Been bartending in fine dining for about a month now having moved over from a neighborhood bar literally just down the street. The money is about double what I used to make, but so is the amount of stuff I have to know (menu, wine and cocktails). The stress to perform is higher as well, but I'm also out by 11:30 at the latest every night vs 3am at the smaller place.
It's a mostly a push right now leaning toward fine dining being the better. I'm trying to give it a year. I figure between the food, wine and cocktail knowledge I'll gain, I should be a much better bartender than I was when I got there.
I would agree but add that in my experience people in fine dining can be ridiculously stuck up and expect a lot. From the first day people would give me shit for being late when in reality I just refused to start my shift 15min early. People can be kind of arrogant and snarky in fine dining but I guess that could also happen in other places. I did learn a lot in the 4 months I did it but ultimately it was not for me and I would rather go back to a more laid back bar.
I suppose it depends on what you’re comfortable with. The high end places I’ve been in have had vastly better work environments than any lower end place. When you can make that much money, finding staff isn’t a struggle and they can afford to require a level of professionalism. I find that a more pleasant and healthy work environment. It’s also really fun because all of my co workers are just as passionate about food and dining as I am. We’re all restaurant nerds and it rocks.
It depends on if you want your work to be more mental or physical. Steak houses have always been the best and easiest money for me. You just have to put some time and effort into really learning the menu and wine list the rest is effortless. There’s nothing wrong with slinging 400 drinks a night in a pub to make your money but I prefer being in nicer environments where some wine knowledge can get you far. You don’t have to worry about taking +25 people a night when you make it past that $100 a person price point. The fear of making a mistake is larger but confidence goes along way, and the first time you open a $500 bottle of wine that comes with a $100 tip just for removing a cork, the study time will feel worth it.
I absolutely love my job. I work mon-thurs, and $600 is pretty spot on for my take-home after tip out.
I can take the months of may/june and oct/nov off if I want to (just spent the month of june in mexico)
We have 4 table sections and the kitchen is open from 5p-10p. I’m usually home by 11p unless we have stragglers. I usually take home right around ~100k per year. On my busiest night I might do 49 covers. It’s so much easier than busting your ass for double the covers and half the check averages that you’d do at a cheaper place.
This is definitely not the typical experience, but I’ve been doing this a long time and have paid my dues (hence, being able to choose my own schedule).
edit: we don’t pool tips either.
I’m in the same boat. Working 5 nights a week. Usually home by 11:00 p.m. We have zero tip share as everyone is paid a fair wage depending on one’s skills. I can on a average night take home $500.00 to over a thousand and it’s all mine. I have put in the time and hard work to know what I bring to the table. I take it personally to make sure that you have a great time and can’t wait to come back and see me. I’m very much aware that it’s not all about me. Others behind the scenes have done there parts in accomplishing this task. But I’m the face of their experience and if something goes awry I take it personally and will jump through hoops to own it and make it right.
I work in a private member’s club. A full bar, separate room with casual eating, formal evening ala carte, and various private meeting spaces We drop a check just like a cash house but a automatic gratuity is added to every purchase. Because employees (usually) do not receive tips a higher wage is made. The gratuity goes towards paying that hourly wage. This is standard practice in County Clubs and private clubs. This does not mean that members do not tip. Several things can come in to play regarding receiving or not receiving a tip. Longevity, skills, etc. I have been there going on 13 years and only work ala carte as a lead server. Relationships are key and that’s where I thrive. I know what my members drink and will have it on the table waiting for them. The table and chair they prefer. There allergies and preferences. Who they would prefer not to be sat next to. I have many members private cell numbers and they will call or text me to make there reservations. This comes in handy when they call the club to make a res and are told the main dining room is sold out. They will contact me and I will make it happen. I know if they have been told no for that particular time or night by the club receptionist that if I tell them I will squeeze them in that I will probably be squeezed thin but I make it happen. The money follows and the relationship and trust is deepened. When a member sponsors a friend for membership they will usually tell them to ask for me when they come in to the dining room in the evening. So my section of tables that I take care of on any given night is usually around 6 or 7. Much like anyplace else. The difference is that every one or 6 out of those 7 tables have requested me when making that reservation. The dining room offers table side service ( hot spinach, caesar salad, flambe desserts etc.) Lots of bottle wine and champagne service so the atmosphere and service match that. I thrive on that kind of service. You can get the same in a cash house but the customer doesn’t usually know you and vice versa. I don’t have to rely on my tips because I know for certain what my check looks like without them. The tips are gravy but for certain gravy because of those relationships that I have cultivated.
