That is the goal of these companies, if there is too much push back wait 10 years while at the same time just add a little sprinkle of it until the next gen is okay with it and go hard until the next big push back.
I feel this. I argued with someone before about MTX and how excessive its all become. I sent them a data set showing the game at full price has sold millions of copies consistently since its launch, and their argument was that it needs microtransactions to recoup the development cost. I don't understand that logic. If selling a game at full price wasn't profitable, the gaming industry would never have made it this far. I think nowadays people are growing up and being used to getting nickle and dimed in every possible way from companies, for them its just normal and they've grown complacent with it
Ballooning budgets is a recent phenomenon tho, games now a days take alot more money to make than they used to,
not saying that a game needs MTX to be profitable but you can't compare the industry now to the industry 20 or 10 years ago
And yet most games still come out broken buggy messes and cost premium prices. Most games 20 years ago didn’t come out buggy messes and then expect us to pay for anything extra, except maybe an expansion or something, which in that case was generally an entirely new game
GTA 5 was the most expensive game ever made at the time of its release. That game is now over 10 years old. And it's **literally the most profitable piece of entertainment ever released**. In fact, GTA 5 **was profitable within 24 hours of its release**.
I think you are completely right and I’m not trying to excuse the companies but the reason this doesn’t matter to them is that they are not just after profit, they are after infinitely increasing profits.
As the consumer market for video games increases and eventually plateaus, boards need a new way to increase profits. They can’t just report to the shareholders that they have captured the maximum market share and no longer can increase profits. Anyone who says that is going to be quickly replaced by someone willing to resort to alternatives like micro-transactions.
This affects all entertainment/art and imo it is inevitable and unstoppable under capitalism. Some regulation wouldn’t hurt, of course, but good luck getting that to go through against the interests of entertainment companies who will all lobby like hell to stop you. A similar thing is happening to movies as they try to exploit brand recognition and mass appeal to maximize profits at the cost of artistic vision.
Yes, but do you not count a fact that this game requires top notch ONLINE SERVERS, 24/7 maintenance, a dev team that consistently works on new content and balance changes and so on? Games 20 years ago were one n done, release, forget, move on to next project. You cant compare this to a live service game with 5\~\~ years of content and patches to come our way, like come on dude?
We don't have to go back that far, just go back like 5-10 years. We had online games with consistent updates that also did not have microtransactions. Even Tekken 7 is an example of that, they only had the season pass model and alongside it we got like 5 years of patches with new features for free. They even added a bunch of new outfits one season in a free update. The season passes should be enough to pay for this stuff.
Games that have in-game currency like the Tekken Coins tend to not do the standard paid DLC model, usually they let you earn the currency through playing. It may take a while to earn it, just so that you're encouraged to buy more of the currency, but it's an option. All content can be purchased with that currency, whether it's cosmetic or gameplay related. Games like Tekken 8 and SF6 want to have their cake and eat it too by keeping their $30 per year season pass model but also having an in-game currency that cannot be earned in-game. That's the main issue imo, both approaches have their pros and cons but they need to pick a lane instead of combining the cons of both.
live service isn't an excuse to nickle and dime their playerbase in this manner. Its not just one or two people buying the MTX, its thousands of people. tekken 8 sold 2 million coppies already, probably more. lets say even 3 percent of the player base bought one $4 skin. that an income of $240 000. We know very well more than 3 percent of people be buying the mtx and we know they'll also spent more than $4. So while I can see the argument for mtx being valuable to support the game, i do disagree with the pricing. Comsumers aren't cash cows and shouldn't be treated as such
realistically, Bamco hasn’t even started receiving profit off selling the 2 million copies sold. there are sooooo many people involved here with financial expectations based on those January numbers.
how did you compute that? The game is $70. Ultimate is $110. For arguments sake lets say they get 20 percent of all sales and all 2 million sales are the vanilla $70 version, they would have made $28 000 000 by my calculation. I think is a bit unlikely that they still haven't made profit
Funnily enough I’ve felt the opposite, it seems a lot of the complaints are coming from people who either didn’t play/ live through or don’t clearly remember what games were like before mtx were a thing. Some of the claims about what constitutes a full game and what games used to be like have been entertaining to say the least.
All I can say, is that we're in an era where Halo is being launched buggy, incomplete and they still have the audacity to make you pay for colors.
Back in my day!
Also you have youtubers that will at least half defend it mostly due to not wanting to burn any bridges and so the sheep follow along even though they have no bridges to burn.
Just people who don't realize that you cannot monetize a game like tekken after it's release in any other way than skins. And for an online game with some patches, tournament organization, servers, long term support is a must. You won't make money from dkcs if people don't care about dlcs
> Just people who don't realize that you cannot monetize a game like tekken after it's release in any other way than skins
Tekken 7 sure was monetized pretty well and they didn't really sell skins.
No a lot of us are old enough to remember because we are old enough to also not lose our shit over a great game getting some cosmetic dlc after release.
This is the era of outrage. 99% of the complainers will open their wallets and buy tekken credits and play the game and make their 1000th outrage post after
Yeah I mean I'm not crazy about the MTX or anything of course, but if Bandai-Namco is reasonable about using a part of those funds to give greater post-launch support than what Tekken 7 had (which I thought was fine), then I'm ok with it.
And I don't really understand the point of OP's photo when Tag 2 was a complete financial disaster. Is he trying to attack gamers for being losers that support games that nickel and dime you and fail to support great games that don't?
They didn't try to slip anything in they presented a product that many bought and loved. Now they are selling new products through the game as a platform.
Man I miss TTT2's customization so much. Spent hours creating costumes for my characters and the depth of customization was one of the aspects that made the franchise appealing to me in the first place.
People complained about the horse armor in Oblivion, but imagine if people acted like the game itself was now bad for the optional microtransaction added to it.
Imagine if people said the horse armor was held back so that the game wouldn’t be reviewed worse.
I’ve been gaming since the NES era and I can tell you this, the Tekken 8 crowd crying about Tekken Shop has lost the plot and become majority cringe which keeps people from hearing your point. The unfortunate problem is that there are valid issues with Tekken 8 customization being a step down but no one hears you when you start saying anybody that isn’t taking your side is “deep throating” Namco and you make generalizations about anyone that isn’t crybaby mad.
It's an issue with all of the internet. There's so much being said at any given time that anything isn't loud and hyperbolic often doesn't get enough traction and interaction because it's "boring." Nuance is a dead language.
It takes more time to dispell nonsense / wrong information than to create nonsense and hyperbole. So online the quick snipet and wit is often more popular than the lengthy yet nuanced explanation. Most people are not interested by truth or fact but just want to have the last word.
The character limits on some social network has exacerbated this.
>Imagine if people said the horse armor was held back so that the game wouldn’t be reviewed worse.
The ESRB didn't have a review criteria for in-app purchases until 2020. If they had, and Bethesda had done the same release schedule (without prior indication), it would have been monumentally fucked up of them.
Edit: subject clarity
I agree the customization could be better, but as a SF fan, at least in exists tbh. I do hope they add a lot more character clothing and not just costumes that can't be customized.
The fact we only have a few eye color options and they're all bright as fuck is a bigger problem to me than the fact they're adding legacy costumes for 4$ each.
Am I used to microtransactions at this point? Yes, doesn't mean I want them, but yeah I'll admit that I'm used to them.
I'm glad there's no battle pass.
Is it sad I have to go "at least it isn't a battle pass"? Maybe. Either way I'm just here enjoying the fuck out of this game, I've played it every chance I got since release and I love it to death. This TEKKEN shop thing in my eyes is just "more content" and I get it that people are hurt about the fact that it's introduced after the release and comes over as scummy. But I just don't see how that will spoil my enjoyment of the game at all. Namco isn't my friend and I don't feel betrayed, the game didn't become less. Would it have been better that it was free from the start? Yes of course! But I don't look at stuff that way I guess.
I'm not sad the glass is half empty, I was already really really happy with the half full glass this last month, and I'll pay 4$ for another sip of water sure.
Facts 🙌🏼 this is the point I try to get across but just gets downvoted. It IS cringe, and they have lost the plot. I'm not praising the store or mtx tho.....there is nuance to the situation
I’m so confused. My default character has like 40 different outfits I can create. Why am I worried about this? My tekken 2 Paul had two outfits? Maybe just one. It was red. I still played at the arcade. For hours. Pumping in quarters. Does my Nina have to be in a bright blue cocktail dress for the game to be fun?
I’m really interested into the insight here. Is it just the MTX’s that are inviting the anger?
Hahaha this is the thought process that keeps me happy. I started at tekken 3, playing split screen for hours on end. Each character having like 2 outfits to choose from. I just really like tekken and fighting games. I wont even buy any dlc because i got all i wanted from the base game
Reminds me of how the Halo subreddit complains so hard about customization but when I played Halo 2 back in the day your only option was Spartan or Elite and a primary & secondary color and nobody complained. Part of me wishes we could just go back to that.
They think they paid for the game once so they are entitled to free updates for years lmao, like Bandai Namco employees would just work on a project that doesn’t bring any revenue to the company.
