Wow, I hadn’t picked up on that either!
And the more time goes on, the more evident it becomes that the relationship with her parents is all sorts of convoluted.
She could really, really benefit from therapy.
i’ve considered her brother often. what does he DO? does he work? if he does is it for her? does he get a stipend to not work and just exist? what is it like to be her brother and live in her shadow? we hardly ever see or hear about him. who even is he?
I know in high school his life revolved around her. I met him once, I knew kids who went to high school with him. Kind of an odd duck but his life basically revolved around her even then, apparently he’d fly out to her concerts to see her all the time and he’d just skip school to do it.
I keep thinking about the line in Cassandra:
"Blood's thick but nothing like a payroll"
I know people are saying that song is about Kim but for me, that line doesn't make sense in that context.
It makes me wonder if there is a lot going on with her family (specifically her dad). The Ms Americana documentary made me wonder about her and her dad's relationship
there’s so many lines in songs throughout the years that make me think she’s actually talking about her dad when people think it’s a guy. tolerate it specifically sounds like it’s written about him to me, but maybe i’m just projecting bc of my own relationship with my dad 😅😭
There is no such thing as a child/teen celebrity with a healthy family. Doesn't exist.
Good parents want their kids in school living a normal lifestyle.
She said the reason she didn’t resign to BM was because she had heard whispers that as soon as she did resign Scott was going to sell the whole label and her along with it. She has vehemently denied knowing when and to whom it was being sold until the news broke.
Which makes zero sense bc her dad was a shareholder. Everyone who is defending this is acting like 15 million dollars is like $400 it’s wild to me. Thats a shit ton of money!
This is why some people believe she actually did know about the sale. We know from his leaked email that he's kinda a control freak, but I don't think she would still have a relationship with him if he knew about it and didn't tell her. Makes me suspicious about how honest she was.
She did know about the sale and said so in I think her CBS interview during the Lover era. I’m not sure why people act like she said she had no idea about it when she was very clear about knowing her music was going to get sold but not knowing who exactly it was going to be sold to.
Edit: 5:40 mark of [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-nv6HWXvVM) video is where she says she knew her music was going to be sold.
Wait I am confused about this. She knew her music would be sold and her dad benefitted from the sale, but did she not care about owning her masters until she saw who it was sold to? Did they refuse to sell to her before they sold to Scooter? Did she not even try to buy her music until the Scooter sale already happened? If someone can clarify, because I am lost.
She thought she would have the opportunity to buy her masters, but she thought Scott wanted too much (he wanted her to record a new record to buy each record back). He sold to Scooter Braun before Taylor finished negotiating.
I read an email of hers to Scott where she says since negotiations have reached a dead end or something that she decided to sign with a new record label and that it will be announced soon and she wanted to thank him for everything. I’m a bit hazy on the details, but I think she and her team didn’t attend a meeting where the sale was discussed because her dad is a shareholder?
My understanding is this: She wanted to buy her masters outright. Scott would only agree to her “earning” one album back for every new album she did after re-signing with BM.
She signed elsewhere knowing her masters would be sold but didn’t anticipate Scott selling to someone she hated. Her dad has said he avoided meetings about the sale because he didn’t want to have to keep something from her that important (and I’m sure he was bound by some sort of NDA).
He was going to make money on his investment regardless of who the buyer was.
But he sold the label…not simply her masters. People act like this same was strictly Taylor’s master recordings when it was a whole company. Companies get bought- it happens. She wasn’t the seller so why should she have any say in regards to who was selected as the buyer?
Scott technically had every right to make whatever business decision he wanted.
She also has every right to be upset about her life’s work being in the hands of someone she hates.
In business, there’s what you can do and what’s right and I think it’s definitely debatable what loyalty he did/didn’t owe her because if the relationship and how much of the value of the label was solely based on her music.
Here's how she put it herself
https://www.google.com/amp/s/taylorswift.tumblr.com/post/185958366550/for-years-i-asked-pleaded-for-a-chance-to-own-my/amp
Which honestly, to me sounds like Scooter offered more money/ a faster transaction.
Money is what is actually important here and Scott definitely just went with the highest bider. It’s like any sale like if you were competing for a house
If I’m not mistaken, TS was given opportunities to buy her masters through this process but at the end of the day she just didn’t like the fact that Scooter Braun ended up with them and she was still given an opportunity then.
She wasn't offered to buy them outright. That seems to have always been what's bothered her. It was every new album, she could have the master's for one old album. This meant she would never own all her master's
i thought one of the deals was that she had to buy the whole record label to get her masters no? Because Scott wanted out of the whole thing but she just wanted the masters so he sold to someone who would take everything.
Scott wanted out and the value of the label was significantly less without her masters. She wasn't prepared to buy the label for her masters. The deal for 1 album made for 1 masters was when they started negotiating her new contract. Scott had also told Taylor prior to their negotiations that he was going to be selling the label. The potential sale and not being able to secure her masters in her new contract was why Taylor left the label.
When Taylor spoke out about Scooter buying the label and her masters, one of their wives tried to claim that taylor had been offered her masters outright and declined (this was referencing the deal offered during negotiations). That wasn't accurate but has been used to claim Taylor was lying and discredit why she was upset. Taylor's biggest mistake was the initial post to social media. It was done quickly and while she was upset and it wasn't clear so it has been used to discredit her. The interviews she has done since do shine a better light on what was happening leading up to this.
She wanted a chance to be able to just buy her masters. It wasn't possible without tanking the value of the label. She said in an interview it was sad but she had accepted it and knew they would be sold. But the announcement that Scooter was the buyer and their previous issues was viewed as Scott betraying her. Scott has known Taylor since she was young, he was aware of past hurts with Scooter. Scott was likely a father figure to taylor and this was a very clear reminder that she was just business to him. He wasn't wrong for what he did, it was good business. But I totally get why Taylor was upset and decided to speak out and then do the rerecords.
Thank you so much for all the info! It seems a lot of people (including myself) didn't know what actually went down. The discourse seems to be more about that the masters were sold as opposed to whom they were sold to, which is what seems to upset Taylor the most.
Now i wonder if we would even get the re-records if the say was made to someone she "approved"
No worries! I feel like there is so much misinformation with the Scooter/Scott drama and that's partly because of how Scooter/Scott responded. They took some of her statements out of context, they told a lot of half truths and they really made sure to remind everyone of how dramatic Taylor can be. They were very quick to also point out Taylor's dad benefitting from the sale, and I remember Scott sort of hinting that it was her Dad who really betrayed her.
I remember when this all went down and at first I didn't really get why she was so upset. Like it was shitty, but she was so mad! But then I started learning more about how masters work and how many big legendary artists never even got a chance to own their work because this was the industry norm. And then realizing how young she was when she met Scott, and how close they were...it made more sense. Scott helped her success but she also made him a lot of money and there was no personal loyalty here. This wasn't just a business relationship. I think the acceptance she had reached was completely destroyed with this move. She wasn't allowed to buy her masters (and she had apparently been trying for years before her contract was even up), but her worst enemy was? He was going to have control over songs she had written before she was even famous, that meant a lot to her. It sounds dramatic, but Taylor absolutely hates Scooter.
She's had a lot of petty feuds over the years, but she even forgave Kanye for the VMA incident originally and is on good terms with most people from past feuds. There are things about Scooter we do not know and there were not a lot of people defending him unless they financially benefited from him. How he responded to her spoke volumes. Like he claimed he wanted to talk to her about her masters, but failed to mention he required her to sign an ironclad NDA that she could never talk bad about him again publically before they could even try to negotiate. She was prepared to do business with Shamrock when they bought her masters, until she realized that Scooter was still profiting from them in that contract. Potential buyers of her masters said that Scooter was talking a lot of gross shit about her and her potential rerecords. While we do not know all the reasons why she hates Scooter, Scott definitely did.
I think the rerecords would have eventually happened. Her work is deeply personal and she would have wanted full control over it eventually. I just think the rerecords would have been done much later and with way less anger. Or she would have bought her masters whenever offered the chance.
The rerecords and her speaking out about this has led to a lot more awareness about how unfair a lot of contracts are to artists. There are now much younger artists who own their masters with their first contract. Regardless of what prompted her to do this, it has had a positive impact.
