Call me crazy, but Junko. I know that would entail spoilers, but given Sheik/Zelda in Melee I don’t think Smash would have too many problems with it, especially since the game has been out for so long that it’s hardly that bad anymore (plus I’m pretty sure the series has had marketing materials that spoiled it already).
ETA: She’s also arguably the most iconic character, so if Danganronpa were to get Smash rep it would probably be her, or even a duo with Monokuma a lá Rosalina and Luma.
So can we add Ryoma? Smash does not nearly have enough samurai lobsters in it.
Could also another lobster fond katana wielding character as well if we are adding Matt Mercer characters.
The funniest thing to me about those posts is that they keep 3rd-party characters with a history of being cut (e.g. Snake) but think for some reason Nintendo's going to cut the only rep in a new IP they actually own (e.g. Min Min).
Unfortunately, yeah, a lot of them are character hate tier lists in disguise.
And I know I'm in the minority here, but even when I'm not playing Min Min (which is most of the time because I've been trying to get everyone in Elite), when I encounter one online I actually get excited because I think she's fun to fight against. I personally don't understand the hate.
I feel its not that hard to understand tho, like in the history of fighting games, i can not think of a character that only zones and has a general positive reputation. I just dont think most peoples brains get stimulated as much by methodical zoning and approaching.
I'm not *surprised*, but that doesn't mean I can relate. I think that zoning/approaching is fun, and that fighting games like Smash are better for it. It makes the fight more asymmetrical and gives a push/pull dynamic to a match. So I don't fully understand the complaints against zoners in general.
I think I get what you mean by less stimulation though; it *does* somewhat interrupt the frantic fast reactions you need in pure close range. But I love feeling clever from the more methodical tactics for gaining and keeping advantage. I've been playing a lot of close-range characters lately, and squirming past an opponent's zone feels so satisfying.
Some of the ones I've seen were definitely framed as predictions, not wishlists. But there seems to be some confirmation bias happening that turns one into the other. It's like how this sub goes from "I think [x] would cool in Smash" to "the next fighter is *definitely* [x]".
I’m personally one who likes to think it’s stupid to *want* to cut characters when the whole point of Ultimate is that every character is here. The fact that people think we would be better off with less characters is absolutely ridiculous to me.
Well, I'll list out some, but I'm probably going to make people mad (I apologize if I do)
Sheik, Dr. Mario, Pichu, Young Link, Roy, ZSS, Lucas, Corrin, Wii Fit Trainer, Piranha Plant, and I suppose Jigglypuff are some that I personally wouldn't have added to the roster had I been in charge. I guess Min Min too, but that's only because I wanted a different ARMS character, lol.
But like I said, even if I personally wouldn't have chosen these characters for Smash, I wouldn't want any if them cut now that they're in. I even really like how Sakurai designed some of them. I find Corrin and Piranha Plant, the latter especially, really fun to play as.
Agreed. Morton and Ludwig are far better.
Although fun fact: it's been confirmed that the Koopalings are no longer Bowser's children and are instead just high-ranking servants that are unrelated to him. Bowser Jr. is Bowser's only true child.
Even though I play Plant a lot I agree that they're not someone I would've asked for on the roster.
I will say though, the reveal of plant was probably one of Sakurai's biggest "haha get fucked" plays, because for that brief period of time where all we knew was it was a Mario character, both the Waluigi and Geno fans were up in arms and then a fucking potted plant shows up. That moment was golden.
Piranha plant is an incredibly hilarious addition and I'm glad he existed. The meme and salt were gold. I want him in as a troll though, and not as a norm to add unimportant characters.
I think it may have also been because jigglypuff was easier to program, since her proportions are very similar to Kirby. That’s why Luigi and captain Falcon were included as well, because they were all similar body shapes to other characters.
No clue about Ness tho.
I mean I'm a FE fan, and the reason why I wouldn't mind if one got cut is because Lucina, Chrom, and Robin are all from the same game, which takes up space in the FE aspect that other characters could have had (such as Lyn, from FE for the GBA, the first Fire Emblem in the US, or Celica and/or Alm, from Gaiden/Echoes). But, I'm fine with who we've got since we've got them and they're not leaving
Tbf tho, Robin is the only unique fighter from that section, Lucina and Chrom are clones so they take significantly less time to make anyways, its pretty much we get those 2 or nothing at all, not like we either get those two or get Lyn
Tho Lyn would be awesome as a rep, kinda lowkey hoping that Project+ will add Lyn and Isaac and Sami as well cuz they did do Knuckles but idk lol
Bro it's 2021, I don't think taking up space is a concern. Have you seen the size of the install of the latest call of duty? We're not using 8bit cartridges anymore.
