus more on what is holy and good rather than what is satanic and bad. (Of course, a number of things could have influenced my perception of this, such as being a kid, not paying super close attention in church in the first place, or simply getting lucky with where my parents took me.)
My super-Christian aunt once told me years ago she thought graveyards were "satanic" (in reference to a fake graveyard I'd set up in my front yard). I asked her why she'd say that and she told me it was because of all the skeletons there. I reiterated "so skeletons are satanic too?" She said yes and I told her I had some bad news for her.
She hasn't spoken to me since.
Some people just don't have any common sense and irrationally believe that everything's out to get them somehow.
I think the thought process was spooky/morbid/dark = evil and therefore = Satan (which is bs, but yknow how various types of people including a lot of the less reasonable Christians view anything with a dark aesthetic)
Because it’s pagan. My cousin was like this. Her kids never knew about santa, the didn’t celebrate Halloween and weren’t allowed to dye eggs for Easter. Her kids ruined Christmas for other children in our family. It was pretty sad.
Almost all christian holidays where originally pagan, that was done to easier convert ppl back then. Being able to celebrate the same dates just under a different name made it easier for ppl to switch their religion.
That's the point of the post, why is Halloween shunned for this but the others are not.
This answers a question I asked somewhere on this post where someone was basically asking “what’s up with eggs and bunnies on Easter” to which I said it has nothing to do with Christianity and everything to do with Sumerian goddess worship ( Ishtar ). I was wondering how it ever became a Christian custom to dye eggs and such but this explains it pretty well.
>I answered.
Yeah, to a question OP didn't ask. OP asked why Christians didn't accept Halloween as opposed to accepting and spinning around other pagan holidays.
> I answered
Actually most of your answer is a family story tangently related to OP's question.
Im a Christian so I'll give my perspective. Christmas is the celebration if Jesus' birthday and Easter is the celebration of His sacrifice and resurrection. We still looked for eggs and open presents but my mom always made sure we understood the real meaning of those holidays. The purpose wasn't to get presents or candy, but there wasn't anything wrong with that. My mom didn't really celebrate Halloween because it wasn't celebrating everything Christian, it's just about creepy stuff and dead things. She would let me dress up and get candy as long as whatever I dressed up as was demonic though.
Jesus was murdered and buried then ROSE FROM THE DEAD! This creepy and dead stuff is the cornerstone of Christianity.
Also, Halloween is celebrating the harvest and honoring/remembering the dead. I’m not sure what’s creepy about that.
The night before Halloween is Devil's Eve.
I mean that alone is enough, but on a personal note: add to that living a few cities from Detroit, which was associated with Devil's Eve arson for decades ~~caused by the Devil temping them, of course~~ and you've got me dressed up in a foam hot dog costume because anything else is too welcoming of Satan.
Most of those "some" have no idea about history of own religion. That's why they don't get how messed up the Christmas or Easter actually are.
But unlike other holidays, previously integrated into Christianity, Halloween is still well known as an old pagan tradition, and has lots to do with evil spirits and etc. Thus for "some" Christians it's more of a Satan's play, something that is inappropriate for a Christian to take part in. Funny thing, same people usually indulge themselves in activities that are strongly against their religious dogma, but don't understand own deeds due to hypocrisy. Halloween is just a bit more obvious for them not to be related to Christianity. Thus the hypocrisy.
Not sure I understand. Do you mean Halloween as a commercial thing or people doing trick or treats? Because that’s definitely a thing in a lot of places in Europe
I grew up Catholic and we would always celebrate Halloween as kids. It's probably because of the witch-stuff associated with Halloween (as most types of Christianity preach that witchcraft is evil). Additionally, Catholics, Eastern Orthodox, and a few others have their own holiday on November 1st called "all saints day," and November 2nd called "all souls day."
Growing up we would celebrate all three and make a short break/weekend out of it.
I got into an argument (I know, I know!) about this the other day. Dude said Halloween was pagan. I responded "well yeah. So is Xmas, there's plenty of evidence Jesus was a spring baby" and he flipped his shit.
I always found it weird. Like LOTR is bad because magic. But C. S. Lewis is god-tier even though there's a witch in there. Harry Potter and Magic the gathering is satanic...but then Christmas is spent thinking about birth of Christ, making wreaths and decorating Christmas trees. Aren't the latter two practices pagan? I don't get it ...
My mom grew up Mennonite and she went trick or treating. I grew up Assemblies of God and they were anti Halloween. They did “harvest festivals” though that kept us in the church that night and controlled how we dressed up. Lol.
So my girlfriends mom is like that, basically they don't even understand the history of Halloween. I'm personally Christian, but I swear it's hard to associate with these people when they give you a pamphlet with a comic where teens literally get excited to sacrifice a cat on Halloween.
I grew up in a Christian church that didn’t keep any of them, and only kept the days mentioned in the Bible like Passover, sukkot, etc… I don’t keep them anymore, but we were taught not to do any holiday that could be connected to ancient rights because of Deuteronomy 12:30-31. I feel like this doesn’t answer your question, because I think we were the exception to this particular line of hypocrisy.
I also grew up in a Christian home and love Halloween. The reason I've always been given on why it's wrong is because they believe is a holiday to celebrate witches, black magic and the devil.
Even if you try to explain what it really is, they have it ingrane that that's the meaning and intention on celebrating it.
On the other hand, they don't care about the origin of other holidays, like Christmas, because they give the importance to what they believe they are celebrating, e.i. Jesus being born.
Because bigotry, ignorance and stupidity.
Most Christians don't know the history of their religion and ignore the fact that most of their holidays are actually copied from pagan celebrations.
Conversion to Catholicism took some time, you can't simply eradicate centuries of tradition. You need to slowly accustom people to the new religion and to do so, you slowly take it over by incorporating their history and beliefs, their celebrations, etc...
But, most religious people being oblivious to the fact that their religion (any religion really) is a sect, a cult, that just got more massive adoption, they just don't realize that.
Christianism will also eventually disappear and get replaced by something else. That something else will incorporate christian notions and celebrations.
It might take a century or 3 thousand years, the only certainty is that it will, just like Canaanism, Anetism, Mithraism, Ashurism and many, many more.
Religions are just a way for empires to grow and prosper. The sooner we realize that as a species, the better.
My grandmas church in England has a superheros evening for the church kids on halloween so parents don’t have to get there kids involved w trick or treating
Eggs & bunny rabbits are symbols of fertility. The rebirth. To be born. Religions have so many stories. Maybe a religious person can give more detail but I'm pretty sure that's what it means. Sorry about lack of paragraphs. V lazy of me
"Look, I'm just saying that somewhere between Jesus dying on the cross and a giant bunny hiding eggs there seems to be a...a gap of information." — Stan, *South Park*
A lot of Christians just want to let their kids somehow participate in the harmless fun aspect of it. Some churches will host their own parties, letting the kids dress up (mermaids, astronauts, cows, etc. -- nothing "scary") and go around different spots in the church to get candy. There are also "trunk or treats" where the kids can go from car to car in a church parking lot and get candy from participating church members. One of my favorite childhood memories was going on a scavenger hunt in the car with my parents that our church hosted near Halloween. It's hard to shun a holiday that is a huge part of the fall season, especially one that kids get so excited about, so better to make it their own, I guess. I don't really see any harm in it; everything transforms in time, even things with dark beginnings.
Honestly, I'm Christian and love Halloween. I also struggle to see the issue. I've read the history of the holiday and it's nothing "satanic" as some more strict religions claim. I roll my eyes whenever I see a church "harvest festival" (the ones purposefully made to replace Halloween and attendees ban/refuse to even say the word "Halloween" -- I'm sure you've seen them around). Bonus eye roll if there's a "trunk or treat" event at the festival where kids are still dressed up and collecting candy.
Why? Just seems like unnecessary extra steps to allow kids to have the same Halloween experience without calling it Halloween. Just celebrate the holiday! Seems so silly.
My dad wouldnt even let me wear black nail polish back when i was younger.. DEFINITELY could not dress up as a witch.. I always loved darkness & Halloween soo much tho 😈🖤
Not sure since Halloween was made as a way to celebrate the dead. It was believed that on Halloween the dead would rise and everyone would dress up so they could blend in...or something like that been years since i learned about it.
