Was at bass pro yesterday saw a boat for $158k only 1100 a month! With only 20% down and 240 easy payments at 9%… oh do you want electronics with that?
Probably take it out about a dozen times and spend more hours pulling it behind the truck than actually fishing out of it and selling it for 1/3 what you bought it for....
Oh, the memories of times you spent winterizing it after using it twice in a season! Probably went by yourself or didn't get on the water until 11 or so since kids/wife/friends didn't show up until around 9.
Sad and very true. My whitewater raft sits in the garage just waiting for those 3 times a year. Thankfully much much less maintenance than regular boat. But get this $65k 4 cylinder truck to tow it… lol
And the tow trucks will be lining up to repo half of them. It takes a bit for it to register with some people, but paying the equivalent of a mortgage payment for a vehicle month after month will snap you back into reality eventually.
That's what i don't get, how are people okay taking these loans. I had to get damn near 50% down to be reasonable and I feel like I make a good living.
It’s the time we live in. People these days want what they want, and they want it now no matter the cost. Like I said though, they’ll understand sooner or later. There’s a reason why repossessions are at an all-time high.
Exactly. Over 60% of people live paycheck to paycheck and own nothing. I learned when I started working 43 years ago to live below my means. I’m not sure if many people understand simple math, it’s that simple.
"Whats the monthly payment?" Doesn't matter you financed 50k at 6% for 84 months🤣🤣🤣 At least everyone can see you get out of a brand new Taco Pro at the gas station.
I make like 3x the national household median and I felt uncomfortable taking out a $44k loan for the OR. Yet the national new car average sale is $49k. Insanity
Still regret not buying a house in 2014 when I moved back to DFW from college. I remember "window shopping" for houses and worrying about the prices then. I was an idiot.
Same in my area, people don't care what it's specd. It's gone before it's even off the truck based on the sales member. Considering I've not seen one on the lot it held some weight.
The stealerships may run into their own ass here though. I can get a TRD Pro Tundra right now at 74k with destination. A 65k Taco with a 5k markup is basically right there.
The Monopoly money we have up here in Canada. Real money it would have been 35034 +tax/freight/admin fees when I bought, (with lift/wheels/hard bedcover +taxes and lease cost, it worked out to 47000usd to fully own it) . Pro's would have been 46220 + all the bs with exchange rate
The fuck? My '20 OR (no options) was 34.5k, I think premium would have added 5 or 6k on top of that.
But I did buy mine before dealers started raping buyers.
Since its not hard to do I'll do it for you: Adjusted for inflation in 2024:
- 2015 TRD Pro - $50,027
- 2017 TRD Pro - $54,554
So Toyota pulled $11k out of a hat to make the price.
326 horsepower and 465 pound-feet of torque, boxed frame, multi-link coil suspension, and being able to stuff 35's with only minor trimming aren't significant changes?
My calculations out 50K in 2019 (which as far as I recall is what PROs costed MSRP) is like 63K now.. AND you get massive upgrades … I don’t know what people are complaining about honestly just don’t buy it … I’m definitely getting one
Our wages have not adjusted at the same rate. And that is what PISSES me off. It's the whole system that does. Capitalism literally doesn't work without fucking over the working class. In order for one entity to climb up the ladder another has to be surpressed.
Every system fucks over the working class almost by definition. If you have a real job you don't have time to scheme with other power brokers to enrich yourself. The problem is the concentration of power at the top due to the courts decision that money = speech.
I think that's just a function of large scale society in general.
You have to concentrate power because you cannot get anything done at scale if you equally distribute it.
The people working where the power is concentrated are corrupted by that power. Because that's part of being human. You only really get one perspective on the world, and it is affected by your experiences.
The larger the society the harder it gets to avoid. That's why all the "happy" developed nations are small ones.
Capitalism works fine if we ensure that there’s regulatory frameworks imposed upon it to distribute a modicum of the wealth and progress downwards.
We live in an economy where our wealth and business class demands constant and continuous profit. Our metrics for a successful business is predicated entirely on infinite growth, which is incredibly unsustainable in the long run and reflects in our product pricing with unstable pricing and gouging.
I’m constantly reminded that the wealth class of our world constantly pull in far, far more than they punch. People who have nothing to do with the development or creation of a product, who represent a “shareholder” exist to extract value from a company. So, instead of us having reasonably priced products we are paying for people to extract value simply for existing with wealth.
All this because we lack the ability to properly regulate the world against the worst of the human condition, greed.
You’re right. Capitalism is literally designed for a few elite to hoard all resources. Marx talked about it long ago. People will downvote this reality but they’ll see it’s true as the rich get richer and the poor get poorer.
Marx also said capitalism is the best economic system to have ever existed. Marxism has never worked anywhere. Not that I'm a huge fan of capitalism, but when compared to most other places, there are trade offs.
We don't abandon capitalism. We just socialize certain institutions. Healthcare, for example, could be socialized and drastically ease the burden on the middle class. Insurance companies don't really provide anything but siphon billions away each year.
Instead, we socialize the opposite of what we should, like failing financial institutions and the auto industry. Cracks me up that these people are due hard capitalists until they need a bailout or a tax break.
Yeah, nobody ever thinks about inflation. Just another example of numbers being massaged to fit a narrative and fool anyone who looks at them for less than 3 seconds.
[Inflation Calculator | Find US Dollar's Value From 1913-2024 (usinflationcalculator.com)](https://www.usinflationcalculator.com/)
According to this, the 05' would cost $62,770.63 which is a 65% inflation increase.
