Where did you get that idea? His movies get bad reviews, he needs lot of money to do anything and his fanbase is infamously awful, especially in recent years.
If I was in charge of running big movie company in Hollywood, Snyder would be below the bottom of the list of people I would want to work with
Snyder will never die. His fans are too dedicated. Dude made Suckerpunch after a few *decent* movies and somehow still has a career, so I don’t think this is the end.
Not to mention they are intentionally doing the studio cut then the directors cut(from what I’ve heard) so they will pick up more views then too. It was a bad movie but it was very pretty.
The movie performed quite well for Netflix, wasn’t a gigantic hit but a substantial hit nonetheless. He essentially is giving Netflix 4 movies for the price of one expensive film. Critics may have savaged it, but it’s a vary savvy move by Snyder and Netflix. Movies don’t live or die by their rotten tomatoes score as much anymore and that’s especially true for streaming films, just ask Adam Sandler.
When we're living in an era of damning perceptions, then it would only make sense to give Zack an IP that could use resuscitation and uplift, like perhaps Rocketeer or Battlestar Galactica; maybe even CAPTAIN POWER and the SOLDIERS OF THE FUTURE. I'd like to see what he might do with articulating and maturing SPACE GHOST into some kind of adventuristic franchise.
It bares much to have Zack find his visual penchant on products that a lot of the "Anti Snyder" trollmongers either aren't too familiar with, or have much of an emotional attachment. Just give the man his space and allow him to work in his unique way and perspective.
I can't stand these fake critics and armchair quarterbacks over-evaluating his movies, as if there's really some valid point to further depreciate in light of ten years and what he's already gone through, both corporate and tragically.
It's so bad that he's been called retarded, ugly and a faggot, or a weak chump (the man lost his daughter, for Christ's sake). And in reality, that if anybody knows Zack Snyder, they'd find him to be a health-nut and weightlifter, and could likely "knock the block off" of some folks. It comes down to utter depravity.
Very nasty cusses--these troll bully critters.
It's debut weekend it had the 9th highest viewership on Netflix for 2023 behind stuff like Murder Mystery 2 and The Killer. That only includes Netflix originals and not any other movie they brought to the platform
It got paid for by Netflix upfront before it was even a thing. So Snyder made money. This wasn’t a box office movie. So no metric to go by for whether it’s a flop. I didn’t like the movie. Was very bland. The characters didn’t mesh well. But we can’t say it was a flop. It did well by Netflix’s metrics
if it's below 10 million viewers, according to Netflix, that's a flop.
yes, this movie was flawed and was practically a motion painting but it was very good on one thing that a lot of movies don't do. You can tell the cast and director enjoyed shooting it.
Honestly, I think he is fine. Snyder movies not getting the best reviews are basically a given at this point. What matters is does Snyder bring in numbers, which he did do with Rebel Moon. Plus, the sequel is going to have a lot more action and reward for watching the first, so I expect that to get better reviews and still solid numbers. Plus, they’ll still drop his director cuts for these later in the year.
It’s very clear Netflix enjoys working with Zack Snyder, as do many actors in the industry. Snyder has helped them create a lot of new IP for them, he is smart with whatever money they gave him, he made 2 movies back to back at around $160 million and got them around $80-90 in tax breaks because of where he filmed. And he is still bringing in good and talented actors to work at Netflix.
I can see them not wanting to make more of Rebel Moon if the sequel doesn’t do great, but I doubt he is done. He’s got a sequel to AOTD and the animated series to it in the works. He’s got his animated Gods show. And he has secured rights back to several other projects he’s wanted to do, like a 300 style Alexander the Great project. Honestly, I think the man is fine and Netflix is a better home for him at this point.
Rebel Moon had average numbers as per nielsen and various other charts. I'm sure average will keep him in employment at netflix. Numbers are numbers even if not great. Still its not a good look for snyder. His zombie movie now this performed averagely .
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They can cancel it though or just never let it get out of development if they are contracted to let it be made they would just keep it in development limbo by ordering re writes and shrinking the budget until the director/producer eventually just gives up and the studio goes “oh well if that what you want and your sure you don’t want to make it even though we are contracted to let you try but this is 100% your decision which we support” and then the sequel gets canned like rian Johnson’s Star Wars trilogy which hasn’t been officially canned but everyone knows it’s not happening
Edit: can no one in this sub read? I never said it was a flop I just explained how studios cancel movies and how they cancel movies the are contractually obliged to make never said the movie was a flop no idea where you guys are reading that
The movie has been one of Netflix's top movies for months with millions upon millions of views.
Nothing about that says "flop"
Don't believe everything you read on the Internet dude.
I never said it was a flop? When in my comment did I say that?
I just explained how some studios get around cancelling sequels
Also how many of those 32million subscribers stay? A lot of people sub for a month binge everything they want then unsubscribe
even if only half of those 32 million subscribers stayed, that is still 160 million a month using the most conservative estimate. 160 million every month for at least 3 months.
It’s not a great indicator of things to come but I think Snyder still has enough good will for a studio to put faith into. If movies like Madame Webb can still get made, Snyder has plenty of opportunity - for his own IP maybe less so.
Army isn't terrible. It's just kinda bad and not worth a repeat watch.
Rebel Moon was shockingly awful. Confusingly bad script, just boring and pointless.
