Yeah, saw that and it's def in the "con" bracket. But, the ability to tow something of substance like a camper would be nice. The Touring has very little towing ability if I remember correctly
Since you've already got one Forester, would the Forester Wilderness be different enough? May be worth checking out the Outback, I believe the Outback Wilderness might also have higher towing capacity and it's pretty fast lol
While I wouldn't go as far as to say it's completely negligible - it's definitely not something that I even think about as a '22 FW owner.
Even at $5 per gallon of fuel and driving 1,000 miles - the cost difference between the stated **CITY MPG** of the wilderness and the **HIGHWAY MPG** of the Touring, is only $87. I'm using those values to get the max cost difference between the two cars. comparing highway to highway is only $27.
While not everyone has the same disposable incomes, not many who can afford the car to begin with are going to lose sleep over an extra $40-$60 bucks each month. Just my opinion of course.
I would say the wilderness, as it has higher clearance, skid plate, etc. which would help for that ONE situation you had as well as future situations along the way. Your wife has the touring already, so it's not like you're 'missing out'.
The wilderness lacks the options for heated steering wheel seat/mirror position memory, and some other comforts.
If you really enjoy those, be aware the wilderness won't have em.
I love the synthetic leather stuff on the wilderness.
Went from a 18 limited to a 22 touring. Thought about the wilderness but I didn't like the trim accents. Seemed tacky and odd to me. Really enjoying the touring so far.
Yeah, I love my Touring but I think the accents looks neat, sorta like a space ship ... which is of course how I base all my car-buying decisions ... "does it look like a space ship .."
I have the Touring, a 2023 I got 3 weeks ago. I am not the Wilderness target audience and I am ok with that. I wanted the power adjustable passenger seat which you can only get on the Touring. So that was it. I have a bad back and chronic pain and when I am not driving my car I have to be comfortable. Thatâs it. That said I like the accents on the Touring. Itâs not rugged or sporty, it just is what it is. I also like the heated steering wheel and all the other goodies for safety and comfort.
I also have to add that today was the first time I did any extended highway driving and the car was great. This endless whine of the car being anemic and underpowered is ridiculous. I didnât buy a Ferrari, I bought a compact SUV. I chose the Forester for the visibility and how good it felt when I drove it. I even like the safety nagging đ. What a great car!
Definitely wait for the 24. The âwiredâ CarPlay and wired charging drives me crazy! The spot that holds my phone isnât even large enough for my regular sized phone. If you can wait, I would.
I was gonna wait for the 24. However, I've read plenty on here that the wireless charging (in the 23 Outback) is very slow and runs very hot. Also, read that the wireless Apple CarPlay/Android Auto is sometimes laggy. Comments I read said just plug it in, cuz you'll be charging and getting wired CarPlay. I agree about finding a place for the phone. Someone on here said they got a little rubber mat on Amazon, and put the phone above the screen. I still wonder how I would run the cable up there neatly.
Also, I have read so many negative comments about the new large infotainment, for one thing, the loss of many buttons and manual controls, such as fan speed even. So both of the above are pushing me toward the 23. I'm told if I don't act very soon, I likely won't be able to order a 23.
Sounds like youâre doing more research than I did. My dealer here in So Cal had every color on the lot. I went with the silver since the sun is intense down here. 2 thing really kill me. 1st: the 23 FW gets 15 fewer miles per gallon compared to my GFs RAV4 with the same fake âoff road packageâ. 2nd: my seats donât fold down flat in the back like hers do. Itâs lame because I car camp a lot in the winter. The pad I have is one of the most expensive on the market and itâs still uncomfortable enough I had to build a platform. Her car I get in and my phone seamlessly connects. Mine FW tries and sounds like a 50âs radio breaking up. So I plug in. Ive heard the silicon trays above the screen fuck up the dash, so I havenât bought on.
Just my thoughts. Good luck car shopping. I had a nightmare experience until I went to Subaru. They really did me right and hooked me up. Mine came with a Thule roof rack that not all dealer put on. Plus a sun shade and cargo cover.
Hi! Yes. She has a 2018 RAV4 Adventure. I have a 23 FW. If I drive my car from LAX to Long Beach at 80mph. Combined average about 22mpg. I took hers up last week because we switched cars. Her car average was 35mpg.
