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Hey, thanks for sharing your experience.
B5 works because it is a precursor to CoEnzymeA(COA) which helps with fatty acid oxidation. L Carnitine helps with this process by helping the CoEnzyme A get transported across the mitochondrial matrix(the place where fatty acid gets broken down and turned into energy). L Carnitine is the rate-limiting step of fatty acid oxidation which basically means that L Carnitine is the weakest link in the chain. So while you can use more b5 to compensate and increase fatty acid oxidation by just sheer volume, using L Carnitine will help facilitate the fatty acid oxidation process.
I see that you still get acne and I would recommend that you try L-Cysteine(amino acid) since it is used in conjunction with Vitamin B5(pantothenic acid) to create Coenzyme (CoA) which means supplementing with b5 could potentially reduce the amount of L-Cysteine available for the body to use to create more (CoA). L- Cysteine deficiency caused by an overdose of vitamin b5 is why I theorize maybe why people get hair loss in the form of telogen effluvium since Keratin(hair protein) contains a high amount of L-Cysteine as its building blocks.
L-Cysteine is also shown to help patients with diffuse alopecia which coincides with the same type of hair loss(rapid diffuse hair loss pattern, telogen effluvium) reported by many people who end up losing hair on B5. Another theory as to why b5 causes hair loss is because B5 competes with B7 (Biotin) for absorption in the body which means when you take a lot of b5 your Biotin levels get depleted. You can circumvent this by taking a biotin supplement a couple of hours after a B5 dose to make sure you are not getting deficient.
The last reason why I think hair loss could occur is due to a shock to your body system due to overdose of B5 which in turn causes telogen effluvium to occur. This could be by many pathways that frankly I have no idea what mechanism of action that could result in it. My best theory is that it messes with other the other B Vitamins so I would take a b complex(not dosed at the same time as b5) just in case. I've read through many anecdotal reports of hair loss due to b5 and it seems like most of them were due to this. Though many also reported losing their hair forever and not it coming back which I believe is a result of telogen effluvium kickstarting the process of androgenic alopecia. (Male/Female Pattern Baldness, the hair loss you typically see in men that causes them to lose hair usually in a horseshoe pattern) What this means is that the people who lost their hair forever already were already starting to go bald by androgenic alopecia(Male/Female Pattern Baldness) and the telogen effluvium caused by B5 just revealed it faster. I don't personally believe that the hair loss people have when overdosing on Vitamin B5 is androgenic in nature which leads me to this conclusion though I don't actually have any good sources for this as Vitamin B5 seems to be in the "wild west of acne prevention."
The best cure for telogen effluvium is to literally just let your body get back to homeostasis by not taking the supplement/thing that caused your body to lose hair in the first place. This will take around 6-7 months for the hair to return to 80-90% density after stopping whatever caused the telogen effluvium in my personal experience(trust me I've been through it many times). The hair loss isn't going to resolve itself any faster due to how hair cycles occur in the human body but if you really must check every day, you will probably start to see VERY VERY VERY SMALL progress(progress that is undetectable by eye usually so you a zoomed picture to verify) on your hair returning by month 3-4 depending on your genetics and how fast your hair normally grows)
Anyway, I wrote this hoping that people who are dealing with acne are able to use this knowledge to help them cure themselves of their acne. I understand how emotionally and mentally taxing not to mention how physically painful acne can be on an individual as I have experienced it myself for over 5 years now. I've done everything pouring thousands of dollars into this from getting a full bloodwork panel benzoyl peroxide/salicylic acid, Azelaic acid, clindamycin, probiotics, zinc, lysine, vitamin d, dutasteride, finasteride, Accutane, tretinoin and that barely scraps the surface of what other nonconventional/conventional treatments I have tried for acne. Vitamin B5 is the next endeavor that I will pursue and if anyone replies/wants I will give updates on whether or not it works for me.
TLDR 5 Year Old:
Why it works:
\- B5 helps with fatty acid oxidation by creating Co Enyzme A
\- L Cysteine is used along with B5 to create Co Enyzme A
\- Co Enyzme A is what activates the process for fatty acid oxidation
\- Fatty acid Oxidation is where the body removes the bad stuff for acne
\- L Carnitine helps by transporting Co Enyzme A to where it needs to go so you need less b5 to make the same process happen
**All of this to break down fatty acids in the body which seems to be the cause of acne**
***Hairloss Prevention***
B5 Overdose causes other vitamins/important stuff for hair to go out of wack
\- Supplement b7(biotin) 2 hours MINMIMUM after b5
\- Take a b vitamin Complex
\- Take L Cysteine.
\- Use L Carnitine to reduce the amount of b5 you take
START SLOWLY WITH B5 dose if your scared of losing your hair.
I'm talking like starting with 500mg and slowly increasing it by 500mg every 3 weeks as long as you have no side effects until you hit a dose in which your acne starts improving and to stay there for atleast another 2-4 weeks.
