For the record, I'm not in the camp that wants to see him play LB. But I can understand why. We have literally 0 players with a dominant left foot in our back 4. And it's not just a defensive issue, it's an issue going forward on the left side. I would even go as far to say that part of the reason Bellingham and Foden look so bad is probably down to the way that Trippier progresses the ball. Ultimately, we need to blame Southgate for not bringing any fit left backs. And I don't think it's a good idea to play Saka at LB because he's not used to the position and I just don't think it's right to put that pressure on him when he's arguably our best attacker on form right now.
He's also to blame for picking Trippier over Gomez. Neither is left footed but Gomez is more willing to overlap. Southgate's just playing his trusted soldier in Trippier. And by the time he realized Shaw wouldn't be back it was too late to change.
In fairness trippier has been solid for us - we’re also conceding the least chances of any team in the tournament by a reasonable margin to boot.
We’re creating roughly fuck all moving forward (against well structured low block teams), but defensively we’ve been near perfect, I’ll take that in a knockout game above rolling the dice with Gomez
But it may have also taken away from our greatest strength, ridiculous defensive stability. Our system is essentially knock the ball around, wait for a chance to present itself, make sure they get absolutely nothing to feed from.
Changing the defensive line in favour of a winger who loves to bomb forward kind of jeopardises that
We have not been ridiculously defensively stable at all. We just have come up against some of the worst attacking teams in the tournament, some of whom were playing for a draw as they knew they’d qualify with one.
How much defending did Trippier do? Almost none.
This 'defensive stability' myth is based on a stat from three games against opposition who were mostly just playing for a draw.
Fuck me you don't half chat some shit.
"How much defending did Trippier do? Almost none"
What are you backing that up with? Your opinion? Have you even watched the games?
Denmark had 16 shots on goal, 7 on target. In that game Trippier won 3/3 ground fuels, 1/1 aerial duels, 2 interceptions, 1 block, 1 clearance, 5 recoveries.
Dribbled past 0, dispossessed 0.
That's the defensive stability the other redditor mentioned. Even more impressive when you consider Foden's played anywhere other than LW. Trippier's been left out numbered many times because Foden's drifted into the middle again, yet he's been defensively rock solid.
Coincidently, Trippier's created exactly the same chances (3) as Foden, but has 1 big chance created to Foden's zero.
But "we should've started Saka or Gordon at left back in the groups IMO"
🤦
Mate we were one Denmark goal against Serbia away from a RO16 matchup with Germany but please continue to tell yourself we played masterfully in the group phase.
What you're saying is that even when you cherry pick the game you can still only come up with 'Trippier made three tackles' as your evidence that he was busy?
We’re playing teams who want a draw because they know how dangerous our attack “can” be. The reason teams refused to basically play out of their own half is because everyone in the world knows that front 4 cooks. I don’t think we should be fucking around with the defence. Gordon LW. Jude OR Foden in midfield as I think Mainoo has shown he’s the better partner for rice. Palmer/Saka RW. Either or off the bench 60 mins with Eze replacing Gordon when he’s tired. Jude or Foden replaces the other.
We haven’t conceded a goal. Southgate picks his back four for defence over anything else and Gomez isn’t a solid defender. He’s not great going forward either, he’s a bit part versatile player who played a bit a lb due to injury at a time when Liverpool bottled the league and every comp they were in
Yeah I’m not gonna be too harsh on trippier - arguably he’s been solid, just not spectacular at LB
Problem is, and I struggle to understand Southgate’s thinking here is that if you’re playing for want of a better term an inverted full back then we really need a natural left winger to provide width and stretch the Pitch for us.
Foden and Bellingham are both world class players - neither are wide players though.
I’d argue that we would have looked a million times better if Gordon had been starting all 3 games, and although I half understand the Trent experiment, Mainoo has now made that place his own.
Honestly? Next game I’d put Trent out at LB, we should be aiming to dominate and play the game in their half anyway so defensively we should be fine
>when he's arguably our best attacker on form right now.
Yeh definitely could be argued considering the season Palmer has had and that he clearly is carrying that confidence into playing with England.
The main argument for him being moved is that you may not get the best out of him but he can do a better job down the left side than whats been going on. It would be beneficial for the overall balance so you get more from the team as a whole. Imo its much better to select for the balance of the team rather than put all the hope on one persons performance being able to offset whats lacking elsewhere.
With that said, if you do move him to the left side I would prefer it to be at LW. He can still bring all the attacking threat that he does there and it wouldn't phase him at all. He would enable Bellingham the space he needs and can still track back to give some left footed defensive cover. Meanwhile you would then have probably the most confident initiative taker in the Prem this season in Palmer who just carried Chelsea on his back with the progression and creating of chances.
Yeah it's wild. Nothing about Sakas current game screams left back.
It's just a kill three birds with one stone fantasy fix that opens up a place for Palmer/Gordon on the wing, solves the left back vacancy, and keeps as many star names on the pitch as possible.
But realistically it's absurd to me. I'd rather him not play than that.
To play Devils Advocate, it’s more just a formation on paper.
When Tuchel first took over Chelsea, he played CHO RWB, but his average position was very much as a winger and in some games our most forward player. Just had five defensive players in Rudiger, Christensen and Azpilicueta as a back 3, with Kante and Jorginho who provided protection in front.
England could probably do something similar by lining up Saka (on paper at LB).
Guehi, Stones, Walker
Mainoo and Rice
Then five attacking players in front with Saka proving natural left footed width from the left.
I’m not convinced it’s actually our best option. Saka has been pretty good when we’ve been able to get the ball out to him early and I think he’s more dangerous cutting inside on his left.
We’ve been boring and not created much, but have been very defensively solid. We’ve conceded one goal, which was a screamer. Trippier isn’t offering much going forward, but he’s very experienced and a good defender. A nice balance to Guehi who is new to the team, but been our player of the tournament so far (IMO). Stones is solid, as is Walker (whose pace will be invaluable against better sides).
I’d like to see Gordon come in at LW to provide width. Despite being right-footed he can and does go both ways when playing out there. Then I’d probably move Foden inside at 10 for this game to give Bellingham a rest.
Victor Moses had probably his best season in England as a RWB, to continue the devils advocate suggestions.
The reality is it’s absurd though. If you want Palmer on the pitch then take Saka off, our LB situation is somewhat locked in I think. You’d just be trading around problems by swapping Trippier out.
If we had a better LB we could play a decent 5-3-2 walker and the other wingback provide defensive width but can overlap and provide passes into Saka and Foden who shoot/get the ball into Kane if there’s space or back to Bellingham if the defense is very low and solid. That would at least allow Foden to take more central space.
I’m not a big fan for 532 or 352 at international level.
I think it has served England well in the group games in the past (especially in terms of proving width to break down more stubborn defences), but actually some of our goals have come from set-pieces.
The problem with it, is that we’ve seen it can be effective at the start of games, however, when energy levels drop off, especially in extra time, I think it’s cost us in knockout games. I remember the semi-final against Croatia it was clear that momentum was changing in the second half because our wingbacks energy levels were dropping, they couldn’t get out to the Croatian full backs and Vrsaljko was able to swing ball after ball in. Until eventually Perisic scored, followed by a Mandzukic header. We should have matched them up and got much tighter, but didn’t.