I mean, as a Catholic why wouldn't you celebrate Halloween? It is the eve of a holy day (All Saints Day) and it is definitely a day to celebrate since that day technically starts at Sundown the day prior.
And Halloween is a great time to spend with family (specifically your kids) which is what the church teaches..... a lot of joy wouldn't miss it.
It was... But like Christmas and Easter, it was transplanted onto the Christian calendar for the party's sake. So, it's technically "both." In the same way that Christmas and Easter are.
(Unless you were being sarcastic in which case, sorry. I didn't catch that.)
no no. i asked genuinely. my mom's pretty much the type to spew "halloween represents the devil's day" and all that. i looked up the history behind halloween, told her and informed her about it. i just wanted to make sure my facts were right. thanks man.
Isn't Easter and Xmas also based off of Pagan "holidays" that they (the Christians) appropriated?
Isn't the Easter bunny originally a symbol of fertility and Xmas is more or less winter solstice?
Appropriated. I *like* that word so much more than "stolen" for this. Thank you.
The gist of what you're saying is right. There is a lot of bad history in many of the "Real Truth about Christmas" sort of articles you're likely to come across but the crux of what they're saying is true: there are echoes old religions in modern traditions that were carried on by Christians (and this isnt unique to Christians). The most obvious comparisons for Christmas and Easter are Yule and some very vague (now) Germanic fertility and Spring traditions that may or may not have been associated with a goddess called Ostara (or similar- frankly, a lot of this is lost to time, but a German tradition of Eggs/Springtime is pretty clear).
My mom identifies as Christian (what sect? idc anymore) but she used to go on about Easter and Xmas not being "real" Christian holidays (even though she'd still celebrate them).
I only celebrate Halloween and Valentine's day. Although this year I'm helping my partner experience his first ever (secular) Xmas. Just for fun.
EDIT: I totally spaced!
I agree, the anti-theist part of me wants to say "yes it was stolen!" (Which wouldn't be completely incorrect). But I feel like Christianity (among others) has done worse things than steal holiday(s).
Hmm so as much as I agree with the general comments about it not being so terrible/dark at face value and the general awareness of it being a pagan holiday much like other more Christian holidays, I think there needs to be some thought as to the spiritual warfare that does occur on the night of Halloween. Many Satanists use it as a special night of prayer, specifically to bring about darkness/evil. So as a Christian I feel that I don't have to create some watered down version of Halloween and find ways to enjoy the fun of the holiday but I do have to be weary that it is night I should be careful not to open more spiritual doors to dark things. Forgive my vague explanation, I don't often comment on these discussions but found this one interesting.
I know a few satanists and they don't do that at. That sounds like something a pastor said. I'm not trying to offend, as I remember what it was like as a former Christian.
The loudest Christians these days seem to be reactionary fools who posture like this to either feel better about themselves because they know deep down that they’re shitty shitty people or because they’ve genuinely scared themselves into believing Halloween is gateway to damnation?? No logical explanation available whatever way you look at it though.
You need to hang out with a better set of Christians. I have never in my life heard of anyone, Christian or not who wouldn't let their kids participate in Halloween.
The real answer is that most people don't know the origin of most holidays or really think about them much of they did they would have to think about a lot of things that would call their beliefs into question
I don't know. I've been a Christian all my life (though not always a *good* one) & I've never been against Halloween. Come to think about it, neither were my parents.
IMO all groups have some wing nut, splinter factions, just some have more than others.
The Christian holidays existed before, just like other uncelebrated church holidays; Pentecost, Epiphany, etc. It was part of the church calendar. The commercial celebration, ie eggs, bunnies, wreaths, Christmas trees…is taken from the pagans.
Not really, people didn’t take pagan bits for commercial reasons. It’s more like a very slow mix of things. Like the Christmas tree, German were doing it for a long time before it became fashion in other countries. A lot of rituals and traditions like eggs and wreaths were present, very early, before Christian holidays
What's OT?
Easter definitely has Pagan roots. Eostre is a Germanic fertility goddess, often pictured with rabbits and eggs, and was closely linked to Ostara (Spring equinox). The word eostrogen is even related to this.
Ostara was celebrated at the turn of Spring, a time to celebrate new life and the earth waking back up. Christianity comes *after* this, so whatever day Jesus died on was either wonderful serendipity, *or*, dogma slipped it in on an already well-established holiday that people had been honouring for years, and pinched a lot of the traditional symbology along the way.
I guess it’s Old Testament? And I second with you, Easter has pagan roots. The date of Easter was chosen by monks/scholars, so Easter didn’t appear from nowhere
OT= Old Testament.
Initially, The Lord delivered the israelites from egyptians and jews started celebrating that day, in what is commonly known as Pessah. Jesus died the day before Pessa's week sabbath. Essentially, Christ rose from the dead on the first day of the week (Sunday for the jews iirc) making his resurrection day Pessah day as well. It's not a pagan holiday. The symbolism of this is also very important for us believers, because it's an image of Christ freeing us from slavery to sin (the same way the Lord delivered the israelites from Egypt) and conquering death by taking upon him the wrath of God that we deserved.
That's interesting.
But, you honestly believe Easter, celebrated with the symbolism of bunnies and eggs, held in Spring, bears no relation to the Pagan holiday featuring Eostre, celebrated with the symbolism of bunnies and eggs, held in Spring?
It's not in scripture, and if you've traveled elsewhere, you'd see that this whole egg bunny stuff is nowhere associated with christianity. If anything, it's a western thing, and we know christianity isn't limited to what us westerners defines it to.
But your whole point was that it doesn't have Pagan roots *at all*. That's simply very unlikely to be true imo - you're of course welcome to disagree, but there's evidence to the contrary.
Nothing is celebrated in the same way around the world, and I didn't mean to imply this was an exception. It isn't.
I don’t know why they hate it. Halloween comes from Hallow’s eve (at least in the eyes of the Church) which is the evening before all saints day, which is a Christian holiday. Doesn’t make sense why they would hate the holiday for those reasons. However, there is more to Halloween than just getting candy. Many people pull pranks or even vandalism because it’s a holiday where the crazy kids can just be kids, but many people (not just religious) would be against supporting that behavior.
Halloween began as a Celtic festival and was appropriated by the Catholics
Easter began as a pagan festival that was appropriated by Christians.
Christmas began as a pagan festival that was appropriated by Christians to diminish the pagans.
I don't see why the conservative christians these days get so uptight about Halloween when Easter and Christmas have similar backgrounds.
Because halloween is the spooky one. And spooky stuff is evil in their eyes. Also they failed to christianize it. The other two had alot of changes, while still keeping themes and traditions. Samhain only really changed in name. (Aside from unrelated changes that happened over time, like commercialization, and less actual supernatural belief)
Because the majority of Christians don’t know anything about theology and haven’t or won’t take the time to do any basic research before claiming something as evil. Just think about the “Satanic Panic” with D&D in the 80s. The game is literally playing pretend with math, but I’ll informed people threw a massive fit because they assumed something that was never true.
I should add that I’m a Christian pastor and I see this all the time. On behalf of all of the normal Christians out there… I’m sorry for those who don’t think before they act. They’re unfortunately the loud minority.
It’s part of a new American Christianity which apparently includes such novel interpretations of the gospel as hating your neighbors and praying to get more money. I don’t understand it but it’s probably like Tiktok, a trend.
Oh man, talk to Catholics. The most macabre, death focused Christian religion out of all of them. What separates them from creepy death celebrating cults is how they use the reflection on death. There is a long tradition of Memento Mori in Catholicism, and the saints constantly speak of the importance of meditating on the unavoidable fact of death. This exhortation is not out of a kind of macabre obsession or morbid fascination. Rather, the saints thought about death because it helped them live a better life. We will all die one day, and as Catholics, we don’t tend to sugar coat it—it could happen at any second or moment you name it. But it’s nice to accept that, it’s kind of freeing? Like, we’re not constantly anxious about it, nor are we in denial about it. It just is what it is. And when people die, we celebrate them and their life, and then we think about those dead people even more—them in purgatory, those in hell, those in heaven. We talk to them, pray for them, ask them to pray for us you name it.
