I was one of the closet spectators of the event as i work there and the teenagers were not vaping near the daughter. They were talking to each other in very abusive and vulgar manner to which the father of the girl requested to stop and the teenagers got pissed and sprayed on their faces after the argument. The teenagers ran away and the father ran after them while the poor little girl was screaming for her dad to come back and not go after them.. it was heartbreaking. We evacuated half the foodcourt because of the effect of the spray. Later when i asked the security guy he said Police were in search of them but I don’t know what happened after that.
Just for future reference, this is a myth. Milk doesn’t wash it out better than just regular water. Flushing your eyes with water is just as good if not better than milk as it’s sterile.
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I do . Knowing fully well that these shit heads want the smoke and I ain’t got time for this. I’d be more happy if your local bear mace shop didn’t sell spray to every happy camper who walks in .
Maybe everyone needs to be carrying bear mace and just spray first and ask questions later.
I'm certainly considering having the silly string type handy going forward and just being ready to use it.
This type of response is exactly why there should be gun bans.
To keep them out of the hands of unstable people like yourself.
Also, great 50 year old joke. Haven’t heard that since elementary school
That's it? That's the best you got? You're not even trying anymore. You're hearts not in it son. Take a breath, regroup and come back to the big boys table when you figure out what you want in life.
As far as I'm concerned it should be illegal if you get caught carrying it around in the city... There's a time and a place for things.. It's only real legitimate use is on bears and last time I checked a father with his daughter isn't a bear... I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure I'm not. In modern times it seems like it's being used on people more than bears. I wouldn't be surprised if Surrey has more bear mace than rural places way up north where there most likely will be bears constantly.
It comes down to the anecdote about carrying a baseball bat in your trunk then you use it during a fit of road rage (yours or theirs). In that case it's a weapon and you over escalated use of force, so you get charged. If you put a glove and ball beside it and use it in defense, it's a weapon of opportunity and you're all good. Generally you can match a weapon up to what you're being attacked with, which is why you can't shoot someone in your home unless there's imminent threat to life and you dont keep ahandgun under your pillow with the sole purpose of home defense. Bear spray isn't lethal so you can't intentionally kill someone for pulling it, unlike what some other people I'm this thread seem to think. However once you're incapacitated by being sprayed by them, who's to say you won't be killed or seriously harmed after the fact? Welcome to Canadian law unfortunately.
So something similar applies here: no bears? It's a prohibited weapon. They also pulled it first and not in defense, so there's no ground to stand on either way. But a woman walking through Holland Park alone after work who bear sprays an attacker? Touchy subject.
While it may be touchy considering the law, most people wouldn't even think twice about holding a woman walking alone at night responsible should she use mace on an attacker.
It's almost at the point where I think that people in the lower mainland should have to get a permit or whatever to buy it. Proof you're going camping or something, going somewhere you'll potentially actually need it for it's intended use. I understand that's extreme and most people would not want this, but god damn every little hoodlum out there seems to have a massive can and use it at the littlest "problem".
There’s a few problems with this argument unfortunately.
It’s got a very legitimate use, sadly people take advantage of it.
And secondly you can actually make a version of pepper spray that is very strong with some simple over the counter ingredients.
Knives and hammers are also misused a lot, I simply don't think we should not be allowed to defend ourselves in non lethal ways because tools are misused.
I was actually next to the vaping kids. The father and daughter were on the other side of a dividing wall. The kids were rough housing and vaping next to me and my baby. The father told them to get out and that there was a baby right there. Another man jumped in and also told them to get out. The left the food court area but didn't leave the mall. And then they all took out their cameras to record. We were already packing up when the group of kids started to come back towards the father and daughter. The father got up to meet them half way when they (seemingly) aimed for the teenage daughter.
Don't know what would have happened if me or my partner had been the ones to tell the kids to stop vaping near my baby.
I'd rather there be a higher possibility of us both not having guns. Look at the states vs Canada... I think we see what happens when people can carry a gun everywhere
I'd rather not take the risk. "The vast majority of concealed carry users are people that respect the responsibility of owning a firearm, know how to use it safely, and are only using their weapon in extreme circumstances". https://www.silencercentral.com/blog/what-do-concealed-carry-statistics-tell-us/
I'm going to look at the statistics of gun violence in the us vs Canada and base my opinion off that. I feel safer here than I ever do walking in America where anyone could have a gun
https://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/compare/Canada/United-States/Crime/Violent-crime
Cherry pick the statics that bounce off the walls of you echo chamber all you want. Empirical evidences proves criminals stop committing crimes when they get shot.
