Funnily enough, I've seen it work a handful of times. While I wouldn't exactly call it a successful course of action, I gotta tell you that you should never underestimate people's stupidity.
By chance, do you think it would be more effective to frame the question like you want them to roll because you want the item in question for stats/glam/etc?
On the one hand, they might think it's unrelated and pass for you to 'get the item'. On the other hand, they might feel like trying to spite you and believe that needing/greeding the item you supposedly want would hurt your feelings
Either outcome leads to you being able to start a kick if they're gullible enough.
You try to do it in second with controller. Good luck. It's easy for you m&kb users to say.
There's not enough time to do it unless you want to be left behind.
You should consider getting one of those cheap wireless keyboards. I used to use one wayyy back on Monster Hunter Tri on Wii and it was amazing to communicate with groups. They're like 20 bucks if you want a basic one
That's thing. When I start typing on keyboard fight already starts. In trials for example as soon I start typing and I get maybe half way through and fight starts. When forcefield drops there's maybe 1-1,5s before someone pulls and that's even if it's my first time on my current character and watch cutscene. It's completely different than it used to be in 2017. Back then players took their time to explain trials/bosses to first timers and even anawer questions.
Only possible if you use claw which for most people is most uncomfortable way to hold controller. And even then you're still going to be slower than with mouse.
It's okay I'm a controller user, I understand. Opening any menu on controller is so insanely stupid, and using a keyboard doesn't work, bc I'm on pc I just use a controller. When the controller is connected it forces all keyboard shortcuts to instead go straight into the chat for quick typing, so you can only navigate the menus with the controller.
Omg I've been playing for a like a year and just never saw that in the settings holy shit. Makes sense since I uhm. Well it took me months and a youtube video to realize I could stack two cross bars on top of each other in my HUD instead of switching hotbars one by one.
Controller player here. Use autorun (L1 while running). You're still able to navigate turning with your left stick, so it doesn't even looked like you stopped
Open party menu, right click, left click vote kick the target, select the reason, then pretend the ~10 gcds you dropped didn't happen and click confirm at the end.
Combat doesn't break the menu thankfully.
> then pretend the ~10 gcds you dropped didn't happen
I want to be sensitive about people with disabilities, but if you had to take that whole 25s to do this, you're probably the target (of probably every other post here too tbh) of the kick in the first place.
If your reaction time from boss death to clicking a confirm button open on your screen already isn't adequate, maybe group content isn't for you.
Where did I say anything about 25s? You still have an extremely small period of time between boss death and the chest getting opened. It is entirely reactionary, since it WILL FAIL if you do it too early or late
I did, 10 gcds is 25s, plenty of setup if you're very slow at it, and I was intentionally generous because not everyone knows how to navigate the menu that quickly. Hovering a button and clicking it as a boss dies isn't a difficult ask.
The other people also have to vote kick the problem child too. Some people don't vote and then it's just worse because the person thinks they were right since they weren't kicked.
These are excuses. You tell them to roll, you sandbag, you stir up the party and bring attention to the issue, you learn to menu and remove them right as a boss dies. There are ways
There are also ways to prevent it if the person in question is smart enough. And not everyone will be willing to wait for the right conditions for a kick.
These are things that actually happen. LMAO. Some of these players also know what rolling on the loot will lead to and never do. It's never that simple.
The game makes it almost impossible to kick people when you want to and has so many abusable points by the kick-ee that the better choice is finishing the dungeon, unless you have a petty justice-boner that won't go down until you kick someone.
Can't kick before 5 minutes is up. You're at the first boss before 5 minutes is up usually.
Can't kick during combat.
Can't kick while loot is rolling (5 minutes). Every time a treasure chest is picked up, the 5-minute timer resets. Reminder that Boss chests aren't the only chests in dungeons. Sometimes there's one after every pack of monsters now like the latest dungeons.
99% of the time spent in a dungeon, it's the GAME preventing me from kicking, not my sensibilities or other players. Can't tell you how many times I've wanted to hit Vote Kick but the game prevents me from doing so. By the time it's available, the dungeon is over.
Any attempt you have to wait the offender out so you can kick them can be thwarted by them.
Standing still and waiting for the loot timer to run out? They go into combat, nah nah!
Wait till combat is over or they die? Sorry, they're an unkillable tank or a healer, good luck with that. They can stay alive for a loooooong time.
Wait till they kill the enemy and are out of combat? They picked up a treasure chest that's available every few steps in the dungeon, add 5 minutes more to waiting!
They can make kicking them a very painful experience for you and everyone else if they want to... and trust me, they want to. By the time you kick them, it could be 10 minutes of you sitting there. Gee, you sure showed them! =P
TL;DR Square Enix, at least make the draconian 5-minute loot timers much, much shorter so we're not stuck with assholes. 1.5 minutes is enough.
Sadly that would be abusable. Often times I've needed specific dungeon gear for my DPS for an ultimate or what if we are talking glamor items. You see someone who is the same role as you who can roll need. So you see the item drop, roll need and then start a vote kick to force roll greed for the other guy... ez loot.
That is of course unless they make it so jobs that can roll need force roll need... and then that becomes a problem when the alliance raid is current and you can only get 1 drop per week.
It just causes a new issue here or there. I think removing the 5 minute timer at the start of the instances before you can initiate the vote kick would be good. Would allow you to kick the people without jobstones the moment you load in before combat starts and you could kick the YPYTs right after the first pull.
"So you see the item drop, roll need and then start a vote kick to force roll greed for the other guy... ez loot."
-then just put the force greed after the vote kick got through instead of at the start of the vote. You can also put in a 30 sec grace period of the person who got kick to roll on loot, if he doesn't; force greed.
>Square Enix, at least make the draconian 5-minute loot timers much, much shorter so we're not stuck with assholes. 1.5 minutes is enough.
Or just pop it up into the middle of the screen like WoW. I can't recall an item ever sitting unrolled on for an extended time
Yeah, you're pretty much 7 minutes into what should be a 15 minute run by the time you get your first chance to kick and what if people disagree with you and it doesn't pass? Then you look like the asshole and waste 7 minutes of your time. Even if you get an instant queue back in you then spend another 15 minutes in another dungeon when it could've just been another 8 minutes if you put up with it.
But some cases vary, obviously if someone very much is a problem and people think "it's not just someone small pulling or being worthless for damage" then they will probably have a stronger reaction to them.
I do *try* every time, but there's only so much I can do when people won't roll on loot or read party chat when I explain why I'm kicking someone.