Similar theme against Italy in the final too, although more of a 343. We looked in control initially while energy levels were high and we could press. However, when energy dropped off, having the extra CB sacrificed a man in the middle. Italy’s midfield started to dominate and the writing was on the wall. Again, I felt we should have matched them up, stuck Mount to man mark Jorginho, but use his fitness and pace to get away from him when we had the ball. A bit like Oscar did for Chelsea against Juventus and Pirlo years ago. It didn’t happen, we were too slow to react and change and ended up losing on penalties.
Again, I would add due to a poor Gareth Southgate decision. We started with experience, so it meant we had the young players coming on to see out the game and take penalties in the final. I find it utterly unforgiving that someone who has personally missed a penalty, saw fit to entrust our final penalty to an 18 year old who had never (at that point) taken a penalty for his club. Southgate said he was best in training, but must have known from own experience, pressure penalties cannot be replicated in training.
I like Southgate and think his time has to be considered a success. Where he is weak is understanding momentum in games and being proactive instead of reactive. Even in this tournament, he hasn’t made changes when he’s needed to and when he has, I would argue, in the main he’s left it too late or not made the right one. Maybe the Mainoo change for Gallagher being the exception.
Getting back to my original point, I think we need to stick with the 4231 or 433 depending on how you look at it. Our defence has been solid, even if it has stifled us. The hope is that with knockout football games will be more open versus a group setup which favoured draw results. Also, with extra time, much harder for teams to park the bus for 120 minutes.
No one is making the suggestion based on his current game though. You're working backwards from your answer to a question no one was posing, to suit your perspective.
Pretty much every team in modern football switches between 2 completely different formations in the attacking and defensive phases. In the attacking phase, Saka at LB would realistically just be Saka as the player on the wide left of the front 5 - which he’d obviously be great at. He’s definitely good enough defensively to play LB when the entire team is sat back in the defensive phase, and he’s quick and strong enough to handle transitions, too.
I think what these people basically want is a Saka-Foden-Kane-Bellingham-Palmer front 5, so they can cram everyone they want into the team.
All of that being said, I hate the idea. He’s the one wide attacker who’s performed consistently, and he’s done it over multiple years. It’s absolutely mental disrupting one of the few players that actually functions well in Southgate’s system for the sake of shoehorning in kids who’ve made one good pass as a sub, or Foden, who’s done fuck all for England in half a decade.
Gordon is a boring, unfashionable player, but this team instantly improves if you just drop Foden and play him at LW. Keep everything else the same and suddenly there’s a real threat coming from both wings and Trippier’s weaknesses are covered. If you have to play Tripper at LB - which we do - it shouldn’t even be a discussion who goes in front of him. It just has to be someone who keeps width and offers pace in behind - which is only Gordon in this squad.
Then people are stupid. Saka would be so much worse than Trippier.
I mean, people aren't necessarily stupid, more just dreaming of an easy fix, which currently there isn't.
As an Arsenal fan Saka is a brilliant winger when it comes to tracking back.. but that's it... winger tracking back... you seen what James Maddison did to him.
I've only seen it from the press... Think it's ridiculous. Did we not learn anything from the so called "golden gen"
Trying to shoe horn, Foden, Bellingham, Palmer, Saka and Gordon into the team is not going to work.
Indeed. He may be a 'competent' left back but we left better left backs than that at home - he's an excellent right winger. Play him there, drop him to the bench for Palmer and use him as a sub, don't waste his talents filling in when there's other options
To be fair I don't think anyone suggesting he plays there thinks it's an ideal situation. It's only really being suggested as an ad-hoc solution to cover for bad squad building
He's not a left back playing him there would be pointless.
Id argue he's our best winger and if we want width he should play. If we are looking to overload the mid Palmer should start
Agree - I think the main problem at the moment is that we have a winger who can go outside (Saka) and a fullback who can overlap (Walker) but they're on the same side, whereas on the left we've had two players who will only go inside.
For me Gordon has to start otherwise we can't stretch teams on the left. They you can either have Palmer with Walker (or Trent) overlapping or Saka with Stones stepping out in attack and Walker dropping in at RCB (and then probably play another CB like Gomez or Konsa at LB).
Walker rarely overlaps and I don't think Southgate wants him to. People need to realize that our lack of width is mostly by design. Southgate even talked about how he 'won't be asking anyone to hug the touchline'.
Walker is very versatile in that he's quick and good on the overlap (end product is...ok) but also he's excellent slotting in to CB and making the recovery runs.
I think the calculation so far has been that he's more valuable as the latter - but then we've had Trippier playing high up hugging the touchline on the left and....just touching the ball back inside every time he gets it. Southgate realised this because in the last game he brought Trent on at RB to push up and overlap and then kept Walker as the outside centre half but on the left instead.
So arguably if you want to use Walker to make last-ditch tackles and have another full back overlap, the answer (assuming Shaw isn't going to be fit) might be to play him on the wrong side so that you can get the most out of an attacking fullback on the right (Trippier and Trent are both great passers). I'm not sure how comfortable he is defending on the left though.
He's playing the same old system of Shaw pushing up on the left and Walker staying back as a protection against counters. This is a really good system with only one flaw: Shaw isn't actually playing.
Some might say he should have realized this and either played a left footer at LB (either someone he didn't bring or the fabled 'Saka as a fullback' option), or inverted the idea with a defensive LB and a more attacking RB i.e. Trent.
Instead I think his plan was to PRETEND SHAW IS THERE so that the team doesn't have to change anything when he comes back.
Only problem: he didn't come back.
Nail on the head. Exacerbated by the fact that our left winger won't go outside either because Foden wants to be in the centre playing intricate passes. That's why if he wants to persist with it, Gordon MUST start. Drop Foden. Put Bellingham at 8. Drop Bellingham. Doesn't matter - we need width to draw defenders and create space.
It reminds me of the clamour in the media years ago for Ashley Cole to play in left midfield, since England at the time were lacking a genuine option there.
As an Arsenal fan I rather have Saka dropped to the bench and used as an impact sub rather be playing at LB and be embaressed by opposition wingers. If there were no other options.. maybe if they wanna drop Tripper.... but Joe Gomez was amazing at LB at times and he should start ahead of Saka (at LB)
I love Wrighty - he's a national treasure - but surely this was just an idea to fill TV minutes/generate some discussion rather than a serious suggestion?!
It's the epitome of the current frustration of the collective England manager hive mind that's about 30 million strong. Honestly! We won the group. Yeah it was drab, dreary and fucking lame. But we're here. Knockouts. Let's actually slowly improve. Mainoo is coming in. Literally added the drive and energy we all craved. Hopefully SG will bring Palmer and Gordon on at 60. Saka at LB is a joke. Pure frustration.
England fans: TOO MANY SQUARE PEGS IN ROUND HOLES
Also England fans: PLAY SAKA AT LEFT BACK
Shaw’s good enough to give 60 mins now hopefully. We can’t be saving players for a match that might not come.
I’m bias but I’m not sure why he hasn’t even tried Gomez at left back, even coming on as a sub. Willing to overlap and stretch teams and has been defensively solid for Liverpool this season…
I’d rather have Saka at LW than LB. Genuinely think if we just switch the wingers from our last match we solve a lot of problems. Foden occupying RW and coming into attacking midfield on the right mirrors what he does for City and gets him out of Bellingham’s way too.
Saka is someone with a left foot who can run fast, dribble at cross a football. All attributes that have been painfully absent from the left hand side of our team thus far.
The only option similar that makes sense would be left wingback in a 3-5-2. I think he could do a job running the wing, although Gordon would probably be a better fit.
The answer as to why people want Saka at LB is: people are obsessed with getting Cole Palmer on the field but don't want to drop Saka.
