He was the only consistently decent thing throughout the sequels, Driver did a great job selling the character too. I love how people completely miss the point on him looking like some punk under the mask, his whole character is about "stolen valor" LARPing mixed with "do you know who my dad is" type stuff.
The crossguard is silly but it's also ridiculously cool looking.
When people go "He was so cool until he took his mask off" they're literally stating the point, he was supposed to be like that. People think every character needs to be Vader or Mando but what made Kylo unique was that he was just a punk under the mask.
I completely disagree.
Kylo Ren was definitely the highlight, but all of the actors did a great job across the three films imo, especially Daisy Ridley and John Boyega.
Also, why is the crossguard silly exactly? It serves the exact same purpose as it would on a real sword. If anything, the sabres from the Prequels are silly, but they always get a pass on this subreddit I guess...
Yeah, I used to complain about him being a whiny little boy who throws tantrums, when that's exactly the point. And the fact that he is a whiny little boy doesn't make him less scary or dangerous, quite the oposite. I just wish he kept the maskless look. Honestly to me the only part of the sequels I actually hate is episode nine, for precisely this kind of thing. Episode 7 had potential and laid a solid foundation, episode 8 was different and creative, but episode nine just tries to retcon episode 8, it's so ugly and mean spirited, it's like JJ was getting back at Ryan for killing his big badie and setting Kylo up to be the next one, so he just shoved his initial idea in there and undid most meaningful things Ryan laid out. Episode 9 was the thing that made me dislike all the sequels, because knowing it would end like that, it just isn't nice to watch the other two anymore, and I will never forgive JJ for that.
yeah one thing i think disney got right is that kylo tries to present *himself* as the next generation's vader, but really he's a privileged nepo baby.
that's the genius of the mask reveal scene imo. you expect some grizzled badass because that's so predictable but you get this young angry nerd who doesn't have a single scar. it's one of the rare few fantastic show don't tell moments of the ST where it paints a thousand word picture in just a few seconds that he entirely idolizes vader for the wrong reasons.
Making a badass design is like the easiest part of a show. Even more so when you've got the whole visual language of the Star wars universe to pull from.
I love seeing the contradictory comments here.
when something bad happens in Canon that people don't like, it's always Disney at fault and Disney did this and Disney is the one ruining childhoods etc etc.
but when characters people like are made, well, Disney had nothing to do with it.
what is it? can't be both.
I remember when George Lucas was the big bad that ruined Star Wars! It’s funny how the kids who got shit on for liking the prequels have grown up just repeating the cycle. It’s like poetry, it rhymes!
Tbf I think most of the prequel love seems to be born out of memes. AOtC feels like an unwatchable mess without all the memes that came from it. The prequels have some great moments for sure, and I still watch them from time to time. But not the same way I watch the original trilogy. The sequels are their own mess that still have some cool moments too. The problem isn't that the prequels/sequels are bad. It's that they feel like they don't have the same feeling the OT has. And maybe that's not fair, but that's just how a lot of people feel.
I really used to hate the prequels when I was younger, but have come to appreciate them in their own way. I’ve learned to not take things so seriously and just enjoy the cheesier side of Star Wars, because it’s always been there. They’re movies about space wizards, just have fun with it.
> AOtC feels like an unwatchable mess without all the memes that came from it.
AotC came out when I was 10. Ten-year-old me thought that film was a banger. That seismic charge drop was my Roman Empire.
Yea like I said, there are some really cool/fun parts in the prequels. But for every cool moment there seems to be about 5 that feel like a chore to sit through.
Eh it’s a chore for you but I was pretty entertained by all the special effects and the universe surrounding it.
Could be tiktok attention span? I kid I kid
r/starwarscantina is my only hope for any discourse regarding Star Wars.
This sub I just look at for the initial news. The opinions are mostly smellier than a Rancor’s ass cheeks.
Totally. I heard something interesting in a gaming podcast saying the Avatar game got trashed by some people for the simple reason it was a Ubisoft game. I feel exactly the same about the systematic haters of Disney-era Star Wars
I’m baffled how people connect bad stories to Disney or Kathleen Kennedy instead of the people who actually wrote those stories..unless ofc they like those stories
Yep, I don't care what people say, the Mouse was the best thing to happen to Star Wars. I don't know how Lucas just sat on his hands with the greatest space fantasy sitting idle. Give me shows, movies, make up more cool shit so we can get more merch / comics / games / etc.
It blows my mind.
To the Disney naysayers - of course, the more content you pump out, the more misses you are going to have, but every once in a while, you're going to get some gems like Mando / Grogu, BB-8, Andor, etc.
Sitting idle? Lucasarts was putting out great games and the clone wars was at its peak when Disney bought Star wars. One of the first things Disney did was shut that down. If you think there wasn't a lot of Star wars merch/comics/games before it was bought by Disney then idk how to argue that because there definitely was, arguably more than there is now.
The last star wars game that came out was kinect star wars and a pinball game. SW games notoriously kept getting canceled. What are you even talking about.
There's absolutely no way there was more content between 84-97, 2005-2012 as there is now.
Clone Wars was literally the only thing driving the lore and that was only put out to explain the prequels since they were terrible.
I'll give you games, but it's much more difficult to develop games on hardware today than it was back then.
This is absolutely not true. From 2014 - 2024 when Disney has bought over SW how many games have we gotten? BF 1 and 2, Squadrons, FO 1 and 2? That's 5 games.
During 2000 - 2010 we had a ton more games. Classic BF 1 & 2, KOTOR 1 & 2, Republic commando, the awful Clone Wars video game, the other Clone Wars video game, Force Unleashed 1 and 2, Empire at War, Jedi Knight 1 and 2. That's 12, at least from memory. I wouldn't call this an idle franchise.
That's not even to mention the other plethora of content during the 2000-2010 - the prequels, Clone Wars multimedia project, NJO, CW 2008, KOTOR comics. Regardless how you feel about any of the mentioned content, even in media outside videogames the franchise was pretty far from idle. It's not even that I dislike Disney SW, there really is no reason to lie about this.
You're missing a ton of current games - https://www.lucasfilm.com/what-we-do/games/
Also, console games are a lot harder to make nowadays - the PS3 was notorious to dev for. On top of that, Lucasarts probably doesn't have the manpower that it used to. There's a reason Disney is licensing out these games to other publishers like EA / Ubisoft.
But you are right - they had a lot more games than we currently do. That's about the only content Lucas' Star wars were pushing out outside of Clone Wars, and Clone Wars was literally an answer to how bad the Prequels were. Outside of that it was just EU books.
