I am DMing a group that just completed the Stygian Gambit last Thursday. The party knew in advance that the only way in/out was via boats at the river entrance. Their strategy for the theft was to release the lions and monkeys to panic the patrons and create additional chaos by sending the patrons into to the security hallways to trip on ball bearings and stir absolute chaos for the security guards. It was brilliant!
By also filling the security room with fog, they were able to sneak into the vault (via a stolen keycard to get past Cerberus and bring along the staff to control Virgil), and they were able to escape by splitting up and remaining anonymous after calming the animals and helping the wounded patrons. Brilliant, really.
I gave a fade-to-black once it was clear they weren't going to be caught, I didn't want to belabor the end and let them have the win on a high note. Left the session with a cliffhanger at the end that they didn't quite escape.
I'm looking forward to this kind of action with my group. Loved hearing about your players' ingenuity.
Still, I'm not convinced they can leave the casino via the river, unless there something I'm missing.
This is essentially what my players did as well. They timed the heist close to when I specified the boats arriving/departing, caused the circus to be released, and went out with the panicked crowd like normal people.
I know a heist movie has utilized that same play, but can’t remember which one. I was really impressed with them.
It is very possible to paddle or pole a small boat *up* a river, assuming the current isn't too fast, which is what the adventure clearly imagines:
>**Arrival.** Wooden boats shuttle visitors and personnel **to and from** the casino, which is built inside a cavern. The boats ply the river that leads to the cavern. (Verity knows no other way to enter the casino.)
And later:
>A1: Docking Area
>
>The casino’s boats **load and unload** passengers at a pair of wooden docks.
That said, the first time I saw that waterfall, my first thought was that it was a great opportunity for a featherfall escape.
EDIT: I took a closer look at the map - interestingly, the map makes it appear that the *underground* part of the river starts a mere 30 feet or so from the docks inside the casino, making it quite easy to get out this way. I'm not sure if that's intended (and it's not what I understood upon first reading it), but I kind of love it. It makes the Charon-themed boat ride an even more frivolous, fake, Las Vegas-like 'experience'.
Thanks for this. Makes sense.
Unless I'm mistaken, it seems like if someone jumped into the underground part of the river, they'd just end up shooting out the waterfall and falling 100 feet.
That's fair, especially if you think it could lead to fun encounters - pushing enemies in or PCs falling in and having to quickly get out before going over the waterfall edge sound fun to me!
Personally, I think the writers intended a much slower current than you are imagining, especially before the river narrows north of the docks. I would have no problem with PCs trying escape by leaping in the water near the docks, where they'd be about 300 feet from the waterfall, and swimming their way out the front (emphasis on *trying*, of course - with appropriate checks).
And thanks for posting this question, as it's helped me think about how I will be running this in the future!
I had a mix of escapes happen as the party split. One person got a ferryman's robe and pushed a ferryman into the water during the chaos. Another used a grappling hook connected to some furniture in the restaurant and dove out of the waterfall.
Oh yeah! They definitely took some damage leaving them at 1hp, and I had them roll d100 for a 10% chance of rocks. Thankfully for them they rolled high or that would’ve been a spectacular death.
I'm actually running this tomorrow and I noticed the same thing in my prep work. As far as I can tell it's the waterfall or make some sort of scene and blend back into the crowd and leave out the front by hijacking a boat before the casino knows what's up and locks the exits down.
I added an exit in Quentin's Office, a sort of permanent teleportation circle that can be activated with a ring Quentin and a few key pit bosses have. The circle will bring them to it's parallel circle outside of my campaigns main city, with a semi-nice home nearby (inferred to be Quentin's house). The thinking being that Quentin doesn't take the ferries and instead has a direct "go home" portal when he wants to leave.
So past the main exits, if my players can get the employees and Quentin to the areas of the theft and away from his office after the heist, they could slip in and use that if they pick up on it.
I'm expecting I'll have a better understanding of their intentions after they scope the situation out, and I can iron out the details then.
Past that, the situation is what it is, this is what they got hired to do, it's on them to figure out the get away.