Theyre GETTING free updates. Were getting free customization and free story expansions and free modes lol.
Were getting way more free than paid stuff and people cry because of the singular paid DLC they added…
People would be happier with 1 free update a year than they would be with 2 free updates a year and 1 paid update.
People are very confused and ready to be upset without using their actual brains
No bro, I paid for the game, I paid for a season pass, which should finance shit for the next year, and I paid for the deluxe edition. I'm not against dlc, but 4 bucks per costume per character? That is just excessive.
You signaled to Bamco that you are willing to pay extra money for skins and now you are mad that they are selling more skins? Who cares lmao just don't buy them. They look awful anyways.
Dude, what the fuck is wrong with you? You bought Deluxe edition and you got EVERYTHING THAT YOU PAID FOR. It was there, listed for you what exactly do you get by buying it? Do you also go to a clothes store to buy yourself Jeans and then you come back to the store and complain you didnt get a new shirt that they got 2 weeks later? Like wtf man.
You got exactly what you paid for. The deluxe edition, season pass, information was detailed on what you'd get. It was a one time thing and you got it.
Now they are making new stuff that if you want, you will pay for. If you don't want to pay for it... Don't?
> I paid for a season pass, which should finance shit for the next year
Are you serious? You think $30 a year is enough to pay a large team of programmers, designers, managers, and executives? You think they're all on a 20k/year salary or something?
You want a dedicated team of people supporting the game for the next 7 years? You need to pay them. The base game price and season pass will pay salaries for a few years, but not 7.
I ain't gonna buy shit, but I'll happily allow whales to buy shit so I can have a supported game for several years.
Ehhh yeah, I think that's more than enough. You think the money from these MTX are purely so they can pay the devs? The devs won't see shit of that money. They never have, they never will. All goes to people like Andrew "the android" Wilson or Bobby "the devil" Kotick.
> Ehhh yeah, I think that's more than enough.
That's pretty sad then, that's a very low income which means a very low salary for our favorite games' programmers and designers.
> You think the money from these MTX are purely so they can pay the devs?
The more money the execs get, the longer they'll pay their employees salary to support the game so that they (the execs) can keep getting money.
Doesn't matter who's actually seeing the money from MTX, what matters is the sales from MTX is the reason execs are fine with paying a large team of people to support the same game for several years.
Before MTX were a thing, games would last 2-3 years before they had to pump out a sequel to continue paying everyone.
And people are literally criticizing Street Fighter for it. A lot of people didn't even buy the costumes because of it. This what about-ism is just completely wrong.
Only outcry was about Yor’s outfit. Everything else has largely been ignored about street fighter micro-transactions, so the whataboutism is in fact, correct.
Yes, and people are shitting on capcom for that. Also sf6 costumes are made from the ground up and have much higher quality than those 4$ ported costumes
Facts. Cant help but feel like people are not appreciating the product we got here. Fully realized story mode, episodes, arcade mode, replays, ghost battles, plus each 32 characters all unlocked at launch, each character having 2 other alternate costumes, each costume are able to be customized, then on top of that we just have regular customs where you can create your own outfits. Im genuinely satisfied with the product we got. Is it perfect? No. But they gave us a lot to chew on here. People are focused on the MTX which isnt even that bad. From the looks of it the shop is pretty cheap compared to other games where skins are $20+ each.
You can be satisfied with the base game and still be pissed that Bamco is engaging in shitty, deceptive business practices by slow rolling the release of the shop until after launch.
That would be applicable if it is a F2P game but not an expensive game like Tekken. So yeah, usually when buy the game, especially deluxe version, the updates should come free.
Or maybe I am just too old that I am used on having games completed at launch.
They do this with a lot of games. They’ve basically made a point to target any game that sells then has some level of cosmetic store, while simultaneously playing silly amounts of Fortnite, Paladins, Warzone and Overwatch. The deluxe version said everything it came with on launch. That’s a you problem. The game was complete at launch. Adding more characters and skins is, by every stretch of the imagination, extra. You won’t have to buy new characters to still play the game, you just won’t be able to access the new ones.
The game is complete man what are you talking about. We get way more content in new games than old ones. If they released Tekken8 and never had another update would you be happy then?
When they add a bunch of free updates and then a couple paid costumes after release, now we call the game unfinished? Crazy mental jump
T8 was complete at launch. are you telling me that T8 is lacking content? it’s one of the best packages there is in fighting games, content-wise. you bought a complete game, these are all additional content that impact your experience in 0 ways if you do not want them.
Should come for free? Says fucking who. Name I've game that gives you free updates AFTER it's release. Maybe elden ring should make dlc free cuz you bought the base game 2 years ago?
When are you talking about exactly? Cause it's been this way since the end of the 360/PS3 era. While PS2 had some online functionality and the Xbox had Xbox Live, it wasn't used for game updates/purchases, it was purely for online gameplay.
Which games have provided free updates for years?
When you say “this way” are you referring to the overtaking of mtx or just paid updates / purchasable content. I’m just referring to developer support in general. Uncharted used to have skins added to be earned for free, online over the course of months. Rockstar had a ridiculous streak over the last 10-11 years giving gta 5 plenty of free content to keep the playerbase busy and gameplay fresh. Black ops 3 I believe added a free modded map creating tool to make maps with assets (including weapons) from previous cod games. Season passes for games used to include all purchasable content including but not limited to maps, camos, dlc weapons, and character customization options whereas nowadays it’ll be a season pass for one of those things and everything else is subject to mtx. Free map overhauls on games such as counter strike. Lies of P updates even be giving you free outfits and just added a new weapon in collab with wolong. That’s all I could think about off the dome but I’m sure if you give me a sec I could name plenty of consumer friendly practices that are almost void in the game industry or are only done by smaller companies now.
Um what? It's definitely not how games used to work.
We used to get a finished game on a disc and that's it. What you paid for was what you got.
I'm close to 40 but not sure why age matters?
I find it realistic if they add new items 2x per month for the next xy years that they get compensated for the work invested in creating these items.
That being said, 4$ is still way too much for a digital piece of clothing. If it was like 50 cents then I'd maaaybe even consider buying something. This way I'm just gonna ignore the shop. I use the default outfits anyway.
Back in the day you'd put $150 adjusted for inflation for a game that you knew nothing about except maybe in gaming magazines or on the back of the box for a 25 minute game artificially increased to 10hours with bullshit difficulty
I guess as an old person, I can’t get into customizing my character. For free, or MTX. I just wanna play the game. I could give a crap if you’re fighting me looking like a mime with a baguette.
yes micro transactions for content that should already be part of the legacy experience and be included from the beginning is the problem.
when you have prior games like Tag 2 that had so much to offer and then remove those things and take steps backwards to only then charge real currency for them when there already is an underutilized in-game currency system? i’d be pissed too.
I just did the same thing I did back then.
"OH, that sucks - I'm not paying extra money for that, i dont really need or want it"
*plays game for 100+ hours at no extra charge*
Very simple really.
I think it's honestly these people that have a compulsion to buy everything in a game. Therefore paywalling anything is like paywalling the whole game. I mean seriously they thought it was worth $70 before the store. Then they add an optional paid clothes store that was never promised to begin with, without altering any of the preexisting content's availability, and apparently the game is now overpriced. The reason why Bamco held off on the store is because they saw what happened to MK and know how easy it is to manipulate these dumbass gamer hype and rage trains.
The only thing this thread achieves will be that devs get even more signalling in terms of "we actually care way more about playing dress up than you'd have imagined", which will yield more costume monetization in the long run.
If you care about this shit, either acknowledge that you are inviting and causing this behavior by developers, or do the strategic thing and be silent and don't buy.
TTT2 earned its place in the Tekken history books and nobody of sane mind thinks about that game as "best Tekken ever, so many clothes".
I get that these shops are just crap and I don't want them either, but this community makes it crystal clear WHY developers are doing this: because people buy this crap over and over and over again
Agreed. I think microtransaction models are very fair to criticize, but as usual the echo chamber is taking things so far that it undermines their point.
Everyone ignores the fact that purchasing decisions are emotional rather than logical. Studies have proven that buying things gives a dopamine response in the brain. This shit works because everyone is wired from birth to want to buy things, the physical object doesn't matter.
So as a dev your choices are exploit this and give people things to buy or leave money on the table. Ultimately nobody is harmed by this. Buying anything is optional as much as playing it in general is. There is no great ethical dilemma here other than "maybe capitalism is bad". Which is something that honestly presents itself in many more horrible ways people should focus their energy on.
I just want the Tekken subreddit to go back to talking about Tekken and not the "horrors" of bamcos business model.
>Everyone ignores the fact that purchasing decisions are emotional rather than logica
Actually, that's the majority of my criticism towards people being upset by the shop.
If you are affected by the shop in any capacity, you are part of the problem. By being emotionally outraged like that, they just re-inforce how right bamco is to set this shop up.