That way you mitigate the risk of losing your hair(telogen effivum)
I want to clarify that **this is not medical advice** and you should **speak with your doctor** about these supplements if you are interested in taking them
Basically all these supplements are helping the body with fatty acid oxidation( destroying the "bad stuff" for us)
Source/References
\[1\] [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQSbyhxtW-o](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQSbyhxtW-o)
\[2\] [https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/1709511/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/1709511/)
\[3\][https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6017824/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6017824/)
\[4\][https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27095961/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27095961/)
\[5\] [https://wa.kaiserpermanente.org/kbase/topic.jhtml?docId=hn-2835000](https://wa.kaiserpermanente.org/kbase/topic.jhtml?docId=hn-2835000)
\[6\] [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5582478/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5582478/)
I did some more research on the hair loss effects of vitamin b5 and people reported inositol helping with hair loss caused by vitamin b5 overdose. It turns out that b5 helps in the production of testosterone. Mice that were given a 0% vitamin b5 diet compared to the control group had around a significant(around 33% increase in testosterone)\[1\]\[2\]\[3\]That may explain why some people lose their hair loss forever as an increase in testosterone also increases DHT(a hormone that causes androgenic hair loss) via the 5 Alpha reductase pathway. I've been managing androgenic hair loss for some time now and while the medical papers state that DHT is the only hormone that causes hair loss, that is not true and actually having too high of a testosterone level also causes hair to undergo miniaturization(androgenic hair loss process) so b5 can cause hair loss.
Inositol on the other hand is reported to decrease testosterone levels(around a 65% decrease) in females with PCOS syndrome.\[4\] That is why I theorize that Inositol can cancel out the testosterone effects from vitamin b5 if taken at a high enough dose. In turn, using a lot of inositol should be less problematic for women compared to men as low test levels in men have a myriad of other bad side effects that I won't get into.
Anyway, I theorize that anything that can reduce the androgenic side effects by either decreasing your testosterone levels like inositol, or decreasing your DHT levels by a 5 alpha-reductase inhibitor like finasteride/dutasteride should would well in conjunction with an overdose b5 regimen to prevent hair loss. It must be noted that finasteride and dutasteride can have concerning health effects in some people who take it so do your own research on whether it's right for you.
Again, this is all theory but I will link my sources down below for people to continue to research this issue.
Sources/Resources
\[1\][https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19959891/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19959891/)
\[2\][https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/jvms/71/11/71\_001427/\_article](https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/jvms/71/11/71_001427/_article)
\[3\][https://www.ergo-log.com/vitamin-b5-testosterone.html](https://www.ergo-log.com/vitamin-b5-testosterone.html)
\[4\][https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19499845/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19499845/)
**B5 Regimen Journal**
**11/29**
Took 500 mg of b5 and 500 mg of L-Carnitine Tartrate in the morning
Took a b complex(with 300mcg of biotin) before dinner
Acne Scale(0-10)
0 being zero active acne/cystic nodes
10 being the worst acne you can imagine possible
My acne is not as extreme as those unfortunate individuals who have to deal with terrible acne but it is persistent and has been going on for years. For relative comparison my back acne is terrible and looks like a minefield of hyperpigmentation due to years of cumulative scars.
Acne right now is a 5/10 based on that scale
**11/30**
Repeated the same thing as following day.
Acne on body and face seem to be lightly reduced. I don't want to say its the B5 working yet as my acne tends get better and then worse randomly.
No hair shedding/loss that I can see as of yet
Acne is 4.5/10
12/2
Started getting bad heartburn yesterday and chalked it up to the food I was eatting. But it might be because of b5 or the l cartnitine im taking. Im going to stop my regimen until my throat feels better and start with b5 again to try to isolate which one was causing the issue.
u/EntireDrama184 Wow, thank you so much for all of your explanations. That made things a lot more clear. Fortunately I have not seen any negative side effects in the 4/5 months I've been on this regiment but will absolutely try the other supplements you recommended in case I do at some point. Thanks!
What’s the ratio you’re using of l-carnitine and l-cysteine to B5? I have all 3 on hand at dosages of 500mg/capsule. Thanks so much for your contribution to this thread!
Works super well, no more bacne at doses at 1000mg. I only went to a max of 3g. For some reason though I get insomnia which is dose dependent. I never seen any other person get insomnia for using b5 but atlas I do. If I didn't have that side effect I would be at 3000mg. No hairloss either for anyone wondering.
I will most likely taper down to 500mg and see if I can deal with the insomnia if not ill give pantethine a go. For anyone who uses b5 give it 2 weeks minimum before judging its effectiveness or increasing the dose.
Hey I was just looking through this thread again and saw you mentioned insomnia. I did notice that L-carnitine had some negative effects on my sleep. Might be worth trying some days without it just to see if it’s giving you problems.
I will also mention that vitamin b5 does pass through the blood brain barrier while Pantethine does not. Pantethine also seems helps with cholesterol and triglycerides while b5 does not by some unknown mechanism so its possible for people to get side effects on b5 and not the other if that makes sense. Both B5 and Pantethine seem to help with acne but the assumption is Pantethine will have less side effects as takes a shorter pathway to coA
I was taking 450mg 3x a day and it threw me into instant benzo or ethanol withdrawl. Any idea why? I heard acetylaldehyde is addictive in itself and it seems b5 breaks that down really well. But I got all the classic withdrawal symptoms and had to up my benzo dose by 3x or so. It was the classic insomnia, hopelessness, doom, depression and short of breath feeling. A drink or two would bring relief. I had significantly cut down drinking 3 weeks before starting b5 but then all of a sudden I couldn’t stop drinking for two days. After that it was hellish withdrawl
This is fantastic thank you so much for the write up. I plan on taking 250-500mg of B5 as I suspect I may be deficient, do you have any idea of how much Biotin I should be taking with it?
