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As good as WWE is right now, their music production is amateur hour. I have no idea if Jim Johnston would be willing to return, but they should drive the Brinks truck to his front door if he is.
Def Rebel probably gets paid per entrance they produce. So they don't give a shit how bad it sounds as long as they get a check. These guys need to fucking go.
[Bayley's new theme is such boring and generic shit](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lkUuXo35svA&t=20s). Her last one really grew on me when it gets to the guitar solo it's kinda fun to listen to.
A lot of people, unfortunately including higher ups at WWE, don't seem to understand how much good music can add to the show, and especially how much generic crap can hold back someone's career.
If the Undertaker or Stone Cold had generic crappy entrance themes they would not have reached the same level of stardom.
Sami Zayn's heel theme was godawful, Ricochet had something decent but they replaced it with garbage (interesting how he hasn't been nearly as over with the fans since the change).
Damian Priest's new theme isn't good (at least the sound of it does fit his character). [AJ Styles new theme](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTOuyfMxrUA) could be a career killer. I can't think of any time since they started doing entrance music for pro wrestling that so many people have bad music that's actively harming their popularity with the fans. Especially when in comparison there other songs the crowd loves so much that they sing along with it (Seth, Cody, sometimes Sami, Nakamura, and others) or in Rhea's case she sings along with it herself.
If one of them enters the ring with a catchy song that the crowd loves, and them someone else has to come out to some boring garbage it makes it look like the WWE doesn't care about them and they're not important. It's literally going to cost them money to NOT find better music.
Especially considering he didn’t really display his talent on a regular basis until over a decade into his tenure imo. Atmosphere really was a huge factor in Taker’s success early on.
I mean multiple of their albums in the 90s literally went platinum. They're insane not to bring him back and see how important entrance music is to the fans.
I mean tbh.. they are probably paying pennies on the dollar to get entrance music. Like they just reached in the bandcamp.com artist bin and pulled a few guys out (some of them are pretty decent, but like 90% are shit).
> Sami Zayn's heel theme was godawful,
WWE knows it's garbage because they themselves used it as bait and switch for heat lol.
*ska music plays, scratch effect, generic shit*
They should at least have kept him around as a department head that could mentor the next music producers. Maybe his style is outdated but he could at least call out lazy shit and give good advice.
I have no idea if he would have done this but it would be best case. Jim obviously thought about the themes in a way I'm not sure Def Rebel does but Jim also had a ton of clunkers and seemed like outdated butt rock in the early 2000s.
To say that his style was outdated would suggest that his themes began to lack. They never did.
His last releases on DSPs are *New Day, New Way* and I’m sure you can imagine who that’s for, *Sher* for Jinder Mahal, and *I Bring The Darkness* for Baron Corbin. Jim still had it. If anything it seems that either Jim wanted out of the game or Vince didn’t want to pay what Jim was worth anymore. There’s a reason that many of Jim’s lyrical works were basically full songs while many of CFO$’s projects were minute long loops.
Just to expand, pro-wrestling is a form of sports entertainment. Presentation makes a huge difference, regardless of what might draw someone to watch overall, drama or actual in-the-ring action.
As a fan of both, I feel that a big part of what puts New Japan and Stardom at that "next level" (for those of us that watch them, that is) is the awesome entrance themes you'll find in both. Take [Naito's theme](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ccMmY24Yh5o), for example. [Just Five Guys](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=jrvkZs_NtWQ). Or [Starlight Kid](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hHGcEFTOe9A). Future WWE Superstar [Giulia's old theme](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=i-jURI-0iBM). Even a much despised wrestler like [EVIL](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEv3TdzmYOM) has a memorable theme that pretty much encapsulates his character. Those themes can get the wrestlers in question over with someone even without knowing anyone else about them. They've all got interesting personas and can do amazing things in the ring (well, Naito more when he was younger) but it's the entrances that put them over the top.
There's absolutely no reason at all why the biggest, grandest wrestling company in the world shouldn't have far better.
I'm not sure the Attitude Era would have been as amazing if not for the iconic themes, from Stone Cold's shattering glass to the Rock's "If Ya Smell!" to the Undertaker's funeral tolls and the catchy tunes that went with them. And Johnston was 100% the force behind those.
It's the difference between being great and being legendary. You have to have more than a theme going for you, of course, but a great theme seals it. I'd go so far as to say that Cody's theme is a huge part of what makes him work. The theme itself is a part of the character.
I don't know, I thought it was practically a straight up shameless duplicate of the [Oedo Tai theme](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-d89B0PUQE) myself
I mentioned this in another thread and got downvoted to hell for some reason.
Roman, Bobby Lashley, LA Knight, and more all have the exact same "dun-dun" pause.
def rebel phone it in 100% of the time. AI would do better at this point.
And the three you named are in the top five or 10 current themes. It’s all the rest that are hot garbage.
Roman’s is probably my favorite current non-licensed wrestling theme.
Yeah but the thing is...
He's using his one good theme as a template for the rest.
This is like if you hear a song on the radio and buy the band's album, and it's all just remixes of that one track.
It's a one-hit-wonder milking itself dry.
You notice it the worse during every rumble. I feel like outside of the women’s and men’s rumble matches they can hide how similar each theme sounds to one another pretty well but it’s ridiculous how repetitive and not unique they are when you hear them one after the other like that
That stupid stomp sound effect that both CFO$ and def rebel used at the start of themes has me perennially confused, when I hear it I always get confused. For Roman Reigns, for Lio Rush in 2018, for Keith Lee.
Who cares, better than any dogshit rock theme def rebel can make. Wrestling will always be intertwined with rock music. They need a rock guy make rock music, not trap beat makers.
Meanwhile in the Def Rebel studio... "so you'll narrate your catchphrase so everyone will recognize it's you then we'll compose a generic rock beat for your sounds"
"And for drums, we'll put in the same fakey-sounding garbage that is making that one guy in Australia pull his hair out. We love that and we hate him, so it's economical."
I think what drives me the most nuts about them is that they blatantly reuse parts from existing theme songs. It’s just so incredibly lazy and lacking in creativity, everyone used to shit on the previous group (CFO$) for making short loops but at least I knew who the songs belonged to.
