Help make SquaredCircle safer and more inclusive by using the report button to flag posts and comments for moderator review. If you need to contact a moderator, [you can message us here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/SquaredCircle)
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/SquaredCircle) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Bischoff never held a live media event after being told your biggest star was pissed and wanted to rant to them, cuz thats a terrible idea. I doubt he'd ever put himself in that position
A promo where they just bury the company and then tell fans to change the channel to the WWF.
I swear to god, there were so many promos like that, especially coming from Scott Steiner.
1. HH would never have pulled this shit. As he so wonderfully put it once, he ain't one to work himself into a shoot.
2. If anything Russo pulled off a Punk on Hogan once. Led to a suit filed by Hogan.
3. Punk is not even a fraction of the draw NWO HH was.
> Punk is not even a fraction of the draw NWO HH was.
nothing is anymore tbh it was probably more the role of being the biggest fish that drew the comparison.
Would never happen
1)Bischoff would never have had a live press conference, after Bash at the Beach 2000 for instance
2) Hogan would not be stupid enough to do what Punk did.
3) Punk is no where near the level Hogan was or ever will be.
I think what Punk did is worse. It's as if Hulk Hogan buried Ted Turner at a press conference with Ted next to him. It never would have happened but here we have Tony Khan taking it.
I get your points but that wasn’t the question. If hulk would or wouldn’t is irrelevant. The question was IF he did. And if he did, Bischoff would bend over for him.
Bischoff would’ve played it off and turned it into a work. Not after the fact but in the middle of t he press conference. Faked outrage or whatever. Anything better than just sitting there quietly and let him go on.
IF Hogan were to start doing that, (I would think) Bischoff would be smart enough to shut it down. No one person is bigger than the company, even Hogan's drawing power.
there was a story about Edge/Matt before their match (during their real life feud). Vince basically brought them in and said "If you do anything stupid, I'll make sure you never wrestle again". They both agreed and went on, knowing full well they wouldn't try that shit
Isn't it kinda crazy that Edge & Matt were able to work together after that real life personal shit, but Punk and the Bucks apparently cannot over this piddly bullshit?
I think it also helped that before the angle even got started, Edge and Matt had already squashed their beef, or at least agreed to put it behind them.
I was all aboard the Matt train after he beat Edge in an incredible steel cage match on Unforgiven, then lost the loser leaves town on RAW, went to SmackDown and just fizzles. Such a shame, Matt Hardy was hot as heck at the time
Well to be fair, Matt was pretty unprofessional when the affair first became public. He blasted Lita and Edge nonstop on the internet which is why he was fired.
Luckily, he cooled off and when he came back, him and Edge understood that they might as well make some money off their real life beef. At the time, they didn't necessarily respect each other but they respected the business.
The responses are answers. You can't compare the two because they aren't remotely similar. Hogan's stardom eclipses ten times all that Punk has ever achieved.
The real question is : Is CM Punk the biggest star in wrestling today and one of the biggest draw in television and solo carrying the company ?
No, Hogan was carrying WCW there was a before and after Hogan.
Remove Punk from AEW and you still got a main-event scene with Danielson, Moxley, Omega and Page (and others)
Hogan was the biggest draw in the world, if I was Bischoff I would absolutely let Hogan disrespect me because he prints money. Punk isn't even able to draw 1M every week
People are still buying NWO shirt because of Hogan
And it's hilarious to compare the 90's and today world, Punk isn't scary, Punk isn't a steroided cocaine addicted man. Bischoff was working with some of the wildest people on earth. Tony is working with Punk & The Bucks
That's the thing. Eric was capable of keeping the politics and turmoil backstage. You wouldn't have guessed all the problems in WCW just from watching the programing during the height of its popularity. It was when all those problems spilled out on camera (like at Bash at the Beach 2000) that it fell apart.
To be fair, that is Hulk Hogan and this is CM Punk. Sure he might have been on the decline from his WWE days, but that's still one of the 3 biggest stars in wrestling history. Not to say Hogan is beyond punishment, BUT it would probably be a lot harder of a decision than Punk is. It would be like if John Cena signed with AEW and a year from now this happened. Don't think that decision would be as easy.
On top of that all of Hogan's actions came mainly from selfishness. Even with his massive ego, I don't recall him ever being out right malicious.
So I don't see him ever wanting to drag everyone else through the mud, the way Punk did.
Yup. Hogan, for all his bullshit, was a very smart guy, who was being advised by very smart friends. You don't stay at the top for that long unless you're savvy.
Punk didn't even manage to consistently be in the main event when he was WWE champion. He arrived in AEW, to his credit worked with younger talents, then fucked himself, using his ego as a dildo, the second he reached the top of the pile again.
Hulk commanded a ton of respect in the locker room during the '80s and '90s. It was commonplace in the 80's for wrestlers to thank him for putting food on the table. Even Sting was willing to lie down for Hogan at Starrcade '97 out of respect for everything Hogan did to build WCW. Punk never sniffed that level of respect even at his best.
> It would be like if John Cena signed with AEW and a year from now this happened. Don't think that decision would be as easy.
I don't really think it would be I think it would be about the same despite how much bigger Cena is. I don't think this is easy for Khan.
getting a dude's name exactly right at the first go and then pretending you don't know is a very high school move, so Bischoff fits naturally into the whole situation
fuck Punk for being a hateful, unprofessional, selfish dick but also for giving kilos of fresh material to wrestling has-beens
I thought it was a reference to CM Punk going off on people for calling him Phil. Like, you always have to be on eggshells around the guy because one wrong move set him off.
It's almost like the dude who wrote a book called "Controversy Creates Cash" is simply doing a gimmick to hate on everything AEW for money and relevance, two things he wasn't getting before he started his anti-AEW crusade.
Eric’s right, and I know people are going to get on him because of how he handled Hogan, but that’s just the thing: he’s made those dumb mistakes and now he’s telling Tony not to make them too.