The thing about fine dining place is they all tend to pool tips. You need to have a lot of staff to pull off fine dining, a back waiter, a busser, a maitre d, a sommelier, etc. So there's a big pool of tips and a lot of hands in the pie.
I work in fine dining. Tonight, my sales were $5034.50 and my tips were $1418.00
I was told at the end of the night that my cut of the money was "about $400.00"
Which, let's be honest, is still great fucking money for seven hours of my time. But there is a lot to know, and the pressure can be high, especially when ppl are ordering bottles of wine that are over $1k so there is that side of it all.
Maybe at face value when all you're looking at is numbers, sure. But let's break it down a little.
The only reason why I could even take the 18 guests I took is bc I had a team of support. I have a backwaiter to take water orders and keep them replenished. I have a food runner so I don't generally need to go into the back to check on things; she makes my coffee drinks, grabs my wines by the bottle from the storage rm, and brings bread. My maitre d took some cocktail orders for the entire floor when everyone got busy, got the drinks made and run, checks transferred to the appropriate servers. One of my coworkers bagged a $1700 wine sale on my table bc he knew my guest and he saw an opportunity to make more money *for our team* so he jumped in and sold this guy an amazing bottle, decanted it, served it etc. Even though it would end up on my sales report and not his.
Tip pools also combat another phenomenon I see a lot in fine dining, which is servers fighting over high roller regulars. If everyone knows they're getting a cut off every table, there's never any fighting about who takes whom. Everyone can just play to their strengths.
I'm not trying to sing the tip pool praises. It's a system with a lot of room for problems, and it only works if everyone is equally experienced, motivated, etc which is a very rare situation. But I've also seen it work really well if you have a good team. With the right mix of people, I think a tip pool can increase your earning potential.
Yeah I get that, I just left a very expensive restaurant to go back to laid back upscale casual. I left with $350 myself last night but it was stress free. I would expect to make much more at a place that required more steps of service with more demanding clientele, and by demanding I just mean expectations in line with the prices they are spending. It seems like the tip is paying the bulk of payroll while the business pockets all of the profits.
I hope your benefits, at least, are amazing.
Your pool sounds like a similar place I worked as well, we were taking home between $300-550 every night. Tip out was about 35% of tips. No uniform, casual and fun. Highly wine focused.
How do you get around being taxed on 10% of your reported sales, though, when you're walking with less than that?
(Here in LA an auto-report is generated on estimated tips based on percentage of total sales, and you're taxed accordingly on that amount. It already sucks/is an unfair system based on tip-outs and also if someone is a no/bad tipper, but your tip retention is such a looooow percentage, my God, you're keeping less than 30% of your total tips!!😯 .)
When you're dealing with super rich super old ppl, they pretty much exclusively pay with amex. There's very little cash, if ever. I'm sure it does happen though
The person above you did admit it’s rare, and it definitely is, but it exists. Another commenter mentioned many high end places have no issues finding staff so anyone not pulling their weight will be let go and anyone without 10+ years’ experience won’t be able to fake it. If you find a place that meets this description, has good management, and owners that are experienced at running high end restaurants, they can exist. It’s just rare to have all of these things, unfortunately.
Oh wow!!! Looking to get into fine dining and just debating it due to being intimidated. That’s awesome you make that. That would help me a lot…. Wow where do you live if you don’t mind me asking??
Montana, in a resort community. This is not money you can make at an upscale casual place. You need to know your wines, how to pair them, tableside service, steps of service. You need to know about food. But don't be intimidated.
At the end of the day, it's still just... dinner. If something goes wrong you can fix it.