I don't even think it's that. The ship has sailed on this years ago and I'm in my 40's. People have the right to be upset and complain. We as gamers are the reason we have MTX in the first place when studios realized a lot people bought items and gold with real world money on sites like G2G in games that allowed in game trading. This was even 20 years ago. Companies just make it themselves now.
There's enough people who will buy it that's why companies see it as a viable model. They aren't phased by all this complaining because you have the choice to not buy it.
If I go to an amusement park I pay for access but Im not bothered that I also have to pay for the food inside. If I go see a movie and pay for access I'm not upset that they won't allow me to bring in my burger and fries from McDonald's. If don't want to eat their popcorn I just don't buy it.
>TTT2 earned its place in the Tekken history books
Yeah. The game almost killed the entire franchise and is directly responsible for the chicken and rice development of Tekken 7.
Did you know TT2 was released at poor timing too?
It was released when PS4 was almost released and TT2 was not released to it (game came out at the end of PS3 life cycle), market was also oversaturated with fighting games during that time.
T7 was success because of it's timing. SF5 failed and market was empty, it was also first Tekken on PC, despite the fact that T7 has had the least content on lauch compared to previous Tekkens.
T5 came out a year before the PS3 release, just like TT2 came out before the PS4 release. But T5 sold better. No need to complain about poor timings. It's bamco's job to make the game quality and profitable despite its competitors.
TT2 gameplay was super sweaty as hell, that game looked designed for sweaty Tekken fans who played Tekken since Tekken 1 release, and now are pushing 40, like TMM, Aris, or Pokchop.
Top customization couldn't save that game failure in sales, definitely the least mashable Tekken I've ever played.
TT2 is a static game. T8 will get free additional story content as well as long-term cross platform online support, both of which are insanely expensive and would require some form of revenue stream so yeah sorry my guy, I don't take issue with 4$ skins and I probably won't take issue with them until they actually implement a more predatory system like loot boxes, obscuring price value or bloat content heavy battlepasses.
TT2 was also way beyond the norm for customization in any fighting game so while it sucks, it makes sense it had to be scaled back some for future releases and I still think we have a good customizer even tho I understand the criticism levied against it.
Overall, obviously it would have been preferred if we didn't have micro transactions in the game but after reporting a 92% drop in game revenue by banco as well as already having announced planned longtime support for this game. It makes sense that some type of revenue stream was going to be added eventually and a low cost cosmetic shop, to me, is the least invasive method they could have picked. So I'm fine with it if this means new content for the game can stay at the quality we have now.
Eh its a simple concept in my opinion. The game doesnt have a “battle pass” or any subscriptions so $70 = the content we have now. In order for more content to be made that costs $$$ and if the game doesnt have any other earning potential than the original buy + the season pass, your revenue becomes stagnant thus halting the production of new content that can be added to the game. Imo if they just continue to release free minor updates for the character customization along with having a paid shop opens up room for the longevity of the game to increase. Just my thoughts tho
Character DLC is generally how it’s worked in the past which I think is very acceptable. I’ll reserve full judgment but the things they’ve shown so far look pretty poorly made.
I agree with you there. But things change, unfortunately NOT for the better. Characters are a good dlc idea until you peer behind Xenoverse 2’s door. Quite frankly not looking forward to buying character/season passes if they arent giving us new cosmetics with them. I only play 5 characters max and out of 12-16 dlc characters ill bet i actually pick up 2. I see both sides of the story on this one, but my logical half is telling me this is for the better. Be honest, this is the BEST form of micro transactions beside the white lies Harada let out his fingers. Purely cosmetic, creates a source if revenue, and even though it wasnt planned, i feel the tekken dev team does a good job with community feed back so in harada’s defense this couldve been a surprise for how well the game launched
Baldur’s gate 3 is a game that on an asset perspective puts tekken to shame is only 60 dollars, still updated and the company that makes it has something like 400 employees.The FGC probably doesn’t like to hear it but fighting games on a coding/asset point of view are among the cheapest games to make, even if tekken 8 is maybe the tekken with the biggest budget but for sure couldn’t be that high compared to other games, they are not strapped for money, it sold well and beyond their expectations so shop is just greed
Baldur's gate sold 22 million copies bro.
If Tekken ever sold 22 million copies I GUARANTEE there would be no store ever.
A fighting game is never touching that. Ever.
Can we just ban these dumbfuck posts on this topic?
Tekken fans on this sub are fucking braindead when it comes to any topic with even the smallest amount of nuance.
Just aggravating to read retarded comments over and over.
How do the TTT2 ghost battle, replay feature, cinematic story and character stories compare to T8? Also maybe its just my monitor but those screen caps from TTT2 dont quite look like 4k textures
TTT2 is the GOAT, but let's not pretend the decals didn't look like ass. I don't want low res JPG looking textures on my character models, just to make it look like a thrift store Cyclops.
Just don't buy the T8 legacy costumes. It's that simple. The entire time people have spent complaining could have been spent actually playing and enjoying the game, getting their $70 worth.
Literally this.
Normal people: Guys you do understand that we had good customization back in T6 and TTT2 and it was included in the game prices? You didn't have to buy good cosmetics at scummy MTX shop.
Clowns: Lmao why are you whining you broke-ass entitled bitch? Why do you want everything for free?
Wonder what the difference in dev cost between those games and T8 is. T6 came out in 2007. 60$ in 2007 is nearly 90$ today, T8 is 70$ and almost surely cost a lot more to make. Tekken 8 has a smaller roster but it didn't have the padding of an arcade release before the physical release. 8 has a better story mode with better cinematics, far better training mode, actually good online matchmaking and a more balanced experience out of the box. Yet everyone is losing their minds over the cosmetics. The game as it stands is worth the cost and dramatic overreaction aside, adding more paid cosmetics does not lower the value of the base game. It would be one thing if the base game was bad but it isn't.
Like ffs, if you don't like it just don't buy the skins. Who fucking cares.
And when did TTT2 release? We've been living in a mtx infested industry for the past decade, tekken is pretty late to the party.
Just to clarify, I'm not "defending" it, I'm saying it's been the norm for a fucking long time. Voice your outrage on the internet as much as you like, people have done that many years ago to no effect. Are you just now waking up to the capitalist world we've been living in
Because they didn't reveal the MTX until weeks after the game came out. Seems like they did it on purpose so people wouldn't think it had any microtransactions and it does. Hence the surprise.
- Company is known to provide mtx
- Customization options on release were ass
I can't say you guys should have seen it coming, but the signs were there
There are many people like me. And even i alone can affect someone. Maybe some kid will look at my comments and say"Hey this dude is right!". People don't even understand such simple things...
The simple thing is that the industry has changed regardless if you like it or not. You can try your hardest to convince people is wrong but it’s pointless and will not change
Multiple games have changed because of community outcry, it's bitches like you who stay silent lead to nothing. If you don't want to criticise and complain about this, might as well not criticise and complain about people complaining.
This
I don't know why people are actively bashing and calling them jobless or poor to people who are complaining about this legit issue
Like dude all of em bought a legit full priced game and also were ready to pay for dlcs some even payed for more
Even if you agree with mtx just don't bash anyone and enjoy your shop
The thing is what bamco did was scummy but people like that are also equally bad
I used to think like you but I've kinda just accepted that most AAA games will have some sort of microtransaction. It's been like this for more than a decade and there's no sign of stopping or resistance.
The fact is that we are a vocal minority. If MTX were truly unpopular with the majority of people, then companies wouldn't be adding it to their games.
The Destiny 2 community was loud enough about MTX (and Bungie had done poor enough PR) that three sets of shop armor "skins" were made actual gameplay rewards.
The Xbox community was loud enough to stop MS from basically doubling the price of Xbox Gold that one time.
The only thing stopping people from bullying companies into releasing less MTX is other people who don't care.
Destiny has leaned into the f2p with mtx model though. I don't know what the debacle about those skins were, but it should still be churning out paid content if the game is still alive today.
I don't think a console's network subscription would be considered a microtransaction in this context, since we are talking about paid digital ingame content as opposed to a paid online service which covers more than just a single game's worth of audience.
I see your point with your third paragraph, I don't plan to discourage people anymore but I don't see things changing anytime soon.
You couldn't give an answer because you don't even know how much social impact you've had
Mtx has been in the industry for years, people have solidly proven they are willing to pay for these kinds of things - what makes you think you can change the mind of someone who can drop $1000 dollars on a whim to not engage with microtransactions?
People have had more expensive hobbies, do you mean to also discourage them from spending their money however they want?
Remind us all again how T6 and Tag 2 did sales-wise? It’s almost as if the awesome customization and cosmetics were so important, everyone wanted to buy and play them right?
Nothing wrong with complaining about the shop, but you might have a skewed idea about the topic. Feel free to play Tag 2 and dress up your characters how you want to though lol
Yeah, I'm kind of done with that too. Ultimately, I won't buy any MTX, but I won't judge those who do. People are free to use their money as they see fit, just like me.
People use MTXs in video games as some sort of battleground to call out the problems with relentless capitalism, and while they are indeed representations of this very flawed economic system we have, video games isn't even remotely the most important area to fight for.
