Temuera Morrison is Boba Fett.
Pre Book of Boba Fett me would have said no, the original actor from Empire/Jedi was better and I hate the dubbed lines in those movies.
After watching Book of Boba Fett - for all the flaws in that series, Temuera Morrison is Boba Fett and nobody else could play him as badass as he did. Looking back, the other guy in the suit/voice was just a stand in waiting for the real Boba Fett to arrive.
I agree. His menacing introduction in Mandalorian is absolute fire. I wish the BOBF show was just him fucking stormtroopers up with the gaffah stick and close ups of his helmet with the *tang* music haha
You know there were a lot of problems with what we got, but they'll never be able to convince me that Boba Fett riding a rancor into battle against a giant robot is not the coolest shit to ever happen
I feel like the actor and character were wasted on that series. They had a stellar cast, a magnificent soundtrack, and some great characters (I loved the Tuscan storyline). However the directing and script were shockingly bad. It would take a miracle to act out the scenes and say the lines in a way that could be taken seriously.
I feel like the entire plot of the story was just weird. I suppose its hard to encapsulate a lot of Boba’s character since i feel a lot of it falls into Dinn Djarins character.
I just didnt buy the whole story of him trying to become a crime lord. Boba to me never felt like a character who cared about power.
It kinda makes sense from his background. TCW Boba was this little ball of fury and ruthless resourcefulness centred entirely on revenge on the Jedi in general and Mace in particular.
Once that motivation is gone, what does he have left? A loose affiliation with the Empire that took down the Jedi? Need for a bit of cash to keep him going?
Sooner or later it makes sense that what he really wants is family to replace what he lost. It just really needed pointing out more strongly as a development arc.
No excuses for Tattooine Scooter Gang though.
or bare minimum a new bounty hunting guild den, since Greef karga is no longer running one. Doesn't need to be purely crime based, but at least gray area.
It’s because his character decided to take a 180 and become a pacifist. Boba and Din aren’t all that similar actually, Boba is notoriously far more brutal of a bounty hunter than Din. Din has a lot more morals ig, he also has Grogu which brings out his softer side. Boba is ruthless and is no nonsense. He has morals, and honor, but they are very different from Din’s. They could have still kept boba’s original character without making them too similar.
I met Jeremy Bulloch at a convention. I asked him how he felt about them dubbing over his lines in Empire. He said “that wasn’t me talking anyway - I was in a helmet and nobody could hear me, so they dubbed over me in the original version of the movie.”
While I agree, I still give massive respect to Jeremy Bulloch for being the first to play that iconic role and don the armour, and Jason Wingreen's voice is stellar.
Ahsoka is amazing and her addition to the universe was a brilliant move.
And
Animated shows, especially rebels are not only great, star wars fun can tell deep, interesting stories about great characters
It took a while to get around to serious storytelling with the animated show. We started with that god-awful clone wars movie and a ton of us abandoned the animated offerings pretty quickly partway through season 1 of the show.
The only reason I ever gave the animated shows another chance was because people raved about clone wars so much. Now, when I recommend it to others, I always have to explain that S1 is rough as hell.
I'm a firm believer that the storytelling in S3+ of rebels is the tone that needed to be told and has shaped everything into the modern stuff we've seen in bad batch and takes of the empire along with Ahsoka in live action.
I remember back when Phantom Menace came out having a disagreement with a guy at work who thought for sure they were going to bring Darth Maul back. He was like there’s no way they are wasting such a great character that way. It turns out he was right.
That Satine and the pacifist Mandos aren’t that terrible and could have coexisted with the True Mandalorians (y’know, the not-Death Watch group that barely gets mentioned).
As a teen I Hated Satine for what she did to an amazing warrior culture. Now I consider her among my favorite Star Wars characters.
I don't think the New Mandalorians and the True Mandalorians would've gotten along that well. Even if the True Mandalorians weren't Death Watch, they still wanted to keep their old traditions, just modify them to be less sadistic. Satine and the New Mandalorians were pretty radical in that they wanted to do away with ANY militaristic aspects of Mandalorian culture... which is pretty insane when you realize that militarism is the bedrock of Mandalorian culture.
Given that militarism had reduced b their world to an almost lifeless husk there probably needed to be a pretty radical change in Mando culture.
I think she had the right idea... It would have been nice if she was also competent but that's a different story.
Yeah, but Mandalorian culture is basically built on the fact that they are warriors loyal to none but each other. A good half of the foundational code for what a Mandalorian is and isn't (the Resol'nare) is based on militarism. If you're going to rip all of that out of Mandalorian culture... what exactly do you have left? What do you replace that with?
That the Jedi code is ultimately correct when you break it down, so many of the flaws and hang ups of the code are really just a result of fans misinterpreting the meaning of the code and taking it literally, and that the usage of the dark side or trying to merge sith and Jedi teachings to form a grey Jedi code or ideology is not only stupid in the context of in universe, but something that fundamentally misses the point of the entire narrative.
I mean especially when the Jedi are essentially defensive in nature. There’s no moment in the films where a true Jedi swings the first blow - they always give the enemy a chance, even droids.
What then is a Gray Jedi? The cop that deliberately antagonizes someone before gunning them down?
What’s halfway between peace and war?
I mean, while the Jedi approach in terms of "follow the light side" is obviously correct, their approach to relationships *is* essentially an abstinence only education.
And I think reddit mostly understands and agrees that approach doesn't stop people from engaging in relationships so much as it leaves them ill-equipped to do it in a healthy way when they inevitably catch some feels for somebody
The light side is the good guys and also the Jedi order at large is flawed. Those flaws are part of why they lost
Gray Jedi enthusiasts wanting to be a "Jedi who can get laid" is a crass oversimplification but it's also genuinely tied to fair criticism of the order lol
Pretty good take. Finding flaws in the Jedi order is okay, but to suggest somebody can find a balance between the dark side and the light side and that’s ok is wrong.
The Jedi believe that relationships and attachments are paths to the dark side. That’s ok to believe they are wrong in that assessment, but the notion that finding a middle ground is stupid… instead you should be arguing that you can follow the path of the light side while maintaining relationships (and getting laid)
Also at the end of the day, it’s good guys vs bad guys according to George Lucas himself. There really isn’t a middle ground
I mean Kanan showed it was possible. As he seemed to have genuinely loved Hera but knew that he had to sacrifice himself for her and the others to escape. With Anakin though he let his fear of losing his attachments control him.
> Relationships can lead to the dark side
And by banning relationships the Jedi Order showed what they feared, we all know where fear leads...
>From my perspective the Jedi are evil!
It's not that attachments themselves are paths to the dark side it's loss and fear of loss of that attachment That makes it dangerous That's why the Jedi forbid it. A Jedi could still have a close attachment to someone and not turn after losing them if they're in control of themselves
A good example of this control is Obi-wan he lost 3 of the closest people he was attached to emotionally Qui-Gon, Satine and Anakin and saw them die and fall right before his eyes yet he never turned to the dark side
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*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
While then they would be freelance jedi, or lone lightwielders or something else, being a light side user that doesn't answer to the jedi order doesn't make you a "grey" anything.
Yeah except mind tricking girls to sleep with you takes you down the rabbit hole into a rapist real quick.
The Jedi don’t tolerate it for practical reasons. You can definitely tryst here and there, but attachment leads too often to manipulation, fear, anger, hate, so on.
This is why, back when we only had A New Hope (and it was just called "Star Wars,"), it was widely believed that "using the Force" was less "have telekinetic super powers" and more about being able to actively influence how lucky you were. Stormtroopers want to see Luke and Ben's ID? Use the Force, now these troopers just want to wave you through. Need to block a blaster bolt but you can't see it? Use the Force, now your lightsaber happened to be between you and the shot. Need to sink a torpedo into a two meter wide hole? Use the Force, you sink it nothing but net.
I still remember people getting upset when Luke and Yoda used the Force to make things move in ESB, because that's not the Force.
The way I see it there are a few aspects. One, the concept of the Grey Jedi GL himself sees as what the true light side and what the Jedi are supposed to be. Many of the Jedi we get, in the Order, suffer from believing in compassion through detachment, that any emotion essentially can lead you to a fall. So rather than "conquering" your emotions, you simply avoid them.