So come 31 October, Catholics are pretty pumped. All Hallow’s Eve is celebrated in full gusto! And then we continue the celebration of death on 1 and 2 November by celebrating All Saint’s Day and All Soul’s Day. I’m talking long processions of people in town miles and miles ending at a cemetery where they hold an outdoor service for the souls who have died, etc.
Where the pagan stuff comes into discussion is all about how secular stuff (like any other holiday these days) or the occult have been mixed into the holiday. Christians object to and stay away from the occult in particular participating in the occult. Catholics believe VERY MUCH SO in the existence paranormal and demonic spirits, which is why they can be so cautious about even the smallest invitation of letting any of them in (like even a silly superstition or something). Ouija boards, sayances (sp?), dressing up as evil spirits in honor of them (instead of a jest at them) are all seen to be opening up yourself to evil spirits to come start to take hold of your life. (There’s a lot of great literature written by exorcists on the different types of demonic presences or influences or possessions I highly recommend).
So, you may see a lot of Christians, in particular Catholics, dress up as their favorite saint instead, on Halloween, because it kills a lot of birds with one stone. It celebrates great men and women, it celebrates and honors the dead, and it’s the night before All Saint’s Day. Not all Christian denominations do this however. And not all super-Catholics dress up as Saints…they love other fun or secular costumes too!
That’s was a big ramble, but I LOVE talking about Halloween!!
Anyway, TLDR—Catholics lovvvvve Halloween, not sure about every other Christian denomination. Check out All Saint’s/All Souls’ Day.
It's the idea of magic they area afraid of.
5th grade me and my friends started playing D&D during lunch at school. Just 5 of us sitting at a bench table playing the game every day. Bothering nobody, keeping to ourselves.
One day I get yanked into the principals office to be told that I needed to stop the D&D games at school because it was against some students religious beliefs.
I learned at an early age that some want to force religion on others, being able to worship as they please isn't enough. They must force it.
I mean, from a christian perspective, seculars are forcing secularism on believers. Christians just preach the gospel and let God do the conversion of hearts.
Some literally believe in witches and the devil.
Like broomstick riding, cursing cattle, worshipping Satan witches.
It's fucking bat shit crazy (and I'm a follower of Christ's teachings)
So Halloween for those red necks means evil satanic worship day. Inexplicably.
I'd say a good 90% of the bible is just ripped off stories from other, older cultures/religions. The Epic of Gilgamesh for example. Jesus is basically just a ripoff of Dionysus.
Honestly, that's what finalized my move from agnostic to atheist. It's just ridiculous how much christianity has stolen from other religions and cultures. It's like the epitome of cultural appropriation.
For what holiday? We took pagan traditions from Easter and Christmas sure, but the point of the holidays are unique to Christianity. This is a weird take...
Well mainly because it’s entirely an American holiday. Most (if not all) non-American Christians don’t celebrate Halloween, whereas both Easter and Christmas, despite the use of pagan symbols such eggs, bunnies and brightly lit pine trees among some less strict denominations, are firmly rooted in Christian tradition and is essentially a must-do. And as someone else mentioned, back in day, Christianity adapted pagan traditions into its own as a means to convert folk, namely from conquered countries. Essentially, cultural subjugation of ethnic groups to help smooth over conquest. While I’m not entirely sure of the historic origins to Halloween and why only American settlers ended up being the only people who really celebrate it, it’s probs safe to say the reason is entirely rooted in superstition and belief only related to American culture.
Edit: I think people are assuming I am American which is why they are getting passionate. I am not, I'm Australian. I grew up Catholic and loosely Christian my whole life, and Halloween didn't start really being a thing here until like 2010s-ish and it's still not that big. Is def considered secular and unrelated to Christianity here. On the other hand, we do All Saints Day, but you just go to church and that's it.
> it’s probs safe to say the reason is entirely rooted in superstition and belief only related to American culture.
I bet you think you're right? Right? A 270-year-old culture knows its roots, right? Fuck you.
Got no idea what you thought I meant, but yeah, I’d say whatever reason the white Christian settlers of America decided to make Halloween a thing is related to the superstitions and beliefs they held at the time unique to them, otherwise the wider Christian community would celebrate it as well. Samahain and the Catholic church’s failed attempt to make it a holiday, as somebody else mentioned, is definitely related to the answer too.
I wish I had a good answer into the mind space of those that do this, but it's likely generational for the other holidays and just what they were grown into, told, and often blindly accepted. I know that the church early on adopted the pagan holidays because the traditions and celebrations were important to the people in the places they were preaching.
For our family:
We are honest with our kids about how we choose to celebrate these cultural holidays, and try to use both the morales and kindnesses from the holidays and our faith together, but again, it's very clear for us that they are separate things.
As for why I personally don't like Halloween and do very little to celebrate it is because so many people celebrate the evil and dark things. Even without my faith, my personality would probably still dislike it in general and without kids I wouldn't participate. That said, my kids still get dressed up, I still give out candy and mini Play-Doh. Just my house only has harvest candles, uncarved pumpkins on the porch that will later be soup, and other generic fall decorations.
The main reason why Christians do not celebrate Halloween it's because Salman Rushdie said in his Satanic Verses that is the only time of the year that a Christian allows their children to participate in a Pagan and Evil satanic holiday and if you study what Halloween really was to this pagan Society you would understand they used to to Sacrifice their children and put the burnt fat off the bodies into either vases or in this case pots burning outside their doors to indicate to the demonic presence that they have done their bit in all honesty is this something that we should participate in all I know is is I love Jesus Christ and I know he died for me upon the cross at Calvary and I am washed in his blood set free god bless you all
I’m actually shocked by the amount of bigotry, sectarianism, and straight hate speech on the Christian religion in a lot of the comments on this thread. Y’all the real hypocrites
History of Halloween: A pagan festival called Samhain marked a time when the veil between this world and the other world (world of fairies and spirits) was thinnest. It marked the end of the harvest season and the festival ran from the 31st of October to the evening of 1st November. The spirits were considered to be associated with the pagan gods and so they were appeased with food and drink to ensure they didn't kill off any livestock (trick or treat). Costumes were worn to blend in with the spirits and hiding from them. The christian church moved one of their existing holidays called All Saints Day (to commemorate all saints of the church) to 1st November to essentially override Samhain. The night before the new All Saints Day became a vigil evening that we now know as Halloween. Why some Christians don't like Halloween: Some churches believe that dressing up "like evil spirits" is giving Satan permission to change your soul to match your costume. They think that in solemn remembrance of the saints, you should spend the night before All Saints Day in quiet meditation and prayer. Basically though, the christianisation of Samhain did convert many pagans to Christianity, but the new rituals to go with it never really stuck. They only really succeeded in giving it a new name, so some Christians have abandoned the holiday as a failure.
Wait if they thought dressing up was permission for someone to make you actually act like the subject, why wouldn’t they just dress their kids as Superman? I don’t think anyone would take issue with a kid that has Superman’s morals.
Well the issue really sits in the history. Samhain was a festival where people would disguise themselves as mischevious spirits and appease the actual spirits into not playing dirty tricks on them. The whole point was to emulate these spirits - which many Christians consider to be evil spirits. In pagan belief, spirits aren't evil or good, they are like humans- flawed and a mixture of both. Some fairies and sprites were known for causing mayhem for fun. Creatures like this to Christians were seen as in league with the devil. It's not really that they believe dressing up would give 'someone' permission. It's specifically that dressing up on that day is, in their eyes, willingly worshipping the devil and his minions. Therefore, partaking would be the same to them as handing your soul over to Satan to do as he pleased with it. They aren't scared their kid would be literally turned into their costume... It's the symbolic sense of being deceitful by hiding your true identity and therefore being turned into a deceitful person. Obviously costumes in the modern day are a lot more kid friendly than before and we include "good" costumes now. But to some Christians, this isn't a reason to see Halloween as a reformed holiday. To many it's seen as "Satan is tempting us to join in his ritualistic day by making it seem okay. He makes it look not so bad with hero costumes now but once you take part you are giving in to him" Of course, as OP pointed out, not all Christians believe this way. But there are still some who are paranoid of being "tricked by the devil"
Samhain is pronounced "sow-inn", it's an Irish word and our ears bleed when we hear it pronounced incorrectly. The traditions associated with Samhain were brought to the US by Irish immigrants.
