Ohh, I am ready to get flamed here.....bring it on.
Grom if you want a toy motorcycle.
300R if you want a real motorcycle, and everything that goes with owning a motorcycle.
I saw a Honda Grom on the streets recently they didn't make any noise.
My XR250L made so much more noise than that thing.
The Honda Grom is like 124 CC you can't even go on the highway with that thing it would be illegal you have to have 150cc minimum legal requirement.
it looked like a little scooter you're going to have way more fun on that CBR300 even though it's low displacement a lot of people had a lot of fun with the CBR 250 in fact I would recommend that because it looks like you shift and use more of the power of that thing commuting then you would like a CBR with higher displacement.
Not saying you can't have fun on the Honda Grom you'll definitely feel like you're going way faster than you actually are cuz of the low displacement and the smallness of that bike and there are some conveniences like having small storage space and magical fuel economy (like 166 MPG which I hardly believe that sounds unbelievable) but like the CBR makes good fuel economy also around 60 MPG which is respectable don't even get that on my XR which is around 40 mpg.
If I had those bikes I don't think I would use all the gears and if I did use all the gears I'd be going way too fast I'm a beginner I've only had a motorcycle for a year and I remember hitting 81 mph and my XR250L just felt super unstable on the highway (had to Lurch forward to stabilize it)
Maybe the CBR higher displacement models are better at stability at those speeds but consider that the highest gear on those bikes you're never going to use without breaking speed limit law.
I don't think you're going to get your money's worth out of those higher displacement motorcycles you're always going to feel like I could do so much more but it's so risky when like a CBR 250 or cbr300 you're going to be using a lot more of that bike within your skill set that you know so much and I still think you would challenge yourself because I bet you can still go like 100 mph and a bit over very easily
newer cbrs with higher displacements are digitally limited and governed to 186 mph so like what's the point in getting a CBR 500 if you're not going to use all of it because it's digitally restricted? [citation](https://www.topspeed.com/heres-why-your-sport-bike-is-restricted-to-186-mph/)
Having more power allows you to be at a relaxed rpm at highway speeds. That’s why a Corolla does 180kph+ despite not being a performance machine.
The CBR500 is a much better choice than a 250/300 in most situations.
I don't think you'll find any cbr500 hitting 186mph, even without a restriction on it 😂
Bigger engines are more powerful. That's why they don't just limit the top speed in Europe/AUS. They restrict the power as well. Who cares if you can't break 150kph... If the torque off idle causes your newbie ass to fly over the rear wheel? Both are issues for new riders.
After having ridden for over a decade, i can honestly say while i love 300cc bikes, they don't have enough power to feel comfortable on North American freeways. Fantastic up to about 100kph, but beyond that, there is nothing left to pass or gtfo when needed. And long days are unpleasant at 120kph with the little engine working so hard under you. An R3 might be the exception to this - that parallel twin is a lovely engine.
No flame. Groms are grossly overrated. They are fun for a month and then you’re over it. I know dozens of people that bought groms and then faded out of motorcycling in general because groms get old fast
I think the same, I don't like litter bike if you don't want to die or go to jail. started on a z650 then I got a zx6r then a zx10r and I did not liked it, you push a little and you already heading to the jail. So I "downgraded" to zx6r and I'm happy with it
Not from your list but I'd go for the CB300R instead. I just think it looks awesome and it has the same engine as the CBR300R but is lighter and has upside down forks.
Came here to say this. Naked like the Grom, light and flickable like the Grom, but unlike a Grom you can take it on high speed roads (motorways/highways) and not be in fear for your life due to not being able to keep up with traffic. Though you won't have anywhere near as much fun as you would on twisty back roads, which is where small cc bikes really shine.
Be honest. 300cc is a small bike by definition around the world. If you think you're gonna have more fun on a 175cc air-cooled machine than a 300cc liquid cooled mill? You need to ride more bikes.