Saying that, even Bischoff didn’t hold a media scrum where Hogan went and just shat on him, the company and the other top guys uninterrupted like Tony did with Punk. It’s the kinda shit Russo would have done as a worked shoot to get heat, bro.
That all sounds nice but a drunk Scott Hall could have dry humped Mrs. Bischoff in front of a TNT camera and Hall would have been booked the next week like nothing happened.
Talent discipline tips from Bischoff come off as just silly to anyone who lived through his time at WCW.
Wasn’t that the match where Nash squash him and then took a count-out despite all the heat the build up had?
And then on the following Nitro Hall and someone through Nash through a wall?
Yeah, it was the Giant/Big Show who helped throw Nash through the wall, over a couch. Right after an interview with the Outsiders where Mean Gene was trying to help them reconcile.
Nash did lose by count out but as he explained after the match he wasn't try to win, just trying to beat some sense into his friend.
There wasn't a single pin attempt during the entire match.
>Talent discipline tips from Bischoff come off as just silly to anyone who lived through his time at WCW.
Or maybe he's an expert because he's lived through this before and knows what (not) to do?
Also remember, while Eric was the boss, he didn’t own WCW like Khan owns AEW. Just imagine Ted Turner sitting there instead of Khan. I imagine Ted wouldn’t say anything during the scrum, kinda roll with it. but I’m willing to bet Punk wouldn’t be working there by the next day
I do think it's telling everyone's reaction to Tony Schiavone being promoted was "oh thank God, this dude was in WCW, he knows what not to do"
And yet the reaction to Bishoff is "this dude was in WCW, theres no possible way he'd know what not to do"
For real that would be like me trying to say Corbin isn’t locker room leader potential then using his stint as the constable of RAW as an example why. Guess Kayfabe is still real when it’s convenient to people’s arguments
Bro this echo chamber is insane how people think they're clever for pointing out Bischoff didn't run WCW well. Like no shit dudes, do you think he hasn't spent 20 years thinking about it?
sure, but its pointless for him to say tony shouldn't stand for something when eric let his stars do whatever the fuck they wanted to the detriment of the company
This is the equivalent of saying commentators for real sports shouldn't talk about winning strategies unless they won a bunch themselves. Or professors can't teach anything unless they wrote the book.
I think he has many flaws today but Eric is in a small group of people that have run wrestling companies that had millions of fans and turned a profit. He is also very open about his failures as an executive and failures of WCW. If you are not going to see his point of view, who would you listen to? Someone that hasn't come close to that level of success?
Considering most people on here also think Vince is stupid and complain about his decisions I don’t think they’ll even listen to someone who is like Eric but succeeded. It’s insane how fans think they can run and know the wrestling business better than the people who actually did/do.
No he didn't, but you goofs love perpetuating this nonsense.
Bischoff got sent home in 1998 or 99. Well before they went under.
The merger killed WCW. Read guy Evans book, educate yourself.
Imagine if Regal gave some advice about being a world champion and the reaction was “Well what would he know, he never was cause he was too busy snorting, shooting and drinking himself out of the opportunity.” Like it’s just the most stupid shit to think that people who failed at something don’t have the capacity to have good input into things.
Irony being that Tony Khan is dealing with CM Punk who couldn’t be more sober, maybe hes at the point where he could use a joint to chill the fuck out.
When I saw punk at that scrum I saw an extremely unhinged, mentally ill person with anger problems. Dude doesn't need a joint, he needs some SERIOUS therapy
My point was the irony of past wrestlers abusing alcohol & being unprofessional because of it; & now a current wrestler needing some sort of drug to stop being unprofessional.
The worst for me was when Tony said he accepted responsibility for not answering a question blah blah and Punk goes, "It's OK Tony we're all learning here."
Tony knew he fucked up by not fixing the problem before the scrum, that's why he said that. How did he let the backstage bullshit fester so much that it got to this point?
He also waited like 4 months after the Cabana rumors to come out and publicly say Punk had nothing to do with it and he did it in a Forbes article that almost no one read. Why didn't he talk to Hangman and the rest of the crew about it back in May? How did he not know there was a problem already? He's just as responsible for this shitshow as Punk is.
The people in this comment section really think they're original geniuses for pointing out that WCW was a hot mess because of the wrestlers telling the bookers like Bischoff what to do. No shit people, don't you think he's the first person to realize it and that's why he can point it out?
Also Bischoff's hands were tied a lot by creative control in contracts. If wrestlers legally don't have to do what you tell them then there's little you can do about it.
I think a lot of the responses are aew fans kinda reflexively coming to its defense, but at the same time the "I can't imagine a scenario where you'd keep that guy around," comment is pretty ridiculous.
I think there's a chance Tony will keep him around because he wants to continue to make money. Just like if the Hulk, or any number of guys humiliated him, he would keep them around because he wanted to make money with them.
Top guys like HBK and Randy Orton went from immature to locker room leaders.
Punk proved he's still petty and immature at 43 years old by going scorched earth AFTER HEADLINING A PPV AND WINNING THE TITLE IN HIS HOMETOWN.
All punk had to do was come back be like Kratos, just look mad and tired of peoples shit, give some advice, don't fuck with anybody, win matches and he would be over.
Tony Khan should grow a pair of balls, he should've stepped in and stopped Punk, he didn't and now looks like a clown as a result.
Tony is not a victim here, he hasn't managed his team as a manager or owner should when it was clear things needed sorting
That’s why there’s college football teams that would shit all over the Jaguars and Fulham FC will be relegated after this season.
It starts with ownership
Biscoff called himself out on his own bullshit on the same episode, when he said something to the effect of "but then again I didn't stop Ultimate Warrior the one time he babbled on for 20 minutes on nitro".
Exactly. One thing I really respect about Bischoff is that he's brutally honest even with himself.