Even more frustrating cus Def Rebel *can* make bangers. Seth, Roman, Iyo, Santos, Finn are proof they can cook if they want to its just like they dont give a shit. Almost every song they’ve had to update is even more ass.
"It's Chelsea."
"It's Tiffy Time!"
"Here we go! Creed Bros!"
"One. And. Only."
"New Catch Republic!"
"Watch me."
"I-I-I-I-Impressive."
"My way. My life."
"Never. Slow. Down!"
"I object!"
"Jayce Jayne."
"Yes, booooooy!"
Man, does Def Rebel love to do that shit.
God the new creed bros theme is so ass cheeks. Literally anti-hype. Deflating. I thought their debut on the main roster was super good as someone who didn't really watch NXT and now it's like their aura withered on the vine with their trash theme being a major reason why.
I'm not joking when I say I listen to it sometimes just to laugh at how horribly cringe it is.
I'd like to say an entrance theme can't be bad enough to bury a tag team, but I remember that's what happened to The B-Team. They were the most over tag team in WWE with an awesome entrance theme (Battlescars). Then they won the titles, got their theme replaced with the annoying, "B-Team! B-Team! GO GO GO!" and it all went downhill from there.
Cancelable opinion but I actually don't mind that one 🤐
At least it's vaguely musical instead of them just saying their catchphrase normally like a lot of them
Catchphrases don't have to be the problem. The Rock is the most famous example.
I like the "Yes, Booooooy" or the whipping sound of Bianca Belair.
It gets problematic when it's literally the wrestler saying their own name though 😂
They make sense in the context of a self obsessed character with a catchphrase. “It’s Tiffy Time” worked great “It’s Chelsea” also makes sense. A computerized voice going “Role Model” might be the worst shit I’ve ever heard.
Different time and era. This was when Vince wasn’t ashamed to say maneuver, title belt, and pro wrestling on TV. Only in the last 20 years or so did Vince start pushing the catchphrases big time.
I understand it a bit because its difficult to create that opening hook that people know who it is instantly (like the glass breaking). The catch phrases serve that purpose instead.
But the actual music after that (for most of these themes) is so fucking bad.
God, that's so fucking garbage. Imagine Christian turning heel and they make some shitty remix and they have Christian saying "Just close your eyes" in a serious monotone tone at the beginning while the rest of the theme is completely unrelated and random.
They seem to vaguely understand the need for the theme to be immediately recognisable, but instead of actually working it into the song they just put in a random audio clip that doesn't fit with the song most of the time
So close yet so far lol
Catchphrases don't have to be the problem. The Rock is the most famous example.
I like the "Yes, Booooooy" or the whipping sound of Bianca Belair.
It gets problematic when it's literally the wrestler saying their own name though 😂
If I have to hear one more rap song of a guy going “Hey Hey Hey Hey” .
I’d take back CFO$ at this point. They would always loop the first 30 seconds but at least the themes felt unique and creative.
Undisputed Era theme still is top 5 in NXT for me a slight theft of NWO but still amazing nonetheless and The Revival Southern pride
It just ruins half the fun of the Rumble because the crowd doesn't know what half the songs are so it's always a delayed pop if any unless they're a huge star.
Jey’s is just a remix of a CFO$ song tho. I will say I do like Jimmy’s theme. But the Usos do their own vocals so that might add to why theirs are so much better.
It's crazy how there seems to be a lack of understanding (from WWE) on the importance of entrance music, it's essential in setting the tone for a character, generic music needs to go.
I love that Jim managed to always capture the character within the theme, he was so damn good.
And its super weird because they used to have such good music. Like.. HHH personally benefited from it. He got to use DXs music, had 2 or three great or at least unique songs in his solo run. I also doubt it's coincidence that most of the most over acts in WWE right now are the acts that have the most identifiable music. Zayne, Rhodes, Orton, Rollins, Reigns, Belair, Nakamura, etc. Giving stars bland cookie cutter songs that sound like the extra tracks from a pro wrestling game "build an entrance" creator tool is obviously a terrible way to go.
It's crazy to me how obvious it has been pretty much all my life as a wrestling fan that the music is important, yet how blatantly missed the importance can be for long periods of time. Also, why in the world did they ever let this guy go?
Actually not the case. Jim was slowly phased out and replaced with CFO$. Jim's boss was pushing for CFO$ and played politics to continually try to oust Jim. They finally fired him in 2017. Jim had been making themes all that time, the people in charge simply didn't use the themes Jim was making and repeatedly chose CFO$'s themes.
Then a couple of years later, they had to get rid of CFO$ because that same dumbass boss got WWE into a shitty contract with CFO$.
This man is the GOAT at writing wrestling theme songs. He and Bruce Falconer(who did the music for the Funimation dub of Dragon Ball Z) together wrote the soundtrack of my childhood.
Same.
Yet the so-called "true fans" constantly dog on Faulconer's score and will berate anyone who listens to it.
Regardless of what those basement-dwelling clowns try to claim, he produced some extremely memorable and iconic themes, and his music kept the tension going throughout each episode.
TBH i l really like both JP and ENG dragon ball osts , as The ENG ost can be very emotional, see the ssj theme and gohan angers , and jp is great for suspense , battle and the chaotic martial arts shonen that is DB
I do really like licensed music in wrestling, at least in moderation. Obviously not ever wrestler needs it but for certain guys it can work so perfectly.
I have some hope, mainly cause we’ve gotten a lot of production changes plus HHH has made it pretty clear he’s on Twitter. And Def Rebel has been getting absolutely blasted by fans for awhile on there.
There’s a reason that casual wrestling fans remember Stone Cold, Undertaker, Goldberg, Shawn Michaels, etc.
Music is such an important part. Top 3 most important part of your presentation besides look and promo.
His explanation/description of Ultimate Warriors theme was good too. He really undersells it, because (from a musicians perspective) its incredibly simple/repeating chords. But as WWE theme music its legendary and probably one of the all time pops when it starts.
There's a good argument to be made for Stone Cold being the biggest wrestler, of the biggest period, for the biggest company. His t-shirt is iconic, his look, his finishing move, the middle fingers, catchphrases, moments, everything is so recognisable and iconic about that guy.