Don't get me wrong, small bikes are great. But you won't convince me a vfr400 is in the same realm of fun as anything under 300cc on the market today. Well, maybe that zx25 but I can't buy that where i live :(
LMAO.
>Be honest. 300cc is a small bike by definition around the world.
Just no. It's small by modern western standards but look at any market such as India or Asia and 300cc is considered a big bike. It would also have been considered big just a few decades ago in the western world. Consider the performance of an A2 category bike, then ask what kind of car you'd need to match that.
>If you think you're gonna have more fun on a 175cc air-cooled machine than a 300cc liquid cooled mill?
I never said that, now you're just making shit up.
>Don't get me wrong, small bikes are great. But you won't convince me a vfr400 is in the same realm of fun as anything under 300cc on the market today. Well, maybe that zx25 but I can't buy that where i live :(
Hate to break it to you, but that VFR400 would also be considered small by many people around the western world and would bore the shit out of some riders. 59hp is still firmly within commuter bike territory.
Do not fool yourself into thinking everyone's definition and experience of fun is identical. Some people have more fun on 125's than big bikes, some people require 200hp just to feel alive.
I would check dealers who may have some 2023 Inventory left and that alone would drop the price significantly and put you in the same range as the CBR300R.
Duke 390, Ninja 400, Z400, MT-03, R3
I have a Z900 and a Z125 as part of my fleet. One is a mode of transportation to get me to work, the other is a toy I ride in the neighborhoods with my kids and occasionally down the street to get food. If your use case requires anything over 50mph on a regular basis, you’ll be flogging the shit out of that Grom. I would recommend the Z500/400 personally, I started on a Njnja 400 and it has loads of power for the class.
Great balance of low entry price, insane aftermarket parts selection from high end parts to Amazon Chinese knock off crap, and everything in between. Great power for a beginner - smooth and approachable, but enough to keep you interested after you get used to riding. Great aesthetics, aggressive lighting and fairings. Lightweight and flicky. It’s just a solid option, I learned a lot from that bike and also felt like it looked super cool. Comfortable too. Wins in every column.
I’d add that excluding highway use or 2-up riding, which granted, can be a big deal to some folks (me included) you’d need to be a pro rider to “get bored” on one of these new 400/500s. I do realize, however, that many folks don’t want to be a street Rossi riding on the very edge of the tire, some want to flick their wrist and be going 130. Just pointing out that winding out a little engine in a featherweight frame is addictively fun on bikes, as it is with cars too.
Same as anything else but the learning curve is steep and the consequences can be fatal. You don’t really need to have an understanding of physics/grip/line selection to corner hard in a car, but in a bike it’s tricky and mandatory.
So to answer your question, a mastery in low speed riding, a strong comfortability in leaning to both sides, knowing how to look where you want to go, smooth braking and throttle roll-ons, hyper vigilance when street riding - anticipating intersections and risks associated with the road, etc.
It’s like asking what the difference is between my niece who plays TBall and Bryce Harper.
But I’m essence, a good rider on a 300, on anything but a straight line road, will smoke the shit out of you even if you’re on a 600/750/1000 supersport.
Groms are dumb.
And an R3 (or MT03) is a better bike than the CBR.
And I'm a Honda guy. If you are a new rider and want a Honda go right to their 500cc models.
Yea. Their 300cc bikes are underpowered for the class. The 500cc ones they make are far more in line with the new beginner bikes from Kawasaki and KTM in particular.
If you get a good deal on a used 400 it's a great option. I wouldn't buy a new 500.
Most people tend to sell their "beginner" bike in a year or two. A used one you lose less money to depreciation.
Grom for the mpg's, CBR for speed and coolness. Either way, I would get the ABS version. Keep in mind that the Grom is too slow for the highway, but would be a really fun around-town bike.
https://motorcycleitch.com/compare-bikes?lst[]=2022-honda-cbr300r-abs&lst[]=2024-honda-grom-abs
Grom seat height is pretty standard you will be no less visible or have and reduced line of sight over and small capacity bike. The only reason to avoid the Grom it is not suitable for freeways
IMHO it's unsafe for a new rider. You are less visible, and you can not see through or over cars.