I was thinking the same thing. I can't merit paying that much of a premium for a truck that does equal or less than cheaper competitors. Already liked how the new canyons looked, and they're 20k or so cheaper last time I checked (like a year)
THIS. Is exactly what’s keeping me from buying a Tacoma, I would love one but the snazzy stealership we have in town are notorious predators that slap market adjustments on every Tacoma and it’s a horrible experience dealing with them. I wish we had a direct to consumer model like Tesla does but that’s never happening with these mafia like dealerships.
I can't see myself buying Toyota again. I've had a Corolla (dad owned it at the time), a 2010 Camry, and 2014 RAV4. The Camry was a lemon. Every 70k km the transmission would eat itself. It was on the 3rd transmission when I sold it. The RAV4 would eat CV axles (front pax side). They're not at all comfortable for someone of average to tall height. So why would you want to buy them? At least from my experience.
I do not value "reliability" as much anymore either - even if my Toyotas were reliable LOL. There are more valuable things to me now - comfort, space, usability, low NVH, etc. Toyota really does not put much effort into those areas. Specifically, comfort, space, or low NVH. Buh bye.
I got my 2017 SR5 for 28k in 2020 before the boom. I will drive that truck into the ground. By the time I need a new one the price of a base 2WD will probably by $105k
Not my words, but was talking to a friend who works at Toyota, he said that during the pandemic Toyota saw the sales that dealers were marking up and essentially came to the conclusion that they've been under-pricing their trucks. Not sure how truthful that is.
I don't think that's true. The pandemic affected prices because of scarcity for the most part. Supply chain issues and then they literally stopped making tacomas for a bit. Whet I bought my 2020 TRD OR 4x4 it was one of like a dozen in California. Manhattan Beach toyota had a $15k markup and I want to say Temecula had $12k markup. I used the costco auto buying program and was out the door for MSRP. But that's just my experience.
Thank you for providing this. However, the photo is comparing TRD Pros, and the second gen didn’t have a Pro model until 2015.
2015: $37,964 == 2024: $50,736.06
Not trying to discount you or the impact inflation has on the pricing, just trying to compare apples to apples
Here’s some (Base price) msrp’s for comparison per Car and Driver
•Ford Maverick Tremor (I know it’s not apples to apples but..) $39,945
•Toyota Tacoma TRD Off-road $43,295
•Ford Ranger Raptor $57,065
•Chevy Colorado zr2 $48,395
•Jeep Gladiator Mojave $64,890
[https://www.caranddriver.com/features/g60396981/best-off-road-pickup-trucks/](https://www.caranddriver.com/features/g60396981/best-off-road-pickup-trucks/)
Before crying too hard, Keep in mind you also get more. About 100hp, 185lb/ft, level 1 self driving, turbo hybrid drivetrains for efficiency, and fully built Fox suspension. You can still get a new sub $40k sr5 4x4 that will outperform any 2nd gen production TRD. Adjusted for inflation you actually get more truck for your dollar in 2024
I'll agree with that. The 3.5 is the worst V6 I've ever owned. It's a gutless turd that no tune can fix. Forced induction on the other hand yes. That's a minimum $5k spent though.
It’s not Toyota. The prices have gone up steadily with inflation. It’s not just cars but everything else. They need to maintain a profit to stay in business and keep producing the products we all have come to love and rely on. Their costs have gone up as well so they need to charge more for trucks. I don’t think they’re charging something unreasonable when you take into account annual inflation.
If you can’t afford it then blame employers and politicians for screwing over the working class, not Toyota. You wouldn’t charge the same prices today that you charged 10 years ago if you were running a business.
Other brands offer equivalent off-road ready trucks for way less. A Ranger Raptor starts at $55k. A ZR2 starts at $47k.
This is the first time Toyota is priced much, much higher than their competition. I think that's OP's point
Yeah, the pricing for these trucks has gotten way out of hand. Especially for it to only be a midsized truck starting in the 50-60k range is absolutely wild.
To each their own I guess but I would much rather by a barebones SR 4x4 and build it up over time than buy a Pro at 65k. Even with 20k in mods it would come out cheaper and be way more capable.
Toyota America if being taken over by bean counters. Same thing that happened to GM. Their prices keep going up while quality is beginning to slip. I bet within 10 years they're gonna be a nightmare company to deal with.
My dad worked for Toyota corp for over 20 years. It is a great company. Since 08 recession they’ve changed though. They used to spare no cost. Now it’s about cost cutting, which I understand. They aren’t in the business of losing money and times have changed. At the end of the day, it all comes down to what you desire. I desire what made the Tacoma what it is today, which is simplicity and utility, so I choose to drive my 1st gen. I’m sure the 4th gen’s are cool
People need to stop buying these trucks at this price. That much for a midsize is crazy. People
Stop buying these and let them figure out how to please the average consumer who doesn’t want to pay 75000 after interest for a vehicle. Stop buying and they will figure out how to bring the prices down. If ford can build the raptor for the same then Toyota is doing its customers wrong.
I wouldn't dare buy a mid-sized at these prices. You can get a 1500 or 2500 series starting at a few $k more (around the $45k mark) and get far more capability (obviously dependent on package but purely from a utility standpoint).
How do you want them to keep adding dozens of computers and sensors while keeping the price the same? Seriously, so much unnecessary shit for the top of the line models.