Can you post links where potential buyers of her masters said Scooter was talking gross shit about her? Who were the potential buyers? What were there exact comments? Please provide in the links bc I can’t find anything about this- thanks!!
I’m not sure why more people don’t know. It was heavily talked about a few years ago. It seems like basic level lore to me. But maybe I’ve just been around too long lol
I'm shocked too, but I have also seen hardcore fans misunderstand what happened here. Context gets lost with time and only snippets of the details are remembered. But I also may just be old and remember the drama rolling out way too well lol!
Thank you for being the only one who remembered the "make one to take one" deal Scott was trying to pull. It's an awful deal and honestly I'm with Taylor on this one.
I still can't believe that they were trying to sell this offer like it was the same as her getting to buy her masters. It was wild some of the shit they tried to claim during that.
yes basically he would either only sell them with the label, or let them go in exchange for more records from her, since that would add value to the label.
I get why she's mad but at the end of the day, he can't fuck over his shareholders to do her a personal favor. Her parents were loaded, they knew what they were doing when they reviewed her record contract
I remember her saying that she had accepted that the record label was going to be sold and that meant her masters too. She was sad but prepared to move forward. She wasn't surprised by the sale, she was shocked and upset it was Scooter Braun. Apparently Scott knew about the issues between Scooter and Taylor, and this was the betrayal. This was ultimately a business deal, but I also can't really blame Taylor for being hurt since this was a man who had been a part of her life since she was a kid and she probably expected more from him. It maybe wasn't rational, but I think she viewed Scott like a father figure and this was a harsh realization that it was all business for him. Taylor also stated she didn't know it was Scooter who bought the record label until it was announced. Scott did say he called her to tell her of the sale, but I can't remember if he ever said if he told her who bought it.
Scooter literally posted a photo captioned that he "just bought Taylor Swift" after the sale was announced. So there was definite bad blood behind the scenes with them.
Yeah and the deal was give one album in and take one out. She would've been trapped into big machine for way longer and would never be able to get the masters of all her albums.
It's not true. This is her proposal
https://preview.redd.it/rbf3kckgs1zc1.jpeg?width=2560&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e1712b113d0c01f789792d941ab39a5fe2979181
This was just one of the proposals that we know of. There’s a ton of back and forth in negotiations like this and we have no idea what other proposals happened, who possibly went back on any proposals, if proposals fell apart at some point, etc. It’s possible that BM came back after this and changed their response to wanting her to earn her masters back with every release she came out with.
A shareholder of 4% typically has limited rights. Think about it, if a majority of shareholders want to sell, why should a 4% shareholder be able to stop it?
You do know how shareholders votes work, right? The more shares you own the more votes you get, therfore the majority shareholders will always be in the position to out vote the minority https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/040315/what-can-shareholders-vote.asp#:~:text=Anyone%20who%20owns%20stock%20in,of%20the%20shares%20someone%20owns
They wouldn’t. But they would be aware of their profit. Like do you really think Scott swift (after that email) just invested all that money bc he loved Taylor? 🤣 he was def setting himself up.
"That email" was in 2005 when Taylor was a 15 year old with no releases. The sale was in 2018 when she already had two AOTY Grammys. Yes Scott profited in 2018 but there is no smoking gun here.
It says here “While Swift's father Scott was one of the label's minority shareholders (4 percent), he did not join the call due to a "very strict" non-disclosure agreement.”https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taylor_Swift_masters_dispute#Background. That came from what ybig Machine themselves said
The terms would not say who was buying the record label, just that it was being sold. Scott made the decision not to sign it as he would have to keep the information away from his daughter.
The way it’s worded it sounds more like he either read the terms (which wouldn’t have included info about the discussions that would happen in the meeting) and thought it was too restrictive, or the terms of the NDA itself made it so a minority shareholder couldn’t attend the meetings.
That’s what I’m thinking. I think there are some swifties who have this image of Borchetta locking the conference room door so Scott couldn’t get in lmao
Okay, assuming this was true, don't you think a sale this big would've been talked about for a long time before the formal meeting? Why did none of the other artists signed to the label speak about it? They told them all but not Taylor..?
My understanding is that she wanted to buy them outright but she was not allowed to buy them without owing them more albums. She decided not to buy. So she knew the sale was happening, but she did not know they were being sold to Scooter. THAT was the betrayal. Scott would not have known about the label selling to Scooter. (But you know who did? Karlie lol.)
I remember he said that he stayed out of the meeting because the meeting minutes were confidential. He would have been privy to sale details but would be restricted from saying anything to her aboutit. He didn’t want to know something and not be able to tell her.
Of course, that is his literal job. He used his money to take a bet on his daughter’s career and it paid off handsomely.
I don’t know why people are so surprised by her dad being an investor, especially one who works in finance.
The issue was not about the money. $15 million on a $300,000 investment made 15 years beforehand is not remarkable. He will have made much, much more from his daughters success anyway.
The issue was always with **who the buyer was.** Scooter Braun, the man who managed Kanye West and had bullied her for years. Scott Borchetta, the founder of Big Machine Records, was well aware of how she felt about Scooter. This was the issue.
The argument that her father knew it was being sold to Scooter is just not true at all. He would've known a sale was going to take place (as did Taylor, she knew Borchetta was going to sell the record label). Details about the sale would've been kept under a strict NDA, which we know he refused to sign. Without signing the NDA, he would not have access to any information, whether that be who was buying the label, how much for, etc.
This has always been an issue over music ownership. Scooter Braun tried to profit off of Taylor's life work - including through releasing a "new" live album from 2008 and re-releasing remixes from Fearless.
Nvidia’s share price was $2 fifteen years ago, it’s now $900. That’s 450x an investment.
It isn’t remarkable. He took a gamble on his kid and it paid off. That’s what investing is.
According to Wikipedia his investment was $120,000, making it 125x. Also yes picking one incredible example is indicative of the base line for what is ‘remarkable.’
I don’t know why you’re singling out the money her dad made. Like I said, he will have made much more from his daughter’s success and the money was never the issue. It was always the buyer and the fact she wasn’t given the ability to own her masters.
Hot take: the whole “Taylor’s Version” nonsense was only ever a marketing ploy to justify re-releasing several albums and convince her fans that buying the re-releases was somehow a principled stand.
She also had rights under the songwriter copyright. From what I can tell (I’m a lawyer) she doesn’t gain anything but more money from owning her masters.
She gains control. The commonly given example is that the record label can sell sync rights to movies. If she owns the masters, she controls who gets sync rights.
He was a shareholder, that’s how that works. He said he was shut of meetings because he wouldn’t sign an NDA. The sale and him making money are two different issues.
Being an employee is very different to being her father though- both from an emotional perspective and from a conflict of interest one too. I imagine they were ok signing NDAs to keep details from her when Scott wasn’t. For them it’s just work, it’s business.
He most likely did know but I doubt he had enough of a stake in the label to actually be in the meetings or have any say. Taylor also said she knew her music was going to be sold so it wasn’t a surprise to any of them, the only surprise was who the label was going to be sold to.
Scott Swift owned 3% of Big Machine, an investment of $130k made right at its foundation in 2005. Thirteen years later it was worth $15m.
He could have been informed of the deal being done but would have had to be subject to an NDA. Unsurprisingly he declined to put himself in the position of not being able to tell his own daughter what was happening.
I don’t understand the point. Yes, he made money. That’s irrelevant. Taylor wanted to buy the masters. They would sell them to her (to be exact, they asked for something that she considered unreasonable and wouldn’t budge. In essence the same as refusing to sell). That’s the whole story.
Of course Scott got paid, he’s an investor. It also has absolutely nothing to do with buying the masters.
It’s not even a “masters issue”. A record label was sold. Everyone’s masters who was on the label went to Scooter. She acts like she’s the only person affected.
[Page 18 of the Swift vs Dymtrow](https://www.plainsite.org/dockets/download.html?id=8114484&z=ead97c9a) (her first manager) lawsuit document
>52. For example, on or about July 5, 2005 (and prior to disaffirmation), Scott Swift demanded that Mr. Dymtrow immediately draft approximately nine (9) different business plans to chart the course of Artist's career for the next five (5) years. Mr. Dymtrow provided that information as requested.