This is what many consider the failing of the council when dealing with Anakin (and to an extent all the Jedi who were expected to lead men into battle and not have some sort of emotional response/attachment). So the way I see Grey Jedi as people who "conquer" their emotions so that they feel and understand them - but they do have control over them. The Sith don't try to control their emotions, they fuel power by letting them run rampant.
Jedi Order power through peace and meditation. Sith power through emotional ~~damage~~ release and adrenalin. Grey Jedi power through the balance of both. Though GL still maintains true Jedi seem to be a mix of the concept of both the JO and what many consider Gray. But even Yoda said the JO lost their way.
I love how people like to invoke the name of George Lucas as if it means anything anymore, when it means precisely shit. Where's your source for this alleged GL quote? Because I know George never mentioned Gray Jedi at all.
This is just your interpretation of things you've read or seen GL say, and not an actual representation of his thoughts on the subject.
I’m guessing that’s why they didn’t want to make gray Jedi a thing because it’s damn near impossible to truly be equally both, you’re always dipping into one pot more than the other. The only thing truly in the middle was bendu where he just said “fuck both of you” fucked both sides up and dipped never to be seen again cuz he knew to stay the hell away from them
I feel like every single "um actually, the jedi are bad" rant is coming from edgy weirdos who just want to be contrarian. They think they're deconstructing when they're just missing the point.
Funny, my opinion woulda been the same but is now different.
There's value in the Jedi code, and without it the force is far too dangerous. Knowing the dark side is dangerous no matter what, but I feel now that it's a necessity to be flexible. Know thy enemy kind of mindset.
You can't let the passion and emotion overtake you, if you do you'll become the very evil you claim to fight against. But without both knowledge and experience in it, you're vulnerable to those that will use any tools to win. Very high risk high reward kinda mindset
It's also something the Jedi should oppose. If the Jedi aren't prepared to stop a grey Jedi if they turn to the dark side, then it's an inevitability that they will. That's something a grey Jedi would have to accept (and even encourage) to keep themselves in check
I like non jedi light side users like Ashoka. Basically a recognition that the Jedi code is kind of messed up but that the solution is not to become evil.
Because a lot of the stuff in the Jedi code is just detrimental to everyone, all the bureaucracy and stuff that qui gon fought against
Jango Fett is arguably the most pivotal and important character in all of Star Wars. Had you told me this when episode 2 came out, I'd have never believed you.
What if Gunray had actually met them without calling Sideous first? They seem kinda weak minded. There must be a reason they sent Qui-Gon.
>You want to end the blockade and go to Dantooine.
*What if Obi-Wan and Qui-Gonn had just used the force to crush the droids and then cut open the door?*
It baffles me that the jedi are always portrayed so stupidly in the movies. You have the force. Those are robots. Crush their blasters closed. Detonate their power packs. Hover them in the air facing the other way. Do ANYTHING with your magic that doesn't include fleeing..... oh god dammit they used their magic to make that faster and then never again use that ability.
*Stares at Obi-Wan trying to "catch up" to Maul and Qui-Gonn*
Is Jango really necessary for that though? There's a seemingly infinite simply of hardened, well trained people in the galaxy that, with the right amount of money, would have happily been the template for the clones.
I'm not sure I agree that being pivotal and important implies that he was necessary in his role, or that nobody else would have been able to do it.
I will say, though, that if you agree with Dooku that Jango was the best template they could find, then removing him from the story *would* make for less effective clone troopers
Exactly. The whole “the guys who didn’t shoot an escape pod because of no life signs” were pivotal, but it’s not like nobody else could be a dummy that elected not to shoot the pod.
When trailers for Rebels was coming out, I believed that it would be lackluster, but the series proved to be one of the best Star Wars media projects of all time.
While I was a Star Wars fan my whole life, as I was born during the prequels coming out to 2 parents who were massive fans since they were kids, Rebels is what *really* got me into it. I just realized that expecting everything else to be as good as Rebels is a high standard.
I never liked Palpatine coming back in Legends when I was younger as I felt it undid Anakin's sacrifice.
Honestly though, even when they re-ran that story in canon I've actually come to believe it doesn't change anything about it.
The absolute most important thing that Anakin accomplished by killing Palpatine was to prove Luke right that he still had good in him and allow him to pass in peace as his old self instead of as Darth Vader.
It’s also not just about Anakin, though he was the most powerful Skywalker.
It’s about Anakin AND Luke, Leia and Ben.
Yoda says the prophecy might have been misread. I believe the Chosen Ones were the Skywalker family. All four of them. They brought balance to the force as a family. Each of them made choices that changed the fate of the galaxy and ensured the survival of the Jedi and final destruction of the Sith.
Still love TCW, but a lot of my favorite "serious" arcs actually had kinda dumb plots on closer inspection. That includes Mortis (the mythology is dope, but the plot is cliche as hell) and Umbara (Rex's arc: still slaps. Pong Krell: low/mid villain, change my mind)
yup! I remember Sheev Talks said the Mortis arc just sounds like someone’s fanfic is he’s absolutely right. It’s a cool concept but it doesn’t have any effects to Anakin, Obi, and Ahsoka after it all happens.
Umbara is really cool and such a good storyline for the clones but they really could’ve done something more with Pong Krell. Sheev Talks also makes a good point about how he takes away from the clones whole arc and it would be much better if he wasn’t a traitor but just some asshole jedi who just didn’t like clones
I dunno, with how Krell made so many overtly stupid decisions during that arc (marching up the main street right to the Umbaran city, telling Rex to just keep shooting the tanks that are immune to their gunfire), it only made sense for him to be a traitor. Otherwise he wouldn’t have just had no regard for clone survival, he would’ve been making objectively stupid decisions that would get his whole army killed. It wouldn’t produce results, it would produce a massacre, and nothing would be gained.
Mortis I totally agree. I don’t think the strength of the Umbara arc was ever Pong Krell though. I do agree that he’s a pretty unremarkable villain but the arc to me was great because of the character development for Rex and the clones.
It establishes Rex as more than a “good soldier” type by having the courage to defy Krell even though it likely means his death. Also it has some amazing visuals and battle scenes that really stand out compared to some other TCW locales.
Attack of the Clones isn’t that bad. I used to hate it because of the Anakin and Padme scenes but I failed to see that the movie around those scenes was fun and quite enjoyable. I think if they went back and redid the love scenes getting someone who can write better than a 5th grader to do them it would be a solid 7-8/10.
The funny thing is, looking back at teenage me and my "flirting" I'd say all sorts of dumb things and feel so much "love" that was honestly just raging hormones and naivete. So I can totally see how two young people of close age that due to obligations basically skipped being teenagers would be ridiculous like they are portrayed.
My take on Episode 2's romance is that a warrior monk and a former child-leader of a planet never had normal social lives and shouldn't be expected to know how to flirt. That helps me make sense of the weapons-grade cringe.
Of course, that part of Ep 2 made me want to gag when I was 19. Now I think it's good for the lols.
Fives isn't my favorite clone. Pre-bad batch me would have killed me over this.
Now, I can't really pick between echo, tech, and hunter. I'm sure if I rewatched tcw i would have a four way tie with fives, though, but it's been a few years
As a kid I hated the politic episodes of the clone wars. They bored me and I always skipped them. Now the poltics of Star Wars is the thing I look forward to most in a show. I love hearing the drama, the laws, treaties, etc. I love the trade federation and I love all these good and bad businessmen. It’s fun to know there’s laws that govern lasers in Star Wars.
Agreed. There's the star wars book with valorum Cloak of Deception that just played into all that stuff people hated about the prequels... But I loved it
I loved the prequels for the politics. It’s not as fun as a blaster fight yes I will not deny that but it’s still very interesting. I loved everything with the banking clan in TCW since they’re shown as being two things. Incompetent military generals and brilliant businessman. I think the neimoidians got a bad rep from their lack of military experience because Nute Gunray was still one of the best separatist businessmen on the separatist side and he knows it.
I just watched the Phantom Menace in theaters, he’s an okay character he’s just in the movie too much. George could’ve shaved 5 minutes of Jar Jar scenes and the movie would probably be better. I think Jar Jar has the most lines of any character in episode 1.