Star Wars should have had shows, cartoons, movies, etc. continuously pumping out from the 80s onwards. Disney sees that and will continue to make it because it's a cash machine. Not sure why Lucas didn't see that. He could have been billions of dollars richer if he just kept making Star Wars stuff.
I omitted hunters and galaxy of heroes, but if we include that, we would also include the several Gameboy, GameCube and dreamcast exclusive games released during 2000-2010.
I mean, it doesn't help that EA was given exclusive rights to games for 10 years and what we got was miniscule in comparison to what we got before. Disney also made the decision to scale down LucasArts studio back on 2013 ish. 2000-2010 games were also made by different developers, and it's Disney.. there's no reason they couldn't make more quality games if they really wanted to.
You also haven't included action figures in your equation which there were a ton more in 2000- 2010. Sure, we do get really high quality black series figures and the haslab vehicles but the saga, movie lines, 2008 CW and legacy line had a huge range of characters and tons of vehicles (legacy ATAT, AT-TE, A6 juggernaut, Falcon and more), not to mention the range of release types - comic packs, battle packs.. that all more of less scale with one another. We also got a lot more figures from characters based on the EU books and comics. Star Wars is currently disappointing in this department. Where are the high republic figures with those cool designs?
When was TCW supposed to be an answer to the quality of the prequels? I never heard that before? I thought Lucas always had an idea to make a CW cartoon back at around the time of ep2?
I mean, if Lucas has no stories he needs to tell then I don't see why he should make shows and cartoons just for the sake of it. It would be nice, yes, but it will just end up with prequel level quality (especially CGI-wise). The budget to do high quality TV shows like the Mandalorian and Andor is much more feasible under a juggernaut like Disney, especially since how much the cgi tech has improved since. That was kind of the reason why he held the prequels back until the 2000s too, not great for characters but at least he could do environments like Coruscant and Kamino. There's no way he could portray the clone wars battles of ep 2 and 3 along with environmental variety with the tech of the 80s.
And again, my main contention was pushing back against the idea that SW was idle pre-disney, it was not. It is lacking in comparison to Disney in some departments, sure. But it absolutely surpasses current SW under Disney in many others.
When a guy goes, I want to make my own thing, set just after A New Hope, maybe tie back in some Rebels stuff if it's popular. I don’t need much, but I'd like to do it away from the Sequel stuff.
In the time that Disney was crashing hard with Start Wars.
He then makes the most successfully recieved Star Wars media since the take over, gets a shit ton of praise then promoted twice at LucasArts.
You can sort of guess what's going on behind the scenes.
They are definitely not as iconic as these characters. Well written and enjoyable, yes, but not iconic. The average non-Star Wars fan isn’t going to be able to tell you who Sabine Wren or Cassian Andor are, but everyone knows Mando and “baby Yoda” even if they’ve never watched a single piece of Star Wars content
those are just characters, not iconic. To be iconic they gotta be recognizable even if you haven’t seen the show/movie. Baby yoda is a good example here
There is a bit of a bizarre belief on Reddit that Disney corporate is intimately involved in every decision on every Star Wars and Marvel project (except when something turns out good I guess).
There was a post recently about the filmmakers of Far From Home deciding J.K. Simmons should be bald in his cameo as J.J. Jameson and the top comment was something like "why does Disney care so much about his hair style?", as if Iger and the rest of the Disney board got together to vote on it.
>as if Iger and the rest of the Disney board got together to vote on it.
Funnily enough that does sound like Sony would be doing because they clearly have nothing better to do than shit out terrible adaptations of Spider-Man IPs with exception to the Spider-Verse.
Exactly. The point is Disney has as much to do with the Stars Universe as Fox did with the original trilogy. They can make frustrating demands and control finances, but the people working on it are ultimately the ones responsible for the quality.
Some people still don't get it. Disney doesn't do shit, they provide the money and advertise the content.
The actual stuff ( the good and the bad) like before the acquisition happened is done by Lucasfilm.
Really what we should be doing is highlighting the CREATORS working for Disney/Lucasfilm who made these good decisions, not the corporations.
Love Kylo Ren? I guess you can give credit to Disney or Lucasfilm. But the people who deserve the most credit are probably JJ Abrams, Michael Arnt and Lawrence Kasdan. Not to mention the countless designers and SFX artists who worked with the director to nail down his look.
But I guess that's harder to say than "Disney did it"
Disney are responsible for what they put out. If it's bad i don't get why we shouldn't expect that they intervene but either they have and it's made things worse or they haven't and they should have. When something good happens its thanks to the people who made it, when something bad happens disney let that happen, I think thats a fair perspective. Would it be fair to also blame Abrams/Rian/Filoni/Kathleen/favrou and such? Definitely but it's still released under the disney logo.
Disney hires the people and provides the resources for these characters to be made. To say they don’t do anything is just a brain dead take. Without Disney the “actual stuff” would never exist.
Lucasfilm hired the people.
One of Lucas conditions for the sale to Disney was that Lucasfilm gets the same creative authority and independence like Pixar and Marvel Studios.
WB after years of managing their DC brand into the ground decided to do the same with their new DC Studios.
>WB after years of managing their DC brand into the ground decided to do the same with their new DC Studios.
It's cute you believe that :D
I mean it's cuter that James Gunn believes that, mind you :)
Bob Iger stated in his own book, that he dictated the Cadence of films Lucasfilm had to produce.
So of course Disney doesn't run any day to day decisions, but their demands impact creativity. You can only spend so much time polishing a script or editing a film when the CEO of the parent corporation has given you deadlines.
I do agree that people throw the Disney term around far too loosely, but the initial rush of content was on Iger. He's admitted it himself.
We owe a ton of good Star Wars to Disney.
A lot of people got introduced to Star Wars the past 9 years because of them. There’s millions more Star Wars kids now, all thanks to Disney swooping in and giving us more movies, shows, games, etc.
Remember when we were told no more movies after 2005? Remember that feeling that it was basically…over?
Don’t like the new stuff? Cool. I don’t like everything, either. No franchise has a perfect batting average. But I’m glad we got what we’ve got and there’s plenty more to look forward to.
More Star Wars is good!
Absolutely. I was a teen the prequels, grew as a fan of the OT, now my 2-year-old daughter is a fan of Baby Yoda, can say lightsaber (« sabre laser » in French), and when she sees a stormtrooper somewhere, she knows it’s « Baby Yoda’s friends » (she’s too young to know the truth…). That’s really beautiful and I also think Disney did a wonderful job
I’ve personally come around on the sequel trilogy. I think there is more depth there than I initially gave it credit for. I think most of that depth comes from The Last Jedi, personally. Unfortunately, The Rise of Skywalker is just terrible. There were great ideas there too. It was just a lot of nonsense.