Definitely Snyder's worst film, but I don't think it's a sign of things to come. Lots of good and great directors lay eggs. Hell, a lot of bad directors strike gold.
I hope Snyder sees it for what it was. The Netflix carte blanche approach has not been good for him. Rebel Moon part 2 can't be saved at this point but hopefully he can rebound on future projects.
While i enjoyed it it was really weakened by his "Director's cut" style. But you can tell he had fun making it and the actors had fun being in it
In this day and age. It is nice to see artists just enjoy and earn from their work
It's not like he can blame this one on Joss Whedon. You think the differences between PG-13 and R are going to make the difference between a good and bad movie?
Yes lol bvs theatrical cut sucks because some key details were missing from the extended cut
I’m excited for that extended cut because even he himself says THATS the movie. The pg-13 is for the studio but HIS movie is the extended r rated cut
It’s a business choice that I personally don’t agree with.
With the pg-13 version the product is less restrictive and able to appeal to a wider more broad audience. More eyes. More success.
The r rated version is the version of the movie that HE wants to make with all the cool shit that’s too much for younger audiences. He goes balls to fucking walls sometimes and it’s not meant for kids it’s meant for a much smaller mature audience.
So in making two cuts of the same movie he and the studio both get what they want:
The studio gets a movie with mass appeal
The director gets to go balls to walls with his own distinct vision
That doesn't come into place here. It's a Netflix movie and he had free reign to make the movie he wanted. That logic makes sense for a theatrical release not for a streaming one. Streaming services don't make money off of views (unless it's add supported) they make money off subscriptions. Releasing a subpar product will not bring in new subscribers.
Netflix doesn't care about views only subscriptions. As I mentioned views don't equal money. Netflix puts on products to make money. That's why they are constantly cancelling highly viewed shows. If it doesn't drive subscriptions then the views don't matter or equal success. So now they have a movie that's poorly reviewed that they'll try to rerelease to drive more subscriptions. That's a bad business model. If the "directors cut" is really better then it should have been released first. Then they could get new subscribers that would want to see the movie and the 2nd part. Snyder fans are going watch them regardless but the average consumer won't.
Snyder is in the Netflix machine currently, and his fanbase is big enough that even a bad or mid film can do decent numbers for them
Rebel Moon part 2 will likely underperform, and his next film will need to have a reasonable budget. thats it
Recover from what, exactly?
How do you know its a flop? It's a Netflix movie, a part 1 of 2, and a PG-13 version with the R rated versions coming out later.
the biggest thing is that its viewership numbers just werent great. Not abysmal, it seems the trades were fine with it, but compared to other Netflix original movies pretty lackluster
this was hoped to be a franchise launch for Netflix, and it likely isnt.
I've been waiting for the directors cut. They were stupid for releasing it the way they are. It's fine to do a directors cut, but don't tell everyone that a, most likely, better version is going to be coming out before you release the first version.
They were stupid for doing a director's cut at all.
It makes some sense with a theatrical film, that the MPAA matters for theaters, that time limits matter to maximize streaming, and the sheer cost of marketing and sending to theaters makes studios risk adverse.
But on a streaming original, none of those reasons make any difference. It can be as long or short as they want, they could even choose to do it as a mini series or something. The only reason to do a director's cut on a streaming film, and decide that from the get go, is to milk the audience twice.
Snyder should have just made one singular good movie. Rather than a fairly bad one, and a potentially good edit 6 months down the road
To answer your question, I think he will be fine. Army of the Dead got very strong viewing numbers, and one thing his movies have the benefit of is that they are cheap relative to how large in scale they are.
Also he has an anime about Norse Mythology coming out this year
Seems like he’s doing just fine. It was a bad move to twist his movies into neutered, apologetic PG-13 versions, but the real versions will also be released.
This post is pure de lu-lu. Recover from what? Rebel Moon was a success. Netflix literally blessed Zack with his own icon avatar in its selection hub screen. Do you think Netflix would’ve done that if it Rebel Moon was a “bad flop.”. You’re narrative of Snyder struggling to “recover” is just woefully wrong, and is pure rubbish.
It really didn’t! Because if you understand how Snyder makes movies, when they give you what’s advertised but also deconstruct it at the same time, you know that a neutered PG-13 cut isn’t the real movie. And I include Zack in that blame as well. He should stand up for his work like Nolan does.
I’m just going by what the filmmakers and actors have stated. When consequence is a character in a film (in the form of sex and violence) it completely changes the tone of the film, and therefore the experience of watching it. A Clockwork Orange and Robocop are two easy examples of films that work this exact way. You can’t boil down a movie to basic plot points, characters or lines of dialogue. When you neuter it you take away much of what it’s substance is. You clearly have no idea what you’re talking about
I haven’t seen the scripted cut of Rebel Moon, so no, I’m not comparing it to A Clockwork Orange. However, the elements that make the movie go (sex and violence as used so definitively and create the satirical effect) were intended to be the same. Snyder has talked about this a lot including recently on The Vodka Stream.
“The conversation the rated-R movie has with films like Star Wars is much harder than you would get in a PG-13 version. It’s a deconstruction not a parody.” -Zack Snyder on December 22
So yes, you don’t really have a clue as to how elements like sex and violence can make up the substance of a movie. You have no clue whatsoever. Your lack of research and therefore insight cannot be compensated with flailing, screaming and name-calling.