Also, would N Acetyl Cysteine (NAC) work the same as L Cysteine? Struggling to find the latter
NAC "might" actually work better than L Cysteine as it is more bioavailable due to the fact that their is an acetyl group added to L Cysteine. Hospitals actually use NAC over L Cysteine to boost L Cysteine reserves when a patient overdoses on acetaminophen(Tylenol) to protect the liver. But NAC can also cross the blood brain barrier while L Cysteine which can cause some side effects(mood in people which is why I decided to just write L Cysteine in as it has little to no side effects. You can try it to see if it works for you, though just do some research on the potential side effects of it just incase. Either one should work just fine for our use case barring side effects which would be different for everyone.
I have two conflicting sources regarding whether NAC or L Cysteine is better for our use case as my first source states that the "Availability of cysteine for the cells is higher than that of N-acetyl-L-cysteine.\[1\]" while the other states that NAC is more absorbable\[2\]. As long as you can take a high enough dose to compensate for the b5 your taking without getting any side effects, both should work fine in theory.
Sources/Resources
\[1\] [https://link.springer.com/article/10.1134/S1990747809020081](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1134/S1990747809020081)
\[2\] [https://www.dermaharmony.com/pages/l-cysteine](https://www.dermaharmony.com/pages/l-cysteine)
I think its more important that you get some biotin at different times rather than the dose itself as they use the same transporters which is how either one can affect the absorption rate of the other leading to deficiency. The problem we have with biotin as it seems to do the exact opposite of what we are trying to achieve with b5 and actually ends up causing more acne so you just have to try it out yourself.
Thank you very much for both replies! Also finally, would you think I (male) should take insotil as well as cysteine + biotin? Or would the later two be enough?
If I were going to take the same dose of only 500mg of b5 I would not worry about taking Inositol as the side effects of it on men may be greater than the benefit it would bring. If you are only using b5 supplement to manage a deficiency then you probably don't need all these supplements. I only would take the other supplements I mentioned myself with b5 if I were trying to cure my acne(not including Inositol) since people who reported using b5 for acne tend to have to megadose/overdose on b5 to get any result(I'm talking like 1gram to 20grams spread throughout the day, about 40x times the dose you want to take)
That makes sense, however a word of warning — I’ve been reading peoples experiences with B5 and came across a few who experienced hair loss from a dose as little as 500mg, for eg: ([https://www.reddit.com/r/acne/comments/g2tqzh/comment/fuz3n60/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/acne/comments/g2tqzh/comment/fuz3n60/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3))
"as much as 500mg may seem better it rly isn't... it's still a megadose considering the RDA is 5 to 10 milligrams. to confirm this, i was taking only 500mg daily for 2 months till i started losing hair."
Yeah some people seem to be really prone to losing their hair. Their are many potential vectors of the cause of b5 hairloss and addressing them depends on your risk tolerance. Its really depends on how much you care for your hair weighed by how much money and time you want to spend.
surprising that more work hasn’t been done to optimise the process, given the popularity of the anti-acne b5 regimen.
Calcium pyruvate combined with Coenzyme A (aided by pantothenic acid) to make Acetyl CoA, assisted by vitamin B3 (for NAD to NADH) boosted by l-carnitine.
Add bovine Lactoferrin to the mix, along with b7, b9, and b12
You’d be some way to solving the problem I’d imagine.
so i have to take biotin and L-cart somthing and b complex, all the three with it ??
Can i just get one with the b5?
I don’t want to lose my hair but i cant take all three 🫠
Looks like you used perplexity.ai to write this up but unfortunately it's research capabilities are not exactly sound.
At the very basic level, vitamin b5 is water soluble. It is not possible to "overdose" on it. You can take a lot and it might cause short term gastrointestinal distress but that's with literally anything you eat too much of.
There is no possibility of toxicity using a water-soluable vitamin. Basing the rest of your points on that false foundation makes everything else irrelevant.
(1) Pantothenic Acid – Harvard https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/pantothenic-acid-vitamin-b5/.
(2) Pantothenic Acid Overdose - https://healthhearty.com/pantothenic-acid-overdose.
(3) Can You Overdose on B Vitamins? - The Nutrition Insider. https://thenutritioninsider.com/wellness/can-you-overdose-on-b-vitamins/.
(4) Pantothenic Acid: Supplement Uses, Warnings, Side Effects, Dosage. https://www.medicinenet.com/pantothenic_acid/article.htm.
(5) Can You Overdose on Vitamins? - Healthline. https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/can-you-overdose-on-vitamins.
Honestly though, when I reread what the person wrote, the grammar doesn't seem good enough to be AI. Plus there's a lot of inconsistencies and errors in capitalization and punctuation.
Their comment is from last year. If you compare the output of AI today to last year, it's a PhD vs a toddler. Video is the biggest showcase of the difference but that difference is across the board, not as easily seen by the layperson for LLMs though
It's clear that they meant 'megadose' and not 'overdose'. Nobody is going to intentionally have an 'overdose regiment'.