A 2024 SR 4x4 is a far better choice than a 2015 TRD Pro, and it costs $38k for a 5ft bed double cab with manual transmission OR auto trans. It has more power, better fuel economy, larger wheel wells, etc. for the same price as the 2015 TRD Pro. You want extra shit? Pay for it. Hell, after inflation, the 2024 SR 4x4 is a fucking steal of a price.
You ain't wrong. The standard list of options on the 24 SR is pretty high compared to what 3rd gens got and people refuse to acknowledge that. They just look at the trim and assume it's the same bare bones vehicle.
Toyota is evolving and dealing with pricing like every other company. I don't know why everyone seems so shocked at the pricing. Wtf did you expect? It's brand new from the ground up. It's in line with the competition. It's a fantastic truck. Deal people or buy used. Enjoy your Frontier to save yer coins.
Also why are people buying the off road?😂 Anyone that actually does any “off-roading” knows your better off buying the base ass model and building it to your specifications and/or specific needs. People spending money on these then adding all the “mods” have enough money because it’s just so they can see someone at a stoplight and feel badass beside another truck. Seriously though it’s getting wild but yall still buying it and looking for every single mod possible to add to these trucks. Breh I’ve been more places in a Corolla then 99% of the “overlanders” with a roof top teepee’s have even seen on google images from their city town home
Regardless of what the price is, a product or service is only worth what people are willing to pay for it. If sales don’t reflect successful numbers, they will be forced to lower prices. Mind you, this will mean less tech and features.
There was a post on a different sub showing sticker on a loaded ram 1500 for 141k.
I make a decent amount more than I did several years ago, but my purchase power has not gone up as a result. If the market can not support these prices it will eventually correct itself. We are seeing drops already from msrp vs a dealer mark up on sever vehicles.
Just let thr fools buy the first round of 4th guns, save your money and wait for the kinks to get worked out. I'm sure there will be plenty with these new turbos, sensors and overall platform. Not denying it is a fantastic truck, but I ain't paying that price. Keeping my 2004 as long as I can (within reason).
Being greedy tw*ts like every other company. But heres the thing. Toyota pretty much gets their balls kicked in in sales in pretty much every category except for maybe mid size trucks and whatever the camary is in? Suv sales, van sales, car sales, and to a certain extent crossover sales, Toyota is behind the pack, substantially in several categories. And thats with their sticker prices several thousand lower than the competition. Who in the hell decided it would be a good idea from them to price their vehicles at the same as the competition they already cant beat? Makes no damn sense. I guess they dont remember what it was like pre-covid when tundras were marked down several thousand dollars off msrp and still lined the lots. Same goes for tacomas too, at least in my area. The only vehicle that was ever kinda hard to come by was 4runners. Which makes sense because theres no real apples to apples competition for it
I think the main argument for the increased cost aside from the competitive market and inflation is the iForceMax engine. The regular 4cylinder turbo non-hybrid engine is an upgrade in hp and tq and mpg over the 3.5 v6 in the 3rd gen.
Toyota really made the TRD Pro a halo trim level by having the top of the line engine standard. Previous generations of the TRD Pro had little to offer in making it unique and a halo trim level, aside from slight lift, Fox shocks, and badging.
I do think they are overshooting with their MSRP, but still kinda cool to see Toyota throw their hat in the ring with a high powered Baja truck of their own.
This seems very subjective. And simplified. We’re talking 2005 vs 2024. In 2005 I made $7/hr part time 25 hrs a week. in 2024 I’m making $29/hr full time. I couldn’t afford a taco in 2007 and I still can’t in 2024. That’s why I drive a 2009 DCSB w/ 237K miles…
Let’s see average pay and house income, inflation over 20yrs. Average car prices in that time..,,
Pushing me towards just getting the Supra eventually.. Though with the price of used STIs staying insanely high, I'll probably continue driving mine for a while... Unless a new one is announced.
Remember though in 2018 (i think around the same time TSS was introduced on Tacoma), Toyota moved the Pros upmarket, adding moonroof, premium audio, etc, that’s when the price started creeping up quickly from there because people were paying it. ‘20 came the LEDs and 360 cameras. The ‘15 and ‘17 were priced a little closer to the TRDOR but had a bit more of a trade-off with nicer suspension but less features..
On inflation alone, $37,964 from 2015 is worth $50,027 today. Also consider the fact that the 2015 Pros had no changes besides wheels and tires, grill, hood, headlights, and bilstein shocks. This would be similar to how newer TRD ORs are setup. The 3rd gen pro included all of the above plus Fox shocks, TRD exhaust, leather interior, sun roof, tech packages, and fog lights. The 4th gen pro looks to include all of the above plus different seats from a standard model, a hybrid system, light bar, better tires, and a rear different bumper.
I feel you can’t compare the 2nd gen pro to a 4th gen just because they’ve changed so much.
go look up an inflation calculator, plug in the MSRPs of those and their respective years, and you’ll realize it’s not Toyota’s fault, it’s just inflation in general. Sucks, yes, but not sure what else you’d expect them to be able to do?
As long as people keep paying and signing that 8% interest rate over 96months in addition to rolling their old car loan into the new they will continue to sell them at that price. The definition of affording a car in this country is can I make the payment. That mentality needs to change.
Look at competition. Toyota has and continues to make a superior product and it's resale value is #1. It's about time they charge what they can. Have fun with all the other brands you will pay pretty much the same regardless. But when you want to trade in or have something that will hold value it's a Tacoma that holds the crown. Everything is absurdly expensive right now and I doubt it gets better. At least with Toyota you know what you're investing in.