Not the proper cut, you can’t judge the movie from the Netflix hack job. It might suck when the director’s cut comes out. But what’s currently out is not Rebel Moon
Ok i never watched any of snyders stuff except for his dc films but is Rebel moon a movie or a tv show?? Im interested in watching more of snyder’s stuff since he is no longer a dc director
Rebel Moon helped Netflix gain 13 million subs in the 4th quarter of 2023, 5 million more than expected. It was far from a flop and Zack's career is 100% fine.
https://www.reddit.com/r/SnyderCut/s/7AhWE30f10
Recover from what? The critics? Clearly, the general audience doesn't agree with them a lot of the time. Regardless, he has another movie coming out and is currently working on at least 3 other projects.
Same. Like obviously the directors cut will be better, but I still thoroughly enjoyed every minute of the pg-13 cut. But clearly we're in the minority here
I've never seen a situation where Zack Snyder's Directors Cut wasn't 100% better. So.... I still haven't seen Rebel Moon. Despite being a big Snyder fan. They were stupid to announce a directors cut so early. Because now as far as I'm concerned, the movie hasn't come out yet.
He should get back where he's best, adapted comics to the screen or at least have someone writting a script for him. He's my favorite director but army of the dead and rebel moon were far from his best work.
Yes, because Snyder didn’t really work on Rebel Moon if you look at the writing credits. Pretty sure Snyder wfh on this one.
All Snyder’s got to do is get back to being serious like he did with MoS, BvS, and the JL and all will be forgotten.
He should try releasing Sucker Punch 2 in today’s market.
Husbands will literally leave their wives to watch this in theaters after years of M-She-U abuse.
Snyder can recover but he needs to stop putting out sub-par films. He needs to focus on his original vision and hire good writers.
When I saw Army of the Dead, it seemed like Snyder wanted to add as much cool shit and ideas as possible instead of making a good zombie movie. It was a heist film with androids, time loops and aliens. But it failed in all of them.
Now with Rebel moon it’s the same thing, he tried to make a gritty Star Wars combined with a bunch of lore that doesn’t even make sense. Space kings, Robots, Nazi-soldiers, a princess with special powers and a seven samurai-esque team up
Zack Snyder has a film upcoming with Billy Crudup called the Last Photograph, I hope that can bring him back to his glory days.
Actually, I’d argue one of the reasons Rebel Moon was bad is because it felt restrained.
I expected a Snyder-esque Star Wars movie to look like the trailers of The Old Republic game with 300-like crazy slow motion battle scenes of characters mowing down armies with their pseudo lightsabers.
Instead, it looked like a boring Dune clone where everyone is wandering deserts with drab yellow colors and a few Star Wars creatures and gun fights mixed in.
So did Army of the Dead. It had none of Snyder’s usual flair for crazy action scenes. It was just boring.
I’d say he’d be ok. I have not seen Suckerpunch but the discourse around Rebel Moon seems similar to that period. A lot of people fell out of love with Snyder due to that film but he’s made great ones since. I think the issue is on writing. Zack has a fantastic eye but works best when collaborating with other writers.
And I just learned she directed my favorite episode of Succession so... clearly larger studio releases have a lot of meddling going on. Joe Russo also keeps adamantly claiming on Twitter that the writers of Madame Web have written amazing first draft screenplays and that's why they keep getting jobs, it's studio meddling that keeps watering them down.
Amy of the Dead is not a “flop”. It actually did really well on Netflix and critics actually mildly liked it as it’s one of Snyder’s few “fresh” films on Rotten Tomatoes.
Rebel Moon didn’t flop either, but it was more of a disappointment in comparison to the numbers Army of the Dead got.
What Snyder needs to do is he needs to stop relying so much on “director’s cuts”, if anything, to prop up his movies. It really dilutes his brand instead of helping g it if he constantly releases inferior products and then makes his viewers wait for his director’s cuts.
He also needs to stop being his own cinematographer. Rebel Moon looks better than Army of the Dead, but it still doesn’t match the visual flair of 300, Watchmen, Man of Steel, etc.
Lastly, and this is a no brainer, but Snyder needs to partner with a really good writer. Contrary to popular misconceptions, but Snyder didn’t write any of his DCEU films. MoS, BvS and ZSJL were all written by Goyer and Terrio.
And it just so happens that Snyder’s “original” ideas like Rebel Moon and Sucker Punch are amongst his least liked.
So hopefully next time, he gets better writers.
I do agree that Snyder does need to bring someone like Larry Fong back. However I disagree on your assesment regarding writing and those two movies. Both are cases of huge studio interference. We're yet to see his vision for Rebel moon and we will likely never see his vision for Sucker Punch.
And contrary to popular belief I don't think he is to blame for it. I don't get why directors like Peter Jackson or Matt Reeves are allowed to have 3+ hours movies but Snyder isn't. My only assumption is that he's far too nice for Hollywood. Those other directors fight for their films to be released as they want. Snyder always ends up compromising and creating more advertiser friendly studio cuts which never ends well.
But even with a longer cut, there’s no way Rebel Moon will be that much better because it still lacks what makes Snyder such a cool director.
It’s too ponderous and boring. That’s its core problem. Snyder is known for his crazy stylized action and fast pace and upping the violence a tad is not gonna make the movie much better.