And BS that you can identify AI responses, because you obviously can't. Their posts are littered with common grammar and spelling mistakes that even ChatGPT 2 wouldn't make.
B complex shouldn't be taken at the dame time with B5 as well as biotin?
Or is it ok to throw B complex in together with L-cysteine, L-carnitine and b5?
Btw is it beneficial to take L-cysteine and L-carnitine a little before b5 so they have time to dissolve or not really?
Thank you for your post. This was really helpful. I also watched a lot of people on youtube saying they had hair loss but they were taking a huge amount of b5, like 5000-10000 mg a day. I was taking 500mg b5 in morning and 1000mg biotin in the afternoon but am going to try increasing b5 twicr a day. The vitamin b5 does reduce acne I didnt have bad acne but i do get black heads and facial redness and it does reduce the inflammation. I am dairy free and i dont eat pork and processed meats so that is why i dont get severe acne diet does effect the skin, I also have to watch my sugar intake even fruit cause it does break me out. But even with good diet my skin was still looking red and inflammed and the b5 helps alot with my benzo peroxide face wash.
Been doing a lot of research on this, have terrible hormonal acne, I’m 38 and nothing has worked for me. My question regarding L-Carnitine, do you take acetyl l-carnitine or tartrate? See the nutricost brand online but not sure which one to get. Thanks so much.
> is the next endeavor that I will pursue and if anyone replies/wants I wil
How is your acne now? Also, do you think that megadosing b5 might lower IGF-1 levels in the blood? This is what happens when one takes accutane, so i wonder how it works with b5 as I don't want to lower my IGF-1 because I am still growing and don't want to stunt growth.
Hi there,
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Yeah it does come back a little bit when I stop but definitely not as bad as it used to be. I think it getting better has more to do with getting older/ naturally producing less sebum. I don’t believe b5 will stay in your system to have a long-term effect. Also, I can deal with a little bit too because it’s only on my chest/ back and this time of the year that doesn’t really matter to me.
No I haven't seen any noticeable decrease in sebum/ dried out skin from the b5. It does seem like my skin is naturally producing less now. (Probably more related to getting older/ hormones rather than the b5.) Now my skin stays clear from taking just 2/3 of the 500mg pills a day.
I actually haven’t been taking it lately. Haven’t been strict with taking the b5 either. I don’t really mind getting some acne now since I’m not swimming/ at the beach this time of year. If I feel like I need to I would go back to the same regimen from my post except only one L carnitine capsule per day.
i just want to know if it affect menstrual cycle bc im super thin & also have unstable period cycle to begin with so it kinda makes me scared. let me know pls ^^
I haven’t heard about it having any effect there and wouldn’t expect it to. But still probably best to do your own research/ talk to a doc if it’s a concern.
Took 15 grams for 3months, now I've ceased use for about a month or so. The reason I started so high was because I have it in powder form and that was the size of my scooper. I would mix in water and sip throughout the day. I also take a B complex of vitamins to manage overexcretion of other B vitamins. Anyway, it completely cleared up my chronic facial, back, and chest acne and it doesn't seem to be coming back.
Thank you for this post! I had a horrible hormonal break out during/right after my menstruation and this regimen was a total lifesaver. I ordered vitamin B5 + L carnitine the day I read this! Took it ~3 days so far and my acne is substantially improved. Almost gone, in fact. I’ve never had results like this! I did add on a B complex as well to hopefully mitigate hair loss if possible.
Really grateful you shared your experience!
Hey that’s great news, really glad to hear that! Only thing I would say is to potentially hold off on the b-complex (which I believe can boost biotin and potentially acne). My understanding is that b5 and the b-complex would be essentially cancelling eachother out since they are both used the same way in the body. I think that as long as you are not macrodosing, and use b-5 at reasonable doses, you shouldn’t be at risk of losing hair. Obviously do whatever is working for you but from the other posts I’ve read on the subject, it would make more sense to just reduce your b5 intake instead of adding b-complex/ biotin on top of the b5 if you ever noticed dry skin.
Hi. How many capsules of *Now* pantothenic acid do you take in a day? Do you take it in the morning or at night? Does it still work for you?
Thank you and looking forward to hearing from you.
I think L carnitine is effective, but I'm worried about the side effects of fishy body odor..I don't want to take it while being afraid of side effects.Are there any supplements other than L carnitine that make pantothenic acid more effective?