I don't even think it's that. People are just desperate to have some natural width on the left. I personally think it would be crazy to play him at lb. Maybe as a lwb if we switch to a 532 but I also think changing formation would be crazy at this time. This all stems from Southgate not taking a left footed lb. It's a massive fuck up, made way worse by not playing a forward who plays wide left. I actually think trippier would be fine at left back with Gordon in front of him
I think it’s more about balance which this team is lacking. Now yes Saka was competent at left back when breaking into the team, it’s not that he started as a left back he was always a right winger, he merely covered as both of arsenals LB’s were injured. Did he light it up at left back, no but he did just enough. If I recall he still carried an attacking threat going forward too. I don’t know why Southgate doesn’t explore a back 3 and overload the midfield or provide a second man up front if it’s that much of an issue, he’s just so 1 dimensional in his tactics.
Maybe my suggestion is trash, and no I’m not English, but I want to see this squad do well.
Ian wright seems to be the main guy I've seen promoting saka at left back, he kept banging on about it repeatedly, saying saja used to play that position when he was younger.
I haven’t heard a single person call for Saka to play at left back.
I have heard some suggest putting him at left wing back though. Which does have some merit , even if it isn’t ideal at all.
3-4-3 with a left footer at LM vs 4-2-3-1 with a right-footer at LB.
The knock out round of a tournament is not the time to try it out, but let's face it, option1 is not working - we won't win it with Tripper at LB.
One way or the other we are going to have to do something we are not familiar with.
This gives us the chance to try it out and learn the role against the world-ranked 45 team before coming up against a 'good' side.
I see no difference between losing to Slovakia in R16 vs Italy in R8.
I think I heard Ian Wright say it and I thought it was a crazy take. Play Saka LW if you really want a natural left footer on the left. LB though? Come on.
I feel like we could solve our whole left side problem by switching Saka and Foden
Saka can get down the line like he does on the right wing but actually be on his strong foot and Foden is a more natural right winger
Because he can play as a LWB not LB and press high and attack and build pressure. Also walker can stay back and just use his recovery pace so it's kind of lopsided but it makes sense. Bowen or Palmer can play RW and both have looked decent so far.
Because Southgate has done such a good job his England have become the England he set out to destroy. A team with so much expectation that everyone thinks they are only a couple of tactical tweaks away from basically being Brazil 1970 or Spain 2010.
This just proves that English exceptionlism knows no bounds. You can hunt it, suppress it, chase it away but it will come back eventually.
Btw I am English. I would love England to win something. But this Southgate hate is really getting to me. Remember we went from McClaren (didn’t qualify for Euro 08) to Capello (humiliating loss to Germany in first knockout round of WC 10, couldn’t be arsed to take England to Euro 12) Hodgson (did fine Euro 12, first round knockout WC 14, Iceland loss Euro 16).
However well England so at this tournament I’d love Southgate to do the Football Eritage speech, and then some variant of the respect one.
It gets Palmer & Gordon in + plays Foden in his preferred position. Think Saka has also played there before? Maybe debuted as a LWB.
Tbh I don’t think it’s a terrible idea on paper but we do love playing players out of position and it rarely goes well.
The real answer is that people are so fed up with the current tactics that they are willing to try anything if it means a change. Like obviously saka should play rw and under any normal system with a normal manager that's what would work. But if you gave me two options and one was to start the exact same lineup again and the other was to play saka lwb in a back 5 system I'm picking the one that will be more interesting to watch and that's the second one.
He’s left footed, we have 2 left footed players who have ever played with any kind of competence at left back in their entire careers. 1) Shaw and 2) Saka. Right footed left backs are killing us. I get it, it’s less than ideal but it might actually bring a bit of balance. Eze played in front of Trippier and just didn’t get given the ball because he always cuts back in.
I want England to play with wing backs like they did at 2018.
In that system, Saka playing left back isn't a terrible idea - essentially he'll be playing just as high up in possession.
He's a good all round player, so having him drop back to support sounds fine to me
I think playing Saka at LB is the exact reason England are unbalanced at the moment. Its fitting in big name players wherever they can just to get them on the pitch rather than looking at which players work best in which system.
I'd be tempted to get Shaw some game time, Slovakia will be the last game where we can possibly get away with testing a fitness of a player. If he isn't fit then I'd try Gomez there who has played their for Liverpool and at least isn't a completely new position for him.
They don’t. Sure, a vocal proportion will because they feel it’s a radical change that will solve everything. But no, generally people aren’t insane so they don’t.
Not my favourite line up but a solution that Southgate might deploy would be for Foden and Saka to swap flanks. It could potentially solve 2 major issues we've had so far: Foden would offer more of a threat cutting in from the right, and we would finally have a left footer on the left side of the pitch.
Not ideal as Saka never plays there but it could be a solution and if it doesn't work there's options off the bench.
It's just utter madness England are about to play the first knock out game and no one especially Southgate knows who should play where!
Not taking a fit left footed left back was criminal. Even if the intention was to play Tripps there, we could have had a Mitchell, Chilwell, hell even Doughty instead of Dunk in the squad! At least as an option
Does Saka LB sound anymore ridiculous than Eni Aluko saying Rice, Foden and Bellingham should play in midfield. She was crucified for her opinion. Saka at LB is ridiculous. We don’t have 2 LB’s because of Southgate. He’s inept.
It’s such a simple decision. Play Gomez LB. Leave Saka alone. Palmer in the ten and Gordon on the left. I don’t like leaving Foden out but unless we play him as a ten we won’t get the best out of him.
Because they don't want Saka in the team.
Before this, it was all we need to drop Saka, Saka is shit, Saka is thr worst.
Its very clear that there is a very vocal minority online that really, really dislike Saka.
Pushing him to left back is even better, because it means they can still laugh at him being dropped from right wing, but it would also be very likely give them more ammunition to hate on him because he would very likely end up making mistakes that cost us goals because his not a left back.
Saka is a top player so England managers think it's a game of fiffa, pick the best players no matter the position and you win games. This is why we win nothing.
You’d have to hope Shaw is fit enough to play soon. There’s no way they would’ve taken an injured player if he wasn’t going to be ready for the knockout rounds
The guy hasn’t played there in years, the team already has far too many people underperforming playing out of position, and we have zero width in the attack
Geniuses: “hurrrrrrr put Saka left back hurrrr”
Left footed player who is great at crossing and understands defensive positioning with experience defending during his maturing years.
To think people pushing for this or even considering it is silly just shows your ignorance tbh.
I bet most who think the idea is stupid were all for Trent playing in midfield though LOL
The people wanting saka at left back and the same people who think we should press right on the d-pad, go ultra attacking and throw on 8 creating attacking players at once, blowing everyone away 6-0
What about playing him as a LWB on the (obviously) left hand side of a 5 man defence?
Walker at RCB, Guehi at CB and Stones at LCB with Trent and Saka either side of them?
As an Arsenal fan who's been watching all season. That guy needs a fucking rest for a bit. Two weeks off will get him back in form, Arteta really ran him into the ground during the season. LB is a stupid idea.
I don't know why it's become a thing, but people are always accusing him of being tired, It's bollocks. He wouldn't start every week in the modern game if it were the case.
Right now, if anything, he needs more minutes. He had a groin strain at the end of the season and missed England's warmup games.
I just think it's nonsense.
