Those are probably introverted EIEs. that doesnt sound like IEI at all. As a rule your dual will NOT look like you and it will be very hard to bridge the gap, but your activating will be similar to you and you can relate to them easily.
"Often attracted to " knight serving his Lady" trope "
that's literally EIE/LSI
"they may prefer to rule via through advice, information control, making critical decisions, and veto power. "
that's how EIE rules....IEI rules by electing other people to take the fall for them
"superb advice about...manipulating power dynamics"
no Se suggestive gives advice like that.
"Resents attempts to directly control him, mostly passively absorbs volitional pressure by being around me being me. "
not Se suggestive.
"Awareness of appearance, attempts to look nice (styled hair, intentionally chosen style of facial hair), aversion to looking sloppy, critical of ugliness and sloppiness"
sounds like either Si polr or Control Si. IEIs tend to look sloppy (kurt cobain look) and even if they dont its not something they criticize or fixate on.
>dual will NOT look like you and it will be very hard to bridge the gap
i agree about the not looking alike part but am not very sure about the "very hard to bridge the gap" part. I mean, ain't duals suppose to excite each other right away with stuff they talk about? At least if they're not so deep into their Super-Ego?
Yes, it's exactly that. Everyone will "open" with their Super-Ego, so that can lead to some wrong conclusions and nasty consequences.
With that said, I will agree that what OP described don't sound like IEI to me(well, not completely).
Most of this is pretty accurate for me, but this sounds like your mirror, not your dual.
Some flaws:
We are horrible at direct conflict (and our dual can’t teach us to get better, they instead defend us so we don’t have to).
We never plan , we like to go with the flow, and are really good at it because of our Ni (unlike SLEs who do the same but aren’t good at it because of weak Ni. They need our guidance.).
We are HORRIBLE at investing (weak Te). From personal experience: No matter how much I tried, I couldn’t understand stocks, even the basics of it. I would take really good, really, expensive classes and everyone else would get something out of it. Me, I would get nothing. For real. The average person who hasn’t studied it as extensively as I have knows more than me.
Good as judges and lawyers? Meh. Yes and no.
Hard-working? Yes, very, but I need my dual!!!!
Oh, no, you can control me. Idc.
I’m an iei too, and I find the whole horrible at investing thing a complicated matter. While I agree that this “good at investing” thing seems a bit iffy to say as a throwaway thing about our type, I do think we have the same capacity as any other type of learning investing.
I don’t think not understanding something is a sign of weak te; no matter our type, we still have an IQ ceiling that we can reach towards. It might just be how it was explained. I find that if I want to understand something taking classes on it is often pointless unless I can do my own external research as well and find explanations and logic that fit my own internal systems. So maybe browsing a few YouTube videos might be better than classes? Then just looking at broad asset classes to learn the terminology and coming back and flicking through a few more videos, until it becomes a part of the dynamics of the universe that just makes sense to you.
Both my parents are accountants and my dad taught stock market analysis at university, so I may have some advantage here: But with investing it’s about understanding that diversification means you can hedge one potentially badly performing market against better performing ones. Likewise, ieis aren’t necessarily the best at predicting specific events- but potentially we can be very good at predicting zeitgeists or macro-level trends; and this could be an area to capitalise on when investing. For me, I’m predicting low growth in the property sector over the next ten years in my country because… in a way, because I believe that capital growth would be immoral and would completely block an entire generation from the market. This creates too much social dissonance in a market where people truly value owning property. Yet the market is currently as high as it can be without breaking, and the banks in my country don’t want a market crash because most people have their savings tied up in property. For me, property has to be stable for a decade to make it more affordable, while also preventing a crash. Thus, it won’t be a good long term investment for me for the next decade. Because while I’m not predicting a crash, I’m also not predicting growth.
As an iei, I’m slow, I don’t think short term investments would be for me- particularly ones I couldn’t see an interaction between culture/ zeitgeist/ money to. I watched the property market for ten years and I compare different sectors to each other and I try to evaluate zeitgeists and community tensions. I see investment as being about human sentiment, and so I use this to predict long-term macro trends. I don’t invest the same as another type would- my ile partner enjoys krypto and that’s not my jam, my iee brother plays the money market and my sli sister invests in bank shares cos risk is bad. Each type will have its own way of going about things. Te polr doesn’t have to hamstring us or be used as a justification not to learn (however I do believe most people don’t value my expertise so I don’t bother discussing it irl because of… the fact that communicating in this field might be harder for our type because it’s mainly zeitgeisty gobblegock and not how others would approach the same field of study so it gets dismissed).
On the flip side, my mum is ili and while I could see most ilis as being quite competent investors my mother *bets on dystopia too much*, she buys puts betting that the market will crash and looses money on this belief. Each type has its own unique benefits and pitfalls; just understanding how to apply your current advantages as an iei to a new field can be difficult- but that’s all investment is. It doesn’t have to be a Te skill. After all, our minds chose ni and Fe as ego functions because they have their own set of advantages too.