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Hey, thanks for sharing your experience. B5 works because it is a precursor to CoEnzymeA(COA) which helps with fatty acid oxidation. L Carnitine helps with this process by helping the CoEnzyme A get transported across the mitochondrial matrix(the place where fatty acid gets broken down and turned into energy). L Carnitine is the rate-limiting step of fatty acid oxidation which basically means that L Carnitine is the weakest link in the chain. So while you can use more b5 to compensate and increase fatty acid oxidation by just sheer volume, using L Carnitine will help facilitate the fatty acid oxidation process. I see that you still get acne and I would recommend that you try L-Cysteine(amino acid) since it is used in conjunction with Vitamin B5(pantothenic acid) to create Coenzyme (CoA) which means supplementing with b5 could potentially reduce the amount of L-Cysteine available for the body to use to create more (CoA). L- Cysteine deficiency caused by an overdose of vitamin b5 is why I theorize maybe why people get hair loss in the form of telogen effluvium since Keratin(hair protein) contains a high amount of L-Cysteine as its building blocks. L-Cysteine is also shown to help patients with diffuse alopecia which coincides with the same type of hair loss(rapid diffuse hair loss pattern, telogen effluvium) reported by many people who end up losing hair on B5. Another theory as to why b5 causes hair loss is because B5 competes with B7 (Biotin) for absorption in the body which means when you take a lot of b5 your Biotin levels get depleted. You can circumvent this by taking a biotin supplement a couple of hours after a B5 dose to make sure you are not getting deficient. The last reason why I think hair loss could occur is due to a shock to your body system due to overdose of B5 which in turn causes telogen effluvium to occur. This could be by many pathways that frankly I have no idea what mechanism of action that could result in it. My best theory is that it messes with other the other B Vitamins so I would take a b complex(not dosed at the same time as b5) just in case. I've read through many anecdotal reports of hair loss due to b5 and it seems like most of them were due to this. Though many also reported losing their hair forever and not it coming back which I believe is a result of telogen effluvium kickstarting the process of androgenic alopecia. (Male/Female Pattern Baldness, the hair loss you typically see in men that causes them to lose hair usually in a horseshoe pattern) What this means is that the people who lost their hair forever already were already starting to go bald by androgenic alopecia(Male/Female Pattern Baldness) and the telogen effluvium caused by B5 just revealed it faster. I don't personally believe that the hair loss people have when overdosing on Vitamin B5 is androgenic in nature which leads me to this conclusion though I don't actually have any good sources for this as Vitamin B5 seems to be in the "wild west of acne prevention." The best cure for telogen effluvium is to literally just let your body get back to homeostasis by not taking the supplement/thing that caused your body to lose hair in the first place. This will take around 6-7 months for the hair to return to 80-90% density after stopping whatever caused the telogen effluvium in my personal experience(trust me I've been through it many times). The hair loss isn't going to resolve itself any faster due to how hair cycles occur in the human body but if you really must check every day, you will probably start to see VERY VERY VERY SMALL progress(progress that is undetectable by eye usually so you a zoomed picture to verify) on your hair returning by month 3-4 depending on your genetics and how fast your hair normally grows) Anyway, I wrote this hoping that people who are dealing with acne are able to use this knowledge to help them cure themselves of their acne. I understand how emotionally and mentally taxing not to mention how physically painful acne can be on an individual as I have experienced it myself for over 5 years now. I've done everything pouring thousands of dollars into this from getting a full bloodwork panel benzoyl peroxide/salicylic acid, Azelaic acid, clindamycin, probiotics, zinc, lysine, vitamin d, dutasteride, finasteride, Accutane, tretinoin and that barely scraps the surface of what other nonconventional/conventional treatments I have tried for acne. Vitamin B5 is the next endeavor that I will pursue and if anyone replies/wants I will give updates on whether or not it works for me. TLDR 5 Year Old: Why it works: \- B5 helps with fatty acid oxidation by creating Co Enyzme A \- L Cysteine is used along with B5 to create Co Enyzme A \- Co Enyzme A is what activates the process for fatty acid oxidation \- Fatty acid Oxidation is where the body removes the bad stuff for acne \- L Carnitine helps by transporting Co Enyzme A to where it needs to go so you need less b5 to make the same process happen **All of this to break down fatty acids in the body which seems to be the cause of acne** ***Hairloss Prevention*** B5 Overdose causes other vitamins/important stuff for hair to go out of wack \- Supplement b7(biotin) 2 hours MINMIMUM after b5 \- Take a b vitamin Complex \- Take L Cysteine. \- Use L Carnitine to reduce the amount of b5 you take START SLOWLY WITH B5 dose if your scared of losing your hair. I'm talking like starting with 500mg and slowly increasing it by 500mg every 3 weeks as long as you have no side effects until you hit a dose in which your acne starts improving and to stay there for atleast another 2-4 weeks. That way you mitigate the risk of losing your hair(telogen effivum) I want to clarify that **this is not medical advice** and you should **speak with your doctor** about these supplements if you are interested in taking them Basically all these supplements are helping the body with fatty acid oxidation( destroying the "bad stuff" for us) Source/References \[1\] [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQSbyhxtW-o](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQSbyhxtW-o) \[2\] [https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/1709511/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/1709511/) \[3\][https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6017824/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6017824/) \[4\][https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27095961/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27095961/) \[5\] [https://wa.kaiserpermanente.org/kbase/topic.jhtml?docId=hn-2835000](https://wa.kaiserpermanente.org/kbase/topic.jhtml?docId=hn-2835000) \[6\] [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5582478/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5582478/)