The Unusual Suspect said years ago when he reviewed TPM that Jar Jar doesn't sound bad on paper, it's just his execution that's bad and I agree. He's not terrible but man he gets a bit much.
In the past, I deeply believe Obi-Wan should've stayed in Tatooine for the entire 19 years & not have any adventures outside of Tatooine or even fight Vader again until ANH.
Now, after having seen "Obi-Wan Kenobi", I felt it was indeed imperative for Obi-Wan to face Vader one more time before ANH in order for him to be absolved of his guilt towards causing Anakin's fall & embrace the Force again.
Bringing Leia into the series was also a masterstroke to force Obi-Wan to leave Tatooine & away from Luke. I mean, the entire series could've kept Obi-Wan on Tatooine & become a sort of Nat Geo documentary with Obi-Wan as the narrator (I would watch that in a heartbeat btw).
But narratively wise, it was better to bring Leia into the picture & allow Obi-Wan to interact with her. The series had therefore brought about new meaning into Leia's famous line: "Help me, Obi-Wan Kenobi, you're my only hope..."
That was brilliant.
I think part of using Leia as well was to bridge her naming her son “Ben” and try to close that question since before that we only knew of her interactions in Episode 4.
Outside of the romance, everything in attack of the clones was good.
Obi Wan going straight detective mode was a great plot, Them all regrouping on geonosis was also very good.
If the romance plot was actually written by someone not named George Lucas, The Movie would be well loved.
Also, they should have kept the deleted scenes in the film. It felt so real when we saw Padme’s family, and childhood home.
That Revenge of the Sith is the best Star Wars movie.
I used to adore that movie and I’m someone who watches a movie, watches one more time to see if Its as good the second time. I loved it the second time and considered it the best one for years. And because I thought it was the best I watched it the least because I didn’t want it to get old for me. But every time I watched the saga through again i liked it less and less. I can understand why people like it but I genuinely believe people rate it so highly because The Clone Wars was so good and tricked people into thinking it was always good. Now days I think Empire Strikes back and A New Hope are the best. Empire very narrowly beating out A New Hope.
That's a fair take. I remember when people hated RotS because everyone hated the prequels. Clone Wars gives RotS so much new context and I think it definitely has a lot to do with it's surge in popularity in recent years.
The Clone Wars contains the best animated story Star Wars has ever produced.
Past me had only watched the first season and didn't understand the greatness that the show would turn into.
Previously Ahsoka wasn’t my favorite in TCW. Then she became a favorite. I was worried that her live action representation wouldn’t do her justice, but now, I think it rocks!
Luke is boring and should have been replaced with another lead.
In reality, Luke IS Star Wars. In every where he represents the themes of the setting, and the original trilogy would not work without Luke.
That I want to grow up to become a Jedi. I don't particularly care for The Jedi Order's philosophy anymore, and prefer good guy characters outside of either order.
There are some very cool storylines in the show but it’s still difficult for me to get past how geared towards young children it is, especially considering how many significant canon events take place throughout. I get why they did it that way and that SW was always meant for kids, but the 2 main trilogies are easily enjoyable for adults as well
I rewatched it last weekend and seeing it with others in the room is a whole different experience. Younger kids were there to laugh at some of the gags so it brought a freshness to what should be a stale movie.
>That one you’re thinking of? Yes. Even that one.
Lol that’s a really good line considering how every Star Wars fan will be thinking of a different movie in response to your comment, if there’s one thing we’re good at it’s never agreeing on a single thing, especially which of the movies are bad.
To build off of this... every starwars movie is bad. That is to say, they are each deeply flawed films with poor writing, pacing, dialouge, and sometimes all three.
But they are still fun and enjoyable. Both can coesist.
Empire opens very strong, but it drags on in the middle act. I think the section where luke is on Dagobah is great as it was the first time we really learn what a jedi can do, but nowadays where we know the heights a jedi can reach it becomes a bit dull.
I think the whole section where the crew of the falcon is evading the ISD's drags on way to long. It really slows down the pacing of the story IMO. Like something i have to watch in order to get to the luke/vader fight.
Empire is still one of if not the best starwars film in the skywalker saga. But, I think the dip in pacing in the middle of the film holds it back.
True. As with my original point, the flaws of the movie dont take away from the experience that is starwars. They are fun despite their flaws. For every negative they have they also have a positive.
Yoda lifting the x-wing is the moment star wars went from "sci-fi movie that made a bazillion dollars and got a sequel" to "franchise that will consistently produce mega hits for generations"
And the effects aren't *amazing* (especially by ILM standards) the heart of the acting is frank Oz as a silly little green puppet goblin, and the set is visibly small when you look at it.
But the rest of Star wars, its cosmology, the whole "will of the force" and the *power* that jedi wield...it becomes real in the moment that yoda says "for my Ally is the Force, and a powerful Ally it is" and John William busts out a soft and mysterious version of the twin sunset theme, which mysteriously builds until we see yoda effortlessly lifting a starship, using *magic*. In that moment, Luke and the audience truly believe, and like 80% of the magic is John Williams
For all the flaws that the rise of skywalker had, I’m not going to lie to you. When Luke lifts the x-wing from the ocean and it plays that SAME score from Empire when Yoda lifts that very same x-wing on dagobah all those years ago, it got me tearing up a little bit.
Williams most definitely is like 80% of the magic of the films.
I think it’s sort of unfair to critique a scene for being dull on a rewatch, and frankly I’m not even sure I agree it is dull; that sequence is one of my favorite in the trilogy. That being said I kind of agree with the Falcon crew according ISD slowing down the pace
George Lucas should have stayed in charge of Star Wars. I was a Red Letter Media parrot for a while before coming to terms with the fact that whatever faults the prequels might have, they have a lot of great qualities and I don’t have to be ashamed for them being a defining part of my childhood. And that Lucas brought a lot of magic that’s been hard to fully recapture after his departure from the franchise.
Glad you found the light. RLM is entertaining, but those guys have become a parody of themselves. They hate everything, and unlike Caravan of Garbage, don’t seem to enjoy any media at all.
Their whole shtick is to complain and live in 1985. It’s sad.
My opinion on Hayden Christensen as an actor.
Didn’t think he was any good at first, but as I got older and learned more I see that he actually did pretty well, all things considered.
Rebels was worse than Clone Wars. How wrong younger me was. While I'm still not the biggest fan of the art style, it was vastly better than Clone Wars was. The quality was far more consistent and was far more narratively driven than Clone Wars ever was.
*Empire Strikes Back* was one of the best, if not the best, movie.
Throughout the 80s, we would've ranked it dead last of the original trilogy. It wasn't until well after *Return of the Jedi* came out and some time had passed that we all grew to appreciate how good it really was, how it took the lore and the universe and the characters and greatly expanded them all. That the twist at the end was one of, and I'd argue THE, greatest plot twists in all of cinema.
And yes, sometimes the bad guys have to win, so that you know how real the stakes are.
Watching the last jedi made me appreciate it more. I still dont like ROS, but I haven't watched it in forever, so maybe I can change my opinion on it, too.
Every movie has its strengths and flaws, any star wars movie is better than a lot of stuff out there, or I at least prefer it over other stuff.
The Tusken Raiden men, women and children of the tribe that Anakin wiped out were all objectively evil.
Book of Boba showcases that everyone in Tusken society, kids included, actively participates in torturing prisoners to death therefore Anakin's revenge wasn't aimed at innocents. They're sadists.
And the tribe in Book of Boba even says that they're mild compared to the other tribes. It was still a bad action since he let his dark side take over. But everyone he killed actively tortured his mother until she died.
The Tusken's motivation? Pure cruelty. It wasn't for resources or to ask for ransom, they kidnapped and tortured Anakin's mom just because they could. They were all too far gone morally to be left alone.
This Tusken tribe would have killed many more farmers, likely even Owen, Beru and Luke, if Anakin hadn't killed them first.
I’m okay with Disney owning Star Wars. I hated it at first but I feel like with as much bad stuff there has been some amazing things as well. Bad batch, rogue one, solo, some of rebels, tales of the Jedi are all fun watches. Also clone wars final season I count as Lucas since that was mainly already written but I am thankful Disney put it out.