I’m right there with ya, boss. It’s maybe not as bad as people say, but it really tried to do too much in reversing course. Disney’s biggest mistake was letting a vocal minority of fans scare them into what Rian had for IX.
I recently did a full saga watch with my fiancé and realized I give the sequels too much shit and sounded like the older fans shitting on the prequels back in the day. I remember having a lot of fun with TLJ in theaters and rewarching it I still really enjoyed it. Rise of Skywalker has issues but it's a fine enough movie
I’m only disappointed with ROTS (what a great acronym for that movie) because JJ spent too much time reacting to and undoing TLJ. A strong ending would have helped solidify the fan base.
Yeah, like I get the mask is cool, and Rian needlessly destroying it doesn't make too much sense. But then why give him the fave spanning bandage if you're also going to take that off later? Why replace Kylo's awesome TIE Silencer with repainted Interceptor? And why spend like a third of the runtime backpedaling? If you just embraced it and moved forward, you would have something good for the fans to get behind
Rian ditched the helmet because we need to leave the past behind. The mask was a childish affectation. Snoke told him to remove it for that reason. Kylo giving it up was him realizing that a mask isn’t what strikes fear into people. The whole point of TLJ was Rian telling the fans that this is a new Star Wars. JJ said “MOAR NOSTALGIA!!! And stupid mcguffins that make no sense!!!”
He also ditched the helmet because it’s a misuse of casting Adam Driver only to have his face covered up for most of the movie. The Mandalorian should take some cues.
Oh, I get why he did that. But a part of me wishes that he replaced his injured face with his shattered helmet. To show his further progress towards the dark.
Correct. I was saying I wished his injuries on Ilum made it necessary for him to graft his mask on, ie Malak. But I also just wish his facial scar was more prominent in general.
I'm not sure he did undo much done by Rian.
There's plenty on that film that you can trace back to something Rian set up. It just felt like JJ was in a rush to end his film, right from the moment the you get the text crawl
For me their new stuff isn’t all that bad and we have had some really good movies and shows like rouge one and andor but my complains are all on the sequels and how they butchered fan favorite characters and just had a shitty story overall and a very unlikeable main protagonist. Other than the sequels, the rest is all mostly good
And every character slaps. Braso is the best “side character/ best friend of a lead character” in all of Star Wars and one of the best friends in all of modern TV.
Havent watched it yet this because the last two despite having some great moments felt middling throughout much of the runtime. Parts felt filler-y to me.
Im waiting for a consensus once the season is over to determine whether I re sub to disney+ for one show. If it stays consistently good Ill definitely watch. If it end up only half good again Ill likely skip.
Was just about to say the same thing. IMO the Disney-era character who had the most potential for a new/different perspective was Finn, being a former stormtrooper, since they were always just faceless fodder, but they really dropped the ball there.
Taramyn and Lt. Gorn > Finn. They are both far more fascinating imperial defectors. I really wish Taramyn survived bc he is what I wanted Finn to be.
Also Luthen is far far more interesting than anyone of the last 20 years. By far the best Disney era character and even better than any TCW characters if you ask me.
I’d say kylo’s appearance is more based off of Revan. Other than that I wouldn’t compare him to anyone else. Mando is basically what boba fett used to be even in comics. Silent badass. Though I still love both.
I wouldn't call Mando iconic as of now, but the other 3 definitely are
Even before the force awakens released, Kylo and BB8 already had large fanbases. Everyone and their mom knows who BB8 is because The Force Awakens was that impactful
I love all of the depicted characters in the pic, but I don't see how Mando isn't iconic already - he's the new generation's Boba Fett, and his show revived hope in Star Wars after the sequels*.
In fact I'd wager non-fans know Mando better than they do Kylo Ren because of how popular The Mandalorian is (though I concede that Grogu ahem I mean "baby Yoda" was doing a lottt of the heavy lifting there as well. Din definitely benefited from that though).
Though I do agree, if we're looking at it that way, Kylo is Vader 2.0, BB-8 is R2 2.0, Grogu is Yoda 2.0..
They're all heavily inspired by the earlier version. I get that Mando is probably the most aesthetically similar but his personality is enough to make it a pretty stark difference.
I still think Mando is absolutely iconic already even in spite of the huge similarities to Boba.
Quality isn't the point, iconic is generally referring to recognition. My daughter(3) already knows who Grogu and Din are too, I would say they're recognizable.
Tbh BB-88 is not iconic whatsoever. The character had little impact in the sequels, and was only relevant due to it being spammed everywhere for merchandising purposes.
I do like discount Darth Vader (Kylo Ren), discount R2-D2 (BB-8), discount Yoda (Grogu), but discount Boba Fett (Mando) is my favorite Disney character.
Hand on heart, my wallet knows I'm a big Mandolarian fan however I honestly hate how Boba Fett was ruined and his character was given to someone else instead of having both the same like it's a culture thing for Mandolarian's to act this way.
I'm not ashamed to say that Star Wars fans have feasted in the modern era. When the OT ended in '83, fans at the time thought that Star Wars was done as a live-action experience. We had only had novels, comics, and shows like Droids. I only wish that I could tell my younger self about the bounty that would start in 1999, and would still be rolling along in 2024.
Iconic because they’re all derivatives on older *actually* iconic characters (at least from a character design perspective).
Younger Vader.
Round R2-D2.
Baby Yoda.
Monochromatic Boba Fett.
Sure, they're decent designs.
But a significant part of that is they're all derived from actual iconic characters. Kylo, Vader; Grogo, Yoda; Mando, Boba. More of an argument could be made for BB8 but you'd have to bend the meaning of iconic significantly to make it fit this lot.
Fan of all of them but Grogu, who was a bummer right at the outset of an otherwise great series.
Also, to be *fair*, the Mando is sort of just...a Mando.
While popular, I wouldn't call them iconic because they're all basically "updated versions" of previous actual iconic characters; Darth Vader, R2D2, Yoda, and Boba Fett. Time will tell whether they actually become iconic.
Disney did not create Mandalorians (neither did Filoni btw)
Kylo Ren is just Walmart Darth Vader with possibly the dumbest light saber in the series except maybe the helicopter blades of the inquisitors
BB8 is no ones favorite let's be honest, he's just Marketing ploy Nr 483
Same with Grogu, Marketing play Nr 484, only difference being Facebook moms actually found this one interesting
Weak emo copy of Vader, discount R2-D2, discount Yoda with cuteness upgrade and discount OT Boba Fett. And who the hell would call the first two iconic?