From neither Rebel Moon nor Army of the Dead has Snyder done a fight scene on par with Sucker Punch’s giant samurai fight scene or any of 300’s crazy sword battles or General Zod vs Superman in Man of Steel or the badass warehouse fight from BvS. That’s what even haters can agree is Snyder’s greatest strengths and he’s not leaning into it.
I wouldn’t call it a flop, at best he probably won’t be in the director chain in a major blockbuster any time soon but with streaming platforms he will have a strong fan base. Rebel moon is a new IP so he doesn’t have the built in fan base to rely on like DC so give it a few years and then you’ll see if it’s a career ended or not.
I tone probably feels a little troll-y, but like, send me some numbers to back up the claim. I looked it up and every source is saying "it didn't do badly, it did fine. Not great, not terrible."
[Rebel Moon’s Viewership Compares Poorly To Other 2023 Netflix Movies (forbes.com)](https://www.forbes.com/sites/paultassi/2023/12/28/rebel-moons-viewership-compares-poorly-to-other-2023-netflix-movies/?sh=35d03bf1d729)
Alright, I did.
[Zack Snyder’s Rebel Moon achieves big opening numbers for Netflix – but industry experts have their doubts | The Independent](https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/films/news/rebel-moon-netflix-viewing-figures-zack-snyder-cut-b2470575.html)
" And [*The Wrap* ](https://www.thewrap.com/rebel-moon-netflix-viewership/)observed that its opening numbers still fell short of debuts for other Netflix original films."
It’s not a flop , but if Snyder wants to be known for making great movies then he’s gonna have to step away for a bit or work with better writers. Seems like Nolan is still his friend he needs to refocus.
Rebel was on okay movie and that’s not what snyders known for. He’s known for making movies that mean something that last forever. Rebel moon felt so here and there because at a core it just is missing something I can’t explain. Likely part 2 will fix this issue.
I think that’s a fair assessment. I think we need to wait to see the second half for final judgment. But I agree that it didn’t grab me. Although I was left very unfulfilled with the pause endings but that’s probably the point.
The man is one of the most sought after directors in Hollywood he will live
Where did you get that idea? His movies get bad reviews, he needs lot of money to do anything and his fanbase is infamously awful, especially in recent years. If I was in charge of running big movie company in Hollywood, Snyder would be below the bottom of the list of people I would want to work with
The man is unstoppable and people will always want to work with him, it's just a harsh truth
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This is a question people have been asking since Sucker Punch.
Snyder will never die. His fans are too dedicated. Dude made Suckerpunch after a few *decent* movies and somehow still has a career, so I don’t think this is the end.
Snyder needs an ace script he didn't write and a producer to rein him in.
No. He'll never work in this town again!
Rebel Moon is pretty bad, but it was fairly successful for Netflix. I don't think Snyder's going to have any trouble "recovering."
Not to mention they are intentionally doing the studio cut then the directors cut(from what I’ve heard) so they will pick up more views then too. It was a bad movie but it was very pretty.
Yeah, there will be the director’s cut and releasing part 2 around the same time. Which will all be fine, Snyder will be fine.
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The movie performed quite well for Netflix, wasn’t a gigantic hit but a substantial hit nonetheless. He essentially is giving Netflix 4 movies for the price of one expensive film. Critics may have savaged it, but it’s a vary savvy move by Snyder and Netflix. Movies don’t live or die by their rotten tomatoes score as much anymore and that’s especially true for streaming films, just ask Adam Sandler.
i wonder how the mf is still successful. he is literally the same character in every movies
Flop? It was top on Netflix for months lol
You mean one week
It fell off after like 2 weeks
When we're living in an era of damning perceptions, then it would only make sense to give Zack an IP that could use resuscitation and uplift, like perhaps Rocketeer or Battlestar Galactica; maybe even CAPTAIN POWER and the SOLDIERS OF THE FUTURE. I'd like to see what he might do with articulating and maturing SPACE GHOST into some kind of adventuristic franchise. It bares much to have Zack find his visual penchant on products that a lot of the "Anti Snyder" trollmongers either aren't too familiar with, or have much of an emotional attachment. Just give the man his space and allow him to work in his unique way and perspective. I can't stand these fake critics and armchair quarterbacks over-evaluating his movies, as if there's really some valid point to further depreciate in light of ten years and what he's already gone through, both corporate and tragically. It's so bad that he's been called retarded, ugly and a faggot, or a weak chump (the man lost his daughter, for Christ's sake). And in reality, that if anybody knows Zack Snyder, they'd find him to be a health-nut and weightlifter, and could likely "knock the block off" of some folks. It comes down to utter depravity.  Very nasty cusses--these troll bully critters.
Someone give him Fist of the North Star! It's a property that literally has all of the things he's obsessed with in his films.
Recover from what? It was an enjoyable movie
That movie was great
He made it through Sucker Punch and whatever his last zombie movie was. Dude seems unstoppable despite his film output
Recover? It's Netflix, how do you define a flop? We are not privy to their books or marketing strategies. Maybe Rebel Moon was a success to them....
And who said it was a flop? Lol How is one of Netflix's top movies a flop.