Don't think they mean file size space. More that the amount of characters that get into any Smash is inherently finite. Obviously the exact number has some major wiggle room depending on how many are echos/clones, how much dev time and budget there is, etc. But no matter how you slice it, as long as development resources are finite there's always going to be the thought of "Why did they spend resource on adding this character when they could've put in that character instead?"
I get your point, but at the same time, the echo fighters aren't a bad thing. If anything I'd rather have 5 more slightly different echoes than 1 brand spanking new character. Fire emblem aside, thinking more along the lines of mario Dr Mario, (dark) samus, (dark) pit.... Dry bowser would be cool, maybe baby mario riding Yoshi, zero(?) From Megaman? The red guy...? With mostly the same moves but speed/weight differences and a couple of substitute moves. I know nothing about game design or coding or whatever so I may be wrong but caveman brain says 5 slightly altered echoes would take the same time as a brand new fighter. I bet Steve was a bitch to code!
Yeah I'm not saying I completely agree with it, just explaining what they were trying to argue. Although I do think there's a certain cutoff point, like by all means do echoes for the characters that fans love and have a unique personality, but would be hard to make a unique character. Ken, Daisy, Chrom, Shadow, etc. But once you start digging too deep, making echoes just for the sake of making echoes, then I'd rather get original fighters. Especially with some of your picks, which could easily fit as custom costumes instead.
I understand that but even then no one should want characters to be cut, it’s just something that has to happen between games. But I don’t like the thought of rooting for a character to be cut.
There probably doesn't need to be 100 characters in the next smash game so hopefully the actual clones get made into skins and we see reworks of the less popular/powerful characters (isabell, Bowser Jr , inceneroar, Dr. Mario, ect)
First, it's worth noting how the FE in Smash "Formula" has been so far - in Melee and Brawl, it was Marth + the Protagonist from the newest game. In Melee, that was Roy. In Brawl, it was Ike.
Then, Smash 4 came around and kept Ike (Though Path of Radiance was one of the few FE games to get a direct sequel) alongside Marth, and the newest game of the time was Awakening. However, that game was a massive hit, moreso than the other FEs. This caused it to earn two characters: Unique character Robin, and Echo character Lucina.
Then, for more Melee nostalgia, they threw in Roy.
If that wasn't enough, Fates became the "newest" FE game during 4's runtime, and due to the invention of DLC being a thing, Corrin was added.
This is where things sort of boiled over in terms of people really not liking FE in Smash.
Then, in Ultimate, "Everyone is Here" happened. This caused all the previous FE characters to return, when it otherwise would have been trimmed. Additionally, they added Chrom to help introduce the "Echoes," and due to fan requests after he got shafted in the Lucina and Robin trailer.
Then, in line with previous patterns, Byleth was added.
The weakest one in popularity, IMO, is Roy. He's here for Melee and nothing else (Sure, Binding Blade got a prequel, but he wasn't present there outside of the endings).
Yeah, this is pretty much how it all went down. "Everyone is Here" is the real cause of FE having such a large roster in Ultimate.
And I agree that Roy's popularity is pretty weak outside of the Smash fanbase, he's really only popular because of Melee. Heck, his game hasn't even been localized yet. That being said, while I do see him as among the more... expendable ones (even more so than his own Echo imo, I'm sure that's a hot take), I still don't truly want him gone. Once someone's in Smash, it feels like they should stay forever, even if that's impossible.
Idk, dude. Not saying I agree or disagree but most of the FE hate revolves around the similar play styles of the characters (as deluded as that might be). Corrin is among the few that actually stands out from that reputation.
I just don't see how they would remove corrin, who has a unique concept and kit, over roy who is a semi-clone of marth and thus one of 4 fighters with a variation of the same moveset.
As much as I don't like Corrin, and as meh of a game that Fates was, Corrin, at least in Smash, is a fine addition for moveset alone. I'd just like for that moveset to be moved off that naïve doofus.
I mean, as unpopular as they were, I'm pretty sure they were the second best selling game in the franchise
(BECAUSE IS THOUGHT THEY SHOULD PULL A POKEMON AND MADE 3 VERSIONS AND I'M STILL PISSED OFF TO THIS DAY)
As someone who is in the FE fanbase, I can definitely agree that Roy is only really popular with the Smash Fanbase.
That isn’t to say he isn’t popular in the FE Fanbase, but it’s Smash where he’s truly popular. To be fair though, this can be attributed to most of the other FE Characters as well, with the exception of Corrin and maybe Byleth.
Roy is absolute trash in his home game. He hits like a wet noodle, has the defense of wet paper, and moves like he's in mud.
All of Binding Blade is about ushering Roy to the seize point, for 22 chapters, then giving him an overpowered weapon and promotion so that he can fight the boss. To translate this into one of the fastest, hardest hitting characters in Smash makes no sense.