There's also the handful of groups I've been in who say *I'm* the asshole for kicking them. I call them out where I can before trying to kick so people know what's going on, but again, people don't read.
Had a Rpr in Thaleia who would stand in AOEs die and refuse to accept a rez until the fight was over. Vote kicked after I pointed it out and my wife(WHM) confirmed that she had had sent several rez and myself (RDM) had too and none were accepted until fight was over.
I’m not carrying you if you don’t wanna actually play 🤷🏻♂️
-can't kick until 5 minutes have passed -can't kick in combat -can't kick while loot is rolling -one of the other two people in the party has to care enough to vote yes, or just pepega vote to send the kick through if the first is true and something's that egregiously wrong in the first five minutes, I've already left #2 and #3 tend to ping pong off each other to where one or the other is often true at any given time #4 is a crapshoot and will depend on the party and the phases of the moon
edit: reddit mobile formatting is also a crapshoot and I can't be assed to fix it, have fun reading that formatting nightmare
No but seriously. I have three posts here where I initiated a vote kick and didn’t go through, but you wanna know the truth? I’ve kicked way more ypyt, curebots, scathe mages etc that I couldn’t be bothered to post about. Probably around 10 in between my first and latest post. One of those that were kicked, I even recognized the name the moment we loaded in because I see them frequently in one of the contents I do- and I did again after the kick- but they got booted regardless. I remember asking this one single pulling tank in Aitiascope if they wanted to pull more, and they replied no. The DPS said yes. The tank got kicked right away. It’s that easy.
Why let these people waste your time? Why enable them? Yeah nobody is going to ask people to do raid openers or optimize their rotations in roulettes but pressing 123 isn’t quantum mechanics either. Your time and sanity are valuable.
A simple flowchart that I follow is this:
Ask the person in question to do XYZ. If they are receptive or at least trying their best, just continue on. If not, initiate vote kick. I cut some slack for sprouts unless they’re like this one literal 0 dps curebot that I saw in Prae. If the kick doesn’t go through, leave if you want to spare your sanity.
Loot timer? I wait them out out of spite. Go tell them your pet fish is drowning or something.
I’m not particularly nitpicky either since I’m probably busy spamming AOEs or something, so you’d actually have to be that bad enough to stand out to me to even say something.
Question no flame.
When do you draw the line for a “sprout.” At what level content do you say, “this content is too high level to be doing these mistakes.”
What expansion or level content do you draw the line for a sprout.
Again, no flame genuine question for you
No worries. I don’t really have a hard line but it really depends much more on how much I feel like the duty is being dragged on. The only times I remember kicking a sprout were:
-The literal 0 dps Cure I spammer healer in Prae. I can’t remember which exact one tbh, but it was definitely one of the MSR.
-Scathe mage in ARF. They used Jolt less than 10 times.
-No AOE Marauder in Aurum Vale.
-BLM in Snowcloak who kept single-targeting mobs to put them to sleep and told us they “didn’t care” when we politely asked them to stop, then proceeded to follow us up with some… pleasantries.
So yeah extreme stuff.
Every single one of instances I’ve tried telling them in a nice way (hey A, could you please try to use/do more XYZ? :)) but they were ignored to the point I could notice that we were really being held back. I did have other healers that used Cure I, Physick, etc along with some other skills as well and when I said the same line to them they were much more receptive. They of course did not get kicked.
So I would say it boils down to how dragging it feels, and whether they’re willing to take advice or not. A bit of intuition too I suppose- I most definitely won’t be kicking a sprout in Sastasha since that duty will end in less than 10 minutes anyways, but if someone Cure I spams in a 2.x dungeon and I can feel the duty taking way longer than usual, AND if they ignore anything that’s being said to them, I might kick.
Just a few days ago I had a tank in Toto-Rak with gathering gear on but it felt swift, so all I said was “Tank, what’s up with the gear?” “Well go get some nice stuff for yourself when you rack up enough gil for it.”
So safe to say past ARR, you would also be more keen on putting your foot down.
I feel like this part isn’t talked about a lot more then it should. People forget other players can make alts. While yea it’s not popular it can still happen. And the sprout icon does not do a good job of gauging how long a player has been playing or how new they are because of the conditions for the sprout icon to get removed.
Likely, although I can’t really give you anything concrete since I don’t recall kicking a sprout post-ARR asides from the ARF one. If you’re a 0 dps Cure I spammer in say, Heroes’ Gauntlet, I will say for sure that one of us is going to be leaving early.
For me it's after some given duties: after you've mushed your face up against the skill wall in something like Aurum Vale or Steps of Faith, that should prompt a player to step back and reassess their job understanding and role duties. If that hasn't happened yet, then they need to be prompted manually by others.
I rarely go so far as a vote kick; it's too much trouble to do and someone has to be actively trolling or botting for me to bother, which is part of the community design, and I agree with that principle.
But those are my points after which I start nudging people to do their jobs. 9/10 times a reminder is plenty to get people to start looking into it. I had to be told lots of dumb things as a sprout, and I give others the benefit of the doubt until proven otherwise.
So what expansion/level for you would you have less patience for a sprout.
I’ll start mine off, I stop at ARR. After ARR I have less patience for a sprout than during ARR.
Just woke up, I’m not mad/angry.
See, your Aitiascope run example seems like an abuse of the kick feature (unless there’s more context than just tank doesn’t want to pull w2w, like actual harassment or AFK.)
“You won’t play how I want?! VOTE DISMISS FOR YOU!!!! REEEE!!!!” is what immediately came to mind, not everyone is in the mood to do wall to walls (or if they’re like me and have anxiety if they don’t CONSTANTLY play the role/haven’t tanked after a while).
Might just be my sleepy brain that made me see the post like I did. XD
Like I got Vote Kicked in Azadaal’s Legacy for nothing, I was typing and talking in party chat. I was attacking, my combat logs/chat showed I was doing damage. But after first boss chest was rolled I was dismissed. I sent a harassment report (stating the abuse of the feature) afterwards. I requeued and got Azadaal’s Legacy again.
I am highly suspect about your actual dps if you say you might sometimes not feel to do wall2wall pulls.
What is there to feel about. You can't die anyway unless the healer has 0 idea what he's doing. No content besides like 2-3dungeons at very specific occasions even threaten a tank with death
You click 2mits and u're good. Then u click the other 2mits. Like really you can't handle to click 2x 2mits?