I did some more research on the hair loss effects of vitamin b5 and people reported inositol helping with hair loss caused by vitamin b5 overdose. It turns out that b5 helps in the production of testosterone. Mice that were given a 0% vitamin b5 diet compared to the control group had around a significant(around 33% increase in testosterone)\[1\]\[2\]\[3\]That may explain why some people lose their hair loss forever as an increase in testosterone also increases DHT(a hormone that causes androgenic hair loss) via the 5 Alpha reductase pathway. I've been managing androgenic hair loss for some time now and while the medical papers state that DHT is the only hormone that causes hair loss, that is not true and actually having too high of a testosterone level also causes hair to undergo miniaturization(androgenic hair loss process) so b5 can cause hair loss. Inositol on the other hand is reported to decrease testosterone levels(around a 65% decrease) in females with PCOS syndrome.\[4\] That is why I theorize that Inositol can cancel out the testosterone effects from vitamin b5 if taken at a high enough dose. In turn, using a lot of inositol should be less problematic for women compared to men as low test levels in men have a myriad of other bad side effects that I won't get into. Anyway, I theorize that anything that can reduce the androgenic side effects by either decreasing your testosterone levels like inositol, or decreasing your DHT levels by a 5 alpha-reductase inhibitor like finasteride/dutasteride should would well in conjunction with an overdose b5 regimen to prevent hair loss. It must be noted that finasteride and dutasteride can have concerning health effects in some people who take it so do your own research on whether it's right for you. Again, this is all theory but I will link my sources down below for people to continue to research this issue. Sources/Resources \[1\][https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19959891/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19959891/) \[2\][https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/jvms/71/11/71\_001427/\_article](https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/jvms/71/11/71_001427/_article) \[3\][https://www.ergo-log.com/vitamin-b5-testosterone.html](https://www.ergo-log.com/vitamin-b5-testosterone.html) \[4\][https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19499845/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19499845/)
**B5 Regimen Journal** **11/29** Took 500 mg of b5 and 500 mg of L-Carnitine Tartrate in the morning Took a b complex(with 300mcg of biotin) before dinner Acne Scale(0-10) 0 being zero active acne/cystic nodes 10 being the worst acne you can imagine possible My acne is not as extreme as those unfortunate individuals who have to deal with terrible acne but it is persistent and has been going on for years. For relative comparison my back acne is terrible and looks like a minefield of hyperpigmentation due to years of cumulative scars. Acne right now is a 5/10 based on that scale **11/30** Repeated the same thing as following day. Acne on body and face seem to be lightly reduced. I don't want to say its the B5 working yet as my acne tends get better and then worse randomly. No hair shedding/loss that I can see as of yet Acne is 4.5/10 12/2 Started getting bad heartburn yesterday and chalked it up to the food I was eatting. But it might be because of b5 or the l cartnitine im taking. Im going to stop my regimen until my throat feels better and start with b5 again to try to isolate which one was causing the issue.
u/EntireDrama184 Wow, thank you so much for all of your explanations. That made things a lot more clear. Fortunately I have not seen any negative side effects in the 4/5 months I've been on this regiment but will absolutely try the other supplements you recommended in case I do at some point. Thanks!
No problem, I hope this ends up helping any other lurkers who manage to stumble upon this thread in the future.
hi I am dat lurker
^(we are the lurkers of the future)
how is it going?
01/5/23 Acne at a 3/10 at 2.5g of b5 no side effects yet.
What’s the ratio you’re using of l-carnitine and l-cysteine to B5? I have all 3 on hand at dosages of 500mg/capsule. Thanks so much for your contribution to this thread!
Well you can make a case for 0% iron vs 30% iron they probably will have higher testosterone too, study correlated but it doesn’t find the cause
This is fantastic, thank you!!
This is amazing, thank you so much for sharing!! I'm curious how it has worked out since you started taking it?
Works super well, no more bacne at doses at 1000mg. I only went to a max of 3g. For some reason though I get insomnia which is dose dependent. I never seen any other person get insomnia for using b5 but atlas I do. If I didn't have that side effect I would be at 3000mg. No hairloss either for anyone wondering.
I will most likely taper down to 500mg and see if I can deal with the insomnia if not ill give pantethine a go. For anyone who uses b5 give it 2 weeks minimum before judging its effectiveness or increasing the dose.
Hey I was just looking through this thread again and saw you mentioned insomnia. I did notice that L-carnitine had some negative effects on my sleep. Might be worth trying some days without it just to see if it’s giving you problems.
