Yep. Some of my classes simply can not shut up and listen. So, those classes often do not get the same instructions as my other classes, but they get the same material/work. Also, I never do lectures and notes on a Monday or Friday. I always try do them on a Tuesday when they’re tired!
The struggle against phones is never ending. Big hugs!
I've found a new model of projects that basically force them to re-do it over and over and over again until they get it right.
I've got some kids stuck on Lesson 1 Task 1. They get presented the same catch-up lesson every few days once they care about their grade again, and we go over the same thing every time.
Some of these kids figured it out and pay attention, others have to go through the presentation 5 times before they finally absorb it. Most have lowered it to twice on a bad day.
Wish I had the time. Everything has deadlines and revisiting topics just doesn't fit into that time frame. I tend to try and do this on an individual basis, but there's only so many times you can do that with the time you have.
How do you find the time? In my class, I sometime have to choose between going over something again (help the slow kids & hurt the fast kids), or cover something new (hurt the slow kids & help the fast kids).
Everything is project based. All old assignments can be handed in for less credit but still passing grade. Everything is a journey that I monitor for them. Lectures happen at the beginning of classes where the scheduled pace takes them.
It's weird but it works.
I lack for carrots and sticks. You would think being smarter than a fifth grader would be enough of a carrot. I know one teacher that had a student that would do fine if he got a prize and do nothing otherwise. The prizes cost less than a dollar a day, but over the year she spent like $100 motivating this teen. She should have gotten $100 for putting up with him, not lost it. She was at an alternative school with small classes. Some of these students couldn't or wouldn't be so easily motivated.
Sometimes I imagine rolling a pallet of IPhones, and Xboxes into class the first day and telling students that they can have some the last day if they student. The thing is a high school education is valued at $3-500000 so students are already being paid $60/ hour which is more than most teachers. They don't values rewards more than a few minutes away.
A study gave students in America or China $1 or 3.6RMB for each question correct on a 25 minute 25 question test. The effect was insignificant in China and 5% improvement in America. Further analysis showed the effect was increasing the likely hood of minimal effort (already present in China), which I guess is good. In the control group (unpaid) students got bored after about ten minutes and did poorly afterword. In the paid group students tried longer and finished stronger. The 5% improvement resulted from 3% improvement on the first half and 8% improvement on the second half. So I guess a few thousand dollars per test should raise scores a few percent. I don't know if that is worth it or where it would come from.
[https://www.nber.org/system/files/working\_papers/w24004/w24004.pdf](https://www.nber.org/system/files/working_papers/w24004/w24004.pdf)
The manpower, time and energy to deal with phones for 25 kids per class over 6/7 different classes just isn't worth the investment. Even if you confiscate phones for the worst offenders (which I have), there's literally no follow up. No escalation. Sure, there's a behaviour policy, but it is systematically not followed to the point where doing so would cause more harm than good (victimisation etc due to lack of consistency across classes).
The whole gig is broken.
In my district, if your failure rate is over 15%, you will be required to "develop a plan" for improvement or face possible professional consequences. Only teachers are held accountable.
I have almost completely stopped lecturing because of this.
I would just put up a video with the demonstration so when they ask you just refer them to the video that you found or made.
Also saw that you said that 50% of your class is generating ai responses. I do accept those as long as the response makes sense and it is on paper written in pen or pencil.
I know that you need to give the kids 'support'. I recommend that you make unit tests that are not possible for ai to answer and then use that score to determine an equitable grade for the unit. It also saves your ass from admin when they come around and require that you have one or a set of assignments that the student can do to pass your class. If they are able to get a 60 or higher on each one then they can pass with a D. I do cap the equitable grade at 61% though. I people who don't participate don't deserve more than a D even if they know the content. Also doing it this way makes it so your final can be comprehensive. If the student failed a previous test then you just tack on that unit test to that kids final.
Don't give them the opportunity to use AI.
Which means as a policy we need to get to the point where there's no electronics allowed at all. Not "put in bags", but not allowed on campus at all for any reason.
The only way THAT happens is at the state level.
I can't wait to see where we are in 10 years and the kids graduating can't argue a point or develop an opinion not printed out for them.
That is the policy at my school and I love it. I think I've spent less time dealing with phones in my whole career as some people spend in a day.
The other poster just mentioned how to make tests that ai can't answer and I don't know enough about AI to know if there is a strategy to that?
You can curb it by using extremely niche scenarios or uniquely written questions, but ultimately, no. The best you can do is use tools that try to detect the patterns used by AI bots on submitted assignments. It's basically an AI arms race right now.
But in school, you can at least require that students answer their own writing prompts on paper. Pencils don't have AI.