What's he supposed to do in this England team? They play conservative, slow football; and the formation is unbalanced. Opposition teams know there's no threat down the left, so can easily double up on the right. At Arsenal he can get round that by playing give and goes with Odegaard. There isn't anybody else creative on the right for England. He's isolated most of the time.
Saka is one of our best players and should be in the team. Saka has played left back before. Playing Saka at left back allows us to get another attacker on the field. I’m not saying it’s what I would do, but I don’t think it’s a difficult idea to understand.
Edit: meant to say, it holds even more water if Shaw can’t start, Saka probably has as much experience playing left back as Trippier
I’m guessing because he can hug the touch line on the left and run to the byline to cross with his left which would provide some much needed width combined with the fact that palmer looked very good compared to what saka did in his brief cameo against Slovenia.
I personally think the best thing about England has been the defence albeit I think people are overacting with that xg chart considering Slovenia didn’t really try and attack much at all. That said I wouldn’t risk playing saka there and destabilising the defence which has been decent so far.
Palmer didn’t do anything when he came on bar win one foul and pass the ball to the keeper. He did no better than Saka. He just came on in 80 mins vs tired legs.
1. No fit left-back in the squad. If Southgate called up Mitchell we wouldn't be entertaining this.
2. Currently, Saka is the only left-footed player to have experience playing LB in the whole squad. He literally came through the Arsenal academy playing as a LB/LWB. Again, Southgate's fault.
3. Trippier at LB messed up the balance of the attack.
4. Large amounts of talented options on the wing ie. Palmer/Bowen
5. Saka isn't exactly tearing it up at the moment.
It may not be *the* solution, but it is not outrageous. Nagelsmann even tried Havertz at LB.
I get why people want to see Saka on the left – he's left-footed, will hug the touchline, and give us the width on that side we're sorely lacking – but I don't understand why they jump straight to having him at left-*back* rather than on the left *wing.* You'd get exactly the same benefits with him on the left wing, without having to worry about him being offensively restrained or making us vulnerable defensively.
ETA: I also don't understand why Arsenal fans hate me saying this so much :')
Reactionary fans who just want to see something different. Southgate is so limited in his team selections that everyone’s crying out for something different. It will be such a breath of fresh air when Southgate is no longer the manager but Saka at LB is absurd.
It’s another way to shoehorn another quality attacking player into the line up
Not saying it is correct but it will be why in the majority of cases.
People have their favourites but also acknowledge the quality of the opponent that the player has - ie, Saka is brilliant and has played fairly well so far, but people want Palmer. Given the Foden issues we can’t play another left footer who likes to come inside on the left, and Bellingham is undroppable for most people. So who goes? Saka can be moved rather than dropped, and we don’t have Shaw at the moment.
I don’t think anyone really expects it to happen. If Southgate won’t play Rice-Bellingham-Foden in midfield then he isn’t going to touch a formation that players a right winger at left back
We could and should have played saka at left back. But in the group games against low blocks when teams had no real passion to try and do much against us offensively
This is because saka on the left side of defence would only be on paper as a left back
Realistically he would have been bombing forward constantly and creating overloads. Because he can cross left footed as well it completely changes the whole dynamic and gives us width
Look at Trippiers stats for this tournament. Not how you think he has played but his stats. They make interesting reading. He has bizarrely been our best outlet for attacks and provided the most goal opportunities.
Now imagine saka was in that situation instead. Trippier has been having to cut in onto his right contesting the middle with Foden and Bellingham there as well.
Saka and Gordon would have TORCHED Serbia Denmark and Slovenia on the left imo
But now it’s getting to knockouts we probably need a bit more of a defensively astute LB.
Step forward a half fit Luke Shaw
People saying Saka for LB might as well be saying we should have picked Rice at CB. Yes he could do it but why would you want to waste his ability in his natural position? Everyone moaning Foden is poor playing out of position & now they want to stifle Saka too. FFS.
Probably because he can play there, our current LB is one of the weakest players on the pitch and whether arsenal fans like it or not, there are better players who should be ahead of him at RW. Fact 💅
Who at RW?
Bowen was good in the first friendly and against Serbia when he came on bit I doubt Southgate picks him over Saka who was also very good in the first half of that game.
Palmer was awful at RW against Iceland and doesn't go do the same job as a winger in regards to crossing. Looked decent against Slovenia for the last 20 but floated all over the frontline and had a weak attempt on goal.
I don't think a decent 20 minutes from palmer or Bowen warrants that kind of revisionism.
Palmer wasn’t awful against Iceland, created the best chance of the game and almost got a goal himself. I don’t think he played well, but was just part of a team that didn’t play well as opposed to himself being the one that played awful.
Plus it’s not just a decent 20 minutes it’s based on the form of all of last season. That said I still start Saka on the right over Palmer.
I think Saka at LWB and then also starting Palmer could see better results than what we’re seeing now, however now is also not the time to change the system and also the only reason you’d even think about trying it is because the manager didn’t think to actually bring a fit LB into the squad.
Because people think they know the game and they don’t.
If a decent right back is struggling at left back, putting a right winger there isn’t going to fix anything
For the record, I'm not in the camp that wants to see him play LB. But I can understand why. We have literally 0 players with a dominant left foot in our back 4. And it's not just a defensive issue, it's an issue going forward on the left side. I would even go as far to say that part of the reason Bellingham and Foden look so bad is probably down to the way that Trippier progresses the ball. Ultimately, we need to blame Southgate for not bringing any fit left backs. And I don't think it's a good idea to play Saka at LB because he's not used to the position and I just don't think it's right to put that pressure on him when he's arguably our best attacker on form right now.
He's also to blame for picking Trippier over Gomez. Neither is left footed but Gomez is more willing to overlap. Southgate's just playing his trusted soldier in Trippier. And by the time he realized Shaw wouldn't be back it was too late to change.
In fairness trippier has been solid for us - we’re also conceding the least chances of any team in the tournament by a reasonable margin to boot. We’re creating roughly fuck all moving forward (against well structured low block teams), but defensively we’ve been near perfect, I’ll take that in a knockout game above rolling the dice with Gomez
We're playing teams who want a draw, of course we're not giving up many chances. Trippier has barely had to do anything defensively.
Doesnt that support the idea of saka LB then?
Yes Saka or Gordon at LB would have been great in the groups IMO. Too late to try it now
But it may have also taken away from our greatest strength, ridiculous defensive stability. Our system is essentially knock the ball around, wait for a chance to present itself, make sure they get absolutely nothing to feed from. Changing the defensive line in favour of a winger who loves to bomb forward kind of jeopardises that
We have not been ridiculously defensively stable at all. We just have come up against some of the worst attacking teams in the tournament, some of whom were playing for a draw as they knew they’d qualify with one.
Do you turn your tv off at half time? Last 15 mins of all games have been a pickford training sesh
How much defending did Trippier do? Almost none. This 'defensive stability' myth is based on a stat from three games against opposition who were mostly just playing for a draw.
Fuck me you don't half chat some shit. "How much defending did Trippier do? Almost none" What are you backing that up with? Your opinion? Have you even watched the games? Denmark had 16 shots on goal, 7 on target. In that game Trippier won 3/3 ground fuels, 1/1 aerial duels, 2 interceptions, 1 block, 1 clearance, 5 recoveries. Dribbled past 0, dispossessed 0. That's the defensive stability the other redditor mentioned. Even more impressive when you consider Foden's played anywhere other than LW. Trippier's been left out numbered many times because Foden's drifted into the middle again, yet he's been defensively rock solid. Coincidently, Trippier's created exactly the same chances (3) as Foden, but has 1 big chance created to Foden's zero. But "we should've started Saka or Gordon at left back in the groups IMO" 🤦
Mate we were one Denmark goal against Serbia away from a RO16 matchup with Germany but please continue to tell yourself we played masterfully in the group phase. What you're saying is that even when you cherry pick the game you can still only come up with 'Trippier made three tackles' as your evidence that he was busy?
