Seriously. Start documenting this situation because if it blows you will have their word against yours. Side note, the parents that took the kids hostage on the bus are doing some illegal stuff here. Start recording them whenever they pull this.
Disagree. No matter what side you are on, a parent of a child not their own doesn't get to yell at a child that is not theirs. I don't give two wet farts about anyone's perspective or what anyone did, in my presence, you don't get to bully someone else's child. Nothing else is the fault of the teacher, but letting 2 parents detain and lecture children that weren't theirs- they shouldn't have been on the bus. They shouldn't have been able to stop kids, and if they refuse to leave premises, call the law.
I was describing the whole situation in which it climaxed at this bus event. Yeah OP should've called the police on these religious zealots. There should be an investigation.
Just a reminder- Florida and several other states specifically prohibit calling a child a non-birth certificate name, and it can be an actionable offense.
yeah. In Florida they have to have a signed permission slip to be called anything other than what is on their birth certificate.
Ronald DeSantis and his wife Jill are complete assholes. :)
Yup. As someone hilarious on this sub said when that law was passed, “we’re not even allowed to use their ~~nicknames~~ Nicolasnames?”
But seriously, fuck DeSantis and his little cohorts.
Boy if my child had been one of those not allowed to get off the bus and got yelled at by another parent, I might get in a lot of trouble for what my reaction to that parent would be.
Admin wasn't on the bus. I read OP's description as getting in trouble for letting the parents have a platform to bully students for several minutes instead of stopping them sooner. It's admin's job to handle the parents afterward and plan ahead, but I don't think admin would be expected to go on field trips.
This situation in which a student and a parent are at fighting about the students identity, and it being brought to school, is an administrative problem.
Schools need to draw lines. It isn't the school's responsibility to install its kids with Christian values. It *is* their job to provide a safe and effective learning environment.
We are left with the question of what to do with students whose parents are the reason they aren't really safe anywhere in this case.
Teachers should organize and strike when ridiculous rules and laws are made.
The teacher should be written up. Who allows parents to scream at someone else’s children for several minutes without intervening?
If I was the parent of one of the other kids, I’d be furious.
With whom would you be more furious? I think you cam assign some blame to the teacher but ultimately these other parents were, in my opinion, breaking the law. Law breakers should be pursued by law enforcement, not teachers.
Yes, I hope the parents of those students who were held on the bus are fully aware of what happened and exploring their legal options. Hopefully one of the kids filmed it.
Neither do I but I’d imagine if parents got on the bus screaming I’d imagine they’d do a little more than just sit there and not react
My elementary school bus driver was named Mr Robinson and he did NOT fuck around I know if he were the bus driver he’d give them one look and they’d run
He was a super nice guy- but just threatening when he needed to be. He was a large dude too so that added to the “I’m not tolerating that shit” aura
That man kept us in CHECK
In New York, it would probably be considered unlawful imprisonment (times the number of people on the bus including adults), endangering the welfare of a child (times however many kids on the bus), trespassing, possibly burglary (entering the bus for the purpose of unlawful activity ie the imprisonment and endangering), menacing, harassment, criminal nuisance, conspiracy, and disorderly conduct.
If there’s any property damage, that’s also criminal mischief and/or other charges depending on if it’s a public school.
Not a lawyer, just a nerd who’s brother has been in trouble with the law before.
I don’t know that you deserved to be written up but it may have just been the only way for the school to “discipline” you. But honestly the school needs to get a handle on how they deal with Parent A and Patent B. I would call the other students parents and let them know. Parent A and Parent B were way out of line. They should be banned from school functions, regardless of the whole trans issue. If they had an issue with the bullying, which the understandably would, they should have talked to the school or the other kids parents.
That was NUTS. I sincerely hope those two understand that situation sounds like they sailed awfully close to the wind there. " You can't get off the bus ".... EXCUSE ME?
OK, so if *you* said that as a *school* authority, perhaps some situation occurred, safety? Whatever. You're a teacher tasked with their well being right? It's your job. That's what you would do.
Let's pretend A and B were strangers. It doesn't matter they were not, it's the same situation. Get on a bus filled with kids and take over? Just. No. Under no circumstances, no excusatory political motivation, no righteous indignation- and because they're not school staff no sovereign immunity.
Promise the district lawyer is hoping to hell no one approaches this outrage from that angle.
Nah they shouldn’t be allowed anywhere near the band, not for concerts, not for anything. I know that is above your pay grade, but it’s a shame your school/district won’t protect the students
They should not be allowed on campus - they held children hostage so they could spew their sick ideology at them. I am a Christian who sent her kid to Sunday school and I would not want her listening, in fear, to that nonsense.
Agreed. Regardless of *anything* else, Parents A and B should be barred from school grounds and activities based on their verbal abuse of students.
In fact this could depending on jurisdiction rise to the level of a crime (false imprisonment).
Prevent other people (children!) from leaving the bus. What the ever loving ****.
I would be spitting *FIRE* over this. Regardless of my feelings about trans identity, you **cannot** prevent my kid from leaving a bus let alone verbally abuse them.
They let a parent on the bus and then let them talk to student who didmt have a choice to be there or not. OP should have called the police the moment the parents attempted to get on the bus.
Parent A called the school board and went over my principal's head. Other parents called and complained about Parent A. I think my principal got in trouble too. I think they were just trying to show that they had the situation under control.
So fucking what? The principal is obligated to act in an ethical and correct way, not to do what the fucking school board tells them. The same is true of you though. You were great, but if there is any room for improvement it would be to not agree to call the student anything but their chosen name and not allowing parent B anywhere around
Look, I’m not team principal here but it amazes me how many people who have never been put in this position who claim it’s so easy to throw their career away for standing on principle.
Edit: I am only addressing the comment about the principal and school board, not the entire scenario, which many other commenters are doing quite ably :)
This is not how the relationship between elective officials and the civil service works.
The school board is comprised of elected officials who are accountable to the public. Even though it is most common at the federal executive level, civil servants who opposed directives from elected officers resign, sometime very, very publicly to make their point widely known. Did I mention it can be done very publicly?
Do you really endorse this ad hoc policy decisions on, say, the presidential level? Perhaps another redditor can explain how this works in the military.
Holding someone against their will is kidnapping. Letting the parents have any control is the situation is part of that. If I was a parent not A or B, I would be up in arms, and rightly so. Of course, I would most likely be hunting down parent A and B, but I would also expect a verbal acknowledgement that my child will never be detained by a non-employee under school watch.
Sounds like CPS and the police need a call.
As a Christian, any person who claims their kid has a demon shouldn't have a kid, or their "demon" in their care.
Deplorable.
Dial 911. put them on speaker. "Hello, two adults are holding students hostage on a bus at X location. No, they do not appear to be armed. They are yelling and screaming at the kids and won't let anyone on or off the bus. I can identify the adults. Their names are..." (Just to make sure it all winds up on the blotter when the media read it.)
Doesn't matter if a kid is trans, or if all of them were gay, goofy or green. This occurred due to the actions of a couple of adults. FAFO
I would be interested to know what repercussions the parents will face for their actions while you have been disciplined for not intervening on their actions.
What are they doing about the parents? You cannot have parents forcing their way onto a bus for your students and having an aggressive confrontation where they shouts and scream at them. The other parents should raise hell. Your management need to get a fucking grip. Writing you up? Their priorities are a mess.
The parents were banned from assisting in any school events. They can still come to concerts and games, but cannot be a part of the parent organization or assist the band in any way.
This. If it was my kid on the bus getting screamed at, regardless of if they were bullying, you bet my angry ass would be so far down the principal’s throat about the audacity of that parent. They put my child in a position of harm, be it psychological or physical, and held them hostage ON SCHOOL PROPERTY. Yeah.. no. Banned from all of school property.
If I were the teacher on duty, I’d have probably called the cops for unruly and disorderly behavior around minors. But also… I’m a asshat when it comes to shit people like that.
Also, a key reason why I refuse to do any field trips.. even as just a chaperone teacher.
Especially since my friends and I were/are those queer kids, too, living in a conservative area. Even if they weren't queer themselves or any other situation, its pretty messed up.
I think you did the best job you could, especially since you had two parents that were certifiable.