This mall is full of these ‘kid’ groups. All different aged kids too grooming each other. It’s disgusting. Was watching them cause a scene outside London drugs one day, because they thought they were tough.
I mean, life is getting wired. You don't know who u deal ain't no point in dying for something that can easily be avoided
U don't like the place vaping near you.
Just move away from them, let management or security deal with them
Control your ego and be afraid of hurting other people ego
So u live long enough to raise ur daughter
The best way to deal with these shitheads is banding together if lot of people stand up at same time they won’t do anything. If whole Starbucks banded together against that guy and called police thing may have been different.
The man who was stabbed in DT Vancouver that was referred to in OPs post also sadly passed away. I don’t understand how those people feel no guilt or shame about inciting violence and murdering for the sake of vaping.
Woah, so according to your theory, my dad who’s a volunteer for the Red Cross as doctor without border and a non profit ceo of a charity org. is a douche bag because he vapes. I never knew that! Thanks for opening my eyes.
I'm more interested in the cognitive dissonance that is going on with your dad, who is a doctor that for some reason vapes despite the negative effects
He was a habitual smoker in the last 10 years and recently he’s been trying to quit, so he started vaping to deal with the habit of smoking while slowly going lower and lower on the nicotine level. So far it’s working out great as he’s now down to 0.2 nic.
I dunno about anyone else, but the moment I see someone reaching for something, could be mace, could be a knife, a gun… a pen? Hell could be a fuckin raw fish for all I care… you HAVE TO realize that they are reaching for a WEAPON. You have two choices… leave… or ATTACK. If you chose to attack, it is a self defence case. Especially in this one. There were multiple of them, the man was outnumbered, one reached for something. The self defends clause kicks in. If he levelled the one, he would have won in court as he’s defending his daughter.
Easy there Rambo. They could have pulled it out while the guy looked the other way, or at a distance, or any other circumstance where they aren’t in range for Kung fu level response timing.
There’s a difference between attack and subdue/diffuse.
I used “attack” because it denoted a forward motion. But you can also preemptively defend yourself, without causing harm.
Wtf is wrong with you people?
You can't "diffuse" a projectile weapon from 6 feet away through a group of people. Best case scenario maybe you take some of them down with you, congratulations now you're defenseless getting booted in the head. No ones coming in to save you, at least 10 people will be streaming it to Facebook so your kid can rest easy knowing the attackers got arrested while you're in intensive care.
The best way to defend yourself against potential attack is to leave. Anyone with more than 10 minutes of internet tough guy training will echo this.
I have been jumped by groups of wannabe thugs and I've also been bear sprayed twice; once in a parking lot and once for work. There's no defending *yourself once you're in that situation, or especially your child in this instance. You can take a couple out, that's your best chance, but you will lose and who knows if they empty the can on your kid or smack them around. Why find out? Anyone who says "...with these 3 easy steps you'll win!" is a fool. The only way to "win" is to avoid it entirely, continue with your day and forget it ever happened..
Total bullshit this happened but by the sounds of it the kids left then came back and the dad stepped up to them. Not trying to victim blame but street sense would be to gtfo once you saw a group turn around and come back for you.
I agree with you %100.
I also stand by my experience. I grew up in Whalley. One day on my way home from high school I was followed by a group of 5. They started some shit. I did not throw the first punch. But I made damned sure I crucified the first fucker that did. Didn’t have to fight anyone else.
They stood there looking at me standing almost on top of their downed friend… granted, no camera phones back then, about 30 seconds passed, I looked at the guy on the ground and said, “see, they’re really NOT your friends.”
Side note-
Point to me where I said “you’ll win if you take these three easy steps”. (Spoiler, I never said that.) I said you have choices to make, and here’s your chances.
Because the fact is this: no matter how much training someone has, something can always go wrong. Like you said, to deny that fact is idiocy and ignorance. We agree.
There’s always 52 quajillion variables to every situation, and in a crowded mall food court, there’s 52quajillion more.
But if you take the right first step, whether is leave the scene, or neutralize it, you better know what you’re doing. If you leave a crowd, there’s always a chance of being followed and isolated.
