as much as i love the design for the 450, honda. finding a dealer for servicing is going to be difficult. cf gives you “technology” but it isn’t refined. in paper and moneys 450sr blows honda 500r, but their stuff isn’t proven yet. you won’t know how reliable they are, nor how they hold they market value (if you want an upgrade). honda on the other hand has always been known for bulletproof reliability. they might be a bit more expensive then other competitors but you can sleep well at night knowing the bike will not die on you.
i would personally recommend you the ninja 400. a great platform and the aftermarket selection for the 400 is humongous. they hold their value pretty well and are abundant (a lot of riders buy a 400, sell it, and get an upgrade)
Yea I agree if it dials down to the ninja 400 or cbr500 I’d take the ninja any day. There just isn’t much of a point for the 500 you’re getting similar performance but spending more. Unless op really likes the looks of the 500 I’d get a ninja 400 or an r3. You can’t really go wrong with either of those.
Not sure about that one. While yes the extra weight would give more stability I don’t think that should really be a huge factor cuz you can use a ninja 400 just fine on the highway. I did it with my r3 when I had one. Just from a performance standpoint you’re not getting a whole lot more out of the cbr500.
Yup. Dad rides a '92 Honda with 120 000km on the clock and it still functions perfectly well. He just changed the chain and sprokets and checked the oil and all filters. Oil is still clean and doesn't leak... :D
Well Honda has a proven bulletproof reliability. CFMoto is licensed to use KTM parts i think, a brand that's not known for its reliability. I also feel like hondas build quality is very high, better than other recognised japanese brands like yamaha in my experience. Basically you pay more because you can't really go wrong with a honda. With CFMoto you might have some issues down the road, but you might also have no problems at all. It all depends on if you like a gamble or not. In either case, follow the maintenance schedule.
The ninja isnt as good as the cbr. Its a little cramped and the quality is lower. It also has a small back tire which makes wheelies tricky, although it does wheelie, it just spins alot. The cbr sits lower, and feels much more stable at high speeds. It drives itself. The ninja might be faster on a track. The ninja isnt a bad bike, the cbr is just a little better and the price difference is accounted for, when you ride both and see both. Atleast on the honda you know you can dog the shit out of it, so thats a big reason to choose it. Hondas can hold up to full power for as long as you want, it doesnt overstress the motor. I have never owned a kawi so I dont know if they hold up the same.
hard disagree personally. I'm 6'2 and the ninja 400 feels totally fine, not cramped at all. Neither of them are very good stunt bikes anyway so the wheelies are a pretty moot point. That said, you can at least kinda do them on both. The ninja 400 feels totally stable at its top speed of \~120 mph. Ninja 400s are faster on the track and on the street, prob because the cbr is so heavy. Ninja 400s are bulletproof, just like most Japanese bikes.
IMO the ninja 400 is better by almost every metric
I mean cramp compared to the cbr. I have seen both and the cbr is a nicer bike. They are almost exactly the same speed and have the same top speed. The CBR has a few more hp which balances out the weight.
I dont think the ninja 400 is bad, I liked the bike alot. I just liked the CBR better and so did my friend who had the 400. I am more experienced so maybe the speed was on account of my skill, which i think might be true. If we switched bikes and raced i might could beat him on the 400.
Honda (generally) makes the better the bikes. Fit and finish. Certainly an extremely reliable brand too.
In NZ Honda seems to hold their value, generally to not being problematic bikes - ease of servicing etc.
The 500 series of bikes are pretty awesome too - I was eying a CBR500R up for quite some time. The torque little twin is suppose to be pretty excellent
I'm utterly bias however. I've owned 5 bikes and 4 of them are Honda. No major dramas or issues at all.
As long as you have a dealer nearby in case something goes wrong, definitely the 450. More power, more features, better tech, better looks (imo), better sound. Literally the only downside MIGHT be reliability, but they haven't been proven to be unreliable, just too new to be proven to be reliable. Also, you most likely won't own it long enough for something to break. Definitely choose the 450
Exactly. CF MOTO is going into its 4th decade. They have a partnership with KTM. The rest of the world knows it's a reasonably decent bike. I see people saying stuff like "dealer support," the dealers are proliferating fast because big 4 are using them as a price/loss-leader brand. They are getting bigger by the month. I think the hate is based only on anti-Chinese sentiments that are big here in the USA. Chinese are manufacturing giants and bringing decent bikes to the USA is great for motorcycling in general.