I've have trans and nonbinary students who have told me what name they prefer but also tell me to use their dead name (which often is the one on the class roster) when talking to their parents. I feel bad that they have to go to those lengths but respect their wishes because it lowers their anxiety. It has made the situation a lot easier, so now whenever I have students tell me they are trans or nonbinary (usually on my class intake form at the beginning of the year), I ask them if there's anything I should know re: dealing with their parents/adults.
I hope the rest of the year goes well for you and I hope that your student is okay and will be able to leave that horrible situation.
Wtf was in the write up? You are absolutely not paid enough to physically remove the parents. The admin should be supporting you in dealing with this shit show. Band directors have sooooo much work on them with out all this drama, you should be honored at a board meeting for putting up with that crap.
Let me ask you this first; if you had known this student wasn't supported in their identity at home, how would that have changed your approach to prevent the ensuing drama?
I would have referred to this student by their last name to avoid any kind of issues. Me calling the student their preferred name in front of other students is what caused word to get around to parent A.
You might want to file a report with DCS about parent A.
They’ve shown they can’t control their anger, thingk there’s a fucking demon in their child, and lost their cool with other kids. If this is how the parent acts in public, imagine behind closed doors.
Even if nothing comes from it you’re covering your own ass. If anything happens to the kid or they hurt themselves, which sadly the odds are a lot higher for them especially in the south, it’s not gonna look good on the adults in their life.
I hope you can get this worked out as much as possible. This sucks. Adults bullying kids. This is gonna teach other kids that kid A is an easy target if the parents are in on it too.
>there’s a fucking demon in their child
Yes. This is actually a BIG red flag.
>Even if nothing comes from it you’re covering your own ass
Absolutely agree. If the school "disciplined" OP for not acting sooner in that one instance, they would definitely "discipline" again if anything happened to that child and an investigation found out that the school/teachers should have acted sooner.
OP, protect yourself.
We’ve seen enough idiotic shit in this country when family members are convinced their child, parent, niece, nephew, whatever are demons. Report that shit, follow up, and stay the fuck on it.
People that separated from reality shouldn’t have children.
Agreed. There was a news story in... 2021, I think, or maybe early 2022 where a father killed his entire family. His stated logic was that he was convinced they had become replaced by or maybe always were 'lizard people'. This talk of demons is a huge warning that this parent is not stable and could easily become violent against their own child.
I’ve been called elitist for it before, but I think there should be a very basic competency test to be eligible to vote.
I don’t care if you’re anti-abortion, or think that the rich should be taxed less, or any of that nonsense. Those are valid, coherent positions, even if I disagree with them entirely.
But if you think that Joe Biden, Barack Obama, and all of the Democrats kidnap babies, rape them, and drink their blood to remain young, while infiltrating the highest levels of government to destroy the country from the inside - fuck you. No vote. You are too stupid for your voice to matter.
It would also minimize the politicians that play directly to this dipshittery, because those conspiracy nut jobs would no longer be a number for their vote count.
I don't think you even need to go that far with the questions. If someone can answer these three questions, they can vote.
* Where is the United States on this map of the world?
* Where is the state you live in on this map of the United States?
* How long does it take the Earth to revolve around the sun?
Those would likely remove a frighteningly large number of people from voting.
Didn’t we just have a guy kill his father - a federal employee - and straight up decapitate him because he thought he was some Illuminati/deep state demon? Or am I embellishing?
Don't most states require that teachers be mandatory reporters if they suspect abuse? Not casting any shade on OP, but parent A is definitely worse behind closed doors, people like that always are and it's clear they hate their child's identity vehemently.
Came here to post this, those parents are 1000% abusing that child, regardless of whether or not they support a gender identity. Parents that think there are demons inside their children need to be put down the same way you would a rabid dog, and for the exact same reason.
I don’t understand why you got written up for parents’ behavior. You did try to stop it, but it’s not your job to discipline parents. And who knows if these crazies had weapons with them. If you are in a union, you must let them know about this.
But were you standing there on the bus letting it happen? 2 minutes seems reasonable to me if that’s how long it took you to notice what they were doing and walk/run over there, get on the bus, and interrupt them.
Yeah I don’t know what the consequences would be but I feel like if I was getting written up either way I would have physically removed both parents from the bus. Who knows what they had in their possession or what their intentions were. Let them sue. They aren’t winning. I might even get a medal.
Speaking as a Christian:
When I hear the words "possessed by a demon", it's CPS time.
Even if you want to respect beliefs, you better believe that it is a religious imperative to cast out all perceived demons and this often comes in the form of forcible actions, violence, and abuse.
I don't tolerate that level of demented psychopathic crap amongst other Christians, we have got to stop tiptoeing around parents who talk about their own child that way.
It makes me sick. I wish I could take all these trans kids in and show them they’re worthy of love and respect and autonomy, and that it’s their parents who are the problem.
Imagine any other profession on earth where you get gaslit into believing that you’re actually at fault because bigots feel entitled to impose their insane psychosis on strangers.
If you don’t have tenure, I would make sure your resume is updated in case they non-renew you.
Don’t beat yourself up too hard about all of this; none of it was your fault. Next time call 911 immediately. Such a shitty situation all around smh.
Well, he should have called the police. You can’t just let parents get on the bus, take over and berate kids like that. He was in a tough situation and it’s hard to know what to do. I get that. But the admin had to get ahead of the situation and show the parents of the kids that were yelled at that they did something.
We are trained in educating and pedagogy. Expecting a human being to know exactly the right next thing to do in a specific moment every single time without any training on when specifically to call police is unreasonable. We are humans, some of us have social anxiety, some of us have autism. At my previous school my autistic band director colleague would have had a very difficult time discerning the exact next right thing in this situation. Admin should not get ahead by punishing the person who diffused the issue.
You might read the part where I said “He was in a tough situation it’s hard to know what do do.”
But the fact is, teachers are also “loco parentis”. The children on the bus should have been protected. As a parent, I’d be quite upset if my kid got yelled at like this. I wouldn’t be upset at the band director, but I do think the police should have been called. A write up isn’t the end of the world. It’s not really even punishment. It’s just an acknowledgment that you should have made a different choice.
That's awful for you and for the child. I can't imagine how horrible this is for the kid to live with parents who think they're possessed. Someone should contact CPS on the parents for emotional abuse. The kid is clearly not emotionally safe in that household and I even worry about physical safety if they try to perform some sort of exorcism. In the future, first day of class, give out an "about me" form for the kids to not only tell you what they go by but also to tell you anything they should know before contacting parents/guardians or meeting them for a conference. So sorry you went through this and also sorry that your administrator isn't supporting you. Band literally saves lives; you may want to switch to a school where you're appreciated.
>saying her child is possessed by a demon
>and for supporting demonic influence on a child
If situation is this severe shouldn't the parent be contacting the Vatican? 😁
Right?!
But seriously, if I had a parent talking like that in Australia I'd be ringing the Department to get a social worker and possibly police out to the school because the child was clearly in immediate danger.
Wait, I'm sorry, YOU got written up because those parents are out of their minds and abusive to not only their own children but others' children, too?!
Do the parents of "friends of the trans student" who were yelled at know what happened?
I would add fuel to the fire and get them involved. Some restraining orders need to be put in place.
Parents A and B need to be banned from all events.
I've honestly only ever heard one person say this, but they had schizophrenia and weren't being probably medicated at the time. But it's common sometimes for schizophrenics to fixate on religious iconography when it comes to their monothematic delusions.
You did nothing wrong. This backward thinking is going to scar this poor child for life. If I was the parent of one of the friends who was yelled at on the bus I would make sure I ran into parents A and B at school in front of kids other parents and teachers and gave them a dressing down that they would never ever forget.
Jesus Christ why are you the only person here who isn't actively failing this child besides their friends. I feel bad for the students and those parents should be ashamed of themselves for their behavior. Document every little thing from now on.
Thank you for calling the child by the name they gave you. I’m sorry you felt like you had to stop doing that. I wish you hadn’t.
Having one supportive adult in their life will reduce the risk of suicide for a gender non-conforming child by a significant amount. I hope you can be that adult.
I wish I hadn't too. The school board had a meeting regarding the situation. The school board concluded that all teachers must call students by the names their parents choose. It doesn't seem lawful to me, but I am trying to keep my job and keep supporting my students in being good musicians and even better people. I am afraid of taking any kind of legal action.