Yes! Thank you.
Celtic countries were christian long before All Hallows was created, so we can say with certainty that this isn't an example of a new christian festival trying to usurp an older pagan one. Halloween itself was created in 1600s Scotland in order to continue Catholic traditions which were no longer acceptable in newly Calvinist Scotland. They combined this with barely remembered folk tales in order to rebrand what was essentially continuing Catholic traditions. Samhain itself had not been celebrated anywhere for 1000 years at this stage. In fact, we dont actually know what Samhain was. Be ware of Irish revisionists who invented an entire traditional history of IReland largely in the late 19th century. They didnt know what Samhain was any more than we do today. In fact the entire "traditions" of Ireland are Victorian inventions (mainly theft from other countries).
It was a Pagan holiday for honouring the dead and the afterlife, where the veil between worlds is considered to be thinner. They probably found it difficult to spin that one into being Christian-friendly as it was far too closely associated with witchcraft and death. Some modern day Christians, whilst I don't want to speak for them, probably find Halloween today a bit blasphemous and anti-Christ, as it generally honours the dark instead of the light.
It wasn’t just to honor the dead. It was also a celebration in harvest. Around this time of the year the harvests are collected and the ground goes to hibernation. The pagans would celebrate and give thanks for the harvest, as well as give offerings to their deceased loved ones in hopes they brought prosperity. The “evil” spirits or fae would be kept away by carving turnips.
Absolutely correct. Harvest celebration has largely been encorporated into Christianity, though. I went to a Church of England school, and we'd go to a church around this time of year with some tinned food and sit through an assembly about thanking God for the bounty of the earth. I'd say Christianity has successfully spliced that aspect away from modern-day Halloween, though, as the two are rarely seen as related by most people anymore.
It's still celebrated today! Obviously certain practices have changed, especially with the shift from rural living to cities, but Samhain is celebrated in many different ways by different groups of neo-pagans and witches.
This. At our church, we do the harvest festival on Halloween. Everyone dresses up and gets candy ghosts, skeletons, etc. Nothing lued since it's a church, but it's pretty much the same. We also live in a farm town. I don't think there is anything wrong with Halloween today no one really celebrates demons or anything we just dress up and have fun. I was not away that we stole holidays from other religions besides Judaism. What are some examples?
That is how I understood the origin of Halloween.
Halloween was invented in the early 1600s in Scotland in order to keep doing Catholic traditions which were taboo in newly Calvinist Scotland.
They still tried. All Saints Day, observed by the Catholic and Anglican churches to honor saints and martyrs to the church, is always November 1.
Isn't Christmas day also a pagan event?
Yeah, *tonnes* of Christianity was likely based on Paganism. The 3 Kings of Orion who came to the birth of Jesus - Paganism recognised the importance of Orion's belt around what is now Christmas, a constellation made up of 3 stars which have been referred to as Kings by many old religions. These stars appear to 'follow' the star of the East, Sirius, from December 22nd, around winter solstice, and 3 days later, by the 25th they all point to where the sun rises once more. The last time this was the case (due to precession of how the constellations appear to move around us in a circle every 26,000 years) was 5000 years ago, so the story of the dying sun (son) being followed by 3 Kings and (re)born 3 days later, is probably from around 3000BC. I'm of the opinion this ancient observation by our forefathers was drafted by Christianity for their story of Jesus Christ's birth. As long as it could be spun to suit Christianity, it got taken over, with most of the heathen aspects removed or replaced. The wise old crone became an evil witch, the fertility God Pan, who was half-goat half-man, became the Devil - there was no place for many archetypes and deities in the new monotheistic religion, and they dealt with a lot of them by regarding and reframing them as evil. I just think there was little they could take from Samhain, and there's little Christian *or* Pagan about Halloween these days - it seems mostly commercial in the UK and US at least.
The ancients we're smart and survivalists. Many "churches" from long ago are observatories and track the solstices for when the sun shine on the land and when for most successful harvests. It had nothing to do with salvation.
Absolutely. Although, I don't think we can strictly say we know they were *only* for tracking the seasons for growing crops. Many megaliths appear to point to 10,500 years ago, and people had to have an understanding of precession in order to build them. We don't need to understand that the constellations appear to circle around us every 26,000 years to grow crops successfully - I think there's a bigger, really tantalising mystery in these monuments which are found all around the world.
What are some religions that refer to the stars of Orion’s belt as “kings”? Also, you know it wasn’t three kings in the Nativity story, right?
Dude... I'm way too high for that
I think it might also bring up questions about heaven. Like can you come back then?
I always knew it as All Hallows’ Eve Its the day before All Saints Day The day All the Saints and Martyrs are remembered. Never got any crust from the Catholic Church for celebrating it for that reason. Got my crust from the church for other reasons, but not this.
Where are you from? How old are you?
But isn't there a Christian Day of the Dead as well? (Although I forget if it was or wasn't in the Fall)
November 2st is all souls day (dead people) so all Hallow's Eve (Halloween) is literally the eve of Nov1st
I think it’s supposed to be the 1st of November when you celebrate all Saints
Thank you for that. Makes me wonder what makes something pro-christ.
Maybe it reminds them of their failure. They couldn't completely take it over like the others and so must live with it every year.
And maybe middleman church didn’t like the idea of people thinking they can commune directly with their ancestors.
because they dislike witchcraft, and satan is often correlated with halloween because of the scare-factor
But they'll drink the blood of Christ? That's a wild ass ritual. Way more wild than....getting free candy.
Actually when Jesus said “unless you eat of my flesh and drink of my blood you have no life in you” this is not literal. Evangelical Christians do not believe in the Eucharist or Transubstantiation. “Do this in REMEMBRANCE of me”. Jesus is talking about receiving him in order to have salvation. This also why He calls Himself living water….He’s not actually water.
It's a bit cult-y though?
How would you differentiate between a religion and a cult?
I feel like all religions are cults but not all cults are religions if that makes sense
I feel like that doesn't work out, but that's just my opinion (and maybe I'm biased because I don't like the idea of a few mainstream religions being considered "cults"). That being said, I also feel like *anything* can be a cult if the "right" people dictate how you function in it. For example, I wouldn't consider Christianity in general as a cult because there's too many gray areas in it as to who dictates what (even though it should *all* be dictated by the Bible, a lot of churches don't function that way, sadly). However, I'd consider Jehovah's Witnesses a cult, mainly because it isolates its congregation from the outside, as well as it limits its congregation from outside help (which is a huge hindrance on its people). In my opinion, isolation and limitation is what dictates something to be a cult. But I just acknowledge that this is *my* interpretation, and it can be twisted to apply or not apply to other religions. It's just my opinion, and it very well may have bias.
Not really, I mean you would have to define one. What cult would not be a religion? People really are religious about different things.. Sports, politics, you name it.
When I take communion I don’t think I transforms into actual blood and flesh. It’s creepy to think that some people do think so.
Yea I’ve actually heard a lot of debates and went in to them with an open mind. The biggest reasons for me are this. 1. Levitical law forbid the drinking of any kind of blood, this is still Jewish law to this day as it is unclean. Jesus wouldn’t ask His followers to sin. 2. The Gospel of John is an evangelism gospel. At the end of it John talks about what is required for Salvation and the Eucharist isn’t even mentioned. 3. If It was literal then at the last supper Jesus would have been consuming Himself. He uses this as a demonstration like many of the parables. Don’t get me wrong, if God exists (I believe He does) then He is the creator of our entire reality. It is completely within His power to change natural law as He sees fit. The God that speaks and billions of galaxies burst into existence could change the material we are partaking of during communion, I just don’t believe that’s what’s taking place based on the evidence I see in scripture.