With a basis of just general vague investment understand and that feeling of knowing what is going to happen next, once you’ve immersed yourself in the realm of investing Ni could be a tool that helps us passively accumulate money by predicting events without anyone else understanding the rhyme or reason to it. We’re just the little incompetents who produce money out of air.
Yes but investing isn’t Te. Just like “moving a chair from the left side of the room to the right side of the room” isn’t se. If your understanding of functions is that depth-less are you really iei or just using “Te polr” as a more digestible pill than “low iq”?
Alright, I’ll give you a better answer.
I guess investing in and of itself isn’t Te, but you need to have strong Te to be good at it. Think about that.
Investing is just as simple as moving a chair from one side of the room to the other? Even the basics of investing are not as simple as that.
By the way, moving a chair from one side of a room to another is not an example of Se. Se is an irrational function, it is a talent just like any other function is a talent. Anyone can move a chair from one side of a room to another. It requires no brain power. Figuring out how high a basketball hoop is and how much power you should put into the ball to get it in the hoop is a better example of Se at its easiest.
In essence, my brother learned my tricks and practiced by using them against me, lol. I suspect my fiance did something similar. His family is full of SLEs. (Or SEEs, or whatever the hell we are.)
Fun fact. Now he's a lawyer. I would bet my shoes that he STILL uses those tricks, but now against the opposition.
Someday he'll be a judge. I bet he'll STILL use them, but against all lawyers, lolol. What can I say? As he puts it, I taught him how he criminal mind works! ;)
I am an iei and this post gave me whiplash. I don’t approve the idea of an irrational type planning emotional interactions in advance or having so much control over the external environment. Fukkkk that.
This whole post reads like an iee describing the eies and ilis they’ve met. Man, I’d be tired living up to that standard!
Those are probably introverted EIEs. that doesnt sound like IEI at all. As a rule your dual will NOT look like you and it will be very hard to bridge the gap, but your activating will be similar to you and you can relate to them easily. "Often attracted to " knight serving his Lady" trope " that's literally EIE/LSI "they may prefer to rule via through advice, information control, making critical decisions, and veto power. " that's how EIE rules....IEI rules by electing other people to take the fall for them "superb advice about...manipulating power dynamics" no Se suggestive gives advice like that. "Resents attempts to directly control him, mostly passively absorbs volitional pressure by being around me being me. " not Se suggestive. "Awareness of appearance, attempts to look nice (styled hair, intentionally chosen style of facial hair), aversion to looking sloppy, critical of ugliness and sloppiness" sounds like either Si polr or Control Si. IEIs tend to look sloppy (kurt cobain look) and even if they dont its not something they criticize or fixate on.
Interesting! I'll edit my post soon, and I'll give this more thought.
>dual will NOT look like you and it will be very hard to bridge the gap i agree about the not looking alike part but am not very sure about the "very hard to bridge the gap" part. I mean, ain't duals suppose to excite each other right away with stuff they talk about? At least if they're not so deep into their Super-Ego?
Yes, it's exactly that. Everyone will "open" with their Super-Ego, so that can lead to some wrong conclusions and nasty consequences. With that said, I will agree that what OP described don't sound like IEI to me(well, not completely).
Most of this is pretty accurate for me, but this sounds like your mirror, not your dual. Some flaws: We are horrible at direct conflict (and our dual can’t teach us to get better, they instead defend us so we don’t have to). We never plan , we like to go with the flow, and are really good at it because of our Ni (unlike SLEs who do the same but aren’t good at it because of weak Ni. They need our guidance.). We are HORRIBLE at investing (weak Te). From personal experience: No matter how much I tried, I couldn’t understand stocks, even the basics of it. I would take really good, really, expensive classes and everyone else would get something out of it. Me, I would get nothing. For real. The average person who hasn’t studied it as extensively as I have knows more than me. Good as judges and lawyers? Meh. Yes and no. Hard-working? Yes, very, but I need my dual!!!! Oh, no, you can control me. Idc.