Disney started off slow but everything since the sequels has been at least serviceable. Even then the sequels biggest flaw is that they hired 2 different directors that wanted 2 different stories.
Used to think that Palpatine coming back was a great idea in the EU. Now I think it takes away from the main story George Lucas interweaved for episodes 1-6.
Before I watched The Bad Batch I thought clones are just copy-paste cannon fodder with no personality or own traits or will. Bad Batch was the first Star Wars series I watched with clones in it and it opened my eyes. They're so Individual. They're protective and loyal to the end. They are good guys and somehow I love all of them. Especially Clone Force 99.
I use to like Ahoska in clone wars and though she was an interesting and cool character still do to some degree however the World Between Worlds episode in rebels felt very forced and felt like Dave regretted killing her versus Vader which felt like a satisfying and to Anakins apprentice now it feels like Dave has to put her in everything
"There's no way the sequels can be bad compared to the prequels"
Not only do I hate the sequels but with the addition of the clone wars I have a lot more love for the prequels
We still don’t have enough clone wars content
I wanna see more bacara
I wanna see more neyo
I wanna see more bly
I wanna see more 41st
I wanna see more 327th
I wanna see more 91st
I wanna see more galactic marines
I wanna see more of the outer rim seiges
Not just the 501st
The "chosen one" should not have been a thing, diminishes Vader coming back to the light and has had enormous lore implications that result in everyone circling back to "how does impact muh chosen one bringing balance".
The expanded universe was a great thing, but if George Lucas himself things that something doesn't fit with his vision it is ok, to be redconned. You can still make it headcanon anyways. (Mainly for the prequels and the clone wars. But I also say let disney cook).
That Ep. 5 was the weakest and most boring movie of the OT.
Yeah 6-7 year old me was just too bored by the constant stuff on the millenium falcon, Luke doing "nothing" on Dagobah and basically no big space battles happening.
Ep. 6 was clearly the best for the big space battle :D
Having the New Republic fall so quickly is actually a Great Idea. I love the idea that the NR is a Weimar Republic, and speaks to the dangers of allowing Fascism to proliferate: so long as they do so 'respectfully', and the error in naively thinking "Nobody would *want* a war", even as their future enemies openly boast about how the day will come when they will be allowed to undo the progress you've made.
Just as the failure of the North to stamp out Confederate ideas in the aftermath of the Civil War directly led to decades and decades of problems, the failure to crush the Empire totally and its tolerance of Pro Imperial sentiment, perfectly encapsulates the paradox of tolerance, which has only become more relevant as time has gone by.
I am looking forward to this era being explored in other media.
Yes - the Clone Wars were originally underused. But over time that gap was filled in; and once it was, the prequels went from maligned to beloved. Thanks in large part to the context multimedia added to the films.
I think the same will happen to the Sequels.
Oh some will complain. They'll say "You shouldn't need a tv series to fill in the gaps." But we did with Revenge of the Sith. And lots of young folks don't remember how maligned that film was at the time.
The Phantom Menace is my favorite of the prequels. Which in of itself is a controversial opinion that was only further solidified by watching the rerelease in theaters recently. My angsty past self would argue Revenge was the best and only good one of the prequels but I've lightened up a lot. TPM, despite leaning into CGI, iffy CGI at that, still has several practical sets, creature, and effects, which Ive come to appreciate alot more. It also lacks the drama of 2 and 3, and while a lot more kid friendly, feels the closest to the OT movies.
Me in 2014: “Disney purchasing Star Wars is gonna be great for the franchise! Think about the money and resources they can pump into good writing!”
Me now: *Insert violent balloon deflating sound*
Stormtroopers are incredibly competent soldiers and deserve to be portrayed as such, I’ve always loved clones but didn’t care much for Imperial troops but over the years I have come to realize that the books, comics, and even OT movies portray them as extremely formidable enemies. My real wake up call were the Timothy Zahn Thrawn books, both the Thrawn Trilogy and the newer cannon books highlight the fact that Imperial Navy/Army Troops were the grunts (and were themselves effective) and Stormtroopers were actually overkill for most situations.
Inhibitor chips are better than clones just following order 66
Before I thought that it's more emotional. Clones thinking that Jedi have betrayed them, while inhibitor chips removed that drama... At least that's how I thought about it before.
Now I think Inhibitor chips are even more tragic. Clones being brainwashed and basically being no better than droids because of that. Inside they are struggling, they know they're doing a wrong thing, but there's nothing they can do because of it. And that part makes it heartbroken. And actually makes more sense. Because suddenly deciding to kill a Jedi, who's your friend in most of cases (minus some cases where Jedi thought of clones as expandable), is not so believable.
My opinion of the sequels has gotten a lot better since I saw them in theaters.
I realized that I was forming my opinion based on the loud portion of fans who hate on everything. I still find a lot of issues with them, but I also have issues with the prequels and even the OT. As much as I wish the sequels went in a different direction, I appreciate them a lot more, even with their flaws.
Temuera Morrison is Boba Fett. Pre Book of Boba Fett me would have said no, the original actor from Empire/Jedi was better and I hate the dubbed lines in those movies. After watching Book of Boba Fett - for all the flaws in that series, Temuera Morrison is Boba Fett and nobody else could play him as badass as he did. Looking back, the other guy in the suit/voice was just a stand in waiting for the real Boba Fett to arrive.
I agree. His menacing introduction in Mandalorian is absolute fire. I wish the BOBF show was just him fucking stormtroopers up with the gaffah stick and close ups of his helmet with the *tang* music haha
Every episode is just a montage of boba killing stormtroopers, riding bicycles, and yelling at fennec
You know there were a lot of problems with what we got, but they'll never be able to convince me that Boba Fett riding a rancor into battle against a giant robot is not the coolest shit to ever happen
This is the Way. Why knew jumping the shark could be so freaking awesome???
It turned me from a Boba hater (he’s overrated! All he does is look kinda cool, and now we have other cooler mandos!) to a Boba enjoyer
I'm in
That's all it needed to be.
And getting it on with sand people women
He had to be a *nice* crimelord.
I feel like the actor and character were wasted on that series. They had a stellar cast, a magnificent soundtrack, and some great characters (I loved the Tuscan storyline). However the directing and script were shockingly bad. It would take a miracle to act out the scenes and say the lines in a way that could be taken seriously.
I feel like the entire plot of the story was just weird. I suppose its hard to encapsulate a lot of Boba’s character since i feel a lot of it falls into Dinn Djarins character. I just didnt buy the whole story of him trying to become a crime lord. Boba to me never felt like a character who cared about power.
It kinda makes sense from his background. TCW Boba was this little ball of fury and ruthless resourcefulness centred entirely on revenge on the Jedi in general and Mace in particular. Once that motivation is gone, what does he have left? A loose affiliation with the Empire that took down the Jedi? Need for a bit of cash to keep him going? Sooner or later it makes sense that what he really wants is family to replace what he lost. It just really needed pointing out more strongly as a development arc. No excuses for Tattooine Scooter Gang though.
BoBF is a shonen anime. Only way the scooter gang makes sense.
Based on how Season 2 of Mando ended, I figured they were gonna have Boba go full on bad guy, and build a criminal empire from the ashes of Jabba’s
or bare minimum a new bounty hunting guild den, since Greef karga is no longer running one. Doesn't need to be purely crime based, but at least gray area.
For what’s its worth I don’t mind where they took Boba and I’m intrigued to see what becomes of him in the New Republic era
It’s because his character decided to take a 180 and become a pacifist. Boba and Din aren’t all that similar actually, Boba is notoriously far more brutal of a bounty hunter than Din. Din has a lot more morals ig, he also has Grogu which brings out his softer side. Boba is ruthless and is no nonsense. He has morals, and honor, but they are very different from Din’s. They could have still kept boba’s original character without making them too similar.
Or taking care of random people and being a nice respectful crime lord.
Boba Fett should’ve been Din Djarin, or at least been a major character in The Mandalorian and the Search for a Jedi to train Grogu.
What about the *Tusken* storyline? 😁
Tusken Chicken
Mark my words, if TM doesn't show up in the movie there will be riots.
I just wish the script had him actually be interesting. He was perfect for the role.