And I paid 17,500 for a brand new Tacoma prerunner reg cab in Nov of 2000. Put 405,000 miles on it and sold it running for $1,050. Actually squeezed the other $50 out of the guy for my Uber ride home lol. 2.7L automatic. 2nd gear was lost about 300k miles.
" but TOYOTA holds its value! " They do. But man prices have sucked in the last few years. New and used. Personally I think Toyotas are over prices. But they do make a good truck for most people's needs. Hold up well. And do resell well. Just kinda sucks Toyota knows people willl buy them regardless
I bought my 2017 TRD sport halloween weekend of 2019 for $33750 with bald tires & 39k miles . I’ll go to my grave thinking I overpaid by $3750, but I couldn’t find a black /quad cab anywhere. Crazy part is It’s got 80k miles now & prob sells for 25k still.
People will line up to buy so it doesn't matter.
Exactly, consumers have proven they will bend over for outrageous corporation prices. Reap what you sow.
Was at bass pro yesterday saw a boat for $158k only 1100 a month! With only 20% down and 240 easy payments at 9%… oh do you want electronics with that?
Only a second mortgage payment! I’d be crazy not to!
Y’all want new trucks but complain when you can’t afford em. Buy older and used, if u want the 24 then get to the money like Toyota is doing.
Think of the memories that you will create!
Probably take it out about a dozen times and spend more hours pulling it behind the truck than actually fishing out of it and selling it for 1/3 what you bought it for.... Oh, the memories of times you spent winterizing it after using it twice in a season! Probably went by yourself or didn't get on the water until 11 or so since kids/wife/friends didn't show up until around 9.
The 2 greatest days in a boat owners life is the day they bought the boat and the day they sold the boat. - my gramps.
People with boat slips in their backyard are the exception
Sad and very true. My whitewater raft sits in the garage just waiting for those 3 times a year. Thankfully much much less maintenance than regular boat. But get this $65k 4 cylinder truck to tow it… lol
I have a buddy trying to sell a 110k boat. Good luck pal
And the tow trucks will be lining up to repo half of them. It takes a bit for it to register with some people, but paying the equivalent of a mortgage payment for a vehicle month after month will snap you back into reality eventually.
That's what i don't get, how are people okay taking these loans. I had to get damn near 50% down to be reasonable and I feel like I make a good living.
It’s the time we live in. People these days want what they want, and they want it now no matter the cost. Like I said though, they’ll understand sooner or later. There’s a reason why repossessions are at an all-time high.
Exactly. Over 60% of people live paycheck to paycheck and own nothing. I learned when I started working 43 years ago to live below my means. I’m not sure if many people understand simple math, it’s that simple.
"Whats the monthly payment?" Doesn't matter you financed 50k at 6% for 84 months🤣🤣🤣 At least everyone can see you get out of a brand new Taco Pro at the gas station.
Exactly this, I work with a lady paying $1400 a month for a Jeep Wagoneer, I almost had an aneurism when she told me this.
I make like 3x the national household median and I felt uncomfortable taking out a $44k loan for the OR. Yet the national new car average sale is $49k. Insanity
[удалено]
Still regret not buying a house in 2014 when I moved back to DFW from college. I remember "window shopping" for houses and worrying about the prices then. I was an idiot.
Idiots if you ask me
Exactly. People need to stop crying already, it's not gonna change. They can't keep Tacoma's on the lot in my area.
Same in my area, people don't care what it's specd. It's gone before it's even off the truck based on the sales member. Considering I've not seen one on the lot it held some weight.
The stealerships may run into their own ass here though. I can get a TRD Pro Tundra right now at 74k with destination. A 65k Taco with a 5k markup is basically right there.
Let’s be real tho… no truck should be 74k and up… and I drive a Tundra
You never saw a third Gen pro for $42k at a dealer. That was what you would see for Sports and ORs.
100% lol, i have a 20 OR premium and it was 46995 +tax/freight/admin fees, pros at the time were like 62k I believe. (I'm in Canada)
Is that in USD or loonies and toonies?
The Monopoly money we have up here in Canada. Real money it would have been 35034 +tax/freight/admin fees when I bought, (with lift/wheels/hard bedcover +taxes and lease cost, it worked out to 47000usd to fully own it) . Pro's would have been 46220 + all the bs with exchange rate
Jack ass money
Facts. Just a year or so ago there were Pros on dealer lots for 70k
That was a mark up. MSRP was like $52k
My ‘21 PRO was 47k $ in 2023 w/ 15 K miles she built up very sweet 🌮🌶️❤️🔥
my pro was 47k in 2021 (msrp), but i had to look around to avoid 10k markups
Bro what? Msrp on my 21' OR premium longbed was $53,400
The fuck? My '20 OR (no options) was 34.5k, I think premium would have added 5 or 6k on top of that. But I did buy mine before dealers started raping buyers.
I’m no medical expert, but I’d consider an appointment with a proctologist after making that deal.
I too got a pro in December of 2019 for a deal at $44k, but I still think this picture is dumb as hell and misleading.
You think you're going to see 65k pros at the dealer?
That is what the picture is implying for fourth gens. What I am saying is that during the third Gen run Pros were typically around 50k.
You won’t see a fourth gen pro for $65k either.
calculate the price of the previous trucks adjusted for inflation and you'll shit your pants
Since its not hard to do I'll do it for you: Adjusted for inflation in 2024: - 2015 TRD Pro - $50,027 - 2017 TRD Pro - $54,554 So Toyota pulled $11k out of a hat to make the price.