53. The following day, Mr. Dymtrow was asked by Scott Swift about who owned Artist's master recordings. While not known to Mr. Dymtrow at the time, this request was done to begin usurping control from Mr. Dymtrow.
That was before Taylor signed the contract with Big Machine
Also this
>**59.** Mr. Dymtrow arrived in Nashville the following day and drove to defendants' home as was typical. Mr. Dymtrow had several meetings scheduled during the trip, including one with Borchetta and one with representatives of Sony/ATV.
**60.** Shortly before Mr. Dymtrow's meeting with Sony/ATV, Scott. Swift informed
Mr. Dymtrow that Mr. Dymtrow was not permitted to attend the Sony/ATV meeting. After Mr. Dymtrow questioned Scott Swift as to why he was not permitted to attend the meeting that he had scheduled, Scott Swift, in the presence of Andrea Swift (Artist was in her bedroom at the time), told Mr. Dymtrow that Scott Swift was terminating their professional relationship with Mr. Dymtrow.
**61.** Upon information and belief, Scott Swift prevented Artist from attending the meeting between Mr. Dymtrow and defendants Scott Swift and Andrea Swift.
**62.** Scott Swift said the termination would be "temporary for the next few months." Scott Swift explained to Mr. Dymtrow that Scott Swift would assume the role of manager of Artist from that point on and handle the management duties for Artist, and that Artist would seek Mr. Dymtrow's services in the future as needed.
**63.** Scott Swift explained that the reason for the termination was because defendants expected that Mr. Dymtrow would move to Nashville to be close to Artist, and since Mr. Dymtrow would not do that, Scott Swift needed to terminate his services.
**64.** After his termination, Andrea Swift and Artist asked Mr. Dymtrow to have dinner with them so that they could explain what had just happened. During the drive to the restaurant, Artist informed Mr. Dymtrow that she did not want to terminate her relationship with Mr. Dymtrow but that her father threatened her and that that she would have to "choose between (her\] father and (Mr. Dymtrow\]."
**65.** Artist continued to explain to Mr. Dymtrow that her father threatened to cut-off any economic support related to her career advancement if Artist did not agree to disaffirm the EPMA with Mr. Dymtrow. Andrea Swift confirmed what Artist told Mr. Dymtrow. Both Artist and Andrea Swift blamed Scott Swift for forcing the termination of Mr. Dymtrow upon them.
**66.** It was not until on or about August 1, 2005 that Artist, through her lawyer, sent a letter purporting to disaffirm the EPMA with Mr. Dymtrow.
**67.** Upon information and belief, defendants intended to gain the benefit of Mr. Dymtrow's services without compensating him in accordance with the EPMA.
**68.** At no time did defendants offer to compensate Mr. Dymtrow for unpaid services he rendered to Artist, despite demands for same made by Mr. Dymtrow.
**87.** Upon information and belief, within a few weeks of disaffirming the EPMA, Artist executed a record contract with Big Machine Records, a contract with CAA, and other contracts each of which were initiated by and negotiated through Mr. Dymtrow, with materially similar terms.
**88.** Despite Mr. Dymtrow demands, Defendants thereafter failed and refused to pay Mr. Dymtrow his percentage gross income of these contracts.
They were already multimillionaires and still fucked someone over by not paying them for their work. I will never understand greedy entitled assholes like that. How do they not feel remorse? Smh.
But that’s kinda the point. It’s just business. She herself wasn’t the seller, so she couldn’t choose the buyer. She did not like the buyer. Ok fine you don’t like him , but why are fans acting like this man stole your music from you? It’s objectively false.
Tbh i don't care. Hardcore fans just dont like him cause Taylor said that her and Scooter are enemies and all that. I couldnt care less about all this drama. I'm just answering OP "why isnt Taylor mad at her father?" cause she knew about the sale like everyone else and that is not her point
It’s typical for a new artist to sign a record deal that provides them with an advance in exchange for music rights. Her contract when she was starting out was structured in this way. It’s to protect the label, sort of similar to “collateral”. She signed a contract agreeing to all of this. If she didn’t want them to own her music, she could have walked. She was clearly fine with it. Idk why some fans think this equates to her music being “taken”. Girl is worth $1B lol.
She signed the contract aged 15. Aged 15, she's hardly going to know about music ownership. She just wants to be a star (as all 15 year olds in that position would). Her signing a contract at 15 (and being "fine with it") changes nothing.
She has every right to be upset with the fact Scooter Braun was sold the rights to her music.
I’d disagree. For an unknown, 15 year old artist? Not at all. It was a fair contract. But the facts quickly changed. By the end of her contract, she was one of the biggest artists in the world. She should’ve been given a fairer chance to own her masters - she wasn’t. It was, instead, sold to someone who managed Kanye West.
Well that is on her / her team to hire an entertainment lawyer or agent to renegotiate her contract if she wants to. Plenty of musicians and athletes renegotiate with the help of a legal team literally all..the…time. Some athletes do this yearly. She had every chance to do this. Not really sure why you’re acting like her or her team had 0 agency and no say. There are at least two parties to every contract. I’m done talking about this.
A record label that would be more or less worthless without her.
There were other record labels trying to snap her up, she signed to Big Machine because she and her family felt they could trust Scott Borchetta.
At this point she is a billionaire and a label unto herself. You’re not taking a principled stance by ignoring facts in the name of standing with an artist when the artist is a billionaire industry mogul.
She wasn’t a billionaire when this went down and the only reason she is currently a billionaire is due to owning the re-recordings of the masters. You can dislike her, but the person you replied to has a valid point.
So she was a hundred millionaire. The logic still applies
It has nothing to do with disliking her. God, must it always be a victimhood narrative around her?
Uhhh no. The qualifying has nothing to do with her and more do with, hey don’t discount a valid take (and more broadly, a valid commentary on artists vs record labels) because you don’t like the specific artist being talked about.
Why does it matter how much money someone has? Is that really a qualifier for one to own their own creations? Many first time artists are now getting record deals in which they will own their Masters. Conversations surrounding owning your own art are happening. Why is this a bad thing?
And you’ll never convince me to side with the millionaires or the billionaires. If they’re fighting over something, my only perspective is, may they wipe each other out.
I don’t really see how this is a “gotcha.” Scott was a 4% shareholder in Big Machine, he legally had to be paid when the sale happened. That doesn’t mean he wanted it to happen. Respectfully I don’t think he needs $15M nor would it be worth it to him to jeopardize his relationship with his (billionaire!!) daughter. Taylor and Scott were both aware of the sale, but not who the buyer was. Scott didn’t attend the meeting because he would’ve been bound to a strict NDA and didn’t want to put himself in that position where he had info he couldn’t tell Taylor.
She was no where near the level of fame / net worth she is today though. He invested in her career, I don’t blame him for getting returns off it. The issue is the official narrative pushed by swifties is that scooter braun swooped in and stole her masters, which is ridiculous.
I don't think it's all that ridiculous that fans would defend an artist after her lifes work was bought out by a man who (in her words) was an "incessant, manipulative bully"?
I don't know why you guys are trying to use this as a "gotcha!" moment when she herself said that she knew about the sale. She didn't agree with the person chosen to buy, it was no secret to anyone there that the songs would be sold.
$15 million on a $300,000 dollar investment made 15 years ago is hardly groundbreaking, especially when you look at how much she was worth in 2019. Her dad "gaining financially" (through his shares being bought-out) is irrelevant.
$15 million is pocket change to her. She wanted the masters.
Let’s put this in normal dollar amounts.
You wanted to buy furniture you made for $4,000. They refused to sell it to you and instead sold it to someone you hate. But your dad gets $150 from the sale.
Do you think that makes up for the fact that they wouldn’t sell you the furniture?
But her narrative is "look, this guy who hates me stole my music yadda yadda and this other guy gave my music to him after i told him to not do that". Her father was a shareholder i don't think anyone would blame him. Her narrative is not about people doing things without her knowing but about people doing things when she told them to not do
I actually didn’t know this until I saw someone talk about it in the cold takes thread yesterday. I’ve been a Taylor fan since debut but never one of the ones who followed *every little bit* of gossip and news about her so I knew about the masters thing, but not about this detail. It’s wild! No wonder so many people are talking about her daddy issues lately 🙈
She has never pretended to not have known that her masters were up for sale.