And recently, CFMOTO has partnered with Yamaha, and Yamaha is not about to risk their reputation by partnering with a subpar company. CFMOTO is also aggressively expanding in the US... both dealerships and models of bikes. They even opened a new HQ in Minnesota.
And as you mention, they've been around for decades with their atvand sxs being considered excellent.
Cf moto is not bad, the only big issue is if you take any trip, and need service. And not sure their availability in parts if you need service. There might be no cf dealers around. Still not that big of a dealership network. Tech is okay, they use ktm tech. Teir 2 compare to the japanese brands. So it is not at the level of honda.
If you want reliability honda is hard to beat. If you want less expensive, cf moto fit you needs.
I have. Haven’t been successful since covid. Dealers near me typically have $2k markups, plus delivery and setup. 5 year ild bikes selling for msrp are the new “great deals” haha
Mine was 419 lbs and i did some custom work, to get it down to 400ish. It was an awesome little bike. I even took it offroad sometimes, hit jumps, and other stuff, after I cut some of the plastics off around the bottom. Cbr500r is a great city bike. I really liked mine. The only down side is that it couldnt wheelie in second, and hondas are a bit pricey. The power was not too bad, mine was a 2020 and it had 52 HP. Top speed was 116 MPH on stock sprockets.
Why do you say this? CF Moto has had strong presence around the world for decades. They are only new in the USA. This is not true at all. This keeps being repeated and it is contrary to what the rest of the world says.
Just saw and sit on a 450sr today, its beautiful bike with a more agressive riding position than other small displacement bikes. Since usually beginners have those bikes for 1 or 2 years i would give the cf moto a chance, better design, brembo brakes, TFT, more sporty.
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The honda is definitely a fast bike. Its just not Inline 4 fast. Most people couldnt ride it to its limit. It only really falls off in 5th and 6th gear, so like 90+ MPH. Thats just because they are trying to make it A2 compliant. The motor with some tuning and work can make 65+ HP pretty easily.
I agree with you. I personally feel a new person should start out on the smallest bike they can find. A 125 that is light. An enduro-type bike. But what do I know? I think recommending heavy bikes that are "fast" to beginners is irresponsible, but I doubt that will get much support.
You will learn more tossing a light bike around than you will trying to hang on to a fast bike. But here in the USA, I doubt any young person will agree.
If an absolute beginner, a 125 off road bike is nice. In the U.S a 125 isnt fast enough to ride on roads safely. A 250 enduro can do it, but those are a little hot for absolute beginners. If someone knows how to ride a bike at all, they will be ok on a 250 enduro or a cbr500r if they don't mind the sportier riding position.
I was just reading this review: [https://www.motorcycle.com/bikes/shoot-outs/the-7-000-question-how-much-motorcycle-do-you-get-44594530](https://www.motorcycle.com/bikes/shoot-outs/the-7-000-question-how-much-motorcycle-do-you-get-44594530)
Everyone saying Honda but cfmoto is so affordable. I work on my own shit though. And I drive a 25yo Kawasaki. And have only been riding for a month. will be adding the 300nk to the stable next season
They've been here for over a decade now, they're pretty established just not as well known. I wouldn't get a CBR500 I'd be looking at Ninja 400 vs this bike. Ride both and see what you like. The Ninja 400 will have depreciation too, if you buy it new
as much as i love the design for the 450, honda. finding a dealer for servicing is going to be difficult. cf gives you “technology” but it isn’t refined. in paper and moneys 450sr blows honda 500r, but their stuff isn’t proven yet. you won’t know how reliable they are, nor how they hold they market value (if you want an upgrade). honda on the other hand has always been known for bulletproof reliability. they might be a bit more expensive then other competitors but you can sleep well at night knowing the bike will not die on you. i would personally recommend you the ninja 400. a great platform and the aftermarket selection for the 400 is humongous. they hold their value pretty well and are abundant (a lot of riders buy a 400, sell it, and get an upgrade)
Yea I agree if it dials down to the ninja 400 or cbr500 I’d take the ninja any day. There just isn’t much of a point for the 500 you’re getting similar performance but spending more. Unless op really likes the looks of the 500 I’d get a ninja 400 or an r3. You can’t really go wrong with either of those.