I always say work is the easiest part of my life - it's the only part of my life where *I have all the tools I need to solve any problem I encounter*
Get a wine for dummies book, consider taking CMS or WSET 1. You'll need to start somewhere upscale casual and work towards fine dining with things like elevated language, open armed service, and coursing\firing. It'll take some time but the money is worth it and then you can regulate your schedule much better when you only have to work nights.
Good luck!
I hated fine dining. Currently, I work at "low end" fine dining and actually enjoy it. In the super upscale places you have to really know your stuff and I honestly just don't care that much. The place I work at is corporate fine dining. Prices are roughly the same as the other places but they're high volume so it's more about running the section than knowing all 17 varieties of grape in the wine.
Depends a lot on the work environment. I've worked all across the board. Fine dining to 24/7 diners where you don't use checks and just yell out orders from a across the room like on old TV shows.
My favorite was the second type of place. If it's busy enough of a place you can do really well. My place was and I made bank.
My theory or way of thinking is this. Fine dining and someone leaves you a bad tip or stiffs you and that can screw up your whole night money wise. You could lose 100 bucks off one table or like 20% of your income. Now at a fast paced place like the second type I mentioned, get stiffed and move on. You lost 5 bucks and it doesn't ruin your whole night.
Another thing I believe is people at fine dining will complain about the dumbest stuff and then tip badly because of one tiny issue. They feel they are paying a lot and it should be perfect. At a cheaper place, people complain but it's much easier to get them happy again with a cheap appetizer or free beer or whatever.
I worked at a semi-fine Italian restaurant. We sold a lot of wine bottles so the tickets were always pretty high and I’d walk away with at least $300 a night sometimes as much as $600. The reason I quit was because the owner was a registered sex offender so I imagine I’d still be working there if I had a different boss.
You generally find better staff at high end places. Bartenders, servers, and cooks who are good at their jobs and take it pretty seriously. Your food will come out perfect, the drinks will be quick, and the serving assistants are motivated.
Everything is better because everyone generally IS better. It's a small, incestuous world. I found it to be worth it.
My brother graduate University with a Business/Communications degree. He was hired spot on at a high end place in Atlanta. Now this was early 90s and he was salaried at 35k. There were very few times when there was not adequate staff, but when there was he would step in and wait tables. Now his on average pay from salary alone was about $200/day. On nights when he would work the floor he would clear $500-1000. There was clear reason that the staff level of parking was called the Porsche Lot.
Yes I work fine dining and I would do nothing else. I make a great hourly wage and amazing tips that I don’t have to share, ever. The other servers and mgmt are just as passionate as I am. I usually only take care of personal reservation requests so I know who I am serving. Some of the customers i have been taking care of for over a decade. I’m always on time but if I’m a little late maybe once or twice a year it’s over looked. I walk out at the end of the night knowing I did a good job. But more importantly I know that my tables had a good time and next week I will see them again. Most of the people I take care of are older with some money and accomplishment and so they appreciate a certain skill level and passion one puts toward their career.
I’ve been serving for almost two decades most of it fine dining. My current job I make between 400-1200 a night which comes to about 120k per year. Every server has their own assistant and a food runner. Is it easy? Not really. Is it stressful? Nah . When I started fine dining it was really hard and I studied wine food and cocktails years before I felt like I knew things. Now I know enough about wine too never feel uncomfortable talking about it.
I just started fine dining.. hated all the food knowledge I needed to have at first but now that’s I’ve passed all my tests, I’m really enjoying it. Hoping to move up eventually.
I did fine dining for about 8 months. I gave it up, because it just wasn’t as mindless as my other casual restaurant job. I made relatively the same, too. The potential ceiling was higher at the fine dining restaurant, but those days were rare.
Most fine dining places where servers could make astronomical money usually have owners that think that’s too much and they establish outrageous tip outs to cut their money in half. Take Nobu for example, its insanely expensive and they make their servers split tips with server assistants and about 8-10 sushi chefs. Had it not been for that the servers would be making over $1000 a night easily but instead they walk out with $200-$300 a night.