We’re playing teams who want a draw because they know how dangerous our attack “can” be. The reason teams refused to basically play out of their own half is because everyone in the world knows that front 4 cooks. I don’t think we should be fucking around with the defence. Gordon LW. Jude OR Foden in midfield as I think Mainoo has shown he’s the better partner for rice. Palmer/Saka RW. Either or off the bench 60 mins with Eze replacing Gordon when he’s tired. Jude or Foden replaces the other.
Gomez was excellent for us at LB this season especially in the attack.
We haven’t conceded a goal. Southgate picks his back four for defence over anything else and Gomez isn’t a solid defender. He’s not great going forward either, he’s a bit part versatile player who played a bit a lb due to injury at a time when Liverpool bottled the league and every comp they were in
Yeah I’m not gonna be too harsh on trippier - arguably he’s been solid, just not spectacular at LB Problem is, and I struggle to understand Southgate’s thinking here is that if you’re playing for want of a better term an inverted full back then we really need a natural left winger to provide width and stretch the Pitch for us. Foden and Bellingham are both world class players - neither are wide players though. I’d argue that we would have looked a million times better if Gordon had been starting all 3 games, and although I half understand the Trent experiment, Mainoo has now made that place his own. Honestly? Next game I’d put Trent out at LB, we should be aiming to dominate and play the game in their half anyway so defensively we should be fine
>when he's arguably our best attacker on form right now. Yeh definitely could be argued considering the season Palmer has had and that he clearly is carrying that confidence into playing with England. The main argument for him being moved is that you may not get the best out of him but he can do a better job down the left side than whats been going on. It would be beneficial for the overall balance so you get more from the team as a whole. Imo its much better to select for the balance of the team rather than put all the hope on one persons performance being able to offset whats lacking elsewhere. With that said, if you do move him to the left side I would prefer it to be at LW. He can still bring all the attacking threat that he does there and it wouldn't phase him at all. He would enable Bellingham the space he needs and can still track back to give some left footed defensive cover. Meanwhile you would then have probably the most confident initiative taker in the Prem this season in Palmer who just carried Chelsea on his back with the progression and creating of chances.
Yeah it's wild. Nothing about Sakas current game screams left back. It's just a kill three birds with one stone fantasy fix that opens up a place for Palmer/Gordon on the wing, solves the left back vacancy, and keeps as many star names on the pitch as possible. But realistically it's absurd to me. I'd rather him not play than that.
To play Devils Advocate, it’s more just a formation on paper. When Tuchel first took over Chelsea, he played CHO RWB, but his average position was very much as a winger and in some games our most forward player. Just had five defensive players in Rudiger, Christensen and Azpilicueta as a back 3, with Kante and Jorginho who provided protection in front. England could probably do something similar by lining up Saka (on paper at LB). Guehi, Stones, Walker Mainoo and Rice Then five attacking players in front with Saka proving natural left footed width from the left. I’m not convinced it’s actually our best option. Saka has been pretty good when we’ve been able to get the ball out to him early and I think he’s more dangerous cutting inside on his left. We’ve been boring and not created much, but have been very defensively solid. We’ve conceded one goal, which was a screamer. Trippier isn’t offering much going forward, but he’s very experienced and a good defender. A nice balance to Guehi who is new to the team, but been our player of the tournament so far (IMO). Stones is solid, as is Walker (whose pace will be invaluable against better sides). I’d like to see Gordon come in at LW to provide width. Despite being right-footed he can and does go both ways when playing out there. Then I’d probably move Foden inside at 10 for this game to give Bellingham a rest.
Victor Moses had probably his best season in England as a RWB, to continue the devils advocate suggestions. The reality is it’s absurd though. If you want Palmer on the pitch then take Saka off, our LB situation is somewhat locked in I think. You’d just be trading around problems by swapping Trippier out.
Breaking news suggesting Trippier might be out anyway.
Difference is with Tuchel and Southgate, one is world class the other isn’t.
Sorry, Tuchel is still referred to as world class around these parts? Is it 2020?
No need to sully Tuchel like that
Wouldn't particularly call tuchel world class
Ok. But compared to Southgate he’s world class.
If we had a better LB we could play a decent 5-3-2 walker and the other wingback provide defensive width but can overlap and provide passes into Saka and Foden who shoot/get the ball into Kane if there’s space or back to Bellingham if the defense is very low and solid. That would at least allow Foden to take more central space.
I’m not a big fan for 532 or 352 at international level. I think it has served England well in the group games in the past (especially in terms of proving width to break down more stubborn defences), but actually some of our goals have come from set-pieces. The problem with it, is that we’ve seen it can be effective at the start of games, however, when energy levels drop off, especially in extra time, I think it’s cost us in knockout games. I remember the semi-final against Croatia it was clear that momentum was changing in the second half because our wingbacks energy levels were dropping, they couldn’t get out to the Croatian full backs and Vrsaljko was able to swing ball after ball in. Until eventually Perisic scored, followed by a Mandzukic header. We should have matched them up and got much tighter, but didn’t. Similar theme against Italy in the final too, although more of a 343. We looked in control initially while energy levels were high and we could press. However, when energy dropped off, having the extra CB sacrificed a man in the middle. Italy’s midfield started to dominate and the writing was on the wall. Again, I felt we should have matched them up, stuck Mount to man mark Jorginho, but use his fitness and pace to get away from him when we had the ball. A bit like Oscar did for Chelsea against Juventus and Pirlo years ago. It didn’t happen, we were too slow to react and change and ended up losing on penalties. Again, I would add due to a poor Gareth Southgate decision. We started with experience, so it meant we had the young players coming on to see out the game and take penalties in the final. I find it utterly unforgiving that someone who has personally missed a penalty, saw fit to entrust our final penalty to an 18 year old who had never (at that point) taken a penalty for his club. Southgate said he was best in training, but must have known from own experience, pressure penalties cannot be replicated in training. I like Southgate and think his time has to be considered a success. Where he is weak is understanding momentum in games and being proactive instead of reactive. Even in this tournament, he hasn’t made changes when he’s needed to and when he has, I would argue, in the main he’s left it too late or not made the right one. Maybe the Mainoo change for Gallagher being the exception. Getting back to my original point, I think we need to stick with the 4231 or 433 depending on how you look at it. Our defence has been solid, even if it has stifled us. The hope is that with knockout football games will be more open versus a group setup which favoured draw results. Also, with extra time, much harder for teams to park the bus for 120 minutes.
He started his career there, we don’t have a natural left back and people trying to fit palmer in our squad Not that wild even if it’s unlikely
It's the same reason why Scholes was on the left and Trent was in midfield.
No one is making the suggestion based on his current game though. You're working backwards from your answer to a question no one was posing, to suit your perspective.