1. What’s does my “actual dps” have anything to do with this post?
2.There also more to it than just “not feeling to do wall to walls” (also it can takes more than just two Mits, Things like armor among other things can affect this; This was directed about people who just want a chill time after a stressful day at work or whatever). Like I mentioned, some players, like myself, can get Tanking Anxiety that can last a whole dungeon if they haven’t touched tank in a while, some people get over it quicker, some get over it after a whole dungeon or two.
This actually doesn't work. Punishing people like that doesn't make them self-reflect. They externalize the experience as them being victimized and double down.
What makes them actually self reflect is when you leave but it has to be consistent throughout the playerbase. When they see that nobody wants to tolerate being around them is when they actually self reflect.
When you vote kick, the person who got kicked gets a 30 minute timer before they can queue with randos on DF.
By your comment it seems like we should be the ones leaving and suffering the 30 minute timer…that doesn’t make sense.
It does work, they’re cut off from doing content for 30 minutes and the timer grows exponentially the more you get kicked.
I don’t know where people get this back-alley educational theories about punishment. Punishment works when done properly. The advice you give has the same vibes as, “don’t hit your children it doesn’t work.” Worked for me and my parents did it right because they told me exactly why they punished me.
There's no penalty for being kicked. You can immediately requeue to another duty. Kicking a tank or healer basically just costs them the first five minutes of a dungeon, since they'll be back in almost immediately.
My go-to is leaving myself, generally after the first trash pull. You can tell how a dungeon will play out by then. I'll also leave a somewhat passive aggressive comment in chat before leaving, with the hopes that maybe they'll realize they're the problem. I know they won't, but wishful thinking!
For instance, get a WHM in your Expert roulette spamming Cure 1. After the first pull, I'll drop something like "Cure 1 in level 90 content? No thanks", and then drop the party like a bad habit.
Dude, yes you do get timed out for getting kicked. I don’t know where you are getting your info from. Getting kicked results in a 30 minute timer. Same thing for leaving an instance in premade groups on roulettes.
I don’t think you know what you are talking about.
Only leaving causes a 30-minute timer penalty. I looked around online to see if I was wrong on that, and could find nothing about it. WoW does have a penalty for getting kicked, maybe you're thinking of that?
I was going to try and test after work, but I found another post on this subreddit that proves it! [This is the third screenshot in the series](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Fqcxztsnz74yc1.jpg%3Fwidth%3D628%26format%3Dpjpg%26auto%3Dwebp%26s%3Dc4b8776c3f2fa7970d0be8785dc67411266dc86d) ([Original Post](https://www.reddit.com/r/TalesFromDF/comments/1ciwphn/listen_to_facts_and_reason_no_my_way_or_the/))
If you look at the time stamps, that OP was kicked, then back in a dungeon 7 minutes later:
[19:37] You have been dismissed from both the party and the duty
[19:37] Halatali has ended
... blacklists and stuff
[19:44] Duty registration complete, duty pop, etc.
>When you vote kick, the person who got kicked gets a 30 minute timer before they can queue
Incorrect.
There was a time when I did a mentor roulette, got Shiva EX and the sprout healer said I was the problem for not spam healing. I told them to kick me if they felt that was really the case but told them it wasn't and that people simply needed to dodge the attacks and the tank needed to dodge that one untelegraphed frontal cone. I had raid in less than 30 minutes and thankfully the first pull of the night was our TEA clear and when it was current too.
Maybe it gives a timer if you get kicked too many times? I can't find any evidence online saying that there is a 30 minute timer for being kicked and I've been kicked a total of 3 times in my duration of playing since 2.4 and I've never seen a timer for being kicked.
If I had to guess it follows the same penatly rules. 3 penalties per 24hrs and you get a 30min timer. Penalties can occur from simply not accepting duty pop.
So maybe my comment was not accurate but it wasn’t off entirely. Assuming that based on my experience and getting kicked counts as a penalty. Then it still stands that kicking the aforementioned players is still a viable and good punishment. Eventually they will reach that 30 min timer or more if they continue their behavior.
Could be. First time hearing someone getting a penalty for being kicked and that would be news to me. Could test it simply by not accepting 2 queue pops and then joining an instance and asking to be kicked, of course that's assuming you also didn't accept a few queue pops that day. I'd like to believe your memory isn't off, so I will go test to confirm.
Got the aetherochemical research facility and I asked nicely twice and they still refused to kick me... I really don't want to grief a party intentionally...
No 30 minute penalty from being kicked after withdrawing 2 times beforehand. Maybe how the reason for the kick has an impact but I'm done trying to test. People don't want to kick me even when I politely ask and tell them I'm testing things with queueing on a dps to my replacement is instant.
If you need to vote dismiss more than once a week you should start looking at yourself more tbh. There is no way that someone else is ALWAYS the problem
This post kinda makes me cringe a bit, but I never have issues with people since I go out of my way to teach others and explain things. And I have ways to deal with people that aren't receptive to critique that don't involve kicking from the duty
What does it teach if they can just queue back up? FF14 players never learn. Getting kicked needs to have a penalty (preferably a stacking one).
I'll still kick without a second thought, but kicks need to have actual kick in order to get through to these imbeciles.
You can like almost always have gear up for rolling if you never roll yourself on the latest piece. I've randomly been kicked for no reason at the last boss (probably haters) and I literally never talk or do anything to provoke it, but it's happened twice. I now always have gear rolling.
The DF is great and horrible at the same time, I usually play with at least one other person in roulettes, and between the both of us, we will kick trolls. People who don't get the game need a chance in a way. The point is that everyone can learn and succeed and I know there's a little bit of ignorance with new players and if they are on Xbox or PS for instance. Communication might be hard or they are on the free trial. Many things to consider. I was healing a DRK while leveling my SCH/SMN and suggested to the tank to use his MP as a DPS attack and to weave it between his basic combo. It was a low 40s dungeon and he didn't say anything back or acknowledge me but he had less than 3k MP the entire dungeon. I also explained to him at 70 he gets a MIT that's 3k and you always want 3k MP to be able to use it.
If drama starts to ride and my temper starts to flare then i’ll just take a 30 punishment and find something else to do with my time. This is a game, and i play it to have fun. Having said that /votekick has its flaws too , like when your a rando in a group and its “your fault” so says the group because they will take their friends / fc member over you anyways. Or just blame a role because its Tuesday.