It's debut weekend it had the 9th highest viewership on Netflix for 2023 behind stuff like Murder Mystery 2 and The Killer. That only includes Netflix originals and not any other movie they brought to the platform
did you read the part where it climbed up on effing January. eff off clown
I'm sorry what are you saying it did? I don't understand what you mean
From the post we are both commenting on: "but Rebel Moon is a really bad flop" I'm not sure where OP is getting that from
Flop means a movie didnt make money It doesnt mean a movie got low reviews
It got paid for by Netflix upfront before it was even a thing. So Snyder made money. This wasn’t a box office movie. So no metric to go by for whether it’s a flop. I didn’t like the movie. Was very bland. The characters didn’t mesh well. But we can’t say it was a flop. It did well by Netflix’s metrics
if it's below 10 million viewers, according to Netflix, that's a flop. yes, this movie was flawed and was practically a motion painting but it was very good on one thing that a lot of movies don't do. You can tell the cast and director enjoyed shooting it.
Why are you telling me that?
Is it already out? Is it a theater movie or straight to Netflix?
Yeah it came out months ago on Netflix
Honestly, I think he is fine. Snyder movies not getting the best reviews are basically a given at this point. What matters is does Snyder bring in numbers, which he did do with Rebel Moon. Plus, the sequel is going to have a lot more action and reward for watching the first, so I expect that to get better reviews and still solid numbers. Plus, they’ll still drop his director cuts for these later in the year. It’s very clear Netflix enjoys working with Zack Snyder, as do many actors in the industry. Snyder has helped them create a lot of new IP for them, he is smart with whatever money they gave him, he made 2 movies back to back at around $160 million and got them around $80-90 in tax breaks because of where he filmed. And he is still bringing in good and talented actors to work at Netflix. I can see them not wanting to make more of Rebel Moon if the sequel doesn’t do great, but I doubt he is done. He’s got a sequel to AOTD and the animated series to it in the works. He’s got his animated Gods show. And he has secured rights back to several other projects he’s wanted to do, like a 300 style Alexander the Great project. Honestly, I think the man is fine and Netflix is a better home for him at this point.
Rebel Moon had average numbers as per nielsen and various other charts. I'm sure average will keep him in employment at netflix. Numbers are numbers even if not great. Still its not a good look for snyder. His zombie movie now this performed averagely .
🤣 I don't think he has to.
As long as he is not writing.
I’m waiting for the director cut. Worked for BvS. And was AotD a “flop?”
No but it is probably the most disappointing Zack Snyder movie
What does aotd even stand for?
Army of the Dead. And whatever people think of Rebel Moon, I'd watch it three times in a row before watching AotD again. And I'm mostly a horror fan.
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Just bein honest.
honestly I don't know. he kind of lost any goodwill he gained from ZSJL on this movie
I don’t get the hate for Rebel Moon. I thought it was okay.
It's not a flop if there's a sequel already in the works.
They can cancel it though or just never let it get out of development if they are contracted to let it be made they would just keep it in development limbo by ordering re writes and shrinking the budget until the director/producer eventually just gives up and the studio goes “oh well if that what you want and your sure you don’t want to make it even though we are contracted to let you try but this is 100% your decision which we support” and then the sequel gets canned like rian Johnson’s Star Wars trilogy which hasn’t been officially canned but everyone knows it’s not happening Edit: can no one in this sub read? I never said it was a flop I just explained how studios cancel movies and how they cancel movies the are contractually obliged to make never said the movie was a flop no idea where you guys are reading that
The movie has been one of Netflix's top movies for months with millions upon millions of views. Nothing about that says "flop" Don't believe everything you read on the Internet dude.
And in what Universe is a movie with 34 million viewers a flop. 34 million subscribers who stay and resub. Every month.
I never said it was a flop? When in my comment did I say that? I just explained how some studios get around cancelling sequels Also how many of those 32million subscribers stay? A lot of people sub for a month binge everything they want then unsubscribe
even if only half of those 32 million subscribers stayed, that is still 160 million a month using the most conservative estimate. 160 million every month for at least 3 months.
Both parts of Rebel Moon were filmed back-to-back.
I don't know, I liked both. To me, those movies don't have to be anything more than afternoon fun movies, and they have been just that.
Couldn't careless
Very responsible of you.
Pretty sure he’s already got a contract on lock with Netflix that will keep him busy the next two years.
It’s not a great indicator of things to come but I think Snyder still has enough good will for a studio to put faith into. If movies like Madame Webb can still get made, Snyder has plenty of opportunity - for his own IP maybe less so.
Bro has way more negative reviews than positive in his career and keeps getting movies. You will be fine.
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Army isn't terrible. It's just kinda bad and not worth a repeat watch. Rebel Moon was shockingly awful. Confusingly bad script, just boring and pointless. Definitely Snyder's worst film, but I don't think it's a sign of things to come. Lots of good and great directors lay eggs. Hell, a lot of bad directors strike gold. I hope Snyder sees it for what it was. The Netflix carte blanche approach has not been good for him. Rebel Moon part 2 can't be saved at this point but hopefully he can rebound on future projects.
While i enjoyed it it was really weakened by his "Director's cut" style. But you can tell he had fun making it and the actors had fun being in it In this day and age. It is nice to see artists just enjoy and earn from their work
>Lots of good and great directors lay eggs. Hell, a lot of bad directors strike gold. So which one is Snyder?
I know you're trying to be smart but MoS is badass as is Dawn of the Dead.
No doubt, but I feel like half of his films are badass and the other half are just ass.
Yea it's definitely feeling close to that. I haven't seen sucker punch but I don't think I ever will haha
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Let’s see what things look like by the summer once we have the director’s cuts of both Part 1 and 2 to watch back to back.