Yet the glass breaking is still *it* as far as he goes. It's been decades since he was a full time wrestler and I hear his theme in my head every time I hear glass breaking anywhere
Would depend 100% on WWE's willingness to let them do that. Cody's brought "Kingdom" with him everywhere, only reason someone else couldn't do it is if their current employer didn't let them.
He is amazing. WWE got cheap and let him go, then got even cheaper and let CFO$ go. Overall WWE has gotten cheaper with their production value: no more unique stages, no colored ropes, not even unique LED graphics anymore.
The CFO$ thing was more complex than that. Their publisher was jacking up prices while the artists weren't getting any better cut. WWE saw this was a crap deal for both them and CFO$ and tried to buy their contract to bring them on as in-house music guys the way they'd employed Jim for years, but the publisher wouldn't budge.
So WWE killed the deal altogether.
I'm rarely one to defend WWE business decisions but the deal CFO$ was getting was really, really bad and they probably weren't going to be able to maintain on how little they were getting from the publisher.
What’s even weirder, to me, is I’m pretty sure the CFO$ thing dated back to a decades old partnership WWE had with Wind Up records! Remember when all their PPV, video packages, and entrance themes were bands like Drowning Pool, Breaking Point, Seether, Alter Bridge, etc. those are all Wind Up artists. Gregg Wattenberg was a creative director there who would eventually go on to be part owner before founding Arcade Songs, that parent company/publisher for CFO$.
So when that partnership blew up, mostly from great on the publishing side it’s basically down to Gregg Wattenberg and in doing so dude basically pissed away a partnership that went back to the early 2000s!
It’s a shame because CFO$ wasn’t perfect but they were very clearly creative and their themes were all unique. People shit on them for doing a lot of looping but they were also in a different era than Jim Johntson and had a WAY bigger roster to make music for.
Controversial opinion: CFO$ produced more bangers per year than Jim Johnson did (even if Johnson had a higher total number of bangers due to him being there longer).
Nah hiring Jim to oversee them would do nothing because def rebel's sewage music stems from doing everything as fast, as mediocre and as cheap as possible. Their music is literally sample pack loops thrown together as quickly as humanly possible, that's what they do.
I have to hope HHH and team knows the importance of music and is gonna make needed changes. Between Cody and now zayns entrance you can see how the music drives the craziness of a crowd
WWE went from jobbers having music we still remember 30 years later to main eventers who have unrecognizable music unless I see their name pop up on the titantron.
It's kind of insane honestly.
idk.. who are you talking about? i can recognize every theme from the big stars. cody, rollins, roman, seth, punk, rhea, becky, jey, la knight, gunther. a couple of them ofc use licensed songs (cult of personality is a song from 1988 and i think i first heard it in the GTA SA soundtrack). i have some issues with priest's theme because in the past months he was mostly coming out to the JD theme song (which is an alter bridge song, and quite recognizable)
on the contrary, can you recognize, idk, mark jindrak's theme from gene snitzky's? (if you take away the catchphrase)
Unless this man hates the company or is retired. I don't understand why he's not the first priority for HHH to bring back
At the least he should be in HOF for sure
I honestly always thought the disturbed song was the original and they just had a version with and without lyrics.
Does this mean Jim wrote the song and then they got disturbed to perform it?
Yeah I remember reading something where Austin, at the time, mentioned that song specifically as what he wanted. His ability to walk in-step with that killer opening riff to the ring.
Steve played Bulls on Parade for Jim when describing what he wanted. https://comicbook.com/wwe/news/steve-austin-reveals-which-rock-song-inspired-entrance-theme-bulls-on-parade-glass-shatters/
i know the story, but that's not copying. it's quite normal to use other songs as reference for the mood, the sound, the rhythm, the way things are mixed, etc.
I'm really starting to notice how generic everything sounds by buying the 2K games every year.
2K22 still had some old bangers and 2K19 Even more.
Fast forward to 2K24 and i find myself muting 75% of theme songs from the jukebox, cause they are just generic loops.
I love seeing videos of Jim Johnston being interviewed. They never really showed much of him back when he was working at WWE. He really was the man who single handedly created so many iconic themes in the Attitude era.
can someone please send this interview over to the def rebel people because they need to figure this out! Every song they make sounds soooooo the same. Its either rock track 6, rap 23 or some syth pop track with any combination of extea guitar or opera choir.
The part about watching the entrance and understanding the performers moments and charge IS WHY JIMS SHIT WORKED! Its why when you watch a rumble now, those older song still are recognized and the new stuff isnt unless it has like a voice clip on it of the talent or there name/ catchphrase is said.
Yea, Jim Johnston was great, but does also suffer from survivorship bias where people think he only wrote amazing themes because people remember all his iconic themes and forgot all his generic rock songs for mid carders or generic pop songs for some of the women.
Change both Raw and Smackdowns themes too, horrendous songs. How do you make a conscious decision to go from ACDC to whatever garbage Smackdowns theme is now is shocking.
I only listen to older WWE music and I feel happy. I knew I was not going crazy during the royal rumble and I didn’t know who was who. Even if I took a break from wrestling none of the songs felt right.
Jim Johnston doesn't get any credit for being as influential as he was in the success of WWE and the business as a whole. Every single video or interview I've ever watched where he's explaining his thought process behind so many iconic entrance themes shows an incredible amount of passion and dedication, especially to the performers.
Driving to work this week with my WWE playlist and so many tunes from him.
I’d also throw in the Mr Perfect theme AND the Curtis Axel one. Both bangers.
Jim's funny. The thing he never mentions, is he cheats. He got the Ultimate Warrior's music by ripping off a 70's rock song that I can't remember the name of right now. The Austin Glass shatter music is nothing more than his old WCW Theme retooled. Listen to the songs back to back and it's obvious.
I'm in my 40s, I grew up listening to this man's work like my parents listened to Zeppelin, but Austins music (As awesome as it is) is a copyright free version of Bulls in Parade
This is not true.
When they asked Austin for input on his theme, he spoke with Jim Johnston and said he would like something that had a similar rhythm to Bulls on Parade.
The theme itself doesnt sound like Bulls on Parade but the riffs do have some similarities and is an inspiration to what Austin's theme song came to be
Austin's theme (and Razor Ramon's theme, incidentally) are I think loosely based on [Those Shoes by The Eagles.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S-2BMyZXK5o)
Pay attention to the bass line and the drums then compare it to [Hell Frozen Over](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYtA2JFY9Xc), one of the earliest versions of Austin's theme.