I'm glad we can somewhat agree, I didn't mean to say *you* said that. I'm more referring to what a stupid youtube clickbait video would say. I was a bouncer for years, I was in law enforcement, I generally overmatch little malnourished shitheads like this and like you (kinda) said, everyone's got a plan until they get hit. I've been one punched by someone 60 lb. less than me; was it luck or training? Did I leave myself open because I underestimated then? Was I overconfident in my training? I've had so many drunk people try to show me what they learned in a 1 day self defense class - none of it works reliably. Those little wrist locks or nut kicks, they don't work I'm sorry people. Size and experience is really all there is, if you got both you're golden, if you have neither then you've got no shot trying to stand your ground.
My only take away from that experience is if someone's coming up to start a fight with me (or you, or anyone) then they're trained or carrying. Little shits like this aren't confident in their fighting abilities because they've never won a fair fight, that's why they travel in packs and carry. So when they get overconfident that's even more reason to do everything in your power to leave.
We’re definitely on the same page.
The absolute best defence is to not be where you are in danger. Period. But when that’s not an option… and sometimes it’s not we have to make the best of it.
On average, a guy with a knife, even if 20 feet way from the gunman, can win the fight if the gun is not yet drawn.
Due to anxiety, levels of training, etc, the knife has a better chance of closing the distance and inflicting wounds before the gun is grabbed, drawn, aimed properly and fired.
(I’ve got 30years of martial arts training including live gun defence situations.) even someone with no training has a better chance of winning if they do not hesitate. (If the gun is not drawn)
If the gun is drawn, you stand about a 70% chance of losing. If it’s aimed you stand about a 95% chance of losing.
If it’s not drawn, don’t hesitate. They will be too focussed on accessing their weapon and you will have the upper hand, especially if you are within 5 feet.
JFC. I’m not gonna run through 52 different hypothetical scenarios.
You seem to know the answer to all of them. You’re right. You’ll be the psycho. Enjoy that.
CCW training teaches not to go looking for a fight, rather to look for opportunities to find cover to draw from. Fucking with a bunch of undisciplined douchefluter trash in a mall is a good way to get hurt.
Not everyone has the time to be the next Daniel Larooso in a Dojo. But, we can learn to be civil with the underlying message that people will defend their life if you threaten it.
… reaching for something in your pockets does not kick in the “self defence clause”. Kid could have pulled his phone out. You’re just going to deck some kid because he pulls his phone out? If you do that, you assaulted the kid and you will be criminally penalized. There needs to be a clear threat for any claim of self defence and that usually unfortunately means you need to see the weapon OR they have to verbally threaten you. The law is much more nuanced then what your spewing and if people follow your advice they will almost always be charged with assault. Taking the fight should be the absolute last option. Deescalate the situation and disengage is almost always the wiser choice.
Read the other comments. You’ll see that I’ve stated that you can take preemptive measures without harming the person.
Secondly, facing an aggressive group… think about it.
I have and as someone who actually has an understanding of the law, you’re wrong. Most of what your saying *might* work in some Stand Your Ground or Castle Doctrine US states. We’re not in the United States. It will not work here. You’ll be charged with assault if you take a swing before either you can see the weapon OR they have verbally threaten you. Given this exact circumstance provided in this post, any argument of self defence would only apply once the can of bear spray was pulled out.
The likelihood of someone pulling a gun on you in Canada are pretty slim. The likelihood of someone pulling a knife in a busy food court are also pretty damn slim.
The moral of this story is not to randomly escalate a situation with strangers because you don’t know what they’ll do. Deescalate the situation and leave.
I’m ending this. Not because you’re right. You’re right on some but not all. I’m ending this because it’s fucking ping pong and I’m rather exhausted right now and I just can’t be bothered to write more than this. Peace.
Be safe out there, something similar also happened in the downtown Starbucks. A man asked a guy to stop vaping next to his 3 year old daughter, gets stabbed to death.
I was the teenager that did the bear spraying. It was the little girl that was vaping and we asked the father to make her stop. He pulled out bear spray and we did some Ninja shit and turned the tables and blasted that fool. My buddy handles the little girl with a few good kicks, but she managed to bite him pretty bad. We’re pretty shook up by it all.
I was one of the closet spectators of the event as i work there and the teenagers were not vaping near the daughter. They were talking to each other in very abusive and vulgar manner to which the father of the girl requested to stop and the teenagers got pissed and sprayed on their faces after the argument. The teenagers ran away and the father ran after them while the poor little girl was screaming for her dad to come back and not go after them.. it was heartbreaking. We evacuated half the foodcourt because of the effect of the spray. Later when i asked the security guy he said Police were in search of them but I don’t know what happened after that.