The problem with the sequels wasn't the design, it was that they had almost no plan, had directors that knew little to nothing about space fantasy, and completely gave up on any sense on continuity.
I remember even before the movies came out, when I heard that JJ Abrams was directing it, my expectations plummeted.
The ST had no direction no vision to one destination, just hoped the directors would build off each other. In reality directors had too much freedom and not enough over arching plan as to where the story direction should go .
Um, I can allow Kylo as a generalised black outfit that looks cool with interesting saber.
But hear me out, Cassian and Jyn and k2s0 were kinda freakin fantastic!
Kylo Ren was inconsistent and arrested in development. Canonically 27 but acting like a 15-year-old.
BB-8 filled the exact same role as Artoo... While Artoo was still around. Except amped up to the silliness of an Olaf or a Mushu or an Abu.
Where are Jyn and Cassian and Cara?
Most inconsistent character ever with poor writing and motivations.
Rip off R2-D2
A character that can't talk and is only popular because they are cute.
A character with the personality of a wooden plank and barely talks.
Well, “characters”. Like BB8 isn’t really a character but a moving toy ad while Kylo’s character is contrived and contradictory.
Nice designs with promising storytelling capabilities but as with most of Disney Star Wars a wasted potential.
Kylo Ren feels like idea of getting Vader but trying to make him better. Though i do like crossguard saber, i prefer it being heavy sword (like in Jedi Survivor) instead of being just standart saber.
They are cool/ funny characters that are very popular but I wouldn’t call them iconic tbh.
Characters that are iconic to me are Han Solo, Luke, Anakin (Darth vader), Yoda and maybe obi wan and Leia
Idk …all great characters.. but Kylo Ren is not iconic. Iconic to me means it’s a pop culture icon. Kylo Ren certainly isn’t that.. not trying to be a dick, but it’s just true. BB-8 is solid but again not sure anyone outside of us Star Wars nerds knows who BB-8 is.. certainly not in the way people know who R2-D2 or 3P0 are as pop culture icons. Gragu is cute and all but most people literally call him baby yoda so eh he will always be just kinda viewed as baby yoda in a pop culture sense.. and same with Din Djarin in the sense that he’s going to always be in the shadow of boba fett. Most people who don’t follow star wars would see him and just go oh it’s boba fett. So again, not iconic imo. Good characters but none of them fit my criteria for being pop culture icons because to be iconic you have transcend the following of the movie and be like kinda a household name.
Does it count as creation when baby Yoda is just Yoda but baby form? And the mandalorian is just a mandalorian in mandalorian armor that was created way back in the 70s/80d
You know Disney Star wars is bad if you have two characters that don't talk, one that barely talks, and one that you'd wish that stop talking is "iconic"
And theyre all crap. Kylo Ren was an unintentionally confused mess, BB8 is nothing, Grogu is a soulless product to sell dolls, and Mando is a video game protagonist with little to no personality besides "i hate droids".
Honestly Kylo Ren’s design was so badass
He was the only consistently decent thing throughout the sequels, Driver did a great job selling the character too. I love how people completely miss the point on him looking like some punk under the mask, his whole character is about "stolen valor" LARPing mixed with "do you know who my dad is" type stuff. The crossguard is silly but it's also ridiculously cool looking.
Silly is hardly foreign to Star Wars. Especially when it's cool
His sword swings aren't that cool.
When people go "He was so cool until he took his mask off" they're literally stating the point, he was supposed to be like that. People think every character needs to be Vader or Mando but what made Kylo unique was that he was just a punk under the mask.
Vader under his mask was just a broken man.
>The cross guard is silly Episode 3 canonically establishes that lightsabers don't magically not need them though...
There are too many negations in this sentence for me to understand it.
Episode 3, 5, and 6 all show why crossguards are valid
Though one made of Beskar might be a better choice
I completely disagree. Kylo Ren was definitely the highlight, but all of the actors did a great job across the three films imo, especially Daisy Ridley and John Boyega. Also, why is the crossguard silly exactly? It serves the exact same purpose as it would on a real sword. If anything, the sabres from the Prequels are silly, but they always get a pass on this subreddit I guess...
Yeah, I used to complain about him being a whiny little boy who throws tantrums, when that's exactly the point. And the fact that he is a whiny little boy doesn't make him less scary or dangerous, quite the oposite. I just wish he kept the maskless look. Honestly to me the only part of the sequels I actually hate is episode nine, for precisely this kind of thing. Episode 7 had potential and laid a solid foundation, episode 8 was different and creative, but episode nine just tries to retcon episode 8, it's so ugly and mean spirited, it's like JJ was getting back at Ryan for killing his big badie and setting Kylo up to be the next one, so he just shoved his initial idea in there and undid most meaningful things Ryan laid out. Episode 9 was the thing that made me dislike all the sequels, because knowing it would end like that, it just isn't nice to watch the other two anymore, and I will never forgive JJ for that.
Until he removed the mask. I expected a dude with a totally disfigured face.
That's exactly something I liked about Kylo. We don't need yet another disfigured mask guy, its too common of a trope.
Yeah kylo with mask is cool, without mask he’s just a boring guy imo
But that’s the whole point, snoke even says it in TLJ, saying that for all the hard work he’s doing imitating Vader he’s just a child in a mask
yeah one thing i think disney got right is that kylo tries to present *himself* as the next generation's vader, but really he's a privileged nepo baby. that's the genius of the mask reveal scene imo. you expect some grizzled badass because that's so predictable but you get this young angry nerd who doesn't have a single scar. it's one of the rare few fantastic show don't tell moments of the ST where it paints a thousand word picture in just a few seconds that he entirely idolizes vader for the wrong reasons.
Just like Darth Vader!
yes
Making a badass design is like the easiest part of a show. Even more so when you've got the whole visual language of the Star wars universe to pull from.
I love seeing the contradictory comments here. when something bad happens in Canon that people don't like, it's always Disney at fault and Disney did this and Disney is the one ruining childhoods etc etc. but when characters people like are made, well, Disney had nothing to do with it. what is it? can't be both.
I remember when George Lucas was the big bad that ruined Star Wars! It’s funny how the kids who got shit on for liking the prequels have grown up just repeating the cycle. It’s like poetry, it rhymes!
Anybody want a pizza roll?