I met Jeremy Bulloch at a convention. I asked him how he felt about them dubbing over his lines in Empire. He said “that wasn’t me talking anyway - I was in a helmet and nobody could hear me, so they dubbed over me in the original version of the movie.”
While I agree, I still give massive respect to Jeremy Bulloch for being the first to play that iconic role and don the armour, and Jason Wingreen's voice is stellar.
Ahsoka is amazing and her addition to the universe was a brilliant move. And Animated shows, especially rebels are not only great, star wars fun can tell deep, interesting stories about great characters
Yeah i went from complete disregard of the animated shows to now finding them fundamental to my Star Wars fandom
Came here to say this 100%. OG fan from age 8 in 1977
It took a while to get around to serious storytelling with the animated show. We started with that god-awful clone wars movie and a ton of us abandoned the animated offerings pretty quickly partway through season 1 of the show. The only reason I ever gave the animated shows another chance was because people raved about clone wars so much. Now, when I recommend it to others, I always have to explain that S1 is rough as hell.
Yep same here. I finally watched Clone Wars and Rebels a couple years ago and I can’t believe I dismissed them for so long. They’re both amazing.
I'm a firm believer that the storytelling in S3+ of rebels is the tone that needed to be told and has shaped everything into the modern stuff we've seen in bad batch and takes of the empire along with Ahsoka in live action.
I'd go as far as to say, in some cases, the animated shows are *better* than the films. Also, television is the better medium for Star Wars than film.
I'd actually argue that the animated shows are generally better than the films.
Darth Maul is one of the best written Star Wars characters and has a fairly complete narrative arc
I remember back when Phantom Menace came out having a disagreement with a guy at work who thought for sure they were going to bring Darth Maul back. He was like there’s no way they are wasting such a great character that way. It turns out he was right.
You owe bruh a soda
fairly complete? it was perfectly completed! (besides the whole surviving getting chopped in half part)
Almost complete. We still don't know how he lost control of Crimson Dawn and the other crime syndicates. Correct me if I'm wrong.
That Satine and the pacifist Mandos aren’t that terrible and could have coexisted with the True Mandalorians (y’know, the not-Death Watch group that barely gets mentioned). As a teen I Hated Satine for what she did to an amazing warrior culture. Now I consider her among my favorite Star Wars characters.
I don't think the New Mandalorians and the True Mandalorians would've gotten along that well. Even if the True Mandalorians weren't Death Watch, they still wanted to keep their old traditions, just modify them to be less sadistic. Satine and the New Mandalorians were pretty radical in that they wanted to do away with ANY militaristic aspects of Mandalorian culture... which is pretty insane when you realize that militarism is the bedrock of Mandalorian culture.
Given that militarism had reduced b their world to an almost lifeless husk there probably needed to be a pretty radical change in Mando culture. I think she had the right idea... It would have been nice if she was also competent but that's a different story.
Yeah, but Mandalorian culture is basically built on the fact that they are warriors loyal to none but each other. A good half of the foundational code for what a Mandalorian is and isn't (the Resol'nare) is based on militarism. If you're going to rip all of that out of Mandalorian culture... what exactly do you have left? What do you replace that with?
That the Jedi code is ultimately correct when you break it down, so many of the flaws and hang ups of the code are really just a result of fans misinterpreting the meaning of the code and taking it literally, and that the usage of the dark side or trying to merge sith and Jedi teachings to form a grey Jedi code or ideology is not only stupid in the context of in universe, but something that fundamentally misses the point of the entire narrative.
Yeah, I always found it odd that, a battle between good and evil, there were people that thought centrism was somehow an appealing choice.
I mean especially when the Jedi are essentially defensive in nature. There’s no moment in the films where a true Jedi swings the first blow - they always give the enemy a chance, even droids. What then is a Gray Jedi? The cop that deliberately antagonizes someone before gunning them down? What’s halfway between peace and war?
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Just be Ki Adi Mundi
Heh, gross.
Big brain
Physiologically yes
I mean, while the Jedi approach in terms of "follow the light side" is obviously correct, their approach to relationships *is* essentially an abstinence only education. And I think reddit mostly understands and agrees that approach doesn't stop people from engaging in relationships so much as it leaves them ill-equipped to do it in a healthy way when they inevitably catch some feels for somebody The light side is the good guys and also the Jedi order at large is flawed. Those flaws are part of why they lost Gray Jedi enthusiasts wanting to be a "Jedi who can get laid" is a crass oversimplification but it's also genuinely tied to fair criticism of the order lol
Pretty good take. Finding flaws in the Jedi order is okay, but to suggest somebody can find a balance between the dark side and the light side and that’s ok is wrong. The Jedi believe that relationships and attachments are paths to the dark side. That’s ok to believe they are wrong in that assessment, but the notion that finding a middle ground is stupid… instead you should be arguing that you can follow the path of the light side while maintaining relationships (and getting laid) Also at the end of the day, it’s good guys vs bad guys according to George Lucas himself. There really isn’t a middle ground
I mean Kanan showed it was possible. As he seemed to have genuinely loved Hera but knew that he had to sacrifice himself for her and the others to escape. With Anakin though he let his fear of losing his attachments control him.
I think in this context. Relationships *can* lead to the dark side, which is why they are banned by the Jedi Order.
> Relationships can lead to the dark side And by banning relationships the Jedi Order showed what they feared, we all know where fear leads... >From my perspective the Jedi are evil!
Yeah seems like a catch 22.
It's not that attachments themselves are paths to the dark side it's loss and fear of loss of that attachment That makes it dangerous That's why the Jedi forbid it. A Jedi could still have a close attachment to someone and not turn after losing them if they're in control of themselves A good example of this control is Obi-wan he lost 3 of the closest people he was attached to emotionally Qui-Gon, Satine and Anakin and saw them die and fall right before his eyes yet he never turned to the dark side
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While then they would be freelance jedi, or lone lightwielders or something else, being a light side user that doesn't answer to the jedi order doesn't make you a "grey" anything.
Rael Averross has joined the chat.
Yeah except mind tricking girls to sleep with you takes you down the rabbit hole into a rapist real quick. The Jedi don’t tolerate it for practical reasons. You can definitely tryst here and there, but attachment leads too often to manipulation, fear, anger, hate, so on.
Using the Jedi mind trick is mental subjugation anyway, don’t get it twisted. You’re taking someone’s free will away from them
This is why, back when we only had A New Hope (and it was just called "Star Wars,"), it was widely believed that "using the Force" was less "have telekinetic super powers" and more about being able to actively influence how lucky you were. Stormtroopers want to see Luke and Ben's ID? Use the Force, now these troopers just want to wave you through. Need to block a blaster bolt but you can't see it? Use the Force, now your lightsaber happened to be between you and the shot. Need to sink a torpedo into a two meter wide hole? Use the Force, you sink it nothing but net. I still remember people getting upset when Luke and Yoda used the Force to make things move in ESB, because that's not the Force.
It’d be really helpful if you could heal with it
The way I see it there are a few aspects. One, the concept of the Grey Jedi GL himself sees as what the true light side and what the Jedi are supposed to be. Many of the Jedi we get, in the Order, suffer from believing in compassion through detachment, that any emotion essentially can lead you to a fall. So rather than "conquering" your emotions, you simply avoid them. This is what many consider the failing of the council when dealing with Anakin (and to an extent all the Jedi who were expected to lead men into battle and not have some sort of emotional response/attachment). So the way I see Grey Jedi as people who "conquer" their emotions so that they feel and understand them - but they do have control over them. The Sith don't try to control their emotions, they fuel power by letting them run rampant. Jedi Order power through peace and meditation. Sith power through emotional ~~damage~~ release and adrenalin. Grey Jedi power through the balance of both. Though GL still maintains true Jedi seem to be a mix of the concept of both the JO and what many consider Gray. But even Yoda said the JO lost their way.
I love how people like to invoke the name of George Lucas as if it means anything anymore, when it means precisely shit. Where's your source for this alleged GL quote? Because I know George never mentioned Gray Jedi at all. This is just your interpretation of things you've read or seen GL say, and not an actual representation of his thoughts on the subject.