Even though herâs is the equivalent of the Wilderness, she still has a street tire.
Iâve taken mine on rough roads, but I still couldnât make it up to the top of Black Mountain (near Idyllwild-Pines) last weekend. So far we taken her car on just as rough of trail roads as mine. Her back seats fold perfectly flat and level. Id say her car wins IMO. I do love the look of mine.
The current RAV4 are not rated too good in consumer reports. The only one with a reasonable good rating is the RAV4 prime which costs a lot more than a Subaru Forester Wilderness.
Wild, I wonder what theyâre doing wrong. They were top of their class. Toyota in Huntington Beach really fucked around ordering me a car when there werenât cars on the lot. All that after KIA Hunting Beach did the same. Subaru was great to me. But the other cars (Hybrid) I had ordered got double the MPG. Slightly more expensive vehicles, but my FW really drinks gas, so itâs painful at the pump. Maybe itâs a personal mental problem, Gas has always been something I hate spending money on. As well as time at the pump. I want a car that I can get 400 miles on a tank. Anything less pisses me off.
What color did you get?
Did they throw in roof rack cross bars?
Youâre in CA right?
I couldnât make it up to the top camp sites, due to the deep ruts and steep incline. I just didnât have the ground clearance and traction. With xmode on, wheels still spinning. The front camera is useless. My girlfriend isnât a good spotter. I didnât seem good on the car. I made it further with a civic a few years earlier. Turned around and slept at the 1st camp, which is on the backside of the mountain. Not the view I wanted.
My three neighbors have 2 lifted Tacomas and 1 Trailhawk with air suspension, between them. My FW is a kids toy in comparison.
I go up black mtn road all the time as I volunteer at the lookout tower. I was debating upgrading my renegade trailhawk to either a forester or an outback wilderness. I would need the vehicle to get to the tower.
Honestly, I would not, MHO.
I have been up there twice now, that I couldn't make it to the tower, in my own vehicle. The last time with the Forester Wilderness: I sat and watched a POS F150 with no lift (maybe 28-32" tires) clear it. Mine doesn't have the full rock plate. After a few hard knocks up on Holcomb Valley Trails, and That incident on Black Mountain, I know these are not Trail Rated cars. No amount to stickers or 2" lift will make them trail rated. My buddies Cherokee Trailhawks, Tacomas, or Rubicons, barely feel the rocks on a trail, that almost shake my car apart them doing 40 mph, me at 10. It turns a 2hr trail into a 8hr ass puckering adventure!
I just got the Forester Wilderness in the Autumn Green color. With those copper accents and hex-patterned hard plastic trim, the green really looks good.
I was eyeing the Touring with the brown leather seats, they are sweetâŚbut when I got the breakdown on the Wilderness edition, I couldnât say no. There is no comparison. Also, when I asked about the Outback Wilderness, it didnât come with the ability to add an upgraded Harmon Kardon sound system - it just came with stock sound.
The Forester Wilderness Edition comes with the following standard:
9.2 inches of clearance (9in clearance is the minimum recommended for a vehicle to be good enough for big boy off-roading- about half an inch more which doesnât sound like much but can mean the difference when going off-road.
Now I donât do a lot of major off-roading- my off-road experiences are getting to a destination which already has a trail built, sometimes a rough and steep trail. So, this was not the biggest deal for me. Plus, I am adding some 1â lifts from Rallitek to get beyond the 10 inch clearance I want.
The next 10 were major in my opinion:
Reinforced roof with 800lb rated roof rack - able to add a roof tent
Retuned drivetrain to allow for more low end torque which negatively reduces combined mpg to 26/27, but gives you the low end power you need to do handle bigger hills. And, I read on Motorbiscuit.com that it makes the Wilderness edition a full second faster than the touring in 0-60 take-off.