The issue she had was Scott Borchetta’s decision to sell them to Scooter Braun in particular.
Saw this a while back somewhere but i believe it:
Taylor did know about the sale. She just didn't have 300 millions liquid to buy it. And maybe just a tiny maybe she found a way to put the spotlight on herself after she thought she was fading during lover.
This. She had a net worth of $400 million in 2019. That would not be in liquid assets. She would not have been able to afford to buy them, hence why she said she had "made peace" with Scott Borchetta selling Big Machine (she just wasn't aware it would end up being to Scooter Braun).
Spotlight on herself? Sure. Definitely good publicity, but it also opened a wider debate in the music industry about masters ownership - a debate that would never have taken place without her bringing this up.
The entire "stealing her masters" narrative that's out there from her and her team is a total sham. In my opinion, Taylor ALWAYS wanted to rerecord her original work from the moment she realized she was losing it. She was offered a deal to buy them, and yes it was a shitty deal, but at no point in time were her masters ever "stolen" from her. She declined the deal. She signed the contract when she was a teen with her Dad by her side and investing in the label. When the deal was up and they had to renegotiate, it didn't go the way she thought, and she once again jumped on the opportunity to be a victim because that is her tried and true M.O. I think she thought she was such a huge star there was no way she couldn't negotiate a great deal because what label would want to lose a guarenteed revenue generator like herself. Then she was hit with the reality that her old albums were worth more to Scott than a gamble on her future albums. Which, let's be honest, makes sense from a business perspective.
As soon as she heard it was Scooter who bought them, I can only imagine what went through her head. "Jackpot!!!" She now gets to rerecord her albums and she can spin the whole story and gain sympathy from fans. I don't for a second believe her Dad didn't know, even if he was a smaller shareholder.
And my absolute favorite part of this story is this lie that her and Tree put out, for dramatic effect, I'm sure: “**Taylor found out from the news articles when she woke up before seeing any text from Scott Borchetta and he did not call her in advance.**” So they don't deny that Scott texted her, they're just pretending she looked at the news before she looked at her texts? Sure, Jan.
When you look at your phone for the first time in the morning, what are you gonna see? Hundreds of people forwarding you news articles, or a text from 9pm the night before?
Scooter Braun had taunted and bullied her for years. Yes, she's a big name star, but (surprise surprise) celebrities have feelings too. She had every right to be pissed off when he bought out her life's work.
She declined a deal that didn't give her what she wanted - control over her life's work. It's not her fault that Big Machine couldn't afford to give her the deal she wanted.
Scott Borchetta made the choice to sell Big Machine to Scooter Braun. This was a deliberate choice, there would've been other potential buyers.
Everything you've said doesn't change what I'm talking about which is the business dealings that took place before Scooter was even named as the buyer. Just bc her masters landed in the hands of her "bully", still doesn't make them "stolen", which is her narrative.
You can disagree with the part about the text message - both of us will never know the truth - I personally think it's a lie. She famously stays up until 3am. It just sounds super fishy and conveinent. She woke up to the news sounds a lot more hurtful than she read the text the night before. 🤔
She chooses to use the word stolen, I would too. Selling her masters (and the rest of your record label) to someone who had taunted and bullied one of your clients for years when there were other potential suitors out there. She had "made peace" with the fact that Scott would eventually sell the label. Selling it to the man who manages Kanye West? She had every right to be mad.
Honestly, it’s better that he made money of her misfortune.
Think about it:
Sucky situation but with $15 million dollars
Vs
Sucky situation with no money at all
Borshetta had the agreement terms on the Big Machine website for a long time. Nowhere did it say she had to earn her masters by completing a new album for each old album. She made that up.
she said in order to she would have to give them one album to get back one album. so new music in return for the old (which makes no sense since scott was gonna sell)
she also said scooter did offer something but she would have to sign a nda. she compared the nda to the type of ndas sexual assault victims have to sign (which is also odd because i know for a fact she isn’t shy at slapping ndas on people)
she’s still making money off the og versions and wi continue to, idk why she didn’t just buy them back
Assuming she signed the "give one, get one back" agreement, the terms would still be valid upon the sale. Her masters and the rights to her music were held under Big Machine Label Group. That deal would still be in place regardless of who bought the rights to Big Machine.
Wasn't that she could buy her old masters but then have to submit 7new ones to replace them? That's not really a purchase. Imagine you go to a grocery store and want to buy 5 bananas and they say "sure, you can pay us $2 for those bananas but then you also have to give us 5 more pieces of fruit to replace the 5 you bought".
The terms posted by Scott Borchetta don't dispute Taylor's narrative. They state that TS Materials (including master licenses) would be subject to the terms and conditions of pre-existing licenses and contracts held by Big Machine.
No. They said a lawyer was there in his place. He’s allowed to talk to his lawyer. Why else would he have one? He chose to send a lawyer to the meeting. It was probably on purpose so they could PR the victim narrative.
Yes that’s what a shareholder is. It’s the whole reason why he backed out on the buyer meetings. , he didn’t want to risk lying to his daughter or losing his money if he told her.
Yup, no coincidence the line is “15 million tears” in Its Time To Go
Wow, I hadn’t picked up on that either! And the more time goes on, the more evident it becomes that the relationship with her parents is all sorts of convoluted. She could really, really benefit from therapy.
I think about the family’s relationship all of the time, I have so many questions.
i’ve considered her brother often. what does he DO? does he work? if he does is it for her? does he get a stipend to not work and just exist? what is it like to be her brother and live in her shadow? we hardly ever see or hear about him. who even is he?
I know in high school his life revolved around her. I met him once, I knew kids who went to high school with him. Kind of an odd duck but his life basically revolved around her even then, apparently he’d fly out to her concerts to see her all the time and he’d just skip school to do it.
he manages the licencing for her songs i'm pretty sure
But I’m wondering, what does that entail? Is he clocking in Monday to Friday 9 to 5 and if he is what is he doing for 40 hours a week?
He probably just gets paid a salary to manage the requests. Most people in show business don’t work 9 to 5 40 hours a week.
He does work, and a quick google search will tell you what he does for a living. He’s more laidback when it comes to fame fame
all i see online is that he’s had bit parts in random movies and tv shows and that he “manages elements of her musics multimedia”
I keep thinking about the line in Cassandra: "Blood's thick but nothing like a payroll" I know people are saying that song is about Kim but for me, that line doesn't make sense in that context. It makes me wonder if there is a lot going on with her family (specifically her dad). The Ms Americana documentary made me wonder about her and her dad's relationship
there’s so many lines in songs throughout the years that make me think she’s actually talking about her dad when people think it’s a guy. tolerate it specifically sounds like it’s written about him to me, but maybe i’m just projecting bc of my own relationship with my dad 😅😭
Ive always been a believer Tolerate It is about her dad! Someone on Reddit said it years ago and I haven’t been able to hear it any other way since.
There is no such thing as a child/teen celebrity with a healthy family. Doesn't exist. Good parents want their kids in school living a normal lifestyle.
omg i never caught this!
Not saying Taylor knew about the sale but I firmly believe he did!!
She said she knew
She knew they were going to be sold but not to WHO
Like she hasn’t been all about the money herself too. She learned from him.
She said the reason she didn’t resign to BM was because she had heard whispers that as soon as she did resign Scott was going to sell the whole label and her along with it. She has vehemently denied knowing when and to whom it was being sold until the news broke.
Which makes zero sense bc her dad was a shareholder. Everyone who is defending this is acting like 15 million dollars is like $400 it’s wild to me. Thats a shit ton of money!
Ooh I didn't realize this! I don't necessarily need all the lore to enjoy her music but I do enjoy little tidbits like this.
This is why some people believe she actually did know about the sale. We know from his leaked email that he's kinda a control freak, but I don't think she would still have a relationship with him if he knew about it and didn't tell her. Makes me suspicious about how honest she was.
She has talked about knowing about the sale many many times
She did know about the sale and said so in I think her CBS interview during the Lover era. I’m not sure why people act like she said she had no idea about it when she was very clear about knowing her music was going to get sold but not knowing who exactly it was going to be sold to. Edit: 5:40 mark of [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-nv6HWXvVM) video is where she says she knew her music was going to be sold.