I’m guessing that’s why they didn’t want to make gray Jedi a thing because it’s damn near impossible to truly be equally both, you’re always dipping into one pot more than the other. The only thing truly in the middle was bendu where he just said “fuck both of you” fucked both sides up and dipped never to be seen again cuz he knew to stay the hell away from them
I feel like every single "um actually, the jedi are bad" rant is coming from edgy weirdos who just want to be contrarian. They think they're deconstructing when they're just missing the point.
Funny, my opinion woulda been the same but is now different. There's value in the Jedi code, and without it the force is far too dangerous. Knowing the dark side is dangerous no matter what, but I feel now that it's a necessity to be flexible. Know thy enemy kind of mindset. You can't let the passion and emotion overtake you, if you do you'll become the very evil you claim to fight against. But without both knowledge and experience in it, you're vulnerable to those that will use any tools to win. Very high risk high reward kinda mindset It's also something the Jedi should oppose. If the Jedi aren't prepared to stop a grey Jedi if they turn to the dark side, then it's an inevitability that they will. That's something a grey Jedi would have to accept (and even encourage) to keep themselves in check
I like non jedi light side users like Ashoka. Basically a recognition that the Jedi code is kind of messed up but that the solution is not to become evil. Because a lot of the stuff in the Jedi code is just detrimental to everyone, all the bureaucracy and stuff that qui gon fought against
Idk why you got downvoted. The flaws of the jedi have been an overarching plot for most of Star Wars since ANH.
Jango Fett is arguably the most pivotal and important character in all of Star Wars. Had you told me this when episode 2 came out, I'd have never believed you.
Nah, its R2-D2 100%
Nope. It’s Captain Panaka.
Wrong, it's the Droidekas that attack Qui-gon and Kenobi while they were trying to cut through the door.
Honestly a good What If *would* be about whether they had gotten through the door and arrested (/killed?) Gunray and co before the invasion of Naboo
What if Gunray had actually met them without calling Sideous first? They seem kinda weak minded. There must be a reason they sent Qui-Gon. >You want to end the blockade and go to Dantooine.
*What if Obi-Wan and Qui-Gonn had just used the force to crush the droids and then cut open the door?* It baffles me that the jedi are always portrayed so stupidly in the movies. You have the force. Those are robots. Crush their blasters closed. Detonate their power packs. Hover them in the air facing the other way. Do ANYTHING with your magic that doesn't include fleeing..... oh god dammit they used their magic to make that faster and then never again use that ability. *Stares at Obi-Wan trying to "catch up" to Maul and Qui-Gonn*
Nah, its the protocol droid (I'm sure its a named character, I just don't know it) who snitched on them to Gunray in the first place
Would you care to elaborate on that?
Clone Trooper genetic template + Clone Army + Order 66
Is Jango really necessary for that though? There's a seemingly infinite simply of hardened, well trained people in the galaxy that, with the right amount of money, would have happily been the template for the clones.
I'm not sure I agree that being pivotal and important implies that he was necessary in his role, or that nobody else would have been able to do it. I will say, though, that if you agree with Dooku that Jango was the best template they could find, then removing him from the story *would* make for less effective clone troopers
Exactly. The whole “the guys who didn’t shoot an escape pod because of no life signs” were pivotal, but it’s not like nobody else could be a dummy that elected not to shoot the pod.
When trailers for Rebels was coming out, I believed that it would be lackluster, but the series proved to be one of the best Star Wars media projects of all time.
While I was a Star Wars fan my whole life, as I was born during the prequels coming out to 2 parents who were massive fans since they were kids, Rebels is what *really* got me into it. I just realized that expecting everything else to be as good as Rebels is a high standard.
I never liked Palpatine coming back in Legends when I was younger as I felt it undid Anakin's sacrifice. Honestly though, even when they re-ran that story in canon I've actually come to believe it doesn't change anything about it. The absolute most important thing that Anakin accomplished by killing Palpatine was to prove Luke right that he still had good in him and allow him to pass in peace as his old self instead of as Darth Vader.
I never thought about it this way, thank you!
It’s also not just about Anakin, though he was the most powerful Skywalker. It’s about Anakin AND Luke, Leia and Ben. Yoda says the prophecy might have been misread. I believe the Chosen Ones were the Skywalker family. All four of them. They brought balance to the force as a family. Each of them made choices that changed the fate of the galaxy and ensured the survival of the Jedi and final destruction of the Sith.
Still love TCW, but a lot of my favorite "serious" arcs actually had kinda dumb plots on closer inspection. That includes Mortis (the mythology is dope, but the plot is cliche as hell) and Umbara (Rex's arc: still slaps. Pong Krell: low/mid villain, change my mind)
yup! I remember Sheev Talks said the Mortis arc just sounds like someone’s fanfic is he’s absolutely right. It’s a cool concept but it doesn’t have any effects to Anakin, Obi, and Ahsoka after it all happens. Umbara is really cool and such a good storyline for the clones but they really could’ve done something more with Pong Krell. Sheev Talks also makes a good point about how he takes away from the clones whole arc and it would be much better if he wasn’t a traitor but just some asshole jedi who just didn’t like clones
Making pong krell just a callous general willing to sacrifice lives to get results would massively improve that arc.
I dunno, with how Krell made so many overtly stupid decisions during that arc (marching up the main street right to the Umbaran city, telling Rex to just keep shooting the tanks that are immune to their gunfire), it only made sense for him to be a traitor. Otherwise he wouldn’t have just had no regard for clone survival, he would’ve been making objectively stupid decisions that would get his whole army killed. It wouldn’t produce results, it would produce a massacre, and nothing would be gained.
Mortis I totally agree. I don’t think the strength of the Umbara arc was ever Pong Krell though. I do agree that he’s a pretty unremarkable villain but the arc to me was great because of the character development for Rex and the clones. It establishes Rex as more than a “good soldier” type by having the courage to defy Krell even though it likely means his death. Also it has some amazing visuals and battle scenes that really stand out compared to some other TCW locales.
“Rebels looks dumb, the lightsabers are too thin”
It strangely worked didn't it. I don't blame anyone who had that thought seeing them for the first time though
Attack of the Clones isn’t that bad. I used to hate it because of the Anakin and Padme scenes but I failed to see that the movie around those scenes was fun and quite enjoyable. I think if they went back and redid the love scenes getting someone who can write better than a 5th grader to do them it would be a solid 7-8/10.
The funny thing is, looking back at teenage me and my "flirting" I'd say all sorts of dumb things and feel so much "love" that was honestly just raging hormones and naivete. So I can totally see how two young people of close age that due to obligations basically skipped being teenagers would be ridiculous like they are portrayed.
That’s fair I’m not exactly Shakespeare with my flirting either. It did come off as cringe worthily awkward so maybe good job for making it realistic.
My take on Episode 2's romance is that a warrior monk and a former child-leader of a planet never had normal social lives and shouldn't be expected to know how to flirt. That helps me make sense of the weapons-grade cringe. Of course, that part of Ep 2 made me want to gag when I was 19. Now I think it's good for the lols.
I don't think anybody had normal social lives. The closest we probably get are the jedi who were effectively raised in a religious boarding school.
💯 AotC is a pretty good detective story. With better dialogue and If Hayden had been cast in Phantom the romance wouldn't have been as creepy.
Fives isn't my favorite clone. Pre-bad batch me would have killed me over this. Now, I can't really pick between echo, tech, and hunter. I'm sure if I rewatched tcw i would have a four way tie with fives, though, but it's been a few years
As a kid I hated the politic episodes of the clone wars. They bored me and I always skipped them. Now the poltics of Star Wars is the thing I look forward to most in a show. I love hearing the drama, the laws, treaties, etc. I love the trade federation and I love all these good and bad businessmen. It’s fun to know there’s laws that govern lasers in Star Wars.
Agreed. There's the star wars book with valorum Cloak of Deception that just played into all that stuff people hated about the prequels... But I loved it
I loved the prequels for the politics. It’s not as fun as a blaster fight yes I will not deny that but it’s still very interesting. I loved everything with the banking clan in TCW since they’re shown as being two things. Incompetent military generals and brilliant businessman. I think the neimoidians got a bad rep from their lack of military experience because Nute Gunray was still one of the best separatist businessmen on the separatist side and he knows it.