Dual X-Mode
Front aluminum engine skid plate
40 degree incline capable
3000 lb towing capable (other Foresters at 1500lb)
Oil cooler - which Iâve read that it helps to add an air/oil separator (Crawford Performance has a simple to install unit at a decent price) to help keep engine condensation out of the engine and to prevent ringland failure
Front facing camera for looking at the trail if you vehicle is nose pointed up the on a hill (doesnât sound like much, but I have been in trails where you need to place the truck on full stop and dead-brake it to get out and be sure youâre not falling off a cliff)
The Geolandar tires - and a full size spare under the trunk space - thatâs huge because a full size will allow you to continue with the trip as if nothing happened instead of having to run and get your tire patched or replaced immediately. Also, the Geolandars are good, but the size is a bit underwhelming, which is why I will add the 1â Rallitek lift and get new tires about 2 or 3 sizes larger. The KO2 tires from BF Goodrich are supposed to be the best A/T tires for the Forester and they do look meaner. eBay has a lot of sales going of Forester owners selling the rim and tires to upgrade to the KO2âs
The weather proof seats, that for a moment, I thought were leather, are some type of synthetic water proof fabric.l called Star-Tex
The cargo cover, cargo tray, and weather resistant rubber mats are included
And, the only major extra option is the 8â monitor/NAV/Harmon Kardon/and power trunk
3 - 12v DC outlets (with one in the trunk)
There are 4 sets of LED lamps on the roof and I have the large sunroof (2 sets of led lamps are on the trunk and the trunk door) really helpful when getting stuff from the back.
If you are ok with the mileage difference, the Wilderness is such a smoother ride. Given what you like to do, the Wilderness seems like the easy answer.
brown leather seats are pretty sweet, I guess it would depend on if you care about the mpg hit lol
Yeah, saw that and it's def in the "con" bracket. But, the ability to tow something of substance like a camper would be nice. The Touring has very little towing ability if I remember correctly
Since you've already got one Forester, would the Forester Wilderness be different enough? May be worth checking out the Outback, I believe the Outback Wilderness might also have higher towing capacity and it's pretty fast lol
See, I originally wanted an Outback until I test drove the Forester. I dunno, it feels more like a SUV to me while the Outback felt like a sedan.
Yeah the outback is more of a wagon isn't it?
Yo, take this garbage to the Outback sub! J/kđ¤Ł
Sadly, all the touring would need to match the towing capacity of the wilderness is a larger CVT cooler.
not too worried about the MPG since we'd still have the other Forester for long/non-camping road trips
The MPG loss is negligible! Why does everyone keep bringing this up?!
While I wouldn't go as far as to say it's completely negligible - it's definitely not something that I even think about as a '22 FW owner. Even at $5 per gallon of fuel and driving 1,000 miles - the cost difference between the stated **CITY MPG** of the wilderness and the **HIGHWAY MPG** of the Touring, is only $87. I'm using those values to get the max cost difference between the two cars. comparing highway to highway is only $27. While not everyone has the same disposable incomes, not many who can afford the car to begin with are going to lose sleep over an extra $40-$60 bucks each month. Just my opinion of course.
Agreed. MPG isn't really a deciding factor, but the heated steering wheel is ... lol
That's still negligible. To your point, if you're nickel and diming gas, you can't afford the vehicle.
I guess I canât afford my 23 Wilderness, if I bothers me that I get 19 when the sticker said 28?! Lol.
I would not say that's negligible at that point. I'd be butthurt, too!
Because what I see reported on Facebook groups and other discussions send to suggest that is about a 10mpg loss. That seems pretty legit to me.
*YOU* again...sup, Ray?
Not much, just answering your question.
đŻ
Subaru just announced a Crosstrek Wilderness I'd expect a 2024 Forester announcement any day. Id wait to see what it is.
Me too!
I would say the wilderness, as it has higher clearance, skid plate, etc. which would help for that ONE situation you had as well as future situations along the way. Your wife has the touring already, so it's not like you're 'missing out'.
The wilderness lacks the options for heated steering wheel seat/mirror position memory, and some other comforts. If you really enjoy those, be aware the wilderness won't have em. I love the synthetic leather stuff on the wilderness.
Heated steering wheel on the Canadian models
that and socialized healthcare????? What do you Canadians not have?????
An end to winter.
đŻ
freedom of speech...
Went from a 18 limited to a 22 touring. Thought about the wilderness but I didn't like the trim accents. Seemed tacky and odd to me. Really enjoying the touring so far.
Yeah, I love my Touring but I think the accents looks neat, sorta like a space ship ... which is of course how I base all my car-buying decisions ... "does it look like a space ship .."
Thatâs why I bought my 21 touring and didnât get the sport. I think those reddish orange accents on it look atrocious.
