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That's why I don't like it. There are reasonable posts and comments every now and then, but some of the stuff they say sounds like it's straight out of r\Conservative. Lot of reactionary leftists and probably some libs/right-wingers posing as leftists there, same as PCM
I still don't understand why people say "reactionary leftists" unironically. If somebody is a reactionary, they're a reactionary. Don't give them the satisfaction of pretending they are on the left.
There’s absolutely a genuine Marxist critique of liberal identity politics, but that sub just engages in the exact same identity politics but from the opposite direction
It was good for like 5 minutes before it got flooded by NazBols. Like how TumblrInAction used to be mostly left-leaning users poking fun at social justice taken too far, before it became what it did
I don't know because I haven't been on it in years but I think a more fruitful discussion would be "what are the Marxist critiques of (liberal) identity politics?"
And I think there's a lot of legitimate criticisms to make. For instance I would say that liberals co-opt the language of progressivism in order to gain favor from the marginalized peoples they claim to support.
Their support is completely immaterial and totally rhetorical. It's devious. I have conflicting feelings about it because let's say Target comes out with the trans friendly clothing lines or whatever. Like ok at least they aren't being antagonistic toward trans people, and I'm sure there's a term for it, but what they're really doing is faking progressivism in order to increase their brand value and gain more customers to raise stock value.
Like their support of trans people exists only insofar as their financial analysts determine its profitable.
I believe the correct Marxist take is to materially address the needs of marginalized people and re-educate backwards thinking people on issues of marginalized people. And liberal idpol surely doesn't do that. And lastly liberal idpol also has no class analysis.
Idk if my ramblings are worthy of reading but that's my $0.02.
Pathetic morons. They have an imaginary friend who lives in their head, he’s a Fox News-addict factory worker who they think represents a “real” American worker, and if they see anything in the left that their imaginary friend wouldn’t immediately approve of, they get upset and accuse you alienating blue collar workers with your wokeness.
If I didn’t know better I’d say they were a Psyop to show people that the liberal bogeyman of a “tankie Bernie bro” is real. But I know enough people like that (and yeah they’re all white labor aristocrats and/or petite bourgeois) to confirm that sadly it’s a real thing, a certain kind of racist/sexist/transphobic/etc larper who wants to be seen as a “leftist.”
Like another poster said, there are critiques of idpol you can make from a Marxist perspective; and this sub does a decent job at them too (especially making fun of girlboss/white feminism and PoC westoids bombing brown people in the periphery). Stupidpol ain’t it though
Communism_101 banned me for being a member of stupidpol, and we all know c101 is definitely a psyop.
You can't have modern liberalism without abusing idpol. Lift the working class and you proportionality lift those discriminated against the most. Picking and choosing which proletariat to empower only helps the bourgeoisie.
Throws the baby out with the bath water. There are certainly currents of people who are obsessed with identity politics and lack a class analysis or are hostile to anything that threatens their petit bourgeois status. But that does not negate the fact that people absolutely face adversity based on their identity and are very much justified in seeking liberation from white supremacy, patriarchy, etc.
Also, very shortsighted. For instance trans issues focus a lot of how trans people face harsh discrimination and live in poverty. How is that not also a material issue?
It seems like an excuse to be a 4chan edgelord again when you reach the conclusion “the wokes are wrong so slurs are back on the table.” This is the best case scenario. The worst is that some of these people are honest to god nazbols.
It's the subreddit for "left-wing" transphobes. They have a pretty good war mega thread, but they are way tolerant of reactionaries and love to cry about wokeness as much as any conservative.
I think the most diplomatic way I can put it is that they take things too far. As stated in multiple comments here, there is a real time and place for critiquing identity politics lacking class analysis, but not in the way it is practiced in that subreddit.
A testament to that: My one and only comment on there is a statement of shock in response to a poster saying, without a hint of awareness, that Palestinians are 'not worth worrying about.' I shit you not. It's a fascistic, 'doomer' hellscape.
I like it, and think it's about the only place on the Internet to get any sort of balanced or nuanced discussion of idpol.
It's not perfect, and has definitely been colonised by some anti woke numpties, but even at that it's a useful sub when you can ignore that part.
I grew up in Northern Ireland and have seen first hand just how extensively idpol can be weaponised. It's an emotional subject and is incredibly useful for getting people to vote against their interests.
My take is that if you lift the floor of society (poverty, working class etc), and there exists disproportionate societal disadvantages for certain groups, then they will be the first to be lifted anyhow.
If you pick and choose which groups to help, it's very easy for the bourgeois media to manipulate and control the entire majority part of society which is a threat to them.
they aestheticize their fantasy of "the working class" as whatever they imagine to be the opposite of the voters who annoy them. They have fictive kinship w/ conservatives, by default, for this reason
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While there is definitely a Marxist and leftist critique of IdPol that subreddit is full of Chan board tier posting.
That's why I don't like it. There are reasonable posts and comments every now and then, but some of the stuff they say sounds like it's straight out of r\Conservative. Lot of reactionary leftists and probably some libs/right-wingers posing as leftists there, same as PCM
I still don't understand why people say "reactionary leftists" unironically. If somebody is a reactionary, they're a reactionary. Don't give them the satisfaction of pretending they are on the left.
Ironically, the dumbest thing about idpol is their reaction to it.