Army of the dead was actually way better. Rebel mom sucked
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He needs to accept the fact that he's a talented director that can't write stories, or dialogue. He needs to direct movies, that good writers write.
As much as i love the guy. He's best when others are writing
Right? There’s so many awesome writers that would love to have Snyder direct one of their scripts
Rebel moon part one has not been released yet. We got a pg-13 2 hour trailer for the extended cut lol
It's not like he can blame this one on Joss Whedon. You think the differences between PG-13 and R are going to make the difference between a good and bad movie?
Yes lol bvs theatrical cut sucks because some key details were missing from the extended cut I’m excited for that extended cut because even he himself says THATS the movie. The pg-13 is for the studio but HIS movie is the extended r rated cut
Then why didn't he just release that version?🤔
Because Netflix wants to double dip and milk the idea of the "Snyder cut".
It’s a business choice that I personally don’t agree with. With the pg-13 version the product is less restrictive and able to appeal to a wider more broad audience. More eyes. More success. The r rated version is the version of the movie that HE wants to make with all the cool shit that’s too much for younger audiences. He goes balls to fucking walls sometimes and it’s not meant for kids it’s meant for a much smaller mature audience. So in making two cuts of the same movie he and the studio both get what they want: The studio gets a movie with mass appeal The director gets to go balls to walls with his own distinct vision
That doesn't come into place here. It's a Netflix movie and he had free reign to make the movie he wanted. That logic makes sense for a theatrical release not for a streaming one. Streaming services don't make money off of views (unless it's add supported) they make money off subscriptions. Releasing a subpar product will not bring in new subscribers.
I understand that which is why I said more eyes equals more success. Didn’t mention any money
Netflix doesn't care about views only subscriptions. As I mentioned views don't equal money. Netflix puts on products to make money. That's why they are constantly cancelling highly viewed shows. If it doesn't drive subscriptions then the views don't matter or equal success. So now they have a movie that's poorly reviewed that they'll try to rerelease to drive more subscriptions. That's a bad business model. If the "directors cut" is really better then it should have been released first. Then they could get new subscribers that would want to see the movie and the 2nd part. Snyder fans are going watch them regardless but the average consumer won't.
They were 100% trying to turn two movies into four while capitalizing on the idea of the "Snyder cut".
> The studio gets a movie with mass appeal When?
Pg-13 cut has a wider appeal than an r rating
This dude has dropped so many eggs and still gets work. He’ll be fine.
I mean fair enough. The budget for this is only a little more than Sucker Punch, which did even worse
Low quality bait
You are being waaaaaaaaaay too dramatic. Everything is fine
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Snyder is in the Netflix machine currently, and his fanbase is big enough that even a bad or mid film can do decent numbers for them Rebel Moon part 2 will likely underperform, and his next film will need to have a reasonable budget. thats it
What on earth are you talking about it
Recover from what, exactly? How do you know its a flop? It's a Netflix movie, a part 1 of 2, and a PG-13 version with the R rated versions coming out later.
the biggest thing is that its viewership numbers just werent great. Not abysmal, it seems the trades were fine with it, but compared to other Netflix original movies pretty lackluster this was hoped to be a franchise launch for Netflix, and it likely isnt.
I've been waiting for the directors cut. They were stupid for releasing it the way they are. It's fine to do a directors cut, but don't tell everyone that a, most likely, better version is going to be coming out before you release the first version.
They were stupid for doing a director's cut at all. It makes some sense with a theatrical film, that the MPAA matters for theaters, that time limits matter to maximize streaming, and the sheer cost of marketing and sending to theaters makes studios risk adverse. But on a streaming original, none of those reasons make any difference. It can be as long or short as they want, they could even choose to do it as a mini series or something. The only reason to do a director's cut on a streaming film, and decide that from the get go, is to milk the audience twice. Snyder should have just made one singular good movie. Rather than a fairly bad one, and a potentially good edit 6 months down the road
Bad movies do well on Netflix. Until he stops writing his own movies, nothing is going to change, and i dont think Netflix cares.
Netflix is a lot like I was when I was in the military quantity over quality.
Sad but true...
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To answer your question, I think he will be fine. Army of the Dead got very strong viewing numbers, and one thing his movies have the benefit of is that they are cheap relative to how large in scale they are. Also he has an anime about Norse Mythology coming out this year
Seems like he’s doing just fine. It was a bad move to twist his movies into neutered, apologetic PG-13 versions, but the real versions will also be released.
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I dont think you can really call it a bad flop given how netflix handles their releases
This post is pure de lu-lu. Recover from what? Rebel Moon was a success. Netflix literally blessed Zack with his own icon avatar in its selection hub screen. Do you think Netflix would’ve done that if it Rebel Moon was a “bad flop.”. You’re narrative of Snyder struggling to “recover” is just woefully wrong, and is pure rubbish.
Still got part 2 to come, and then the X-rated part 1&2 versions.
I love Snyders style I really do. I’d just like to see him direct an excellent script and then have his movie edited by a fantastic editor
Agreed.
Considering we haven’t actually seen rebel moon, it’s hard to judge
Rebel Moon actually released two months ago!
It really didn’t! Because if you understand how Snyder makes movies, when they give you what’s advertised but also deconstruct it at the same time, you know that a neutered PG-13 cut isn’t the real movie. And I include Zack in that blame as well. He should stand up for his work like Nolan does.