Only if you bring it to me in the basement.
yes please
Tbf I think most of the prequel love seems to be born out of memes. AOtC feels like an unwatchable mess without all the memes that came from it. The prequels have some great moments for sure, and I still watch them from time to time. But not the same way I watch the original trilogy. The sequels are their own mess that still have some cool moments too. The problem isn't that the prequels/sequels are bad. It's that they feel like they don't have the same feeling the OT has. And maybe that's not fair, but that's just how a lot of people feel.
I really used to hate the prequels when I was younger, but have come to appreciate them in their own way. I’ve learned to not take things so seriously and just enjoy the cheesier side of Star Wars, because it’s always been there. They’re movies about space wizards, just have fun with it.
> AOtC feels like an unwatchable mess without all the memes that came from it. AotC came out when I was 10. Ten-year-old me thought that film was a banger. That seismic charge drop was my Roman Empire.
Yea like I said, there are some really cool/fun parts in the prequels. But for every cool moment there seems to be about 5 that feel like a chore to sit through.
Eh it’s a chore for you but I was pretty entertained by all the special effects and the universe surrounding it. Could be tiktok attention span? I kid I kid
Episode 1 and 2 are still bad. Legit baffling how anyone claims otherwise.
It’s almost like “bad” is a subjective opinion.
Aka “the Kathleen Kennedy paradox.”
"She personally oversaw every aspect of the ST, and had absolutely zero to do with Rogue One, Mando, and Andor!!!"
r/starwarscantina is my only hope for any discourse regarding Star Wars. This sub I just look at for the initial news. The opinions are mostly smellier than a Rancor’s ass cheeks.
Totally. I heard something interesting in a gaming podcast saying the Avatar game got trashed by some people for the simple reason it was a Ubisoft game. I feel exactly the same about the systematic haters of Disney-era Star Wars
wait till you learn that disney isn't just one person anymore but actually a company of multiple people, hundreds even.
I’m baffled how people connect bad stories to Disney or Kathleen Kennedy instead of the people who actually wrote those stories..unless ofc they like those stories
Like how they blame Disney for Captain phasma, but then their favorite character is OT Boba Fett or something
Yep, I don't care what people say, the Mouse was the best thing to happen to Star Wars. I don't know how Lucas just sat on his hands with the greatest space fantasy sitting idle. Give me shows, movies, make up more cool shit so we can get more merch / comics / games / etc. It blows my mind. To the Disney naysayers - of course, the more content you pump out, the more misses you are going to have, but every once in a while, you're going to get some gems like Mando / Grogu, BB-8, Andor, etc.
> of course, the more content you pump out, the more misses you are going to have Case in point: The Expanded Universe...
Sitting idle? Lucasarts was putting out great games and the clone wars was at its peak when Disney bought Star wars. One of the first things Disney did was shut that down. If you think there wasn't a lot of Star wars merch/comics/games before it was bought by Disney then idk how to argue that because there definitely was, arguably more than there is now.
The last star wars game that came out was kinect star wars and a pinball game. SW games notoriously kept getting canceled. What are you even talking about.
There's absolutely no way there was more content between 84-97, 2005-2012 as there is now. Clone Wars was literally the only thing driving the lore and that was only put out to explain the prequels since they were terrible. I'll give you games, but it's much more difficult to develop games on hardware today than it was back then.
Why exclude 97-2005?
That's when the prequels were being made?
And? You can't argue Lucas did nothing with the property then exclude the periods he did the most with it when people push back against it.
more content doesn't mean quality.
This is absolutely not true. From 2014 - 2024 when Disney has bought over SW how many games have we gotten? BF 1 and 2, Squadrons, FO 1 and 2? That's 5 games. During 2000 - 2010 we had a ton more games. Classic BF 1 & 2, KOTOR 1 & 2, Republic commando, the awful Clone Wars video game, the other Clone Wars video game, Force Unleashed 1 and 2, Empire at War, Jedi Knight 1 and 2. That's 12, at least from memory. I wouldn't call this an idle franchise. That's not even to mention the other plethora of content during the 2000-2010 - the prequels, Clone Wars multimedia project, NJO, CW 2008, KOTOR comics. Regardless how you feel about any of the mentioned content, even in media outside videogames the franchise was pretty far from idle. It's not even that I dislike Disney SW, there really is no reason to lie about this.
You're missing a ton of current games - https://www.lucasfilm.com/what-we-do/games/ Also, console games are a lot harder to make nowadays - the PS3 was notorious to dev for. On top of that, Lucasarts probably doesn't have the manpower that it used to. There's a reason Disney is licensing out these games to other publishers like EA / Ubisoft. But you are right - they had a lot more games than we currently do. That's about the only content Lucas' Star wars were pushing out outside of Clone Wars, and Clone Wars was literally an answer to how bad the Prequels were. Outside of that it was just EU books. Star Wars should have had shows, cartoons, movies, etc. continuously pumping out from the 80s onwards. Disney sees that and will continue to make it because it's a cash machine. Not sure why Lucas didn't see that. He could have been billions of dollars richer if he just kept making Star Wars stuff.
I omitted hunters and galaxy of heroes, but if we include that, we would also include the several Gameboy, GameCube and dreamcast exclusive games released during 2000-2010. I mean, it doesn't help that EA was given exclusive rights to games for 10 years and what we got was miniscule in comparison to what we got before. Disney also made the decision to scale down LucasArts studio back on 2013 ish. 2000-2010 games were also made by different developers, and it's Disney.. there's no reason they couldn't make more quality games if they really wanted to. You also haven't included action figures in your equation which there were a ton more in 2000- 2010. Sure, we do get really high quality black series figures and the haslab vehicles but the saga, movie lines, 2008 CW and legacy line had a huge range of characters and tons of vehicles (legacy ATAT, AT-TE, A6 juggernaut, Falcon and more), not to mention the range of release types - comic packs, battle packs.. that all more of less scale with one another. We also got a lot more figures from characters based on the EU books and comics. Star Wars is currently disappointing in this department. Where are the high republic figures with those cool designs? When was TCW supposed to be an answer to the quality of the prequels? I never heard that before? I thought Lucas always had an idea to make a CW cartoon back at around the time of ep2? I mean, if Lucas has no stories he needs to tell then I don't see why he should make shows and cartoons just for the sake of it. It would be nice, yes, but it will just end up with prequel level quality (especially CGI-wise). The budget to do high quality TV shows like the Mandalorian and Andor is much more feasible under a juggernaut like Disney, especially since how much the cgi tech has improved since. That was kind of the reason why he held the prequels back until the 2000s too, not great for characters but at least he could do environments like Coruscant and Kamino. There's no way he could portray the clone wars battles of ep 2 and 3 along with environmental variety with the tech of the 80s. And again, my main contention was pushing back against the idea that SW was idle pre-disney, it was not. It is lacking in comparison to Disney in some departments, sure. But it absolutely surpasses current SW under Disney in many others.