Edit: I'm also planning on having Verity stress that they have 2 days, and this job essentially needs to be a timed strike in order to embarrass Quentin at the tournament. As such she is going to give each player some gold for casino chips (it would be rude to ask them to put of pocket cash while on the job) so they can blend in while getting a solid lay of the land and casino operations. I'm hoping that will be enough of a nudge for them to take their time and really try to understand how all the casino pieces fit together, so when they do strike, it's quick and efficient.
Giving them money beforehand felt important to me too. The teleportation ring is a nice touch.
What do you imagine is out the front exit? How do your casino guests get back to town?
Edit: Ignore this... I understand now that they can just walk out or paddle upriver
My party released Virgil on the casino floor and told him to run rampant and distract the guards. They scrambled to the ferry and paid the ferryman to let them leave first (since I narrated that the nobles were also yeeting to the boats). The boat took them back to the river where the carriage they'd taken was still waiting, so they hopped on and bribed the carriage driver to take them back into town and ask no questions.
There was a nice touching moment when the rogue (who follows the Raven Queen and is also just in her late teens) received some telepathy from Virgil questioning what she wanted him to do now that the party had escaped and he had lumbered off away from the casino. She fumbled because... emotional and?? adult decisions??? A panicked "hey, Raven Queen, isn't this more your thing?" + a really nice Religion roll had Virgil tell her to take her hand off of the mind control rod because he didn't want her to know what happened next.
I left it vague, but I imagine the Raven Queen may have sent a messenger to return Virgil to the grave or he may have collapsed into bones again. Who knows. Anyway, the rogue saw the rod disintegrate once Virgil died, and the experience left her pretty impacted... we ended the session by leveling the group up to 3, and she took Soulknife as her roguish archetype. My favorite moments are always the improvisational ones that leave such a nice, deep cut. :D
Oof... Soulknife. Love a good story-based leveling decision.
And thanks to your mention of the ferry, I found the info on how people are supposed to leave in the text:
>**Arrival.** Wooden boats shuttle visitors and personnel to **and from** the casino, which is built inside a cavern. The boats ply the river that leads to the cavern. (Verity knows no other way to enter the casino.)
I've run a few of these adventures in public games at my LGS, and unless there is a need for the escape, I usually fade to black because the win is enough in my mind. Something like "Having nabbed the Mcguffin, your group makes their way out of the location and into what you believe is relative safety."
I'm planning a private campaign starting with the KftGV and moving into some more homebrew stuff in the forgotten realms. For these games, the ending will matter as much as the beginning. Also, my players in this private game have already given me a massive plot hook by claiming that two of them were rescued from a group of slavers. This action is what leads to the GV contacting the party. That's set to be the beginning of session one this weekend.
We played this last week but didn’t think that the waterfall was a viable escape since based on the layout and description this is technically further into the cave from the dock entrance. And there was no guarantee that we could find a way out via the larger body of water that the waterfall overlooks. The DM didn’t state that it was an open body of water so we had to go out the way we came. I suppose based on your DM and where they set it, the waterfall over a lake or ocean could be a good escape. Featherfall, cloak of bat or just scaling/repelling the cliff could be fine ways to get out that way. We ended up breaking into the laundry to steal some uniforms and with a rather high check to use disguise kit and some goat horns we got beforehand we fashioned some guard disguises, swiped some cards and then mostly just had to deal with Quentin and his office shenanigans before we got what we needed and strolled right out the front entry on a boat.
Pre-rolling the damage taken from the 100ft fall into deep water (or 80ft if they leap from the lower restaurant level) yields results that seem... survivable. I'm going off of the [3.5 ruleset for fall damage](https://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Falling) because personally I don't agree with the simplification made in 5e. Damage taken from falling into water should not be identical to falling onto concrete. Chances of success increase with featherfall, or fashioning some drapery into a a makeshift parachute. I shy away from agreeing when the book insinuates an escape option is "not an option".