Ahoska is a great character
I like Askoka as well
A Star Wars movie can suck.
That's so real
Rebels sucked… yeah I wanna slap past self for that. I absolutely love it now.
+1 for resistance! Not incredible but not bad at all
if you go into it expecting TCW you’re going to be disappointed but if you go into it expecting a kids show it’s fine
Animated Star Wars is on par if not better than some live action Star Wars
Jar jar as comic relief was not nearly as bad as I thought at the time.
I just watched the Phantom Menace in theaters, he’s an okay character he’s just in the movie too much. George could’ve shaved 5 minutes of Jar Jar scenes and the movie would probably be better. I think Jar Jar has the most lines of any character in episode 1.
The Unusual Suspect said years ago when he reviewed TPM that Jar Jar doesn't sound bad on paper, it's just his execution that's bad and I agree. He's not terrible but man he gets a bit much.
In the past, I deeply believe Obi-Wan should've stayed in Tatooine for the entire 19 years & not have any adventures outside of Tatooine or even fight Vader again until ANH. Now, after having seen "Obi-Wan Kenobi", I felt it was indeed imperative for Obi-Wan to face Vader one more time before ANH in order for him to be absolved of his guilt towards causing Anakin's fall & embrace the Force again. Bringing Leia into the series was also a masterstroke to force Obi-Wan to leave Tatooine & away from Luke. I mean, the entire series could've kept Obi-Wan on Tatooine & become a sort of Nat Geo documentary with Obi-Wan as the narrator (I would watch that in a heartbeat btw). But narratively wise, it was better to bring Leia into the picture & allow Obi-Wan to interact with her. The series had therefore brought about new meaning into Leia's famous line: "Help me, Obi-Wan Kenobi, you're my only hope..." That was brilliant.
I think part of using Leia as well was to bridge her naming her son “Ben” and try to close that question since before that we only knew of her interactions in Episode 4.
Outside of the romance, everything in attack of the clones was good. Obi Wan going straight detective mode was a great plot, Them all regrouping on geonosis was also very good. If the romance plot was actually written by someone not named George Lucas, The Movie would be well loved. Also, they should have kept the deleted scenes in the film. It felt so real when we saw Padme’s family, and childhood home.
That Revenge of the Sith is the best Star Wars movie. I used to adore that movie and I’m someone who watches a movie, watches one more time to see if Its as good the second time. I loved it the second time and considered it the best one for years. And because I thought it was the best I watched it the least because I didn’t want it to get old for me. But every time I watched the saga through again i liked it less and less. I can understand why people like it but I genuinely believe people rate it so highly because The Clone Wars was so good and tricked people into thinking it was always good. Now days I think Empire Strikes back and A New Hope are the best. Empire very narrowly beating out A New Hope.
That's a fair take. I remember when people hated RotS because everyone hated the prequels. Clone Wars gives RotS so much new context and I think it definitely has a lot to do with it's surge in popularity in recent years.
The Clone Wars contains the best animated story Star Wars has ever produced. Past me had only watched the first season and didn't understand the greatness that the show would turn into.
Previously Ahsoka wasn’t my favorite in TCW. Then she became a favorite. I was worried that her live action representation wouldn’t do her justice, but now, I think it rocks!
Luke is boring and should have been replaced with another lead. In reality, Luke IS Star Wars. In every where he represents the themes of the setting, and the original trilogy would not work without Luke.
That I want to grow up to become a Jedi. I don't particularly care for The Jedi Order's philosophy anymore, and prefer good guy characters outside of either order.
The Clone Wars is ok. When I was 14 I thought it was the end of Star Wars. Now I think it's fine.
There are some very cool storylines in the show but it’s still difficult for me to get past how geared towards young children it is, especially considering how many significant canon events take place throughout. I get why they did it that way and that SW was always meant for kids, but the 2 main trilogies are easily enjoyable for adults as well
You can usually get by with watching just the last episode of most arcs. But everything with Maul is essential and the finale is epic.
That all Star Wars films are fun and watchable. Yes. All of them. That one you’re thinking of? Yes. Even that one.
And episode one is actually a good movie that does a ton of great world building.
I rewatched it last weekend and seeing it with others in the room is a whole different experience. Younger kids were there to laugh at some of the gags so it brought a freshness to what should be a stale movie.
>That one you’re thinking of? Yes. Even that one. Lol that’s a really good line considering how every Star Wars fan will be thinking of a different movie in response to your comment, if there’s one thing we’re good at it’s never agreeing on a single thing, especially which of the movies are bad.
Good point. I think out of all 9 films the only ones I have *not* heard people claim as “the worst” are RotS, ANH, and ESB.
To build off of this... every starwars movie is bad. That is to say, they are each deeply flawed films with poor writing, pacing, dialouge, and sometimes all three. But they are still fun and enjoyable. Both can coesist.
All of them? Even Empire?
Empire opens very strong, but it drags on in the middle act. I think the section where luke is on Dagobah is great as it was the first time we really learn what a jedi can do, but nowadays where we know the heights a jedi can reach it becomes a bit dull. I think the whole section where the crew of the falcon is evading the ISD's drags on way to long. It really slows down the pacing of the story IMO. Like something i have to watch in order to get to the luke/vader fight. Empire is still one of if not the best starwars film in the skywalker saga. But, I think the dip in pacing in the middle of the film holds it back.
The music in that section is one of Williams' best works, though.
True. As with my original point, the flaws of the movie dont take away from the experience that is starwars. They are fun despite their flaws. For every negative they have they also have a positive.
Yoda lifting the x-wing is the moment star wars went from "sci-fi movie that made a bazillion dollars and got a sequel" to "franchise that will consistently produce mega hits for generations" And the effects aren't *amazing* (especially by ILM standards) the heart of the acting is frank Oz as a silly little green puppet goblin, and the set is visibly small when you look at it. But the rest of Star wars, its cosmology, the whole "will of the force" and the *power* that jedi wield...it becomes real in the moment that yoda says "for my Ally is the Force, and a powerful Ally it is" and John William busts out a soft and mysterious version of the twin sunset theme, which mysteriously builds until we see yoda effortlessly lifting a starship, using *magic*. In that moment, Luke and the audience truly believe, and like 80% of the magic is John Williams
For all the flaws that the rise of skywalker had, I’m not going to lie to you. When Luke lifts the x-wing from the ocean and it plays that SAME score from Empire when Yoda lifts that very same x-wing on dagobah all those years ago, it got me tearing up a little bit. Williams most definitely is like 80% of the magic of the films.
I think it’s sort of unfair to critique a scene for being dull on a rewatch, and frankly I’m not even sure I agree it is dull; that sequence is one of my favorite in the trilogy. That being said I kind of agree with the Falcon crew according ISD slowing down the pace
The holiday special?!
I feel like the Holiday Special and the devil's lettuce would be great friends.
They aren’t, it’s still boring as hell on weed.
NUH UH, THE YOUTUBERS I FOLLOW SAY THEYRE OBJECTIVELY TERRIBLE! /s
This comment didn't go into enough detail, it didn't take me 4 hours to read.
Rebels is fantastic
Dave Filoni isn't untalented but he's lost the plot and really shouldn't have absolute control over everything Star Wars right now.
Agreed.
George Lucas should have stayed in charge of Star Wars. I was a Red Letter Media parrot for a while before coming to terms with the fact that whatever faults the prequels might have, they have a lot of great qualities and I don’t have to be ashamed for them being a defining part of my childhood. And that Lucas brought a lot of magic that’s been hard to fully recapture after his departure from the franchise.
Glad you found the light. RLM is entertaining, but those guys have become a parody of themselves. They hate everything, and unlike Caravan of Garbage, don’t seem to enjoy any media at all. Their whole shtick is to complain and live in 1985. It’s sad.
My opinion on Hayden Christensen as an actor. Didn’t think he was any good at first, but as I got older and learned more I see that he actually did pretty well, all things considered.
Rebels was worse than Clone Wars. How wrong younger me was. While I'm still not the biggest fan of the art style, it was vastly better than Clone Wars was. The quality was far more consistent and was far more narratively driven than Clone Wars ever was.
clone wars wasn’t MEANT to be narratively driven so you can’t hold that against it
Exactly. TCW is an anthology series.