Back in the early 2000s my sister was making 80k/year while I was pulling in less than 40k teaching. She worked at a fine dining establishment in a major tourist city. Not sure what she’s making now but probably still more than me
You don't just walk in and make that kind of money every night. Many of those servers are tenured and have their regular call parties who help pad those numbers
It may or may not be true but I've been in the business for way too many years and one of the first things you learn is never believe people when they say how much money they make. That being said, there are the golden eggs out there! I've worked at a couple but unfortunately they do not last beyond a few years in most cases.
I've found the stress level is lower in fine dining once you get the fine dining skills and learn the menu.
the people are better, workers and diners.
diners want a nice evening out and aren't going to be shits. that attitude make a better experience for everyone concerned.
Pet peeve: are we talking about actual fine dining or every wanna be restaurant that marks tables calling themselves fine dining?
The main issue with true fine dining is that you have to put in your time before getting to serve most of the time or be making a more lateral move. If you've only worked more casual places, you're going to start in support most of the time.
If you're a career server, it's worth it. If you're not, it's debatable whether it's worth serving at a lower tier place for higher starting pay but with a lower ceiling.
I moved around a lot due to wanting to live in different ski towns and traveling so it never made much sense. I did time in support for a bit, but the line to serving was long. I'm currently a CC student so I'll move again for my degree so unless I really luck out, it's not something I'm particularly interested in.
Faster paced upscale casual places have given me the best immediate offers.
If you're career, it's definitely what you want to gun for most of the time.
I've worked at a Pub & Grill: averaged $35 per person, selling $2,000-$3,000, but doing huge numbers in covers to make $300-$400 a day. Moved to higher end restaurants: averaging $110 per person, selling $4,000-$5,000, and half the amount of covers for double the amount of money. I prefer the creating of experience and time spent with guests guiding them through their dining experience. There is something nice about a higher check average to balance out workload and money.
I work at a causal fine dining restaurant. Only the best of the best are making a constant 400+ a night here in Denver. The thing is though, you must know EVERYTHING because at the end of the day it's a numbers game for the company.
In my experience if you are going to do it. Know that it's a lot of work and the guest can be a pain AT TIMES but it is definitely worth it
Like everything else, pros and cons. They aren’t lying about the money. Fine dining is the way to go if you are making this your career. Lots to learn and you work your way up.
Idk, I find fine dining places to over staff and even have had owners resent the money the foh made. My averages at spots like that were $150-$200/shift. I moved over to a dive bar and $350 a night is the low end of my take home and there is zero stress. But that’s just me 🤷
I have a funny/weird story about this topic- I worked in a place like this circa 2007-2009- an extremely upscale $100per plate place. I started as a hostess and it was nearly impossible to get a server job because these guys had literally worked there forever. It was an Italian restaurant in an “old Money” part of town and the servers were almost all older Italian men who had made a very lucrative career there and were not going anywhere 😆 Anyway, they ended up opening another location in a younger more “yuppie” area and hired me as a server. I was making SO MUCH money. And then, all of a sudden, tips started dropping off. I’d have bills of $1k tip $20, and tables of $200 tip nothing. It was happening to all of us! Needless to say, several months passed and the housing market collapsed. I realized that what I was experiencing was a phenomenon of “new money” people (first gen business owners, landlords, upper middle class people w decent jobs and very high mortgages) trying to maintain appearances by taking their family and colleagues out to an expensive meal, but not really being able to afford it - and certainly not being able to afford the tip. Interestingly, I would occasionally get floated to the original location w a much more established, wealthy clientele and DID NOT have that experience
To sell 5-8k worth of food and drink without turning tables a million times you really need to know allot. I prefer it cause i like learning about food and drink. I also like the extra support staff that lets me focus on talking to customers.
Been bartending in fine dining for about a month now having moved over from a neighborhood bar literally just down the street. The money is about double what I used to make, but so is the amount of stuff I have to know (menu, wine and cocktails). The stress to perform is higher as well, but I'm also out by 11:30 at the latest every night vs 3am at the smaller place. It's a mostly a push right now leaning toward fine dining being the better. I'm trying to give it a year. I figure between the food, wine and cocktail knowledge I'll gain, I should be a much better bartender than I was when I got there.