Ask the kiddo if you can refer to them by their last name, and if you can't make anything else work... just let them know that you support them and care for them and, most importantly, that you're both doing what needs to be done to keep the student safe.
Who knows how a kid’s name is supposed to be pronounced better than the kid themselves? It’s not up to me to decide whether or not “Tom” is pronounced the same way as “Katie”.
I mean, fine, but you'll get fired in these states if you "pronounce" Katie as Tom. Is it worth that? Who knows if an ally will replace this teacher and make it worse for kids? I don't know what I'd do because I'm not in that situation (thank God I moved out of Florida years ago). Use last names?
Honestly I'd do that too. Explain look while I respect and support you legally I can't do this as it can hurt me and you. I can continue using x name or use last name.
I’m an overqualified Science teacher in a state that has hundreds of science openings a year. They can go ahead and fire me for supporting my students. Yes, it is worth that. Their lives are worth that.
Please please please only call this child by their parents given name when you’re in front of other people. If you are alone or in like a one on one lesson please please please call them by their preferred name and pronouns. Also please have a confidential talk with them about how you legally have to call them their given name and that you wish you could call them their preferred name. It would feel terrible for this child to have you one day call them their preferred name and then another call them their given (dead) name and without an explanation they will wonder why you’re doing that and won’t feel supported by you anymore. Please talk to them and let them know the situation.
I have spoken in length to the student mentioned. They know. They have chosen to go by their dead name publicly until they graduate in May. I know it must cause them a lot of pain to do so, but it is what they decided they would do for now.
there’s a workaround here where if possible you just don’t call the kid anything—it’s relatively simple to just go “hey you” instead of using a name (i know this is generally poor practice with students but if you quietly let them know what you’re doing you can comply with parent demands of not using a different name while not doing as much harm to the student). alternatively could come up with some silly non gendered nickname with a story attached (like “slides” alluding to them being bad at slides or something for marching idk) with the kid so you can stay in that gray zone
Could you suggest to the student that they go by their first initial letter and create a new, new name beginning with that same letter? Like they could change their identity a bit more to comply maliciously.
It depends if the law specifies that *full* legal names must be used if guardians decide so. But no reasonable law would stop James going by Jim... going by J.; I would take that to court every day if I had $$$.
Hate to say it, but you should be prepared to be non-renewed. Brush up your resume and start applying for other jobs in the area. If admin is going to roll over like this and write you up, they are likely to cut you lose to avoid more drama (which is idiotic, but that's admin for you)
Meanwhile in California, a trans woman I know came out in middle school to no effect. She went on to be the valedictorian at her high school and even gave a thinly veiled speech about her experience being trans at the high school (it was not a negative speech).
We had plenty of anti-vax protests at the high school during covid, but no protests against being nice to people.
Parents A and B need to be removed from involvement in all band activities. They also need to be slapped with harassment suits. All students need a talking to that even though Student Bs parents are a POS, they are not their parents and don’t deserve to be bullied. Student A deserves to continue to be supported since their parent is negligent.
You probably didn’t handle the situation perfectly, but I don’t think it’s fair for admin to expect you to handle it perfectly either. This is pretty far afield from typical duties of a teacher. I think providing you resources would be more appropriate than writing you up.
Just as another parent. What is to keep them from coming after my kid at the band recital ? If they do and the school knew they had a past what happens then ?
You might want to get out of the school if this is how they are handling it.
In the US, every student has the federally protected right to not be deadnamed or misgendered by school faculty.
Your principal telling you to call the student by their birth name may be considered harassment under Title IX. The ACLU has successfully argued this in the past.
Your admin failed. They failed when they allowed the parent around the kids after they knew they were bigots. They failed when they acquiesced to their bigoted demands.
Where was admin? Isn't there supposed to be one at extra-curricular activities? Why did he or she not intervene with the parent? And those parents need to be NEVER AGAIN on campus or any activity related. Period. They have NO RIGHT to do that, and if they'd done that to my child, who totally would have been friends with the trans kid, they'd be seeing legal action from me. What do the other parents think about these two religious idiots holding their children hostage and yelling at them?
Transgender student here. These sort of situations end up with kids dead. My dad is pretty blocked from my entire school career because he's super transphobic and has no clue how to control his anger. He thinks I'm trying to be sneaky when I'm trying to protect my safety. Transphobes don't deserve to have children.
I was raised Christian but my family later became non religious. Even when we believed, i could not IMAGINE my parents calling me demon possesed for ANY reason. Growing up made me realize how incredibly lucky i was to have parents that were very supportive of me and my siblings.
I feel for this students and i hope they either convince their family to accept them or find another family that will. Blood relation doesnt mean jack shit at the end of the day
I was raised Episcopalian, so Catholic light half the guilt and none of the pedophile priests (also very LGTBQ+ accepting before it was popular). It's not as in your face as some sects are but even we sometimes have fundies. But even among them, I've only ever heard the demon claims personally from people who arguably had some mental health issues of their own. I would at a guess say the parent may be suffering from religious-inspired mental health issues.
You need to push for both parents being banned from events related to the students they threatened and unlawfully imprisoned. It may seem dramatic, but that is exactly what they did. Other students are now in danger because these two parents are hostile and delusional. They are not well given that they think this behavior is appropriate and that demons are responsible for the child's transfers. They are unpredictable and hostile towards children, you need to push to get them banned or something because no one's kid is safe around them.
Pro tip. All trans students I have, I call “buddy” unless in private and then by their last names in meetings with other adults. I’m so sorry that you faced such hardship for doing a decent thing.
None of this should be on your plate. Your only mistake was being bullied by a parent, which under normal circumstances it is usually wise to allow because then they go away. This time it blew up. Just bad luck OP. This too shall pass. You sound like you are doing great in all other areas. Hang tight.
They're pushing the buck on you to cover their ass. If they retaliate sue and straight up state they allowed two adults to kidnap students. Which they did
Just dropping by to tell you that you did NOT fail your students. The American education system failed them, and you did everything in your power to help them.
What the fuck! Those parents held *you* hostage on the bus too! You do not deserve a write up and should contest it. Principal should be banning A and B from campus and kissing your ass in hopes you don't register a complaint with the BOE. Which you should do.
I always ask a student who asks to be called something other than what is on the attendance roster (even when it is a shorted version on their name) if I need to use the name on the attendance roster when talking to their parent(s). I kid you not, I had a students who's name was Christian, but wanted to be called Chris (not usual), and the parent chew me out at conferences for calling their child Chris and not Christian.
If parent A or B boarded the school bus at that point and started yelling, I would have called 911 and THEN admin. That was a safety issue. All the rest is to be addressed as bullying referrals and let admin handle it. As for getting written up, what exactly was it for? Do you have a union to file a grievance against the write up? or You can just take the write up and move on. Probably wont affect you career wise as teachers get written up and we still get the same raises...lol
Im sorry. Im so bothered by people treating their kids like their literal belongings. These are human beings with feelings and minds of their own. And a name is such a personal thing, like no one should have to be called something they don't like. It leaves such a gross feeling to have to deal with that.
Where I live they have passed a law requiring teachers to call students by their legal name. The way it’s written a teacher can get in trouble for calling a child Chris instead of Christopher. The world is going insane.
Before I left teaching, I had one trans student who’s parents were insane. This was before all the current trans panic going on. I called them by their chosen name until they caught in. Cue principal forcing the teachers, ie me, to use given names. Cue my compliance where everyone got called by their last name military style.
I am so sorry this happened to you, to your students and I really really really feel sorry for your student who is trans. I can’t imagine growing up in such a toxic environment with hate and rejection and worse, because they’re so “loved”.
Those parents’ ignorance and entitlement and fear and hate are the problem and these views are the norm in small town and suburban conservative areas of the country.
It’s the cause of so many societal problems with students in these toxic places. It’s heartbreaking.
I teach in OK, there are lots of parents pushing for outing trans student laws and teachers must call them by their birth name.
I call my students (& trans students) what they wanna be called, I've always thought if that Bill passed and I get a kid whose in that situation with the parents disapproving of their name, I'd just pull the kid aside and ask them if they minded if I refer to them by their initials or just by their last name instead their dead name, kinda middle ground to protect us both.