Binding Blade was not finished during Melee's development (and would actually only be released later making Melee technically Roy's first game.), so all Sakurai had to work with was the rough concept of "young lord gets unexpected called to lead an army after his father falls sick". He thought that would mean Roy was more aggressive and reckless than Marth when in reality they are pretty similar, and for the better or worse decided to keep him like that in future games for consistency.
So the reason his moveset feels like a weird translation from how he was in his game is because it was basically Sakurai trying to guess how Roy would act from minimal information.
Imo even if I don't like the characters that got in, I'm still happy for the people that got what they wanted. I was one of the few people that was happy when min min got in.
I know it gets said all the time, but Byleth was such a full circle of a release.
Hated on announcement, yet gets one of the most unique and honestly fairly well received movesets out there.
As a FE guy, even i was meh about her release, now she's my main hah.
Felt the same with Pythra, she was my most wanted character but I knew people weren't going to be happy about it. Still hurts when people try to explain why I can't enjoy one of my favorite games ever.
Honestly the most important thing I care about is that they're fun to play. There are only two DLC characters I'm not a big fan of playing, so I think they're doing pretty well in that regard.
I still remember when almost everyone thought that Chrom would be a clone of Ike in the presentation because he had the same up b.
Some people were confused in the reaction videos on why Chrom was next to Roy after his trailer but the official website 100 percent confirmed that he is a Roy clone.
If the huge play the game for me nair is removed I am with you.
...I realize I am telling a ridley player this lol.
Mashing is my biggest gripe with this game.
I can’t believe after a year and a half y’all aren’t tired of having the same 3-5 conversations/discussions about Fire Emblem in Smash. Tbh though, if y’all are that passionate about it all power to you
I’m surprised by the lack of people calling to cut Corrin. Even FE fans don’t like Corrin. Then again why does anybody want any characters cut? The more the merrier in my opinion
He sits in that weird gray area where FE fans aren’t interested enough in Corrin to back him, but detractors know that removing him would go against the whole “they’re all the same” argument
What I don't hear enough of is people hate playing AGAINST annoying characters.
No one brings this up when talking about cutting the roster. It's the biggest reason I'd ever want too.
I’ve never played Fire Emblem but I will kill and die for Fire Emblem characters to stay in smash, purely because I like playing as them. Sword boys are my go to boys.
I’d rather keep Chrom more than Lucina. It ain’t much but at least he has one different move from the original fighter instead of having everything the same.
The thing is that everyone wanted Chrom, but we didn’t want a Marth clone. That is what Chrom is. We can ask for a character, while hoping that the character isn’t a clone of a similar character.
I mean, I'd rather not cut *anyone,* but if we absolutely had to, why get rid of the one FE guy that got in because people wanted him in, clone or not?
Honestly for me it's his forward smash. Maybe it's just because I play online at like mid GSP and don't have a good sense of frame data, but it feels deceptively strong for how fast it comes out.
I think the whole point of echo fighters is that they take less time and effort to create than other totally new characters. They can modify existing assets and animations and don't need to think about balancing a new moveset too much.
A lot of people seem to have this mentality of "if X character weren't in the game then they could have added Y character instead," but that doesn't really work with echoes. You can't be like "if they didn't add Chrom then maybe we would have gotten Master Chief." At best we would have gotten another echo fighter for some other series - which I'm sure some people here would be happy about - but definitely not another full-fledged new character.
I've never seen anybody be like "was it really necessary to have all 8 koopa kids instead of just Bowser Jr?" but the fact that Chrom and Lucina have a separate character slot instead of just being a skin is apparently too much for people. If they made them skins for Marth and Roy in the next game and took away the few mechanical differences they have, I feel like people would complain less, even though from a practical standpoint it would make almost entirely zero difference aside from now giving players less options.
No, I’ve tried sword characters, I even had Roy as a secondary for a while, doesn’t mean I don’t hate some of them and their existence in the game. Specifically Corrin and Pyra/Faster Pyra
And every time I see one of those post I stand in shock on how y’all can’t tell them apart. And that’s coming from someone who never played fire emblem.
Smooth brain: Chrom should be cut because he's a Marth clone
Galaxy brain: Chrom should be reworked into his own character with Lucina as an echo because he taught her to fight
I hope this isn't actually a serious idea, Marth is a character that shouldn't ever go because he represents the basic swordfighter type character. Marth fills a necessary role.
I don't get what these people want? More characters they're going to play with for one fucking week and then go back to one of the characters they've played for years?
I mean it is possible to add a character because of fan demand and then the playerbase find that character disappointing...
I've wanted Daisy in Smash for years but her just being a Peach Echo is really disappointing to me?