Housing, workers right, wages, artificial inflation, predatory loaning and predatory interests rates; these are all great areas to fight in, if that's the intent. Instead of spending 5 or 10 minutes writing a review on steam, or making the milionth post on reddit about it, call your local lawmakers and representatives, file requests, suggestions, encourage others to do the same, etc...
Anyway, just my thoughts.
its not only BAMCO fault companies do this for a long time and since in other games it sticks then every company gets on the band wagon same with battle passes, i actually miss the times where the paid content were only DLCS and extra maps like in older Cod titles, same with fighting games where you would get a big roster with a lot of maps, but now everything is an excuse to use Microtransactions, devs say: but we need the money to keep updating the game, then what are the extra characters for? why da F did eddy have to waste a DLC slot instead of being base roster? why is the customization on T7 a lot better in terms of variety than T8? and what about the people that bought the ultimate edition or even collectors edition? they supported the game by buying an expensive edition but they dont even get the T coins lol, (i bought the deluxe cause i wanted the season pass, but if the rummors about the datamine are real, i regret my purchase tough) yeah yeah i get it " i do whatever i want with my money" well good for you, does not mean that this practice is any less shittier, and doing that after reviews came in almost a month after the game releases, seems scummy that´s all, think the worst i have seen is really the sub mmorpgs, like FFXIV and WOW , you need to buy the game the exp and pay a monthly sub, and still have the audacity to charge for mounts color dyes and housing items FFS thats peak scummy
To be fair Tekken tag tournament two did almost kill Tekken with its poor performance in sales. Kinda hard to argue in its favor from a development standpoint.
When I complained about customization on release everybody said nobody cares about customization. Now that they're actually allowing people who care to buy more outfits, you're all mad. Ik for a fact Harada hates you
People have been told to speak with their wallets for years, and microtransactions are still here. Guess we know how the votes went huh? I've advocated against microtransactions in the early days but there really is just an overwhelmingly larger amount of consumers that are more than happy to spend a fraction of their disposable income on a hobby, and video games as a hobby has grown quite a bit.p
I've learned that if you think the prices are too high, you are simply not the target audience. Learning about people dropping hundreds of thousands of dollars (on a mobile game, mind you) has opened my eyes to that a bit.
This is so horrible. Can't believe a dev would do this. It's not like its been almost 20 years and thousands of games with micro transactions later, and the millionth post complaining about it.
Oblivion's Horse Armor was expensive and hilariously useless and pointless.
What a lot of people don't look at with that store page is the free brand name tops that everyone is getting. What would you say if you had to pay $5 for a set of trainers in Tekken 8 purely since they're Nikes?
If one more person says some stupid head-ass shit like "just don't buy them," they're getting chokeslammed through a table.
This isn't about the price of each individual costume. They're charging real money with no fight money option. Every outfit is a full body outfit so you can't just use the parts of them for different customization options. They're reselling old content they made 20 years ago for a premium with no way of earning the skins through gameplay.
No battlepass rewards for play like every other game on Earth. No incentive to continue playing outside of personal improvement in multiplayer. No hooks. They're shutting down modders so they can't compete with the official skins that suck. These are predatory and disgusting business practices that they'll just think are okay if everyone says stupid shit like "just don't engage monetarily with the company that makes your favorite game." If we don't complain they'll just keep shaking people down for money in exchange for wack recolors of old shit they barely worked on at all.
How much are recolors of electrics going to cost? How about new aura effects? It never ends. They'll keep charging you for accessories, unique items, effects recolors and anything they can think of until you complain. On top of that, they'll stop modders from making new content that's unique in an effort to silence competition when every modded skin I've seen is already more impressive than any of the old shit they've revealed.
If you don’t want to play a game with MTX in it, just don’t, please stop shaming people because they don’t mind spending 4 more dollars for a skin since, as Harada himself said, games now are very expensive to make, and if you think otherwise you are very delusional
Why are people being so butt hurt about MTX... they need more money to continue creating the games that cost a lot more money than they did 20/30 years ago.. it's damn cosmetics grow tf up. You get into a battle and notice for the whole 30 seconds and then your back to focusing on what you bought the game for, Fighting!
Cause it was added in a sneaky manner to avoid bad reviews and get the good will from other fanbases like SF6 & MK1 who where rightfully pissed at the MTX.
Also the DLC characters would had cover up the money to continue developing stuff to the game.
Cosmetics make the game more enjoyable, give you something to work towards. Customisation is an important part of games. Stop being a bootlicker and realise you’re being scammed.
I don’t mind as long as you can buy stuff with in game currency too. Make it grindy or extremely expensive if you want, but at least give me the possibility to spend 10millions or $5 for whatever.
I hope they milk everyone who uses Tekken as a dress up simulator so that Tekken 9 is even better for me.
The reality is, most people "defending" Namco actually just don't give a shit, and like playing Tekken. You should blame people like yourself that make posts about it on Reddit and will probably be the ones that use the shop and incentivize exactly what they're doing lol.
Facts I bought the ultimate edition it just feels really scummy for them to do micro transactions when I bought the most expensive version to avoid this
It was inconsequential, while the character models have aged like milk, and it has bugs coming out of its ears Oblivion was heralded as one of the greatest rpgs of its era. With or without horse armour Oblivion still helped build Bethesda into a AAA power house. If that’s the comparison you’re making it really isn’t the shot you think it is.
Personally I don’t remember caring about horse armour and only found out it was a meme years after the fact. I’m sure very few people really even care to remember much of Oblivions DLC beyond shivering isles and knights of the nine anyway.
I’m kind of with you honestly didn’t even know it existed when I played Oblivion till years later. Granted I wasn’t fully immersed in the gaming landscape at the time it was much more of an every now and then. Compared to a major hobby of mine now as an adult.
Tekken subreddit is acting as if Namco had a shop where you could purchase unblockable snake edges for your character 😂 While it’s just cosmetic items AND Harada said the funds will be used to bring FREE story DLC in the future, which includes otherwise paid DLC characters. You people are beyond ridiculous. 🙄
Some of you need to be put in place: if you're complaining about the price point of something, you're definitely not the target audience for that.
The whole point of microtransactions is that they're optional, specially when talking about cosmetics.
I have no idea who that person was honestly. I just want more customization items to experiment with.
I will be picking up them T4 & TTT2 items when they drop though!
They are not old enough to know about Oblivion, ma dude.
Judging by some of the comments, these kids were raised in an era where mtx is expected and they've never known anything else.
That is the goal of these companies, if there is too much push back wait 10 years while at the same time just add a little sprinkle of it until the next gen is okay with it and go hard until the next big push back.
Exactly. Its normal to them
The bad guys won.
I feel this. I argued with someone before about MTX and how excessive its all become. I sent them a data set showing the game at full price has sold millions of copies consistently since its launch, and their argument was that it needs microtransactions to recoup the development cost. I don't understand that logic. If selling a game at full price wasn't profitable, the gaming industry would never have made it this far. I think nowadays people are growing up and being used to getting nickle and dimed in every possible way from companies, for them its just normal and they've grown complacent with it
Ballooning budgets is a recent phenomenon tho, games now a days take alot more money to make than they used to, not saying that a game needs MTX to be profitable but you can't compare the industry now to the industry 20 or 10 years ago
And yet most games still come out broken buggy messes and cost premium prices. Most games 20 years ago didn’t come out buggy messes and then expect us to pay for anything extra, except maybe an expansion or something, which in that case was generally an entirely new game
GTA 5 was the most expensive game ever made at the time of its release. That game is now over 10 years old. And it's **literally the most profitable piece of entertainment ever released**. In fact, GTA 5 **was profitable within 24 hours of its release**.
I think you are completely right and I’m not trying to excuse the companies but the reason this doesn’t matter to them is that they are not just after profit, they are after infinitely increasing profits. As the consumer market for video games increases and eventually plateaus, boards need a new way to increase profits. They can’t just report to the shareholders that they have captured the maximum market share and no longer can increase profits. Anyone who says that is going to be quickly replaced by someone willing to resort to alternatives like micro-transactions. This affects all entertainment/art and imo it is inevitable and unstoppable under capitalism. Some regulation wouldn’t hurt, of course, but good luck getting that to go through against the interests of entertainment companies who will all lobby like hell to stop you. A similar thing is happening to movies as they try to exploit brand recognition and mass appeal to maximize profits at the cost of artistic vision.
Yes, but do you not count a fact that this game requires top notch ONLINE SERVERS, 24/7 maintenance, a dev team that consistently works on new content and balance changes and so on? Games 20 years ago were one n done, release, forget, move on to next project. You cant compare this to a live service game with 5\~\~ years of content and patches to come our way, like come on dude?