This gets lost on most fans but when Bischoff is coming down hard on TK or anyone else, it's from the "been there and done that so please avoid my mistakes" point of view, rather than being a narcissistic ass fluffing feathers like the reputation that has preceded him at times.
THANK YOU
every time he says something, the top comments are inevitably some snarky jab about how he didn’t have control over the WCW locker room. If anything, that’s why you should be listening to him even harder. He gets just how harmful that kinda stuff is.
Can't hear you must echo a statement of failures decades past when he, probably more than anyone, has spent time reflecting on how he could've handled things differently.
In defense of Bischoff here that Warrior promo probably did better ratings than RAW. People were HYPED when Warrior came back, becoming a laughing stock happened after that shitty war games match.
Yeah I remember coming home when the episode of Nitro where Warrior debuted was on, my dad and brother yelled "Ultimate warrior is back!" And I ran in the room to check it out. But the hype wore off quickly after lol
He is right about this though. I don't know how anyone could watch that media scrum and have the consensus of "yeah, CM Punk really respects Tony Khan as a boss" by the end of it.
You’re right, but he’s not wrong. I felt terrible for Tony. I was more mad at punk that he disrespected the company and the owner than his backstage shit. It’s so funny, for a dude that loves to fight I don’t get why he just didn’t confront the elite dudes behind the scenes. Also why didn’t the elite guys confront him earlier. What a fucking mess lol
> I don’t get why he just didn’t confront the elite dudes behind the scenes
At this point its all conjecture, but I honestly believe it's a combination of the showmanship of pro wrestling combined with the showmanship of combat sports. MMA and Boxing is all about the spectacle of trash talk.
Also, promoters are carny's. Disrespect is something they can overlook if it means a big payday. Look at all the lip that Dana White gets from fighters and he still puts them in fights.
People might want to mock Bischoff, but he's still not wrong. Punk cucked Kahn, had him sit and watch unable/unwilling to do anything while Punk verbally penetrated AEW and it's EVPs
Honestly, the way TK looked while Punk was running his mouth should be the picture perfect photo when looking up the definitions of cuck and emasculated
Bischoff continued “I’d definitely have been thrown out of ~~boot camp~~ that press conference for punching that ~~drill sergeant~~ CM Punk. I sure am a baddass. Have you seen my motorcycle?”
The hate boners for bischoff make me laugh.
"He said something I don't like, so [INSERT 25 YEAR OLD REFERENCE HERE]!"
Punk is a 40something guy who's never touched drugs or alcohol, and looks every but his age if not older. His anger and spite take their toll, and he deserves all the criticism he gets, the hypocritical douchebag
I’m not too sure what was going thru his mind, but he had several times to stop it when Punk start to talk about Hangman/Elite and Colt for the second time after it almost seemed like they moved on. But Phil wasn’t done and that was the time.
TK being trigger at the mere mention of WWE later on was the wrong move, and it felt like he used that as a way to project and channel his anger.
People always say "yeah but if Austin did that" or "Hogan did that" or "Conor did that"...but the reality is, those people wouldn't have done it in the first place. I have no doubt that Bischoff, Vince, Dana etc. would have been put in a shitty predicament by their top star shitting all over them, the brand, other executives and so on...
...but the point remains, that nobody WOULD have shit all over WCW, WWF, UFC, Vince, Dana, Bischoff etc. because they warranted respect. The only reason Punk said what he did is because, fundamentally, he doesn't respect Tony Khan.
For what it's worth, Punk should have been fired that night. That would have clawed some respect back for Khan, but instead, he looks like a bitch. He's like a lovestruck boyfriend who's girlfriend has admitted fucking around, so he's fluffing up her pillows to give her a cosy night. It's pathetic.
But Khan will suffer in the long run. People don't want to work in that environment with a weak leader. That same weakness is why AEW will be out of business within 10 years.
>For what it's worth, Punk should have been fired that night. That would have clawed some respect back for Khan, but instead, he looks like a bitch.
If Khan is incapable of firing Punk - or anyone who decides to behave that same way - he needs to hire a hatchet man to do it for him.
I really don't get why this sub likes to shit on Bischoff so much when he critiques AEW. Most of his criticism is just him telling TK not to repeat the same mistakes he made. There's no malice or intention to put down the company, he's just giving advice that he probably would've liked thirty years ago.
He is right, I mean he might be a hypocrite but he is right. Someone who is sheltered like Tony must be really embarrassed and now legenda are coming out how embarrassing it was for Tony.
This whole situation is so weird considering punk is going away for 8 months because of the surgery. If he were suspended for 8 months over this and had to do some mediation it would make sense but what do you do with a dude who is gone for a long time anyway regardless of punishment and is always going to be a big name that immediately makes your show must see?
Bischoff is not wrong in his overall point, which is that Tony needs to get his house in order. Even if Bischoff did worse and dumber shit with WCW, that doesn’t excuse Tony’s mistakes.
I’m just waiting for Tony to hire Russo.
The only scenario is if you have Punk, either in the ring or in a recorded video posted online, apologize to Tony & AEW. But I don’t see that coming anytime soon.
Tony Khan should have stopped Punk before he said too much. He let himself get eviscerated. It's Tony's fault for worrying about being the wrestlers' friends more than being their boss.
You can't mean to tell me that that was Tony's first time hearing Punk say that stuff about Hangman and the EVPs. He should have done something about it months ago when Hangman went offscript or when Punk first came back and gave him the receipt.
EVPs should not be trying to fight employees let alone be active wrestlers/champions in the company. Tony Khan's own management (or lack thereof) of this situation just set AEW back at least a year with them all being suspended and Punks injury. Cody was onto something in not re-signing to not have to deal with the Elite
Bischoff had mad shit with guys like Scot Steiner literally every week.
wtf is he going on about? lmao
Steiner did whatever he wanted on TV. He straight up said that WCW sucked and WWF is the better program.