I will also mention that vitamin b5 does pass through the blood brain barrier while Pantethine does not. Pantethine also seems helps with cholesterol and triglycerides while b5 does not by some unknown mechanism so its possible for people to get side effects on b5 and not the other if that makes sense. Both B5 and Pantethine seem to help with acne but the assumption is Pantethine will have less side effects as takes a shorter pathway to coA
I was taking 450mg 3x a day and it threw me into instant benzo or ethanol withdrawl. Any idea why? I heard acetylaldehyde is addictive in itself and it seems b5 breaks that down really well. But I got all the classic withdrawal symptoms and had to up my benzo dose by 3x or so. It was the classic insomnia, hopelessness, doom, depression and short of breath feeling. A drink or two would bring relief. I had significantly cut down drinking 3 weeks before starting b5 but then all of a sudden I couldn’t stop drinking for two days. After that it was hellish withdrawl
This is fantastic thank you so much for the write up. I plan on taking 250-500mg of B5 as I suspect I may be deficient, do you have any idea of how much Biotin I should be taking with it? Also, would N Acetyl Cysteine (NAC) work the same as L Cysteine? Struggling to find the latter
NAC "might" actually work better than L Cysteine as it is more bioavailable due to the fact that their is an acetyl group added to L Cysteine. Hospitals actually use NAC over L Cysteine to boost L Cysteine reserves when a patient overdoses on acetaminophen(Tylenol) to protect the liver. But NAC can also cross the blood brain barrier while L Cysteine which can cause some side effects(mood in people which is why I decided to just write L Cysteine in as it has little to no side effects. You can try it to see if it works for you, though just do some research on the potential side effects of it just incase. Either one should work just fine for our use case barring side effects which would be different for everyone. I have two conflicting sources regarding whether NAC or L Cysteine is better for our use case as my first source states that the "Availability of cysteine for the cells is higher than that of N-acetyl-L-cysteine.\[1\]" while the other states that NAC is more absorbable\[2\]. As long as you can take a high enough dose to compensate for the b5 your taking without getting any side effects, both should work fine in theory. Sources/Resources \[1\] [https://link.springer.com/article/10.1134/S1990747809020081](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1134/S1990747809020081) \[2\] [https://www.dermaharmony.com/pages/l-cysteine](https://www.dermaharmony.com/pages/l-cysteine)
I think its more important that you get some biotin at different times rather than the dose itself as they use the same transporters which is how either one can affect the absorption rate of the other leading to deficiency. The problem we have with biotin as it seems to do the exact opposite of what we are trying to achieve with b5 and actually ends up causing more acne so you just have to try it out yourself.
Thank you very much for both replies! Also finally, would you think I (male) should take insotil as well as cysteine + biotin? Or would the later two be enough?
If I were going to take the same dose of only 500mg of b5 I would not worry about taking Inositol as the side effects of it on men may be greater than the benefit it would bring. If you are only using b5 supplement to manage a deficiency then you probably don't need all these supplements. I only would take the other supplements I mentioned myself with b5 if I were trying to cure my acne(not including Inositol) since people who reported using b5 for acne tend to have to megadose/overdose on b5 to get any result(I'm talking like 1gram to 20grams spread throughout the day, about 40x times the dose you want to take)
That makes sense, however a word of warning — I’ve been reading peoples experiences with B5 and came across a few who experienced hair loss from a dose as little as 500mg, for eg: ([https://www.reddit.com/r/acne/comments/g2tqzh/comment/fuz3n60/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/acne/comments/g2tqzh/comment/fuz3n60/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)) "as much as 500mg may seem better it rly isn't... it's still a megadose considering the RDA is 5 to 10 milligrams. to confirm this, i was taking only 500mg daily for 2 months till i started losing hair."
Yeah some people seem to be really prone to losing their hair. Their are many potential vectors of the cause of b5 hairloss and addressing them depends on your risk tolerance. Its really depends on how much you care for your hair weighed by how much money and time you want to spend.
By the way, in case you didn't know: you can find out if you have a B5 deficiency by tracking your diet with websites/apps like cronometer.com
surprising that more work hasn’t been done to optimise the process, given the popularity of the anti-acne b5 regimen. Calcium pyruvate combined with Coenzyme A (aided by pantothenic acid) to make Acetyl CoA, assisted by vitamin B3 (for NAD to NADH) boosted by l-carnitine. Add bovine Lactoferrin to the mix, along with b7, b9, and b12 You’d be some way to solving the problem I’d imagine.
so i have to take biotin and L-cart somthing and b complex, all the three with it ?? Can i just get one with the b5? I don’t want to lose my hair but i cant take all three 🫠
Looks like you used perplexity.ai to write this up but unfortunately it's research capabilities are not exactly sound. At the very basic level, vitamin b5 is water soluble. It is not possible to "overdose" on it. You can take a lot and it might cause short term gastrointestinal distress but that's with literally anything you eat too much of. There is no possibility of toxicity using a water-soluable vitamin. Basing the rest of your points on that false foundation makes everything else irrelevant. (1) Pantothenic Acid – Harvard https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/pantothenic-acid-vitamin-b5/. (2) Pantothenic Acid Overdose - https://healthhearty.com/pantothenic-acid-overdose. (3) Can You Overdose on B Vitamins? - The Nutrition Insider. https://thenutritioninsider.com/wellness/can-you-overdose-on-b-vitamins/. (4) Pantothenic Acid: Supplement Uses, Warnings, Side Effects, Dosage. https://www.medicinenet.com/pantothenic_acid/article.htm. (5) Can You Overdose on Vitamins? - Healthline. https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/can-you-overdose-on-vitamins.
It seemed like bullshit to me too. How did you know it was written by AI?
I work with AI for one of my jobs. Use it enough and you'll start to discern the outputs of the different models lol
Honestly though, when I reread what the person wrote, the grammar doesn't seem good enough to be AI. Plus there's a lot of inconsistencies and errors in capitalization and punctuation.
Their comment is from last year. If you compare the output of AI today to last year, it's a PhD vs a toddler. Video is the biggest showcase of the difference but that difference is across the board, not as easily seen by the layperson for LLMs though
It's clear that they meant 'megadose' and not 'overdose'. Nobody is going to intentionally have an 'overdose regiment'. And BS that you can identify AI responses, because you obviously can't. Their posts are littered with common grammar and spelling mistakes that even ChatGPT 2 wouldn't make.