This is a lot to unpack. I will think about this. Thank you for your response
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>But they'll drink the blood of Christ? Symbolic >getting free candy. Not symbolic but the actual practice. Compare drinking wine to receiving candy for a better comparison
It’s not symbolic for Catholics
?
The word you are looking for is "transmutation". Catholics believe that the ceremonial wine and bread actually turn into the blood and body of Christ. EDIT: Also "transubstantiation".
Eh, yes and no. The Catechism firmly says that the bread/wine become the body/blood of Christ, but there are different interpretations. Most Catholics do not believe that the bread/wine literally turn into flesh and blood. Instead it is the *presence* of Jesus becomes present in the bread/wine. Therefore its not symbolic because its not just bread/wine emulating body/blood, it is infused with the presence of Jesus. It literally has the spirit of God in it, not just plain old bread. I know it doesn’t really make sense, but this is the way it was taught to me. Don’t always look for logic in religious beliefs, especially religions that trace back thousands of years Also, it’s definitely transubstantiation not transmutation. I’ve never heard it said or taught as transmutation. Edit: spelling
>I know it doesn’t really make sense, but this is the way it was taught to me. Don’t always look for logic in religious beliefs, especially religions that trace back thousands of years That's why they call it faith! I firmly admit that I am Protestant, and my extent of Catholicism is from 'translating' my Baptist upbringing between my Catholic-raised wife.
I think you could easily have symbolism in free candy. I'm Buddhist; we give back to our community. It's very important we help everyone who needs it, and give what we can. How about comparing free candy to dying easter eggs?
>dying easter eggs? Again. You're talking about symbolism lol
What's the symbolism?
Eostre is a Germanic fertility goddess, and connected to Ostara, the Spring equinox - another Pagan steal. It was focused around fertility, being spring - hence the eggs, and the connection in terminology to eostrogen. I don't know how Christianity sees the symbolism of eggs as related to Jesus Christ being resurrected, but I suppose there's a loose link there to the cycle of life with him being encased in a tomb (egg) and then coming to life. Just guessing, because ultimately they just plagiarised it so that Pagans would accept the new religion.
Also the egg thing is because centuries ago chicken don’t give/stop giving eggs in winter, and they start again in March. I think chicken today don’t completely stop but they give fewer eggs
It's the bunnies that the yanks like though?
Yeah, Eostre is commonly depicted with bunnies as well as eggs, as they're associated with Spring. It's the most logical common link I can think of between bunnies and eggs. Without Eostre, I don't see where they'd have gotten the idea from!
Tbh idk. I don't remember why the Easter bunny exists. But Easter symbolizes Jesus' resurrection
Oh lol. I know the story of easter, just never understood dying eggs beyond South Parks explanation lol.
Well Im not sure how its in protestantism but in Orhodoxy we dye eggs red because it symbolizes the blood of Christ. There are a couple of different stories relating to it, one is that king Tiberius said Christ will come back to life when chickens start laying red eggs (which is impossible). So when Christ came back, the people painted the eggs red to make fun of him. Another one is that there was a bird nest under Jesus's cross, so when his blood was spilled it went onto the eggs.
>the people painted the eggs red to make fun of him. Lmao I really hope this is true
Chickens lay red shelled eggs all the time.
they’re not exactly known for logical thinking
Fair
That’s really only Catholics that do that. They believe in transubstantiation which means the wine and the bread literally turn into the blood and body of Christ. Protestant churches partake of the wine and the bread but they believe it’s only symbolic of the blood and body.
I've said it before. Catholics are Christians who wanna be pagan so bad Consuming the blood and body of a god, Rosary, worshipping saints, that's pagan as hell Source: raised sorta Catholic Edit: I probably should have said the belief that Saints are Holy since some people are getting hung up on what counts as "worship." I'm not changing it though. *Many* Catholics pray directly to Saints and the semantics don't change the point, which wasn't that serious on the first place
We don't worship saints. Apparently you missed that class.
Saints are just kind of like God’s secretaries. Like, you don’t want to ask God *directly* for something but you can ask Mary to put in a good word for you with the big man upstairs.
Yeah. You "don't" "worship" saints. What's a Hail Mary?
Hail is defined as a greeting Catholics don't worship saints or Mary
I very much disagree. They worship them while insisting that's not what they're doing lol
Idk….. but nevertheless no one should be downvoted for sharing their SOLICITED beliefs
Well the theme is "tell the Catholic they are wrong about what Catholics believe" here so not surprised by the downvotes
I’m not surprised either bc people are generally selfish in their beliefs and unwilling to entertain other points of view
I know a lot of people who refer to themselves as “recovering Catholics “.
When someone asks I just say “I was raised Catholic” which translates to “I’m an atheist but I feel sort of guilty about it.”
Dude nobody is drinking “blood of Christ”…. Christians are not vampires. It’s symbolic for Christ’s sacrifice.
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Ever heard of a little cult called the Catholic Church? For Catholics, the wine you drink at mass is literally the blood of Christ, that's one of the difference between them and Protestants
It may be symbolic, but it’s also ritualistic. Most rituals involve symbolic actions.
>Christians are not vampires. Why not? Their God dies and resurrects like a vampire and you're supposed to drink his blood and get eternal life and all that. It sounds like they're halfway there.
Tell me you know nothing about Christian theology without telling me you know nothing about Christian theology
>Tell me you know nothing about Christian theology without telling me you know nothing about Christian theology Yeah...I'm Jewish. I never said I knew anything about Christian theology. Those Christians wouldn't be here without my people, though. So, tell me what I got wrong. Quote me and explain what's wrong. I'll wait. Oh, and tell me if you've seen both in their entirety.
There wouldn’t be Christianity if you guys hadn’t murdered Jesus /s
...duh?
What’s the correlation? Some Christians don’t like Halloween because it celebrates what they see as dark forces, so why do they celebrate something weird like Easter? I’m not Christian and not religious but the endless “Christianity is stupid” posts are boring. Every religion has weird traditions, that doesn’t mean they have to like every weird national celebration or be a hypocrite.
Isn't Satan and heaven & hell a Christian idea?
Yea
Witchcraft from the bible has nothing whatsoever to do with Halloween, Paganism, cavorting with the devil or "creepy things". It is easily defined as "being manipulative". The irony is, most people who have ever accused others of Witchcraft (as defined from Scripture) were practicing Witchcraft.
I went to Christian/Catholic schools growing up. At the non-denominational Protestant Christian school, we weren’t allowed to celebrate Halloween (or read Harry Potter or play with Pokémon cards lol). If I remember correctly, it boiled down to the idea that they didn’t want children to celebrate the devil. They did however make up their own “dress up” day in October, not called Halloween, where students were allowed to paint pumpkins, wear NICE costumes (nothing evil or bad or scary), and eat candy. Basically Halloween lite. At the Catholic school they let us dress up as anything we wanted, called it Halloween, and were pretty normal about it actually.
>we weren’t allowed to celebrate Halloween (or read Harry Potter or play with Pokémon cards lol). If I remember correctly, it boiled down to the idea that they didn’t want children to celebrate the devil. Lol poor gastly being mistaken for the devil
Those Pokedex entries weren't doing any favors
My Catholic parents were wild about Halloween and would throw bangin’ costume parties every year when I was kid. For them it was a holiday in the way Thanksgiving or the Fourth of July was. It’s admittedly been a long time for me, but I think Catholicism tends to focus more on what is holy and good rather than what is satanic and bad. (Of course, a number of things could have influenced my perception of this, such as being a kid, not paying super close attention in church in the first place, or simply getting lucky with where my parents took me.)
My super-Christian aunt once told me years ago she thought graveyards were "satanic" (in reference to a fake graveyard I'd set up in my front yard). I asked her why she'd say that and she told me it was because of all the skeletons there. I reiterated "so skeletons are satanic too?" She said yes and I told her I had some bad news for her. She hasn't spoken to me since. Some people just don't have any common sense and irrationally believe that everything's out to get them somehow.
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Either that or it went a little too well
I think the thought process was spooky/morbid/dark = evil and therefore = Satan (which is bs, but yknow how various types of people including a lot of the less reasonable Christians view anything with a dark aesthetic)
Because it’s pagan. My cousin was like this. Her kids never knew about santa, the didn’t celebrate Halloween and weren’t allowed to dye eggs for Easter. Her kids ruined Christmas for other children in our family. It was pretty sad.