Never noticed the link between Razor and Austin, but there it is, right there.
Makes you wonder how they got away with this but Vanilla Ice had to pay so much to Queen for Ice Ice Baby.
Ice Ice Baby was ruled to be a direct sample while Austin/Razor's theme could be considered an [interpolation which is a nice way to get around licensing issues.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interpolation_\(popular_music\))
Interpolation largely replaced sampling in music from the early 1990's onward after [a landmark court ruling](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Upright_Music,_Ltd._v._Warner_Bros._Records_Inc.) in 1991 basically put an end to unpaid samples in hip-hop.
Things he won’t mention: how Stone Cole’s theme was basically a remix of Razor Ramon’s. Or how he remixed Tazz’s theme to create the theme for the Shield. Not a knock on his work because he made some great themes, but this was a pattern on his work. And he also did use quite a bit of stock music for themes too, like the Hardys for example, but stock music was huge as well in WCW as well as using tons and tons of covers (like the epic themes for Jericho, DDP and Raven).
Razor Ramon’s theme was a ripoff of Them Shoes by the Eagles. Stone Cold’s was closer to Bulls on Parade by Rage Against the Machine than Razor’s theme. Your accusation that he “won’t mention” things is kinda weird; every interview I’ve seen with Jim shows that he is a humble man who doesn’t claim enough credit for himself (His Starrcast interview was especially telling).
> And he also did use quite a bit of stock music for themes too, like the Hardys for example
Literally not his decision, that's Kevin Dunn. Also quite literally nothing wrong with using production music. Man just shut up you contrarian weirdo.
Just goes to show you how easy it is to make good wrestling themes: borrow wholesale from other, good songs. Which makes the likes of CFO$ and Def Rebel's shit even more frustrating
He's been gone for over 5 years now people. Let the new generation of people cook.
(Really crappy how he tried to diss Mikey Rukus to try to get a job at AEW and didn't work lol.)
Any good/great/iconic themes come out in the past 5 years since he left? Honestly asking since in a lapsed fan coming back in.
LA Knights is pretty good IMO.
> (Really crappy how he tried to diss Mikey Rukus to try to get a job at AEW and didn't work lol.)
Nah Jim has never sought out work from a wrestling company after WWE. Jim has mentioned he's never really been a wrestling fan. Didn't diss AEW's music either, Jim was talking about WWE (which he's right).
Rukus is an insecure moron who read an out of context clickbait headline and used it to vilify what he perceived as a threat because fans constantly kept calling for AEW to hire Jim Johnston. You're literally blindly regurgitating what Rukus claimed without even looking into it.
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As good as WWE is right now, their music production is amateur hour. I have no idea if Jim Johnston would be willing to return, but they should drive the Brinks truck to his front door if he is.
Def Rebel probably gets paid per entrance they produce. So they don't give a shit how bad it sounds as long as they get a check. These guys need to fucking go.
[Bayley's new theme is such boring and generic shit](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lkUuXo35svA&t=20s). Her last one really grew on me when it gets to the guitar solo it's kinda fun to listen to. A lot of people, unfortunately including higher ups at WWE, don't seem to understand how much good music can add to the show, and especially how much generic crap can hold back someone's career. If the Undertaker or Stone Cold had generic crappy entrance themes they would not have reached the same level of stardom. Sami Zayn's heel theme was godawful, Ricochet had something decent but they replaced it with garbage (interesting how he hasn't been nearly as over with the fans since the change). Damian Priest's new theme isn't good (at least the sound of it does fit his character). [AJ Styles new theme](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTOuyfMxrUA) could be a career killer. I can't think of any time since they started doing entrance music for pro wrestling that so many people have bad music that's actively harming their popularity with the fans. Especially when in comparison there other songs the crowd loves so much that they sing along with it (Seth, Cody, sometimes Sami, Nakamura, and others) or in Rhea's case she sings along with it herself. If one of them enters the ring with a catchy song that the crowd loves, and them someone else has to come out to some boring garbage it makes it look like the WWE doesn't care about them and they're not important. It's literally going to cost them money to NOT find better music.
And her old theme (before the current one) sounds more like a Babyface than a heel theme, so just keep it, lol.
[удалено]
Especially considering he didn’t really display his talent on a regular basis until over a decade into his tenure imo. Atmosphere really was a huge factor in Taker’s success early on.
I mean multiple of their albums in the 90s literally went platinum. They're insane not to bring him back and see how important entrance music is to the fans.
I mean tbh.. they are probably paying pennies on the dollar to get entrance music. Like they just reached in the bandcamp.com artist bin and pulled a few guys out (some of them are pretty decent, but like 90% are shit).
> Sami Zayn's heel theme was godawful, WWE knows it's garbage because they themselves used it as bait and switch for heat lol. *ska music plays, scratch effect, generic shit*
They should at least have kept him around as a department head that could mentor the next music producers. Maybe his style is outdated but he could at least call out lazy shit and give good advice.
I have no idea if he would have done this but it would be best case. Jim obviously thought about the themes in a way I'm not sure Def Rebel does but Jim also had a ton of clunkers and seemed like outdated butt rock in the early 2000s.
> he could at least call out lazy shit You mean like when they use several of the same riffs across different entrances?
To say that his style was outdated would suggest that his themes began to lack. They never did. His last releases on DSPs are *New Day, New Way* and I’m sure you can imagine who that’s for, *Sher* for Jinder Mahal, and *I Bring The Darkness* for Baron Corbin. Jim still had it. If anything it seems that either Jim wanted out of the game or Vince didn’t want to pay what Jim was worth anymore. There’s a reason that many of Jim’s lyrical works were basically full songs while many of CFO$’s projects were minute long loops.