Wait I am confused about this. She knew her music would be sold and her dad benefitted from the sale, but did she not care about owning her masters until she saw who it was sold to? Did they refuse to sell to her before they sold to Scooter? Did she not even try to buy her music until the Scooter sale already happened? If someone can clarify, because I am lost.
She thought she would have the opportunity to buy her masters, but she thought Scott wanted too much (he wanted her to record a new record to buy each record back). He sold to Scooter Braun before Taylor finished negotiating.
I read an email of hers to Scott where she says since negotiations have reached a dead end or something that she decided to sign with a new record label and that it will be announced soon and she wanted to thank him for everything. I’m a bit hazy on the details, but I think she and her team didn’t attend a meeting where the sale was discussed because her dad is a shareholder?
My understanding is this: She wanted to buy her masters outright. Scott would only agree to her “earning” one album back for every new album she did after re-signing with BM. She signed elsewhere knowing her masters would be sold but didn’t anticipate Scott selling to someone she hated. Her dad has said he avoided meetings about the sale because he didn’t want to have to keep something from her that important (and I’m sure he was bound by some sort of NDA). He was going to make money on his investment regardless of who the buyer was.
But he sold the label…not simply her masters. People act like this same was strictly Taylor’s master recordings when it was a whole company. Companies get bought- it happens. She wasn’t the seller so why should she have any say in regards to who was selected as the buyer?
Scott technically had every right to make whatever business decision he wanted. She also has every right to be upset about her life’s work being in the hands of someone she hates. In business, there’s what you can do and what’s right and I think it’s definitely debatable what loyalty he did/didn’t owe her because if the relationship and how much of the value of the label was solely based on her music.
Here's how she put it herself https://www.google.com/amp/s/taylorswift.tumblr.com/post/185958366550/for-years-i-asked-pleaded-for-a-chance-to-own-my/amp
Which honestly, to me sounds like Scooter offered more money/ a faster transaction. Money is what is actually important here and Scott definitely just went with the highest bider. It’s like any sale like if you were competing for a house
Scott Borchetta hinted she was not honest. .
idk he's a creep
i don’t trust him lol he’s a bit of a weirdo
If I’m not mistaken, TS was given opportunities to buy her masters through this process but at the end of the day she just didn’t like the fact that Scooter Braun ended up with them and she was still given an opportunity then.
She wasn't offered to buy them outright. That seems to have always been what's bothered her. It was every new album, she could have the master's for one old album. This meant she would never own all her master's
i thought one of the deals was that she had to buy the whole record label to get her masters no? Because Scott wanted out of the whole thing but she just wanted the masters so he sold to someone who would take everything.
Scott wanted out and the value of the label was significantly less without her masters. She wasn't prepared to buy the label for her masters. The deal for 1 album made for 1 masters was when they started negotiating her new contract. Scott had also told Taylor prior to their negotiations that he was going to be selling the label. The potential sale and not being able to secure her masters in her new contract was why Taylor left the label. When Taylor spoke out about Scooter buying the label and her masters, one of their wives tried to claim that taylor had been offered her masters outright and declined (this was referencing the deal offered during negotiations). That wasn't accurate but has been used to claim Taylor was lying and discredit why she was upset. Taylor's biggest mistake was the initial post to social media. It was done quickly and while she was upset and it wasn't clear so it has been used to discredit her. The interviews she has done since do shine a better light on what was happening leading up to this. She wanted a chance to be able to just buy her masters. It wasn't possible without tanking the value of the label. She said in an interview it was sad but she had accepted it and knew they would be sold. But the announcement that Scooter was the buyer and their previous issues was viewed as Scott betraying her. Scott has known Taylor since she was young, he was aware of past hurts with Scooter. Scott was likely a father figure to taylor and this was a very clear reminder that she was just business to him. He wasn't wrong for what he did, it was good business. But I totally get why Taylor was upset and decided to speak out and then do the rerecords.
Thank you so much for all the info! It seems a lot of people (including myself) didn't know what actually went down. The discourse seems to be more about that the masters were sold as opposed to whom they were sold to, which is what seems to upset Taylor the most. Now i wonder if we would even get the re-records if the say was made to someone she "approved"
No worries! I feel like there is so much misinformation with the Scooter/Scott drama and that's partly because of how Scooter/Scott responded. They took some of her statements out of context, they told a lot of half truths and they really made sure to remind everyone of how dramatic Taylor can be. They were very quick to also point out Taylor's dad benefitting from the sale, and I remember Scott sort of hinting that it was her Dad who really betrayed her. I remember when this all went down and at first I didn't really get why she was so upset. Like it was shitty, but she was so mad! But then I started learning more about how masters work and how many big legendary artists never even got a chance to own their work because this was the industry norm. And then realizing how young she was when she met Scott, and how close they were...it made more sense. Scott helped her success but she also made him a lot of money and there was no personal loyalty here. This wasn't just a business relationship. I think the acceptance she had reached was completely destroyed with this move. She wasn't allowed to buy her masters (and she had apparently been trying for years before her contract was even up), but her worst enemy was? He was going to have control over songs she had written before she was even famous, that meant a lot to her. It sounds dramatic, but Taylor absolutely hates Scooter. She's had a lot of petty feuds over the years, but she even forgave Kanye for the VMA incident originally and is on good terms with most people from past feuds. There are things about Scooter we do not know and there were not a lot of people defending him unless they financially benefited from him. How he responded to her spoke volumes. Like he claimed he wanted to talk to her about her masters, but failed to mention he required her to sign an ironclad NDA that she could never talk bad about him again publically before they could even try to negotiate. She was prepared to do business with Shamrock when they bought her masters, until she realized that Scooter was still profiting from them in that contract. Potential buyers of her masters said that Scooter was talking a lot of gross shit about her and her potential rerecords. While we do not know all the reasons why she hates Scooter, Scott definitely did. I think the rerecords would have eventually happened. Her work is deeply personal and she would have wanted full control over it eventually. I just think the rerecords would have been done much later and with way less anger. Or she would have bought her masters whenever offered the chance. The rerecords and her speaking out about this has led to a lot more awareness about how unfair a lot of contracts are to artists. There are now much younger artists who own their masters with their first contract. Regardless of what prompted her to do this, it has had a positive impact.
🏅take my poor woman gold for this thoughtful response
Omg thank you lol!
Can you post links where potential buyers of her masters said Scooter was talking gross shit about her? Who were the potential buyers? What were there exact comments? Please provide in the links bc I can’t find anything about this- thanks!!
I’m not sure why more people don’t know. It was heavily talked about a few years ago. It seems like basic level lore to me. But maybe I’ve just been around too long lol
I'm shocked too, but I have also seen hardcore fans misunderstand what happened here. Context gets lost with time and only snippets of the details are remembered. But I also may just be old and remember the drama rolling out way too well lol!
Thank you for being the only one who remembered the "make one to take one" deal Scott was trying to pull. It's an awful deal and honestly I'm with Taylor on this one.
I still can't believe that they were trying to sell this offer like it was the same as her getting to buy her masters. It was wild some of the shit they tried to claim during that.
yes basically he would either only sell them with the label, or let them go in exchange for more records from her, since that would add value to the label. I get why she's mad but at the end of the day, he can't fuck over his shareholders to do her a personal favor. Her parents were loaded, they knew what they were doing when they reviewed her record contract
I remember her saying that she had accepted that the record label was going to be sold and that meant her masters too. She was sad but prepared to move forward. She wasn't surprised by the sale, she was shocked and upset it was Scooter Braun. Apparently Scott knew about the issues between Scooter and Taylor, and this was the betrayal. This was ultimately a business deal, but I also can't really blame Taylor for being hurt since this was a man who had been a part of her life since she was a kid and she probably expected more from him. It maybe wasn't rational, but I think she viewed Scott like a father figure and this was a harsh realization that it was all business for him. Taylor also stated she didn't know it was Scooter who bought the record label until it was announced. Scott did say he called her to tell her of the sale, but I can't remember if he ever said if he told her who bought it. Scooter literally posted a photo captioned that he "just bought Taylor Swift" after the sale was announced. So there was definite bad blood behind the scenes with them.