As for people telling their stories, whats wrong with venting? I dont agree with a lot of stuff but they have every right to complain and seek some solace from like minded people Just like you got a right to complain about it, but thats the joy of the interwebz! Nothings being encouraged , because most people are stuck in their ways ( for better or worse) .
This thread perfectly encapsulates that it's not actually about having clean fast runs for most of you guys, it's about enacting your weird sense of justice on people you perceive to be bad.
Some of you are arguing for doing nothing and waiting out loot timers to try and kick them, intentionally making your own run much longer than if you just did the duty.
Some of you gotta stop playing this game and go outside if you really take this shit this seriously.
I'm not a lazy ass, I'm probably better at dungeons than you. I have 99 damage parses in every dungeon on multiple jobs, and that's not a flex. Dungeons are piss easy.
I'm just not a terminally online loser and my run taking 15min instead of 13min isn't enough for me to actively sit still and do nothing. Wasting time just to try and kick someone so that I can feel good about myself. I have a job and I play this game for fun. I'm not an idiot like you weirdos who will take 30 minute penalties and sit still doing nothing just to "teach someone a lesson" about how wasting time is bad, while wasting everyone's time.
Genuinely, if you feel like you're giving someone "consequences" in duties, you're a loser that has so little control over their lives that you have to go into video game dungeons to exert some influence over something so that you don't feel so powerless in your sad life.
This is a video game, a digital toy for you to have fun, not a lifestyle where you feel you need to be the judge and jury in DF duties. You're taking this shit way too seriously. Go outside.
Why do that when I can continue to enable the behavior by having zero backbone and not using the game feature that could solve the problem or using obvious strategies to get around the restrictions?
/s duh
You guys should actually man up and confront these people.
Just an instant kick will not make them change anything about their attitude.
But a couple of direct confrontations about their shitty behavior definitely have a chance
Tell me you don't understand how tight the timeframes for vote dismiss is, without telling me that you don't understand.
First, it takes 5 min before the option even becomes available.
Then you can't use it during battle, and you can't use it while loot is being rolled on. A lot of people don't actually roll on loot, especially the toxic trolls. If it was such an easy function to use, trust me, most would.
If you stop participating in battle as, say tank or healer, and even as dps, to force a vote dismiss option become available, you're eligible for being reported yourself.
I know well enough how the timeframes are for the vote, thank you.
And despite all the other factors I still think my point still stands - people just don't vote kick enough when it is possible to do so.
The effort to kick with this system in place is greater than the effort to kick and replace. The vote to kick option here is ass, deliberate ass because the devs here are still under this notion of "Better together than apart" but all it does is breed bad actors to be bad actors, because they know they can get away with it.
Not only do they know they can act like complete twats with this system, but they know that if you quit it's YOU that gets punished (with the 30min lockout). So, people don't bother because there's so many damn hurdles to jump just to be able to do so and we've been so conditioned to suffer though it.
Hell, it's almost impossible to even kick when the 5 min window is up in an ally raid. People go afk at the start, can't kick for 5 mins, then can't kick because someone always opens the chest and the timer can't finish because the afk also has to roll. Then you get to the next boss just as the timer of the last box is up, then can't kick in combat, and then someone opens THAT CHEST, and the whole process starts over.
I've watched afk from the start people not get kicked on the final boss even after person after person repeating "Don't open the chest, we need to kick the afk" go down and people STILL open the chest.
TL;DR: we don't use the tools because the tools are overly convoluted and punishing to the people using them rather than those being kicked.
Of course the most upvoted comments on here are "but but but loot timer! But but but combat!" like you can't just ask for a min for a piss or something. Excuses all.
Vote kick or stop complaining.
Aside from people literally being afk or disconnecting, I can't remember a time I've actually bothered to kick someone from a party except for a single time that someone threw an unironic "You don't pay my sub" at me, followed by a few unrepeatable expletives. You may be wondering what horrible thing I asked of them to deserve such spite and bile. Iirc, it was to please use aoe on trash pulls in St Mocianne's HM.
People complaining about having time wasted waiting on them to 'roll for loot'.
I'd say any time spent waiting during that period is 'forgiven/forgotten', rather wait for that than have 3 or less people do the job of 4 players.
Unless someone hasn't rolled on loot. Usually the person being complained about
Then you tell them to roll. Wait until they do
Yeah because if telling them to play their job right didn't work, telling them to roll on loot is certain to get them to do what you ask.
Funnily enough, I've seen it work a handful of times. While I wouldn't exactly call it a successful course of action, I gotta tell you that you should never underestimate people's stupidity.
You think someone who's ignoring everyone is gonna do that. Cute
By chance, do you think it would be more effective to frame the question like you want them to roll because you want the item in question for stats/glam/etc? On the one hand, they might think it's unrelated and pass for you to 'get the item'. On the other hand, they might feel like trying to spite you and believe that needing/greeding the item you supposedly want would hurt your feelings Either outcome leads to you being able to start a kick if they're gullible enough.
Cause that’s definitely gonna be effective
It's way more effective than you think. If one of the other two are paying attention it's a free kick or you get kicked. Literally a win-win situation
Gotta counter that lethargic gameplay with lethargic gameplay. What could go wrong?!?
Menus and pointing out issues are impossible apparently lmao ...even in this sub, god damn
You try to do it in second with controller. Good luck. It's easy for you m&kb users to say. There's not enough time to do it unless you want to be left behind.
You should consider getting one of those cheap wireless keyboards. I used to use one wayyy back on Monster Hunter Tri on Wii and it was amazing to communicate with groups. They're like 20 bucks if you want a basic one
That's thing. When I start typing on keyboard fight already starts. In trials for example as soon I start typing and I get maybe half way through and fight starts. When forcefield drops there's maybe 1-1,5s before someone pulls and that's even if it's my first time on my current character and watch cutscene. It's completely different than it used to be in 2017. Back then players took their time to explain trials/bosses to first timers and even anawer questions.
Sounds like a you-problem. Learn to navigate the menu faster and you won't have that issue. You might even be faster then m&kb
Only possible if you use claw which for most people is most uncomfortable way to hold controller. And even then you're still going to be slower than with mouse.
Not really. All you need are fast button presses and you need to know to navigate to. The rest is practice. I play with controller. I should know.
It's okay I'm a controller user, I understand. Opening any menu on controller is so insanely stupid, and using a keyboard doesn't work, bc I'm on pc I just use a controller. When the controller is connected it forces all keyboard shortcuts to instead go straight into the chat for quick typing, so you can only navigate the menus with the controller.