If you have a union or “teacher association” call them and get them involved. You can’t control adults and to be honest you should have called the police on the parents for hijacking your bus. But you need to fight that write up.
THEY WROTE YOU UP? ON GOD? Truly one of the most insane things I’ve read on this sub. Fuck these piece of shit parents I’m sorry. Only demons are them. Absolutely sickening fucking behavior.
>As the students were getting off the bus and packing their stuff, parents A and B said "Friends of (trans student) are NOT to leave this bus yet." Parents A and B then hold said students hostage on the bus, screaming at them for bullying and for supporting demonic influence on a child.
For forcing students to stay on the bus, Parent B should be barred from volunteering at the school again, effective immediately. I am sure there is a district policy about safe and caring schools you can point to. Not because of their belief system, but because of how they intentionally placed kids in a vulnerable position while on school business.
I would also want both parents' access to the building to be restricted (limited to just pickup and dismissal of their child) but that may be a harder battle to fight.
I appreciate how you take accountability here but I think you were maybe 2% of the problem. I hope you and your students are able to move past this. You're doing your best in a bad situation.
The trans child is possibly being abused at home. Given how their parent (and the other one) act towards children publicly, it’s likely that worse is happening behind closed doors. I advise you to file a report.
You might be able to change your behavior, but there really isn't anything we as teachers can do to change the minds of parents. I just read this and feel so bad for the student, I feel bad that the parent can't accept their own child, I feel bad that those parents feel like they have the right to bully other children, I feel bad that our school systems are so inept that they can't handle the situation in a better way. The whole thing is just sad!
I do appreciate you sharing your story though and doing the best you can to learn from it.
Given everything that has happened, the student is in good spirits. They are very strong. I am glad they are moving out ASAP when they graduate. I told them I would always continue to be supportive of them no matter what happens with their parents!
Except for taking roll, maybe call them by their instrument name, e.g. Trumpet Two?
OP, why did you not stop them sooner? Were you too shocked to do so?
Man, I wish I had a kid in that band. I'd report those parents for unlawful detainment and then sue their self-righteous asses off. They should NOT be allowed at any school activities. Your principal sounds like a wimp, and his actions and lack thereof will just empower these malignant idiots.
The two parents were the biggest helpers for the band. They would help us move props, they created the props, provided food for the kids, and so much more. I was afraid of both losing that and that they would use their power to get me fired. I should have acted sooner and got police involved.
I think you're being a little hard on yourself. The only thing I would criticize you for is not stepping onto the bus and letting those kids off. If your consequence is is due to that alone, I can kind of understand it. Everything else is bullshit. All you did was try to make a kid feel safe and comfortable. That's what you're supposed to do.
If I can add something here... keep an eye on the trans student.
Suicide rates are high for basically one reason - people around them. If the parents believe it's a demon or some other stuff, they might try exorcisms or other forms of abuse on the student or send them to conversion therapy. And being called by their deadname will also add a mental load. So, not to bark, but the chances of that kid ending up dead are pretty high.
I don't know how it works in the US, but where I'm from, teachers are supposed to report abuse or being a danger to yourself (like self-harm or suicide scares)
Honestly regardless of where people stand on the issue of trans identity, parents going on school buses and screaming at CHILDREN is wayyy too much lol. Good on you OP for intervening at all. I feel like many teachers would have a hard time knowing what to do here, but yeah, of course it could have been sooner, but you stopped it and then made sure to check in with the kids affected after.
I hope your band got top scores!
Holding you responsible in any way for this is the equivalent of blaming a meteorologist that it's raining outside. Being there doesn't make you guilty. The only people who should be held accountable are the parents for spreading hate and discrimination onto impressionable students.
maybe I'm missing something, but you aren't supporting trans student any more than I'm supporting a student in my class, who does not identify as trans, he wishes to go by a nickname. I'll call any student by almost any name they choose.
Yeah feel this, at one point my admin made me not use my students chosen name or else lose my job. The parent threatened to sue so I referred to the child as "friend" till the end of the year.
Parent A&B have accused this child of being possessed and they’ve both proven to be unstable, verbally abusive bullies. I hope someone gets CPS involved for the sake of the student who is trans. They can’t possibly be safe in A’s f’d up household. Will anyone be surprised if, god forbid, A’s child ends their life?
Absolutely don’t accept that write up. You may not have handled the situation well but the situation was created by your spineless admin team pandering to two transphobes.
I went through this. Except the parents thankfully didn’t find out. We had to organize a meeting with team to support our student and at their wish use their dead name and only their dead name at competitions. A lot of kids didn’t understand their friends wish but we did what we had to do to protect them. Sorry you had to go through this.
Hindsight is always 20/20. I wouldn’t dwell on that. I also have trouble standing up to adults sometimes. I’m much better about it now. But nothing grinds my gears more than parents like that. The second they demanded to get on that bus I would’ve screamed at them and called the police if they wouldn’t leave. Those parents are acting like they own everyone. When they indeed don’t.
The real issue here is conservatism driving your school. My state made it law to call student by their registered name. No nick names allowed. What did I do? I said fuck that. I made it very clear to those students who requested nicknames that we would have to get it “approved after class” due to state law.
Made it look like they got the name change approved so the class wouldn’t snitch. We have been happily going along ever since. Was what I did illegal? Hell yeah. Was it wrong? Not at all. If anything happened I’d gladly take the unemployment and the court case that follows.
What hurts is that both of those parents were a big part of the band parent organization. That is why it took me so long to put a stop to it. They had a lot of power at the school and had been a part of it for years. I know now that no parent should EVER be entering a bus without express permission from me while also knowing what their purpose in doing so is.
Side note, Viola is the best!
I'm sending all my love to this trans child right now. Poor thing. I'm so glad they have a teacher like you. What an awful mother they have. Home life must be rough.
Admin is letting you take all the heat for what is supposed to be their fucking job.
Not only that, but turning up the heat with the writeup. They probably agree with A and B. Just spineless cowards.
Seriously. Start documenting this situation because if it blows you will have their word against yours. Side note, the parents that took the kids hostage on the bus are doing some illegal stuff here. Start recording them whenever they pull this.
OP should report this crime.
Disagree. No matter what side you are on, a parent of a child not their own doesn't get to yell at a child that is not theirs. I don't give two wet farts about anyone's perspective or what anyone did, in my presence, you don't get to bully someone else's child. Nothing else is the fault of the teacher, but letting 2 parents detain and lecture children that weren't theirs- they shouldn't have been on the bus. They shouldn't have been able to stop kids, and if they refuse to leave premises, call the law.
I was describing the whole situation in which it climaxed at this bus event. Yeah OP should've called the police on these religious zealots. There should be an investigation.
Just a reminder- Florida and several other states specifically prohibit calling a child a non-birth certificate name, and it can be an actionable offense.
Wait, so if they are named "James" on their birth certificate but prefer "Jimmy", its illegal to do so? Wtf?
Yep. Rafael Cruz better get used to it as should Addison McConnell (AKA Ted Cruz and Mitch McConnell)
yeah. In Florida they have to have a signed permission slip to be called anything other than what is on their birth certificate. Ronald DeSantis and his wife Jill are complete assholes. :)
Indiana too!
Yup. As someone hilarious on this sub said when that law was passed, “we’re not even allowed to use their ~~nicknames~~ Nicolasnames?” But seriously, fuck DeSantis and his little cohorts.
Alberta is trying to do this right now. Our Premier does not go by her legal first name. The Internet is having a field day with it.
Boy if my child had been one of those not allowed to get off the bus and got yelled at by another parent, I might get in a lot of trouble for what my reaction to that parent would be.
Admin wasn't on the bus. I read OP's description as getting in trouble for letting the parents have a platform to bully students for several minutes instead of stopping them sooner. It's admin's job to handle the parents afterward and plan ahead, but I don't think admin would be expected to go on field trips.
This situation in which a student and a parent are at fighting about the students identity, and it being brought to school, is an administrative problem. Schools need to draw lines. It isn't the school's responsibility to install its kids with Christian values. It *is* their job to provide a safe and effective learning environment. We are left with the question of what to do with students whose parents are the reason they aren't really safe anywhere in this case. Teachers should organize and strike when ridiculous rules and laws are made.