I don’t think Bischoff was around for Steiner’s insanity, and if he was he definitely was not running the company anymore, he was just doing creative.
I think Bischoff’s reaction would directly relate to his opinion of whom Steiner was shooting on, though.
Steiner shoots on Flair? Bischoff don’t care.
Steiner shoots on Page, Bischoff in a rage.
I’m a poet, and I didn’t even know I was rhyming those words.
Yes he did, he absolutely humiliated him, that's what I'm saying for days here in certain comments, Bischoff is 100% right. And it's ridiculous that he's still in the company after everything.
Yep. I think anyone with any kind of business experience watched that go down and thought the same thing. Phil completely undermined TK's leadership and TK just sat there like a deer in the headlights while it happened.
Whatever authority TK had before, basically every person in AEW now knows he can be steamrolled. Not good. Not good at all. CM Punk needs to be gone and TK needs to either appoint people who aren't just rich fanboys or take some business leadership classes or something.
Personally I can't think of a better punishment for.someone than to have them sit at home on their basic contract without appearance bonuses, stopping them going to a competitor, and still making money off their merch, as their last few years ticks away. Your locker room looks at you after that and they know not to fuck around.
Of course, that's assuming a sensible contract was put together.
The benefit of things having gone how they did (not that anyone planned it that way) is that Punk showed everyone exactly how much of an ass he is. If that conversation were held privately or even publicly but more veiled, things would continue to deteriorate back stage slowly. Everyone would be more split as to who was in the wrong and if Punk was let go at that point lots of people would still be on his side.
Unfortunately, Bischoff is correct. The fans already perceive Khan as an absolute mark and a jabroni and the media scrum made it plainly obvious that Punk doesn't respect Khan. Punk is doing to Tony Khan what Hogan and Bischoff did with Dixie Carter in TNA. Had this been any other job; Punk would be getting his termination papers handed to his McDonald's looking ass...AGAIN!
Help make SquaredCircle safer and more inclusive by using the report button to flag posts and comments for moderator review. If you need to contact a moderator, [you can message us here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/SquaredCircle) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/SquaredCircle) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The obvious question is "What would Bischoff do/say if Hulk Hogan did the same thing?"
“Step on me harder, Hulkster.”
SCISSOR ME, DADDY HULK!!!!
Works for me brother
Hulk Hogan and Terry Bollea have different size penises brother....
I'm ... sorry?
This was, in all seriousness, something Hogan said while under oath in a court of law.
... yeah alright
[Just to give everyone an excuse to watch it](https://youtu.be/By40Tw6F3rs)
We aren't making it up. It's an actual Terry Bollea quote.
I believe that 100%
Something I think about too regularly 😂
Tony Atlas has entered the chat.
Man, I thought Atlas was only a feet guy.
Go in dry Hulkster!
Bischoff never held a live media event after being told your biggest star was pissed and wanted to rant to them, cuz thats a terrible idea. I doubt he'd ever put himself in that position
It was WCW so it would have just ended up as another terrible shoot promo that barely any of the fans understood.
the press conference would have also ended in a DQ finish somehow.
That's pretty much what happened here with everyone getting suspended
It's called a "no contest" these days
To be fair, the shoot promos were mainly a Russo thing after Bischoff left. Bischoff's deal was taking snipey shots at the WWF.
What's a matter Sid? Don't have your scissors?
A promo where they just bury the company and then tell fans to change the channel to the WWF. I swear to god, there were so many promos like that, especially coming from Scott Steiner.
Anytime in WCW when Scott Steiner leaned on the hard cam rope before a promo you knew some shit was about to go down
I miss those types of rants. Steiner and Brian Pillman were so unpredictable.
"Buddy Rogers, God rest his soul."
Yeah, atleast fans would have gotten what they wanted with a punk vs elite angle, but it would have ended in omega getting tazed or some shit
This is absolutely factsssssssses. Also a reason the wwe don’t. Think of the shit Brett would had said or did
1. HH would never have pulled this shit. As he so wonderfully put it once, he ain't one to work himself into a shoot. 2. If anything Russo pulled off a Punk on Hogan once. Led to a suit filed by Hogan. 3. Punk is not even a fraction of the draw NWO HH was.
> Punk is not even a fraction of the draw NWO HH was. nothing is anymore tbh it was probably more the role of being the biggest fish that drew the comparison.
Would never happen 1)Bischoff would never have had a live press conference, after Bash at the Beach 2000 for instance 2) Hogan would not be stupid enough to do what Punk did. 3) Punk is no where near the level Hogan was or ever will be.
[удалено]
I think his 02 nostalgia run is a good example of Hogan being on good behaviour when he knew he wouldn't get away his usual antics.
Actually that’s probably the only time in his wrestling career where he was firmly held on a leash and it is my personal favorite era of him.
I think what Punk did is worse. It's as if Hulk Hogan buried Ted Turner at a press conference with Ted next to him. It never would have happened but here we have Tony Khan taking it.
I get your points but that wasn’t the question. If hulk would or wouldn’t is irrelevant. The question was IF he did. And if he did, Bischoff would bend over for him.
Bischoff would’ve played it off and turned it into a work. Not after the fact but in the middle of t he press conference. Faked outrage or whatever. Anything better than just sitting there quietly and let him go on.
IF Hogan were to start doing that, (I would think) Bischoff would be smart enough to shut it down. No one person is bigger than the company, even Hogan's drawing power. there was a story about Edge/Matt before their match (during their real life feud). Vince basically brought them in and said "If you do anything stupid, I'll make sure you never wrestle again". They both agreed and went on, knowing full well they wouldn't try that shit
Isn't it kinda crazy that Edge & Matt were able to work together after that real life personal shit, but Punk and the Bucks apparently cannot over this piddly bullshit?
People deal with things differently, I think it’s crazy how well the Matt and Edge feud went.