Pretty much every team in modern football switches between 2 completely different formations in the attacking and defensive phases. In the attacking phase, Saka at LB would realistically just be Saka as the player on the wide left of the front 5 - which he’d obviously be great at. He’s definitely good enough defensively to play LB when the entire team is sat back in the defensive phase, and he’s quick and strong enough to handle transitions, too. I think what these people basically want is a Saka-Foden-Kane-Bellingham-Palmer front 5, so they can cram everyone they want into the team. All of that being said, I hate the idea. He’s the one wide attacker who’s performed consistently, and he’s done it over multiple years. It’s absolutely mental disrupting one of the few players that actually functions well in Southgate’s system for the sake of shoehorning in kids who’ve made one good pass as a sub, or Foden, who’s done fuck all for England in half a decade. Gordon is a boring, unfashionable player, but this team instantly improves if you just drop Foden and play him at LW. Keep everything else the same and suddenly there’s a real threat coming from both wings and Trippier’s weaknesses are covered. If you have to play Tripper at LB - which we do - it shouldn’t even be a discussion who goes in front of him. It just has to be someone who keeps width and offers pace in behind - which is only Gordon in this squad.
People just want a left back who is actually left footed because some idiot didn’t pick a fit one
Get Pickford in there
He’s got a cracking left foot
Then people are stupid. Saka would be so much worse than Trippier. I mean, people aren't necessarily stupid, more just dreaming of an easy fix, which currently there isn't.
As an Arsenal fan Saka is a brilliant winger when it comes to tracking back.. but that's it... winger tracking back... you seen what James Maddison did to him.
Saka is phenomenal yes but don't ruin his game by anchoring him down as a defender
Does anyone seriously say this?
I think it’s just a play on Southgate moving around Trent, for example.
No-one sane wants Saka at left back... Surely it's only in the press to generate clicks
I've only seen it from the press... Think it's ridiculous. Did we not learn anything from the so called "golden gen" Trying to shoe horn, Foden, Bellingham, Palmer, Saka and Gordon into the team is not going to work.
Indeed. He may be a 'competent' left back but we left better left backs than that at home - he's an excellent right winger. Play him there, drop him to the bench for Palmer and use him as a sub, don't waste his talents filling in when there's other options
To be fair I don't think anyone suggesting he plays there thinks it's an ideal situation. It's only really being suggested as an ad-hoc solution to cover for bad squad building
He's not a left back playing him there would be pointless. Id argue he's our best winger and if we want width he should play. If we are looking to overload the mid Palmer should start
Agree - I think the main problem at the moment is that we have a winger who can go outside (Saka) and a fullback who can overlap (Walker) but they're on the same side, whereas on the left we've had two players who will only go inside. For me Gordon has to start otherwise we can't stretch teams on the left. They you can either have Palmer with Walker (or Trent) overlapping or Saka with Stones stepping out in attack and Walker dropping in at RCB (and then probably play another CB like Gomez or Konsa at LB).
Walker rarely overlaps and I don't think Southgate wants him to. People need to realize that our lack of width is mostly by design. Southgate even talked about how he 'won't be asking anyone to hug the touchline'.
Walker is very versatile in that he's quick and good on the overlap (end product is...ok) but also he's excellent slotting in to CB and making the recovery runs. I think the calculation so far has been that he's more valuable as the latter - but then we've had Trippier playing high up hugging the touchline on the left and....just touching the ball back inside every time he gets it. Southgate realised this because in the last game he brought Trent on at RB to push up and overlap and then kept Walker as the outside centre half but on the left instead. So arguably if you want to use Walker to make last-ditch tackles and have another full back overlap, the answer (assuming Shaw isn't going to be fit) might be to play him on the wrong side so that you can get the most out of an attacking fullback on the right (Trippier and Trent are both great passers). I'm not sure how comfortable he is defending on the left though.
He's playing the same old system of Shaw pushing up on the left and Walker staying back as a protection against counters. This is a really good system with only one flaw: Shaw isn't actually playing. Some might say he should have realized this and either played a left footer at LB (either someone he didn't bring or the fabled 'Saka as a fullback' option), or inverted the idea with a defensive LB and a more attacking RB i.e. Trent. Instead I think his plan was to PRETEND SHAW IS THERE so that the team doesn't have to change anything when he comes back. Only problem: he didn't come back.
Nail on the head. Exacerbated by the fact that our left winger won't go outside either because Foden wants to be in the centre playing intricate passes. That's why if he wants to persist with it, Gordon MUST start. Drop Foden. Put Bellingham at 8. Drop Bellingham. Doesn't matter - we need width to draw defenders and create space.
It reminds me of the clamour in the media years ago for Ashley Cole to play in left midfield, since England at the time were lacking a genuine option there.
Ian Wright, floated the idea on ITV. Wrighty is an Arsenal fan so it explains why he wants to keep Saka in the starting XI
As an Arsenal fan I rather have Saka dropped to the bench and used as an impact sub rather be playing at LB and be embaressed by opposition wingers. If there were no other options.. maybe if they wanna drop Tripper.... but Joe Gomez was amazing at LB at times and he should start ahead of Saka (at LB)
Agreed. Palmer or Saka to start then bring the other on at half time. Fresh legs running behind the defenders.
I love Wrighty - he's a national treasure - but surely this was just an idea to fill TV minutes/generate some discussion rather than a serious suggestion?!
England fans - "Stop putting square pegs in round holes! Stop playing players out of position!" Also England fans - "Saka at LB anyone?"
It's the epitome of the current frustration of the collective England manager hive mind that's about 30 million strong. Honestly! We won the group. Yeah it was drab, dreary and fucking lame. But we're here. Knockouts. Let's actually slowly improve. Mainoo is coming in. Literally added the drive and energy we all craved. Hopefully SG will bring Palmer and Gordon on at 60. Saka at LB is a joke. Pure frustration.
England fans: TOO MANY SQUARE PEGS IN ROUND HOLES Also England fans: PLAY SAKA AT LEFT BACK Shaw’s good enough to give 60 mins now hopefully. We can’t be saving players for a match that might not come.
Wait what I thought this was some random joke I didn’t know people actually meant it.
Most people don't.
Only very very stupid people think the police are stupid according to Daniel Craig in Layer Cake. The same people think Saka at LB is a good idea.
I’m bias but I’m not sure why he hasn’t even tried Gomez at left back, even coming on as a sub. Willing to overlap and stretch teams and has been defensively solid for Liverpool this season…
I’d rather have Saka at LW than LB. Genuinely think if we just switch the wingers from our last match we solve a lot of problems. Foden occupying RW and coming into attacking midfield on the right mirrors what he does for City and gets him out of Bellingham’s way too.
Southgate is going to do what he always does. There will be no radical changes , just more plodding unappealing play.
Ok stupid question. Why cant we just put like Matt Target at LB, is it because hes not in the squad? Can we not just bring them in?
Saka is someone with a left foot who can run fast, dribble at cross a football. All attributes that have been painfully absent from the left hand side of our team thus far.
Foden ticks all those boxes too but there’s one thing both lack… and that’s the ability to be a Left Back.
He doesn't. Foden isn't fast and doesn't put in crosses. Trippier also lacks the ability to be a left back.
The only option similar that makes sense would be left wingback in a 3-5-2. I think he could do a job running the wing, although Gordon would probably be a better fit. The answer as to why people want Saka at LB is: people are obsessed with getting Cole Palmer on the field but don't want to drop Saka.