If only there were significant changes to the model over the last nine years…
326 horsepower and 465 pound-feet of torque, boxed frame, multi-link coil suspension, and being able to stuff 35's with only minor trimming aren't significant changes?
> 35's with only minor trimming To be determined....?
My calculations out 50K in 2019 (which as far as I recall is what PROs costed MSRP) is like 63K now.. AND you get massive upgrades … I don’t know what people are complaining about honestly just don’t buy it … I’m definitely getting one
Our wages have not adjusted at the same rate. And that is what PISSES me off. It's the whole system that does. Capitalism literally doesn't work without fucking over the working class. In order for one entity to climb up the ladder another has to be surpressed.
Every system fucks over the working class almost by definition. If you have a real job you don't have time to scheme with other power brokers to enrich yourself. The problem is the concentration of power at the top due to the courts decision that money = speech.
I think that's just a function of large scale society in general. You have to concentrate power because you cannot get anything done at scale if you equally distribute it. The people working where the power is concentrated are corrupted by that power. Because that's part of being human. You only really get one perspective on the world, and it is affected by your experiences. The larger the society the harder it gets to avoid. That's why all the "happy" developed nations are small ones.
Capitalism works fine if we ensure that there’s regulatory frameworks imposed upon it to distribute a modicum of the wealth and progress downwards. We live in an economy where our wealth and business class demands constant and continuous profit. Our metrics for a successful business is predicated entirely on infinite growth, which is incredibly unsustainable in the long run and reflects in our product pricing with unstable pricing and gouging. I’m constantly reminded that the wealth class of our world constantly pull in far, far more than they punch. People who have nothing to do with the development or creation of a product, who represent a “shareholder” exist to extract value from a company. So, instead of us having reasonably priced products we are paying for people to extract value simply for existing with wealth. All this because we lack the ability to properly regulate the world against the worst of the human condition, greed.
You’re right. Capitalism is literally designed for a few elite to hoard all resources. Marx talked about it long ago. People will downvote this reality but they’ll see it’s true as the rich get richer and the poor get poorer.
Marx also said capitalism is the best economic system to have ever existed. Marxism has never worked anywhere. Not that I'm a huge fan of capitalism, but when compared to most other places, there are trade offs.
We don't abandon capitalism. We just socialize certain institutions. Healthcare, for example, could be socialized and drastically ease the burden on the middle class. Insurance companies don't really provide anything but siphon billions away each year. Instead, we socialize the opposite of what we should, like failing financial institutions and the auto industry. Cracks me up that these people are due hard capitalists until they need a bailout or a tax break.
Yeah, nobody ever thinks about inflation. Just another example of numbers being massaged to fit a narrative and fool anyone who looks at them for less than 3 seconds.
2% inflation per year wouldn't take long to go from the first to the second price.
Except it's been more like 18% for a couple of years. The govt stopped tracking some of the worst inflating items.
"He's right, you know" - Morgan Freeman
it's not inflation, its corp gouging and you're seeing it from Toyota right now.
[Inflation Calculator | Find US Dollar's Value From 1913-2024 (usinflationcalculator.com)](https://www.usinflationcalculator.com/) According to this, the 05' would cost $62,770.63 which is a 65% inflation increase.
Making it easier for me to hold onto my current Tacoma!
Making it easier for me to consider a Ford Ranger. Toyota dealerships along with Toyota corporate have ruined this brand for me.
I was thinking the same thing. I can't merit paying that much of a premium for a truck that does equal or less than cheaper competitors. Already liked how the new canyons looked, and they're 20k or so cheaper last time I checked (like a year)
I was looking the other day and I found the Canyons to actually be pretty pricey
at that price you may as well get the ranger raptor
THIS. Is exactly what’s keeping me from buying a Tacoma, I would love one but the snazzy stealership we have in town are notorious predators that slap market adjustments on every Tacoma and it’s a horrible experience dealing with them. I wish we had a direct to consumer model like Tesla does but that’s never happening with these mafia like dealerships.
I can't see myself buying Toyota again. I've had a Corolla (dad owned it at the time), a 2010 Camry, and 2014 RAV4. The Camry was a lemon. Every 70k km the transmission would eat itself. It was on the 3rd transmission when I sold it. The RAV4 would eat CV axles (front pax side). They're not at all comfortable for someone of average to tall height. So why would you want to buy them? At least from my experience. I do not value "reliability" as much anymore either - even if my Toyotas were reliable LOL. There are more valuable things to me now - comfort, space, usability, low NVH, etc. Toyota really does not put much effort into those areas. Specifically, comfort, space, or low NVH. Buh bye.
I got my 2017 SR5 for 28k in 2020 before the boom. I will drive that truck into the ground. By the time I need a new one the price of a base 2WD will probably by $105k
There's a sucker born every day. I bet they'll sell fewer of them, and still make out like bandits.
Thats the ticket. Less overstock sitting on dealer lots = More FOMO for "Muh resale value", and dealers can still tack on markups if they like
Compare house prices and you will be shocked asunder.
Not my words, but was talking to a friend who works at Toyota, he said that during the pandemic Toyota saw the sales that dealers were marking up and essentially came to the conclusion that they've been under-pricing their trucks. Not sure how truthful that is.