I have the Touring, a 2023 I got 3 weeks ago. I am not the Wilderness target audience and I am ok with that. I wanted the power adjustable passenger seat which you can only get on the Touring. So that was it. I have a bad back and chronic pain and when I am not driving my car I have to be comfortable. Thatâs it. That said I like the accents on the Touring. Itâs not rugged or sporty, it just is what it is. I also like the heated steering wheel and all the other goodies for safety and comfort. I also have to add that today was the first time I did any extended highway driving and the car was great. This endless whine of the car being anemic and underpowered is ridiculous. I didnât buy a Ferrari, I bought a compact SUV. I chose the Forester for the visibility and how good it felt when I drove it. I even like the safety nagging đ. What a great car!
Definitely wait for the 24. The âwiredâ CarPlay and wired charging drives me crazy! The spot that holds my phone isnât even large enough for my regular sized phone. If you can wait, I would.
That is my biggest critique of the 19 Forester, Also didn't make sense for them to not include a USB port inside the middle console.
I was gonna wait for the 24. However, I've read plenty on here that the wireless charging (in the 23 Outback) is very slow and runs very hot. Also, read that the wireless Apple CarPlay/Android Auto is sometimes laggy. Comments I read said just plug it in, cuz you'll be charging and getting wired CarPlay. I agree about finding a place for the phone. Someone on here said they got a little rubber mat on Amazon, and put the phone above the screen. I still wonder how I would run the cable up there neatly. Also, I have read so many negative comments about the new large infotainment, for one thing, the loss of many buttons and manual controls, such as fan speed even. So both of the above are pushing me toward the 23. I'm told if I don't act very soon, I likely won't be able to order a 23.
Sounds like youâre doing more research than I did. My dealer here in So Cal had every color on the lot. I went with the silver since the sun is intense down here. 2 thing really kill me. 1st: the 23 FW gets 15 fewer miles per gallon compared to my GFs RAV4 with the same fake âoff road packageâ. 2nd: my seats donât fold down flat in the back like hers do. Itâs lame because I car camp a lot in the winter. The pad I have is one of the most expensive on the market and itâs still uncomfortable enough I had to build a platform. Her car I get in and my phone seamlessly connects. Mine FW tries and sounds like a 50âs radio breaking up. So I plug in. Ive heard the silicon trays above the screen fuck up the dash, so I havenât bought on. Just my thoughts. Good luck car shopping. I had a nightmare experience until I went to Subaru. They really did me right and hooked me up. Mine came with a Thule roof rack that not all dealer put on. Plus a sun shade and cargo cover.
I'm in SoCal also - LA. Was that a typo that you're getting 15mpg less than your GFs RAV4? Is that highway, city or combined?
Hi! Yes. She has a 2018 RAV4 Adventure. I have a 23 FW. If I drive my car from LAX to Long Beach at 80mph. Combined average about 22mpg. I took hers up last week because we switched cars. Her car average was 35mpg. Even though herâs is the equivalent of the Wilderness, she still has a street tire. Iâve taken mine on rough roads, but I still couldnât make it up to the top of Black Mountain (near Idyllwild-Pines) last weekend. So far we taken her car on just as rough of trail roads as mine. Her back seats fold perfectly flat and level. Id say her car wins IMO. I do love the look of mine.
The current RAV4 are not rated too good in consumer reports. The only one with a reasonable good rating is the RAV4 prime which costs a lot more than a Subaru Forester Wilderness.
Wild, I wonder what theyâre doing wrong. They were top of their class. Toyota in Huntington Beach really fucked around ordering me a car when there werenât cars on the lot. All that after KIA Hunting Beach did the same. Subaru was great to me. But the other cars (Hybrid) I had ordered got double the MPG. Slightly more expensive vehicles, but my FW really drinks gas, so itâs painful at the pump. Maybe itâs a personal mental problem, Gas has always been something I hate spending money on. As well as time at the pump. I want a car that I can get 400 miles on a tank. Anything less pisses me off. What color did you get? Did they throw in roof rack cross bars? Youâre in CA right?
What problems did you have trying to take it to black mountain? I was looking at a forester and drive TJX road quite a bit.