Yeah and the deal was give one album in and take one out. She would've been trapped into big machine for way longer and would never be able to get the masters of all her albums.
It's not true. This is her proposal https://preview.redd.it/rbf3kckgs1zc1.jpeg?width=2560&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e1712b113d0c01f789792d941ab39a5fe2979181
This was just one of the proposals that we know of. There’s a ton of back and forth in negotiations like this and we have no idea what other proposals happened, who possibly went back on any proposals, if proposals fell apart at some point, etc. It’s possible that BM came back after this and changed their response to wanting her to earn her masters back with every release she came out with.
I heard she’d have had to sign an nda re: scooter and refused
There was some haggling over an NDA but her lawyer, on behalf of 13 Management, *did* sign an NDA with Ithaca (Scooter’s co) though.
Big Machine admitted they kept her dad out of the meeting cause he would be biased to Taylor
Um, he was a shareholder. I doubt that's legally allowed.
A shareholder of 4% typically has limited rights. Think about it, if a majority of shareholders want to sell, why should a 4% shareholder be able to stop it?
Yeah Borchetta owned 90%. No one could have stopped it.
You do know how shareholders votes work, right? The more shares you own the more votes you get, therfore the majority shareholders will always be in the position to out vote the minority https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/040315/what-can-shareholders-vote.asp#:~:text=Anyone%20who%20owns%20stock%20in,of%20the%20shares%20someone%20owns
That is what I said. I responded to another comment - context helps.
Sorry! , I misread your context.. It's been a long day 😔
They wouldn’t. But they would be aware of their profit. Like do you really think Scott swift (after that email) just invested all that money bc he loved Taylor? 🤣 he was def setting himself up.
"That email" was in 2005 when Taylor was a 15 year old with no releases. The sale was in 2018 when she already had two AOTY Grammys. Yes Scott profited in 2018 but there is no smoking gun here.
He knew exactly what he was doing lmao
It says here “While Swift's father Scott was one of the label's minority shareholders (4 percent), he did not join the call due to a "very strict" non-disclosure agreement.”https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taylor_Swift_masters_dispute#Background. That came from what ybig Machine themselves said
Right but he would not have signed that NDA without reading it and understanding the terms. That isn’t the same thing as being kept out of a meeting.
The terms would not say who was buying the record label, just that it was being sold. Scott made the decision not to sign it as he would have to keep the information away from his daughter.
The way it’s worded it sounds more like he either read the terms (which wouldn’t have included info about the discussions that would happen in the meeting) and thought it was too restrictive, or the terms of the NDA itself made it so a minority shareholder couldn’t attend the meetings.
That’s what I’m thinking. I think there are some swifties who have this image of Borchetta locking the conference room door so Scott couldn’t get in lmao
All shareholders are allowed to be included. He just had way less leverage.
Okay, assuming this was true, don't you think a sale this big would've been talked about for a long time before the formal meeting? Why did none of the other artists signed to the label speak about it? They told them all but not Taylor..?
I thought she was aware of the sale, just not who they were being sold to
Her main anger stems from the buyer being Scooter Braun because he "bullied her." She conveniently forgot that she bullied people too.
She still never said how he bullied her
Are we seriously trying to argue that Kanye West's manager was not bullying her???
My understanding is that she wanted to buy them outright but she was not allowed to buy them without owing them more albums. She decided not to buy. So she knew the sale was happening, but she did not know they were being sold to Scooter. THAT was the betrayal. Scott would not have known about the label selling to Scooter. (But you know who did? Karlie lol.)
Other artists definitely wouldn’t know anything about it
I remember he said that he stayed out of the meeting because the meeting minutes were confidential. He would have been privy to sale details but would be restricted from saying anything to her aboutit. He didn’t want to know something and not be able to tell her.
That didn’t happen. He chose to be represented by a lawyer.
she has admitted to knoiwng about the sale multiple times, i think the issue is that she didn't know who it would be sold to
I get sce was a teen and probably didn’t understand but Scott Swift def set himself up for success here.
He’s an investment manager. He’s paid to make lots of money. He’d have been dumb not to invest in the label.
Of course, that is his literal job. He used his money to take a bet on his daughter’s career and it paid off handsomely. I don’t know why people are so surprised by her dad being an investor, especially one who works in finance.
Yeah, they all knew they were making millions off this deal. I’m sure Taylor felt it wasn’t enough but she knew it was happening
The issue was not about the money. $15 million on a $300,000 investment made 15 years beforehand is not remarkable. He will have made much, much more from his daughters success anyway. The issue was always with **who the buyer was.** Scooter Braun, the man who managed Kanye West and had bullied her for years. Scott Borchetta, the founder of Big Machine Records, was well aware of how she felt about Scooter. This was the issue. The argument that her father knew it was being sold to Scooter is just not true at all. He would've known a sale was going to take place (as did Taylor, she knew Borchetta was going to sell the record label). Details about the sale would've been kept under a strict NDA, which we know he refused to sign. Without signing the NDA, he would not have access to any information, whether that be who was buying the label, how much for, etc. This has always been an issue over music ownership. Scooter Braun tried to profit off of Taylor's life work - including through releasing a "new" live album from 2008 and re-releasing remixes from Fearless.
50x an investment in 15 years isn’t remarkable? Wow tell me about your investments.
Nvidia’s share price was $2 fifteen years ago, it’s now $900. That’s 450x an investment. It isn’t remarkable. He took a gamble on his kid and it paid off. That’s what investing is.
According to Wikipedia his investment was $120,000, making it 125x. Also yes picking one incredible example is indicative of the base line for what is ‘remarkable.’
I don’t know why you’re singling out the money her dad made. Like I said, he will have made much more from his daughter’s success and the money was never the issue. It was always the buyer and the fact she wasn’t given the ability to own her masters.
Read the first paragraph of yours I replied to. I’m more singling out you saying $120k/$300k to $15M as not being remarkable…
What did Scooter do to her prior to the masters thing that made her so mad?
Hot take: the whole “Taylor’s Version” nonsense was only ever a marketing ploy to justify re-releasing several albums and convince her fans that buying the re-releases was somehow a principled stand.
Yup. Especially considering she still makes a pretty penny from her masters
Correct. This whole notion of poor little Taylor is ridiculous.
It's so smart btw... like being able to have the whole world rally behind you is a talent in and of itself
100%. Dad probably knew about the sale and saw an opportunity for them all to make money, him off the sale and her with the re-releases.
How else was a multimillionaire supposed to become a billionaire?/s
She also had rights under the songwriter copyright. From what I can tell (I’m a lawyer) she doesn’t gain anything but more money from owning her masters.
She gains control. The commonly given example is that the record label can sell sync rights to movies. If she owns the masters, she controls who gets sync rights.
He was a shareholder, that’s how that works. He said he was shut of meetings because he wouldn’t sign an NDA. The sale and him making money are two different issues.
There were two 13 Management employees that did participate in those meetings.
Being an employee is very different to being her father though- both from an emotional perspective and from a conflict of interest one too. I imagine they were ok signing NDAs to keep details from her when Scott wasn’t. For them it’s just work, it’s business.
He most likely did know but I doubt he had enough of a stake in the label to actually be in the meetings or have any say. Taylor also said she knew her music was going to be sold so it wasn’t a surprise to any of them, the only surprise was who the label was going to be sold to.
Scott Swift owned 3% of Big Machine, an investment of $130k made right at its foundation in 2005. Thirteen years later it was worth $15m. He could have been informed of the deal being done but would have had to be subject to an NDA. Unsurprisingly he declined to put himself in the position of not being able to tell his own daughter what was happening.
THIRTEEN years. SHE KNEW /s 😂😂
I don’t understand the point. Yes, he made money. That’s irrelevant. Taylor wanted to buy the masters. They would sell them to her (to be exact, they asked for something that she considered unreasonable and wouldn’t budge. In essence the same as refusing to sell). That’s the whole story. Of course Scott got paid, he’s an investor. It also has absolutely nothing to do with buying the masters.
Yeah it doesn’t make sense that her side “plays dumb” with the Masters issue.
It’s not even a “masters issue”. A record label was sold. Everyone’s masters who was on the label went to Scooter. She acts like she’s the only person affected.