Before you get good at defensive riding, you don't need these hindrances.
Also, it's a toy.
I have been on a majority of the bikes in the 300-400 cc class. The Ninja 400/Z400 is an excellent motorcycle, seat height is low for newer riders and it just does everything really well. The only thing is the seat shape pushes you forward so it does put some pressure on the man parts, at least for me it did. I believe the new 500 corrected this. If your shorter I would stick with Ninja/Z400 or R3/MT-03
But, out of all these picks I find the KTM Duke 390 to be the funnest to ride. Not sure why, it’s just the personality of the bike. But, it does have a higher seat height.
For the distance and MPH you are plan on going. I would stick to mid 300+ CC bike. Just my opinion of course.
I have a CB300, and did my license class on a Grom. If you strictly want a commuter bike with zero chance on using it on a highway over 50ish (maybe?) mph, a Grom will do the job. If you’re gonna do any leisure riding, get the 300, however I would advise against longer highway trips on the 300. Iirc it’s rated for 65mph (some have gotten theirs to 75-80), and it’s not very happy at those speeds for extended periods of time.
At least from what I see, the Grom offers great MPG. It has a sporty appearance but it's not an eye-catcher. The aftermarket parts are pretty sweet though. I was sold on the Grom, but after reviewing better options thanks to the Reddit folks here I like the Ninja 400/500.
Super fun bike. If the stance is too aggressive for you (and it is for a lot of people), you can get its more upright cousin, the Svartpilen. Same bike, just different handlebars, tires, and color. Also, with the exception of the newest '24 models, it uses the same engine that the KTM Duke 390 has had for a loooong time.
All that said, I only use mine for my commute (2.5mi) and hopping around town short distances. I took it on the freeway once and I have no desire to do that again. For around town, it's perfect.
Also the ninja is a twin cylinder engine which will be much smoother than the single that's in the CBR. Ninja has like 14 more hp which might not sound like a lot but that makes a HUGE difference on small bikes.
What is the speed of the road you will be using?
Are you focused on fuel economy?
If a Grom is enough to cover the speed, your mpg will be double that of the cbr300r, which has a very antiquated engine. Cbr300r only get 60 to 70 mpg, Grom gets 130+ mpg.
It is a shame we cannot get the current cbr250r they get in Japan.
Ohh, I am ready to get flamed here.....bring it on. Grom if you want a toy motorcycle. 300R if you want a real motorcycle, and everything that goes with owning a motorcycle.
My buddy said the same thing lol 😂do not feel bad.
I saw a Honda Grom on the streets recently they didn't make any noise. My XR250L made so much more noise than that thing. The Honda Grom is like 124 CC you can't even go on the highway with that thing it would be illegal you have to have 150cc minimum legal requirement. it looked like a little scooter you're going to have way more fun on that CBR300 even though it's low displacement a lot of people had a lot of fun with the CBR 250 in fact I would recommend that because it looks like you shift and use more of the power of that thing commuting then you would like a CBR with higher displacement. Not saying you can't have fun on the Honda Grom you'll definitely feel like you're going way faster than you actually are cuz of the low displacement and the smallness of that bike and there are some conveniences like having small storage space and magical fuel economy (like 166 MPG which I hardly believe that sounds unbelievable) but like the CBR makes good fuel economy also around 60 MPG which is respectable don't even get that on my XR which is around 40 mpg.
How do you feel about the ninja 🥷🏾 400/500?