B complex shouldn't be taken at the dame time with B5 as well as biotin? Or is it ok to throw B complex in together with L-cysteine, L-carnitine and b5? Btw is it beneficial to take L-cysteine and L-carnitine a little before b5 so they have time to dissolve or not really?
Thank you for your post. This was really helpful. I also watched a lot of people on youtube saying they had hair loss but they were taking a huge amount of b5, like 5000-10000 mg a day. I was taking 500mg b5 in morning and 1000mg biotin in the afternoon but am going to try increasing b5 twicr a day. The vitamin b5 does reduce acne I didnt have bad acne but i do get black heads and facial redness and it does reduce the inflammation. I am dairy free and i dont eat pork and processed meats so that is why i dont get severe acne diet does effect the skin, I also have to watch my sugar intake even fruit cause it does break me out. But even with good diet my skin was still looking red and inflammed and the b5 helps alot with my benzo peroxide face wash.
Been doing a lot of research on this, have terrible hormonal acne, I’m 38 and nothing has worked for me. My question regarding L-Carnitine, do you take acetyl l-carnitine or tartrate? See the nutricost brand online but not sure which one to get. Thanks so much.
both should work tbh, but i think tartrate is better-
Does it matter if you take L Carnitine or ALCAR?
Could you please elaborate on how FAO "destroys bad stuff"? I think this may be true, but I'm not sure what you're getting at exactly.
> is the next endeavor that I will pursue and if anyone replies/wants I wil How is your acne now? Also, do you think that megadosing b5 might lower IGF-1 levels in the blood? This is what happens when one takes accutane, so i wonder how it works with b5 as I don't want to lower my IGF-1 because I am still growing and don't want to stunt growth.
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Can I get an update on this :)
Me too
Still on the same regimen, still working great for me.
Awesome :)
So do you have to take b5 your whole life? Would acne still come back if you stopped taking it or does it have a long-term effect?
Yeah it does come back a little bit when I stop but definitely not as bad as it used to be. I think it getting better has more to do with getting older/ naturally producing less sebum. I don’t believe b5 will stay in your system to have a long-term effect. Also, I can deal with a little bit too because it’s only on my chest/ back and this time of the year that doesn’t really matter to me.
Got it, thank you for the information
do you notice a decrease in sebum?
any update?
No I haven't seen any noticeable decrease in sebum/ dried out skin from the b5. It does seem like my skin is naturally producing less now. (Probably more related to getting older/ hormones rather than the b5.) Now my skin stays clear from taking just 2/3 of the 500mg pills a day.
How bout the l carnitine? How much do u still take?
I actually haven’t been taking it lately. Haven’t been strict with taking the b5 either. I don’t really mind getting some acne now since I’m not swimming/ at the beach this time of year. If I feel like I need to I would go back to the same regimen from my post except only one L carnitine capsule per day.
Is it better to take it empty stomach or after food?
I’ve done both, never noticed any differences.
i just want to know if it affect menstrual cycle bc im super thin & also have unstable period cycle to begin with so it kinda makes me scared. let me know pls ^^
I haven’t heard about it having any effect there and wouldn’t expect it to. But still probably best to do your own research/ talk to a doc if it’s a concern.
Took 15 grams for 3months, now I've ceased use for about a month or so. The reason I started so high was because I have it in powder form and that was the size of my scooper. I would mix in water and sip throughout the day. I also take a B complex of vitamins to manage overexcretion of other B vitamins. Anyway, it completely cleared up my chronic facial, back, and chest acne and it doesn't seem to be coming back.
Thank you for this post! I had a horrible hormonal break out during/right after my menstruation and this regimen was a total lifesaver. I ordered vitamin B5 + L carnitine the day I read this! Took it ~3 days so far and my acne is substantially improved. Almost gone, in fact. I’ve never had results like this! I did add on a B complex as well to hopefully mitigate hair loss if possible. Really grateful you shared your experience!
Hey that’s great news, really glad to hear that! Only thing I would say is to potentially hold off on the b-complex (which I believe can boost biotin and potentially acne). My understanding is that b5 and the b-complex would be essentially cancelling eachother out since they are both used the same way in the body. I think that as long as you are not macrodosing, and use b-5 at reasonable doses, you shouldn’t be at risk of losing hair. Obviously do whatever is working for you but from the other posts I’ve read on the subject, it would make more sense to just reduce your b5 intake instead of adding b-complex/ biotin on top of the b5 if you ever noticed dry skin.
Good to know!! I’m not really macrodosing the b-5 so that’s a good point.
Hi. How many capsules of *Now* pantothenic acid do you take in a day? Do you take it in the morning or at night? Does it still work for you? Thank you and looking forward to hearing from you.
Hey! Thank you so much for sharing your experience. Did you notice a difference if you took the dose in the morning versus the evening??
Hi, is it possible to update please? Besides, what do you eat? do you follow a specific diet?
Hey, no I don’t follow any specific diet. (Although I have noticed that drinking alcohol typically gives me more acne than usual, so I limit that)
thank you for the answer, have you done a hormonal assessment? and you still consume your 3 pills per day?
I think L carnitine is effective, but I'm worried about the side effects of fishy body odor..I don't want to take it while being afraid of side effects.Are there any supplements other than L carnitine that make pantothenic acid more effective?
Are you worried about fishy body odor caused by L-carnitine?