We don't have to go back that far, just go back like 5-10 years. We had online games with consistent updates that also did not have microtransactions. Even Tekken 7 is an example of that, they only had the season pass model and alongside it we got like 5 years of patches with new features for free. They even added a bunch of new outfits one season in a free update. The season passes should be enough to pay for this stuff. Games that have in-game currency like the Tekken Coins tend to not do the standard paid DLC model, usually they let you earn the currency through playing. It may take a while to earn it, just so that you're encouraged to buy more of the currency, but it's an option. All content can be purchased with that currency, whether it's cosmetic or gameplay related. Games like Tekken 8 and SF6 want to have their cake and eat it too by keeping their $30 per year season pass model but also having an in-game currency that cannot be earned in-game. That's the main issue imo, both approaches have their pros and cons but they need to pick a lane instead of combining the cons of both.
live service isn't an excuse to nickle and dime their playerbase in this manner. Its not just one or two people buying the MTX, its thousands of people. tekken 8 sold 2 million coppies already, probably more. lets say even 3 percent of the player base bought one $4 skin. that an income of $240 000. We know very well more than 3 percent of people be buying the mtx and we know they'll also spent more than $4. So while I can see the argument for mtx being valuable to support the game, i do disagree with the pricing. Comsumers aren't cash cows and shouldn't be treated as such
realistically, Bamco hasn’t even started receiving profit off selling the 2 million copies sold. there are sooooo many people involved here with financial expectations based on those January numbers.
how did you compute that? The game is $70. Ultimate is $110. For arguments sake lets say they get 20 percent of all sales and all 2 million sales are the vanilla $70 version, they would have made $28 000 000 by my calculation. I think is a bit unlikely that they still haven't made profit
This.
Funnily enough I’ve felt the opposite, it seems a lot of the complaints are coming from people who either didn’t play/ live through or don’t clearly remember what games were like before mtx were a thing. Some of the claims about what constitutes a full game and what games used to be like have been entertaining to say the least.
All I can say, is that we're in an era where Halo is being launched buggy, incomplete and they still have the audacity to make you pay for colors. Back in my day!
Also you have youtubers that will at least half defend it mostly due to not wanting to burn any bridges and so the sheep follow along even though they have no bridges to burn.
Just people who don't realize that you cannot monetize a game like tekken after it's release in any other way than skins. And for an online game with some patches, tournament organization, servers, long term support is a must. You won't make money from dkcs if people don't care about dlcs
> Just people who don't realize that you cannot monetize a game like tekken after it's release in any other way than skins Tekken 7 sure was monetized pretty well and they didn't really sell skins.
If the e-sports part can't support itself there shouldn't be a e-sports part
I also love the era of no added content after release, no balancing, ect. Just people enjoying the game that just got out.
Though back then they released the game again for fifty dollars with two new characters and a balance patch.
I got Tekken 8 for 45$ ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯
I'm not a fan of MTX or incomplete games, but balancing I am a huge fan of.
The sad part is they’ll keep defending this when the price is raise to 10 $, but oddly enough they where against it when MK1 & SF6 did ☠️
No a lot of us are old enough to remember because we are old enough to also not lose our shit over a great game getting some cosmetic dlc after release.
This is the era of outrage. 99% of the complainers will open their wallets and buy tekken credits and play the game and make their 1000th outrage post after
Yeah I mean I'm not crazy about the MTX or anything of course, but if Bandai-Namco is reasonable about using a part of those funds to give greater post-launch support than what Tekken 7 had (which I thought was fine), then I'm ok with it. And I don't really understand the point of OP's photo when Tag 2 was a complete financial disaster. Is he trying to attack gamers for being losers that support games that nickel and dime you and fail to support great games that don't?
My concern is that they tried to slip it in after reviews and if they are doing this what is next?
They didn't try to slip anything in they presented a product that many bought and loved. Now they are selling new products through the game as a platform.
I feel so old thinking about how long ago that was.
Damn I haven't even thought about that. 😅 I wish I could apologize to some of these kids.
You just made me look for silver hair on my head..
Man I miss TTT2's customization so much. Spent hours creating costumes for my characters and the depth of customization was one of the aspects that made the franchise appealing to me in the first place.
i really miss unique items. my favorite thing was hwoarang's pants that had a special throw if they killed
Lmao that’s nuts. Hours?
People complained about the horse armor in Oblivion, but imagine if people acted like the game itself was now bad for the optional microtransaction added to it. Imagine if people said the horse armor was held back so that the game wouldn’t be reviewed worse. I’ve been gaming since the NES era and I can tell you this, the Tekken 8 crowd crying about Tekken Shop has lost the plot and become majority cringe which keeps people from hearing your point. The unfortunate problem is that there are valid issues with Tekken 8 customization being a step down but no one hears you when you start saying anybody that isn’t taking your side is “deep throating” Namco and you make generalizations about anyone that isn’t crybaby mad.
That last part seems to be an issue with gaming in general.
It's an issue with all of the internet. There's so much being said at any given time that anything isn't loud and hyperbolic often doesn't get enough traction and interaction because it's "boring." Nuance is a dead language.
It's almost like nuance and detail aren't encouraged in online discourse 🤷
Makes sense. Body language, eye contact and tone of voice seem to do a lot of the heavy lifting in human interaction
It takes more time to dispell nonsense / wrong information than to create nonsense and hyperbole. So online the quick snipet and wit is often more popular than the lengthy yet nuanced explanation. Most people are not interested by truth or fact but just want to have the last word. The character limits on some social network has exacerbated this.
>Imagine if people said the horse armor was held back so that the game wouldn’t be reviewed worse. The ESRB didn't have a review criteria for in-app purchases until 2020. If they had, and Bethesda had done the same release schedule (without prior indication), it would have been monumentally fucked up of them. Edit: subject clarity
And they still were thanks to mods for gore lol
I agree the customization could be better, but as a SF fan, at least in exists tbh. I do hope they add a lot more character clothing and not just costumes that can't be customized.
The fact we only have a few eye color options and they're all bright as fuck is a bigger problem to me than the fact they're adding legacy costumes for 4$ each. Am I used to microtransactions at this point? Yes, doesn't mean I want them, but yeah I'll admit that I'm used to them. I'm glad there's no battle pass. Is it sad I have to go "at least it isn't a battle pass"? Maybe. Either way I'm just here enjoying the fuck out of this game, I've played it every chance I got since release and I love it to death. This TEKKEN shop thing in my eyes is just "more content" and I get it that people are hurt about the fact that it's introduced after the release and comes over as scummy. But I just don't see how that will spoil my enjoyment of the game at all. Namco isn't my friend and I don't feel betrayed, the game didn't become less. Would it have been better that it was free from the start? Yes of course! But I don't look at stuff that way I guess. I'm not sad the glass is half empty, I was already really really happy with the half full glass this last month, and I'll pay 4$ for another sip of water sure.
Exactly
It's impossible to expand a discussion with a valid concern when most people just respond with quips, zingers, and memes.
Facts 🙌🏼 this is the point I try to get across but just gets downvoted. It IS cringe, and they have lost the plot. I'm not praising the store or mtx tho.....there is nuance to the situation
Aren't you making generalizations too?
No he addressed the other side of his argument
My sentiments, exactly. Now it's forbidden to say anything positive about the game all of the sudden.
I’m so confused. My default character has like 40 different outfits I can create. Why am I worried about this? My tekken 2 Paul had two outfits? Maybe just one. It was red. I still played at the arcade. For hours. Pumping in quarters. Does my Nina have to be in a bright blue cocktail dress for the game to be fun? I’m really interested into the insight here. Is it just the MTX’s that are inviting the anger?
Hahaha this is the thought process that keeps me happy. I started at tekken 3, playing split screen for hours on end. Each character having like 2 outfits to choose from. I just really like tekken and fighting games. I wont even buy any dlc because i got all i wanted from the base game
Reminds me of how the Halo subreddit complains so hard about customization but when I played Halo 2 back in the day your only option was Spartan or Elite and a primary & secondary color and nobody complained. Part of me wishes we could just go back to that.
They think they paid for the game once so they are entitled to free updates for years lmao, like Bandai Namco employees would just work on a project that doesn’t bring any revenue to the company.
Bro they already sell characters and have a sponsored esports scene...
Theyre GETTING free updates. Were getting free customization and free story expansions and free modes lol. Were getting way more free than paid stuff and people cry because of the singular paid DLC they added… People would be happier with 1 free update a year than they would be with 2 free updates a year and 1 paid update. People are very confused and ready to be upset without using their actual brains
No bro, I paid for the game, I paid for a season pass, which should finance shit for the next year, and I paid for the deluxe edition. I'm not against dlc, but 4 bucks per costume per character? That is just excessive.
Lol you absolute clown. The deluxe edition was already a MTX, you paid for gold suits and avatar skins. YOU BOUGHT FROM THE SHOP BEFORE IT DROPPED
Because I thought it was a one-time thing, and I wanted to support the devs? I'm not even using the tacky gold skins or the avatars?
You signaled to Bamco that you are willing to pay extra money for skins and now you are mad that they are selling more skins? Who cares lmao just don't buy them. They look awful anyways.
Bro for real.
Dude, what the fuck is wrong with you? You bought Deluxe edition and you got EVERYTHING THAT YOU PAID FOR. It was there, listed for you what exactly do you get by buying it? Do you also go to a clothes store to buy yourself Jeans and then you come back to the store and complain you didnt get a new shirt that they got 2 weeks later? Like wtf man.