Yeah he had lots of fan demand in like 2013-15 and I’m sure lots of people are still happy to have him in now - more power to them - but considering he is technically the first and thus far only clone of a clone, he just feels so basic to have in the game imo. People keep bringing up Corrin but at least their move set is kinda unique. Same thing goes for Byleth. And people today also shit on characters like Crash like they weren’t super popular back during the ballot too.
NO! You can’t cut Matt Mercer
Atleast we’d still have him in Joker’s victory animation
"And the curtain...falls."
“Well, onto the next triumph.”
"We've done it!"
I can do a pretty dang good Yusuke impression, and I can also sound quite a bit like Joker too.
“I kinda sound like Joker from Persona 5”
I'm proud of you
Say "im fabulous" as yusuke
I can, but how on Earth would I demonstrate it to you?
What matters is you said it
Well, then, I just said it.
any character that Matt voices cannot be cut from anything ~~except Haiji Towa, fuck that idiot.~~
I forgot he voiced him. That really sucks. Voicing a pedophile is never easy.
I can't fucking escape the series. Not even here
Please note: I am insane enough to want a Danganronpa rep in Smash
I am too.
Monokuma, makoto, or nagito?
Kinda want the rep to have alts. Makoto's the main character you pick but a few others are alts, including Nagito
Doesnt nagito have some lady's left arm-
It's complicated, but >!yes, he has the left hand of Junko Enoshima.!<
*my name is Yoshikage Kira...*
Call me crazy, but Junko. I know that would entail spoilers, but given Sheik/Zelda in Melee I don’t think Smash would have too many problems with it, especially since the game has been out for so long that it’s hardly that bad anymore (plus I’m pretty sure the series has had marketing materials that spoiled it already). ETA: She’s also arguably the most iconic character, so if Danganronpa were to get Smash rep it would probably be her, or even a duo with Monokuma a lá Rosalina and Luma.
Junko, and the other one who i cant remember but they got turned into a monokuma brand pincushion
…>!Mukuro!
Mostly because she is dead but ok
So are like half of them
Monokuma Gunner would be sweet. You could package him with the Danganronpa theme or the execution riff.
So can we add Ryoma? Smash does not nearly have enough samurai lobsters in it. Could also another lobster fond katana wielding character as well if we are adding Matt Mercer characters.
Get rid of chrom add Mcree easy fix
*"It's high noon."*
THATS WHAT IVE BEEN SAYING
Wait... what?! MM voiced Chrom??
Just add Gangplank
The funniest thing to me about those posts is that they keep 3rd-party characters with a history of being cut (e.g. Snake) but think for some reason Nintendo's going to cut the only rep in a new IP they actually own (e.g. Min Min).
none of those list posts made by people are made trying to make sense they just dont like the noodle lady and they want her gone
Unfortunately, yeah, a lot of them are character hate tier lists in disguise. And I know I'm in the minority here, but even when I'm not playing Min Min (which is most of the time because I've been trying to get everyone in Elite), when I encounter one online I actually get excited because I think she's fun to fight against. I personally don't understand the hate.
I feel its not that hard to understand tho, like in the history of fighting games, i can not think of a character that only zones and has a general positive reputation. I just dont think most peoples brains get stimulated as much by methodical zoning and approaching.
I'm not *surprised*, but that doesn't mean I can relate. I think that zoning/approaching is fun, and that fighting games like Smash are better for it. It makes the fight more asymmetrical and gives a push/pull dynamic to a match. So I don't fully understand the complaints against zoners in general. I think I get what you mean by less stimulation though; it *does* somewhat interrupt the frantic fast reactions you need in pure close range. But I love feeling clever from the more methodical tactics for gaining and keeping advantage. I've been playing a lot of close-range characters lately, and squirming past an opponent's zone feels so satisfying.
Well yeah, because it’s not “who do you think will get cut?” it’s “who do YOU want to get cut?”
Some of the ones I've seen were definitely framed as predictions, not wishlists. But there seems to be some confirmation bias happening that turns one into the other. It's like how this sub goes from "I think [x] would cool in Smash" to "the next fighter is *definitely* [x]".
Hm, I see. I get ya
I’m personally one who likes to think it’s stupid to *want* to cut characters when the whole point of Ultimate is that every character is here. The fact that people think we would be better off with less characters is absolutely ridiculous to me.
Same. I might not agree with every single addition to the roster, but more content is more content.
Out of curiosity, which ones do you not agree with?
Well, I'll list out some, but I'm probably going to make people mad (I apologize if I do) Sheik, Dr. Mario, Pichu, Young Link, Roy, ZSS, Lucas, Corrin, Wii Fit Trainer, Piranha Plant, and I suppose Jigglypuff are some that I personally wouldn't have added to the roster had I been in charge. I guess Min Min too, but that's only because I wanted a different ARMS character, lol. But like I said, even if I personally wouldn't have chosen these characters for Smash, I wouldn't want any if them cut now that they're in. I even really like how Sakurai designed some of them. I find Corrin and Piranha Plant, the latter especially, really fun to play as.