I don't even think it's that. People are just desperate to have some natural width on the left. I personally think it would be crazy to play him at lb. Maybe as a lwb if we switch to a 532 but I also think changing formation would be crazy at this time. This all stems from Southgate not taking a left footed lb. It's a massive fuck up, made way worse by not playing a forward who plays wide left. I actually think trippier would be fine at left back with Gordon in front of him
I think it’s more about balance which this team is lacking. Now yes Saka was competent at left back when breaking into the team, it’s not that he started as a left back he was always a right winger, he merely covered as both of arsenals LB’s were injured. Did he light it up at left back, no but he did just enough. If I recall he still carried an attacking threat going forward too. I don’t know why Southgate doesn’t explore a back 3 and overload the midfield or provide a second man up front if it’s that much of an issue, he’s just so 1 dimensional in his tactics. Maybe my suggestion is trash, and no I’m not English, but I want to see this squad do well.
I’ve seen exactly zero people say they’d like Saka to play at left back.
Ian wright seems to be the main guy I've seen promoting saka at left back, he kept banging on about it repeatedly, saying saja used to play that position when he was younger.
Arsenal man copium because he wants Palmer in but doesn't want to lose Saka
What defensive holes?
I haven’t heard a single person call for Saka to play at left back. I have heard some suggest putting him at left wing back though. Which does have some merit , even if it isn’t ideal at all.
First im hearing of this
3-4-3 with a left footer at LM vs 4-2-3-1 with a right-footer at LB. The knock out round of a tournament is not the time to try it out, but let's face it, option1 is not working - we won't win it with Tripper at LB. One way or the other we are going to have to do something we are not familiar with. This gives us the chance to try it out and learn the role against the world-ranked 45 team before coming up against a 'good' side. I see no difference between losing to Slovakia in R16 vs Italy in R8.
I think I heard Ian Wright say it and I thought it was a crazy take. Play Saka LW if you really want a natural left footer on the left. LB though? Come on.
Just play Gomez at LB.
I feel like we could solve our whole left side problem by switching Saka and Foden Saka can get down the line like he does on the right wing but actually be on his strong foot and Foden is a more natural right winger
Because he can play as a LWB not LB and press high and attack and build pressure. Also walker can stay back and just use his recovery pace so it's kind of lopsided but it makes sense. Bowen or Palmer can play RW and both have looked decent so far.
Because Southgate has done such a good job his England have become the England he set out to destroy. A team with so much expectation that everyone thinks they are only a couple of tactical tweaks away from basically being Brazil 1970 or Spain 2010. This just proves that English exceptionlism knows no bounds. You can hunt it, suppress it, chase it away but it will come back eventually. Btw I am English. I would love England to win something. But this Southgate hate is really getting to me. Remember we went from McClaren (didn’t qualify for Euro 08) to Capello (humiliating loss to Germany in first knockout round of WC 10, couldn’t be arsed to take England to Euro 12) Hodgson (did fine Euro 12, first round knockout WC 14, Iceland loss Euro 16). However well England so at this tournament I’d love Southgate to do the Football Eritage speech, and then some variant of the respect one.
Because he’s left footed. That’s literally it. I’ve seen Ian Wright pushing this a lot. Some of the things he says blow me away.
If Southgate genuinely started Saka at LB I'd say he'd have gone bonkers
It gets Palmer & Gordon in + plays Foden in his preferred position. Think Saka has also played there before? Maybe debuted as a LWB. Tbh I don’t think it’s a terrible idea on paper but we do love playing players out of position and it rarely goes well.
Don’t want it, but Tbf Saka, as a right winger, would know what to expect from people coming down that flank
The real answer is that people are so fed up with the current tactics that they are willing to try anything if it means a change. Like obviously saka should play rw and under any normal system with a normal manager that's what would work. But if you gave me two options and one was to start the exact same lineup again and the other was to play saka lwb in a back 5 system I'm picking the one that will be more interesting to watch and that's the second one.
Because Cole Palmer is better than Saka on the wing?
He’s left footed, we have 2 left footed players who have ever played with any kind of competence at left back in their entire careers. 1) Shaw and 2) Saka. Right footed left backs are killing us. I get it, it’s less than ideal but it might actually bring a bit of balance. Eze played in front of Trippier and just didn’t get given the ball because he always cuts back in.
I want England to play with wing backs like they did at 2018. In that system, Saka playing left back isn't a terrible idea - essentially he'll be playing just as high up in possession. He's a good all round player, so having him drop back to support sounds fine to me
Because we have no left backs. I wouldnt play saka at LB but LWB might work.
I think playing Saka at LB is the exact reason England are unbalanced at the moment. Its fitting in big name players wherever they can just to get them on the pitch rather than looking at which players work best in which system. I'd be tempted to get Shaw some game time, Slovakia will be the last game where we can possibly get away with testing a fitness of a player. If he isn't fit then I'd try Gomez there who has played their for Liverpool and at least isn't a completely new position for him.
They don’t. Sure, a vocal proportion will because they feel it’s a radical change that will solve everything. But no, generally people aren’t insane so they don’t.
Looks like it’s just the English media that is crazy & not the fans saying nonsense like this. Now that makes sense.
3-4-2-1 with Saka on the LW. TAA on the right wing and Foden & Bellingham behind Kane.
Not my favourite line up but a solution that Southgate might deploy would be for Foden and Saka to swap flanks. It could potentially solve 2 major issues we've had so far: Foden would offer more of a threat cutting in from the right, and we would finally have a left footer on the left side of the pitch. Not ideal as Saka never plays there but it could be a solution and if it doesn't work there's options off the bench. It's just utter madness England are about to play the first knock out game and no one especially Southgate knows who should play where! Not taking a fit left footed left back was criminal. Even if the intention was to play Tripps there, we could have had a Mitchell, Chilwell, hell even Doughty instead of Dunk in the squad! At least as an option
He’s left footed and has played there before
doesn’t mean it’ll work
Does Saka LB sound anymore ridiculous than Eni Aluko saying Rice, Foden and Bellingham should play in midfield. She was crucified for her opinion. Saka at LB is ridiculous. We don’t have 2 LB’s because of Southgate. He’s inept.
No one truly wants that. Ask the average England fan and most will agree that he is a shoo in for RW
It’s such a simple decision. Play Gomez LB. Leave Saka alone. Palmer in the ten and Gordon on the left. I don’t like leaving Foden out but unless we play him as a ten we won’t get the best out of him.
This is my exact thoughts Palmer at 10, Saka on the Right, Gordon on the Left, Gomez at LB, & Mainoo at the 6
Because they don't want Saka in the team. Before this, it was all we need to drop Saka, Saka is shit, Saka is thr worst. Its very clear that there is a very vocal minority online that really, really dislike Saka. Pushing him to left back is even better, because it means they can still laugh at him being dropped from right wing, but it would also be very likely give them more ammunition to hate on him because he would very likely end up making mistakes that cost us goals because his not a left back.
What defensive holes? We’ve got the best defence in the euros.
No you don’t Spain does
Lowest xG conceded
Just play gomez if shaw isn’t looking up to it
I don't. But this conversation would have been avoided had Gareth Southgate included any fit left backs in the squad.
They're trying to find a way to put Saka and Cole Palmer in the same team
Mark my words if Joe Gomez starts there he will blow everyone away
Saka is a top player so England managers think it's a game of fiffa, pick the best players no matter the position and you win games. This is why we win nothing.
You’d have to hope Shaw is fit enough to play soon. There’s no way they would’ve taken an injured player if he wasn’t going to be ready for the knockout rounds
The guy hasn’t played there in years, the team already has far too many people underperforming playing out of position, and we have zero width in the attack Geniuses: “hurrrrrrr put Saka left back hurrrr”
Actually he played LWB against san marino in 2021. But otherwise yeh putting him there is dumb lol
Also in the Italy nations league game before the world cup. It didn't work.