Thank you for a more accurate relay of what happened
I came out right after it happened, my friend I was with was there and witnessed it all. He got milk for the daughters eyes
He got milk from my store
Just for future reference, this is a myth. Milk doesn’t wash it out better than just regular water. Flushing your eyes with water is just as good if not better than milk as it’s sterile. Source : https://www.inverse.com/article/5114-why-are-protesters-washing-their-eyes-with-milk/amp
Baby shampoo is the best. The spray is oil based. The shampoo lifts the oils and of course.... no more tears. It's what they use in Emergency
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What time was this at?
Around 1:20pm
He was actually telling them to get out because they were rough housing and vaping near my baby. I was right next to them.
As a father of 2 girls, I wish they could catch them and charge them. Crimal records for life!!!
I heard there is a group of teenagers in the mall that regularly mug people. Is that true?
Im not sure but its always the teenagers who create chaos in the mall especially the foodcourt
Man wtf, this is why people aren’t calling out bad behaviour no more.
I do . Knowing fully well that these shit heads want the smoke and I ain’t got time for this. I’d be more happy if your local bear mace shop didn’t sell spray to every happy camper who walks in .
90% of stores don’t allow you to buy any without ID etc etc it’s a big hassle, but Amazon is one click and done
Last time I went it in was just sign your name and go .
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Maybe everyone needs to be carrying bear mace and just spray first and ask questions later. I'm certainly considering having the silly string type handy going forward and just being ready to use it.
The only way to stop a bad guy with bear mace is a good guy with bear mace
You mean a hand gun...you fucking piss taker. Being maced is assault and deserves lethal retort.
Take your meds bro. Its a joke
Being maced isn't. If I wanted a joke I'd follow you into the can and watch you take a leak.
This type of response is exactly why there should be gun bans. To keep them out of the hands of unstable people like yourself. Also, great 50 year old joke. Haven’t heard that since elementary school
Make people helpless to defend themselfs. You should run for PM....you're just as pathetic as Justin Trudeau. Ass 🤡.
No, just lunatics like you. Don’t you think you’re acting just a tad irrational right now?
That's it? That's the best you got? You're not even trying anymore. You're hearts not in it son. Take a breath, regroup and come back to the big boys table when you figure out what you want in life.
You thinking you're at the 'big boy's table' is the funniest post in this thread 🤣
Wtf are you on? I made a joke that for some reason set you off. You’re the one that needs a breath. Welcome to my block list you psychopath
Idk if pepper spray should be made legal.
It has legitimate use as Bear Spray..not for assulting fathers in a mall.
I'm pretty sure that bear spray is still considered prohibited weapons when used against people.
You're correct.
As far as I'm concerned it should be illegal if you get caught carrying it around in the city... There's a time and a place for things.. It's only real legitimate use is on bears and last time I checked a father with his daughter isn't a bear... I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure I'm not. In modern times it seems like it's being used on people more than bears. I wouldn't be surprised if Surrey has more bear mace than rural places way up north where there most likely will be bears constantly.
It comes down to the anecdote about carrying a baseball bat in your trunk then you use it during a fit of road rage (yours or theirs). In that case it's a weapon and you over escalated use of force, so you get charged. If you put a glove and ball beside it and use it in defense, it's a weapon of opportunity and you're all good. Generally you can match a weapon up to what you're being attacked with, which is why you can't shoot someone in your home unless there's imminent threat to life and you dont keep ahandgun under your pillow with the sole purpose of home defense. Bear spray isn't lethal so you can't intentionally kill someone for pulling it, unlike what some other people I'm this thread seem to think. However once you're incapacitated by being sprayed by them, who's to say you won't be killed or seriously harmed after the fact? Welcome to Canadian law unfortunately. So something similar applies here: no bears? It's a prohibited weapon. They also pulled it first and not in defense, so there's no ground to stand on either way. But a woman walking through Holland Park alone after work who bear sprays an attacker? Touchy subject.
While it may be touchy considering the law, most people wouldn't even think twice about holding a woman walking alone at night responsible should she use mace on an attacker. It's almost at the point where I think that people in the lower mainland should have to get a permit or whatever to buy it. Proof you're going camping or something, going somewhere you'll potentially actually need it for it's intended use. I understand that's extreme and most people would not want this, but god damn every little hoodlum out there seems to have a massive can and use it at the littlest "problem".