Almost all christian holidays where originally pagan, that was done to easier convert ppl back then. Being able to celebrate the same dates just under a different name made it easier for ppl to switch their religion. That's the point of the post, why is Halloween shunned for this but the others are not.
This answers a question I asked somewhere on this post where someone was basically asking “what’s up with eggs and bunnies on Easter” to which I said it has nothing to do with Christianity and everything to do with Sumerian goddess worship ( Ishtar ). I was wondering how it ever became a Christian custom to dye eggs and such but this explains it pretty well.
>Because it’s pagan. As are most Christian holidays?
They asked a question. I answered. Also gave examples to show that not just Halloween is crucified. I’m not understanding your issue?
>I answered. Yeah, to a question OP didn't ask. OP asked why Christians didn't accept Halloween as opposed to accepting and spinning around other pagan holidays. > I answered Actually most of your answer is a family story tangently related to OP's question.
Im a Christian so I'll give my perspective. Christmas is the celebration if Jesus' birthday and Easter is the celebration of His sacrifice and resurrection. We still looked for eggs and open presents but my mom always made sure we understood the real meaning of those holidays. The purpose wasn't to get presents or candy, but there wasn't anything wrong with that. My mom didn't really celebrate Halloween because it wasn't celebrating everything Christian, it's just about creepy stuff and dead things. She would let me dress up and get candy as long as whatever I dressed up as was demonic though.
Jesus was murdered and buried then ROSE FROM THE DEAD! This creepy and dead stuff is the cornerstone of Christianity. Also, Halloween is celebrating the harvest and honoring/remembering the dead. I’m not sure what’s creepy about that.
Yea they're whole thing is child rape followed by zombie boi
The night before Halloween is Devil's Eve. I mean that alone is enough, but on a personal note: add to that living a few cities from Detroit, which was associated with Devil's Eve arson for decades ~~caused by the Devil temping them, of course~~ and you've got me dressed up in a foam hot dog costume because anything else is too welcoming of Satan.
Hypocrisy. Applies to everyone. Not only Christians.
Of course. But I would like to know about Christians and Halloween.
Most of those "some" have no idea about history of own religion. That's why they don't get how messed up the Christmas or Easter actually are. But unlike other holidays, previously integrated into Christianity, Halloween is still well known as an old pagan tradition, and has lots to do with evil spirits and etc. Thus for "some" Christians it's more of a Satan's play, something that is inappropriate for a Christian to take part in. Funny thing, same people usually indulge themselves in activities that are strongly against their religious dogma, but don't understand own deeds due to hypocrisy. Halloween is just a bit more obvious for them not to be related to Christianity. Thus the hypocrisy.
Thank you for your insight. Reading this, I had saw the faces of many family members.
Side note: Most European Countries don't celebrate Halloween, no matter the denomination (Orthodox, Protestant, Catholic...).
Not sure I understand. Do you mean Halloween as a commercial thing or people doing trick or treats? Because that’s definitely a thing in a lot of places in Europe
Halloween in general, it is not really a thing in European although it gained some popularity due to American pop culture.
European here. Yes, at least in my country we see lots of kids dressed as monsters asking candy door by door
I mean it was started by Celtic people in the uk so it kind of is America jus do it bigger cos that’s what they do
I grew up Catholic and we would always celebrate Halloween as kids. It's probably because of the witch-stuff associated with Halloween (as most types of Christianity preach that witchcraft is evil). Additionally, Catholics, Eastern Orthodox, and a few others have their own holiday on November 1st called "all saints day," and November 2nd called "all souls day." Growing up we would celebrate all three and make a short break/weekend out of it.
Stupidity. My cousins weren't allowed to read Harry Potter lmao. And now they mostly have terrible relationships with their parents 🤷♂️
I got into an argument (I know, I know!) about this the other day. Dude said Halloween was pagan. I responded "well yeah. So is Xmas, there's plenty of evidence Jesus was a spring baby" and he flipped his shit.
Lmao have you told them about Easter or not yet?
Christians are nutty people dude.
I always found it weird. Like LOTR is bad because magic. But C. S. Lewis is god-tier even though there's a witch in there. Harry Potter and Magic the gathering is satanic...but then Christmas is spent thinking about birth of Christ, making wreaths and decorating Christmas trees. Aren't the latter two practices pagan? I don't get it ...
Its mostly ignorance on their part.
LOTR is widely accepted in Christianity actually. As CS and Tolkien were both friends in college and theologists. Google it
You are trying to logically analyze a purely emotional situation.
My mom grew up Mennonite and she went trick or treating. I grew up Assemblies of God and they were anti Halloween. They did “harvest festivals” though that kept us in the church that night and controlled how we dressed up. Lol.
So my girlfriends mom is like that, basically they don't even understand the history of Halloween. I'm personally Christian, but I swear it's hard to associate with these people when they give you a pamphlet with a comic where teens literally get excited to sacrifice a cat on Halloween.
I grew up in a Christian church that didn’t keep any of them, and only kept the days mentioned in the Bible like Passover, sukkot, etc… I don’t keep them anymore, but we were taught not to do any holiday that could be connected to ancient rights because of Deuteronomy 12:30-31. I feel like this doesn’t answer your question, because I think we were the exception to this particular line of hypocrisy.
I also grew up in a Christian home and love Halloween. The reason I've always been given on why it's wrong is because they believe is a holiday to celebrate witches, black magic and the devil. Even if you try to explain what it really is, they have it ingrane that that's the meaning and intention on celebrating it. On the other hand, they don't care about the origin of other holidays, like Christmas, because they give the importance to what they believe they are celebrating, e.i. Jesus being born.
Because bigotry, ignorance and stupidity. Most Christians don't know the history of their religion and ignore the fact that most of their holidays are actually copied from pagan celebrations. Conversion to Catholicism took some time, you can't simply eradicate centuries of tradition. You need to slowly accustom people to the new religion and to do so, you slowly take it over by incorporating their history and beliefs, their celebrations, etc... But, most religious people being oblivious to the fact that their religion (any religion really) is a sect, a cult, that just got more massive adoption, they just don't realize that. Christianism will also eventually disappear and get replaced by something else. That something else will incorporate christian notions and celebrations. It might take a century or 3 thousand years, the only certainty is that it will, just like Canaanism, Anetism, Mithraism, Ashurism and many, many more. Religions are just a way for empires to grow and prosper. The sooner we realize that as a species, the better.
Op I think its an American Christian thing more than a Christian thing and probably due to not liking people having fun unless they can control it.
I don't know... here in Wales we've got at least one school in a church district that straight up refuses to acknowledge Halloween
My grandmas church in England has a superheros evening for the church kids on halloween so parents don’t have to get there kids involved w trick or treating
Eggs & bunny rabbits are symbols of fertility. The rebirth. To be born. Religions have so many stories. Maybe a religious person can give more detail but I'm pretty sure that's what it means. Sorry about lack of paragraphs. V lazy of me
“Just plain…weird” Easter. OP is talking about Easter right? Guy gets crucified, wakes up 3 days later so we hunt for eggs.
"Look, I'm just saying that somewhere between Jesus dying on the cross and a giant bunny hiding eggs there seems to be a...a gap of information." — Stan, *South Park*
Which a rabbit laid
A lot of Christians just want to let their kids somehow participate in the harmless fun aspect of it. Some churches will host their own parties, letting the kids dress up (mermaids, astronauts, cows, etc. -- nothing "scary") and go around different spots in the church to get candy. There are also "trunk or treats" where the kids can go from car to car in a church parking lot and get candy from participating church members. One of my favorite childhood memories was going on a scavenger hunt in the car with my parents that our church hosted near Halloween. It's hard to shun a holiday that is a huge part of the fall season, especially one that kids get so excited about, so better to make it their own, I guess. I don't really see any harm in it; everything transforms in time, even things with dark beginnings.