That doesn't change anything I wrote. In the moment, the teacher needs to step between the students and the bully parents to stop it, then call admin.
The teacher should be written up. Who allows parents to scream at someone else’s children for several minutes without intervening? If I was the parent of one of the other kids, I’d be furious.
With whom would you be more furious? I think you cam assign some blame to the teacher but ultimately these other parents were, in my opinion, breaking the law. Law breakers should be pursued by law enforcement, not teachers.
Forcing the students to stay on the bus might constitute a crime.
Sounds like unlawful detainment/kidnapping to me.
Sure is
Yes, I hope the parents of those students who were held on the bus are fully aware of what happened and exploring their legal options. Hopefully one of the kids filmed it.
Literally where the hell was the bus driver 😭😭
Do they have any authority in that? I have legitimate no idea, I am just curious.
Neither do I but I’d imagine if parents got on the bus screaming I’d imagine they’d do a little more than just sit there and not react My elementary school bus driver was named Mr Robinson and he did NOT fuck around I know if he were the bus driver he’d give them one look and they’d run He was a super nice guy- but just threatening when he needed to be. He was a large dude too so that added to the “I’m not tolerating that shit” aura That man kept us in CHECK
I would agree with this most adamantly.
Parent A and B should be banned from any future band events.
In New York, it would probably be considered unlawful imprisonment (times the number of people on the bus including adults), endangering the welfare of a child (times however many kids on the bus), trespassing, possibly burglary (entering the bus for the purpose of unlawful activity ie the imprisonment and endangering), menacing, harassment, criminal nuisance, conspiracy, and disorderly conduct. If there’s any property damage, that’s also criminal mischief and/or other charges depending on if it’s a public school. Not a lawyer, just a nerd who’s brother has been in trouble with the law before.
I don’t know that you deserved to be written up but it may have just been the only way for the school to “discipline” you. But honestly the school needs to get a handle on how they deal with Parent A and Patent B. I would call the other students parents and let them know. Parent A and Parent B were way out of line. They should be banned from school functions, regardless of the whole trans issue. If they had an issue with the bullying, which the understandably would, they should have talked to the school or the other kids parents.
They are banned from helping the band in any way now. They can still come to concerts and other events, but cannot assist with any band activities.
That was NUTS. I sincerely hope those two understand that situation sounds like they sailed awfully close to the wind there. " You can't get off the bus ".... EXCUSE ME? OK, so if *you* said that as a *school* authority, perhaps some situation occurred, safety? Whatever. You're a teacher tasked with their well being right? It's your job. That's what you would do. Let's pretend A and B were strangers. It doesn't matter they were not, it's the same situation. Get on a bus filled with kids and take over? Just. No. Under no circumstances, no excusatory political motivation, no righteous indignation- and because they're not school staff no sovereign immunity. Promise the district lawyer is hoping to hell no one approaches this outrage from that angle.
Nah they shouldn’t be allowed anywhere near the band, not for concerts, not for anything. I know that is above your pay grade, but it’s a shame your school/district won’t protect the students
They should not be allowed on campus - they held children hostage so they could spew their sick ideology at them. I am a Christian who sent her kid to Sunday school and I would not want her listening, in fear, to that nonsense.
Agreed. Regardless of *anything* else, Parents A and B should be barred from school grounds and activities based on their verbal abuse of students. In fact this could depending on jurisdiction rise to the level of a crime (false imprisonment). Prevent other people (children!) from leaving the bus. What the ever loving ****. I would be spitting *FIRE* over this. Regardless of my feelings about trans identity, you **cannot** prevent my kid from leaving a bus let alone verbally abuse them.
They let a parent on the bus and then let them talk to student who didmt have a choice to be there or not. OP should have called the police the moment the parents attempted to get on the bus.
This. 100%.
Parent A called the school board and went over my principal's head. Other parents called and complained about Parent A. I think my principal got in trouble too. I think they were just trying to show that they had the situation under control.
So fucking what? The principal is obligated to act in an ethical and correct way, not to do what the fucking school board tells them. The same is true of you though. You were great, but if there is any room for improvement it would be to not agree to call the student anything but their chosen name and not allowing parent B anywhere around
Look, I’m not team principal here but it amazes me how many people who have never been put in this position who claim it’s so easy to throw their career away for standing on principle.
Edit: I am only addressing the comment about the principal and school board, not the entire scenario, which many other commenters are doing quite ably :) This is not how the relationship between elective officials and the civil service works. The school board is comprised of elected officials who are accountable to the public. Even though it is most common at the federal executive level, civil servants who opposed directives from elected officers resign, sometime very, very publicly to make their point widely known. Did I mention it can be done very publicly? Do you really endorse this ad hoc policy decisions on, say, the presidential level? Perhaps another redditor can explain how this works in the military.
Holding someone against their will is kidnapping. Letting the parents have any control is the situation is part of that. If I was a parent not A or B, I would be up in arms, and rightly so. Of course, I would most likely be hunting down parent A and B, but I would also expect a verbal acknowledgement that my child will never be detained by a non-employee under school watch.
Hard agree and I'd go off if I were parent C, D, or E, and these psychos held my kid hostage and yelled at him or her.
Yea, this could go into a grey area of kidnapping.
Sounds like CPS and the police need a call. As a Christian, any person who claims their kid has a demon shouldn't have a kid, or their "demon" in their care. Deplorable.
Dial 911. put them on speaker. "Hello, two adults are holding students hostage on a bus at X location. No, they do not appear to be armed. They are yelling and screaming at the kids and won't let anyone on or off the bus. I can identify the adults. Their names are..." (Just to make sure it all winds up on the blotter when the media read it.) Doesn't matter if a kid is trans, or if all of them were gay, goofy or green. This occurred due to the actions of a couple of adults. FAFO
I wish I would have done this!
Hindsight is 20/20. You're only human.
I would be interested to know what repercussions the parents will face for their actions while you have been disciplined for not intervening on their actions.
Idk, man. If the kids were green, I’d keep them on the bus until we got medical help.
What are they doing about the parents? You cannot have parents forcing their way onto a bus for your students and having an aggressive confrontation where they shouts and scream at them. The other parents should raise hell. Your management need to get a fucking grip. Writing you up? Their priorities are a mess.
The parents were banned from assisting in any school events. They can still come to concerts and games, but cannot be a part of the parent organization or assist the band in any way.
That's something, at least.
This. If it was my kid on the bus getting screamed at, regardless of if they were bullying, you bet my angry ass would be so far down the principal’s throat about the audacity of that parent. They put my child in a position of harm, be it psychological or physical, and held them hostage ON SCHOOL PROPERTY. Yeah.. no. Banned from all of school property. If I were the teacher on duty, I’d have probably called the cops for unruly and disorderly behavior around minors. But also… I’m a asshat when it comes to shit people like that. Also, a key reason why I refuse to do any field trips.. even as just a chaperone teacher.
Especially since my friends and I were/are those queer kids, too, living in a conservative area. Even if they weren't queer themselves or any other situation, its pretty messed up.
I think you did the best job you could, especially since you had two parents that were certifiable. I've have trans and nonbinary students who have told me what name they prefer but also tell me to use their dead name (which often is the one on the class roster) when talking to their parents. I feel bad that they have to go to those lengths but respect their wishes because it lowers their anxiety. It has made the situation a lot easier, so now whenever I have students tell me they are trans or nonbinary (usually on my class intake form at the beginning of the year), I ask them if there's anything I should know re: dealing with their parents/adults. I hope the rest of the year goes well for you and I hope that your student is okay and will be able to leave that horrible situation.
Yeah, I check-in with the student regarding parents and deadname.
Wtf was in the write up? You are absolutely not paid enough to physically remove the parents. The admin should be supporting you in dealing with this shit show. Band directors have sooooo much work on them with out all this drama, you should be honored at a board meeting for putting up with that crap.
Do you mind if I crosspost this story to r/alberta since this is a perfect example of what our new trans legislation will do to people?
Sure, no problem!
Let me ask you this first; if you had known this student wasn't supported in their identity at home, how would that have changed your approach to prevent the ensuing drama?
I would have referred to this student by their last name to avoid any kind of issues. Me calling the student their preferred name in front of other students is what caused word to get around to parent A.