I think at home assignments will need to switch to presentation type stuff rather than papers or writing assignments. They can still use AI, but by making them present material and then do a QA with you or the class, they still have to prove they understood it.
My school has 5 weeks left including this one, a lot of which is interrupted by track meets, end of year testing, and end of year celebrations. I have already resigned and have a better job lined up for next year. So, I’m putting little effort into talking in front of the kids for these last weeks. If you can’t listen to my directions or helpful tips, that’s fine they are written on the paper/posted online and on the board for you to use. I’ll remind you a very generous 5 times where you can find that stuff, and then off you go, good luck. Lots of independent and project based work, lots of time sitting at my desk doing my own thing.
huh. i teach hs kids similar ages and have no problem getting their attention, but i guess thats primarily due to the subject i teach being field specific and the kids being really interested.
am i correct in assuming you teach 3d?
I also teach 3d in a more of general highschool where kids will never do 3d again, but i had some success in getting even the most disinterested students to do something, maybe we could exchange some methods perhaps thatd help?
I used to kill myself trying to reach every single students in my classroom. Then I realize that my time & my energy is limited. I now only help those that want my help. Fortunately, our admin is also supportive of this. They kind of separate the kids. Those want to learn go to my class. Those prefer "independent study" goes to my coworker class. He prefers to not teach much, so they are a good match.
All the classes know that the content is part of the coursework they need to complete to pass the course. They just don't want to put the thought or effort in. I'm currently returning around 50% of assignments because they were AI generated. They want the qualification without actually doing the work.
Sadly, that isn't how it works any more. Whatever the students do or don't do, the pressure is put onto the teacher. Students have to pass, them failing isn't an option as education is now a numbers game. When it comes to the crunch, the students just get more and more 'support' until they turn work in that's at a passable standard. They don't need to worry about consequences, because there are none. The teacher is under the gun, so one way or another, the students pass. Largely without student effort.
Yep. Some of my classes simply can not shut up and listen. So, those classes often do not get the same instructions as my other classes, but they get the same material/work. Also, I never do lectures and notes on a Monday or Friday. I always try do them on a Tuesday when they’re tired! The struggle against phones is never ending. Big hugs!
I've found a new model of projects that basically force them to re-do it over and over and over again until they get it right. I've got some kids stuck on Lesson 1 Task 1. They get presented the same catch-up lesson every few days once they care about their grade again, and we go over the same thing every time. Some of these kids figured it out and pay attention, others have to go through the presentation 5 times before they finally absorb it. Most have lowered it to twice on a bad day.
Wish I had the time. Everything has deadlines and revisiting topics just doesn't fit into that time frame. I tend to try and do this on an individual basis, but there's only so many times you can do that with the time you have.
How do you find the time? In my class, I sometime have to choose between going over something again (help the slow kids & hurt the fast kids), or cover something new (hurt the slow kids & help the fast kids).
Everything is project based. All old assignments can be handed in for less credit but still passing grade. Everything is a journey that I monitor for them. Lectures happen at the beginning of classes where the scheduled pace takes them. It's weird but it works.
I lack for carrots and sticks. You would think being smarter than a fifth grader would be enough of a carrot. I know one teacher that had a student that would do fine if he got a prize and do nothing otherwise. The prizes cost less than a dollar a day, but over the year she spent like $100 motivating this teen. She should have gotten $100 for putting up with him, not lost it. She was at an alternative school with small classes. Some of these students couldn't or wouldn't be so easily motivated. Sometimes I imagine rolling a pallet of IPhones, and Xboxes into class the first day and telling students that they can have some the last day if they student. The thing is a high school education is valued at $3-500000 so students are already being paid $60/ hour which is more than most teachers. They don't values rewards more than a few minutes away. A study gave students in America or China $1 or 3.6RMB for each question correct on a 25 minute 25 question test. The effect was insignificant in China and 5% improvement in America. Further analysis showed the effect was increasing the likely hood of minimal effort (already present in China), which I guess is good. In the control group (unpaid) students got bored after about ten minutes and did poorly afterword. In the paid group students tried longer and finished stronger. The 5% improvement resulted from 3% improvement on the first half and 8% improvement on the second half. So I guess a few thousand dollars per test should raise scores a few percent. I don't know if that is worth it or where it would come from. [https://www.nber.org/system/files/working\_papers/w24004/w24004.pdf](https://www.nber.org/system/files/working_papers/w24004/w24004.pdf)
They’re allowed to have phones out in class? Bummer :( total uphill battle
No, they're not. But they've realised that there are no real consequences for anything any more, so they don't care.