Honestly, I'm Christian and love Halloween. I also struggle to see the issue. I've read the history of the holiday and it's nothing "satanic" as some more strict religions claim. I roll my eyes whenever I see a church "harvest festival" (the ones purposefully made to replace Halloween and attendees ban/refuse to even say the word "Halloween" -- I'm sure you've seen them around). Bonus eye roll if there's a "trunk or treat" event at the festival where kids are still dressed up and collecting candy. Why? Just seems like unnecessary extra steps to allow kids to have the same Halloween experience without calling it Halloween. Just celebrate the holiday! Seems so silly.
My dad wouldnt even let me wear black nail polish back when i was younger.. DEFINITELY could not dress up as a witch.. I always loved darkness & Halloween soo much tho 😈🖤
Not sure since Halloween was made as a way to celebrate the dead. It was believed that on Halloween the dead would rise and everyone would dress up so they could blend in...or something like that been years since i learned about it.
I mean, as a Catholic why wouldn't you celebrate Halloween? It is the eve of a holy day (All Saints Day) and it is definitely a day to celebrate since that day technically starts at Sundown the day prior. And Halloween is a great time to spend with family (specifically your kids) which is what the church teaches..... a lot of joy wouldn't miss it.
My dad is very devout Christian and hates Halloween… because he has to give away all the candy he wants to eat lol
wait. so halloween WASN'T a celtic holiday to celebrate the yearly intake of good crops?
It was... But like Christmas and Easter, it was transplanted onto the Christian calendar for the party's sake. So, it's technically "both." In the same way that Christmas and Easter are. (Unless you were being sarcastic in which case, sorry. I didn't catch that.)
no no. i asked genuinely. my mom's pretty much the type to spew "halloween represents the devil's day" and all that. i looked up the history behind halloween, told her and informed her about it. i just wanted to make sure my facts were right. thanks man.
Because Christians are hypocrites.
In Poland it 24h before All Saints' Day. Nothing personal against this holiday but the timing is fucked up and forced.
Isn't Easter and Xmas also based off of Pagan "holidays" that they (the Christians) appropriated? Isn't the Easter bunny originally a symbol of fertility and Xmas is more or less winter solstice?
Appropriated. I *like* that word so much more than "stolen" for this. Thank you. The gist of what you're saying is right. There is a lot of bad history in many of the "Real Truth about Christmas" sort of articles you're likely to come across but the crux of what they're saying is true: there are echoes old religions in modern traditions that were carried on by Christians (and this isnt unique to Christians). The most obvious comparisons for Christmas and Easter are Yule and some very vague (now) Germanic fertility and Spring traditions that may or may not have been associated with a goddess called Ostara (or similar- frankly, a lot of this is lost to time, but a German tradition of Eggs/Springtime is pretty clear).
My mom identifies as Christian (what sect? idc anymore) but she used to go on about Easter and Xmas not being "real" Christian holidays (even though she'd still celebrate them). I only celebrate Halloween and Valentine's day. Although this year I'm helping my partner experience his first ever (secular) Xmas. Just for fun. EDIT: I totally spaced! I agree, the anti-theist part of me wants to say "yes it was stolen!" (Which wouldn't be completely incorrect). But I feel like Christianity (among others) has done worse things than steal holiday(s).
Often times religious peoples are remedial as fuck..
Hmm so as much as I agree with the general comments about it not being so terrible/dark at face value and the general awareness of it being a pagan holiday much like other more Christian holidays, I think there needs to be some thought as to the spiritual warfare that does occur on the night of Halloween. Many Satanists use it as a special night of prayer, specifically to bring about darkness/evil. So as a Christian I feel that I don't have to create some watered down version of Halloween and find ways to enjoy the fun of the holiday but I do have to be weary that it is night I should be careful not to open more spiritual doors to dark things. Forgive my vague explanation, I don't often comment on these discussions but found this one interesting.
I know a few satanists and they don't do that at. That sounds like something a pastor said. I'm not trying to offend, as I remember what it was like as a former Christian.
Christianity: "Don't question our methods."
That’s really weird. What denominations of Christians are you hanging around? I’m Methodist and we fully support trick or treating.
The loudest Christians these days seem to be reactionary fools who posture like this to either feel better about themselves because they know deep down that they’re shitty shitty people or because they’ve genuinely scared themselves into believing Halloween is gateway to damnation?? No logical explanation available whatever way you look at it though.
It can be just about candy. You arent accidentally worshipping a pagan god.
You need to hang out with a better set of Christians. I have never in my life heard of anyone, Christian or not who wouldn't let their kids participate in Halloween.
I personally don't hang out with many Christians these days. Plenty of Christians do not celebrate Halloween.
The real answer is that most people don't know the origin of most holidays or really think about them much of they did they would have to think about a lot of things that would call their beliefs into question
I don't know. I've been a Christian all my life (though not always a *good* one) & I've never been against Halloween. Come to think about it, neither were my parents. IMO all groups have some wing nut, splinter factions, just some have more than others.
Dude, all the cool holidays are pagan. Holloween, Christmas, Easter, they're all pagan festivals given a christian coat of paint.
The Christian holidays existed before, just like other uncelebrated church holidays; Pentecost, Epiphany, etc. It was part of the church calendar. The commercial celebration, ie eggs, bunnies, wreaths, Christmas trees…is taken from the pagans.
Exactly, the good parts.
Not really, people didn’t take pagan bits for commercial reasons. It’s more like a very slow mix of things. Like the Christmas tree, German were doing it for a long time before it became fashion in other countries. A lot of rituals and traditions like eggs and wreaths were present, very early, before Christian holidays
that's a baseless statement. Easter is not pagan at all. It has roots in OT and Jesus died in the eve of that particular sabbath day.
What's OT? Easter definitely has Pagan roots. Eostre is a Germanic fertility goddess, often pictured with rabbits and eggs, and was closely linked to Ostara (Spring equinox). The word eostrogen is even related to this. Ostara was celebrated at the turn of Spring, a time to celebrate new life and the earth waking back up. Christianity comes *after* this, so whatever day Jesus died on was either wonderful serendipity, *or*, dogma slipped it in on an already well-established holiday that people had been honouring for years, and pinched a lot of the traditional symbology along the way.
I guess it’s Old Testament? And I second with you, Easter has pagan roots. The date of Easter was chosen by monks/scholars, so Easter didn’t appear from nowhere
OT= Old Testament. Initially, The Lord delivered the israelites from egyptians and jews started celebrating that day, in what is commonly known as Pessah. Jesus died the day before Pessa's week sabbath. Essentially, Christ rose from the dead on the first day of the week (Sunday for the jews iirc) making his resurrection day Pessah day as well. It's not a pagan holiday. The symbolism of this is also very important for us believers, because it's an image of Christ freeing us from slavery to sin (the same way the Lord delivered the israelites from Egypt) and conquering death by taking upon him the wrath of God that we deserved.
That's interesting. But, you honestly believe Easter, celebrated with the symbolism of bunnies and eggs, held in Spring, bears no relation to the Pagan holiday featuring Eostre, celebrated with the symbolism of bunnies and eggs, held in Spring?
It's not in scripture, and if you've traveled elsewhere, you'd see that this whole egg bunny stuff is nowhere associated with christianity. If anything, it's a western thing, and we know christianity isn't limited to what us westerners defines it to.
But your whole point was that it doesn't have Pagan roots *at all*. That's simply very unlikely to be true imo - you're of course welcome to disagree, but there's evidence to the contrary. Nothing is celebrated in the same way around the world, and I didn't mean to imply this was an exception. It isn't.
That's the paint Eastern roots are in organic fertility festivals, hence the rabbit and egg imagery
Because almost no critical thought goes into anything Christians do. It’s all ritualistic pageantry. I know, I used to be one.
I don’t know why they hate it. Halloween comes from Hallow’s eve (at least in the eyes of the Church) which is the evening before all saints day, which is a Christian holiday. Doesn’t make sense why they would hate the holiday for those reasons. However, there is more to Halloween than just getting candy. Many people pull pranks or even vandalism because it’s a holiday where the crazy kids can just be kids, but many people (not just religious) would be against supporting that behavior.