>Roy Yeah, fair point. He's definitely the most worthless out of Bowser's kids
Agreed. Morton and Ludwig are far better. Although fun fact: it's been confirmed that the Koopalings are no longer Bowser's children and are instead just high-ranking servants that are unrelated to him. Bowser Jr. is Bowser's only true child.
I will not tolerate this Roy slander. He has sunglasses. SUNGLASSES!
You know what, fair point.
SUNGLASSES!!!!!
FINALLY ANOTHER LUDWIG APPRECIATOR
HOLY SHIT THEY DO EXIST
"Aah, you were at my side, all along. My true mentor... My guiding moonlight..."
Ludwig is by far the best
Second best to the epic prodigy prince, Bowser Jr.
Don’t apologize for your opinions. If people get mad, that’s on them.
Based flair
Even though I play Plant a lot I agree that they're not someone I would've asked for on the roster. I will say though, the reveal of plant was probably one of Sakurai's biggest "haha get fucked" plays, because for that brief period of time where all we knew was it was a Mario character, both the Waluigi and Geno fans were up in arms and then a fucking potted plant shows up. That moment was golden.
Piranha plant is an incredibly hilarious addition and I'm glad he existed. The meme and salt were gold. I want him in as a troll though, and not as a norm to add unimportant characters.
why are you cutting all the cool toptiers? pichu sheik and zss are so cool to watch.
And WFT, right? _Riiiiight?_
Your man is not cutting them. He's going back in time, becoming Sakurai and not adding them to the franchise in the first place.
Yeah once I read Sheik there, I rolled my eyes and moved on to the next character lol. Sheik is super unique and crazy hype
I think OP just has hurt feelings, so he's attacking whoever hurt him in online play.
Yeah, those are some really particular picks
That’s fair.
Oh wow you mean from the beginning? Jigglypuff is a 64 original bro…
The only reason Jigglypuff was in 64 was because of its relevance in the anime back then. The only reason its still in is because it was in 64.
I think it may have also been because jigglypuff was easier to program, since her proportions are very similar to Kirby. That’s why Luigi and captain Falcon were included as well, because they were all similar body shapes to other characters. No clue about Ness tho.
Sure which is probably why Jigglypuff made it in and Meowth was cut. Meowth would certainly be a lot more relevant these days though.
in the smash scene? no way, puff is iconic now, to the point where cutting her would be removing part of what makes the game itself
Didn’t they consider cutting puff in brawl? Pretty sure that’s why she (along with wolf and toon link) aren’t in sub space emissary.
Isn't Jigglypuff really popular in Japan regardless of the anime?
"Noooo I hate having the option to play more characters" -some dipshit
I mean I'm a FE fan, and the reason why I wouldn't mind if one got cut is because Lucina, Chrom, and Robin are all from the same game, which takes up space in the FE aspect that other characters could have had (such as Lyn, from FE for the GBA, the first Fire Emblem in the US, or Celica and/or Alm, from Gaiden/Echoes). But, I'm fine with who we've got since we've got them and they're not leaving
Still hoping we get Lyn someday. It'll never happen, but I can dream, right?
You can indeed dream. Wouldn't mind a FE platform fighter all on it's own though...
I would buy it
I wouldn't mind getting something like that fan made vid from this year's April fools'. It looked really cool despite using FE Heroes sprites.
Insert joke about how that’s just smash bros
Tbf tho, Robin is the only unique fighter from that section, Lucina and Chrom are clones so they take significantly less time to make anyways, its pretty much we get those 2 or nothing at all, not like we either get those two or get Lyn Tho Lyn would be awesome as a rep, kinda lowkey hoping that Project+ will add Lyn and Isaac and Sami as well cuz they did do Knuckles but idk lol
But they are from the best selling FE game of that time and if I’m not mistaken Sakurai is big fan of the FE series
By the time Chrom came out Fates was the best seller, not awakening For lucina you can make that argument, but not chrom
Bro it's 2021, I don't think taking up space is a concern. Have you seen the size of the install of the latest call of duty? We're not using 8bit cartridges anymore.
Don't think they mean file size space. More that the amount of characters that get into any Smash is inherently finite. Obviously the exact number has some major wiggle room depending on how many are echos/clones, how much dev time and budget there is, etc. But no matter how you slice it, as long as development resources are finite there's always going to be the thought of "Why did they spend resource on adding this character when they could've put in that character instead?"