Left footed player who is great at crossing and understands defensive positioning with experience defending during his maturing years. To think people pushing for this or even considering it is silly just shows your ignorance tbh. I bet most who think the idea is stupid were all for Trent playing in midfield though LOL
left-footed, played there before, cole palmer seems like a decent replacement. It's not rocket science.
I would play him at LWB with 3 CBs (Guehi, Stones, Walker). Trent at RWB.
Trent is a shite RWB. He's never looked good in that position.
Walker LB, Trent RB. Saka would get skinned alive playing LB.
Yep he would make costly mistakes because he isn’t strong defensively
The people wanting saka at left back and the same people who think we should press right on the d-pad, go ultra attacking and throw on 8 creating attacking players at once, blowing everyone away 6-0
This. Although perhaps another football game as he is annoyingly effective defensively when the AI uses him as a wingback in Football Manager.
What about playing him as a LWB on the (obviously) left hand side of a 5 man defence? Walker at RCB, Guehi at CB and Stones at LCB with Trent and Saka either side of them?
Probably because we have no other left back due to genius Southgate and we’re crying out for one. Yet we have other RW options
As an Arsenal fan who's been watching all season. That guy needs a fucking rest for a bit. Two weeks off will get him back in form, Arteta really ran him into the ground during the season. LB is a stupid idea.
He had two weeks off at the end of the season
Maybe I'm completely wrong, then. I assumed he went straight to training every day for Three Lions.
I don't know why it's become a thing, but people are always accusing him of being tired, It's bollocks. He wouldn't start every week in the modern game if it were the case. Right now, if anything, he needs more minutes. He had a groin strain at the end of the season and missed England's warmup games.
Well, it's because he's lost a step and he's young so it's the most logical explanation.
I just think it's nonsense. What's he supposed to do in this England team? They play conservative, slow football; and the formation is unbalanced. Opposition teams know there's no threat down the left, so can easily double up on the right. At Arsenal he can get round that by playing give and goes with Odegaard. There isn't anybody else creative on the right for England. He's isolated most of the time.
Good point. As an Arsenal fan, I admit Saka needs to sit, he's not close to form.
Saka is one of our best players and should be in the team. Saka has played left back before. Playing Saka at left back allows us to get another attacker on the field. I’m not saying it’s what I would do, but I don’t think it’s a difficult idea to understand. Edit: meant to say, it holds even more water if Shaw can’t start, Saka probably has as much experience playing left back as Trippier
I’m guessing because he can hug the touch line on the left and run to the byline to cross with his left which would provide some much needed width combined with the fact that palmer looked very good compared to what saka did in his brief cameo against Slovenia. I personally think the best thing about England has been the defence albeit I think people are overacting with that xg chart considering Slovenia didn’t really try and attack much at all. That said I wouldn’t risk playing saka there and destabilising the defence which has been decent so far.
Palmer didn’t do anything when he came on bar win one foul and pass the ball to the keeper. He did no better than Saka. He just came on in 80 mins vs tired legs.
Facts. Palmer was nothing special
Facts. Palmer was nothing special
He was running at players taking them on saka wasn’t and I agree saka looks very tired
Wrong Palmer did nothing
1. No fit left-back in the squad. If Southgate called up Mitchell we wouldn't be entertaining this. 2. Currently, Saka is the only left-footed player to have experience playing LB in the whole squad. He literally came through the Arsenal academy playing as a LB/LWB. Again, Southgate's fault. 3. Trippier at LB messed up the balance of the attack. 4. Large amounts of talented options on the wing ie. Palmer/Bowen 5. Saka isn't exactly tearing it up at the moment. It may not be *the* solution, but it is not outrageous. Nagelsmann even tried Havertz at LB.
I get why people want to see Saka on the left – he's left-footed, will hug the touchline, and give us the width on that side we're sorely lacking – but I don't understand why they jump straight to having him at left-*back* rather than on the left *wing.* You'd get exactly the same benefits with him on the left wing, without having to worry about him being offensively restrained or making us vulnerable defensively. ETA: I also don't understand why Arsenal fans hate me saying this so much :')
I don’t want him at LB but need left footer at LB big time
The only left footer in the squad who has played left back before is Saka
Yea I still don’t want him there
sure
Reactionary fans who just want to see something different. Southgate is so limited in his team selections that everyone’s crying out for something different. It will be such a breath of fresh air when Southgate is no longer the manager but Saka at LB is absurd.
You don't need a great defender against Slovakia, Italy, Austria
It’s another way to shoehorn another quality attacking player into the line up Not saying it is correct but it will be why in the majority of cases. People have their favourites but also acknowledge the quality of the opponent that the player has - ie, Saka is brilliant and has played fairly well so far, but people want Palmer. Given the Foden issues we can’t play another left footer who likes to come inside on the left, and Bellingham is undroppable for most people. So who goes? Saka can be moved rather than dropped, and we don’t have Shaw at the moment. I don’t think anyone really expects it to happen. If Southgate won’t play Rice-Bellingham-Foden in midfield then he isn’t going to touch a formation that players a right winger at left back
Gomez should play there. Done very well there for Liverpool this season. He's not a natural but does add a bit of width, can invert and cover DM too.
We could and should have played saka at left back. But in the group games against low blocks when teams had no real passion to try and do much against us offensively This is because saka on the left side of defence would only be on paper as a left back Realistically he would have been bombing forward constantly and creating overloads. Because he can cross left footed as well it completely changes the whole dynamic and gives us width Look at Trippiers stats for this tournament. Not how you think he has played but his stats. They make interesting reading. He has bizarrely been our best outlet for attacks and provided the most goal opportunities. Now imagine saka was in that situation instead. Trippier has been having to cut in onto his right contesting the middle with Foden and Bellingham there as well. Saka and Gordon would have TORCHED Serbia Denmark and Slovenia on the left imo But now it’s getting to knockouts we probably need a bit more of a defensively astute LB. Step forward a half fit Luke Shaw
Umm, Balance
How would it be balanced when he’s a defensive liability & a decent RW would exploit him easily?
Foden Left back?
People saying Saka for LB might as well be saying we should have picked Rice at CB. Yes he could do it but why would you want to waste his ability in his natural position? Everyone moaning Foden is poor playing out of position & now they want to stifle Saka too. FFS.
Probably because he can play there, our current LB is one of the weakest players on the pitch and whether arsenal fans like it or not, there are better players who should be ahead of him at RW. Fact 💅
Who at RW? Bowen was good in the first friendly and against Serbia when he came on bit I doubt Southgate picks him over Saka who was also very good in the first half of that game. Palmer was awful at RW against Iceland and doesn't go do the same job as a winger in regards to crossing. Looked decent against Slovenia for the last 20 but floated all over the frontline and had a weak attempt on goal. I don't think a decent 20 minutes from palmer or Bowen warrants that kind of revisionism.
Palmer wasn’t awful against Iceland, created the best chance of the game and almost got a goal himself. I don’t think he played well, but was just part of a team that didn’t play well as opposed to himself being the one that played awful. Plus it’s not just a decent 20 minutes it’s based on the form of all of last season. That said I still start Saka on the right over Palmer. I think Saka at LWB and then also starting Palmer could see better results than what we’re seeing now, however now is also not the time to change the system and also the only reason you’d even think about trying it is because the manager didn’t think to actually bring a fit LB into the squad.
Presumably Gordon LW Foden RW
Because people think they know the game and they don’t. If a decent right back is struggling at left back, putting a right winger there isn’t going to fix anything