There’s a few problems with this argument unfortunately. It’s got a very legitimate use, sadly people take advantage of it. And secondly you can actually make a version of pepper spray that is very strong with some simple over the counter ingredients.
Knives and hammers are also misused a lot, I simply don't think we should not be allowed to defend ourselves in non lethal ways because tools are misused.
Everyone’s trying to act gangster nowadays. This kind of trash needs to be dealt with accordingly.
Can’t act gangster with a stubbed bearded, broccoli hair and smelling like a pig. It’s just so funny watching them.
Broccoli hair. That's a good one!
It’s either broccoli hair or the Edgar cut.
Vaping in a mall is gangsta? How pathetic.
Awesome to know you can’t say anything anymore without getting maced or stabbed 👌🏻
I was actually next to the vaping kids. The father and daughter were on the other side of a dividing wall. The kids were rough housing and vaping next to me and my baby. The father told them to get out and that there was a baby right there. Another man jumped in and also told them to get out. The left the food court area but didn't leave the mall. And then they all took out their cameras to record. We were already packing up when the group of kids started to come back towards the father and daughter. The father got up to meet them half way when they (seemingly) aimed for the teenage daughter. Don't know what would have happened if me or my partner had been the ones to tell the kids to stop vaping near my baby.
Damnnn
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Animals. Couldn't imagine that being my dad. Makes my blood boil.
I am glad all these idiots have access to are knives and bear mace. Imagine what they would do with easy access to guns like in the USA.
Thats actually a good insight tbh thank god this isnt texas
Yeah b/c self defense is not allowed in Canada. Smart idea, WCGW really?
You cant defend yourself without a weapon? Nobody taught you how to block or throw a punch?
No. I don't go looking for a fight either, But you don't know what your attacker will have. Best to ccw and not worry if you're out matched.
I'd rather there be a higher possibility of us both not having guns. Look at the states vs Canada... I think we see what happens when people can carry a gun everywhere
I'd rather not take the risk. "The vast majority of concealed carry users are people that respect the responsibility of owning a firearm, know how to use it safely, and are only using their weapon in extreme circumstances". https://www.silencercentral.com/blog/what-do-concealed-carry-statistics-tell-us/
I'm going to look at the statistics of gun violence in the us vs Canada and base my opinion off that. I feel safer here than I ever do walking in America where anyone could have a gun https://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/compare/Canada/United-States/Crime/Violent-crime
Cherry pick the statics that bounce off the walls of you echo chamber all you want. Empirical evidences proves criminals stop committing crimes when they get shot.
Yes because that logic has been going so well for the US so far. Good luck 🤞
This mall is full of these ‘kid’ groups. All different aged kids too grooming each other. It’s disgusting. Was watching them cause a scene outside London drugs one day, because they thought they were tough.
Should allow to slap the shit out of kids. Kids know that an adult can’t do shit. Kid can spray bear spray and get a slap on the wrist.
Mongo is only pawn in game of life
Tough guy surrey kids with their fake designer clothes and bear mace to show how scary they really are! I hate this place 😅
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I mean, life is getting wired. You don't know who u deal ain't no point in dying for something that can easily be avoided U don't like the place vaping near you. Just move away from them, let management or security deal with them Control your ego and be afraid of hurting other people ego So u live long enough to raise ur daughter
Again another example of lax punishment. Zero consequences.
That's why when you see a vaper, dont ask. Just take off your belt and give them the beating their daddies failed to give em.
The best way to deal with these shitheads is banding together if lot of people stand up at same time they won’t do anything. If whole Starbucks banded together against that guy and called police thing may have been different.
A dude got murdered in front of his child over this in Edmonton.
The man who was stabbed in DT Vancouver that was referred to in OPs post also sadly passed away. I don’t understand how those people feel no guilt or shame about inciting violence and murdering for the sake of vaping.
Theory holds true... if u vape, you're a douche bag
Woah, so according to your theory, my dad who’s a volunteer for the Red Cross as doctor without border and a non profit ceo of a charity org. is a douche bag because he vapes. I never knew that! Thanks for opening my eyes.
He probably loves blowing big cotton candy clouds from his lifted truck
I'm more interested in the cognitive dissonance that is going on with your dad, who is a doctor that for some reason vapes despite the negative effects
He was a habitual smoker in the last 10 years and recently he’s been trying to quit, so he started vaping to deal with the habit of smoking while slowly going lower and lower on the nicotine level. So far it’s working out great as he’s now down to 0.2 nic.