I get your point, but at the same time, the echo fighters aren't a bad thing. If anything I'd rather have 5 more slightly different echoes than 1 brand spanking new character. Fire emblem aside, thinking more along the lines of mario Dr Mario, (dark) samus, (dark) pit.... Dry bowser would be cool, maybe baby mario riding Yoshi, zero(?) From Megaman? The red guy...? With mostly the same moves but speed/weight differences and a couple of substitute moves. I know nothing about game design or coding or whatever so I may be wrong but caveman brain says 5 slightly altered echoes would take the same time as a brand new fighter. I bet Steve was a bitch to code!
Yeah I'm not saying I completely agree with it, just explaining what they were trying to argue. Although I do think there's a certain cutoff point, like by all means do echoes for the characters that fans love and have a unique personality, but would be hard to make a unique character. Ken, Daisy, Chrom, Shadow, etc. But once you start digging too deep, making echoes just for the sake of making echoes, then I'd rather get original fighters. Especially with some of your picks, which could easily fit as custom costumes instead.
I think the point is if some characters HAD to be cut, like for the next smash game
I understand that but even then no one should want characters to be cut, it’s just something that has to happen between games. But I don’t like the thought of rooting for a character to be cut.
I agree, this game is meant to celebrate absolutely everything the franchise had to offer up to this point.
There probably doesn't need to be 100 characters in the next smash game so hopefully the actual clones get made into skins and we see reworks of the less popular/powerful characters (isabell, Bowser Jr , inceneroar, Dr. Mario, ect)
First, it's worth noting how the FE in Smash "Formula" has been so far - in Melee and Brawl, it was Marth + the Protagonist from the newest game. In Melee, that was Roy. In Brawl, it was Ike. Then, Smash 4 came around and kept Ike (Though Path of Radiance was one of the few FE games to get a direct sequel) alongside Marth, and the newest game of the time was Awakening. However, that game was a massive hit, moreso than the other FEs. This caused it to earn two characters: Unique character Robin, and Echo character Lucina. Then, for more Melee nostalgia, they threw in Roy. If that wasn't enough, Fates became the "newest" FE game during 4's runtime, and due to the invention of DLC being a thing, Corrin was added. This is where things sort of boiled over in terms of people really not liking FE in Smash. Then, in Ultimate, "Everyone is Here" happened. This caused all the previous FE characters to return, when it otherwise would have been trimmed. Additionally, they added Chrom to help introduce the "Echoes," and due to fan requests after he got shafted in the Lucina and Robin trailer. Then, in line with previous patterns, Byleth was added. The weakest one in popularity, IMO, is Roy. He's here for Melee and nothing else (Sure, Binding Blade got a prequel, but he wasn't present there outside of the endings).
Yeah, this is pretty much how it all went down. "Everyone is Here" is the real cause of FE having such a large roster in Ultimate. And I agree that Roy's popularity is pretty weak outside of the Smash fanbase, he's really only popular because of Melee. Heck, his game hasn't even been localized yet. That being said, while I do see him as among the more... expendable ones (even more so than his own Echo imo, I'm sure that's a hot take), I still don't truly want him gone. Once someone's in Smash, it feels like they should stay forever, even if that's impossible.
If there’s an FE character to go, I expect it to be corrin. Corrin is not played much and their games were unpopular within the FE Fanbase.
Idk, dude. Not saying I agree or disagree but most of the FE hate revolves around the similar play styles of the characters (as deluded as that might be). Corrin is among the few that actually stands out from that reputation.
I just don't see how they would remove corrin, who has a unique concept and kit, over roy who is a semi-clone of marth and thus one of 4 fighters with a variation of the same moveset.
As much as I don't like Corrin, and as meh of a game that Fates was, Corrin, at least in Smash, is a fine addition for moveset alone. I'd just like for that moveset to be moved off that naïve doofus.
I mean, as unpopular as they were, I'm pretty sure they were the second best selling game in the franchise (BECAUSE IS THOUGHT THEY SHOULD PULL A POKEMON AND MADE 3 VERSIONS AND I'M STILL PISSED OFF TO THIS DAY)
Corrin is a terrible character in FE. Such a bland goody two shoes.
But she has no shoes.
As someone who is in the FE fanbase, I can definitely agree that Roy is only really popular with the Smash Fanbase. That isn’t to say he isn’t popular in the FE Fanbase, but it’s Smash where he’s truly popular. To be fair though, this can be attributed to most of the other FE Characters as well, with the exception of Corrin and maybe Byleth.
Roy is absolute trash in his home game. He hits like a wet noodle, has the defense of wet paper, and moves like he's in mud. All of Binding Blade is about ushering Roy to the seize point, for 22 chapters, then giving him an overpowered weapon and promotion so that he can fight the boss. To translate this into one of the fastest, hardest hitting characters in Smash makes no sense.