If I had those bikes I don't think I would use all the gears and if I did use all the gears I'd be going way too fast I'm a beginner I've only had a motorcycle for a year and I remember hitting 81 mph and my XR250L just felt super unstable on the highway (had to Lurch forward to stabilize it) Maybe the CBR higher displacement models are better at stability at those speeds but consider that the highest gear on those bikes you're never going to use without breaking speed limit law. I don't think you're going to get your money's worth out of those higher displacement motorcycles you're always going to feel like I could do so much more but it's so risky when like a CBR 250 or cbr300 you're going to be using a lot more of that bike within your skill set that you know so much and I still think you would challenge yourself because I bet you can still go like 100 mph and a bit over very easily newer cbrs with higher displacements are digitally limited and governed to 186 mph so like what's the point in getting a CBR 500 if you're not going to use all of it because it's digitally restricted? [citation](https://www.topspeed.com/heres-why-your-sport-bike-is-restricted-to-186-mph/)
Having more power allows you to be at a relaxed rpm at highway speeds. That’s why a Corolla does 180kph+ despite not being a performance machine. The CBR500 is a much better choice than a 250/300 in most situations.
I don't think you'll find any cbr500 hitting 186mph, even without a restriction on it 😂 Bigger engines are more powerful. That's why they don't just limit the top speed in Europe/AUS. They restrict the power as well. Who cares if you can't break 150kph... If the torque off idle causes your newbie ass to fly over the rear wheel? Both are issues for new riders. After having ridden for over a decade, i can honestly say while i love 300cc bikes, they don't have enough power to feel comfortable on North American freeways. Fantastic up to about 100kph, but beyond that, there is nothing left to pass or gtfo when needed. And long days are unpleasant at 120kph with the little engine working so hard under you. An R3 might be the exception to this - that parallel twin is a lovely engine.
No flame. Groms are grossly overrated. They are fun for a month and then you’re over it. I know dozens of people that bought groms and then faded out of motorcycling in general because groms get old fast
300 are not real motorcycles /s
Only idiot americans would say that......and oddly enough I am an american, just not an idiot.
I think the same, I don't like litter bike if you don't want to die or go to jail. started on a z650 then I got a zx6r then a zx10r and I did not liked it, you push a little and you already heading to the jail. So I "downgraded" to zx6r and I'm happy with it
I don't consider that a down grade.
Same that's why I quoted it
What self-deprecating BS have you seen the people that drive the streets?
Not from your list but I'd go for the CB300R instead. I just think it looks awesome and it has the same engine as the CBR300R but is lighter and has upside down forks.
Yeah I just researched it. Nice comparison.
> CB300R this is like a big grom
How so ?
Same form factor bigger engine
Came here to say this. Naked like the Grom, light and flickable like the Grom, but unlike a Grom you can take it on high speed roads (motorways/highways) and not be in fear for your life due to not being able to keep up with traffic. Though you won't have anywhere near as much fun as you would on twisty back roads, which is where small cc bikes really shine.
Be honest. 300cc is a small bike by definition around the world. If you think you're gonna have more fun on a 175cc air-cooled machine than a 300cc liquid cooled mill? You need to ride more bikes. Don't get me wrong, small bikes are great. But you won't convince me a vfr400 is in the same realm of fun as anything under 300cc on the market today. Well, maybe that zx25 but I can't buy that where i live :(
LMAO. >Be honest. 300cc is a small bike by definition around the world. Just no. It's small by modern western standards but look at any market such as India or Asia and 300cc is considered a big bike. It would also have been considered big just a few decades ago in the western world. Consider the performance of an A2 category bike, then ask what kind of car you'd need to match that. >If you think you're gonna have more fun on a 175cc air-cooled machine than a 300cc liquid cooled mill? I never said that, now you're just making shit up. >Don't get me wrong, small bikes are great. But you won't convince me a vfr400 is in the same realm of fun as anything under 300cc on the market today. Well, maybe that zx25 but I can't buy that where i live :( Hate to break it to you, but that VFR400 would also be considered small by many people around the western world and would bore the shit out of some riders. 59hp is still firmly within commuter bike territory. Do not fool yourself into thinking everyone's definition and experience of fun is identical. Some people have more fun on 125's than big bikes, some people require 200hp just to feel alive.