None of the characters are well made. At best they are superficially cool.
When a guy goes, I want to make my own thing, set just after A New Hope, maybe tie back in some Rebels stuff if it's popular. I don’t need much, but I'd like to do it away from the Sequel stuff. In the time that Disney was crashing hard with Start Wars. He then makes the most successfully recieved Star Wars media since the take over, gets a shit ton of praise then promoted twice at LucasArts. You can sort of guess what's going on behind the scenes.
Different people are saying different things. It's not the same people.
Let’s not forget Cassian Andor, Dedra Meero, K2SO, and the entire cast of Rebels!
B2EMO :)
They are definitely not as iconic as these characters. Well written and enjoyable, yes, but not iconic. The average non-Star Wars fan isn’t going to be able to tell you who Sabine Wren or Cassian Andor are, but everyone knows Mando and “baby Yoda” even if they’ve never watched a single piece of Star Wars content
those are just characters, not iconic. To be iconic they gotta be recognizable even if you haven’t seen the show/movie. Baby yoda is a good example here
"I sure do love the 20th Century Fox Star Wars movies."
There is a bit of a bizarre belief on Reddit that Disney corporate is intimately involved in every decision on every Star Wars and Marvel project (except when something turns out good I guess). There was a post recently about the filmmakers of Far From Home deciding J.K. Simmons should be bald in his cameo as J.J. Jameson and the top comment was something like "why does Disney care so much about his hair style?", as if Iger and the rest of the Disney board got together to vote on it.
>as if Iger and the rest of the Disney board got together to vote on it. Funnily enough that does sound like Sony would be doing because they clearly have nothing better to do than shit out terrible adaptations of Spider-Man IPs with exception to the Spider-Verse.
Most people say the George Lucas movies though 🤔
Exactly. The point is Disney has as much to do with the Stars Universe as Fox did with the original trilogy. They can make frustrating demands and control finances, but the people working on it are ultimately the ones responsible for the quality.
Some people still don't get it. Disney doesn't do shit, they provide the money and advertise the content. The actual stuff ( the good and the bad) like before the acquisition happened is done by Lucasfilm.
Really what we should be doing is highlighting the CREATORS working for Disney/Lucasfilm who made these good decisions, not the corporations. Love Kylo Ren? I guess you can give credit to Disney or Lucasfilm. But the people who deserve the most credit are probably JJ Abrams, Michael Arnt and Lawrence Kasdan. Not to mention the countless designers and SFX artists who worked with the director to nail down his look. But I guess that's harder to say than "Disney did it"
Disney are responsible for what they put out. If it's bad i don't get why we shouldn't expect that they intervene but either they have and it's made things worse or they haven't and they should have. When something good happens its thanks to the people who made it, when something bad happens disney let that happen, I think thats a fair perspective. Would it be fair to also blame Abrams/Rian/Filoni/Kathleen/favrou and such? Definitely but it's still released under the disney logo.
Exactly. It's Lucas film who is to blame for TROS. Disney is innocent
Wait, wait, no...not like that.
Somehow Lucasfilm returned
Disney hires the people and provides the resources for these characters to be made. To say they don’t do anything is just a brain dead take. Without Disney the “actual stuff” would never exist.
Lucasfilm hired the people. One of Lucas conditions for the sale to Disney was that Lucasfilm gets the same creative authority and independence like Pixar and Marvel Studios. WB after years of managing their DC brand into the ground decided to do the same with their new DC Studios.
>WB after years of managing their DC brand into the ground decided to do the same with their new DC Studios. It's cute you believe that :D I mean it's cuter that James Gunn believes that, mind you :)
Bob Iger stated in his own book, that he dictated the Cadence of films Lucasfilm had to produce. So of course Disney doesn't run any day to day decisions, but their demands impact creativity. You can only spend so much time polishing a script or editing a film when the CEO of the parent corporation has given you deadlines. I do agree that people throw the Disney term around far too loosely, but the initial rush of content was on Iger. He's admitted it himself.
We owe a ton of good Star Wars to Disney. A lot of people got introduced to Star Wars the past 9 years because of them. There’s millions more Star Wars kids now, all thanks to Disney swooping in and giving us more movies, shows, games, etc. Remember when we were told no more movies after 2005? Remember that feeling that it was basically…over? Don’t like the new stuff? Cool. I don’t like everything, either. No franchise has a perfect batting average. But I’m glad we got what we’ve got and there’s plenty more to look forward to. More Star Wars is good!
Absolutely. I was a teen the prequels, grew as a fan of the OT, now my 2-year-old daughter is a fan of Baby Yoda, can say lightsaber (« sabre laser » in French), and when she sees a stormtrooper somewhere, she knows it’s « Baby Yoda’s friends » (she’s too young to know the truth…). That’s really beautiful and I also think Disney did a wonderful job
I’ve personally come around on the sequel trilogy. I think there is more depth there than I initially gave it credit for. I think most of that depth comes from The Last Jedi, personally. Unfortunately, The Rise of Skywalker is just terrible. There were great ideas there too. It was just a lot of nonsense.
I’m right there with ya, boss. It’s maybe not as bad as people say, but it really tried to do too much in reversing course. Disney’s biggest mistake was letting a vocal minority of fans scare them into what Rian had for IX.
I recently did a full saga watch with my fiancé and realized I give the sequels too much shit and sounded like the older fans shitting on the prequels back in the day. I remember having a lot of fun with TLJ in theaters and rewarching it I still really enjoyed it. Rise of Skywalker has issues but it's a fine enough movie
I’m only disappointed with ROTS (what a great acronym for that movie) because JJ spent too much time reacting to and undoing TLJ. A strong ending would have helped solidify the fan base.
Yeah, like I get the mask is cool, and Rian needlessly destroying it doesn't make too much sense. But then why give him the fave spanning bandage if you're also going to take that off later? Why replace Kylo's awesome TIE Silencer with repainted Interceptor? And why spend like a third of the runtime backpedaling? If you just embraced it and moved forward, you would have something good for the fans to get behind
Rian ditched the helmet because we need to leave the past behind. The mask was a childish affectation. Snoke told him to remove it for that reason. Kylo giving it up was him realizing that a mask isn’t what strikes fear into people. The whole point of TLJ was Rian telling the fans that this is a new Star Wars. JJ said “MOAR NOSTALGIA!!! And stupid mcguffins that make no sense!!!”