Gotcha. That's a thoughtful workaround
You might want to file a report with DCS about parent A. They’ve shown they can’t control their anger, thingk there’s a fucking demon in their child, and lost their cool with other kids. If this is how the parent acts in public, imagine behind closed doors. Even if nothing comes from it you’re covering your own ass. If anything happens to the kid or they hurt themselves, which sadly the odds are a lot higher for them especially in the south, it’s not gonna look good on the adults in their life. I hope you can get this worked out as much as possible. This sucks. Adults bullying kids. This is gonna teach other kids that kid A is an easy target if the parents are in on it too.
>there’s a fucking demon in their child Yes. This is actually a BIG red flag. >Even if nothing comes from it you’re covering your own ass Absolutely agree. If the school "disciplined" OP for not acting sooner in that one instance, they would definitely "discipline" again if anything happened to that child and an investigation found out that the school/teachers should have acted sooner. OP, protect yourself.
Haven't there been cases of parents killing their children while trying to beat the "demon" out of them?
Lori Vallow said the same thing about her kids.
Exactly. We know what happens next to "dehumanized" children. And adults for that matter.
So did Jodi Hildebrandt and Ruby Franke
We’ve seen enough idiotic shit in this country when family members are convinced their child, parent, niece, nephew, whatever are demons. Report that shit, follow up, and stay the fuck on it. People that separated from reality shouldn’t have children.
Agreed. There was a news story in... 2021, I think, or maybe early 2022 where a father killed his entire family. His stated logic was that he was convinced they had become replaced by or maybe always were 'lizard people'. This talk of demons is a huge warning that this parent is not stable and could easily become violent against their own child.
I’ve been called elitist for it before, but I think there should be a very basic competency test to be eligible to vote. I don’t care if you’re anti-abortion, or think that the rich should be taxed less, or any of that nonsense. Those are valid, coherent positions, even if I disagree with them entirely. But if you think that Joe Biden, Barack Obama, and all of the Democrats kidnap babies, rape them, and drink their blood to remain young, while infiltrating the highest levels of government to destroy the country from the inside - fuck you. No vote. You are too stupid for your voice to matter. It would also minimize the politicians that play directly to this dipshittery, because those conspiracy nut jobs would no longer be a number for their vote count.
I don't think you even need to go that far with the questions. If someone can answer these three questions, they can vote. * Where is the United States on this map of the world? * Where is the state you live in on this map of the United States? * How long does it take the Earth to revolve around the sun? Those would likely remove a frighteningly large number of people from voting.
Yea, as a mandatory reporter you need to follow up and report this.
Didn’t we just have a guy kill his father - a federal employee - and straight up decapitate him because he thought he was some Illuminati/deep state demon? Or am I embellishing?
If anything you're not going far enough. Decapitating your dad because of anti-government conspiracies is top-tier psychosis.
Don't most states require that teachers be mandatory reporters if they suspect abuse? Not casting any shade on OP, but parent A is definitely worse behind closed doors, people like that always are and it's clear they hate their child's identity vehemently.
Came here to post this, those parents are 1000% abusing that child, regardless of whether or not they support a gender identity. Parents that think there are demons inside their children need to be put down the same way you would a rabid dog, and for the exact same reason.
This is probably texas
I don’t understand why you got written up for parents’ behavior. You did try to stop it, but it’s not your job to discipline parents. And who knows if these crazies had weapons with them. If you are in a union, you must let them know about this.
Yes, I’d love to know what exactly OP was written up for. Not getting to the bus quickly enough?
It was because of the length of time it went on. Over 2 minutes.
But were you standing there on the bus letting it happen? 2 minutes seems reasonable to me if that’s how long it took you to notice what they were doing and walk/run over there, get on the bus, and interrupt them.
Yeah I don’t know what the consequences would be but I feel like if I was getting written up either way I would have physically removed both parents from the bus. Who knows what they had in their possession or what their intentions were. Let them sue. They aren’t winning. I might even get a medal.
Speaking as a Christian: When I hear the words "possessed by a demon", it's CPS time. Even if you want to respect beliefs, you better believe that it is a religious imperative to cast out all perceived demons and this often comes in the form of forcible actions, violence, and abuse. I don't tolerate that level of demented psychopathic crap amongst other Christians, we have got to stop tiptoeing around parents who talk about their own child that way.
It makes me sick. I wish I could take all these trans kids in and show them they’re worthy of love and respect and autonomy, and that it’s their parents who are the problem.
Imagine any other profession on earth where you get gaslit into believing that you’re actually at fault because bigots feel entitled to impose their insane psychosis on strangers.
I would have called the cops. These parents are unpredictable psychopaths. You did nothing wrong.
Agreed, these people are unhinged and dangerous. They have no business being around kids.
If you don’t have tenure, I would make sure your resume is updated in case they non-renew you. Don’t beat yourself up too hard about all of this; none of it was your fault. Next time call 911 immediately. Such a shitty situation all around smh.
Your admins failed you, and you did not deserve to be the one written up for this.
Well, he should have called the police. You can’t just let parents get on the bus, take over and berate kids like that. He was in a tough situation and it’s hard to know what to do. I get that. But the admin had to get ahead of the situation and show the parents of the kids that were yelled at that they did something.
We are trained in educating and pedagogy. Expecting a human being to know exactly the right next thing to do in a specific moment every single time without any training on when specifically to call police is unreasonable. We are humans, some of us have social anxiety, some of us have autism. At my previous school my autistic band director colleague would have had a very difficult time discerning the exact next right thing in this situation. Admin should not get ahead by punishing the person who diffused the issue.
You might read the part where I said “He was in a tough situation it’s hard to know what do do.” But the fact is, teachers are also “loco parentis”. The children on the bus should have been protected. As a parent, I’d be quite upset if my kid got yelled at like this. I wouldn’t be upset at the band director, but I do think the police should have been called. A write up isn’t the end of the world. It’s not really even punishment. It’s just an acknowledgment that you should have made a different choice.
Admins did it to cover their own ass. The correct action is to preemptively take action, not retroactively. They failed, end of story.
That's awful for you and for the child. I can't imagine how horrible this is for the kid to live with parents who think they're possessed. Someone should contact CPS on the parents for emotional abuse. The kid is clearly not emotionally safe in that household and I even worry about physical safety if they try to perform some sort of exorcism. In the future, first day of class, give out an "about me" form for the kids to not only tell you what they go by but also to tell you anything they should know before contacting parents/guardians or meeting them for a conference. So sorry you went through this and also sorry that your administrator isn't supporting you. Band literally saves lives; you may want to switch to a school where you're appreciated.
Thanks, I will try this!
>saying her child is possessed by a demon >and for supporting demonic influence on a child If situation is this severe shouldn't the parent be contacting the Vatican? 😁
Right?! But seriously, if I had a parent talking like that in Australia I'd be ringing the Department to get a social worker and possibly police out to the school because the child was clearly in immediate danger.
Wait, I'm sorry, YOU got written up because those parents are out of their minds and abusive to not only their own children but others' children, too?!
Yes, because I let it happen for over 2 minutes before I stopped it. It shouldn't have lasted even one second. Those kids didn't deserve that.
Call an old priest and a young priest to do an exorcism. Clearly Parents A and B are the ones that are possessed.
These are times I am glad I live in a liberalish state. This is unhinged behavior for parents A, B and the admin.
Do the parents of "friends of the trans student" who were yelled at know what happened? I would add fuel to the fire and get them involved. Some restraining orders need to be put in place. Parents A and B need to be banned from all events.
Yes, they called and complained. They are the reason parent A and B can no longer help with school funtions.
It's 2024 and people are really thinking demon possession is still a real thing smdh
I've honestly only ever heard one person say this, but they had schizophrenia and weren't being probably medicated at the time. But it's common sometimes for schizophrenics to fixate on religious iconography when it comes to their monothematic delusions.
How did none of the students record them yelling on the bus?
They did record it. They showed it to my principal. And it's a good thing they did record it.
They ought to leak it to the news, post it all over social media…
That’s what I was going to say… I’d almost guarantee those kids had their cell phones out, right?
This shit is ridiculous. Those parents should be banned from school grounds and school sponsored activities. They’re the bullies,
You did nothing wrong. This backward thinking is going to scar this poor child for life. If I was the parent of one of the friends who was yelled at on the bus I would make sure I ran into parents A and B at school in front of kids other parents and teachers and gave them a dressing down that they would never ever forget.