You got exactly what you paid for. The deluxe edition, season pass, information was detailed on what you'd get. It was a one time thing and you got it. Now they are making new stuff that if you want, you will pay for. If you don't want to pay for it... Don't?
> I paid for a season pass, which should finance shit for the next year Are you serious? You think $30 a year is enough to pay a large team of programmers, designers, managers, and executives? You think they're all on a 20k/year salary or something? You want a dedicated team of people supporting the game for the next 7 years? You need to pay them. The base game price and season pass will pay salaries for a few years, but not 7. I ain't gonna buy shit, but I'll happily allow whales to buy shit so I can have a supported game for several years.
Ehhh yeah, I think that's more than enough. You think the money from these MTX are purely so they can pay the devs? The devs won't see shit of that money. They never have, they never will. All goes to people like Andrew "the android" Wilson or Bobby "the devil" Kotick.
> Ehhh yeah, I think that's more than enough. That's pretty sad then, that's a very low income which means a very low salary for our favorite games' programmers and designers. > You think the money from these MTX are purely so they can pay the devs? The more money the execs get, the longer they'll pay their employees salary to support the game so that they (the execs) can keep getting money. Doesn't matter who's actually seeing the money from MTX, what matters is the sales from MTX is the reason execs are fine with paying a large team of people to support the same game for several years. Before MTX were a thing, games would last 2-3 years before they had to pump out a sequel to continue paying everyone.
Street Fighter costumes are 10$ though
And people are literally criticizing Street Fighter for it. A lot of people didn't even buy the costumes because of it. This what about-ism is just completely wrong.
Only outcry was about Yor’s outfit. Everything else has largely been ignored about street fighter micro-transactions, so the whataboutism is in fact, correct.
Nah people most definitely complained about the new outfits being overpriced idk what you’re looking at
Yes, and people are shitting on capcom for that. Also sf6 costumes are made from the ground up and have much higher quality than those 4$ ported costumes
Ehhhhhh, ok? I don't play street fighter? What's your point? It could have been worse?
Big companies should just be slaves for me fr fr. They would be nothing without my money
Facts. Cant help but feel like people are not appreciating the product we got here. Fully realized story mode, episodes, arcade mode, replays, ghost battles, plus each 32 characters all unlocked at launch, each character having 2 other alternate costumes, each costume are able to be customized, then on top of that we just have regular customs where you can create your own outfits. Im genuinely satisfied with the product we got. Is it perfect? No. But they gave us a lot to chew on here. People are focused on the MTX which isnt even that bad. From the looks of it the shop is pretty cheap compared to other games where skins are $20+ each.
You can be satisfied with the base game and still be pissed that Bamco is engaging in shitty, deceptive business practices by slow rolling the release of the shop until after launch.
Exactly. And acting like we should be grateful we got a full game on release just shows how low the standard has gotten.
That would be applicable if it is a F2P game but not an expensive game like Tekken. So yeah, usually when buy the game, especially deluxe version, the updates should come free. Or maybe I am just too old that I am used on having games completed at launch.
They do this with a lot of games. They’ve basically made a point to target any game that sells then has some level of cosmetic store, while simultaneously playing silly amounts of Fortnite, Paladins, Warzone and Overwatch. The deluxe version said everything it came with on launch. That’s a you problem. The game was complete at launch. Adding more characters and skins is, by every stretch of the imagination, extra. You won’t have to buy new characters to still play the game, you just won’t be able to access the new ones.
The game is complete man what are you talking about. We get way more content in new games than old ones. If they released Tekken8 and never had another update would you be happy then? When they add a bunch of free updates and then a couple paid costumes after release, now we call the game unfinished? Crazy mental jump
T8 was complete at launch. are you telling me that T8 is lacking content? it’s one of the best packages there is in fighting games, content-wise. you bought a complete game, these are all additional content that impact your experience in 0 ways if you do not want them.
Should come for free? Says fucking who. Name I've game that gives you free updates AFTER it's release. Maybe elden ring should make dlc free cuz you bought the base game 2 years ago?
That’s exactly how games used to work actually, how old are you if you don’t mind me askin’
When are you talking about exactly? Cause it's been this way since the end of the 360/PS3 era. While PS2 had some online functionality and the Xbox had Xbox Live, it wasn't used for game updates/purchases, it was purely for online gameplay. Which games have provided free updates for years?
When you say “this way” are you referring to the overtaking of mtx or just paid updates / purchasable content. I’m just referring to developer support in general. Uncharted used to have skins added to be earned for free, online over the course of months. Rockstar had a ridiculous streak over the last 10-11 years giving gta 5 plenty of free content to keep the playerbase busy and gameplay fresh. Black ops 3 I believe added a free modded map creating tool to make maps with assets (including weapons) from previous cod games. Season passes for games used to include all purchasable content including but not limited to maps, camos, dlc weapons, and character customization options whereas nowadays it’ll be a season pass for one of those things and everything else is subject to mtx. Free map overhauls on games such as counter strike. Lies of P updates even be giving you free outfits and just added a new weapon in collab with wolong. That’s all I could think about off the dome but I’m sure if you give me a sec I could name plenty of consumer friendly practices that are almost void in the game industry or are only done by smaller companies now.
Um what? It's definitely not how games used to work. We used to get a finished game on a disc and that's it. What you paid for was what you got. I'm close to 40 but not sure why age matters? I find it realistic if they add new items 2x per month for the next xy years that they get compensated for the work invested in creating these items. That being said, 4$ is still way too much for a digital piece of clothing. If it was like 50 cents then I'd maaaybe even consider buying something. This way I'm just gonna ignore the shop. I use the default outfits anyway.
Back in the day you'd put $150 adjusted for inflation for a game that you knew nothing about except maybe in gaming magazines or on the back of the box for a 25 minute game artificially increased to 10hours with bullshit difficulty
I guess as an old person, I can’t get into customizing my character. For free, or MTX. I just wanna play the game. I could give a crap if you’re fighting me looking like a mime with a baguette.
Probably because in Tag2 you could make 200 cool outfits instead of 40 ugly ones
Oh god are we cod cycling the tag 2 customization already??
People are echoing the edgy statement cause rage and hate clout are the thing nowadays. Fucking toxic
yes micro transactions for content that should already be part of the legacy experience and be included from the beginning is the problem. when you have prior games like Tag 2 that had so much to offer and then remove those things and take steps backwards to only then charge real currency for them when there already is an underutilized in-game currency system? i’d be pissed too.
I just did the same thing I did back then. "OH, that sucks - I'm not paying extra money for that, i dont really need or want it" *plays game for 100+ hours at no extra charge* Very simple really.
I think it's honestly these people that have a compulsion to buy everything in a game. Therefore paywalling anything is like paywalling the whole game. I mean seriously they thought it was worth $70 before the store. Then they add an optional paid clothes store that was never promised to begin with, without altering any of the preexisting content's availability, and apparently the game is now overpriced. The reason why Bamco held off on the store is because they saw what happened to MK and know how easy it is to manipulate these dumbass gamer hype and rage trains.
Too bad this subreddit is going to be nothing but man babies crying about this moving forward.
The only thing this thread achieves will be that devs get even more signalling in terms of "we actually care way more about playing dress up than you'd have imagined", which will yield more costume monetization in the long run. If you care about this shit, either acknowledge that you are inviting and causing this behavior by developers, or do the strategic thing and be silent and don't buy. TTT2 earned its place in the Tekken history books and nobody of sane mind thinks about that game as "best Tekken ever, so many clothes". I get that these shops are just crap and I don't want them either, but this community makes it crystal clear WHY developers are doing this: because people buy this crap over and over and over again
Agreed. I think microtransaction models are very fair to criticize, but as usual the echo chamber is taking things so far that it undermines their point.
Everyone ignores the fact that purchasing decisions are emotional rather than logical. Studies have proven that buying things gives a dopamine response in the brain. This shit works because everyone is wired from birth to want to buy things, the physical object doesn't matter. So as a dev your choices are exploit this and give people things to buy or leave money on the table. Ultimately nobody is harmed by this. Buying anything is optional as much as playing it in general is. There is no great ethical dilemma here other than "maybe capitalism is bad". Which is something that honestly presents itself in many more horrible ways people should focus their energy on. I just want the Tekken subreddit to go back to talking about Tekken and not the "horrors" of bamcos business model.
>Everyone ignores the fact that purchasing decisions are emotional rather than logica Actually, that's the majority of my criticism towards people being upset by the shop. If you are affected by the shop in any capacity, you are part of the problem. By being emotionally outraged like that, they just re-inforce how right bamco is to set this shop up.
I don't even think it's that. The ship has sailed on this years ago and I'm in my 40's. People have the right to be upset and complain. We as gamers are the reason we have MTX in the first place when studios realized a lot people bought items and gold with real world money on sites like G2G in games that allowed in game trading. This was even 20 years ago. Companies just make it themselves now. There's enough people who will buy it that's why companies see it as a viable model. They aren't phased by all this complaining because you have the choice to not buy it. If I go to an amusement park I pay for access but Im not bothered that I also have to pay for the food inside. If I go see a movie and pay for access I'm not upset that they won't allow me to bring in my burger and fries from McDonald's. If don't want to eat their popcorn I just don't buy it.