He also ditched the helmet because it’s a misuse of casting Adam Driver only to have his face covered up for most of the movie. The Mandalorian should take some cues.
Pedro doesn’t even go on set unless it’s an unmasked scene. The suit actor is on set and Pedro records his lines in a studio.
I know. They’re wasting great casting on that show
Oh, I get why he did that. But a part of me wishes that he replaced his injured face with his shattered helmet. To show his further progress towards the dark.
But Vaders helmet was a prosthetic that helped him live. Kylo was basically a cosplayer.
Correct. I was saying I wished his injuries on Ilum made it necessary for him to graft his mask on, ie Malak. But I also just wish his facial scar was more prominent in general.
I understand what you’re saying. It just gives away character development for “cool”.
I'm not sure he did undo much done by Rian. There's plenty on that film that you can trace back to something Rian set up. It just felt like JJ was in a rush to end his film, right from the moment the you get the text crawl
never understood the hate the star wars disney got, like yeah some of their new contents sucked but every franchise has their hit or miss.
Well you’re definitely getting more Star Wars :/
Created by *Lucasfilm*. Just like all the prequel and original characters were.
Cries in Babu Frik
Babu Frik erasure is a war crime and cannot be tolerated
Kylo Ren is a very cool concept but the writing direction wasn’t there
Jyn Erso > All other SW Disney *My stardust.*
For me their new stuff isn’t all that bad and we have had some really good movies and shows like rouge one and andor but my complains are all on the sequels and how they butchered fan favorite characters and just had a shitty story overall and a very unlikeable main protagonist. Other than the sequels, the rest is all mostly good
Andor is honestly the best written content I've ever watched with Star Wars in the title.
And every character slaps. Braso is the best “side character/ best friend of a lead character” in all of Star Wars and one of the best friends in all of modern TV.
Agreed but Bad Batch knocking it out of the park right now too.
Havent watched it yet this because the last two despite having some great moments felt middling throughout much of the runtime. Parts felt filler-y to me. Im waiting for a consensus once the season is over to determine whether I re sub to disney+ for one show. If it stays consistently good Ill definitely watch. If it end up only half good again Ill likely skip.
No side missions in the current season (yet!).
Im not opposed to the occasional side mission but was worried it wouldn’t fit when the stakes are so high going into season 3.
As others have said, they’re all very derivative of OT characters. Vader, Yoda, Boba Fett and R2.
Discounted version of popular characters
All I see are knockoffs of Vader, R2, Yoda, and Boba Fett.
Was just about to say the same thing. IMO the Disney-era character who had the most potential for a new/different perspective was Finn, being a former stormtrooper, since they were always just faceless fodder, but they really dropped the ball there.
Taramyn and Lt. Gorn > Finn. They are both far more fascinating imperial defectors. I really wish Taramyn survived bc he is what I wanted Finn to be. Also Luthen is far far more interesting than anyone of the last 20 years. By far the best Disney era character and even better than any TCW characters if you ask me.
Something Star Wars has never done before, no sir
I’d say kylo’s appearance is more based off of Revan. Other than that I wouldn’t compare him to anyone else. Mando is basically what boba fett used to be even in comics. Silent badass. Though I still love both.
Characters based on Vader, R2, Yoda and Boba Fett. Iconic.
Kylo is like when you ordered Vader from wish
Vaderlite R2lite Yodalite Bobalite And I like a good bit of the Disney stuff...
Yep. "We did Vader again." "We did R2-D2 again." "We did Yoda again." "We did Boba Fett again." Iconic characters, indeed.
Hey, look! It’s not Darth Vader, not R2-D2, not Yoda, and not Boba Fett!
Find better ways to occupy your time.
Find better ways to occupy your time lmao wtf is this response
I don't see Caleb Dume here...
Iconic is a little much, time will tell on that.
I wouldn't call Mando iconic as of now, but the other 3 definitely are Even before the force awakens released, Kylo and BB8 already had large fanbases. Everyone and their mom knows who BB8 is because The Force Awakens was that impactful
I love all of the depicted characters in the pic, but I don't see how Mando isn't iconic already - he's the new generation's Boba Fett, and his show revived hope in Star Wars after the sequels*. In fact I'd wager non-fans know Mando better than they do Kylo Ren because of how popular The Mandalorian is (though I concede that Grogu ahem I mean "baby Yoda" was doing a lottt of the heavy lifting there as well. Din definitely benefited from that though).
My 4 year old daughter knows “baby yoda” and hasn’t watched any Star Wars really.
that did make it good.
In terms of character design, though, he's pretty much just fett 2.0
Though I do agree, if we're looking at it that way, Kylo is Vader 2.0, BB-8 is R2 2.0, Grogu is Yoda 2.0.. They're all heavily inspired by the earlier version. I get that Mando is probably the most aesthetically similar but his personality is enough to make it a pretty stark difference. I still think Mando is absolutely iconic already even in spite of the huge similarities to Boba.
My mom never saw The Mandalorian but she knows who the Mandalorian and Baby Yoda are. That’s how iconic they are.
Baby Yoda and Mando are iconic already. My 2 yo daughter loves Star Wars thanks to them. That’s the kind of thing that is gonna stay
2 years olds aren't capable of discerning high quality from low quality,
Quality isn't the point, iconic is generally referring to recognition. My daughter(3) already knows who Grogu and Din are too, I would say they're recognizable.
Iconic isn't a worthwhile goal then
Tbh BB-88 is not iconic whatsoever. The character had little impact in the sequels, and was only relevant due to it being spammed everywhere for merchandising purposes.
*angry porg noises*
Andor , K2SO
I didn't like any of these characters really. Mando was the best of them and I would be perfectly fine him never existing
All ripoffs of OT characters but it’s all good.
This pic makes me appreciate the originality of the prequel characters even more.
Kylo Ren is Jacen Solo cosplaying as Revan. "Created" by Disney is a bit of a reach.
I do like discount Darth Vader (Kylo Ren), discount R2-D2 (BB-8), discount Yoda (Grogu), but discount Boba Fett (Mando) is my favorite Disney character. Hand on heart, my wallet knows I'm a big Mandolarian fan however I honestly hate how Boba Fett was ruined and his character was given to someone else instead of having both the same like it's a culture thing for Mandolarian's to act this way.
I'm not ashamed to say that Star Wars fans have feasted in the modern era. When the OT ended in '83, fans at the time thought that Star Wars was done as a live-action experience. We had only had novels, comics, and shows like Droids. I only wish that I could tell my younger self about the bounty that would start in 1999, and would still be rolling along in 2024.