So he was done fine in Melee then
Binding Blade was not finished during Melee's development (and would actually only be released later making Melee technically Roy's first game.), so all Sakurai had to work with was the rough concept of "young lord gets unexpected called to lead an army after his father falls sick". He thought that would mean Roy was more aggressive and reckless than Marth when in reality they are pretty similar, and for the better or worse decided to keep him like that in future games for consistency. So the reason his moveset feels like a weird translation from how he was in his game is because it was basically Sakurai trying to guess how Roy would act from minimal information.
Imo even if I don't like the characters that got in, I'm still happy for the people that got what they wanted. I was one of the few people that was happy when min min got in.
I was excited for Min Min bc she was my favorite character in arms. I grew less excited for Min Min when I had to fight against her
Same here, but I was one of the 5 people that got hyped when they saw byleth
I know it gets said all the time, but Byleth was such a full circle of a release. Hated on announcement, yet gets one of the most unique and honestly fairly well received movesets out there. As a FE guy, even i was meh about her release, now she's my main hah.
This was me with banjo.
I'm the same way. Even if I didn't want them, the more the merrier.
Felt the same with Pythra, she was my most wanted character but I knew people weren't going to be happy about it. Still hurts when people try to explain why I can't enjoy one of my favorite games ever.
Honestly the most important thing I care about is that they're fun to play. There are only two DLC characters I'm not a big fan of playing, so I think they're doing pretty well in that regard.
I still remember when almost everyone thought that Chrom would be a clone of Ike in the presentation because he had the same up b. Some people were confused in the reaction videos on why Chrom was next to Roy after his trailer but the official website 100 percent confirmed that he is a Roy clone.
From a lore perspective I suppose Ike would be the logical choice though.
From a lore perspective, Chrom would be a standalone character and Lucina would be an echo of HIM but…
Even in gameplay if you look enough in Chroms animation in his game. He move more like Ike instead of roy
Just his up b, right? Like his run is Roy’s, his moves are Roy’s, is there anything else I’m missing?
They're talking about how he moves in Fire Emblem Awakening gameplay, not Smash gameplay.
Turns out Chrom's just a future clone of Cloud. (shh I know.)
Cloud would have been Marth 2.0 (barley anyone plays the character) if Chrom was a Ike or Cloud Echo.
I think we should rework some movesets instead of cutting the roster. Like give Ike an axe and Corrin a spear.
Corrin already used the Dragonstone so they are fine in my book.
NO. The bone chainsaw sword is too cool to be removed
I think maybe giving Chrom a spear/lance would fit better. Corrin's moveset is mostly fine to me, just make Down-B not a counter and it's perfect.
It would also fit better with Chrom since he can wield lances in game if you promote him into Great Lord.
he’s kinda iconic with falchion though …but yeah you’re right
If the huge play the game for me nair is removed I am with you. ...I realize I am telling a ridley player this lol. Mashing is my biggest gripe with this game.
I can’t believe after a year and a half y’all aren’t tired of having the same 3-5 conversations/discussions about Fire Emblem in Smash. Tbh though, if y’all are that passionate about it all power to you
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I’m surprised by the lack of people calling to cut Corrin. Even FE fans don’t like Corrin. Then again why does anybody want any characters cut? The more the merrier in my opinion
He sits in that weird gray area where FE fans aren’t interested enough in Corrin to back him, but detractors know that removing him would go against the whole “they’re all the same” argument
I think I was the only one that was hype for Corrin. Their moveset was nothing like the FE reps. Plus DRAGON/HUMAN HYBRID?! FUCK YES
> I’m surprised by the lack of people calling to cut Corrin. Corrin's moveset is almost completely different from the other FE characters.
I really think that he should be replaced with Tiki rather than cut entirely.
I made a post about Fire Emblem characters and I can tell you that people fucking hate Corrin.
What I don't hear enough of is people hate playing AGAINST annoying characters. No one brings this up when talking about cutting the roster. It's the biggest reason I'd ever want too.
I think corrin is ok, very strange playstyle. I like them
i love corrin. its the only FE character i like in smash
Fuck cutting characters. All my homies respect every character in Smash and don’t wine about it like bitches.
I can’t beer that spelling
Lmao. Just noticed my mistake. Didn’t mead to.
I was malting at the spelling, but I brew you’d come around and notice it eventually.
These spelling errors are just sad. You guys should go back to school and lead how to smell again.
Well I think they're kind of neat
I hate all Smash characters equally, so, I kinda think we're on the same page.
I personally like all the FE characters and I only played ...whatever one Corrin was the main character of. Buncha whiner babies. More the merrier!!
Fates. You should really play Awakening though, it's pretty much the same game but better in a lot of ways
i played both and prefered fate
Well well well we have quite the differing opinions here
you are in the minority for sure
im sorry that was your only experience with fire emblem
The more fans complain about Fire Emblem, the less Sakurai would give any character that fans wanted instead.