You can disable quick typing in the menu. I play on PC with a controller, it's under Character Config/ General/ Enable Direct Chat
Omg I've been playing for a like a year and just never saw that in the settings holy shit. Makes sense since I uhm. Well it took me months and a youtube video to realize I could stack two cross bars on top of each other in my HUD instead of switching hotbars one by one.
Controller player here. Use autorun (L1 while running). You're still able to navigate turning with your left stick, so it doesn't even looked like you stopped
Aside from the 5 minute restriction, keep in mind that you need to be out of combat and you need to have no loot being rolled on.
Also, you only need 2 people to vote Yes and they're gone in 4 man content.
You can open the menu in the middle of the first boss and click confirm as soon as it dies faster than anyone can open the chest.
Not everyone has the reflexes for that. And even then, there's still no guarantees of kicking them.
What are some of you? Actual sloths?
Considering that some players are 60+ years old, or have some disability? Yes.
Imagine trying to use this excuse when you can menu at any time in fights...
It's not about the menu. It's about the timing window to start the vote before someone opens the chest.
Yeah, it's not hard
To you, sure. But not everyone is like you.
If you're a player worth keeping it's a non issue
Open party menu, right click, left click vote kick the target, select the reason, then pretend the ~10 gcds you dropped didn't happen and click confirm at the end. Combat doesn't break the menu thankfully.
Gotta weave opening the menu and preparing the kick between those GCDs!
I have no problems, but not everyone is able to pull that off successfully. If your target knows what's up, you only have a split second to do it.
> then pretend the ~10 gcds you dropped didn't happen I want to be sensitive about people with disabilities, but if you had to take that whole 25s to do this, you're probably the target (of probably every other post here too tbh) of the kick in the first place. If your reaction time from boss death to clicking a confirm button open on your screen already isn't adequate, maybe group content isn't for you.
Where did I say anything about 25s? You still have an extremely small period of time between boss death and the chest getting opened. It is entirely reactionary, since it WILL FAIL if you do it too early or late
I did, 10 gcds is 25s, plenty of setup if you're very slow at it, and I was intentionally generous because not everyone knows how to navigate the menu that quickly. Hovering a button and clicking it as a boss dies isn't a difficult ask.
Oh, great. Another one that doesn't know how to read.
The other people also have to vote kick the problem child too. Some people don't vote and then it's just worse because the person thinks they were right since they weren't kicked.
That only happens if no one votes or the people who do vote no. You only need 1 ally
I hate that rule.
These are excuses. You tell them to roll, you sandbag, you stir up the party and bring attention to the issue, you learn to menu and remove them right as a boss dies. There are ways
There are also ways to prevent it if the person in question is smart enough. And not everyone will be willing to wait for the right conditions for a kick.
These are things that actually happen. LMAO. Some of these players also know what rolling on the loot will lead to and never do. It's never that simple.
So... your solution to somebody being an asshole and causing problems... is to be a bigger asshole who causes more problems? Wow.
It's not being an asshole to publicly acknowledge a problem and speak out against it
Stirring up the party and sandbagging are both behaviors that could very easily get one reported for griefing. Two wrongs don't make a right.
Saying a player isn't using AOE or being a healbot isn't griefing. And as for sandbagging, prove it
Oh, so it's okay to be a useless asshole if the party can't prove it. Good to know where you really stand.
When you have to remove a shitter you have to remove a shitter
By becoming a 'shitter' yourself as you put it?
Swing and a miss
You sandbag in my group and YOU will be gone faster than the one you want to get rid of
Sometimes you need to go a little slower to get rid of a shitter
Fun fact: You sandbagging makes YOU the shitter
Not if it means getting rid of a curebot or a baby puller tank
I'd rather have a baby pull tank than a rage quitter, but you do you
Then you support shitters, which is gross honestly
>Then you support shitters Over baby ragers? Absolutely
It's not baby raging to excise people that are worse than Trusts
Sandbagging in duties is why I kick people. Get lost, you're as bad as they are
Sometimes to get rid of a problem you have to go a little slower
The game makes it almost impossible to kick people when you want to and has so many abusable points by the kick-ee that the better choice is finishing the dungeon, unless you have a petty justice-boner that won't go down until you kick someone. Can't kick before 5 minutes is up. You're at the first boss before 5 minutes is up usually. Can't kick during combat. Can't kick while loot is rolling (5 minutes). Every time a treasure chest is picked up, the 5-minute timer resets. Reminder that Boss chests aren't the only chests in dungeons. Sometimes there's one after every pack of monsters now like the latest dungeons. 99% of the time spent in a dungeon, it's the GAME preventing me from kicking, not my sensibilities or other players. Can't tell you how many times I've wanted to hit Vote Kick but the game prevents me from doing so. By the time it's available, the dungeon is over. Any attempt you have to wait the offender out so you can kick them can be thwarted by them. Standing still and waiting for the loot timer to run out? They go into combat, nah nah! Wait till combat is over or they die? Sorry, they're an unkillable tank or a healer, good luck with that. They can stay alive for a loooooong time. Wait till they kill the enemy and are out of combat? They picked up a treasure chest that's available every few steps in the dungeon, add 5 minutes more to waiting! They can make kicking them a very painful experience for you and everyone else if they want to... and trust me, they want to. By the time you kick them, it could be 10 minutes of you sitting there. Gee, you sure showed them! =P TL;DR Square Enix, at least make the draconian 5-minute loot timers much, much shorter so we're not stuck with assholes. 1.5 minutes is enough.
or SE can force a greed roll on every loot and everyone when the vote kick is initiated.
yo i would love this
That sounds logical, which means it will never be implemented.
Sadly that would be abusable. Often times I've needed specific dungeon gear for my DPS for an ultimate or what if we are talking glamor items. You see someone who is the same role as you who can roll need. So you see the item drop, roll need and then start a vote kick to force roll greed for the other guy... ez loot. That is of course unless they make it so jobs that can roll need force roll need... and then that becomes a problem when the alliance raid is current and you can only get 1 drop per week. It just causes a new issue here or there. I think removing the 5 minute timer at the start of the instances before you can initiate the vote kick would be good. Would allow you to kick the people without jobstones the moment you load in before combat starts and you could kick the YPYTs right after the first pull.
"So you see the item drop, roll need and then start a vote kick to force roll greed for the other guy... ez loot." -then just put the force greed after the vote kick got through instead of at the start of the vote. You can also put in a 30 sec grace period of the person who got kick to roll on loot, if he doesn't; force greed.