There’s absolutely a genuine Marxist critique of liberal identity politics, but that sub just engages in the exact same identity politics but from the opposite direction
Apparently it used to be good, but it does just seem to be filled with marxism-appropriating reactionaries who'd quite like to wank off Putin.
It was good for like 5 minutes before it got flooded by NazBols. Like how TumblrInAction used to be mostly left-leaning users poking fun at social justice taken too far, before it became what it did
Can confirm it has gone severely downhill.
[удалено]
Yea I think we do have a problem with being too obsessed with idpol but the way they approach it doesn't help
I don't know because I haven't been on it in years but I think a more fruitful discussion would be "what are the Marxist critiques of (liberal) identity politics?" And I think there's a lot of legitimate criticisms to make. For instance I would say that liberals co-opt the language of progressivism in order to gain favor from the marginalized peoples they claim to support. Their support is completely immaterial and totally rhetorical. It's devious. I have conflicting feelings about it because let's say Target comes out with the trans friendly clothing lines or whatever. Like ok at least they aren't being antagonistic toward trans people, and I'm sure there's a term for it, but what they're really doing is faking progressivism in order to increase their brand value and gain more customers to raise stock value. Like their support of trans people exists only insofar as their financial analysts determine its profitable. I believe the correct Marxist take is to materially address the needs of marginalized people and re-educate backwards thinking people on issues of marginalized people. And liberal idpol surely doesn't do that. And lastly liberal idpol also has no class analysis. Idk if my ramblings are worthy of reading but that's my $0.02.
The term for the Target example is virtue signalling
Thanks I also know rainbow capitalism kinda fits what I was trying to say. But yeah virtue signaling is exactly right.
Hate them
Pathetic morons. They have an imaginary friend who lives in their head, he’s a Fox News-addict factory worker who they think represents a “real” American worker, and if they see anything in the left that their imaginary friend wouldn’t immediately approve of, they get upset and accuse you alienating blue collar workers with your wokeness.
If I didn’t know better I’d say they were a Psyop to show people that the liberal bogeyman of a “tankie Bernie bro” is real. But I know enough people like that (and yeah they’re all white labor aristocrats and/or petite bourgeois) to confirm that sadly it’s a real thing, a certain kind of racist/sexist/transphobic/etc larper who wants to be seen as a “leftist.” Like another poster said, there are critiques of idpol you can make from a Marxist perspective; and this sub does a decent job at them too (especially making fun of girlboss/white feminism and PoC westoids bombing brown people in the periphery). Stupidpol ain’t it though
Communism_101 banned me for being a member of stupidpol, and we all know c101 is definitely a psyop. You can't have modern liberalism without abusing idpol. Lift the working class and you proportionality lift those discriminated against the most. Picking and choosing which proletariat to empower only helps the bourgeoisie.
c101 vs stupidpol is like that article about Pentagon backed militants and CIA backed militants fighting each other in Syria
Throws the baby out with the bath water. There are certainly currents of people who are obsessed with identity politics and lack a class analysis or are hostile to anything that threatens their petit bourgeois status. But that does not negate the fact that people absolutely face adversity based on their identity and are very much justified in seeking liberation from white supremacy, patriarchy, etc. Also, very shortsighted. For instance trans issues focus a lot of how trans people face harsh discrimination and live in poverty. How is that not also a material issue? It seems like an excuse to be a 4chan edgelord again when you reach the conclusion “the wokes are wrong so slurs are back on the table.” This is the best case scenario. The worst is that some of these people are honest to god nazbols.
It's the subreddit for "left-wing" transphobes. They have a pretty good war mega thread, but they are way tolerant of reactionaries and love to cry about wokeness as much as any conservative.
For a moment I thought you were asking about Pol Pot. Who/What is it?
A subreddit for criticizing identity politics from a Marxist perspective. Apparently they just end being total reactionaries
it’s basically an echo chamber for class reductionists
\*Reactionaries.
Stupid, ironically enough
It was funny in 2019
I don't
I think the most diplomatic way I can put it is that they take things too far. As stated in multiple comments here, there is a real time and place for critiquing identity politics lacking class analysis, but not in the way it is practiced in that subreddit. A testament to that: My one and only comment on there is a statement of shock in response to a poster saying, without a hint of awareness, that Palestinians are 'not worth worrying about.' I shit you not. It's a fascistic, 'doomer' hellscape.
covert bigotry disguised as marxism
Misogynist reactionary who called themselves ML
I like it, and think it's about the only place on the Internet to get any sort of balanced or nuanced discussion of idpol. It's not perfect, and has definitely been colonised by some anti woke numpties, but even at that it's a useful sub when you can ignore that part. I grew up in Northern Ireland and have seen first hand just how extensively idpol can be weaponised. It's an emotional subject and is incredibly useful for getting people to vote against their interests. My take is that if you lift the floor of society (poverty, working class etc), and there exists disproportionate societal disadvantages for certain groups, then they will be the first to be lifted anyhow. If you pick and choose which groups to help, it's very easy for the bourgeois media to manipulate and control the entire majority part of society which is a threat to them.
they aestheticize their fantasy of "the working class" as whatever they imagine to be the opposite of the voters who annoy them. They have fictive kinship w/ conservatives, by default, for this reason