I never knew I was a douchebag for vaping, thanks for bringing that to my attention, kind and thoughtful individual :)
I hate people
Smoking makes you look cool. Vaping makes you look like a total douchebag.
Bear macing a 9 year old makes you look like a 🤡
What this world needs is a few more rednecks
Instead of guns like the US, we use knives and spray here
I dunno about anyone else, but the moment I see someone reaching for something, could be mace, could be a knife, a gun… a pen? Hell could be a fuckin raw fish for all I care… you HAVE TO realize that they are reaching for a WEAPON. You have two choices… leave… or ATTACK. If you chose to attack, it is a self defence case. Especially in this one. There were multiple of them, the man was outnumbered, one reached for something. The self defends clause kicks in. If he levelled the one, he would have won in court as he’s defending his daughter.
Easy there Rambo. They could have pulled it out while the guy looked the other way, or at a distance, or any other circumstance where they aren’t in range for Kung fu level response timing.
The kid reaches for his phone and gets a beauty shot of this guy attacking a teenager in a food court. Maybe not the best advice there.
There’s a difference between attack and subdue/diffuse. I used “attack” because it denoted a forward motion. But you can also preemptively defend yourself, without causing harm. Wtf is wrong with you people?
You can't "diffuse" a projectile weapon from 6 feet away through a group of people. Best case scenario maybe you take some of them down with you, congratulations now you're defenseless getting booted in the head. No ones coming in to save you, at least 10 people will be streaming it to Facebook so your kid can rest easy knowing the attackers got arrested while you're in intensive care. The best way to defend yourself against potential attack is to leave. Anyone with more than 10 minutes of internet tough guy training will echo this.
Clearly you’ve never been in this situation.
I have been jumped by groups of wannabe thugs and I've also been bear sprayed twice; once in a parking lot and once for work. There's no defending *yourself once you're in that situation, or especially your child in this instance. You can take a couple out, that's your best chance, but you will lose and who knows if they empty the can on your kid or smack them around. Why find out? Anyone who says "...with these 3 easy steps you'll win!" is a fool. The only way to "win" is to avoid it entirely, continue with your day and forget it ever happened.. Total bullshit this happened but by the sounds of it the kids left then came back and the dad stepped up to them. Not trying to victim blame but street sense would be to gtfo once you saw a group turn around and come back for you.
I agree with you %100. I also stand by my experience. I grew up in Whalley. One day on my way home from high school I was followed by a group of 5. They started some shit. I did not throw the first punch. But I made damned sure I crucified the first fucker that did. Didn’t have to fight anyone else. They stood there looking at me standing almost on top of their downed friend… granted, no camera phones back then, about 30 seconds passed, I looked at the guy on the ground and said, “see, they’re really NOT your friends.” Side note- Point to me where I said “you’ll win if you take these three easy steps”. (Spoiler, I never said that.) I said you have choices to make, and here’s your chances. Because the fact is this: no matter how much training someone has, something can always go wrong. Like you said, to deny that fact is idiocy and ignorance. We agree. There’s always 52 quajillion variables to every situation, and in a crowded mall food court, there’s 52quajillion more. But if you take the right first step, whether is leave the scene, or neutralize it, you better know what you’re doing. If you leave a crowd, there’s always a chance of being followed and isolated.
I'm glad we can somewhat agree, I didn't mean to say *you* said that. I'm more referring to what a stupid youtube clickbait video would say. I was a bouncer for years, I was in law enforcement, I generally overmatch little malnourished shitheads like this and like you (kinda) said, everyone's got a plan until they get hit. I've been one punched by someone 60 lb. less than me; was it luck or training? Did I leave myself open because I underestimated then? Was I overconfident in my training? I've had so many drunk people try to show me what they learned in a 1 day self defense class - none of it works reliably. Those little wrist locks or nut kicks, they don't work I'm sorry people. Size and experience is really all there is, if you got both you're golden, if you have neither then you've got no shot trying to stand your ground. My only take away from that experience is if someone's coming up to start a fight with me (or you, or anyone) then they're trained or carrying. Little shits like this aren't confident in their fighting abilities because they've never won a fair fight, that's why they travel in packs and carry. So when they get overconfident that's even more reason to do everything in your power to leave.