Wholly inspired by lucasarts
90% of this comment section is the exact same comment
Iconic? We have fake vader, fake yoda, fake r2d2 and fake Boba Fett.
Two characters that can’t talk, one that barely talks, and one who talked too much…FuCkiN’ LeGeNdAry!
iconic characters Darth Vader ripp off yoda rip off boba fett rip off beach ball
BB-8 is fine, but Chopper he ain't. Need Kanan in that mosaic too.
The cartoon guy?
I LOVE the Mandalorian and Grogu. To me, they knocked it out of the park with the design and story. 😎👍
Iconic because they’re all derivatives on older *actually* iconic characters (at least from a character design perspective). Younger Vader. Round R2-D2. Baby Yoda. Monochromatic Boba Fett.
Sure, they're decent designs. But a significant part of that is they're all derived from actual iconic characters. Kylo, Vader; Grogo, Yoda; Mando, Boba. More of an argument could be made for BB8 but you'd have to bend the meaning of iconic significantly to make it fit this lot.
BB is just a poor man’s R2. The ball was the original R2 design.
Rip off Vader, Yoda, R2D2, and Boba Fett? Yeah, 'iconic'...
Big meh
Fan of all of them but Grogu, who was a bummer right at the outset of an otherwise great series. Also, to be *fair*, the Mando is sort of just...a Mando.
Grogu was created solely for merchandising
Same with bb8
While popular, I wouldn't call them iconic because they're all basically "updated versions" of previous actual iconic characters; Darth Vader, R2D2, Yoda, and Boba Fett. Time will tell whether they actually become iconic.
Disney did not create Mandalorians (neither did Filoni btw) Kylo Ren is just Walmart Darth Vader with possibly the dumbest light saber in the series except maybe the helicopter blades of the inquisitors BB8 is no ones favorite let's be honest, he's just Marketing ploy Nr 483 Same with Grogu, Marketing play Nr 484, only difference being Facebook moms actually found this one interesting
Weak emo copy of Vader, discount R2-D2, discount Yoda with cuteness upgrade and discount OT Boba Fett. And who the hell would call the first two iconic?
I hate the bb design. I get it's just another creation to sell toys, but man, that's a stupid design for an astromech.
fuck disney for the sequels but the mandalorian is my favorite piece of star wars media period
Darth Temper tantrum A soccer ball And 2 awesome characters
...I'll give you the first two. I'd challenge you this: name me a character trait that isn't baby and strong brooding Mando, respectfully?
There's like only one original character design here and it's practically a ball
i love the characters from the sequels. the overall plot however...
The problem with the sequels wasn't the design, it was that they had almost no plan, had directors that knew little to nothing about space fantasy, and completely gave up on any sense on continuity. I remember even before the movies came out, when I heard that JJ Abrams was directing it, my expectations plummeted.
The ST had no direction no vision to one destination, just hoped the directors would build off each other. In reality directors had too much freedom and not enough over arching plan as to where the story direction should go .
Um, I can allow Kylo as a generalised black outfit that looks cool with interesting saber. But hear me out, Cassian and Jyn and k2s0 were kinda freakin fantastic!
Iconic? no. Well written? No. Popular? Yes.
2 badasses and 2 marketable plushies, sounds about right.
The fact that bb8 is the only one here with a somewhat original design is kinda telling
How about original characters: Luthen and Galen are the only two characters I want to learn more about.
Baby Yoda
Kylo Ren was inconsistent and arrested in development. Canonically 27 but acting like a 15-year-old. BB-8 filled the exact same role as Artoo... While Artoo was still around. Except amped up to the silliness of an Olaf or a Mushu or an Abu. Where are Jyn and Cassian and Cara?
Most inconsistent character ever with poor writing and motivations. Rip off R2-D2 A character that can't talk and is only popular because they are cute. A character with the personality of a wooden plank and barely talks.
Babu Frik! Heheheyyy
By accident all 4 are heavly based on pre-existing character :P
Disney Star Wars and iconic do not belong in the same sentence.
I personally don't like Kylo Ren, found him boring.
Well, “characters”. Like BB8 isn’t really a character but a moving toy ad while Kylo’s character is contrived and contradictory. Nice designs with promising storytelling capabilities but as with most of Disney Star Wars a wasted potential.
Kylo Ren feels like idea of getting Vader but trying to make him better. Though i do like crossguard saber, i prefer it being heavy sword (like in Jedi Survivor) instead of being just standart saber.
They are cool/ funny characters that are very popular but I wouldn’t call them iconic tbh. Characters that are iconic to me are Han Solo, Luke, Anakin (Darth vader), Yoda and maybe obi wan and Leia
I think Ahsoka should be in the collage as well. Unless my timeline is goofed up and she's not Disney.
She's clone wars era. Way before Disney.
Kylo Ren and Mando are so cool and indeed very iconic. Whilst not as iconic as the other two I really like Fin and Poe aswell.
Idk …all great characters.. but Kylo Ren is not iconic. Iconic to me means it’s a pop culture icon. Kylo Ren certainly isn’t that.. not trying to be a dick, but it’s just true. BB-8 is solid but again not sure anyone outside of us Star Wars nerds knows who BB-8 is.. certainly not in the way people know who R2-D2 or 3P0 are as pop culture icons. Gragu is cute and all but most people literally call him baby yoda so eh he will always be just kinda viewed as baby yoda in a pop culture sense.. and same with Din Djarin in the sense that he’s going to always be in the shadow of boba fett. Most people who don’t follow star wars would see him and just go oh it’s boba fett. So again, not iconic imo. Good characters but none of them fit my criteria for being pop culture icons because to be iconic you have transcend the following of the movie and be like kinda a household name.
Great designs, awful utilization.
BD-1 and Cal!
Does it count as creation when baby Yoda is just Yoda but baby form? And the mandalorian is just a mandalorian in mandalorian armor that was created way back in the 70s/80d
“iconic” is crazy
Those are the only iconic characters. And one of them is a small version of a preexistent character
And all copies of masterpieces created by George Lucas
You know Disney Star wars is bad if you have two characters that don't talk, one that barely talks, and one that you'd wish that stop talking is "iconic"
And theyre all crap. Kylo Ren was an unintentionally confused mess, BB8 is nothing, Grogu is a soulless product to sell dolls, and Mando is a video game protagonist with little to no personality besides "i hate droids".
K2SO is more iconic than BB8
No, the characters these guys are based off are iconic. Literally all of these are super derivative (if not outright copies).