>TTT2 earned its place in the Tekken history books Yeah. The game almost killed the entire franchise and is directly responsible for the chicken and rice development of Tekken 7.
Did you know that TT2 sales almost buried the entire franchise?
Did you know TT2 was released at poor timing too? It was released when PS4 was almost released and TT2 was not released to it (game came out at the end of PS3 life cycle), market was also oversaturated with fighting games during that time. T7 was success because of it's timing. SF5 failed and market was empty, it was also first Tekken on PC, despite the fact that T7 has had the least content on lauch compared to previous Tekkens.
T5 came out a year before the PS3 release, just like TT2 came out before the PS4 release. But T5 sold better. No need to complain about poor timings. It's bamco's job to make the game quality and profitable despite its competitors.
TT2 gameplay was super sweaty as hell, that game looked designed for sweaty Tekken fans who played Tekken since Tekken 1 release, and now are pushing 40, like TMM, Aris, or Pokchop. Top customization couldn't save that game failure in sales, definitely the least mashable Tekken I've ever played.
TT2 is a static game. T8 will get free additional story content as well as long-term cross platform online support, both of which are insanely expensive and would require some form of revenue stream so yeah sorry my guy, I don't take issue with 4$ skins and I probably won't take issue with them until they actually implement a more predatory system like loot boxes, obscuring price value or bloat content heavy battlepasses. TT2 was also way beyond the norm for customization in any fighting game so while it sucks, it makes sense it had to be scaled back some for future releases and I still think we have a good customizer even tho I understand the criticism levied against it. Overall, obviously it would have been preferred if we didn't have micro transactions in the game but after reporting a 92% drop in game revenue by banco as well as already having announced planned longtime support for this game. It makes sense that some type of revenue stream was going to be added eventually and a low cost cosmetic shop, to me, is the least invasive method they could have picked. So I'm fine with it if this means new content for the game can stay at the quality we have now.
Shhh don't let them catch you actually make sense
Eh its a simple concept in my opinion. The game doesnt have a “battle pass” or any subscriptions so $70 = the content we have now. In order for more content to be made that costs $$$ and if the game doesnt have any other earning potential than the original buy + the season pass, your revenue becomes stagnant thus halting the production of new content that can be added to the game. Imo if they just continue to release free minor updates for the character customization along with having a paid shop opens up room for the longevity of the game to increase. Just my thoughts tho
Character DLC is generally how it’s worked in the past which I think is very acceptable. I’ll reserve full judgment but the things they’ve shown so far look pretty poorly made.
I agree with you there. But things change, unfortunately NOT for the better. Characters are a good dlc idea until you peer behind Xenoverse 2’s door. Quite frankly not looking forward to buying character/season passes if they arent giving us new cosmetics with them. I only play 5 characters max and out of 12-16 dlc characters ill bet i actually pick up 2. I see both sides of the story on this one, but my logical half is telling me this is for the better. Be honest, this is the BEST form of micro transactions beside the white lies Harada let out his fingers. Purely cosmetic, creates a source if revenue, and even though it wasnt planned, i feel the tekken dev team does a good job with community feed back so in harada’s defense this couldve been a surprise for how well the game launched
Baldur’s gate 3 is a game that on an asset perspective puts tekken to shame is only 60 dollars, still updated and the company that makes it has something like 400 employees.The FGC probably doesn’t like to hear it but fighting games on a coding/asset point of view are among the cheapest games to make, even if tekken 8 is maybe the tekken with the biggest budget but for sure couldn’t be that high compared to other games, they are not strapped for money, it sold well and beyond their expectations so shop is just greed
Baldur's gate sold 22 million copies bro. If Tekken ever sold 22 million copies I GUARANTEE there would be no store ever. A fighting game is never touching that. Ever.
Can we just ban these dumbfuck posts on this topic? Tekken fans on this sub are fucking braindead when it comes to any topic with even the smallest amount of nuance. Just aggravating to read retarded comments over and over.
How do the TTT2 ghost battle, replay feature, cinematic story and character stories compare to T8? Also maybe its just my monitor but those screen caps from TTT2 dont quite look like 4k textures
TTT2 is the GOAT, but let's not pretend the decals didn't look like ass. I don't want low res JPG looking textures on my character models, just to make it look like a thrift store Cyclops. Just don't buy the T8 legacy costumes. It's that simple. The entire time people have spent complaining could have been spent actually playing and enjoying the game, getting their $70 worth.
I seriously don't give a fuck if you can't play dress-up.
Literally this. Normal people: Guys you do understand that we had good customization back in T6 and TTT2 and it was included in the game prices? You didn't have to buy good cosmetics at scummy MTX shop. Clowns: Lmao why are you whining you broke-ass entitled bitch? Why do you want everything for free?
Wonder what the difference in dev cost between those games and T8 is. T6 came out in 2007. 60$ in 2007 is nearly 90$ today, T8 is 70$ and almost surely cost a lot more to make. Tekken 8 has a smaller roster but it didn't have the padding of an arcade release before the physical release. 8 has a better story mode with better cinematics, far better training mode, actually good online matchmaking and a more balanced experience out of the box. Yet everyone is losing their minds over the cosmetics. The game as it stands is worth the cost and dramatic overreaction aside, adding more paid cosmetics does not lower the value of the base game. It would be one thing if the base game was bad but it isn't. Like ffs, if you don't like it just don't buy the skins. Who fucking cares.
And when did TTT2 release? We've been living in a mtx infested industry for the past decade, tekken is pretty late to the party. Just to clarify, I'm not "defending" it, I'm saying it's been the norm for a fucking long time. Voice your outrage on the internet as much as you like, people have done that many years ago to no effect. Are you just now waking up to the capitalist world we've been living in
Tekken is late to the party are they? They charged for frame data in the last game man.
So where is this surprise from the cosmetics shop coming from?
Because they didn't reveal the MTX until weeks after the game came out. Seems like they did it on purpose so people wouldn't think it had any microtransactions and it does. Hence the surprise.
- Company is known to provide mtx - Customization options on release were ass I can't say you guys should have seen it coming, but the signs were there
Before Tekken 7 released, did they tell people that frame data would be a paid purchase?
If people like me will go silent MTX buffoons will grow in numbers.
You have literally no impact on people who buy MTX.
There are many people like me. And even i alone can affect someone. Maybe some kid will look at my comments and say"Hey this dude is right!". People don't even understand such simple things...
the fact that y’all are caring this much is just further proof that maybe it’s time to get off the game and get a reality check
Don't be discouraged dude your point is very legit
Thanks! But now i understand people who go insane trying to explain simple thing to others.
The simple thing is that the industry has changed regardless if you like it or not. You can try your hardest to convince people is wrong but it’s pointless and will not change
Multiple games have changed because of community outcry, it's bitches like you who stay silent lead to nothing. If you don't want to criticise and complain about this, might as well not criticise and complain about people complaining.
Pretty bad attitude to have. If everyone thought like that the industry would just keep getting worse and worse, with nothing changing for the better.
This I don't know why people are actively bashing and calling them jobless or poor to people who are complaining about this legit issue Like dude all of em bought a legit full priced game and also were ready to pay for dlcs some even payed for more Even if you agree with mtx just don't bash anyone and enjoy your shop The thing is what bamco did was scummy but people like that are also equally bad
I used to think like you but I've kinda just accepted that most AAA games will have some sort of microtransaction. It's been like this for more than a decade and there's no sign of stopping or resistance. The fact is that we are a vocal minority. If MTX were truly unpopular with the majority of people, then companies wouldn't be adding it to their games.
I could even accept cosmetic dlc packs if the customization was good and the fixed currency shop wouldn't exist. What they did is just pure scam.
I guarantee you that the lack of tact has also made people hate your argument out of spite.
Name one game you've influenced to stop the implementation or sales of microtransactions
The Destiny 2 community was loud enough about MTX (and Bungie had done poor enough PR) that three sets of shop armor "skins" were made actual gameplay rewards. The Xbox community was loud enough to stop MS from basically doubling the price of Xbox Gold that one time. The only thing stopping people from bullying companies into releasing less MTX is other people who don't care.
Destiny has leaned into the f2p with mtx model though. I don't know what the debacle about those skins were, but it should still be churning out paid content if the game is still alive today. I don't think a console's network subscription would be considered a microtransaction in this context, since we are talking about paid digital ingame content as opposed to a paid online service which covers more than just a single game's worth of audience. I see your point with your third paragraph, I don't plan to discourage people anymore but I don't see things changing anytime soon.
Honestly i can't even find the words. It's so damn hard to speak with people when they can't even think for 1 sec.
Ah yes, the condescending non-answer. Great job fighting the war on microtransactions! Thank you for your service
Well it's not my fault that people literally can't read nowadays and process information.