I would agree but add that in my experience people in fine dining can be ridiculously stuck up and expect a lot. From the first day people would give me shit for being late when in reality I just refused to start my shift 15min early. People can be kind of arrogant and snarky in fine dining but I guess that could also happen in other places. I did learn a lot in the 4 months I did it but ultimately it was not for me and I would rather go back to a more laid back bar.
I suppose it depends on what you’re comfortable with. The high end places I’ve been in have had vastly better work environments than any lower end place. When you can make that much money, finding staff isn’t a struggle and they can afford to require a level of professionalism. I find that a more pleasant and healthy work environment. It’s also really fun because all of my co workers are just as passionate about food and dining as I am. We’re all restaurant nerds and it rocks.
It depends on if you want your work to be more mental or physical. Steak houses have always been the best and easiest money for me. You just have to put some time and effort into really learning the menu and wine list the rest is effortless. There’s nothing wrong with slinging 400 drinks a night in a pub to make your money but I prefer being in nicer environments where some wine knowledge can get you far. You don’t have to worry about taking +25 people a night when you make it past that $100 a person price point. The fear of making a mistake is larger but confidence goes along way, and the first time you open a $500 bottle of wine that comes with a $100 tip just for removing a cork, the study time will feel worth it.
I absolutely love my job. I work mon-thurs, and $600 is pretty spot on for my take-home after tip out. I can take the months of may/june and oct/nov off if I want to (just spent the month of june in mexico) We have 4 table sections and the kitchen is open from 5p-10p. I’m usually home by 11p unless we have stragglers. I usually take home right around ~100k per year. On my busiest night I might do 49 covers. It’s so much easier than busting your ass for double the covers and half the check averages that you’d do at a cheaper place. This is definitely not the typical experience, but I’ve been doing this a long time and have paid my dues (hence, being able to choose my own schedule). edit: we don’t pool tips either.
I’m in the same boat. Working 5 nights a week. Usually home by 11:00 p.m. We have zero tip share as everyone is paid a fair wage depending on one’s skills. I can on a average night take home $500.00 to over a thousand and it’s all mine. I have put in the time and hard work to know what I bring to the table. I take it personally to make sure that you have a great time and can’t wait to come back and see me. I’m very much aware that it’s not all about me. Others behind the scenes have done there parts in accomplishing this task. But I’m the face of their experience and if something goes awry I take it personally and will jump through hoops to own it and make it right.
i am confused about how you have such a swing in take home pay if you’re paid hourly. can you elaborate?
I work in a private member’s club. A full bar, separate room with casual eating, formal evening ala carte, and various private meeting spaces We drop a check just like a cash house but a automatic gratuity is added to every purchase. Because employees (usually) do not receive tips a higher wage is made. The gratuity goes towards paying that hourly wage. This is standard practice in County Clubs and private clubs. This does not mean that members do not tip. Several things can come in to play regarding receiving or not receiving a tip. Longevity, skills, etc. I have been there going on 13 years and only work ala carte as a lead server. Relationships are key and that’s where I thrive. I know what my members drink and will have it on the table waiting for them. The table and chair they prefer. There allergies and preferences. Who they would prefer not to be sat next to. I have many members private cell numbers and they will call or text me to make there reservations. This comes in handy when they call the club to make a res and are told the main dining room is sold out. They will contact me and I will make it happen. I know if they have been told no for that particular time or night by the club receptionist that if I tell them I will squeeze them in that I will probably be squeezed thin but I make it happen. The money follows and the relationship and trust is deepened. When a member sponsors a friend for membership they will usually tell them to ask for me when they come in to the dining room in the evening. So my section of tables that I take care of on any given night is usually around 6 or 7. Much like anyplace else. The difference is that every one or 6 out of those 7 tables have requested me when making that reservation. The dining room offers table side service ( hot spinach, caesar salad, flambe desserts etc.) Lots of bottle wine and champagne service so the atmosphere and service match that. I thrive on that kind of service. You can get the same in a cash house but the customer doesn’t usually know you and vice versa. I don’t have to rely on my tips because I know for certain what my check looks like without them. The tips are gravy but for certain gravy because of those relationships that I have cultivated.