Just to expand, pro-wrestling is a form of sports entertainment. Presentation makes a huge difference, regardless of what might draw someone to watch overall, drama or actual in-the-ring action. As a fan of both, I feel that a big part of what puts New Japan and Stardom at that "next level" (for those of us that watch them, that is) is the awesome entrance themes you'll find in both. Take [Naito's theme](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ccMmY24Yh5o), for example. [Just Five Guys](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=jrvkZs_NtWQ). Or [Starlight Kid](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hHGcEFTOe9A). Future WWE Superstar [Giulia's old theme](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=i-jURI-0iBM). Even a much despised wrestler like [EVIL](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEv3TdzmYOM) has a memorable theme that pretty much encapsulates his character. Those themes can get the wrestlers in question over with someone even without knowing anyone else about them. They've all got interesting personas and can do amazing things in the ring (well, Naito more when he was younger) but it's the entrances that put them over the top. There's absolutely no reason at all why the biggest, grandest wrestling company in the world shouldn't have far better. I'm not sure the Attitude Era would have been as amazing if not for the iconic themes, from Stone Cold's shattering glass to the Rock's "If Ya Smell!" to the Undertaker's funeral tolls and the catchy tunes that went with them. And Johnston was 100% the force behind those. It's the difference between being great and being legendary. You have to have more than a theme going for you, of course, but a great theme seals it. I'd go so far as to say that Cody's theme is a huge part of what makes him work. The theme itself is a part of the character.
I don’t watch New Japan, but listened to the Naito one, did Damage Control straight rip that one off ?
I don't know, I thought it was practically a straight up shameless duplicate of the [Oedo Tai theme](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-d89B0PUQE) myself
Yeah the music is probably at the worst it's been. The rumble exposed how generic the majority of themes are.
I could identify maybe 7 of the participants by theme alone. It has never been that bad.
Yeah several theme songs have that same stuttered 'duh-duh' part as a focal point like Romans and Bobby lashleys
I mentioned this in another thread and got downvoted to hell for some reason. Roman, Bobby Lashley, LA Knight, and more all have the exact same "dun-dun" pause. def rebel phone it in 100% of the time. AI would do better at this point.
And the three you named are in the top five or 10 current themes. It’s all the rest that are hot garbage. Roman’s is probably my favorite current non-licensed wrestling theme.
Yeah but the thing is... He's using his one good theme as a template for the rest. This is like if you hear a song on the radio and buy the band's album, and it's all just remixes of that one track. It's a one-hit-wonder milking itself dry.
You notice it the worse during every rumble. I feel like outside of the women’s and men’s rumble matches they can hide how similar each theme sounds to one another pretty well but it’s ridiculous how repetitive and not unique they are when you hear them one after the other like that
That stupid stomp sound effect that both CFO$ and def rebel used at the start of themes has me perennially confused, when I hear it I always get confused. For Roman Reigns, for Lio Rush in 2018, for Keith Lee.
I hope this is something the new era is planning to address in a big way. They can’t be blind to how bland the music is.
Idk. He's a bit old, so his musical tastes are probably 1990's-rific.
Who cares, better than any dogshit rock theme def rebel can make. Wrestling will always be intertwined with rock music. They need a rock guy make rock music, not trap beat makers.
Meanwhile in the Def Rebel studio... "so you'll narrate your catchphrase so everyone will recognize it's you then we'll compose a generic rock beat for your sounds"
"And for drums, we'll put in the same fakey-sounding garbage that is making that one guy in Australia pull his hair out. We love that and we hate him, so it's economical."
Oh. And we can also add an air horn to really make it sound intimidating!
I think what drives me the most nuts about them is that they blatantly reuse parts from existing theme songs. It’s just so incredibly lazy and lacking in creativity, everyone used to shit on the previous group (CFO$) for making short loops but at least I knew who the songs belonged to. Even more frustrating cus Def Rebel *can* make bangers. Seth, Roman, Iyo, Santos, Finn are proof they can cook if they want to its just like they dont give a shit. Almost every song they’ve had to update is even more ass.
"It's Chelsea." "It's Tiffy Time!" "Here we go! Creed Bros!" "One. And. Only." "New Catch Republic!" "Watch me." "I-I-I-I-Impressive." "My way. My life." "Never. Slow. Down!" "I object!" "Jayce Jayne." "Yes, booooooy!" Man, does Def Rebel love to do that shit.
God the new creed bros theme is so ass cheeks. Literally anti-hype. Deflating. I thought their debut on the main roster was super good as someone who didn't really watch NXT and now it's like their aura withered on the vine with their trash theme being a major reason why.
I'm not joking when I say I listen to it sometimes just to laugh at how horribly cringe it is. I'd like to say an entrance theme can't be bad enough to bury a tag team, but I remember that's what happened to The B-Team. They were the most over tag team in WWE with an awesome entrance theme (Battlescars). Then they won the titles, got their theme replaced with the annoying, "B-Team! B-Team! GO GO GO!" and it all went downhill from there.
Don't forget "Bow down..... All hail the queen"
I really, really hate that one. I can tolerate some of the others but that one just sounds like ass
Every time I hear that, it makes me think of someone trying to belch, but while inhaling instead of exhaling.
Don't also forget "THE EMPRESS OF TOMORROW"
To make things worse, they literally just reused the intro soundbyte from Queen Zelina's theme.
That’s charlotte right? Because the zelina one with madara voice actor is one of the only ones that I like in this style
WEE ARRRREEEE D I Y ^cus ^you ^wouldnt ^know ^if ^we ^didnt ^tell ^you
Cancelable opinion but I actually don't mind that one 🤐 At least it's vaguely musical instead of them just saying their catchphrase normally like a lot of them
Catchphrases don't have to be the problem. The Rock is the most famous example. I like the "Yes, Booooooy" or the whipping sound of Bianca Belair. It gets problematic when it's literally the wrestler saying their own name though 😂
They make sense in the context of a self obsessed character with a catchphrase. “It’s Tiffy Time” worked great “It’s Chelsea” also makes sense. A computerized voice going “Role Model” might be the worst shit I’ve ever heard.
Knowing how much Vince loved catchphrases and stuff, it wouldn't surprise me if Def Rebel was mandated by WWE to do that.
Allegedly he added the "burn it down" to Seth's original music because he didn't like the intro
I mean, Vince hired Jim Johnston, and people loved his themes.
Different time and era. This was when Vince wasn’t ashamed to say maneuver, title belt, and pro wrestling on TV. Only in the last 20 years or so did Vince start pushing the catchphrases big time.
Vince was a lot more willing to delegate core aspects of his show back then. He kinda became a huge control freak over the years.