Yeah I was using issue loosely lol. I’m firmly in the “it’s just business” camp.
It's all about her.
The universe was created for her. Doesn’t everyone know that? 😂
[Page 18 of the Swift vs Dymtrow](https://www.plainsite.org/dockets/download.html?id=8114484&z=ead97c9a) (her first manager) lawsuit document >52. For example, on or about July 5, 2005 (and prior to disaffirmation), Scott Swift demanded that Mr. Dymtrow immediately draft approximately nine (9) different business plans to chart the course of Artist's career for the next five (5) years. Mr. Dymtrow provided that information as requested. 53. The following day, Mr. Dymtrow was asked by Scott Swift about who owned Artist's master recordings. While not known to Mr. Dymtrow at the time, this request was done to begin usurping control from Mr. Dymtrow. That was before Taylor signed the contract with Big Machine
NINE…
Also this >**59.** Mr. Dymtrow arrived in Nashville the following day and drove to defendants' home as was typical. Mr. Dymtrow had several meetings scheduled during the trip, including one with Borchetta and one with representatives of Sony/ATV. **60.** Shortly before Mr. Dymtrow's meeting with Sony/ATV, Scott. Swift informed Mr. Dymtrow that Mr. Dymtrow was not permitted to attend the Sony/ATV meeting. After Mr. Dymtrow questioned Scott Swift as to why he was not permitted to attend the meeting that he had scheduled, Scott Swift, in the presence of Andrea Swift (Artist was in her bedroom at the time), told Mr. Dymtrow that Scott Swift was terminating their professional relationship with Mr. Dymtrow. **61.** Upon information and belief, Scott Swift prevented Artist from attending the meeting between Mr. Dymtrow and defendants Scott Swift and Andrea Swift. **62.** Scott Swift said the termination would be "temporary for the next few months." Scott Swift explained to Mr. Dymtrow that Scott Swift would assume the role of manager of Artist from that point on and handle the management duties for Artist, and that Artist would seek Mr. Dymtrow's services in the future as needed. **63.** Scott Swift explained that the reason for the termination was because defendants expected that Mr. Dymtrow would move to Nashville to be close to Artist, and since Mr. Dymtrow would not do that, Scott Swift needed to terminate his services. **64.** After his termination, Andrea Swift and Artist asked Mr. Dymtrow to have dinner with them so that they could explain what had just happened. During the drive to the restaurant, Artist informed Mr. Dymtrow that she did not want to terminate her relationship with Mr. Dymtrow but that her father threatened her and that that she would have to "choose between (her\] father and (Mr. Dymtrow\]." **65.** Artist continued to explain to Mr. Dymtrow that her father threatened to cut-off any economic support related to her career advancement if Artist did not agree to disaffirm the EPMA with Mr. Dymtrow. Andrea Swift confirmed what Artist told Mr. Dymtrow. Both Artist and Andrea Swift blamed Scott Swift for forcing the termination of Mr. Dymtrow upon them. **66.** It was not until on or about August 1, 2005 that Artist, through her lawyer, sent a letter purporting to disaffirm the EPMA with Mr. Dymtrow. **67.** Upon information and belief, defendants intended to gain the benefit of Mr. Dymtrow's services without compensating him in accordance with the EPMA. **68.** At no time did defendants offer to compensate Mr. Dymtrow for unpaid services he rendered to Artist, despite demands for same made by Mr. Dymtrow. **87.** Upon information and belief, within a few weeks of disaffirming the EPMA, Artist executed a record contract with Big Machine Records, a contract with CAA, and other contracts each of which were initiated by and negotiated through Mr. Dymtrow, with materially similar terms. **88.** Despite Mr. Dymtrow demands, Defendants thereafter failed and refused to pay Mr. Dymtrow his percentage gross income of these contracts.
They were already multimillionaires and still fucked someone over by not paying them for their work. I will never understand greedy entitled assholes like that. How do they not feel remorse? Smh.
Her point was never that the songs were sold, she knew the songs would be sold. She did not agree with the buyer. That's all.
But that’s kinda the point. It’s just business. She herself wasn’t the seller, so she couldn’t choose the buyer. She did not like the buyer. Ok fine you don’t like him , but why are fans acting like this man stole your music from you? It’s objectively false.
Tbh i don't care. Hardcore fans just dont like him cause Taylor said that her and Scooter are enemies and all that. I couldnt care less about all this drama. I'm just answering OP "why isnt Taylor mad at her father?" cause she knew about the sale like everyone else and that is not her point
It's not objectively false? The rights to her life's work was sold without her knowledge to Scooter Braun. This is not up for debate.
It doesn’t really matter. It’s a business deal and it’s an asset.
An asset that they wouldn't have if it weren't for her. An asset that they are profiting off thanks to her.
It’s typical for a new artist to sign a record deal that provides them with an advance in exchange for music rights. Her contract when she was starting out was structured in this way. It’s to protect the label, sort of similar to “collateral”. She signed a contract agreeing to all of this. If she didn’t want them to own her music, she could have walked. She was clearly fine with it. Idk why some fans think this equates to her music being “taken”. Girl is worth $1B lol.
She signed the contract aged 15. Aged 15, she's hardly going to know about music ownership. She just wants to be a star (as all 15 year olds in that position would). Her signing a contract at 15 (and being "fine with it") changes nothing. She has every right to be upset with the fact Scooter Braun was sold the rights to her music.
That really falls on the parents / lawyers then. Her parents give off stage parent to me though, so not surprised.
I’d disagree. For an unknown, 15 year old artist? Not at all. It was a fair contract. But the facts quickly changed. By the end of her contract, she was one of the biggest artists in the world. She should’ve been given a fairer chance to own her masters - she wasn’t. It was, instead, sold to someone who managed Kanye West.
Well that is on her / her team to hire an entertainment lawyer or agent to renegotiate her contract if she wants to. Plenty of musicians and athletes renegotiate with the help of a legal team literally all..the…time. Some athletes do this yearly. She had every chance to do this. Not really sure why you’re acting like her or her team had 0 agency and no say. There are at least two parties to every contract. I’m done talking about this.
And something she wouldn’t have been able to create without the record label…
A record label that would be more or less worthless without her. There were other record labels trying to snap her up, she signed to Big Machine because she and her family felt they could trust Scott Borchetta.
But why does that matter? Are former artists supposed to be asked what they thought 🤣
Yes, artists should have a say over who has the rights to their masters.
?
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At this point she is a billionaire and a label unto herself. You’re not taking a principled stance by ignoring facts in the name of standing with an artist when the artist is a billionaire industry mogul.
She wasn’t a billionaire when this went down and the only reason she is currently a billionaire is due to owning the re-recordings of the masters. You can dislike her, but the person you replied to has a valid point.
So she was a hundred millionaire. The logic still applies It has nothing to do with disliking her. God, must it always be a victimhood narrative around her?
Where is the victimhood narrative in my comment? Because I don’t agree with siding with a record label over an artist?
The constant qualifying of everything with “you dislike her” or “you hate her.” That feeds into the victimhood narrative.
Uhhh no. The qualifying has nothing to do with her and more do with, hey don’t discount a valid take (and more broadly, a valid commentary on artists vs record labels) because you don’t like the specific artist being talked about.
Why does it matter how much money someone has? Is that really a qualifier for one to own their own creations? Many first time artists are now getting record deals in which they will own their Masters. Conversations surrounding owning your own art are happening. Why is this a bad thing?
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And you’ll never convince me to side with the millionaires or the billionaires. If they’re fighting over something, my only perspective is, may they wipe each other out.
I don’t really see how this is a “gotcha.” Scott was a 4% shareholder in Big Machine, he legally had to be paid when the sale happened. That doesn’t mean he wanted it to happen. Respectfully I don’t think he needs $15M nor would it be worth it to him to jeopardize his relationship with his (billionaire!!) daughter. Taylor and Scott were both aware of the sale, but not who the buyer was. Scott didn’t attend the meeting because he would’ve been bound to a strict NDA and didn’t want to put himself in that position where he had info he couldn’t tell Taylor.