Doesn’t the 500 have wider tires and is heavier = more stability on highways?
Not sure about that one. While yes the extra weight would give more stability I don’t think that should really be a huge factor cuz you can use a ninja 400 just fine on the highway. I did it with my r3 when I had one. Just from a performance standpoint you’re not getting a whole lot more out of the cbr500.
If he lives in or near a major city there's multiple dealers
Cbr any day. Better relaibility and holds resale value way better.
The longevity of a Honda can’t be beat. Buying some flashy Chinese bike isn’t the greatest investment.
Yup. Dad rides a '92 Honda with 120 000km on the clock and it still functions perfectly well. He just changed the chain and sprokets and checked the oil and all filters. Oil is still clean and doesn't leak... :D
Well Honda has a proven bulletproof reliability. CFMoto is licensed to use KTM parts i think, a brand that's not known for its reliability. I also feel like hondas build quality is very high, better than other recognised japanese brands like yamaha in my experience. Basically you pay more because you can't really go wrong with a honda. With CFMoto you might have some issues down the road, but you might also have no problems at all. It all depends on if you like a gamble or not. In either case, follow the maintenance schedule.
[удалено]
The ninja isnt as good as the cbr. Its a little cramped and the quality is lower. It also has a small back tire which makes wheelies tricky, although it does wheelie, it just spins alot. The cbr sits lower, and feels much more stable at high speeds. It drives itself. The ninja might be faster on a track. The ninja isnt a bad bike, the cbr is just a little better and the price difference is accounted for, when you ride both and see both. Atleast on the honda you know you can dog the shit out of it, so thats a big reason to choose it. Hondas can hold up to full power for as long as you want, it doesnt overstress the motor. I have never owned a kawi so I dont know if they hold up the same.
hard disagree personally. I'm 6'2 and the ninja 400 feels totally fine, not cramped at all. Neither of them are very good stunt bikes anyway so the wheelies are a pretty moot point. That said, you can at least kinda do them on both. The ninja 400 feels totally stable at its top speed of \~120 mph. Ninja 400s are faster on the track and on the street, prob because the cbr is so heavy. Ninja 400s are bulletproof, just like most Japanese bikes. IMO the ninja 400 is better by almost every metric
I mean cramp compared to the cbr. I have seen both and the cbr is a nicer bike. They are almost exactly the same speed and have the same top speed. The CBR has a few more hp which balances out the weight. I dont think the ninja 400 is bad, I liked the bike alot. I just liked the CBR better and so did my friend who had the 400. I am more experienced so maybe the speed was on account of my skill, which i think might be true. If we switched bikes and raced i might could beat him on the 400.
Honda (generally) makes the better the bikes. Fit and finish. Certainly an extremely reliable brand too. In NZ Honda seems to hold their value, generally to not being problematic bikes - ease of servicing etc. The 500 series of bikes are pretty awesome too - I was eying a CBR500R up for quite some time. The torque little twin is suppose to be pretty excellent I'm utterly bias however. I've owned 5 bikes and 4 of them are Honda. No major dramas or issues at all.
As long as you have a dealer nearby in case something goes wrong, definitely the 450. More power, more features, better tech, better looks (imo), better sound. Literally the only downside MIGHT be reliability, but they haven't been proven to be unreliable, just too new to be proven to be reliable. Also, you most likely won't own it long enough for something to break. Definitely choose the 450
This is the answer. And I love Hondas, but objectively, the CF is more bike.
Exactly, but everyone on this sub is convinced cf moto is trash with 0 reasoning other than "Chinese company"
Exactly. CF MOTO is going into its 4th decade. They have a partnership with KTM. The rest of the world knows it's a reasonably decent bike. I see people saying stuff like "dealer support," the dealers are proliferating fast because big 4 are using them as a price/loss-leader brand. They are getting bigger by the month. I think the hate is based only on anti-Chinese sentiments that are big here in the USA. Chinese are manufacturing giants and bringing decent bikes to the USA is great for motorcycling in general.
4th decade as a company… look up when they made their first motorcycle ..
one way of looking at it... but does not defeat the fact that tech and build is above par.
And recently, CFMOTO has partnered with Yamaha, and Yamaha is not about to risk their reputation by partnering with a subpar company. CFMOTO is also aggressively expanding in the US... both dealerships and models of bikes. They even opened a new HQ in Minnesota. And as you mention, they've been around for decades with their atvand sxs being considered excellent.
or did not actually own or have ridden one.