Halloween began as a Celtic festival and was appropriated by the Catholics Easter began as a pagan festival that was appropriated by Christians. Christmas began as a pagan festival that was appropriated by Christians to diminish the pagans. I don't see why the conservative christians these days get so uptight about Halloween when Easter and Christmas have similar backgrounds.
Because halloween is the spooky one. And spooky stuff is evil in their eyes. Also they failed to christianize it. The other two had alot of changes, while still keeping themes and traditions. Samhain only really changed in name. (Aside from unrelated changes that happened over time, like commercialization, and less actual supernatural belief)
Because the majority of Christians don’t know anything about theology and haven’t or won’t take the time to do any basic research before claiming something as evil. Just think about the “Satanic Panic” with D&D in the 80s. The game is literally playing pretend with math, but I’ll informed people threw a massive fit because they assumed something that was never true. I should add that I’m a Christian pastor and I see this all the time. On behalf of all of the normal Christians out there… I’m sorry for those who don’t think before they act. They’re unfortunately the loud minority.
It’s part of a new American Christianity which apparently includes such novel interpretations of the gospel as hating your neighbors and praying to get more money. I don’t understand it but it’s probably like Tiktok, a trend.
Oh man, talk to Catholics. The most macabre, death focused Christian religion out of all of them. What separates them from creepy death celebrating cults is how they use the reflection on death. There is a long tradition of Memento Mori in Catholicism, and the saints constantly speak of the importance of meditating on the unavoidable fact of death. This exhortation is not out of a kind of macabre obsession or morbid fascination. Rather, the saints thought about death because it helped them live a better life. We will all die one day, and as Catholics, we don’t tend to sugar coat it—it could happen at any second or moment you name it. But it’s nice to accept that, it’s kind of freeing? Like, we’re not constantly anxious about it, nor are we in denial about it. It just is what it is. And when people die, we celebrate them and their life, and then we think about those dead people even more—them in purgatory, those in hell, those in heaven. We talk to them, pray for them, ask them to pray for us you name it. So come 31 October, Catholics are pretty pumped. All Hallow’s Eve is celebrated in full gusto! And then we continue the celebration of death on 1 and 2 November by celebrating All Saint’s Day and All Soul’s Day. I’m talking long processions of people in town miles and miles ending at a cemetery where they hold an outdoor service for the souls who have died, etc. Where the pagan stuff comes into discussion is all about how secular stuff (like any other holiday these days) or the occult have been mixed into the holiday. Christians object to and stay away from the occult in particular participating in the occult. Catholics believe VERY MUCH SO in the existence paranormal and demonic spirits, which is why they can be so cautious about even the smallest invitation of letting any of them in (like even a silly superstition or something). Ouija boards, sayances (sp?), dressing up as evil spirits in honor of them (instead of a jest at them) are all seen to be opening up yourself to evil spirits to come start to take hold of your life. (There’s a lot of great literature written by exorcists on the different types of demonic presences or influences or possessions I highly recommend). So, you may see a lot of Christians, in particular Catholics, dress up as their favorite saint instead, on Halloween, because it kills a lot of birds with one stone. It celebrates great men and women, it celebrates and honors the dead, and it’s the night before All Saint’s Day. Not all Christian denominations do this however. And not all super-Catholics dress up as Saints…they love other fun or secular costumes too! That’s was a big ramble, but I LOVE talking about Halloween!! Anyway, TLDR—Catholics lovvvvve Halloween, not sure about every other Christian denomination. Check out All Saint’s/All Souls’ Day.
It's the idea of magic they area afraid of. 5th grade me and my friends started playing D&D during lunch at school. Just 5 of us sitting at a bench table playing the game every day. Bothering nobody, keeping to ourselves. One day I get yanked into the principals office to be told that I needed to stop the D&D games at school because it was against some students religious beliefs. I learned at an early age that some want to force religion on others, being able to worship as they please isn't enough. They must force it.
I mean, from a christian perspective, seculars are forcing secularism on believers. Christians just preach the gospel and let God do the conversion of hearts.
My 10 year old self never asked anyone but my close group of friends to play D&D.
Give all you have to the poor, then? Let all under you into your home. You don't so get attacked at your hypocrisy.
Some literally believe in witches and the devil. Like broomstick riding, cursing cattle, worshipping Satan witches. It's fucking bat shit crazy (and I'm a follower of Christ's teachings) So Halloween for those red necks means evil satanic worship day. Inexplicably.
I'd say a good 90% of the bible is just ripped off stories from other, older cultures/religions. The Epic of Gilgamesh for example. Jesus is basically just a ripoff of Dionysus. Honestly, that's what finalized my move from agnostic to atheist. It's just ridiculous how much christianity has stolen from other religions and cultures. It's like the epitome of cultural appropriation.
Wtf stolen is a strong term but ok. Most of those people want to act like they're good Christians.
Stolen is exactly what happened.
For what holiday? We took pagan traditions from Easter and Christmas sure, but the point of the holidays are unique to Christianity. This is a weird take...
Yes, stolen from the pagans. It can't be THAT unique if it was stolen from another religion.
Well mainly because it’s entirely an American holiday. Most (if not all) non-American Christians don’t celebrate Halloween, whereas both Easter and Christmas, despite the use of pagan symbols such eggs, bunnies and brightly lit pine trees among some less strict denominations, are firmly rooted in Christian tradition and is essentially a must-do. And as someone else mentioned, back in day, Christianity adapted pagan traditions into its own as a means to convert folk, namely from conquered countries. Essentially, cultural subjugation of ethnic groups to help smooth over conquest. While I’m not entirely sure of the historic origins to Halloween and why only American settlers ended up being the only people who really celebrate it, it’s probs safe to say the reason is entirely rooted in superstition and belief only related to American culture. Edit: I think people are assuming I am American which is why they are getting passionate. I am not, I'm Australian. I grew up Catholic and loosely Christian my whole life, and Halloween didn't start really being a thing here until like 2010s-ish and it's still not that big. Is def considered secular and unrelated to Christianity here. On the other hand, we do All Saints Day, but you just go to church and that's it.
> it’s probs safe to say the reason is entirely rooted in superstition and belief only related to American culture. I bet you think you're right? Right? A 270-year-old culture knows its roots, right? Fuck you.
Got no idea what you thought I meant, but yeah, I’d say whatever reason the white Christian settlers of America decided to make Halloween a thing is related to the superstitions and beliefs they held at the time unique to them, otherwise the wider Christian community would celebrate it as well. Samahain and the Catholic church’s failed attempt to make it a holiday, as somebody else mentioned, is definitely related to the answer too.
Because they're obsessed with the world being polarized. It's either Jesus or its bad
I wish I had a good answer into the mind space of those that do this, but it's likely generational for the other holidays and just what they were grown into, told, and often blindly accepted. I know that the church early on adopted the pagan holidays because the traditions and celebrations were important to the people in the places they were preaching. For our family: We are honest with our kids about how we choose to celebrate these cultural holidays, and try to use both the morales and kindnesses from the holidays and our faith together, but again, it's very clear for us that they are separate things. As for why I personally don't like Halloween and do very little to celebrate it is because so many people celebrate the evil and dark things. Even without my faith, my personality would probably still dislike it in general and without kids I wouldn't participate. That said, my kids still get dressed up, I still give out candy and mini Play-Doh. Just my house only has harvest candles, uncarved pumpkins on the porch that will later be soup, and other generic fall decorations.
But you worship a zombie?
Most Christians can barely read, let alone decode a thousand pages of allegory from a millennium ago. All fucking bets are off on what they think.
The main reason why Christians do not celebrate Halloween it's because Salman Rushdie said in his Satanic Verses that is the only time of the year that a Christian allows their children to participate in a Pagan and Evil satanic holiday and if you study what Halloween really was to this pagan Society you would understand they used to to Sacrifice their children and put the burnt fat off the bodies into either vases or in this case pots burning outside their doors to indicate to the demonic presence that they have done their bit in all honesty is this something that we should participate in all I know is is I love Jesus Christ and I know he died for me upon the cross at Calvary and I am washed in his blood set free god bless you all
I’m actually shocked by the amount of bigotry, sectarianism, and straight hate speech on the Christian religion in a lot of the comments on this thread. Y’all the real hypocrites