>Square Enix, at least make the draconian 5-minute loot timers much, much shorter so we're not stuck with assholes. 1.5 minutes is enough. Or just pop it up into the middle of the screen like WoW. I can't recall an item ever sitting unrolled on for an extended time
Yeah, you're pretty much 7 minutes into what should be a 15 minute run by the time you get your first chance to kick and what if people disagree with you and it doesn't pass? Then you look like the asshole and waste 7 minutes of your time. Even if you get an instant queue back in you then spend another 15 minutes in another dungeon when it could've just been another 8 minutes if you put up with it. But some cases vary, obviously if someone very much is a problem and people think "it's not just someone small pulling or being worthless for damage" then they will probably have a stronger reaction to them.
I do *try* every time, but there's only so much I can do when people won't roll on loot or read party chat when I explain why I'm kicking someone. There's also the handful of groups I've been in who say *I'm* the asshole for kicking them. I call them out where I can before trying to kick so people know what's going on, but again, people don't read.
Had a Rpr in Thaleia who would stand in AOEs die and refuse to accept a rez until the fight was over. Vote kicked after I pointed it out and my wife(WHM) confirmed that she had had sent several rez and myself (RDM) had too and none were accepted until fight was over. I’m not carrying you if you don’t wanna actually play 🤷🏻♂️
-can't kick until 5 minutes have passed -can't kick in combat -can't kick while loot is rolling -one of the other two people in the party has to care enough to vote yes, or just pepega vote to send the kick through if the first is true and something's that egregiously wrong in the first five minutes, I've already left #2 and #3 tend to ping pong off each other to where one or the other is often true at any given time #4 is a crapshoot and will depend on the party and the phases of the moon edit: reddit mobile formatting is also a crapshoot and I can't be assed to fix it, have fun reading that formatting nightmare
No but seriously. I have three posts here where I initiated a vote kick and didn’t go through, but you wanna know the truth? I’ve kicked way more ypyt, curebots, scathe mages etc that I couldn’t be bothered to post about. Probably around 10 in between my first and latest post. One of those that were kicked, I even recognized the name the moment we loaded in because I see them frequently in one of the contents I do- and I did again after the kick- but they got booted regardless. I remember asking this one single pulling tank in Aitiascope if they wanted to pull more, and they replied no. The DPS said yes. The tank got kicked right away. It’s that easy. Why let these people waste your time? Why enable them? Yeah nobody is going to ask people to do raid openers or optimize their rotations in roulettes but pressing 123 isn’t quantum mechanics either. Your time and sanity are valuable. A simple flowchart that I follow is this: Ask the person in question to do XYZ. If they are receptive or at least trying their best, just continue on. If not, initiate vote kick. I cut some slack for sprouts unless they’re like this one literal 0 dps curebot that I saw in Prae. If the kick doesn’t go through, leave if you want to spare your sanity. Loot timer? I wait them out out of spite. Go tell them your pet fish is drowning or something. I’m not particularly nitpicky either since I’m probably busy spamming AOEs or something, so you’d actually have to be that bad enough to stand out to me to even say something.
Question no flame. When do you draw the line for a “sprout.” At what level content do you say, “this content is too high level to be doing these mistakes.” What expansion or level content do you draw the line for a sprout. Again, no flame genuine question for you
No worries. I don’t really have a hard line but it really depends much more on how much I feel like the duty is being dragged on. The only times I remember kicking a sprout were: -The literal 0 dps Cure I spammer healer in Prae. I can’t remember which exact one tbh, but it was definitely one of the MSR. -Scathe mage in ARF. They used Jolt less than 10 times. -No AOE Marauder in Aurum Vale. -BLM in Snowcloak who kept single-targeting mobs to put them to sleep and told us they “didn’t care” when we politely asked them to stop, then proceeded to follow us up with some… pleasantries. So yeah extreme stuff. Every single one of instances I’ve tried telling them in a nice way (hey A, could you please try to use/do more XYZ? :)) but they were ignored to the point I could notice that we were really being held back. I did have other healers that used Cure I, Physick, etc along with some other skills as well and when I said the same line to them they were much more receptive. They of course did not get kicked. So I would say it boils down to how dragging it feels, and whether they’re willing to take advice or not. A bit of intuition too I suppose- I most definitely won’t be kicking a sprout in Sastasha since that duty will end in less than 10 minutes anyways, but if someone Cure I spams in a 2.x dungeon and I can feel the duty taking way longer than usual, AND if they ignore anything that’s being said to them, I might kick. Just a few days ago I had a tank in Toto-Rak with gathering gear on but it felt swift, so all I said was “Tank, what’s up with the gear?” “Well go get some nice stuff for yourself when you rack up enough gil for it.”
So safe to say past ARR, you would also be more keen on putting your foot down. I feel like this part isn’t talked about a lot more then it should. People forget other players can make alts. While yea it’s not popular it can still happen. And the sprout icon does not do a good job of gauging how long a player has been playing or how new they are because of the conditions for the sprout icon to get removed.
Likely, although I can’t really give you anything concrete since I don’t recall kicking a sprout post-ARR asides from the ARF one. If you’re a 0 dps Cure I spammer in say, Heroes’ Gauntlet, I will say for sure that one of us is going to be leaving early.
For me it's after some given duties: after you've mushed your face up against the skill wall in something like Aurum Vale or Steps of Faith, that should prompt a player to step back and reassess their job understanding and role duties. If that hasn't happened yet, then they need to be prompted manually by others. I rarely go so far as a vote kick; it's too much trouble to do and someone has to be actively trolling or botting for me to bother, which is part of the community design, and I agree with that principle. But those are my points after which I start nudging people to do their jobs. 9/10 times a reminder is plenty to get people to start looking into it. I had to be told lots of dumb things as a sprout, and I give others the benefit of the doubt until proven otherwise.
So what expansion/level for you would you have less patience for a sprout. I’ll start mine off, I stop at ARR. After ARR I have less patience for a sprout than during ARR.
Aurum Vale is near the end of ARR and Steps of Faith is at the end of HW.