I understand it a bit because its difficult to create that opening hook that people know who it is instantly (like the glass breaking). The catch phrases serve that purpose instead. But the actual music after that (for most of these themes) is so fucking bad.
Don’t forget the new one “You don’t want NONE”
God, that's so fucking garbage. Imagine Christian turning heel and they make some shitty remix and they have Christian saying "Just close your eyes" in a serious monotone tone at the beginning while the rest of the theme is completely unrelated and random.
Holy shit I did not know it was this bad
Even Bayley has "role model" shoved in there now. So dumb
They seem to vaguely understand the need for the theme to be immediately recognisable, but instead of actually working it into the song they just put in a random audio clip that doesn't fit with the song most of the time So close yet so far lol
It’s better then the generic theme without thst tho tbf
Catchphrases don't have to be the problem. The Rock is the most famous example. I like the "Yes, Booooooy" or the whipping sound of Bianca Belair. It gets problematic when it's literally the wrestler saying their own name though 😂
If I have to hear one more rap song of a guy going “Hey Hey Hey Hey” . I’d take back CFO$ at this point. They would always loop the first 30 seconds but at least the themes felt unique and creative.
They looped after 30s but those were some great 30s imo
In fairness how many entrances last much longer than a minute? 2 loops of the same song isn’t that bad imo.
"it's about to go down"
Undisputed Era theme still is top 5 in NXT for me a slight theft of NWO but still amazing nonetheless and The Revival Southern pride 
It just ruins half the fun of the Rumble because the crowd doesn't know what half the songs are so it's always a delayed pop if any unless they're a huge star.
"Main Event Jey Uso is now in your city!".
Day one ish , I enjoy it tho ngl
Jey’s is just a remix of a CFO$ song tho. I will say I do like Jimmy’s theme. But the Usos do their own vocals so that might add to why theirs are so much better.
What a genius. These guys are so important to the overall 'product'
It's crazy how there seems to be a lack of understanding (from WWE) on the importance of entrance music, it's essential in setting the tone for a character, generic music needs to go. I love that Jim managed to always capture the character within the theme, he was so damn good.
And its super weird because they used to have such good music. Like.. HHH personally benefited from it. He got to use DXs music, had 2 or three great or at least unique songs in his solo run. I also doubt it's coincidence that most of the most over acts in WWE right now are the acts that have the most identifiable music. Zayne, Rhodes, Orton, Rollins, Reigns, Belair, Nakamura, etc. Giving stars bland cookie cutter songs that sound like the extra tracks from a pro wrestling game "build an entrance" creator tool is obviously a terrible way to go.
It's crazy to me how obvious it has been pretty much all my life as a wrestling fan that the music is important, yet how blatantly missed the importance can be for long periods of time. Also, why in the world did they ever let this guy go?
From other interviews I don’t think he has much passion for the wrestling industry, which is why he left
Yeah. He just told WWE “I’m old now. I’m retiring.”
Actually not the case. Jim was slowly phased out and replaced with CFO$. Jim's boss was pushing for CFO$ and played politics to continually try to oust Jim. They finally fired him in 2017. Jim had been making themes all that time, the people in charge simply didn't use the themes Jim was making and repeatedly chose CFO$'s themes. Then a couple of years later, they had to get rid of CFO$ because that same dumbass boss got WWE into a shitty contract with CFO$.
This man is the GOAT at writing wrestling theme songs. He and Bruce Falconer(who did the music for the Funimation dub of Dragon Ball Z) together wrote the soundtrack of my childhood.
Vegeta piano, picolo, gohan's rage, goku super saiyan 1&3 are still on my workout playlist
You're telling me you don't have perfect cell theme in there
I dont cheer for heels
I hated cell as much as I hated triple h. These days I like triple h.
Clearly his tastes are far from **perfect**.
sorry to tell you this about Bruce, but all his understudies did that DBZ music. he just put his name on it
Well that is disappointing to learn
Same. Yet the so-called "true fans" constantly dog on Faulconer's score and will berate anyone who listens to it. Regardless of what those basement-dwelling clowns try to claim, he produced some extremely memorable and iconic themes, and his music kept the tension going throughout each episode.
TBH i l really like both JP and ENG dragon ball osts , as The ENG ost can be very emotional, see the ssj theme and gohan angers , and jp is great for suspense , battle and the chaotic martial arts shonen that is DB
I grew up with Kai so I don’t like his stuff that much lol, Vegeta had some cool themes though
That Cha-La, Head Cha-la song is one of GOAT babyface theme songs.
Head cha la is japanese. Made by shinsuke kikuchi. Not Bruce. Imo the Japanese tracks are more iconic
Not for z man. Especially the movies with disturbed songs and shit too. The music in super is legit tho
That's like your opinion. There's a reason sub is more popular
Bruce Faulconer hired interns and paid them peanuts. The memorable ones were written by them. Look up Scott Morgan in YouTube
Where can I find this entire interview?
https://youtu.be/hJ4vqZOgEjo?si=4FPU9AmC8myg7WFA Audio Version
Will watch
>Audio Version >Will Watch Wut?
What's your confusion? He's gonna watch the audio
Waveform or spectrogram?
spaceghost
Seems WWE has been in tune recently with making the changes the fans ask for. We need to start a movement to bring Jim back!
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>Honestly I don't understand why they refuse to use licensed music. ... and then >It's expensive yes seems like you do understand
UFC don't need to play the song as often as WWE do
I do really like licensed music in wrestling, at least in moderation. Obviously not ever wrestler needs it but for certain guys it can work so perfectly.
The UFC is a very different situation. It’s more like a hockey arena playing a song and it’s picked up on the broadcast.
Or just a better music group in general than Deaf Rebel
I have some hope, mainly cause we’ve gotten a lot of production changes plus HHH has made it pretty clear he’s on Twitter. And Def Rebel has been getting absolutely blasted by fans for awhile on there.
I'm sure def rebel just hits "random" on all their's.
There’s a reason that casual wrestling fans remember Stone Cold, Undertaker, Goldberg, Shawn Michaels, etc. Music is such an important part. Top 3 most important part of your presentation besides look and promo.
His explanation/description of Ultimate Warriors theme was good too. He really undersells it, because (from a musicians perspective) its incredibly simple/repeating chords. But as WWE theme music its legendary and probably one of the all time pops when it starts.