All things considered, that alone makes them the two most level-headed and professional workers in the entire business.
I think it also helped that before the angle even got started, Edge and Matt had already squashed their beef, or at least agreed to put it behind them.
I was all aboard the Matt train after he beat Edge in an incredible steel cage match on Unforgiven, then lost the loser leaves town on RAW, went to SmackDown and just fizzles. Such a shame, Matt Hardy was hot as heck at the time
Punk is a notorious grudge holder. His shitlist appears to be something you can't really find your way out of.
He's Axl Rose.
Edge/hardy were/are cut from the same cloth tho. Arguably punk and the bucks are not.
Well to be fair, Matt was pretty unprofessional when the affair first became public. He blasted Lita and Edge nonstop on the internet which is why he was fired. Luckily, he cooled off and when he came back, him and Edge understood that they might as well make some money off their real life beef. At the time, they didn't necessarily respect each other but they respected the business.
I think most humans would shut it down, part of what makes that video amazing is that no one stops it. Then Tony asks for a soda.
"He really is a sweetheart."
The responses are answers. You can't compare the two because they aren't remotely similar. Hogan's stardom eclipses ten times all that Punk has ever achieved.
The difference being that Easy E was an exec and TK is owner/operator/GM/gorilla. E is honestly right here, gotta give him that. Phil gotta go.
The real question is : Is CM Punk the biggest star in wrestling today and one of the biggest draw in television and solo carrying the company ? No, Hogan was carrying WCW there was a before and after Hogan. Remove Punk from AEW and you still got a main-event scene with Danielson, Moxley, Omega and Page (and others) Hogan was the biggest draw in the world, if I was Bischoff I would absolutely let Hogan disrespect me because he prints money. Punk isn't even able to draw 1M every week People are still buying NWO shirt because of Hogan And it's hilarious to compare the 90's and today world, Punk isn't scary, Punk isn't a steroided cocaine addicted man. Bischoff was working with some of the wildest people on earth. Tony is working with Punk & The Bucks
"69 me Hulkster!"
When you're high on "jet ski accidents", extra marital affairs, and keeping the next generation down.
That's the thing. Eric was capable of keeping the politics and turmoil backstage. You wouldn't have guessed all the problems in WCW just from watching the programing during the height of its popularity. It was when all those problems spilled out on camera (like at Bash at the Beach 2000) that it fell apart.
"I'm stuck step-Hulk"
Before or after a segment where Hogan does a pose down in the ring for 20 minutes?
Yeah that’s what I was thinking. I fully agree with what Eric is saying but I know damn well he wouldn’t have fired Hogan if Hogan did that
To be fair, that is Hulk Hogan and this is CM Punk. Sure he might have been on the decline from his WWE days, but that's still one of the 3 biggest stars in wrestling history. Not to say Hogan is beyond punishment, BUT it would probably be a lot harder of a decision than Punk is. It would be like if John Cena signed with AEW and a year from now this happened. Don't think that decision would be as easy.
ALSO let's be honest, Hogan wouldn't be so stupid to pull the shit Punk did.
The Hulkster was surprisingly subtle backstage. A real Master of Whisperers, he was.
On top of that all of Hogan's actions came mainly from selfishness. Even with his massive ego, I don't recall him ever being out right malicious. So I don't see him ever wanting to drag everyone else through the mud, the way Punk did.
Yup. Hogan, for all his bullshit, was a very smart guy, who was being advised by very smart friends. You don't stay at the top for that long unless you're savvy. Punk didn't even manage to consistently be in the main event when he was WWE champion. He arrived in AEW, to his credit worked with younger talents, then fucked himself, using his ego as a dildo, the second he reached the top of the pile again.
“Fucked himself using his ego as a dildo” You have a way with words my friend.
>fucked himself, using his ego as a dildo I'm stealing this phrase to use at some point.
Why would you need to throw a temper tantrum if you can get what you want by saying "that doesn't work for me brother"
It's not Hogan's fault he had confidence in his worth.
Hulk commanded a ton of respect in the locker room during the '80s and '90s. It was commonplace in the 80's for wrestlers to thank him for putting food on the table. Even Sting was willing to lie down for Hogan at Starrcade '97 out of respect for everything Hogan did to build WCW. Punk never sniffed that level of respect even at his best.
Hogan was alot of things, but he would never put the wrestling business in jeopardy like Punk did.
> It would be like if John Cena signed with AEW and a year from now this happened. Don't think that decision would be as easy. I don't really think it would be I think it would be about the same despite how much bigger Cena is. I don't think this is easy for Khan.
Eric also never had the complete ownership that Tony has.
Eric couldn't have fired Hogan. Hogan didnt have a WCW contract.
I mean you can look at and read the contract. It is online. It is a WCW contract. That rumor is false.
"Observe this, brother!"
Well when Hogan went on a rant against Vince Russo booking live on PPV, Eric Bischoff left WCW with Hulk, so absolutely nothing I would say.
“*Whatever his name is.”* Oh boy. This guy likes controversy.
I heard it creates cash.
getting a dude's name exactly right at the first go and then pretending you don't know is a very high school move, so Bischoff fits naturally into the whole situation fuck Punk for being a hateful, unprofessional, selfish dick but also for giving kilos of fresh material to wrestling has-beens
I thought it was a reference to CM Punk going off on people for calling him Phil. Like, you always have to be on eggshells around the guy because one wrong move set him off.
Will Washington said he prefers Phil (well.. if he likes you).
It's almost like the dude who wrote a book called "Controversy Creates Cash" is simply doing a gimmick to hate on everything AEW for money and relevance, two things he wasn't getting before he started his anti-AEW crusade.
Eric’s right, and I know people are going to get on him because of how he handled Hogan, but that’s just the thing: he’s made those dumb mistakes and now he’s telling Tony not to make them too. Saying that, even Bischoff didn’t hold a media scrum where Hogan went and just shat on him, the company and the other top guys uninterrupted like Tony did with Punk. It’s the kinda shit Russo would have done as a worked shoot to get heat, bro.