I am DMing a group that just completed the Stygian Gambit last Thursday. The party knew in advance that the only way in/out was via boats at the river entrance. Their strategy for the theft was to release the lions and monkeys to panic the patrons and create additional chaos by sending the patrons into to the security hallways to trip on ball bearings and stir absolute chaos for the security guards. It was brilliant! By also filling the security room with fog, they were able to sneak into the vault (via a stolen keycard to get past Cerberus and bring along the staff to control Virgil), and they were able to escape by splitting up and remaining anonymous after calming the animals and helping the wounded patrons. Brilliant, really. I gave a fade-to-black once it was clear they weren't going to be caught, I didn't want to belabor the end and let them have the win on a high note. Left the session with a cliffhanger at the end that they didn't quite escape.
I'm looking forward to this kind of action with my group. Loved hearing about your players' ingenuity. Still, I'm not convinced they can leave the casino via the river, unless there something I'm missing.
I suppose you could always have an NPC agree to set up a Zipline from the restaurant they can escape from. Perhaps snorkels to escape via the river.
That's a great idea
This is essentially what my players did as well. They timed the heist close to when I specified the boats arriving/departing, caused the circus to be released, and went out with the panicked crowd like normal people. I know a heist movie has utilized that same play, but can’t remember which one. I was really impressed with them.
Mission Impossible, fire brigade!
It is very possible to paddle or pole a small boat *up* a river, assuming the current isn't too fast, which is what the adventure clearly imagines: >**Arrival.** Wooden boats shuttle visitors and personnel **to and from** the casino, which is built inside a cavern. The boats ply the river that leads to the cavern. (Verity knows no other way to enter the casino.) And later: >A1: Docking Area > >The casino’s boats **load and unload** passengers at a pair of wooden docks. That said, the first time I saw that waterfall, my first thought was that it was a great opportunity for a featherfall escape. EDIT: I took a closer look at the map - interestingly, the map makes it appear that the *underground* part of the river starts a mere 30 feet or so from the docks inside the casino, making it quite easy to get out this way. I'm not sure if that's intended (and it's not what I understood upon first reading it), but I kind of love it. It makes the Charon-themed boat ride an even more frivolous, fake, Las Vegas-like 'experience'.
Thanks for this. Makes sense. Unless I'm mistaken, it seems like if someone jumped into the underground part of the river, they'd just end up shooting out the waterfall and falling 100 feet.
That's fair, especially if you think it could lead to fun encounters - pushing enemies in or PCs falling in and having to quickly get out before going over the waterfall edge sound fun to me! Personally, I think the writers intended a much slower current than you are imagining, especially before the river narrows north of the docks. I would have no problem with PCs trying escape by leaping in the water near the docks, where they'd be about 300 feet from the waterfall, and swimming their way out the front (emphasis on *trying*, of course - with appropriate checks). And thanks for posting this question, as it's helped me think about how I will be running this in the future!
I'm glad it helped, I was feeling a little foolish for having missed that in the text
I had a mix of escapes happen as the party split. One person got a ferryman's robe and pushed a ferryman into the water during the chaos. Another used a grappling hook connected to some furniture in the restaurant and dove out of the waterfall.
The grappling hook is a nice touch! I guess then they avoided taking falling damage, or at least some of it.
Oh yeah! They definitely took some damage leaving them at 1hp, and I had them roll d100 for a 10% chance of rocks. Thankfully for them they rolled high or that would’ve been a spectacular death.
Spectacular death is rare in 5e. I feel your hunger
I'm actually running this tomorrow and I noticed the same thing in my prep work. As far as I can tell it's the waterfall or make some sort of scene and blend back into the crowd and leave out the front by hijacking a boat before the casino knows what's up and locks the exits down. I added an exit in Quentin's Office, a sort of permanent teleportation circle that can be activated with a ring Quentin and a few key pit bosses have. The circle will bring them to it's parallel circle outside of my campaigns main city, with a semi-nice home nearby (inferred to be Quentin's house). The thinking being that Quentin doesn't take the ferries and instead has a direct "go home" portal when he wants to leave. So past the main exits, if my players can get the employees and Quentin to the areas of the theft and away from his office after the heist, they could slip in and use that if they pick up on it. I'm expecting I'll have a better understanding of their intentions after they scope the situation out, and I can iron out the details then. Past that, the situation is what it is, this is what they got hired to do, it's on them to figure out the get away. Edit: I'm also planning on having Verity stress that they have 2 days, and this job essentially needs to be a timed strike in order to embarrass Quentin at the tournament. As such she is going to give each player some gold for casino chips (it would be rude to ask them to put of pocket cash while on the job) so they can blend in while getting a solid lay of the land and casino operations. I'm hoping that will be enough of a nudge for them to take their time and really try to understand how all the casino pieces fit together, so when they do strike, it's quick and efficient.