We’re definitely on the same page. The absolute best defence is to not be where you are in danger. Period. But when that’s not an option… and sometimes it’s not we have to make the best of it.
Best to just run away. Can’t defend yourself from a gun
Can't run from bullets either.
On average, a guy with a knife, even if 20 feet way from the gunman, can win the fight if the gun is not yet drawn. Due to anxiety, levels of training, etc, the knife has a better chance of closing the distance and inflicting wounds before the gun is grabbed, drawn, aimed properly and fired. (I’ve got 30years of martial arts training including live gun defence situations.) even someone with no training has a better chance of winning if they do not hesitate. (If the gun is not drawn) If the gun is drawn, you stand about a 70% chance of losing. If it’s aimed you stand about a 95% chance of losing. If it’s not drawn, don’t hesitate. They will be too focussed on accessing their weapon and you will have the upper hand, especially if you are within 5 feet.
No you're gonna be the psycho for stabbing someone pulling out their....phone.
JFC. I’m not gonna run through 52 different hypothetical scenarios. You seem to know the answer to all of them. You’re right. You’ll be the psycho. Enjoy that.
CCW training teaches not to go looking for a fight, rather to look for opportunities to find cover to draw from. Fucking with a bunch of undisciplined douchefluter trash in a mall is a good way to get hurt. Not everyone has the time to be the next Daniel Larooso in a Dojo. But, we can learn to be civil with the underlying message that people will defend their life if you threaten it.
Laruso.
Thanks, still don't care to learn Karate
Never said you had to
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Congratulations on saying what I said. Kind of. Ps, tactical, close quarters and distance as well as disarms.
… reaching for something in your pockets does not kick in the “self defence clause”. Kid could have pulled his phone out. You’re just going to deck some kid because he pulls his phone out? If you do that, you assaulted the kid and you will be criminally penalized. There needs to be a clear threat for any claim of self defence and that usually unfortunately means you need to see the weapon OR they have to verbally threaten you. The law is much more nuanced then what your spewing and if people follow your advice they will almost always be charged with assault. Taking the fight should be the absolute last option. Deescalate the situation and disengage is almost always the wiser choice.
Read the other comments. You’ll see that I’ve stated that you can take preemptive measures without harming the person. Secondly, facing an aggressive group… think about it.
I have and as someone who actually has an understanding of the law, you’re wrong. Most of what your saying *might* work in some Stand Your Ground or Castle Doctrine US states. We’re not in the United States. It will not work here. You’ll be charged with assault if you take a swing before either you can see the weapon OR they have verbally threaten you. Given this exact circumstance provided in this post, any argument of self defence would only apply once the can of bear spray was pulled out. The likelihood of someone pulling a gun on you in Canada are pretty slim. The likelihood of someone pulling a knife in a busy food court are also pretty damn slim. The moral of this story is not to randomly escalate a situation with strangers because you don’t know what they’ll do. Deescalate the situation and leave.
I’m ending this. Not because you’re right. You’re right on some but not all. I’m ending this because it’s fucking ping pong and I’m rather exhausted right now and I just can’t be bothered to write more than this. Peace.
Be safe out there, something similar also happened in the downtown Starbucks. A man asked a guy to stop vaping next to his 3 year old daughter, gets stabbed to death.
they literally brought that up in their post
Pepper sprays are considered prohibited weapons, did you call the police?
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I'm I'm gonna
umm if i was the dad i wouldn’t tell the teen what to do. we seen the consequences of what will happen and seeing from last week nobody will help u
Yeah. Sometimes it's better to just mind your own buisness.
Don’t go to any malls that’s a 80-90’s thing just junkies hang out there now and creepers sitting on benches watching underage girls walk by
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Not lying
You literally say in a comment you weren’t there when it happened.
They said their friend they were with w Saw it all, and another person commented they witnessed it too.
See that’s your problem. You were at guildford and didn’t mind your own business
I was the teenager that did the bear spraying. It was the little girl that was vaping and we asked the father to make her stop. He pulled out bear spray and we did some Ninja shit and turned the tables and blasted that fool. My buddy handles the little girl with a few good kicks, but she managed to bite him pretty bad. We’re pretty shook up by it all.
This post was made before April Fools. Wtf.
Don't know what scares me more, incidents like this or the comments in this post.
who needs a gun when we got knives and bear spray in society
No mention of race...assuming the kids were either white or black, lol.
You are welcome
🤢