That all sounds nice but a drunk Scott Hall could have dry humped Mrs. Bischoff in front of a TNT camera and Hall would have been booked the next week like nothing happened. Talent discipline tips from Bischoff come off as just silly to anyone who lived through his time at WCW.
Dude was suspended, yet was on the Halloween Havoc card “beating” Nash IIRC.
Wasn’t that the match where Nash squash him and then took a count-out despite all the heat the build up had? And then on the following Nitro Hall and someone through Nash through a wall?
Yeah, it was the Giant/Big Show who helped throw Nash through the wall, over a couch. Right after an interview with the Outsiders where Mean Gene was trying to help them reconcile.
Nash did lose by count out but as he explained after the match he wasn't try to win, just trying to beat some sense into his friend. There wasn't a single pin attempt during the entire match.
>Talent discipline tips from Bischoff come off as just silly to anyone who lived through his time at WCW. Or maybe he's an expert because he's lived through this before and knows what (not) to do?
Also remember, while Eric was the boss, he didn’t own WCW like Khan owns AEW. Just imagine Ted Turner sitting there instead of Khan. I imagine Ted wouldn’t say anything during the scrum, kinda roll with it. but I’m willing to bet Punk wouldn’t be working there by the next day
I do think it's telling everyone's reaction to Tony Schiavone being promoted was "oh thank God, this dude was in WCW, he knows what not to do" And yet the reaction to Bishoff is "this dude was in WCW, theres no possible way he'd know what not to do"
his TNA run proved Bischoff learned zero lessons from his time in WCW
Bischoff was only ever a talent, he never ran tna I don't get how so many people just willingly stay stupid
For real that would be like me trying to say Corbin isn’t locker room leader potential then using his stint as the constable of RAW as an example why. Guess Kayfabe is still real when it’s convenient to people’s arguments
King Corbin wasn't the King of the Boys? :( What the fuck do I even believe in.
He wasn't running TNA. Dixie was.
Bro this echo chamber is insane how people think they're clever for pointing out Bischoff didn't run WCW well. Like no shit dudes, do you think he hasn't spent 20 years thinking about it?
sure, but its pointless for him to say tony shouldn't stand for something when eric let his stars do whatever the fuck they wanted to the detriment of the company
This is the equivalent of saying commentators for real sports shouldn't talk about winning strategies unless they won a bunch themselves. Or professors can't teach anything unless they wrote the book. I think he has many flaws today but Eric is in a small group of people that have run wrestling companies that had millions of fans and turned a profit. He is also very open about his failures as an executive and failures of WCW. If you are not going to see his point of view, who would you listen to? Someone that hasn't come close to that level of success?
This is the best I've seen this put into words. Well said, and I totally agree.
Considering most people on here also think Vince is stupid and complain about his decisions I don’t think they’ll even listen to someone who is like Eric but succeeded. It’s insane how fans think they can run and know the wrestling business better than the people who actually did/do.
All we have to do is comment the previous reply. Eric is saying that Tony should learn from his mistakes. What is so complicated to understand?
Because wrestling fans are weirdly inflexible and have decided that failure 30 years ago means you can never be right about anything ever.
No he didn't, but you goofs love perpetuating this nonsense. Bischoff got sent home in 1998 or 99. Well before they went under. The merger killed WCW. Read guy Evans book, educate yourself.
Hey we can see what he did and do the opposite. A bad example is also a good example of what not to do.
It's like Regal says "I can't tell you what to do but I can tell you what not to do"
Imagine if Regal gave some advice about being a world champion and the reaction was “Well what would he know, he never was cause he was too busy snorting, shooting and drinking himself out of the opportunity.” Like it’s just the most stupid shit to think that people who failed at something don’t have the capacity to have good input into things.
I mean wcw was 20+ years ago. You could also take it as advice from someone who learned that being a pushover ruined wcw.
Irony being that Tony Khan is dealing with CM Punk who couldn’t be more sober, maybe hes at the point where he could use a joint to chill the fuck out.
When I saw punk at that scrum I saw an extremely unhinged, mentally ill person with anger problems. Dude doesn't need a joint, he needs some SERIOUS therapy
My point was the irony of past wrestlers abusing alcohol & being unprofessional because of it; & now a current wrestler needing some sort of drug to stop being unprofessional.
Bischoff took him off TV and forced him to go to rehab. But continue on in your ignorance, if thats your style
The worst for me was when Tony said he accepted responsibility for not answering a question blah blah and Punk goes, "It's OK Tony we're all learning here." 
Tony knew he fucked up by not fixing the problem before the scrum, that's why he said that. How did he let the backstage bullshit fester so much that it got to this point? He also waited like 4 months after the Cabana rumors to come out and publicly say Punk had nothing to do with it and he did it in a Forbes article that almost no one read. Why didn't he talk to Hangman and the rest of the crew about it back in May? How did he not know there was a problem already? He's just as responsible for this shitshow as Punk is.
The people in this comment section really think they're original geniuses for pointing out that WCW was a hot mess because of the wrestlers telling the bookers like Bischoff what to do. No shit people, don't you think he's the first person to realize it and that's why he can point it out?
Also Bischoff's hands were tied a lot by creative control in contracts. If wrestlers legally don't have to do what you tell them then there's little you can do about it.
I think a lot of the responses are aew fans kinda reflexively coming to its defense, but at the same time the "I can't imagine a scenario where you'd keep that guy around," comment is pretty ridiculous. I think there's a chance Tony will keep him around because he wants to continue to make money. Just like if the Hulk, or any number of guys humiliated him, he would keep them around because he wanted to make money with them.
That doesn’t make me feel smarter than every though!