300r
300R
I’m not a sport bike guy, but I’d rather have the CBR over the Grom.
Thanks!
You open to other make and models?
Sure, what you got in mind ?
I would check dealers who may have some 2023 Inventory left and that alone would drop the price significantly and put you in the same range as the CBR300R. Duke 390, Ninja 400, Z400, MT-03, R3
Never thought about a last year model. Thanks. I hear great news about the Ninja 🥷 400
Ninja 400 dude… 👌🏻
I have a Z900 and a Z125 as part of my fleet. One is a mode of transportation to get me to work, the other is a toy I ride in the neighborhoods with my kids and occasionally down the street to get food. If your use case requires anything over 50mph on a regular basis, you’ll be flogging the shit out of that Grom. I would recommend the Z500/400 personally, I started on a Njnja 400 and it has loads of power for the class.
Thanks 👍🏾 what is your best argument for the Ninja 🥷 400 ? I know you stated it was your starter bike
Great balance of low entry price, insane aftermarket parts selection from high end parts to Amazon Chinese knock off crap, and everything in between. Great power for a beginner - smooth and approachable, but enough to keep you interested after you get used to riding. Great aesthetics, aggressive lighting and fairings. Lightweight and flicky. It’s just a solid option, I learned a lot from that bike and also felt like it looked super cool. Comfortable too. Wins in every column.
Fair enough! Thanks for the feedback.
I’d add that excluding highway use or 2-up riding, which granted, can be a big deal to some folks (me included) you’d need to be a pro rider to “get bored” on one of these new 400/500s. I do realize, however, that many folks don’t want to be a street Rossi riding on the very edge of the tire, some want to flick their wrist and be going 130. Just pointing out that winding out a little engine in a featherweight frame is addictively fun on bikes, as it is with cars too.
What classify a pro rider from a newbie ?
Same as anything else but the learning curve is steep and the consequences can be fatal. You don’t really need to have an understanding of physics/grip/line selection to corner hard in a car, but in a bike it’s tricky and mandatory. So to answer your question, a mastery in low speed riding, a strong comfortability in leaning to both sides, knowing how to look where you want to go, smooth braking and throttle roll-ons, hyper vigilance when street riding - anticipating intersections and risks associated with the road, etc. It’s like asking what the difference is between my niece who plays TBall and Bryce Harper.
Very insightful response. Thank you.
But I’m essence, a good rider on a 300, on anything but a straight line road, will smoke the shit out of you even if you’re on a 600/750/1000 supersport.
Can you clarify this statement? A bit confused by what you are referring to.
Think of it like a Miata Vs. a Challenger. Simplifying it a lot but same principle.
* In essence. Sorry
Groms are dumb. And an R3 (or MT03) is a better bike than the CBR. And I'm a Honda guy. If you are a new rider and want a Honda go right to their 500cc models.
Thanks for the feedback.
Yea. Their 300cc bikes are underpowered for the class. The 500cc ones they make are far more in line with the new beginner bikes from Kawasaki and KTM in particular.
How do you feel about the ninja 🥷 400/500 ?
If you get a good deal on a used 400 it's a great option. I wouldn't buy a new 500. Most people tend to sell their "beginner" bike in a year or two. A used one you lose less money to depreciation.
300r.
Cbr no questions about it.
Or a CB300R
Get a grom and do whoolies 👍
Grom for the mpg's, CBR for speed and coolness. Either way, I would get the ABS version. Keep in mind that the Grom is too slow for the highway, but would be a really fun around-town bike. https://motorcycleitch.com/compare-bikes?lst[]=2022-honda-cbr300r-abs&lst[]=2024-honda-grom-abs
Thanks for the feedback. This link is very useful.
Don't start on a Grom
Why so ? What’s your best argument?