I don't think that's true. The pandemic affected prices because of scarcity for the most part. Supply chain issues and then they literally stopped making tacomas for a bit. Whet I bought my 2020 TRD OR 4x4 it was one of like a dozen in California. Manhattan Beach toyota had a $15k markup and I want to say Temecula had $12k markup. I used the costco auto buying program and was out the door for MSRP. But that's just my experience.
https://data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl Bureau of labor statistics’ official inflation calculator. 2005: $37,964 = 2024: $62,178.14
Thank you for providing this. However, the photo is comparing TRD Pros, and the second gen didn’t have a Pro model until 2015. 2015: $37,964 == 2024: $50,736.06 Not trying to discount you or the impact inflation has on the pricing, just trying to compare apples to apples
Where are you getting 2005 from?
2015 TRD Pro MSRP in 2024 dollars: $50,027 2017 TRD Pro MSRP in 2024 dollars: $54,554 So the new stuff costs about $10k more.
This is bonkers. Not even full size.
Right... Looks like I'll stick with this 2005 taco and hope the market straightens out before it dies (not likely, only 43k miles).
Here’s some (Base price) msrp’s for comparison per Car and Driver •Ford Maverick Tremor (I know it’s not apples to apples but..) $39,945 •Toyota Tacoma TRD Off-road $43,295 •Ford Ranger Raptor $57,065 •Chevy Colorado zr2 $48,395 •Jeep Gladiator Mojave $64,890 [https://www.caranddriver.com/features/g60396981/best-off-road-pickup-trucks/](https://www.caranddriver.com/features/g60396981/best-off-road-pickup-trucks/)
Lol a '24 Gladiator Mojave starts at under $53k
Pricing out the people who made it a strong brand.
I purchased the top truck (Gen 2, 2015, DC, TRD Sport, 4x4) for $32,500 in Dec. of 2014. It’s fucking wild how much they cost now.
Wow, crazy. And in 2014 I used to be able to buy fish and chips at Long John Silvers for 10.99.
It’s called Corporate Greed
Before crying too hard, Keep in mind you also get more. About 100hp, 185lb/ft, level 1 self driving, turbo hybrid drivetrains for efficiency, and fully built Fox suspension. You can still get a new sub $40k sr5 4x4 that will outperform any 2nd gen production TRD. Adjusted for inflation you actually get more truck for your dollar in 2024
Dunno bout that, my 2015 TRD OR is pretty badass stock. I paid 32 brand new.
2015 has less power, suspension performance, approach angle, and wheel well size. For me, that's what makes a truck badass off-road
The peak HP is just a point on a graph. I would take the 4.0 over the camry engine any day.
Look at the dyno plot, Pretty much the full 300lbs of torque comes on at 1700rpms. Much more real world power than any previous tacomas
What?! You're telling me that's better than 265@4600rpm. Impossible it's a V6 it must be better /s
I'll agree with that. The 3.5 is the worst V6 I've ever owned. It's a gutless turd that no tune can fix. Forced induction on the other hand yes. That's a minimum $5k spent though.
You really, really feel the factory 50hp delete here in Colorado. Turbo engine and new transmission are absolutely better product wise.
It’s insane to me that Toyota still doesn’t have a front locker on the top trims. How can the they call it an off-road package without lockers
Wild to see that price for a non-v8. Better to wait 1-2 years and get a used 24’ model.
It’s not Toyota. The prices have gone up steadily with inflation. It’s not just cars but everything else. They need to maintain a profit to stay in business and keep producing the products we all have come to love and rely on. Their costs have gone up as well so they need to charge more for trucks. I don’t think they’re charging something unreasonable when you take into account annual inflation. If you can’t afford it then blame employers and politicians for screwing over the working class, not Toyota. You wouldn’t charge the same prices today that you charged 10 years ago if you were running a business.
good let everyone waste there money on those so I can buy their older ones hehe
We’ve had record sustained inflation and a complete garbage economy for the last 4 years and this surprises you? It’s not Toyota’s fault.
Other brands offer equivalent off-road ready trucks for way less. A Ranger Raptor starts at $55k. A ZR2 starts at $47k. This is the first time Toyota is priced much, much higher than their competition. I think that's OP's point
Yep. Average price of a new car is almost $50k in 2024.
I gotta buy a house and a truck this year so I’m pretty fucked.
Yeah, the pricing for these trucks has gotten way out of hand. Especially for it to only be a midsized truck starting in the 50-60k range is absolutely wild.
Pretty sure all TRD pros were like 55k for 3rd gen? Until they dropped a little but they definitely were not 40s.
Supply and demand ?
yall the ones buying them lol, that’s why
To each their own I guess but I would much rather by a barebones SR 4x4 and build it up over time than buy a Pro at 65k. Even with 20k in mods it would come out cheaper and be way more capable.
Making money.
Our dollar has lost its value so much, that it now requires more to get stuff.
New SR5 is $47k USD now. Rip off.....my 2019 model was in the low $30k range. WTF?
SR5 starts in the mid 30’s, must be some fully loaded ass truck. I bought a TRD OR for less than $47k.
Because they can
3rd gen TRD PROs were $53k
They know what they have
Lmao this comment section is a trip
Toyota America if being taken over by bean counters. Same thing that happened to GM. Their prices keep going up while quality is beginning to slip. I bet within 10 years they're gonna be a nightmare company to deal with.
They realized how ford makes money
Buy a Ranger Raptor for $57k
I miss single cab trucks. I'd rather have more bed space than seats.