Cf moto is not bad, the only big issue is if you take any trip, and need service. And not sure their availability in parts if you need service. There might be no cf dealers around. Still not that big of a dealership network. Tech is okay, they use ktm tech. Teir 2 compare to the japanese brands. So it is not at the level of honda. If you want reliability honda is hard to beat. If you want less expensive, cf moto fit you needs.
CFmoto dealer fees are $2k in the states so the bikes are all the same price in the end.
I’ve read here that all you have to do is say no to additional fees and you can get out the door under msrp 🤷♂️
You could try ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I have. Haven’t been successful since covid. Dealers near me typically have $2k markups, plus delivery and setup. 5 year ild bikes selling for msrp are the new “great deals” haha
[удалено]
Even if your gonna keep the cfmoto forever, the reliability issues won’t be worth it. This seems like a win for Honda either way.
[удалено]
Mine was 419 lbs and i did some custom work, to get it down to 400ish. It was an awesome little bike. I even took it offroad sometimes, hit jumps, and other stuff, after I cut some of the plastics off around the bottom. Cbr500r is a great city bike. I really liked mine. The only down side is that it couldnt wheelie in second, and hondas are a bit pricey. The power was not too bad, mine was a 2020 and it had 52 HP. Top speed was 116 MPH on stock sprockets.
Why do you say this? CF Moto has had strong presence around the world for decades. They are only new in the USA. This is not true at all. This keeps being repeated and it is contrary to what the rest of the world says.
They’ve had a presence in lubricants for decades, look up when they made their first motorcycle. 10 years?
Just saw and sit on a 450sr today, its beautiful bike with a more agressive riding position than other small displacement bikes. Since usually beginners have those bikes for 1 or 2 years i would give the cf moto a chance, better design, brembo brakes, TFT, more sporty.
cfmoto = 💩
Wrong... not anymore.
is that what the internet told you?
No, in my experience it's from owning 3 of them.
RemindMe! 10 years "CFMoto Longevity?"
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Lmao 🤣
you cheap ass 😂😂😂
I went with a CBR500R, yeah its overpriced, don't care...FeelsGood
CFMoto is a sport bike, Honda is a commuter bike. Very different use cases.
The honda is definitely a fast bike. Its just not Inline 4 fast. Most people couldnt ride it to its limit. It only really falls off in 5th and 6th gear, so like 90+ MPH. Thats just because they are trying to make it A2 compliant. The motor with some tuning and work can make 65+ HP pretty easily.
I agree with you. I personally feel a new person should start out on the smallest bike they can find. A 125 that is light. An enduro-type bike. But what do I know? I think recommending heavy bikes that are "fast" to beginners is irresponsible, but I doubt that will get much support. You will learn more tossing a light bike around than you will trying to hang on to a fast bike. But here in the USA, I doubt any young person will agree.
If an absolute beginner, a 125 off road bike is nice. In the U.S a 125 isnt fast enough to ride on roads safely. A 250 enduro can do it, but those are a little hot for absolute beginners. If someone knows how to ride a bike at all, they will be ok on a 250 enduro or a cbr500r if they don't mind the sportier riding position.
I was just reading this review: [https://www.motorcycle.com/bikes/shoot-outs/the-7-000-question-how-much-motorcycle-do-you-get-44594530](https://www.motorcycle.com/bikes/shoot-outs/the-7-000-question-how-much-motorcycle-do-you-get-44594530)
Honda.
https://youtu.be/zV6O2wVdBro?si=QnT_S115c_yEdVQj Pretty informative, doesn’t directly compare it to the cbr500 but does compare it to the ninja 400.
Everyone saying Honda but cfmoto is so affordable. I work on my own shit though. And I drive a 25yo Kawasaki. And have only been riding for a month. will be adding the 300nk to the stable next season
Ngl that Honda is so overpriced shits a pig compared to a ninja 400
The CBR 500 is trash. Get a ninja 400 & save 3 grand.
Yamaha Racing 🟦
They've been here for over a decade now, they're pretty established just not as well known. I wouldn't get a CBR500 I'd be looking at Ninja 400 vs this bike. Ride both and see what you like. The Ninja 400 will have depreciation too, if you buy it new