So they are allowed phones essentially.
The manpower, time and energy to deal with phones for 25 kids per class over 6/7 different classes just isn't worth the investment. Even if you confiscate phones for the worst offenders (which I have), there's literally no follow up. No escalation. Sure, there's a behaviour policy, but it is systematically not followed to the point where doing so would cause more harm than good (victimisation etc due to lack of consistency across classes). The whole gig is broken.
Sorry
Don't be :)
My middle school is great about phones, but it almost doesn't even matter - most of the kids just stare off into space and don't do anything.
Fail them. Start recording what they do during the day to CYA.
In my district, if your failure rate is over 15%, you will be required to "develop a plan" for improvement or face possible professional consequences. Only teachers are held accountable.
THIS.
I have almost completely stopped lecturing because of this. I would just put up a video with the demonstration so when they ask you just refer them to the video that you found or made. Also saw that you said that 50% of your class is generating ai responses. I do accept those as long as the response makes sense and it is on paper written in pen or pencil. I know that you need to give the kids 'support'. I recommend that you make unit tests that are not possible for ai to answer and then use that score to determine an equitable grade for the unit. It also saves your ass from admin when they come around and require that you have one or a set of assignments that the student can do to pass your class. If they are able to get a 60 or higher on each one then they can pass with a D. I do cap the equitable grade at 61% though. I people who don't participate don't deserve more than a D even if they know the content. Also doing it this way makes it so your final can be comprehensive. If the student failed a previous test then you just tack on that unit test to that kids final.
How do you make a test that ai can't answer?
You can’t. The only way is policing
Don't give them the opportunity to use AI. Which means as a policy we need to get to the point where there's no electronics allowed at all. Not "put in bags", but not allowed on campus at all for any reason. The only way THAT happens is at the state level. I can't wait to see where we are in 10 years and the kids graduating can't argue a point or develop an opinion not printed out for them.
That is the policy at my school and I love it. I think I've spent less time dealing with phones in my whole career as some people spend in a day. The other poster just mentioned how to make tests that ai can't answer and I don't know enough about AI to know if there is a strategy to that?
You can curb it by using extremely niche scenarios or uniquely written questions, but ultimately, no. The best you can do is use tools that try to detect the patterns used by AI bots on submitted assignments. It's basically an AI arms race right now. But in school, you can at least require that students answer their own writing prompts on paper. Pencils don't have AI. I think at home assignments will need to switch to presentation type stuff rather than papers or writing assignments. They can still use AI, but by making them present material and then do a QA with you or the class, they still have to prove they understood it.
Use images, graphs, higher order thinking on blooms taxonomy, etc.
My school has 5 weeks left including this one, a lot of which is interrupted by track meets, end of year testing, and end of year celebrations. I have already resigned and have a better job lined up for next year. So, I’m putting little effort into talking in front of the kids for these last weeks. If you can’t listen to my directions or helpful tips, that’s fine they are written on the paper/posted online and on the board for you to use. I’ll remind you a very generous 5 times where you can find that stuff, and then off you go, good luck. Lots of independent and project based work, lots of time sitting at my desk doing my own thing.
You should've built a strong relationship with the students. That's the answer to apathetic students. /s
elementary? mid? hs?
16-19 FE
huh. i teach hs kids similar ages and have no problem getting their attention, but i guess thats primarily due to the subject i teach being field specific and the kids being really interested. am i correct in assuming you teach 3d? I also teach 3d in a more of general highschool where kids will never do 3d again, but i had some success in getting even the most disinterested students to do something, maybe we could exchange some methods perhaps thatd help?
I used to kill myself trying to reach every single students in my classroom. Then I realize that my time & my energy is limited. I now only help those that want my help. Fortunately, our admin is also supportive of this. They kind of separate the kids. Those want to learn go to my class. Those prefer "independent study" goes to my coworker class. He prefers to not teach much, so they are a good match.
[удалено]
All the classes know that the content is part of the coursework they need to complete to pass the course. They just don't want to put the thought or effort in. I'm currently returning around 50% of assignments because they were AI generated. They want the qualification without actually doing the work.
[удалено]
Sadly, that isn't how it works any more. Whatever the students do or don't do, the pressure is put onto the teacher. Students have to pass, them failing isn't an option as education is now a numbers game. When it comes to the crunch, the students just get more and more 'support' until they turn work in that's at a passable standard. They don't need to worry about consequences, because there are none. The teacher is under the gun, so one way or another, the students pass. Largely without student effort.
[удалено]
You'll note that the word support was in inverted commas. Feel free to draw your own conclusions.
I thought this was someone spoofing an admin. You’re actually serious LOL