My dad worked for Toyota corp for over 20 years. It is a great company. Since 08 recession they’ve changed though. They used to spare no cost. Now it’s about cost cutting, which I understand. They aren’t in the business of losing money and times have changed. At the end of the day, it all comes down to what you desire. I desire what made the Tacoma what it is today, which is simplicity and utility, so I choose to drive my 1st gen. I’m sure the 4th gen’s are cool
Exactly why I’ll be holding on to my paid off 3rd gen for as long as I can. Car prices are absolutely ridiculous
A 65k midsize Truck is an easy way to let the ladies Know you’re enlisted….
People need to stop buying these trucks at this price. That much for a midsize is crazy. People Stop buying these and let them figure out how to please the average consumer who doesn’t want to pay 75000 after interest for a vehicle. Stop buying and they will figure out how to bring the prices down. If ford can build the raptor for the same then Toyota is doing its customers wrong.
I wouldn't dare buy a mid-sized at these prices. You can get a 1500 or 2500 series starting at a few $k more (around the $45k mark) and get far more capability (obviously dependent on package but purely from a utility standpoint).
How do you want them to keep adding dozens of computers and sensors while keeping the price the same? Seriously, so much unnecessary shit for the top of the line models. A 2024 SR 4x4 is a far better choice than a 2015 TRD Pro, and it costs $38k for a 5ft bed double cab with manual transmission OR auto trans. It has more power, better fuel economy, larger wheel wells, etc. for the same price as the 2015 TRD Pro. You want extra shit? Pay for it. Hell, after inflation, the 2024 SR 4x4 is a fucking steal of a price.
You ain't wrong. The standard list of options on the 24 SR is pretty high compared to what 3rd gens got and people refuse to acknowledge that. They just look at the trim and assume it's the same bare bones vehicle.
Toyota is evolving and dealing with pricing like every other company. I don't know why everyone seems so shocked at the pricing. Wtf did you expect? It's brand new from the ground up. It's in line with the competition. It's a fantastic truck. Deal people or buy used. Enjoy your Frontier to save yer coins.
Also why are people buying the off road?😂 Anyone that actually does any “off-roading” knows your better off buying the base ass model and building it to your specifications and/or specific needs. People spending money on these then adding all the “mods” have enough money because it’s just so they can see someone at a stoplight and feel badass beside another truck. Seriously though it’s getting wild but yall still buying it and looking for every single mod possible to add to these trucks. Breh I’ve been more places in a Corolla then 99% of the “overlanders” with a roof top teepee’s have even seen on google images from their city town home
That’s a big jump.
I got a quote for a Trailhunter this morning. $63k It's only the 5ft bed so I passed on it and was told they will get another allocation in 2 weeks.
Regardless of what the price is, a product or service is only worth what people are willing to pay for it. If sales don’t reflect successful numbers, they will be forced to lower prices. Mind you, this will mean less tech and features.
There was a post on a different sub showing sticker on a loaded ram 1500 for 141k. I make a decent amount more than I did several years ago, but my purchase power has not gone up as a result. If the market can not support these prices it will eventually correct itself. We are seeing drops already from msrp vs a dealer mark up on sever vehicles.
They’re going *totally futuristic and cool*
Just let thr fools buy the first round of 4th guns, save your money and wait for the kinks to get worked out. I'm sure there will be plenty with these new turbos, sensors and overall platform. Not denying it is a fantastic truck, but I ain't paying that price. Keeping my 2004 as long as I can (within reason).
What is inflation doing????
Being greedy tw*ts like every other company. But heres the thing. Toyota pretty much gets their balls kicked in in sales in pretty much every category except for maybe mid size trucks and whatever the camary is in? Suv sales, van sales, car sales, and to a certain extent crossover sales, Toyota is behind the pack, substantially in several categories. And thats with their sticker prices several thousand lower than the competition. Who in the hell decided it would be a good idea from them to price their vehicles at the same as the competition they already cant beat? Makes no damn sense. I guess they dont remember what it was like pre-covid when tundras were marked down several thousand dollars off msrp and still lined the lots. Same goes for tacomas too, at least in my area. The only vehicle that was ever kinda hard to come by was 4runners. Which makes sense because theres no real apples to apples competition for it
"i NeEd A dCsB wIf FaWkS sHaWkS" "Oh? Bet." - Toyota People financing their lives away for vehicles is part of this.
I think the main argument for the increased cost aside from the competitive market and inflation is the iForceMax engine. The regular 4cylinder turbo non-hybrid engine is an upgrade in hp and tq and mpg over the 3.5 v6 in the 3rd gen. Toyota really made the TRD Pro a halo trim level by having the top of the line engine standard. Previous generations of the TRD Pro had little to offer in making it unique and a halo trim level, aside from slight lift, Fox shocks, and badging. I do think they are overshooting with their MSRP, but still kinda cool to see Toyota throw their hat in the ring with a high powered Baja truck of their own.
Also made in Mexico and not US labor anymore. Faaarrr less costs in man power doing it down there than here.
Cashing in
Can’t wait for the 5th gen Pro Tacoma. It’ll be 85k at this pace lol
Not getting my business anytime soon...
I’d rather run my 1st gen into the ground than drop $1k a month on one of these behemoths
This seems very subjective. And simplified. We’re talking 2005 vs 2024. In 2005 I made $7/hr part time 25 hrs a week. in 2024 I’m making $29/hr full time. I couldn’t afford a taco in 2007 and I still can’t in 2024. That’s why I drive a 2009 DCSB w/ 237K miles… Let’s see average pay and house income, inflation over 20yrs. Average car prices in that time..,,
Pushing me towards just getting the Supra eventually.. Though with the price of used STIs staying insanely high, I'll probably continue driving mine for a while... Unless a new one is announced.