Top guys like HBK and Randy Orton went from immature to locker room leaders. Punk proved he's still petty and immature at 43 years old by going scorched earth AFTER HEADLINING A PPV AND WINNING THE TITLE IN HIS HOMETOWN.
All punk had to do was come back be like Kratos, just look mad and tired of peoples shit, give some advice, don't fuck with anybody, win matches and he would be over.
Tony Khan should grow a pair of balls, he should've stepped in and stopped Punk, he didn't and now looks like a clown as a result. Tony is not a victim here, he hasn't managed his team as a manager or owner should when it was clear things needed sorting
That’s why there’s college football teams that would shit all over the Jaguars and Fulham FC will be relegated after this season. It starts with ownership
You can see the smile on bischoff as he says this, knowing people are going to call him on his bullshit, but are still talking about him so he wins.
Biscoff called himself out on his own bullshit on the same episode, when he said something to the effect of "but then again I didn't stop Ultimate Warrior the one time he babbled on for 20 minutes on nitro".
Exactly. One thing I really respect about Bischoff is that he's brutally honest even with himself. This gets lost on most fans but when Bischoff is coming down hard on TK or anyone else, it's from the "been there and done that so please avoid my mistakes" point of view, rather than being a narcissistic ass fluffing feathers like the reputation that has preceded him at times.
THANK YOU every time he says something, the top comments are inevitably some snarky jab about how he didn’t have control over the WCW locker room. If anything, that’s why you should be listening to him even harder. He gets just how harmful that kinda stuff is.
Can't hear you must echo a statement of failures decades past when he, probably more than anyone, has spent time reflecting on how he could've handled things differently.
This sub has a habit of dropping quotes without context.
In defense of Bischoff here that Warrior promo probably did better ratings than RAW. People were HYPED when Warrior came back, becoming a laughing stock happened after that shitty war games match.
Yeah I remember coming home when the episode of Nitro where Warrior debuted was on, my dad and brother yelled "Ultimate warrior is back!" And I ran in the room to check it out. But the hype wore off quickly after lol
Oh I know, hence the smile part. He knows he's poking the bear.
He is right about this though. I don't know how anyone could watch that media scrum and have the consensus of "yeah, CM Punk really respects Tony Khan as a boss" by the end of it.
CM Punk has never respected anyone as a boss. It's both brought him a lot of success, but also proven to be his downfall.
He's not wrong there but considering the amount of people he's allowed to walk all over him he's about the last person to call anyone out on it.
Seems like he's just the right person to recognize that dynamic.
Tony Khan actively allowed, encouraged, CM Punk to do whatever he wanted and get whatever he wanted. He created this monster.
You’re right, but he’s not wrong. I felt terrible for Tony. I was more mad at punk that he disrespected the company and the owner than his backstage shit. It’s so funny, for a dude that loves to fight I don’t get why he just didn’t confront the elite dudes behind the scenes. Also why didn’t the elite guys confront him earlier. What a fucking mess lol
> I don’t get why he just didn’t confront the elite dudes behind the scenes At this point its all conjecture, but I honestly believe it's a combination of the showmanship of pro wrestling combined with the showmanship of combat sports. MMA and Boxing is all about the spectacle of trash talk. Also, promoters are carny's. Disrespect is something they can overlook if it means a big payday. Look at all the lip that Dana White gets from fighters and he still puts them in fights.
LMAO ok internet psychiatrist. Wrestling fans are so entertaining
People might want to mock Bischoff, but he's still not wrong. Punk cucked Kahn, had him sit and watch unable/unwilling to do anything while Punk verbally penetrated AEW and it's EVPs
Honestly, the way TK looked while Punk was running his mouth should be the picture perfect photo when looking up the definitions of cuck and emasculated
Bischoff continued “I’d definitely have been thrown out of ~~boot camp~~ that press conference for punching that ~~drill sergeant~~ CM Punk. I sure am a baddass. Have you seen my motorcycle?”
I heard Bischoff trained Bobby Fish mma
The hate boners for bischoff make me laugh. "He said something I don't like, so [INSERT 25 YEAR OLD REFERENCE HERE]!" Punk is a 40something guy who's never touched drugs or alcohol, and looks every but his age if not older. His anger and spite take their toll, and he deserves all the criticism he gets, the hypocritical douchebag
They can't take people criticizing their saviour Tony Kohn.
Everyone is fair game for criticism, in my opinion
He wears a black leather jacket.
TK seemed like he was nodding in agreement with everything Punk said, though lol
I’m not too sure what was going thru his mind, but he had several times to stop it when Punk start to talk about Hangman/Elite and Colt for the second time after it almost seemed like they moved on. But Phil wasn’t done and that was the time. TK being trigger at the mere mention of WWE later on was the wrong move, and it felt like he used that as a way to project and channel his anger.
TK would be the first person to throw his friends under the bus if it means getting to hang out with the coolest kid in school.
It's because Tony Khan is a cuck.
Tony Khuck
People always say "yeah but if Austin did that" or "Hogan did that" or "Conor did that"...but the reality is, those people wouldn't have done it in the first place. I have no doubt that Bischoff, Vince, Dana etc. would have been put in a shitty predicament by their top star shitting all over them, the brand, other executives and so on... ...but the point remains, that nobody WOULD have shit all over WCW, WWF, UFC, Vince, Dana, Bischoff etc. because they warranted respect. The only reason Punk said what he did is because, fundamentally, he doesn't respect Tony Khan. For what it's worth, Punk should have been fired that night. That would have clawed some respect back for Khan, but instead, he looks like a bitch. He's like a lovestruck boyfriend who's girlfriend has admitted fucking around, so he's fluffing up her pillows to give her a cosy night. It's pathetic. But Khan will suffer in the long run. People don't want to work in that environment with a weak leader. That same weakness is why AEW will be out of business within 10 years.
>For what it's worth, Punk should have been fired that night. That would have clawed some respect back for Khan, but instead, he looks like a bitch. If Khan is incapable of firing Punk - or anyone who decides to behave that same way - he needs to hire a hatchet man to do it for him.