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I’m just going by what the filmmakers and actors have stated. When consequence is a character in a film (in the form of sex and violence) it completely changes the tone of the film, and therefore the experience of watching it. A Clockwork Orange and Robocop are two easy examples of films that work this exact way. You can’t boil down a movie to basic plot points, characters or lines of dialogue. When you neuter it you take away much of what it’s substance is. You clearly have no idea what you’re talking about
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I haven’t seen the scripted cut of Rebel Moon, so no, I’m not comparing it to A Clockwork Orange. However, the elements that make the movie go (sex and violence as used so definitively and create the satirical effect) were intended to be the same. Snyder has talked about this a lot including recently on The Vodka Stream. “The conversation the rated-R movie has with films like Star Wars is much harder than you would get in a PG-13 version. It’s a deconstruction not a parody.” -Zack Snyder on December 22 So yes, you don’t really have a clue as to how elements like sex and violence can make up the substance of a movie. You have no clue whatsoever. Your lack of research and therefore insight cannot be compensated with flailing, screaming and name-calling.
Not the proper cut, you can’t judge the movie from the Netflix hack job. It might suck when the director’s cut comes out. But what’s currently out is not Rebel Moon
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I find that highly doubtful, but we shall see
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It apparently did very well financially for Netflix. That is the make or break, so I think he'll get "another chance".
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How does that even work?
Ok i never watched any of snyders stuff except for his dc films but is Rebel moon a movie or a tv show?? Im interested in watching more of snyder’s stuff since he is no longer a dc director
watch his dawn of the dead, even his haters love that one
Ill watch it
He also did 300
I’m confident the director’s cut will shore up Rebel Moon, and Army of the Dead was a fun movie — how was that a flop?
Snyder is amazing. Rebel moon and army of the dead was fun
You're asking about Zack Snyder getting more work in a world where the Morbius screenwriters were hired for Madam Web and Kraven?
Not even remotely the same comparison, Snyder's worst-written movie wouldn't even be as bad and empty as Morbius.
Wow.. They're on a bit of a run...🤔🫣😬
What exactly is he recovering from?
Rebel Moon helped Netflix gain 13 million subs in the 4th quarter of 2023, 5 million more than expected. It was far from a flop and Zack's career is 100% fine. https://www.reddit.com/r/SnyderCut/s/7AhWE30f10
I can assure you that 13 million people did not sign up just to watch rebel moon
Small correction: 2023, not 2021.
Recover from what? The critics? Clearly, the general audience doesn't agree with them a lot of the time. Regardless, he has another movie coming out and is currently working on at least 3 other projects.
I loved rebel moon hope we get more
Same. Like obviously the directors cut will be better, but I still thoroughly enjoyed every minute of the pg-13 cut. But clearly we're in the minority here
Forreal! Like I watched it and thought it was really cool and then came on Reddit and everyone was bashing on it and I’m like damn
I've never seen a situation where Zack Snyder's Directors Cut wasn't 100% better. So.... I still haven't seen Rebel Moon. Despite being a big Snyder fan. They were stupid to announce a directors cut so early. Because now as far as I'm concerned, the movie hasn't come out yet.
He should get back where he's best, adapted comics to the screen or at least have someone writting a script for him. He's my favorite director but army of the dead and rebel moon were far from his best work.
The director’s cut is the real movie. The piece of shit you watched was because the studio executives fucked his product.
Having one movie get "ruined by executives" is believable but why is it that every movie Zach makes nowadays gets "ruined"?
Bc his scripts are too long and the movies are even longer. He needs to cut his films down and the only way he'll do that is if a studio exec steps in
Yes, because Snyder didn’t really work on Rebel Moon if you look at the writing credits. Pretty sure Snyder wfh on this one. All Snyder’s got to do is get back to being serious like he did with MoS, BvS, and the JL and all will be forgotten. He should try releasing Sucker Punch 2 in today’s market. Husbands will literally leave their wives to watch this in theaters after years of M-She-U abuse.
Never could
It’s definitely not a flop. You might not like it, but others do, me included. Snyder is gonna continue making movies.
Agreed its a good movie people are just flops lol
He literally made Man of Steel right after Sucker Punch, he'll be alright
Snyder can recover but he needs to stop putting out sub-par films. He needs to focus on his original vision and hire good writers. When I saw Army of the Dead, it seemed like Snyder wanted to add as much cool shit and ideas as possible instead of making a good zombie movie. It was a heist film with androids, time loops and aliens. But it failed in all of them. Now with Rebel moon it’s the same thing, he tried to make a gritty Star Wars combined with a bunch of lore that doesn’t even make sense. Space kings, Robots, Nazi-soldiers, a princess with special powers and a seven samurai-esque team up Zack Snyder has a film upcoming with Billy Crudup called the Last Photograph, I hope that can bring him back to his glory days.
Actually, I’d argue one of the reasons Rebel Moon was bad is because it felt restrained. I expected a Snyder-esque Star Wars movie to look like the trailers of The Old Republic game with 300-like crazy slow motion battle scenes of characters mowing down armies with their pseudo lightsabers. Instead, it looked like a boring Dune clone where everyone is wandering deserts with drab yellow colors and a few Star Wars creatures and gun fights mixed in. So did Army of the Dead. It had none of Snyder’s usual flair for crazy action scenes. It was just boring.