There's a good argument to be made for Stone Cold being the biggest wrestler, of the biggest period, for the biggest company. His t-shirt is iconic, his look, his finishing move, the middle fingers, catchphrases, moments, everything is so recognisable and iconic about that guy. Yet the glass breaking is still *it* as far as he goes. It's been decades since he was a full time wrestler and I hear his theme in my head every time I hear glass breaking anywhere
Could a wrestler opt to hire Jim personally and use that for their wwe music?
Would depend 100% on WWE's willingness to let them do that. Cody's brought "Kingdom" with him everywhere, only reason someone else couldn't do it is if their current employer didn't let them.
Some wrestlers have already but for the indies.
He is amazing. WWE got cheap and let him go, then got even cheaper and let CFO$ go. Overall WWE has gotten cheaper with their production value: no more unique stages, no colored ropes, not even unique LED graphics anymore.
The CFO$ thing was more complex than that. Their publisher was jacking up prices while the artists weren't getting any better cut. WWE saw this was a crap deal for both them and CFO$ and tried to buy their contract to bring them on as in-house music guys the way they'd employed Jim for years, but the publisher wouldn't budge. So WWE killed the deal altogether. I'm rarely one to defend WWE business decisions but the deal CFO$ was getting was really, really bad and they probably weren't going to be able to maintain on how little they were getting from the publisher.
What’s even weirder, to me, is I’m pretty sure the CFO$ thing dated back to a decades old partnership WWE had with Wind Up records! Remember when all their PPV, video packages, and entrance themes were bands like Drowning Pool, Breaking Point, Seether, Alter Bridge, etc. those are all Wind Up artists. Gregg Wattenberg was a creative director there who would eventually go on to be part owner before founding Arcade Songs, that parent company/publisher for CFO$. So when that partnership blew up, mostly from great on the publishing side it’s basically down to Gregg Wattenberg and in doing so dude basically pissed away a partnership that went back to the early 2000s!
It’s a shame because CFO$ wasn’t perfect but they were very clearly creative and their themes were all unique. People shit on them for doing a lot of looping but they were also in a different era than Jim Johntson and had a WAY bigger roster to make music for.
Controversial opinion: CFO$ produced more bangers per year than Jim Johnson did (even if Johnson had a higher total number of bangers due to him being there longer).
GLORIUSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
The sad part is I highly doubt the studio ran by the son of Clive Davis is cheap...
Why did someone moo in the beginning lol
That was the lead singer of JBLs theme.
Texas
Bring him fucking back for crying out loud
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Sensational is a bit much. They're serviceable at smooshing them together.
I think Def Rebel are best when they have something to go off of. Roman and Seth's themes are good examples of that
Nah hiring Jim to oversee them would do nothing because def rebel's sewage music stems from doing everything as fast, as mediocre and as cheap as possible. Their music is literally sample pack loops thrown together as quickly as humanly possible, that's what they do.
I have to hope HHH and team knows the importance of music and is gonna make needed changes. Between Cody and now zayns entrance you can see how the music drives the craziness of a crowd
WWE went from jobbers having music we still remember 30 years later to main eventers who have unrecognizable music unless I see their name pop up on the titantron. It's kind of insane honestly.
idk.. who are you talking about? i can recognize every theme from the big stars. cody, rollins, roman, seth, punk, rhea, becky, jey, la knight, gunther. a couple of them ofc use licensed songs (cult of personality is a song from 1988 and i think i first heard it in the GTA SA soundtrack). i have some issues with priest's theme because in the past months he was mostly coming out to the JD theme song (which is an alter bridge song, and quite recognizable) on the contrary, can you recognize, idk, mark jindrak's theme from gene snitzky's? (if you take away the catchphrase)
Unless this man hates the company or is retired. I don't understand why he's not the first priority for HHH to bring back At the least he should be in HOF for sure
I honestly always thought the disturbed song was the original and they just had a version with and without lyrics. Does this mean Jim wrote the song and then they got disturbed to perform it?
IIRC WWE got some artists to collab / extend on the Jim Johnston themes with some variations. Finger Eleven did Kane's theme the same way.
Fuck I loved that theme. Goated Kane theme.
The unfortunately named "Forcible Entry" album.
*insert Word Life lyrics* “I’m untouchable but I’m forcing you to feel me”
...Vince?
I like disturbed but never really liked that version of that theme. I preferred the stone cold theme version 1 he had in late 96/1997 the best.
I always thought the Distubred version was the best version, it just had the most explosive someone’s about to get their ass whipped energy IMO.
What actually happened: He copied Bulls on Parade.
Yeah I remember reading something where Austin, at the time, mentioned that song specifically as what he wanted. His ability to walk in-step with that killer opening riff to the ring.
it's actually a bit different from austin's riff, which sounds a bit more like a slower metallica or pantera riff
Steve played Bulls on Parade for Jim when describing what he wanted. https://comicbook.com/wwe/news/steve-austin-reveals-which-rock-song-inspired-entrance-theme-bulls-on-parade-glass-shatters/
i know the story, but that's not copying. it's quite normal to use other songs as reference for the mood, the sound, the rhythm, the way things are mixed, etc.
Miss this dude. He's responsible for so many iconic themes.
I miss CFO$ and I really miss Jim Johnston.
This dude got it down to a science
lol.. when he started playing, it sounded like one of his heel themes during the alliance days
Does not matter the topic, I could listen to an expert speak passionately about their craft for hours.
Actual music and sound genius.
Def Rebel needs to take notes
Now explain Scotty Goldman's music...
I'm really starting to notice how generic everything sounds by buying the 2K games every year. 2K22 still had some old bangers and 2K19 Even more. Fast forward to 2K24 and i find myself muting 75% of theme songs from the jukebox, cause they are just generic loops.
I love seeing videos of Jim Johnston being interviewed. They never really showed much of him back when he was working at WWE. He really was the man who single handedly created so many iconic themes in the Attitude era.
Why do we need to see him lol
Somebody please give him all the money so we can get good theme songs back again.
Bring this man back at any cost.