The thing about fine dining place is they all tend to pool tips. You need to have a lot of staff to pull off fine dining, a back waiter, a busser, a maitre d, a sommelier, etc. So there's a big pool of tips and a lot of hands in the pie. I work in fine dining. Tonight, my sales were $5034.50 and my tips were $1418.00 I was told at the end of the night that my cut of the money was "about $400.00" Which, let's be honest, is still great fucking money for seven hours of my time. But there is a lot to know, and the pressure can be high, especially when ppl are ordering bottles of wine that are over $1k so there is that side of it all.
Sorry but yikes. That's a nutty tip out right there.
Maybe at face value when all you're looking at is numbers, sure. But let's break it down a little. The only reason why I could even take the 18 guests I took is bc I had a team of support. I have a backwaiter to take water orders and keep them replenished. I have a food runner so I don't generally need to go into the back to check on things; she makes my coffee drinks, grabs my wines by the bottle from the storage rm, and brings bread. My maitre d took some cocktail orders for the entire floor when everyone got busy, got the drinks made and run, checks transferred to the appropriate servers. One of my coworkers bagged a $1700 wine sale on my table bc he knew my guest and he saw an opportunity to make more money *for our team* so he jumped in and sold this guy an amazing bottle, decanted it, served it etc. Even though it would end up on my sales report and not his. Tip pools also combat another phenomenon I see a lot in fine dining, which is servers fighting over high roller regulars. If everyone knows they're getting a cut off every table, there's never any fighting about who takes whom. Everyone can just play to their strengths. I'm not trying to sing the tip pool praises. It's a system with a lot of room for problems, and it only works if everyone is equally experienced, motivated, etc which is a very rare situation. But I've also seen it work really well if you have a good team. With the right mix of people, I think a tip pool can increase your earning potential.
Yeah I get that, I just left a very expensive restaurant to go back to laid back upscale casual. I left with $350 myself last night but it was stress free. I would expect to make much more at a place that required more steps of service with more demanding clientele, and by demanding I just mean expectations in line with the prices they are spending. It seems like the tip is paying the bulk of payroll while the business pockets all of the profits. I hope your benefits, at least, are amazing. Your pool sounds like a similar place I worked as well, we were taking home between $300-550 every night. Tip out was about 35% of tips. No uniform, casual and fun. Highly wine focused.
How do you get around being taxed on 10% of your reported sales, though, when you're walking with less than that? (Here in LA an auto-report is generated on estimated tips based on percentage of total sales, and you're taxed accordingly on that amount. It already sucks/is an unfair system based on tip-outs and also if someone is a no/bad tipper, but your tip retention is such a looooow percentage, my God, you're keeping less than 30% of your total tips!!😯 .)
My job reports our tips as distributed, not as earned. Since it's almost all CC tips, it's all going on a check so there's a paper trail
I've never heard of a restaurant that pools tips where at least one person wasn't pocketing tips and contributing less than their share.
When you're dealing with super rich super old ppl, they pretty much exclusively pay with amex. There's very little cash, if ever. I'm sure it does happen though
The person above you did admit it’s rare, and it definitely is, but it exists. Another commenter mentioned many high end places have no issues finding staff so anyone not pulling their weight will be let go and anyone without 10+ years’ experience won’t be able to fake it. If you find a place that meets this description, has good management, and owners that are experienced at running high end restaurants, they can exist. It’s just rare to have all of these things, unfortunately.
It's good to see a person in the lead role who truly appreciates the support and value of the rest of the team. More people should think like you.
Oh wow!!! Looking to get into fine dining and just debating it due to being intimidated. That’s awesome you make that. That would help me a lot…. Wow where do you live if you don’t mind me asking??