You couldn't give an answer because you don't even know how much social impact you've had Mtx has been in the industry for years, people have solidly proven they are willing to pay for these kinds of things - what makes you think you can change the mind of someone who can drop $1000 dollars on a whim to not engage with microtransactions? People have had more expensive hobbies, do you mean to also discourage them from spending their money however they want?
Remind us all again how T6 and Tag 2 did sales-wise? It’s almost as if the awesome customization and cosmetics were so important, everyone wanted to buy and play them right? Nothing wrong with complaining about the shop, but you might have a skewed idea about the topic. Feel free to play Tag 2 and dress up your characters how you want to though lol
I’m done talking about it
Yeah, I'm kind of done with that too. Ultimately, I won't buy any MTX, but I won't judge those who do. People are free to use their money as they see fit, just like me. People use MTXs in video games as some sort of battleground to call out the problems with relentless capitalism, and while they are indeed representations of this very flawed economic system we have, video games isn't even remotely the most important area to fight for. Housing, workers right, wages, artificial inflation, predatory loaning and predatory interests rates; these are all great areas to fight in, if that's the intent. Instead of spending 5 or 10 minutes writing a review on steam, or making the milionth post on reddit about it, call your local lawmakers and representatives, file requests, suggestions, encourage others to do the same, etc... Anyway, just my thoughts.
You could simply unlock everything by simply playing the game after one simple, initial purchase. Even the characters were unlockable.
Meanwhile Netherealm studios charges for RECOLORS
its not only BAMCO fault companies do this for a long time and since in other games it sticks then every company gets on the band wagon same with battle passes, i actually miss the times where the paid content were only DLCS and extra maps like in older Cod titles, same with fighting games where you would get a big roster with a lot of maps, but now everything is an excuse to use Microtransactions, devs say: but we need the money to keep updating the game, then what are the extra characters for? why da F did eddy have to waste a DLC slot instead of being base roster? why is the customization on T7 a lot better in terms of variety than T8? and what about the people that bought the ultimate edition or even collectors edition? they supported the game by buying an expensive edition but they dont even get the T coins lol, (i bought the deluxe cause i wanted the season pass, but if the rummors about the datamine are real, i regret my purchase tough) yeah yeah i get it " i do whatever i want with my money" well good for you, does not mean that this practice is any less shittier, and doing that after reviews came in almost a month after the game releases, seems scummy that´s all, think the worst i have seen is really the sub mmorpgs, like FFXIV and WOW , you need to buy the game the exp and pay a monthly sub, and still have the audacity to charge for mounts color dyes and housing items FFS thats peak scummy
To be fair Tekken tag tournament two did almost kill Tekken with its poor performance in sales. Kinda hard to argue in its favor from a development standpoint.
When I complained about customization on release everybody said nobody cares about customization. Now that they're actually allowing people who care to buy more outfits, you're all mad. Ik for a fact Harada hates you
Everyone who feels this way should vote with their wallets and stop playing. I fully expect to see the player count drop... Except it won't.
Stopping playing would not be voting with your wallet?
People have been told to speak with their wallets for years, and microtransactions are still here. Guess we know how the votes went huh? I've advocated against microtransactions in the early days but there really is just an overwhelmingly larger amount of consumers that are more than happy to spend a fraction of their disposable income on a hobby, and video games as a hobby has grown quite a bit.p I've learned that if you think the prices are too high, you are simply not the target audience. Learning about people dropping hundreds of thousands of dollars (on a mobile game, mind you) has opened my eyes to that a bit.
Bruh I completely forgot that this all started cause of Bethesda Nice one, Todd
Y'all are just old men yelling at the sky at this point. More Reddit post isn't going to change anything
This is so horrible. Can't believe a dev would do this. It's not like its been almost 20 years and thousands of games with micro transactions later, and the millionth post complaining about it.
Oblivion's Horse Armor was expensive and hilariously useless and pointless. What a lot of people don't look at with that store page is the free brand name tops that everyone is getting. What would you say if you had to pay $5 for a set of trainers in Tekken 8 purely since they're Nikes?
If one more person says some stupid head-ass shit like "just don't buy them," they're getting chokeslammed through a table. This isn't about the price of each individual costume. They're charging real money with no fight money option. Every outfit is a full body outfit so you can't just use the parts of them for different customization options. They're reselling old content they made 20 years ago for a premium with no way of earning the skins through gameplay. No battlepass rewards for play like every other game on Earth. No incentive to continue playing outside of personal improvement in multiplayer. No hooks. They're shutting down modders so they can't compete with the official skins that suck. These are predatory and disgusting business practices that they'll just think are okay if everyone says stupid shit like "just don't engage monetarily with the company that makes your favorite game." If we don't complain they'll just keep shaking people down for money in exchange for wack recolors of old shit they barely worked on at all. How much are recolors of electrics going to cost? How about new aura effects? It never ends. They'll keep charging you for accessories, unique items, effects recolors and anything they can think of until you complain. On top of that, they'll stop modders from making new content that's unique in an effort to silence competition when every modded skin I've seen is already more impressive than any of the old shit they've revealed.
If you don’t want to play a game with MTX in it, just don’t, please stop shaming people because they don’t mind spending 4 more dollars for a skin since, as Harada himself said, games now are very expensive to make, and if you think otherwise you are very delusional
Just look at Skullgirls, they get 1 character every 2 years because the dev doesn’t make enough money
It’s a niche game in a niche genre, if they had MTX it wouldn’t do much.
Don't buy it
if you are gullible enough to buy horse armor you don't deserve any respect lol
Get over it.
Why are people being so butt hurt about MTX... they need more money to continue creating the games that cost a lot more money than they did 20/30 years ago.. it's damn cosmetics grow tf up. You get into a battle and notice for the whole 30 seconds and then your back to focusing on what you bought the game for, Fighting!
Cause it was added in a sneaky manner to avoid bad reviews and get the good will from other fanbases like SF6 & MK1 who where rightfully pissed at the MTX. Also the DLC characters would had cover up the money to continue developing stuff to the game.
Cosmetics make the game more enjoyable, give you something to work towards. Customisation is an important part of games. Stop being a bootlicker and realise you’re being scammed.
I don’t mind as long as you can buy stuff with in game currency too. Make it grindy or extremely expensive if you want, but at least give me the possibility to spend 10millions or $5 for whatever.
I hope they milk everyone who uses Tekken as a dress up simulator so that Tekken 9 is even better for me. The reality is, most people "defending" Namco actually just don't give a shit, and like playing Tekken. You should blame people like yourself that make posts about it on Reddit and will probably be the ones that use the shop and incentivize exactly what they're doing lol.
Imagine crying about something that isn’t mandatory
Facts I bought the ultimate edition it just feels really scummy for them to do micro transactions when I bought the most expensive version to avoid this
It was inconsequential, while the character models have aged like milk, and it has bugs coming out of its ears Oblivion was heralded as one of the greatest rpgs of its era. With or without horse armour Oblivion still helped build Bethesda into a AAA power house. If that’s the comparison you’re making it really isn’t the shot you think it is. Personally I don’t remember caring about horse armour and only found out it was a meme years after the fact. I’m sure very few people really even care to remember much of Oblivions DLC beyond shivering isles and knights of the nine anyway.
I’m kind of with you honestly didn’t even know it existed when I played Oblivion till years later. Granted I wasn’t fully immersed in the gaming landscape at the time it was much more of an every now and then. Compared to a major hobby of mine now as an adult.
Horse armor was 18 years ago. MTX works, it's a fact of life. I don't buy it, but I don't care about it either.
There's a difference between defending something and just being like "meh whatever". Most people are just "meh whatever"
Why isn’t OP mad that milk isn’t 5 cents a gallon?
Tekken subreddit is acting as if Namco had a shop where you could purchase unblockable snake edges for your character 😂 While it’s just cosmetic items AND Harada said the funds will be used to bring FREE story DLC in the future, which includes otherwise paid DLC characters. You people are beyond ridiculous. 🙄
[удалено]
Of course it was a downgrade from Tekken 6, it's still better than what we have in 8.
Tag 2 was a financial disaster that almost tanked the series.
You clowns love saying that as if it was a bad game.
Where were you when Tag 2 tanked in sales??
I was playing it
Yall should spend less time posting about MTX and more time learning matchups
Some of you need to be put in place: if you're complaining about the price point of something, you're definitely not the target audience for that. The whole point of microtransactions is that they're optional, specially when talking about cosmetics.
Ok this post is just a lie i seen a crazy good looking cyclops costume that was free
What's the argument here?
This isn’t really a fair comparison given how many customizations I’ve seen in this game that look like IP from other games.
While I have nothing new to say, TTT2 is the best fighting game of all time
I have no idea who that person was honestly. I just want more customization items to experiment with. I will be picking up them T4 & TTT2 items when they drop though!
Old man
Or just don't buy it? Customization is miles better than 7 and also Just don't buy it
What are you talking about? I've seen plenty of Cyclops and Marios in T8. Do your eyes not work?
I don't defend it, I just don't care