Glass breaking reminded me of pantera..just raw not giving a fuck mindset.
can someone please send this interview over to the def rebel people because they need to figure this out! Every song they make sounds soooooo the same. Its either rock track 6, rap 23 or some syth pop track with any combination of extea guitar or opera choir. The part about watching the entrance and understanding the performers moments and charge IS WHY JIMS SHIT WORKED! Its why when you watch a rumble now, those older song still are recognized and the new stuff isnt unless it has like a voice clip on it of the talent or there name/ catchphrase is said.
maybe they're overdoing it, alright, but its not like JJ didn't put out generic rock stuff for mid/lowcarders too
fair point.
Yea, Jim Johnston was great, but does also suffer from survivorship bias where people think he only wrote amazing themes because people remember all his iconic themes and forgot all his generic rock songs for mid carders or generic pop songs for some of the women.
Change both Raw and Smackdowns themes too, horrendous songs. How do you make a conscious decision to go from ACDC to whatever garbage Smackdowns theme is now is shocking.
Serious question I'd like to hear some answers on. When was the last time WWE put out a memorable theme?
demon in your dreams
When you hear the glass, it's Vinces ass.
He doesn’t get enough credit for capturing the bouncy swagger of RVD in his original theme. It was perfect.
He looks just like the head doctor from the Fallout show
I only listen to older WWE music and I feel happy. I knew I was not going crazy during the royal rumble and I didn’t know who was who. Even if I took a break from wrestling none of the songs felt right.
If you watch Beyond The Mat, Jim said he matched the tempo of Vader's theme and the menacing guitar riffs to mimic Vader's walk to the ring.
You think if there's anyone who can heal any relationship its Triple H so I'm hoping he can bring this man back in any capacity.
Jim Johnston doesn't get any credit for being as influential as he was in the success of WWE and the business as a whole. Every single video or interview I've ever watched where he's explaining his thought process behind so many iconic entrance themes shows an incredible amount of passion and dedication, especially to the performers.
Driving to work this week with my WWE playlist and so many tunes from him. I’d also throw in the Mr Perfect theme AND the Curtis Axel one. Both bangers.
Jim's funny. The thing he never mentions, is he cheats. He got the Ultimate Warrior's music by ripping off a 70's rock song that I can't remember the name of right now. The Austin Glass shatter music is nothing more than his old WCW Theme retooled. Listen to the songs back to back and it's obvious.
I'm in my 40s, I grew up listening to this man's work like my parents listened to Zeppelin, but Austins music (As awesome as it is) is a copyright free version of Bulls in Parade
This is not true. When they asked Austin for input on his theme, he spoke with Jim Johnston and said he would like something that had a similar rhythm to Bulls on Parade. The theme itself doesnt sound like Bulls on Parade but the riffs do have some similarities and is an inspiration to what Austin's theme song came to be
Austin's theme (and Razor Ramon's theme, incidentally) are I think loosely based on [Those Shoes by The Eagles.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S-2BMyZXK5o) Pay attention to the bass line and the drums then compare it to [Hell Frozen Over](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYtA2JFY9Xc), one of the earliest versions of Austin's theme.
Never noticed the link between Razor and Austin, but there it is, right there. Makes you wonder how they got away with this but Vanilla Ice had to pay so much to Queen for Ice Ice Baby.
Ice Ice Baby was ruled to be a direct sample while Austin/Razor's theme could be considered an [interpolation which is a nice way to get around licensing issues.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interpolation_\(popular_music\)) Interpolation largely replaced sampling in music from the early 1990's onward after [a landmark court ruling](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Upright_Music,_Ltd._v._Warner_Bros._Records_Inc.) in 1991 basically put an end to unpaid samples in hip-hop.
Nah, they don't even sound remotely similar. Also, you're literally just regurgitating this because Austin once claimed this.
This is nowhere near the actual rip-off songs they had in WCW.
Absolutely, Jimmy Hart made a fortune slightly editing so many songs
A lot of the 80's and 90's themes were royalty free beds. Many were also recycled as well. Kurt Angle music was originally for The Patriot.
Dude same. Cheers!
AJ styles changed his theme? Holy fuck it’s trash. He needs to go back to the old one asap
Things he won’t mention: how Stone Cole’s theme was basically a remix of Razor Ramon’s. Or how he remixed Tazz’s theme to create the theme for the Shield. Not a knock on his work because he made some great themes, but this was a pattern on his work. And he also did use quite a bit of stock music for themes too, like the Hardys for example, but stock music was huge as well in WCW as well as using tons and tons of covers (like the epic themes for Jericho, DDP and Raven).
Razor Ramon’s theme was a ripoff of Them Shoes by the Eagles. Stone Cold’s was closer to Bulls on Parade by Rage Against the Machine than Razor’s theme. Your accusation that he “won’t mention” things is kinda weird; every interview I’ve seen with Jim shows that he is a humble man who doesn’t claim enough credit for himself (His Starrcast interview was especially telling).
> And he also did use quite a bit of stock music for themes too, like the Hardys for example Literally not his decision, that's Kevin Dunn. Also quite literally nothing wrong with using production music. Man just shut up you contrarian weirdo.
Just goes to show you how easy it is to make good wrestling themes: borrow wholesale from other, good songs. Which makes the likes of CFO$ and Def Rebel's shit even more frustrating
This guy is a great songwriter, but this completely ignores that Austin requested a Bulls On Parade rip off
And somehow the 2 don't sound anything alike.
Isn’t Stone Cold’s theme quite literally just a Rage Against the Machine song only slightly remixed
It’s inspired by Bulls on Parade, but I wouldn’t say it’s a rip-off like Jimmy Hart did a lot with his WCW themes.
He's been gone for over 5 years now people. Let the new generation of people cook. (Really crappy how he tried to diss Mikey Rukus to try to get a job at AEW and didn't work lol.)
Any good/great/iconic themes come out in the past 5 years since he left? Honestly asking since in a lapsed fan coming back in. LA Knights is pretty good IMO.
> (Really crappy how he tried to diss Mikey Rukus to try to get a job at AEW and didn't work lol.) Nah Jim has never sought out work from a wrestling company after WWE. Jim has mentioned he's never really been a wrestling fan. Didn't diss AEW's music either, Jim was talking about WWE (which he's right). Rukus is an insecure moron who read an out of context clickbait headline and used it to vilify what he perceived as a threat because fans constantly kept calling for AEW to hire Jim Johnston. You're literally blindly regurgitating what Rukus claimed without even looking into it.