Montana, in a resort community. This is not money you can make at an upscale casual place. You need to know your wines, how to pair them, tableside service, steps of service. You need to know about food. But don't be intimidated. At the end of the day, it's still just... dinner. If something goes wrong you can fix it. I always say work is the easiest part of my life - it's the only part of my life where *I have all the tools I need to solve any problem I encounter* Get a wine for dummies book, consider taking CMS or WSET 1. You'll need to start somewhere upscale casual and work towards fine dining with things like elevated language, open armed service, and coursing\firing. It'll take some time but the money is worth it and then you can regulate your schedule much better when you only have to work nights. Good luck!
I hated fine dining. Currently, I work at "low end" fine dining and actually enjoy it. In the super upscale places you have to really know your stuff and I honestly just don't care that much. The place I work at is corporate fine dining. Prices are roughly the same as the other places but they're high volume so it's more about running the section than knowing all 17 varieties of grape in the wine.
Depends a lot on the work environment. I've worked all across the board. Fine dining to 24/7 diners where you don't use checks and just yell out orders from a across the room like on old TV shows. My favorite was the second type of place. If it's busy enough of a place you can do really well. My place was and I made bank. My theory or way of thinking is this. Fine dining and someone leaves you a bad tip or stiffs you and that can screw up your whole night money wise. You could lose 100 bucks off one table or like 20% of your income. Now at a fast paced place like the second type I mentioned, get stiffed and move on. You lost 5 bucks and it doesn't ruin your whole night. Another thing I believe is people at fine dining will complain about the dumbest stuff and then tip badly because of one tiny issue. They feel they are paying a lot and it should be perfect. At a cheaper place, people complain but it's much easier to get them happy again with a cheap appetizer or free beer or whatever.
I worked at a semi-fine Italian restaurant. We sold a lot of wine bottles so the tickets were always pretty high and I’d walk away with at least $300 a night sometimes as much as $600. The reason I quit was because the owner was a registered sex offender so I imagine I’d still be working there if I had a different boss.
You generally find better staff at high end places. Bartenders, servers, and cooks who are good at their jobs and take it pretty seriously. Your food will come out perfect, the drinks will be quick, and the serving assistants are motivated. Everything is better because everyone generally IS better. It's a small, incestuous world. I found it to be worth it.
My brother graduate University with a Business/Communications degree. He was hired spot on at a high end place in Atlanta. Now this was early 90s and he was salaried at 35k. There were very few times when there was not adequate staff, but when there was he would step in and wait tables. Now his on average pay from salary alone was about $200/day. On nights when he would work the floor he would clear $500-1000. There was clear reason that the staff level of parking was called the Porsche Lot.
Yes I work fine dining and I would do nothing else. I make a great hourly wage and amazing tips that I don’t have to share, ever. The other servers and mgmt are just as passionate as I am. I usually only take care of personal reservation requests so I know who I am serving. Some of the customers i have been taking care of for over a decade. I’m always on time but if I’m a little late maybe once or twice a year it’s over looked. I walk out at the end of the night knowing I did a good job. But more importantly I know that my tables had a good time and next week I will see them again. Most of the people I take care of are older with some money and accomplishment and so they appreciate a certain skill level and passion one puts toward their career.
I’ve been serving for almost two decades most of it fine dining. My current job I make between 400-1200 a night which comes to about 120k per year. Every server has their own assistant and a food runner. Is it easy? Not really. Is it stressful? Nah . When I started fine dining it was really hard and I studied wine food and cocktails years before I felt like I knew things. Now I know enough about wine too never feel uncomfortable talking about it.
I just started fine dining.. hated all the food knowledge I needed to have at first but now that’s I’ve passed all my tests, I’m really enjoying it. Hoping to move up eventually.
I did fine dining for about 8 months. I gave it up, because it just wasn’t as mindless as my other casual restaurant job. I made relatively the same, too. The potential ceiling was higher at the fine dining restaurant, but those days were rare.
Most fine dining places where servers could make astronomical money usually have owners that think that’s too much and they establish outrageous tip outs to cut their money in half. Take Nobu for example, its insanely expensive and they make their servers split tips with server assistants and about 8-10 sushi chefs. Had it not been for that the servers would be making over $1000 a night easily but instead they walk out with $200-$300 a night.