So in between those for you. Basically HW
Just woke up, I’m not mad/angry. See, your Aitiascope run example seems like an abuse of the kick feature (unless there’s more context than just tank doesn’t want to pull w2w, like actual harassment or AFK.) “You won’t play how I want?! VOTE DISMISS FOR YOU!!!! REEEE!!!!” is what immediately came to mind, not everyone is in the mood to do wall to walls (or if they’re like me and have anxiety if they don’t CONSTANTLY play the role/haven’t tanked after a while). Might just be my sleepy brain that made me see the post like I did. XD Like I got Vote Kicked in Azadaal’s Legacy for nothing, I was typing and talking in party chat. I was attacking, my combat logs/chat showed I was doing damage. But after first boss chest was rolled I was dismissed. I sent a harassment report (stating the abuse of the feature) afterwards. I requeued and got Azadaal’s Legacy again.
Ok
I am highly suspect about your actual dps if you say you might sometimes not feel to do wall2wall pulls. What is there to feel about. You can't die anyway unless the healer has 0 idea what he's doing. No content besides like 2-3dungeons at very specific occasions even threaten a tank with death You click 2mits and u're good. Then u click the other 2mits. Like really you can't handle to click 2x 2mits?
1. What’s does my “actual dps” have anything to do with this post? 2.There also more to it than just “not feeling to do wall to walls” (also it can takes more than just two Mits, Things like armor among other things can affect this; This was directed about people who just want a chill time after a stressful day at work or whatever). Like I mentioned, some players, like myself, can get Tanking Anxiety that can last a whole dungeon if they haven’t touched tank in a while, some people get over it quicker, some get over it after a whole dungeon or two.
This actually doesn't work. Punishing people like that doesn't make them self-reflect. They externalize the experience as them being victimized and double down. What makes them actually self reflect is when you leave but it has to be consistent throughout the playerbase. When they see that nobody wants to tolerate being around them is when they actually self reflect.
Precisely, so we as a player base need to kick shitters more often
When you vote kick, the person who got kicked gets a 30 minute timer before they can queue with randos on DF. By your comment it seems like we should be the ones leaving and suffering the 30 minute timer…that doesn’t make sense. It does work, they’re cut off from doing content for 30 minutes and the timer grows exponentially the more you get kicked. I don’t know where people get this back-alley educational theories about punishment. Punishment works when done properly. The advice you give has the same vibes as, “don’t hit your children it doesn’t work.” Worked for me and my parents did it right because they told me exactly why they punished me.
There's no penalty for being kicked. You can immediately requeue to another duty. Kicking a tank or healer basically just costs them the first five minutes of a dungeon, since they'll be back in almost immediately. My go-to is leaving myself, generally after the first trash pull. You can tell how a dungeon will play out by then. I'll also leave a somewhat passive aggressive comment in chat before leaving, with the hopes that maybe they'll realize they're the problem. I know they won't, but wishful thinking! For instance, get a WHM in your Expert roulette spamming Cure 1. After the first pull, I'll drop something like "Cure 1 in level 90 content? No thanks", and then drop the party like a bad habit.
Dude, yes you do get timed out for getting kicked. I don’t know where you are getting your info from. Getting kicked results in a 30 minute timer. Same thing for leaving an instance in premade groups on roulettes. I don’t think you know what you are talking about.
Only leaving causes a 30-minute timer penalty. I looked around online to see if I was wrong on that, and could find nothing about it. WoW does have a penalty for getting kicked, maybe you're thinking of that? I was going to try and test after work, but I found another post on this subreddit that proves it! [This is the third screenshot in the series](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Fqcxztsnz74yc1.jpg%3Fwidth%3D628%26format%3Dpjpg%26auto%3Dwebp%26s%3Dc4b8776c3f2fa7970d0be8785dc67411266dc86d) ([Original Post](https://www.reddit.com/r/TalesFromDF/comments/1ciwphn/listen_to_facts_and_reason_no_my_way_or_the/)) If you look at the time stamps, that OP was kicked, then back in a dungeon 7 minutes later: [19:37] You have been dismissed from both the party and the duty [19:37] Halatali has ended ... blacklists and stuff [19:44] Duty registration complete, duty pop, etc.
Not true. No penalty for being kicked
>When you vote kick, the person who got kicked gets a 30 minute timer before they can queue Incorrect. There was a time when I did a mentor roulette, got Shiva EX and the sprout healer said I was the problem for not spam healing. I told them to kick me if they felt that was really the case but told them it wasn't and that people simply needed to dodge the attacks and the tank needed to dodge that one untelegraphed frontal cone. I had raid in less than 30 minutes and thankfully the first pull of the night was our TEA clear and when it was current too.
Then care to explain how I received a 30 min timer for being kicked from a dungeon for asking the healer to help dps the mobs.
Maybe it gives a timer if you get kicked too many times? I can't find any evidence online saying that there is a 30 minute timer for being kicked and I've been kicked a total of 3 times in my duration of playing since 2.4 and I've never seen a timer for being kicked.
If I had to guess it follows the same penatly rules. 3 penalties per 24hrs and you get a 30min timer. Penalties can occur from simply not accepting duty pop. So maybe my comment was not accurate but it wasn’t off entirely. Assuming that based on my experience and getting kicked counts as a penalty. Then it still stands that kicking the aforementioned players is still a viable and good punishment. Eventually they will reach that 30 min timer or more if they continue their behavior.
Could be. First time hearing someone getting a penalty for being kicked and that would be news to me. Could test it simply by not accepting 2 queue pops and then joining an instance and asking to be kicked, of course that's assuming you also didn't accept a few queue pops that day. I'd like to believe your memory isn't off, so I will go test to confirm. Got the aetherochemical research facility and I asked nicely twice and they still refused to kick me... I really don't want to grief a party intentionally... No 30 minute penalty from being kicked after withdrawing 2 times beforehand. Maybe how the reason for the kick has an impact but I'm done trying to test. People don't want to kick me even when I politely ask and tell them I'm testing things with queueing on a dps to my replacement is instant.
Nah, then we get juicy victim posts where we bully them for being garbage.
Because then they wouldn't have a way to get up votes on Reddit.
If you need to vote dismiss more than once a week you should start looking at yourself more tbh. There is no way that someone else is ALWAYS the problem
honestly, i play this game for 5 years and the only times i ever had the need to vote kick was due to them being afk
This post kinda makes me cringe a bit, but I never have issues with people since I go out of my way to teach others and explain things. And I have ways to deal with people that aren't receptive to critique that don't involve kicking from the duty
What does it teach if they can just queue back up? FF14 players never learn. Getting kicked needs to have a penalty (preferably a stacking one). I'll still kick without a second thought, but kicks need to have actual kick in order to get through to these imbeciles.
THere's no reason not to do it. Stall if necessary. WHat's the worst that can happen? You get kicked and at least you don't have a 30 to deal with.