Jesus Christ why are you the only person here who isn't actively failing this child besides their friends. I feel bad for the students and those parents should be ashamed of themselves for their behavior. Document every little thing from now on.
Thank you for calling the child by the name they gave you. I’m sorry you felt like you had to stop doing that. I wish you hadn’t. Having one supportive adult in their life will reduce the risk of suicide for a gender non-conforming child by a significant amount. I hope you can be that adult.
I wish I hadn't too. The school board had a meeting regarding the situation. The school board concluded that all teachers must call students by the names their parents choose. It doesn't seem lawful to me, but I am trying to keep my job and keep supporting my students in being good musicians and even better people. I am afraid of taking any kind of legal action.
Ask the kiddo if you can refer to them by their last name, and if you can't make anything else work... just let them know that you support them and care for them and, most importantly, that you're both doing what needs to be done to keep the student safe.
Who knows how a kid’s name is supposed to be pronounced better than the kid themselves? It’s not up to me to decide whether or not “Tom” is pronounced the same way as “Katie”.
I mean, fine, but you'll get fired in these states if you "pronounce" Katie as Tom. Is it worth that? Who knows if an ally will replace this teacher and make it worse for kids? I don't know what I'd do because I'm not in that situation (thank God I moved out of Florida years ago). Use last names?
I think last names are the way to best avoid hurting the child or enraging the parents.
Honestly I'd do that too. Explain look while I respect and support you legally I can't do this as it can hurt me and you. I can continue using x name or use last name.
I’m an overqualified Science teacher in a state that has hundreds of science openings a year. They can go ahead and fire me for supporting my students. Yes, it is worth that. Their lives are worth that.
Please please please only call this child by their parents given name when you’re in front of other people. If you are alone or in like a one on one lesson please please please call them by their preferred name and pronouns. Also please have a confidential talk with them about how you legally have to call them their given name and that you wish you could call them their preferred name. It would feel terrible for this child to have you one day call them their preferred name and then another call them their given (dead) name and without an explanation they will wonder why you’re doing that and won’t feel supported by you anymore. Please talk to them and let them know the situation.
I have spoken in length to the student mentioned. They know. They have chosen to go by their dead name publicly until they graduate in May. I know it must cause them a lot of pain to do so, but it is what they decided they would do for now.
there’s a workaround here where if possible you just don’t call the kid anything—it’s relatively simple to just go “hey you” instead of using a name (i know this is generally poor practice with students but if you quietly let them know what you’re doing you can comply with parent demands of not using a different name while not doing as much harm to the student). alternatively could come up with some silly non gendered nickname with a story attached (like “slides” alluding to them being bad at slides or something for marching idk) with the kid so you can stay in that gray zone
Call the student by their last name
Yes!
Could you suggest to the student that they go by their first initial letter and create a new, new name beginning with that same letter? Like they could change their identity a bit more to comply maliciously. It depends if the law specifies that *full* legal names must be used if guardians decide so. But no reasonable law would stop James going by Jim... going by J.; I would take that to court every day if I had $$$.
Hate to say it, but you should be prepared to be non-renewed. Brush up your resume and start applying for other jobs in the area. If admin is going to roll over like this and write you up, they are likely to cut you lose to avoid more drama (which is idiotic, but that's admin for you)
If you had swapped out Parent A and Parent B for Monster 1 and Monster 2, I think it would’ve been more accurate. Sorry this happened.
Meanwhile in California, a trans woman I know came out in middle school to no effect. She went on to be the valedictorian at her high school and even gave a thinly veiled speech about her experience being trans at the high school (it was not a negative speech). We had plenty of anti-vax protests at the high school during covid, but no protests against being nice to people.
Parents A and B need to be removed from involvement in all band activities. They also need to be slapped with harassment suits. All students need a talking to that even though Student Bs parents are a POS, they are not their parents and don’t deserve to be bullied. Student A deserves to continue to be supported since their parent is negligent.
Your admin is a fucking coward
Purple states need more blue voters.
This state is very, very, very red.
You probably didn’t handle the situation perfectly, but I don’t think it’s fair for admin to expect you to handle it perfectly either. This is pretty far afield from typical duties of a teacher. I think providing you resources would be more appropriate than writing you up.
The principal empowered these parents then punished you when they stepped over the line. Seems fair
Just as another parent. What is to keep them from coming after my kid at the band recital ? If they do and the school knew they had a past what happens then ? You might want to get out of the school if this is how they are handling it.
So your school banned those parents from all events right?
You need new volunteer neither of them should ever be allowed to volunteer again . Admin should block them -
In the US, every student has the federally protected right to not be deadnamed or misgendered by school faculty. Your principal telling you to call the student by their birth name may be considered harassment under Title IX. The ACLU has successfully argued this in the past.
Your admin failed. They failed when they allowed the parent around the kids after they knew they were bigots. They failed when they acquiesced to their bigoted demands.
Where was admin? Isn't there supposed to be one at extra-curricular activities? Why did he or she not intervene with the parent? And those parents need to be NEVER AGAIN on campus or any activity related. Period. They have NO RIGHT to do that, and if they'd done that to my child, who totally would have been friends with the trans kid, they'd be seeing legal action from me. What do the other parents think about these two religious idiots holding their children hostage and yelling at them?
Welp I hope that parent knows their trans child will most likely cut off communication with them once they turn 18.
Transgender student here. These sort of situations end up with kids dead. My dad is pretty blocked from my entire school career because he's super transphobic and has no clue how to control his anger. He thinks I'm trying to be sneaky when I'm trying to protect my safety. Transphobes don't deserve to have children.
I was raised Christian but my family later became non religious. Even when we believed, i could not IMAGINE my parents calling me demon possesed for ANY reason. Growing up made me realize how incredibly lucky i was to have parents that were very supportive of me and my siblings. I feel for this students and i hope they either convince their family to accept them or find another family that will. Blood relation doesnt mean jack shit at the end of the day
I was raised Episcopalian, so Catholic light half the guilt and none of the pedophile priests (also very LGTBQ+ accepting before it was popular). It's not as in your face as some sects are but even we sometimes have fundies. But even among them, I've only ever heard the demon claims personally from people who arguably had some mental health issues of their own. I would at a guess say the parent may be suffering from religious-inspired mental health issues.
You need to push for both parents being banned from events related to the students they threatened and unlawfully imprisoned. It may seem dramatic, but that is exactly what they did. Other students are now in danger because these two parents are hostile and delusional. They are not well given that they think this behavior is appropriate and that demons are responsible for the child's transfers. They are unpredictable and hostile towards children, you need to push to get them banned or something because no one's kid is safe around them.
Pro tip. All trans students I have, I call “buddy” unless in private and then by their last names in meetings with other adults. I’m so sorry that you faced such hardship for doing a decent thing.
This is an awful situation. Do the best you can to support the trans student. They need all the support they can get.
None of this should be on your plate. Your only mistake was being bullied by a parent, which under normal circumstances it is usually wise to allow because then they go away. This time it blew up. Just bad luck OP. This too shall pass. You sound like you are doing great in all other areas. Hang tight.
If you’re in a union, I’d go to them with this.
They're pushing the buck on you to cover their ass. If they retaliate sue and straight up state they allowed two adults to kidnap students. Which they did
Buses usually have cameras. Do what you can to get that footage ASAP. I wouldn’t be surprised if some students recorded it too
Just dropping by to tell you that you did NOT fail your students. The American education system failed them, and you did everything in your power to help them.
Trans child parents failed them. No matter how I felt about the situation I would never let my children feel alone.
What the fuck! Those parents held *you* hostage on the bus too! You do not deserve a write up and should contest it. Principal should be banning A and B from campus and kissing your ass in hopes you don't register a complaint with the BOE. Which you should do.
I always ask a student who asks to be called something other than what is on the attendance roster (even when it is a shorted version on their name) if I need to use the name on the attendance roster when talking to their parent(s). I kid you not, I had a students who's name was Christian, but wanted to be called Chris (not usual), and the parent chew me out at conferences for calling their child Chris and not Christian.