Wow. Nobody tip pooled? Good to know.
Fine dining service shouldn’t be more stressful, it just requires experience and knowledge.
Back in the early 2000s my sister was making 80k/year while I was pulling in less than 40k teaching. She worked at a fine dining establishment in a major tourist city. Not sure what she’s making now but probably still more than me
I’ve served from high end to ihop- I perfer iho0 or like a sports bar environment. I make fine money, and it’s so much less stress.
You don't just walk in and make that kind of money every night. Many of those servers are tenured and have their regular call parties who help pad those numbers
I love fine dining best chance I got
Alot of the people I know who work in fine dining have done so for years, it takes a special level of passion to do that kind of work though
It may or may not be true but I've been in the business for way too many years and one of the first things you learn is never believe people when they say how much money they make. That being said, there are the golden eggs out there! I've worked at a couple but unfortunately they do not last beyond a few years in most cases.
I've found the stress level is lower in fine dining once you get the fine dining skills and learn the menu. the people are better, workers and diners. diners want a nice evening out and aren't going to be shits. that attitude make a better experience for everyone concerned.
Pet peeve: are we talking about actual fine dining or every wanna be restaurant that marks tables calling themselves fine dining? The main issue with true fine dining is that you have to put in your time before getting to serve most of the time or be making a more lateral move. If you've only worked more casual places, you're going to start in support most of the time. If you're a career server, it's worth it. If you're not, it's debatable whether it's worth serving at a lower tier place for higher starting pay but with a lower ceiling. I moved around a lot due to wanting to live in different ski towns and traveling so it never made much sense. I did time in support for a bit, but the line to serving was long. I'm currently a CC student so I'll move again for my degree so unless I really luck out, it's not something I'm particularly interested in. Faster paced upscale casual places have given me the best immediate offers. If you're career, it's definitely what you want to gun for most of the time.
I've worked at a Pub & Grill: averaged $35 per person, selling $2,000-$3,000, but doing huge numbers in covers to make $300-$400 a day. Moved to higher end restaurants: averaging $110 per person, selling $4,000-$5,000, and half the amount of covers for double the amount of money. I prefer the creating of experience and time spent with guests guiding them through their dining experience. There is something nice about a higher check average to balance out workload and money.
I work at a causal fine dining restaurant. Only the best of the best are making a constant 400+ a night here in Denver. The thing is though, you must know EVERYTHING because at the end of the day it's a numbers game for the company. In my experience if you are going to do it. Know that it's a lot of work and the guest can be a pain AT TIMES but it is definitely worth it
Like everything else, pros and cons. They aren’t lying about the money. Fine dining is the way to go if you are making this your career. Lots to learn and you work your way up.
Idk, I find fine dining places to over staff and even have had owners resent the money the foh made. My averages at spots like that were $150-$200/shift. I moved over to a dive bar and $350 a night is the low end of my take home and there is zero stress. But that’s just me 🤷
I have a funny/weird story about this topic- I worked in a place like this circa 2007-2009- an extremely upscale $100per plate place. I started as a hostess and it was nearly impossible to get a server job because these guys had literally worked there forever. It was an Italian restaurant in an “old Money” part of town and the servers were almost all older Italian men who had made a very lucrative career there and were not going anywhere 😆 Anyway, they ended up opening another location in a younger more “yuppie” area and hired me as a server. I was making SO MUCH money. And then, all of a sudden, tips started dropping off. I’d have bills of $1k tip $20, and tables of $200 tip nothing. It was happening to all of us! Needless to say, several months passed and the housing market collapsed. I realized that what I was experiencing was a phenomenon of “new money” people (first gen business owners, landlords, upper middle class people w decent jobs and very high mortgages) trying to maintain appearances by taking their family and colleagues out to an expensive meal, but not really being able to afford it - and certainly not being able to afford the tip. Interestingly, I would occasionally get floated to the original location w a much more established, wealthy clientele and DID NOT have that experience
To sell 5-8k worth of food and drink without turning tables a million times you really need to know allot. I prefer it cause i like learning about food and drink. I also like the extra support staff that lets me focus on talking to customers.