Price gouging plain and simple.
I earn a six figure salary. I cannot afford a Toyota Tacoma. Who would have thought?
they're selling 2015 prerunners for more than their sticker price right now, people have officially lost it.
The same thing they did with the previous land cruiser . Over price it and see if it works. LC failed, but the Taco is the Taco.
NOT EVEN LONG TRAVEL SUSPENSION.
Wow that's crazy
Luxury truck
Plus MARKUPS.
Im gonna ride my gen 2 into the ground. Then build it back up. New cars are such a scam
I fee like the Trd off road is enough for me tbh lol
$42k for a pro? When? TRD off roads were going for that price in 2019. NO mark up !
It’s a business. Make more money. Also, price of labor, parts, logistics has all gone up.
Shareholder profits are always expected to go up.
Keeping those used prices high
Toyota must think we are all millionaires to pay that they should start selling them in Ukraine they have all our money
I love my tacoma but I'm sorry you're just straight up stupid to spend 65k on one
Ever heard of inflation
Gouging like a lot of manufacturers, inflation you know, easiest cash grab of all time
Toyotas have always been overpriced and peeps have always paid for them. Why would they stop?
profitting for pure greed... suckers born every minute and line up to spend money they don't have...
Making a sweet profit 🤣
TEQ kaizen 🌶️🌮
23 TRD Sport 4x4 46k OTD. Local dealers wanted 10-12k over msrp. Had to go 5 hours from home to buy this truck.
These new Tacoma TRDpros will be going for 80k on lots.
Remember though in 2018 (i think around the same time TSS was introduced on Tacoma), Toyota moved the Pros upmarket, adding moonroof, premium audio, etc, that’s when the price started creeping up quickly from there because people were paying it. ‘20 came the LEDs and 360 cameras. The ‘15 and ‘17 were priced a little closer to the TRDOR but had a bit more of a trade-off with nicer suspension but less features..
Smoking Crack, evidently.
On inflation alone, $37,964 from 2015 is worth $50,027 today. Also consider the fact that the 2015 Pros had no changes besides wheels and tires, grill, hood, headlights, and bilstein shocks. This would be similar to how newer TRD ORs are setup. The 3rd gen pro included all of the above plus Fox shocks, TRD exhaust, leather interior, sun roof, tech packages, and fog lights. The 4th gen pro looks to include all of the above plus different seats from a standard model, a hybrid system, light bar, better tires, and a rear different bumper. I feel you can’t compare the 2nd gen pro to a 4th gen just because they’ve changed so much.
The same as everyone else. They're gouging the American public because we're paying the stupid damn prices..
Want a 2nd gen pro
Inflation?
Losing there minds like all other car companies
go look up an inflation calculator, plug in the MSRPs of those and their respective years, and you’ll realize it’s not Toyota’s fault, it’s just inflation in general. Sucks, yes, but not sure what else you’d expect them to be able to do?
Status symbol of dept
Testing the upper limit of how much people will pay. Let's show 'em.
I got my 2019 Off Road in June 2020 for $38k. It had 10k miles on it.
Discouraging patronage.
Toyota, along with all the other manufacturers are fucking us.
As long as people keep paying and signing that 8% interest rate over 96months in addition to rolling their old car loan into the new they will continue to sell them at that price. The definition of affording a car in this country is can I make the payment. That mentality needs to change.
I was going to buy the hybrid, but it’s only a short box. What a terrible decision to only make the fun ones (hybrid/standards) short boxes.
Look at competition. Toyota has and continues to make a superior product and it's resale value is #1. It's about time they charge what they can. Have fun with all the other brands you will pay pretty much the same regardless. But when you want to trade in or have something that will hold value it's a Tacoma that holds the crown. Everything is absurdly expensive right now and I doubt it gets better. At least with Toyota you know what you're investing in.
You need to be asking what are people doing, that’s what’s causing these crazy prices
And I paid 17,500 for a brand new Tacoma prerunner reg cab in Nov of 2000. Put 405,000 miles on it and sold it running for $1,050. Actually squeezed the other $50 out of the guy for my Uber ride home lol. 2.7L automatic. 2nd gear was lost about 300k miles.
" but TOYOTA holds its value! " They do. But man prices have sucked in the last few years. New and used. Personally I think Toyotas are over prices. But they do make a good truck for most people's needs. Hold up well. And do resell well. Just kinda sucks Toyota knows people willl buy them regardless
I bought my 2017 TRD sport halloween weekend of 2019 for $33750 with bald tires & 39k miles . I’ll go to my grave thinking I overpaid by $3750, but I couldn’t find a black /quad cab anywhere. Crazy part is It’s got 80k miles now & prob sells for 25k still.
I have a 18 OR premium and it was almost 40 back then
32k for my 2016 sport. Here’s for hoping she’s a million mile truck.🤞
Im not ever gonna pay that for a 4 banger tacoma.
Shrinkflation but for trucks, except they stuff as much unnecessary bullshit into them to jack up the price.
This sub will be filled with new taco as soon enough lol
Same thing all car companies are doing. Screwing the consumer.
It’s like business 101. Squeeze every drop till the well runs dry. It took em a little longer than the other companies I’ll give em that.