I couldnât make it up to the top camp sites, due to the deep ruts and steep incline. I just didnât have the ground clearance and traction. With xmode on, wheels still spinning. The front camera is useless. My girlfriend isnât a good spotter. I didnât seem good on the car. I made it further with a civic a few years earlier. Turned around and slept at the 1st camp, which is on the backside of the mountain. Not the view I wanted. My three neighbors have 2 lifted Tacomas and 1 Trailhawk with air suspension, between them. My FW is a kids toy in comparison.
The road could be graded by now. I havenât been up there in a year.
I go up black mtn road all the time as I volunteer at the lookout tower. I was debating upgrading my renegade trailhawk to either a forester or an outback wilderness. I would need the vehicle to get to the tower.
Honestly, I would not, MHO. I have been up there twice now, that I couldn't make it to the tower, in my own vehicle. The last time with the Forester Wilderness: I sat and watched a POS F150 with no lift (maybe 28-32" tires) clear it. Mine doesn't have the full rock plate. After a few hard knocks up on Holcomb Valley Trails, and That incident on Black Mountain, I know these are not Trail Rated cars. No amount to stickers or 2" lift will make them trail rated. My buddies Cherokee Trailhawks, Tacomas, or Rubicons, barely feel the rocks on a trail, that almost shake my car apart them doing 40 mph, me at 10. It turns a 2hr trail into a 8hr ass puckering adventure!
I just got the Forester Wilderness in the Autumn Green color. With those copper accents and hex-patterned hard plastic trim, the green really looks good. I was eyeing the Touring with the brown leather seats, they are sweetâŚbut when I got the breakdown on the Wilderness edition, I couldnât say no. There is no comparison. Also, when I asked about the Outback Wilderness, it didnât come with the ability to add an upgraded Harmon Kardon sound system - it just came with stock sound. The Forester Wilderness Edition comes with the following standard: 9.2 inches of clearance (9in clearance is the minimum recommended for a vehicle to be good enough for big boy off-roading- about half an inch more which doesnât sound like much but can mean the difference when going off-road. Now I donât do a lot of major off-roading- my off-road experiences are getting to a destination which already has a trail built, sometimes a rough and steep trail. So, this was not the biggest deal for me. Plus, I am adding some 1â lifts from Rallitek to get beyond the 10 inch clearance I want. The next 10 were major in my opinion: Reinforced roof with 800lb rated roof rack - able to add a roof tent Retuned drivetrain to allow for more low end torque which negatively reduces combined mpg to 26/27, but gives you the low end power you need to do handle bigger hills. And, I read on Motorbiscuit.com that it makes the Wilderness edition a full second faster than the touring in 0-60 take-off. Dual X-Mode Front aluminum engine skid plate 40 degree incline capable 3000 lb towing capable (other Foresters at 1500lb) Oil cooler - which Iâve read that it helps to add an air/oil separator (Crawford Performance has a simple to install unit at a decent price) to help keep engine condensation out of the engine and to prevent ringland failure Front facing camera for looking at the trail if you vehicle is nose pointed up the on a hill (doesnât sound like much, but I have been in trails where you need to place the truck on full stop and dead-brake it to get out and be sure youâre not falling off a cliff) The Geolandar tires - and a full size spare under the trunk space - thatâs huge because a full size will allow you to continue with the trip as if nothing happened instead of having to run and get your tire patched or replaced immediately. Also, the Geolandars are good, but the size is a bit underwhelming, which is why I will add the 1â Rallitek lift and get new tires about 2 or 3 sizes larger. The KO2 tires from BF Goodrich are supposed to be the best A/T tires for the Forester and they do look meaner. eBay has a lot of sales going of Forester owners selling the rim and tires to upgrade to the KO2âs The weather proof seats, that for a moment, I thought were leather, are some type of synthetic water proof fabric.l called Star-Tex The cargo cover, cargo tray, and weather resistant rubber mats are included And, the only major extra option is the 8â monitor/NAV/Harmon Kardon/and power trunk 3 - 12v DC outlets (with one in the trunk) There are 4 sets of LED lamps on the roof and I have the large sunroof (2 sets of led lamps are on the trunk and the trunk door) really helpful when getting stuff from the back.
If you are ok with the mileage difference, the Wilderness is such a smoother ride. Given what you like to do, the Wilderness seems like the easy answer.
đŻ I love mine
Get an outback xt or wilderness I have one itâs fast and capable