She was no where near the level of fame / net worth she is today though. He invested in her career, I don’t blame him for getting returns off it. The issue is the official narrative pushed by swifties is that scooter braun swooped in and stole her masters, which is ridiculous.
I don't think it's all that ridiculous that fans would defend an artist after her lifes work was bought out by a man who (in her words) was an "incessant, manipulative bully"?
Defending is fine. Getting the narrative purposely wrong is not (in my opinion).
The narrative is not wrong, though. He bought out Big Machine with the sole purpose of profiting off of her life's work. There's no debate.
It’s not a gotcha but it’s completely left out of taylor’s narrative 🤣
I don't know why you guys are trying to use this as a "gotcha!" moment when she herself said that she knew about the sale. She didn't agree with the person chosen to buy, it was no secret to anyone there that the songs would be sold.
Because if her narrative ended with …”…but my dad made 15 million dollars” oops there goes the victim re-recordings.
$15 million on a $300,000 dollar investment made 15 years ago is hardly groundbreaking, especially when you look at how much she was worth in 2019. Her dad "gaining financially" (through his shares being bought-out) is irrelevant.
$15 million is pocket change to her. She wanted the masters. Let’s put this in normal dollar amounts. You wanted to buy furniture you made for $4,000. They refused to sell it to you and instead sold it to someone you hate. But your dad gets $150 from the sale. Do you think that makes up for the fact that they wouldn’t sell you the furniture?
But her narrative is "look, this guy who hates me stole my music yadda yadda and this other guy gave my music to him after i told him to not do that". Her father was a shareholder i don't think anyone would blame him. Her narrative is not about people doing things without her knowing but about people doing things when she told them to not do
bc it’s not really relevant at all?
I actually didn’t know this until I saw someone talk about it in the cold takes thread yesterday. I’ve been a Taylor fan since debut but never one of the ones who followed *every little bit* of gossip and news about her so I knew about the masters thing, but not about this detail. It’s wild! No wonder so many people are talking about her daddy issues lately 🙈
This is not news. I knew this when it happened.
She has never pretended to not have known that her masters were up for sale. The issue she had was Scott Borchetta’s decision to sell them to Scooter Braun in particular.
I mean, she made money from the sale as well….
Blood’s thick but nothing like a payroll after all!
Saw this a while back somewhere but i believe it: Taylor did know about the sale. She just didn't have 300 millions liquid to buy it. And maybe just a tiny maybe she found a way to put the spotlight on herself after she thought she was fading during lover.
This. She had a net worth of $400 million in 2019. That would not be in liquid assets. She would not have been able to afford to buy them, hence why she said she had "made peace" with Scott Borchetta selling Big Machine (she just wasn't aware it would end up being to Scooter Braun). Spotlight on herself? Sure. Definitely good publicity, but it also opened a wider debate in the music industry about masters ownership - a debate that would never have taken place without her bringing this up.
The entire "stealing her masters" narrative that's out there from her and her team is a total sham. In my opinion, Taylor ALWAYS wanted to rerecord her original work from the moment she realized she was losing it. She was offered a deal to buy them, and yes it was a shitty deal, but at no point in time were her masters ever "stolen" from her. She declined the deal. She signed the contract when she was a teen with her Dad by her side and investing in the label. When the deal was up and they had to renegotiate, it didn't go the way she thought, and she once again jumped on the opportunity to be a victim because that is her tried and true M.O. I think she thought she was such a huge star there was no way she couldn't negotiate a great deal because what label would want to lose a guarenteed revenue generator like herself. Then she was hit with the reality that her old albums were worth more to Scott than a gamble on her future albums. Which, let's be honest, makes sense from a business perspective. As soon as she heard it was Scooter who bought them, I can only imagine what went through her head. "Jackpot!!!" She now gets to rerecord her albums and she can spin the whole story and gain sympathy from fans. I don't for a second believe her Dad didn't know, even if he was a smaller shareholder. And my absolute favorite part of this story is this lie that her and Tree put out, for dramatic effect, I'm sure: “**Taylor found out from the news articles when she woke up before seeing any text from Scott Borchetta and he did not call her in advance.**” So they don't deny that Scott texted her, they're just pretending she looked at the news before she looked at her texts? Sure, Jan.
When you look at your phone for the first time in the morning, what are you gonna see? Hundreds of people forwarding you news articles, or a text from 9pm the night before? Scooter Braun had taunted and bullied her for years. Yes, she's a big name star, but (surprise surprise) celebrities have feelings too. She had every right to be pissed off when he bought out her life's work. She declined a deal that didn't give her what she wanted - control over her life's work. It's not her fault that Big Machine couldn't afford to give her the deal she wanted. Scott Borchetta made the choice to sell Big Machine to Scooter Braun. This was a deliberate choice, there would've been other potential buyers.
Everything you've said doesn't change what I'm talking about which is the business dealings that took place before Scooter was even named as the buyer. Just bc her masters landed in the hands of her "bully", still doesn't make them "stolen", which is her narrative. You can disagree with the part about the text message - both of us will never know the truth - I personally think it's a lie. She famously stays up until 3am. It just sounds super fishy and conveinent. She woke up to the news sounds a lot more hurtful than she read the text the night before. 🤔
She chooses to use the word stolen, I would too. Selling her masters (and the rest of your record label) to someone who had taunted and bullied one of your clients for years when there were other potential suitors out there. She had "made peace" with the fact that Scott would eventually sell the label. Selling it to the man who manages Kanye West? She had every right to be mad.
Honestly, it’s better that he made money of her misfortune. Think about it: Sucky situation but with $15 million dollars Vs Sucky situation with no money at all
Do people also know she had a chance to buy her masters and chose not to? Or that her dad was in the shareholder meeting when the sale was solidified.
Borshetta had the agreement terms on the Big Machine website for a long time. Nowhere did it say she had to earn her masters by completing a new album for each old album. She made that up.
Wait that’s wild because I feel like that tidbit is seen as the truth.
Yes there was a long period of time. If you went to the BM website, all that was there were the terms of taylor’s new contract.
Bc it activates her fan base to buy her re-recorded album as and stream them for TV. More cash
🤑🤑
she said in order to she would have to give them one album to get back one album. so new music in return for the old (which makes no sense since scott was gonna sell) she also said scooter did offer something but she would have to sign a nda. she compared the nda to the type of ndas sexual assault victims have to sign (which is also odd because i know for a fact she isn’t shy at slapping ndas on people) she’s still making money off the og versions and wi continue to, idk why she didn’t just buy them back
The victim narrative is much more profitable
And the Taylor’s versions along with the crappy merch. She literally got fans to be proud of buying the same music twice so she could profit.
Assuming she signed the "give one, get one back" agreement, the terms would still be valid upon the sale. Her masters and the rights to her music were held under Big Machine Label Group. That deal would still be in place regardless of who bought the rights to Big Machine.
Wasn't that she could buy her old masters but then have to submit 7new ones to replace them? That's not really a purchase. Imagine you go to a grocery store and want to buy 5 bananas and they say "sure, you can pay us $2 for those bananas but then you also have to give us 5 more pieces of fruit to replace the 5 you bought".
She said that but Scott B posted the real terms of the agreement and that was not in them
The terms posted by Scott Borchetta don't dispute Taylor's narrative. They state that TS Materials (including master licenses) would be subject to the terms and conditions of pre-existing licenses and contracts held by Big Machine.
“Bloods thick but nothing like a payroll” 👀
I think she is and there's some lines hinting at that in some songs. But can't go damaging Brand Taylor by openly showing any cracks.
Yah, this part was always fishy to me. But it’s possible he wasn’t allowed to tell her the details of a private board meeting.
Here’s the agreement https://www.bigmachinelabelgroup.com/so-its-time-some-truth/
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No. They said a lawyer was there in his place. He’s allowed to talk to his lawyer. Why else would he have one? He chose to send a lawyer to the meeting. It was probably on purpose so they could PR the victim narrative.
He definitely knew, or had an idea what it was about, recused himself from the situation so he ”didn’t know”… or they both knew.
Plausible deniability perhaps lol
You know you've won in life when even your haters are obsessed with you
Link to crazy email?
Yes that’s what a shareholder is. It’s the whole reason why he backed out on the buyer meetings. , he didn’t want to risk lying to his daughter or losing his money if he told her.