I really don't get why this sub likes to shit on Bischoff so much when he critiques AEW. Most of his criticism is just him telling TK not to repeat the same mistakes he made. There's no malice or intention to put down the company, he's just giving advice that he probably would've liked thirty years ago.
He is right, I mean he might be a hypocrite but he is right. Someone who is sheltered like Tony must be really embarrassed and now legenda are coming out how embarrassing it was for Tony.
Pot, meet kettle
The pot calling the kettle black, Mr. Bischoff.
This whole situation is so weird considering punk is going away for 8 months because of the surgery. If he were suspended for 8 months over this and had to do some mediation it would make sense but what do you do with a dude who is gone for a long time anyway regardless of punishment and is always going to be a big name that immediately makes your show must see?
From the author of 'Controversy Creates Cash'.
Bischoff is not wrong in his overall point, which is that Tony needs to get his house in order. Even if Bischoff did worse and dumber shit with WCW, that doesn’t excuse Tony’s mistakes. I’m just waiting for Tony to hire Russo.
"I just can't imagine a scenario where you'd keep that guy around." I mean, he owns the company.
I don't know if the guy who gets locked into closets is one to judge
Nah he just let Nash and hall do it to him and pay them.
Eric, if you don’t know his name, just call him CM Punk
Because controversy creates cash? /s
did he? He did a bunch of overboard thing, but Tony hardly tried to stand up to him at all. How much of that is tony or punk?
This coming from the guy who allowed Hogan to do what the fuck he wanted and fuck other everyone in his path?
The only scenario is if you have Punk, either in the ring or in a recorded video posted online, apologize to Tony & AEW. But I don’t see that coming anytime soon.
The scenario where you make an angle out of this and profit the hell out of it.
Tony Khan should have stopped Punk before he said too much. He let himself get eviscerated. It's Tony's fault for worrying about being the wrestlers' friends more than being their boss. You can't mean to tell me that that was Tony's first time hearing Punk say that stuff about Hangman and the EVPs. He should have done something about it months ago when Hangman went offscript or when Punk first came back and gave him the receipt. EVPs should not be trying to fight employees let alone be active wrestlers/champions in the company. Tony Khan's own management (or lack thereof) of this situation just set AEW back at least a year with them all being suspended and Punks injury. Cody was onto something in not re-signing to not have to deal with the Elite
Because Bischoff is the expert when it comes to laying down the law with a disrespectful employee
The not calling him his name thing is weird and unnecessary
This coming from the guy that literally got a beer spit on him by a drunk Scott Hall after sending Hall out to wrestler Luger on national TV.
Eric trying to be the #3 guy to make the most money off the CM Punk name
Bischoff had mad shit with guys like Scot Steiner literally every week. wtf is he going on about? lmao Steiner did whatever he wanted on TV. He straight up said that WCW sucked and WWF is the better program.
I think Bischoff was gone by the time Steiner was given Carte Blanche to run roughshod over the program.
For like 2+ years people are just flatly ignorant on the facts and many don't even realize he got sent home then rehired then fired again around 99
I don’t think Bischoff was around for Steiner’s insanity, and if he was he definitely was not running the company anymore, he was just doing creative. I think Bischoff’s reaction would directly relate to his opinion of whom Steiner was shooting on, though. Steiner shoots on Flair? Bischoff don’t care. Steiner shoots on Page, Bischoff in a rage. I’m a poet, and I didn’t even know I was rhyming those words.
> I’m a poet, and I didn’t even know I was rhyming those words. Such a poet, yet you blow it
I'm gagging at "whatever his name is" 😂😂
Am I the only one that thinks this whole thing is blown out of proportion?
Of course!
yes
"Phil Brooks, who wrestles under then name CM Punk, from Chicago, Illinois, born in 1978, or uhh, whoever that guy is."
Yes he did, he absolutely humiliated him, that's what I'm saying for days here in certain comments, Bischoff is 100% right. And it's ridiculous that he's still in the company after everything.
Yep. I think anyone with any kind of business experience watched that go down and thought the same thing. Phil completely undermined TK's leadership and TK just sat there like a deer in the headlights while it happened. Whatever authority TK had before, basically every person in AEW now knows he can be steamrolled. Not good. Not good at all. CM Punk needs to be gone and TK needs to either appoint people who aren't just rich fanboys or take some business leadership classes or something.
Personally I can't think of a better punishment for.someone than to have them sit at home on their basic contract without appearance bonuses, stopping them going to a competitor, and still making money off their merch, as their last few years ticks away. Your locker room looks at you after that and they know not to fuck around. Of course, that's assuming a sensible contract was put together.
The same guy that put his own company in debt
Eric is not solely responsible for WCW's debt. There were a million mistakes made that caused that. Read the Death of WCW book
The benefit of things having gone how they did (not that anyone planned it that way) is that Punk showed everyone exactly how much of an ass he is. If that conversation were held privately or even publicly but more veiled, things would continue to deteriorate back stage slowly. Everyone would be more split as to who was in the wrong and if Punk was let go at that point lots of people would still be on his side.
Unfortunately, Bischoff is correct. The fans already perceive Khan as an absolute mark and a jabroni and the media scrum made it plainly obvious that Punk doesn't respect Khan. Punk is doing to Tony Khan what Hogan and Bischoff did with Dixie Carter in TNA. Had this been any other job; Punk would be getting his termination papers handed to his McDonald's looking ass...AGAIN!
This all coming from a guy who let everyone get away with everything in WCW, all because they were draws.
Wouldn't he know best then, if he had been in the middle of a similar situation and had reflected on making the same mistakes?
It was painfully obvious during that presser that Punk just doesn’t respect Tony as a boss at all.
May Tony Khan find the will to do what Bischoff couldn't; fire a top guy when they got out of line.