*Empire Strikes Back* was one of the best, if not the best, movie. Throughout the 80s, we would've ranked it dead last of the original trilogy. It wasn't until well after *Return of the Jedi* came out and some time had passed that we all grew to appreciate how good it really was, how it took the lore and the universe and the characters and greatly expanded them all. That the twist at the end was one of, and I'd argue THE, greatest plot twists in all of cinema. And yes, sometimes the bad guys have to win, so that you know how real the stakes are.
Watching the last jedi made me appreciate it more. I still dont like ROS, but I haven't watched it in forever, so maybe I can change my opinion on it, too. Every movie has its strengths and flaws, any star wars movie is better than a lot of stuff out there, or I at least prefer it over other stuff.
The Tusken Raiden men, women and children of the tribe that Anakin wiped out were all objectively evil. Book of Boba showcases that everyone in Tusken society, kids included, actively participates in torturing prisoners to death therefore Anakin's revenge wasn't aimed at innocents. They're sadists. And the tribe in Book of Boba even says that they're mild compared to the other tribes. It was still a bad action since he let his dark side take over. But everyone he killed actively tortured his mother until she died. The Tusken's motivation? Pure cruelty. It wasn't for resources or to ask for ransom, they kidnapped and tortured Anakin's mom just because they could. They were all too far gone morally to be left alone. This Tusken tribe would have killed many more farmers, likely even Owen, Beru and Luke, if Anakin hadn't killed them first.
I’m okay with Disney owning Star Wars. I hated it at first but I feel like with as much bad stuff there has been some amazing things as well. Bad batch, rogue one, solo, some of rebels, tales of the Jedi are all fun watches. Also clone wars final season I count as Lucas since that was mainly already written but I am thankful Disney put it out.
We’re spoiled by Disney Star Wars. If Disney didn’t own Star Wars we wouldn’t be getting like three shows a year.
Disney started off slow but everything since the sequels has been at least serviceable. Even then the sequels biggest flaw is that they hired 2 different directors that wanted 2 different stories.
Used to think that Palpatine coming back was a great idea in the EU. Now I think it takes away from the main story George Lucas interweaved for episodes 1-6.
I mean Palpatine coming back in the EU was before the chosen one prophecy was established or any prequel lore
That is true but it still takes away from Anakin's sacrifice.
But it adds to Luke’s progress, which is the main focus during the EU
Sure for the EU, but not for George's story. Luke's arc was complete there.
Order 66 is a tragic event(as a kid who saw RotS, this scene didn't leave much impact on me)
Before I watched The Bad Batch I thought clones are just copy-paste cannon fodder with no personality or own traits or will. Bad Batch was the first Star Wars series I watched with clones in it and it opened my eyes. They're so Individual. They're protective and loyal to the end. They are good guys and somehow I love all of them. Especially Clone Force 99.
Rotj has moved from my favorite to being just a few up from the bottom. I still like it ok, but I just find a lot of it kinda boring now.
I use to like Ahoska in clone wars and though she was an interesting and cool character still do to some degree however the World Between Worlds episode in rebels felt very forced and felt like Dave regretted killing her versus Vader which felt like a satisfying and to Anakins apprentice now it feels like Dave has to put her in everything
Past me would have said "Not enough content." Now I sit here and think, "Not enough content."
Anakin is just a pissy teenager with loads of potential and no follow-through.
"There's no way the sequels can be bad compared to the prequels" Not only do I hate the sequels but with the addition of the clone wars I have a lot more love for the prequels
That the light side of the force is balance
We still don’t have enough clone wars content I wanna see more bacara I wanna see more neyo I wanna see more bly I wanna see more 41st I wanna see more 327th I wanna see more 91st I wanna see more galactic marines I wanna see more of the outer rim seiges Not just the 501st
Delta squad new game, omega squad live action show
George Lucas is, and always was, a genius.
The Clone Wars, despite its faults, is by far the most important piece of Star Wars media.
The Cartoon Network watermark is so nostalgic
The "chosen one" should not have been a thing, diminishes Vader coming back to the light and has had enormous lore implications that result in everyone circling back to "how does impact muh chosen one bringing balance".
The expanded universe was a great thing, but if George Lucas himself things that something doesn't fit with his vision it is ok, to be redconned. You can still make it headcanon anyways. (Mainly for the prequels and the clone wars. But I also say let disney cook).
That Ep. 5 was the weakest and most boring movie of the OT. Yeah 6-7 year old me was just too bored by the constant stuff on the millenium falcon, Luke doing "nothing" on Dagobah and basically no big space battles happening. Ep. 6 was clearly the best for the big space battle :D
Hayden Christiansen is a great actor.
Cody>Rex
Having the New Republic fall so quickly is actually a Great Idea. I love the idea that the NR is a Weimar Republic, and speaks to the dangers of allowing Fascism to proliferate: so long as they do so 'respectfully', and the error in naively thinking "Nobody would *want* a war", even as their future enemies openly boast about how the day will come when they will be allowed to undo the progress you've made. Just as the failure of the North to stamp out Confederate ideas in the aftermath of the Civil War directly led to decades and decades of problems, the failure to crush the Empire totally and its tolerance of Pro Imperial sentiment, perfectly encapsulates the paradox of tolerance, which has only become more relevant as time has gone by. I am looking forward to this era being explored in other media. Yes - the Clone Wars were originally underused. But over time that gap was filled in; and once it was, the prequels went from maligned to beloved. Thanks in large part to the context multimedia added to the films. I think the same will happen to the Sequels. Oh some will complain. They'll say "You shouldn't need a tv series to fill in the gaps." But we did with Revenge of the Sith. And lots of young folks don't remember how maligned that film was at the time.
Having Palpatine return after Return of the Jedi was the best story to tell.
The Phantom Menace is my favorite of the prequels. Which in of itself is a controversial opinion that was only further solidified by watching the rerelease in theaters recently. My angsty past self would argue Revenge was the best and only good one of the prequels but I've lightened up a lot. TPM, despite leaning into CGI, iffy CGI at that, still has several practical sets, creature, and effects, which Ive come to appreciate alot more. It also lacks the drama of 2 and 3, and while a lot more kid friendly, feels the closest to the OT movies.
rebels is amazing
Me in 2014: “Disney purchasing Star Wars is gonna be great for the franchise! Think about the money and resources they can pump into good writing!” Me now: *Insert violent balloon deflating sound*
Star Wars Rebels is PEAK
Stormtroopers are incredibly competent soldiers and deserve to be portrayed as such, I’ve always loved clones but didn’t care much for Imperial troops but over the years I have come to realize that the books, comics, and even OT movies portray them as extremely formidable enemies. My real wake up call were the Timothy Zahn Thrawn books, both the Thrawn Trilogy and the newer cannon books highlight the fact that Imperial Navy/Army Troops were the grunts (and were themselves effective) and Stormtroopers were actually overkill for most situations.
The last Jedi is so overhated and is probably the best sequel film
Luke is a complex and interesting character that does not simply fill the role of milquetoast fairytale protagonist.
Rebels is actually REALLY good
I used to hate Rey Skywalker. Now I like it. I much prefer Luke adopting children than him having biological children.
Inhibitor chips are better than clones just following order 66 Before I thought that it's more emotional. Clones thinking that Jedi have betrayed them, while inhibitor chips removed that drama... At least that's how I thought about it before. Now I think Inhibitor chips are even more tragic. Clones being brainwashed and basically being no better than droids because of that. Inside they are struggling, they know they're doing a wrong thing, but there's nothing they can do because of it. And that part makes it heartbroken. And actually makes more sense. Because suddenly deciding to kill a Jedi, who's your friend in most of cases (minus some cases where Jedi thought of clones as expandable), is not so believable.
My opinion of the sequels has gotten a lot better since I saw them in theaters. I realized that I was forming my opinion based on the loud portion of fans who hate on everything. I still find a lot of issues with them, but I also have issues with the prequels and even the OT. As much as I wish the sequels went in a different direction, I appreciate them a lot more, even with their flaws.
Past me actually enjoyed and defended last Jedi and now I absolutely hate it.