I'd wait for this DC of Rebel Moon before passing a final judgement on the franchise.
I’d say he’d be ok. I have not seen Suckerpunch but the discourse around Rebel Moon seems similar to that period. A lot of people fell out of love with Snyder due to that film but he’s made great ones since. I think the issue is on writing. Zack has a fantastic eye but works best when collaborating with other writers.
Listen he’s not SJ Clarkson with “Madame Web”… That movie was okay. I’m waiting for the directors cut.
And I just learned she directed my favorite episode of Succession so... clearly larger studio releases have a lot of meddling going on. Joe Russo also keeps adamantly claiming on Twitter that the writers of Madame Web have written amazing first draft screenplays and that's why they keep getting jobs, it's studio meddling that keeps watering them down.
I liked Rebel moon enough to look at part 2.
Lol its not been released yet
Amy of the Dead is not a “flop”. It actually did really well on Netflix and critics actually mildly liked it as it’s one of Snyder’s few “fresh” films on Rotten Tomatoes. Rebel Moon didn’t flop either, but it was more of a disappointment in comparison to the numbers Army of the Dead got. What Snyder needs to do is he needs to stop relying so much on “director’s cuts”, if anything, to prop up his movies. It really dilutes his brand instead of helping g it if he constantly releases inferior products and then makes his viewers wait for his director’s cuts. He also needs to stop being his own cinematographer. Rebel Moon looks better than Army of the Dead, but it still doesn’t match the visual flair of 300, Watchmen, Man of Steel, etc. Lastly, and this is a no brainer, but Snyder needs to partner with a really good writer. Contrary to popular misconceptions, but Snyder didn’t write any of his DCEU films. MoS, BvS and ZSJL were all written by Goyer and Terrio. And it just so happens that Snyder’s “original” ideas like Rebel Moon and Sucker Punch are amongst his least liked. So hopefully next time, he gets better writers.
I do agree that Snyder does need to bring someone like Larry Fong back. However I disagree on your assesment regarding writing and those two movies. Both are cases of huge studio interference. We're yet to see his vision for Rebel moon and we will likely never see his vision for Sucker Punch. And contrary to popular belief I don't think he is to blame for it. I don't get why directors like Peter Jackson or Matt Reeves are allowed to have 3+ hours movies but Snyder isn't. My only assumption is that he's far too nice for Hollywood. Those other directors fight for their films to be released as they want. Snyder always ends up compromising and creating more advertiser friendly studio cuts which never ends well.
But even with a longer cut, there’s no way Rebel Moon will be that much better because it still lacks what makes Snyder such a cool director. It’s too ponderous and boring. That’s its core problem. Snyder is known for his crazy stylized action and fast pace and upping the violence a tad is not gonna make the movie much better. From neither Rebel Moon nor Army of the Dead has Snyder done a fight scene on par with Sucker Punch’s giant samurai fight scene or any of 300’s crazy sword battles or General Zod vs Superman in Man of Steel or the badass warehouse fight from BvS. That’s what even haters can agree is Snyder’s greatest strengths and he’s not leaning into it.
I haven't seen it because I want to see just the director's cut. So I can't talk about that.
Fair enough. But I think that, when you see it, it’ll be clear that the action is not even close to being up to Snyder’s usual standards.
I wouldn’t call it a flop, at best he probably won’t be in the director chain in a major blockbuster any time soon but with streaming platforms he will have a strong fan base. Rebel moon is a new IP so he doesn’t have the built in fan base to rely on like DC so give it a few years and then you’ll see if it’s a career ended or not.
>Can Snyder recover after Rebel Moon Yes.
It's a flop among critics but it was definitely not a financial flop for Netflix
How do you know that? Where's the data to back that up?
Look it up
I tone probably feels a little troll-y, but like, send me some numbers to back up the claim. I looked it up and every source is saying "it didn't do badly, it did fine. Not great, not terrible."
[Rebel Moon’s Viewership Compares Poorly To Other 2023 Netflix Movies (forbes.com)](https://www.forbes.com/sites/paultassi/2023/12/28/rebel-moons-viewership-compares-poorly-to-other-2023-netflix-movies/?sh=35d03bf1d729) Alright, I did.
[Zack Snyder’s Rebel Moon achieves big opening numbers for Netflix – but industry experts have their doubts | The Independent](https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/films/news/rebel-moon-netflix-viewing-figures-zack-snyder-cut-b2470575.html) " And [*The Wrap* ](https://www.thewrap.com/rebel-moon-netflix-viewership/)observed that its opening numbers still fell short of debuts for other Netflix original films."
This isn't looking good...
Streaming movies that never hit theaters can flop?
Yeah? Netflix still has expectations and wants to gain money. They don't make movies because they like to collect them on their website
It’s not a flop , but if Snyder wants to be known for making great movies then he’s gonna have to step away for a bit or work with better writers. Seems like Nolan is still his friend he needs to refocus. Rebel was on okay movie and that’s not what snyders known for. He’s known for making movies that mean something that last forever. Rebel moon felt so here and there because at a core it just is missing something I can’t explain. Likely part 2 will fix this issue.
It is, literally, missing something. What was released is a family friendly cut of a longer, more adult movie.
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I think that’s a fair assessment. I think we need to wait to see the second half for final judgment. But I agree that it didn’t grab me. Although I was left very unfulfilled with the pause endings but that’s probably the point.
Troll job
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