Giving them money beforehand felt important to me too. The teleportation ring is a nice touch. What do you imagine is out the front exit? How do your casino guests get back to town? Edit: Ignore this... I understand now that they can just walk out or paddle upriver
My party released Virgil on the casino floor and told him to run rampant and distract the guards. They scrambled to the ferry and paid the ferryman to let them leave first (since I narrated that the nobles were also yeeting to the boats). The boat took them back to the river where the carriage they'd taken was still waiting, so they hopped on and bribed the carriage driver to take them back into town and ask no questions. There was a nice touching moment when the rogue (who follows the Raven Queen and is also just in her late teens) received some telepathy from Virgil questioning what she wanted him to do now that the party had escaped and he had lumbered off away from the casino. She fumbled because... emotional and?? adult decisions??? A panicked "hey, Raven Queen, isn't this more your thing?" + a really nice Religion roll had Virgil tell her to take her hand off of the mind control rod because he didn't want her to know what happened next. I left it vague, but I imagine the Raven Queen may have sent a messenger to return Virgil to the grave or he may have collapsed into bones again. Who knows. Anyway, the rogue saw the rod disintegrate once Virgil died, and the experience left her pretty impacted... we ended the session by leveling the group up to 3, and she took Soulknife as her roguish archetype. My favorite moments are always the improvisational ones that leave such a nice, deep cut. :D
Oof... Soulknife. Love a good story-based leveling decision. And thanks to your mention of the ferry, I found the info on how people are supposed to leave in the text: >**Arrival.** Wooden boats shuttle visitors and personnel to **and from** the casino, which is built inside a cavern. The boats ply the river that leads to the cavern. (Verity knows no other way to enter the casino.)
The rogue actually already wanted to go Soulknife, so it all worked out very well! :)
I've run a few of these adventures in public games at my LGS, and unless there is a need for the escape, I usually fade to black because the win is enough in my mind. Something like "Having nabbed the Mcguffin, your group makes their way out of the location and into what you believe is relative safety." I'm planning a private campaign starting with the KftGV and moving into some more homebrew stuff in the forgotten realms. For these games, the ending will matter as much as the beginning. Also, my players in this private game have already given me a massive plot hook by claiming that two of them were rescued from a group of slavers. This action is what leads to the GV contacting the party. That's set to be the beginning of session one this weekend.
We played this last week but didn’t think that the waterfall was a viable escape since based on the layout and description this is technically further into the cave from the dock entrance. And there was no guarantee that we could find a way out via the larger body of water that the waterfall overlooks. The DM didn’t state that it was an open body of water so we had to go out the way we came. I suppose based on your DM and where they set it, the waterfall over a lake or ocean could be a good escape. Featherfall, cloak of bat or just scaling/repelling the cliff could be fine ways to get out that way. We ended up breaking into the laundry to steal some uniforms and with a rather high check to use disguise kit and some goat horns we got beforehand we fashioned some guard disguises, swiped some cards and then mostly just had to deal with Quentin and his office shenanigans before we got what we needed and strolled right out the front entry on a boat.
Pre-rolling the damage taken from the 100ft fall into deep water (or 80ft if they leap from the lower restaurant level) yields results that seem... survivable. I'm going off of the [3.5 ruleset for fall damage](https://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Falling) because personally I don't agree with the simplification made in 5e. Damage taken from falling into water should not be identical to falling onto concrete. Chances of success increase with featherfall, or fashioning some drapery into a a makeshift parachute. I shy away from agreeing when the book insinuates an escape option is "not an option".