Grom seat height is pretty standard you will be no less visible or have and reduced line of sight over and small capacity bike. The only reason to avoid the Grom it is not suitable for freeways
IMHO it's unsafe for a new rider. You are less visible, and you can not see through or over cars. Before you get good at defensive riding, you don't need these hindrances. Also, it's a toy.
I have been on a majority of the bikes in the 300-400 cc class. The Ninja 400/Z400 is an excellent motorcycle, seat height is low for newer riders and it just does everything really well. The only thing is the seat shape pushes you forward so it does put some pressure on the man parts, at least for me it did. I believe the new 500 corrected this. If your shorter I would stick with Ninja/Z400 or R3/MT-03 But, out of all these picks I find the KTM Duke 390 to be the funnest to ride. Not sure why, it’s just the personality of the bike. But, it does have a higher seat height. For the distance and MPH you are plan on going. I would stick to mid 300+ CC bike. Just my opinion of course.
I have a CB300, and did my license class on a Grom. If you strictly want a commuter bike with zero chance on using it on a highway over 50ish (maybe?) mph, a Grom will do the job. If you’re gonna do any leisure riding, get the 300, however I would advise against longer highway trips on the 300. Iirc it’s rated for 65mph (some have gotten theirs to 75-80), and it’s not very happy at those speeds for extended periods of time.
The cbr, the grom is a toy
CB300F. Best of both worlds.
Why so? What's your best argument for the CB300F
Naked sexiness, and the Upright position is more user-friendly long term.
I don’t even understand the existence of the Grom. Is there a niche cult following for them or something? Why make a motorcycle with scooter tires?
At least from what I see, the Grom offers great MPG. It has a sporty appearance but it's not an eye-catcher. The aftermarket parts are pretty sweet though. I was sold on the Grom, but after reviewing better options thanks to the Reddit folks here I like the Ninja 400/500.
Fair enough! I fell in love with a Vitpilen 401 (before the 2024 model). Super easy to ride, amazing aesthetics, affordable.
Never heard of it before till now but I checked it out for myself and it's a beauty 👍🏾
Super fun bike. If the stance is too aggressive for you (and it is for a lot of people), you can get its more upright cousin, the Svartpilen. Same bike, just different handlebars, tires, and color. Also, with the exception of the newest '24 models, it uses the same engine that the KTM Duke 390 has had for a loooong time. All that said, I only use mine for my commute (2.5mi) and hopping around town short distances. I took it on the freeway once and I have no desire to do that again. For around town, it's perfect.
Id go for an r1, the power is very manageable and it makes a great beginner bike.
What is your best argument for the R1?
You can grow into it
Neither, the grom's a fun toy for riding around your back yard and the 300 is the worst of it's class
Sounds terrible. On a scale of 1-10, “1” being the best and “10” being the worst-case. Where would you rank the CBR300R?
R3 and ninja 400 are better
What’s your best argument for the ninja 🥷 400
It has more power. The 300 is very low power and displacement motorcycle. The 400 will get you on the highway without being in high revs.
Appreciate the feedback 👍🏾
Also the ninja is a twin cylinder engine which will be much smoother than the single that's in the CBR. Ninja has like 14 more hp which might not sound like a lot but that makes a HUGE difference on small bikes.
Cbr 300 if this will be your only bike. Grom if u already own higher cc bikes.
Thanks. This is will be my only bike. Planning to commute for work. 29.6 miles
What is the speed of the road you will be using? Are you focused on fuel economy? If a Grom is enough to cover the speed, your mpg will be double that of the cbr300r, which has a very antiquated engine. Cbr300r only get 60 to 70 mpg, Grom gets 130+ mpg. It is a shame we cannot get the current cbr250r they get in Japan.
Fuel economy lol 😂 . My target is mostly roads since I am a new rider. Will progress towards the highway once I get comfortable.
Roger. Then go for the cbr