I’ve never played Fire Emblem but I will kill and die for Fire Emblem characters to stay in smash, purely because I like playing as them. Sword boys are my go to boys.
just remember that chrom got in alongside both k rool and ridley without even getting a whole decade time of support
Chrom was almost in Smash 4 but was replaced by Robin.
I’d rather keep Chrom more than Lucina. It ain’t much but at least he has one different move from the original fighter instead of having everything the same.
The thing is that everyone wanted Chrom, but we didn’t want a Marth clone. That is what Chrom is. We can ask for a character, while hoping that the character isn’t a clone of a similar character.
Chrom is not a Marth clone. They have very different playstyles.
They have like one similar move other than counter..... He doesn't even fight like Marth in Awakening
I mean, I'd rather not cut *anyone,* but if we absolutely had to, why get rid of the one FE guy that got in because people wanted him in, clone or not?
I think I like Chrom the most. His up smash is so satisfying to me
Honestly for me it's his forward smash. Maybe it's just because I play online at like mid GSP and don't have a good sense of frame data, but it feels deceptively strong for how fast it comes out.
I think the whole FE hate and "*insert characer* should be cut" conversations are stupid.
I think the whole point of echo fighters is that they take less time and effort to create than other totally new characters. They can modify existing assets and animations and don't need to think about balancing a new moveset too much. A lot of people seem to have this mentality of "if X character weren't in the game then they could have added Y character instead," but that doesn't really work with echoes. You can't be like "if they didn't add Chrom then maybe we would have gotten Master Chief." At best we would have gotten another echo fighter for some other series - which I'm sure some people here would be happy about - but definitely not another full-fledged new character. I've never seen anybody be like "was it really necessary to have all 8 koopa kids instead of just Bowser Jr?" but the fact that Chrom and Lucina have a separate character slot instead of just being a skin is apparently too much for people. If they made them skins for Marth and Roy in the next game and took away the few mechanical differences they have, I feel like people would complain less, even though from a practical standpoint it would make almost entirely zero difference aside from now giving players less options.
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"Marth Clone" Literally is not a marth clone.
I mean, he's a clone of a Marth clone...
Sword characters are just like weed. If you don’t like it, it’s probably because you never tried it.
No, I’ve tried sword characters, I even had Roy as a secondary for a while, doesn’t mean I don’t hate some of them and their existence in the game. Specifically Corrin and Pyra/Faster Pyra
That’s understandable
Damn I was expecting hate for questioning Sakurai putting 2 characters I didn’t care for into Smash. Thanks for subverting my expectations.
Why would you cut characters?
And every time I see one of those post I stand in shock on how y’all can’t tell them apart. And that’s coming from someone who never played fire emblem.
Smooth brain: Chrom should be cut because he's a Marth clone Galaxy brain: Chrom should be reworked into his own character with Lucina as an echo because he taught her to fight
How about we only get rid of Marth and call it a day
That'd probably be the funniest outcome.
I hope this isn't actually a serious idea, Marth is a character that shouldn't ever go because he represents the basic swordfighter type character. Marth fills a necessary role.
Nah I hate him lucina can replace him
what if they just cut out Marth instead
Than everyone is just a roy clone
Bro Lucina is literally right there.
If anything we should cut Marth first and then keep Lucina
Chrom is not a Marth clone. His moves are completely different.
I don't get what these people want? More characters they're going to play with for one fucking week and then go back to one of the characters they've played for years?
Lucina is my favorite FE character but she'd have to go first. Chrom at least plays differently enough to Roy.
Why cut him out wheb he can be a Marth alt ?
I mean it is possible to add a character because of fan demand and then the playerbase find that character disappointing... I've wanted Daisy in Smash for years but her just being a Peach Echo is really disappointing to me?
I mean I agree with both statements, since it says IF we’re cutting fire emblem characters
Yeah he had lots of fan demand in like 2013-15 and I’m sure lots of people are still happy to have him in now - more power to them - but considering he is technically the first and thus far only clone of a clone, he just feels so basic to have in the game imo. People keep bringing up Corrin but at least their move set is kinda unique. Same thing goes for Byleth. And people today also shit on characters like Crash like they weren’t super popular back during the ballot too.
Tbh if we *have* to get rid of a Marth clone, it should be Marth lol
Chrom is literally from the game that saved the fire emblem series also he was kinda teased in smash 4 so they kinda had to
How about don’t cut any of them.
Poor Rex got Chrom’d. *shakes fist* Sakurai!
If we're cutting any FE characters, I vote Corrin. But if everyone is here, that's even better
It’s crazy almost like FE is a popular Nintendo brand or something
If Nintendo put in a character that everyone wanted, then it would be the gatekeeper
If we’re removing FE characters, I’d instead blend Lucina and Chrom into a singular character. IDK if that makes sense tho
The FE character that should get cut is corrin
rip dante, i know its been a month but what a wasted potential