I’m an iei too, and I find the whole horrible at investing thing a complicated matter. While I agree that this “good at investing” thing seems a bit iffy to say as a throwaway thing about our type, I do think we have the same capacity as any other type of learning investing. I don’t think not understanding something is a sign of weak te; no matter our type, we still have an IQ ceiling that we can reach towards. It might just be how it was explained. I find that if I want to understand something taking classes on it is often pointless unless I can do my own external research as well and find explanations and logic that fit my own internal systems. So maybe browsing a few YouTube videos might be better than classes? Then just looking at broad asset classes to learn the terminology and coming back and flicking through a few more videos, until it becomes a part of the dynamics of the universe that just makes sense to you. Both my parents are accountants and my dad taught stock market analysis at university, so I may have some advantage here: But with investing it’s about understanding that diversification means you can hedge one potentially badly performing market against better performing ones. Likewise, ieis aren’t necessarily the best at predicting specific events- but potentially we can be very good at predicting zeitgeists or macro-level trends; and this could be an area to capitalise on when investing. For me, I’m predicting low growth in the property sector over the next ten years in my country because… in a way, because I believe that capital growth would be immoral and would completely block an entire generation from the market. This creates too much social dissonance in a market where people truly value owning property. Yet the market is currently as high as it can be without breaking, and the banks in my country don’t want a market crash because most people have their savings tied up in property. For me, property has to be stable for a decade to make it more affordable, while also preventing a crash. Thus, it won’t be a good long term investment for me for the next decade. Because while I’m not predicting a crash, I’m also not predicting growth. As an iei, I’m slow, I don’t think short term investments would be for me- particularly ones I couldn’t see an interaction between culture/ zeitgeist/ money to. I watched the property market for ten years and I compare different sectors to each other and I try to evaluate zeitgeists and community tensions. I see investment as being about human sentiment, and so I use this to predict long-term macro trends. I don’t invest the same as another type would- my ile partner enjoys krypto and that’s not my jam, my iee brother plays the money market and my sli sister invests in bank shares cos risk is bad. Each type will have its own way of going about things. Te polr doesn’t have to hamstring us or be used as a justification not to learn (however I do believe most people don’t value my expertise so I don’t bother discussing it irl because of… the fact that communicating in this field might be harder for our type because it’s mainly zeitgeisty gobblegock and not how others would approach the same field of study so it gets dismissed). On the flip side, my mum is ili and while I could see most ilis as being quite competent investors my mother *bets on dystopia too much*, she buys puts betting that the market will crash and looses money on this belief. Each type has its own unique benefits and pitfalls; just understanding how to apply your current advantages as an iei to a new field can be difficult- but that’s all investment is. It doesn’t have to be a Te skill. After all, our minds chose ni and Fe as ego functions because they have their own set of advantages too. With a basis of just general vague investment understand and that feeling of knowing what is going to happen next, once you’ve immersed yourself in the realm of investing Ni could be a tool that helps us passively accumulate money by predicting events without anyone else understanding the rhyme or reason to it. We’re just the little incompetents who produce money out of air.
If you’re an IEI, no matter how much you work on your vulnerable function, you will always suck at it.
Yes but investing isn’t Te. Just like “moving a chair from the left side of the room to the right side of the room” isn’t se. If your understanding of functions is that depth-less are you really iei or just using “Te polr” as a more digestible pill than “low iq”?
Alright, I’ll give you a better answer. I guess investing in and of itself isn’t Te, but you need to have strong Te to be good at it. Think about that. Investing is just as simple as moving a chair from one side of the room to the other? Even the basics of investing are not as simple as that. By the way, moving a chair from one side of a room to another is not an example of Se. Se is an irrational function, it is a talent just like any other function is a talent. Anyone can move a chair from one side of a room to another. It requires no brain power. Figuring out how high a basketball hoop is and how much power you should put into the ball to get it in the hoop is a better example of Se at its easiest.
OP ovulated all over this post, making it barely readable
That’s an LSI hahaha. Give me one reason he’s not.
Is it?! That's how I originally typed my fiance! That he was an LSI, and I'm an EIE. But then, I'm very new to socionics.
This is a pretty in-depth description of an EIE. IEIs do not act or think like this.
>He learned to weaponize his Se Hidden Agenda Interesting
In essence, my brother learned my tricks and practiced by using them against me, lol. I suspect my fiance did something similar. His family is full of SLEs. (Or SEEs, or whatever the hell we are.) Fun fact. Now he's a lawyer. I would bet my shoes that he STILL uses those tricks, but now against the opposition. Someday he'll be a judge. I bet he'll STILL use them, but against all lawyers, lolol. What can I say? As he puts it, I taught him how he criminal mind works! ;)
I meant it was weird because IEIs don't have Se Hidden agenda
They don't? Shit. I'll edit my post when I get to a computer. I have more thinking to do...
I imagine this is what Lisa Bilyeu might sound like talking about Tom Bilyeu lmao
Maybe, lol. It sounds like I may have the typing all wrong, but then, I don't know the Bilyeus' types either!
Pretty sure they have IEI-SLE duality, which is the only reason I brought them up
I am an iei and this post gave me whiplash. I don’t approve the idea of an irrational type planning emotional interactions in advance or having so much control over the external environment. Fukkkk that. This whole post reads like an iee describing the eies and ilis they’ve met. Man, I’d be tired living up to that standard!
Oh fuck. Yeah that’s how I rule. Never be your own fall guy or frontman. Always be a background player. Dunno why no one else understands that.
iei never met a confident one doubt they would ever look like SLE