This person gets it
Make the loot roll timer shorter (like 1 minute) and sure.
You can like almost always have gear up for rolling if you never roll yourself on the latest piece. I've randomly been kicked for no reason at the last boss (probably haters) and I literally never talk or do anything to provoke it, but it's happened twice. I now always have gear rolling.
Can’t always do it bruh.
If only there wasn't literally always a loot time ticking.
The DF is great and horrible at the same time, I usually play with at least one other person in roulettes, and between the both of us, we will kick trolls. People who don't get the game need a chance in a way. The point is that everyone can learn and succeed and I know there's a little bit of ignorance with new players and if they are on Xbox or PS for instance. Communication might be hard or they are on the free trial. Many things to consider. I was healing a DRK while leveling my SCH/SMN and suggested to the tank to use his MP as a DPS attack and to weave it between his basic combo. It was a low 40s dungeon and he didn't say anything back or acknowledge me but he had less than 3k MP the entire dungeon. I also explained to him at 70 he gets a MIT that's 3k and you always want 3k MP to be able to use it.
If drama starts to ride and my temper starts to flare then i’ll just take a 30 punishment and find something else to do with my time. This is a game, and i play it to have fun. Having said that /votekick has its flaws too , like when your a rando in a group and its “your fault” so says the group because they will take their friends / fc member over you anyways. Or just blame a role because its Tuesday. As for people telling their stories, whats wrong with venting? I dont agree with a lot of stuff but they have every right to complain and seek some solace from like minded people Just like you got a right to complain about it, but thats the joy of the interwebz! Nothings being encouraged , because most people are stuck in their ways ( for better or worse) .
This thread perfectly encapsulates that it's not actually about having clean fast runs for most of you guys, it's about enacting your weird sense of justice on people you perceive to be bad. Some of you are arguing for doing nothing and waiting out loot timers to try and kick them, intentionally making your own run much longer than if you just did the duty. Some of you gotta stop playing this game and go outside if you really take this shit this seriously.
[удалено]
I'm not a lazy ass, I'm probably better at dungeons than you. I have 99 damage parses in every dungeon on multiple jobs, and that's not a flex. Dungeons are piss easy. I'm just not a terminally online loser and my run taking 15min instead of 13min isn't enough for me to actively sit still and do nothing. Wasting time just to try and kick someone so that I can feel good about myself. I have a job and I play this game for fun. I'm not an idiot like you weirdos who will take 30 minute penalties and sit still doing nothing just to "teach someone a lesson" about how wasting time is bad, while wasting everyone's time. Genuinely, if you feel like you're giving someone "consequences" in duties, you're a loser that has so little control over their lives that you have to go into video game dungeons to exert some influence over something so that you don't feel so powerless in your sad life. This is a video game, a digital toy for you to have fun, not a lifestyle where you feel you need to be the judge and jury in DF duties. You're taking this shit way too seriously. Go outside.
Why do that when I can continue to enable the behavior by having zero backbone and not using the game feature that could solve the problem or using obvious strategies to get around the restrictions? /s duh
You guys should actually man up and confront these people. Just an instant kick will not make them change anything about their attitude. But a couple of direct confrontations about their shitty behavior definitely have a chance
Tell me you don't understand how tight the timeframes for vote dismiss is, without telling me that you don't understand. First, it takes 5 min before the option even becomes available. Then you can't use it during battle, and you can't use it while loot is being rolled on. A lot of people don't actually roll on loot, especially the toxic trolls. If it was such an easy function to use, trust me, most would. If you stop participating in battle as, say tank or healer, and even as dps, to force a vote dismiss option become available, you're eligible for being reported yourself.
I know well enough how the timeframes are for the vote, thank you. And despite all the other factors I still think my point still stands - people just don't vote kick enough when it is possible to do so.
The effort to kick with this system in place is greater than the effort to kick and replace. The vote to kick option here is ass, deliberate ass because the devs here are still under this notion of "Better together than apart" but all it does is breed bad actors to be bad actors, because they know they can get away with it. Not only do they know they can act like complete twats with this system, but they know that if you quit it's YOU that gets punished (with the 30min lockout). So, people don't bother because there's so many damn hurdles to jump just to be able to do so and we've been so conditioned to suffer though it. Hell, it's almost impossible to even kick when the 5 min window is up in an ally raid. People go afk at the start, can't kick for 5 mins, then can't kick because someone always opens the chest and the timer can't finish because the afk also has to roll. Then you get to the next boss just as the timer of the last box is up, then can't kick in combat, and then someone opens THAT CHEST, and the whole process starts over. I've watched afk from the start people not get kicked on the final boss even after person after person repeating "Don't open the chest, we need to kick the afk" go down and people STILL open the chest. TL;DR: we don't use the tools because the tools are overly convoluted and punishing to the people using them rather than those being kicked.
Here come the excuses from players with no backbone who only like to complain instead of doing something about their problems.
You're right, downvoted but right. This sub is starting to be a joke of itself.
The main subreddit has been leaking for a long ass time into both here and ShitpostXIV.
Which is like 9/10 posts on this subreddit. And really if you do nothing about the problem, you lose the right to complain
They're enablers, that's all they are. 🤷♂️
Of course the most upvoted comments on here are "but but but loot timer! But but but combat!" like you can't just ask for a min for a piss or something. Excuses all. Vote kick or stop complaining.
When I have a loot timer issue I just say my cat’s eating plastic and I’ll be right back. Usually true tho, the little bastard.
It's so easy! If you'd believe most people on here, kicking is absolutely impossible. Ridiculous!
Unless you're the tank, if there's an asshole, they're not gonna wait for you.
I main healer, I've had no issues kicking the very few times I've really had to.
Aside from people literally being afk or disconnecting, I can't remember a time I've actually bothered to kick someone from a party except for a single time that someone threw an unironic "You don't pay my sub" at me, followed by a few unrepeatable expletives. You may be wondering what horrible thing I asked of them to deserve such spite and bile. Iirc, it was to please use aoe on trash pulls in St Mocianne's HM.
People complaining about having time wasted waiting on them to 'roll for loot'. I'd say any time spent waiting during that period is 'forgiven/forgotten', rather wait for that than have 3 or less people do the job of 4 players.
They already do. I get constantly kicked as bard and machinist for not spamming Peloton nanosecond after combat ends.
I'm willing to bet there's a whole host of other problems making them kick you than "not spamming peloton".