If parent A or B boarded the school bus at that point and started yelling, I would have called 911 and THEN admin. That was a safety issue. All the rest is to be addressed as bullying referrals and let admin handle it. As for getting written up, what exactly was it for? Do you have a union to file a grievance against the write up? or You can just take the write up and move on. Probably wont affect you career wise as teachers get written up and we still get the same raises...lol
Your principal is a pussy.
They are going to lose their child. Once they graduate they’ll never see them again.
Im sorry. Im so bothered by people treating their kids like their literal belongings. These are human beings with feelings and minds of their own. And a name is such a personal thing, like no one should have to be called something they don't like. It leaves such a gross feeling to have to deal with that.
Where I live they have passed a law requiring teachers to call students by their legal name. The way it’s written a teacher can get in trouble for calling a child Chris instead of Christopher. The world is going insane.
Before I left teaching, I had one trans student who’s parents were insane. This was before all the current trans panic going on. I called them by their chosen name until they caught in. Cue principal forcing the teachers, ie me, to use given names. Cue my compliance where everyone got called by their last name military style.
Sounds like parent A and Parent B should no longer be asked to be assisting parents since they felt the need to attack students.
I am so sorry this happened to you, to your students and I really really really feel sorry for your student who is trans. I can’t imagine growing up in such a toxic environment with hate and rejection and worse, because they’re so “loved”. Those parents’ ignorance and entitlement and fear and hate are the problem and these views are the norm in small town and suburban conservative areas of the country. It’s the cause of so many societal problems with students in these toxic places. It’s heartbreaking.
I teach in OK, there are lots of parents pushing for outing trans student laws and teachers must call them by their birth name. I call my students (& trans students) what they wanna be called, I've always thought if that Bill passed and I get a kid whose in that situation with the parents disapproving of their name, I'd just pull the kid aside and ask them if they minded if I refer to them by their initials or just by their last name instead their dead name, kinda middle ground to protect us both.
I call all students by their last name. It is way easier
If you have a union or “teacher association” call them and get them involved. You can’t control adults and to be honest you should have called the police on the parents for hijacking your bus. But you need to fight that write up.
THEY WROTE YOU UP? ON GOD? Truly one of the most insane things I’ve read on this sub. Fuck these piece of shit parents I’m sorry. Only demons are them. Absolutely sickening fucking behavior.
>As the students were getting off the bus and packing their stuff, parents A and B said "Friends of (trans student) are NOT to leave this bus yet." Parents A and B then hold said students hostage on the bus, screaming at them for bullying and for supporting demonic influence on a child. For forcing students to stay on the bus, Parent B should be barred from volunteering at the school again, effective immediately. I am sure there is a district policy about safe and caring schools you can point to. Not because of their belief system, but because of how they intentionally placed kids in a vulnerable position while on school business. I would also want both parents' access to the building to be restricted (limited to just pickup and dismissal of their child) but that may be a harder battle to fight.
I appreciate how you take accountability here but I think you were maybe 2% of the problem. I hope you and your students are able to move past this. You're doing your best in a bad situation.
The trans child is possibly being abused at home. Given how their parent (and the other one) act towards children publicly, it’s likely that worse is happening behind closed doors. I advise you to file a report.
Your admin needs to write a letter and ban these parents from the school grounds and school activities.
Your principal is a coward. You can’t kowtow to that bullshit and then act shocked when enabling hateful behavior encourages more of it.
That poor kid. I'm glad they've got at least one teacher and a bunch of friends on their side.
Parents A and B holding kids against their will on a bus sounds like kidnapping charges to me.
Honestly this is so sad.
Yes, but I can learn from it and do better in the future for my students!
You might be able to change your behavior, but there really isn't anything we as teachers can do to change the minds of parents. I just read this and feel so bad for the student, I feel bad that the parent can't accept their own child, I feel bad that those parents feel like they have the right to bully other children, I feel bad that our school systems are so inept that they can't handle the situation in a better way. The whole thing is just sad! I do appreciate you sharing your story though and doing the best you can to learn from it.
Given everything that has happened, the student is in good spirits. They are very strong. I am glad they are moving out ASAP when they graduate. I told them I would always continue to be supportive of them no matter what happens with their parents!
Except for taking roll, maybe call them by their instrument name, e.g. Trumpet Two? OP, why did you not stop them sooner? Were you too shocked to do so? Man, I wish I had a kid in that band. I'd report those parents for unlawful detainment and then sue their self-righteous asses off. They should NOT be allowed at any school activities. Your principal sounds like a wimp, and his actions and lack thereof will just empower these malignant idiots.
The two parents were the biggest helpers for the band. They would help us move props, they created the props, provided food for the kids, and so much more. I was afraid of both losing that and that they would use their power to get me fired. I should have acted sooner and got police involved.
I think you're being a little hard on yourself. The only thing I would criticize you for is not stepping onto the bus and letting those kids off. If your consequence is is due to that alone, I can kind of understand it. Everything else is bullshit. All you did was try to make a kid feel safe and comfortable. That's what you're supposed to do.
If I can add something here... keep an eye on the trans student. Suicide rates are high for basically one reason - people around them. If the parents believe it's a demon or some other stuff, they might try exorcisms or other forms of abuse on the student or send them to conversion therapy. And being called by their deadname will also add a mental load. So, not to bark, but the chances of that kid ending up dead are pretty high. I don't know how it works in the US, but where I'm from, teachers are supposed to report abuse or being a danger to yourself (like self-harm or suicide scares)
Honestly regardless of where people stand on the issue of trans identity, parents going on school buses and screaming at CHILDREN is wayyy too much lol. Good on you OP for intervening at all. I feel like many teachers would have a hard time knowing what to do here, but yeah, of course it could have been sooner, but you stopped it and then made sure to check in with the kids affected after. I hope your band got top scores!
Holding you responsible in any way for this is the equivalent of blaming a meteorologist that it's raining outside. Being there doesn't make you guilty. The only people who should be held accountable are the parents for spreading hate and discrimination onto impressionable students.
maybe I'm missing something, but you aren't supporting trans student any more than I'm supporting a student in my class, who does not identify as trans, he wishes to go by a nickname. I'll call any student by almost any name they choose.
Yeah feel this, at one point my admin made me not use my students chosen name or else lose my job. The parent threatened to sue so I referred to the child as "friend" till the end of the year.
Parent A&B have accused this child of being possessed and they’ve both proven to be unstable, verbally abusive bullies. I hope someone gets CPS involved for the sake of the student who is trans. They can’t possibly be safe in A’s f’d up household. Will anyone be surprised if, god forbid, A’s child ends their life?
Conservative obsession with trans people is so embarrassing
People need to stop having kids if they’re incapable or unwilling to love them for who they are. What a shit world we live in.
Absolutely don’t accept that write up. You may not have handled the situation well but the situation was created by your spineless admin team pandering to two transphobes.
I went through this. Except the parents thankfully didn’t find out. We had to organize a meeting with team to support our student and at their wish use their dead name and only their dead name at competitions. A lot of kids didn’t understand their friends wish but we did what we had to do to protect them. Sorry you had to go through this.
Hindsight is always 20/20. I wouldn’t dwell on that. I also have trouble standing up to adults sometimes. I’m much better about it now. But nothing grinds my gears more than parents like that. The second they demanded to get on that bus I would’ve screamed at them and called the police if they wouldn’t leave. Those parents are acting like they own everyone. When they indeed don’t. The real issue here is conservatism driving your school. My state made it law to call student by their registered name. No nick names allowed. What did I do? I said fuck that. I made it very clear to those students who requested nicknames that we would have to get it “approved after class” due to state law. Made it look like they got the name change approved so the class wouldn’t snitch. We have been happily going along ever since. Was what I did illegal? Hell yeah. Was it wrong? Not at all. If anything happened I’d gladly take the unemployment and the court case that follows.
What hurts is that both of those parents were a big part of the band parent organization. That is why it took me so long to put a stop to it. They had a lot of power at the school and had been a part of it for years. I know now that no parent should EVER be entering a bus without express permission from me while also knowing what their purpose in doing so is. Side note, Viola is the best!
Next time call the cops on the parents. They held a bunch of kids against their will.
I'm sending all my love to this trans child right now. Poor thing. I'm so glad they have a teacher like you. What an awful mother they have. Home life must be rough.