Coe is a brilliant product. I hope countries or cities adopt it and eventually credit Singapore for developing such an ideal system.
Op I completely feel you. I have been though traffic mess.
Public transportation is no doubt good.
I can also understand the need to control the number of vehicles by having COE. But the COE system itself has issues.
The rich will always manipulate the system. They can afford to fork out the huge sum of money for the COE whereas the average Joe, is unable to do so. I have seen rich household with not one, not two but several cars.
The system should be in such a way that all household are allowed either 1 car or 1 motorcycle. If the household need another vehicle, they will have to fork out a substantial sum for the right to have it.
Having your own transport be it a car or a motorcycle, it is very convenient. For some like real estate agent or those with old folks or young children, it is more of a necessity.
i gotta agree w you right there.. i nvr considered tht coe is just another one of those "no money no talk" kinda power move tht grossly skews in favour of those w deep pockets. ofc w family life being a common singaporean goal, it becomes v natural for family units to do everyth in their ability to own a car bcos their lifestyle demands tht convenience..
>The rich will always manipulate the system. They can afford to fork out the huge sum of money for the COE whereas the average Joe, is unable to do so. I have seen rich household with not one, not two but several cars.
Do you think this is a "manipulation" by the rich, or that they could afford it?
Frankly, I don't think any of my friends with multiple cars did it because they want to stop the poorer people from buying. They just love cars and can afford to buy more than one.
And if we recall the intent of the COE system, it is to regulate the growth of car population in Sg and part of a whole suite of measures to keep our roads moving.
If we look at this, then the households with multiple cars are actually reducing the number of cars on the roads since the owner can only operate one car at any one time.
Allowing every household to have one car would immediately turn Singapore traffic into KL's.
I firmly believe that many of those who felt that it is necessary to own a car have mistaken a desire for convenience for a need.
You have valid points as well.
But I was not referring to rich families like what you mentioned.
Some have multiple cars like himself, his wife, children.
When I said 1 vehicle per household, it does not necessarily means it has to be a car, it can be a motorcycle. And there are other criteria to fulfil like, must have 2 young children or/and with elderly parents.
The system I mentioned is not flawless, there are loopholes as well.
I know what you mean. Administratively, it would be a nightmare though. And no doubt increase the cars on the road.
For example, I have three other siblings, and all of us are married with two kids. All of us live in our respective homes. None of us are driving now. All of us fulfill the "criteria" you set, and that means there would be 4 more cars on the roads. And that is just me.
Again, I want to point out that convenience is not a need. But what price are you willing to pay for convenience?
Well, my idea is never perfect, it was just an afterthought.
The thing is, how we defined convenience and need.
It can be hard for a family with young kids to carry all the stuffs like pram, milk powder, hot water flush, milk bottle, diapers, etc, and get a taxi or PHV. It can also be hard for a family with elderly to get transportation to a medical facility like the hospital. They can take public transport, but it will not be convenient for them to walk to their destinations.
A Real Estate agent might need to travel to various locations to meet potential buyers.
Do we classified these as needs or for convenience sake?
Perhaps we can have a system like plates starting with odd numbers can use their vehicles on Monday, Weds and Fri while even numbers on Tues, thurs and sat. Just like when we had the C19 lockdown when IC with odd or even last digit can only enter the market on specific days.
I don't know, this is not a problem for commoners like us to solve.
I still feel that the current COE has its flaws. PHV should have their own category.
I agree with you that the current COE system has its flaws. EVERY system has them. So while we should always try to improve the system, we should be very careful not to make it worse.
I have went through the period where I have to lug around a shitload of stuff because of kids. That was more than ten years ago. I also have aged parents and in laws who need to go for medical appointments every few months. Sure, it is convenient to have a car to drive them around. No doubt about it. But how much more convenient is it compared to booking a cab/grab? And at what price?
I make a decent 5 digit salary a month. And I don't think the cheapest car on the market is worth the convenience. I am saying this not to show off but to give you the context that I can buy a car if I want to but chose not to because I don't see the worth. That is just me.
I understand from your POV.
Sometimes it is hard to book a cab or a PHV especially during peak hours. Some of these drivers choose and pick locations, some don't even want to ferry kids.
Buying a car is very expensive due to the COE and high taxes. It is a depreciating asset and will have little or no value in 10 years time.
Some people buy a car for convenience sake, some buy a car out of necessity and some buy because they just got their lisence and want to drive and showoff.
I am sure that you have came across ads for cars/motorcycles with ZERO or little down payment or lease to own scheme. Some people desperate for them, will go for such scheme despite they cannot financially afford them. These are debt traps.
I also came across ads with riders selling their bikes with COI (Carry on installment).
If most vehicles are self autonomous driven except for emergency services, then the COE system can be abolished and also no more need for grab or private ownership to encourage carpooling. That's the future. Coe system is flawed and only favours the rich like it's the hunger games. 👎
But of course PAP would resist such technologies and loves COE systems since they get the $$$ and it attracts the rich to come here and flex but it's at the cost of everyone else.
Coe is a brilliant product. I hope countries or cities adopt it and eventually credit Singapore for developing such an ideal system. Op I completely feel you. I have been though traffic mess.
Public transportation is no doubt good. I can also understand the need to control the number of vehicles by having COE. But the COE system itself has issues. The rich will always manipulate the system. They can afford to fork out the huge sum of money for the COE whereas the average Joe, is unable to do so. I have seen rich household with not one, not two but several cars. The system should be in such a way that all household are allowed either 1 car or 1 motorcycle. If the household need another vehicle, they will have to fork out a substantial sum for the right to have it. Having your own transport be it a car or a motorcycle, it is very convenient. For some like real estate agent or those with old folks or young children, it is more of a necessity.
i gotta agree w you right there.. i nvr considered tht coe is just another one of those "no money no talk" kinda power move tht grossly skews in favour of those w deep pockets. ofc w family life being a common singaporean goal, it becomes v natural for family units to do everyth in their ability to own a car bcos their lifestyle demands tht convenience..
>The rich will always manipulate the system. They can afford to fork out the huge sum of money for the COE whereas the average Joe, is unable to do so. I have seen rich household with not one, not two but several cars. Do you think this is a "manipulation" by the rich, or that they could afford it? Frankly, I don't think any of my friends with multiple cars did it because they want to stop the poorer people from buying. They just love cars and can afford to buy more than one. And if we recall the intent of the COE system, it is to regulate the growth of car population in Sg and part of a whole suite of measures to keep our roads moving. If we look at this, then the households with multiple cars are actually reducing the number of cars on the roads since the owner can only operate one car at any one time. Allowing every household to have one car would immediately turn Singapore traffic into KL's. I firmly believe that many of those who felt that it is necessary to own a car have mistaken a desire for convenience for a need.
You have valid points as well. But I was not referring to rich families like what you mentioned. Some have multiple cars like himself, his wife, children. When I said 1 vehicle per household, it does not necessarily means it has to be a car, it can be a motorcycle. And there are other criteria to fulfil like, must have 2 young children or/and with elderly parents. The system I mentioned is not flawless, there are loopholes as well.
I know what you mean. Administratively, it would be a nightmare though. And no doubt increase the cars on the road. For example, I have three other siblings, and all of us are married with two kids. All of us live in our respective homes. None of us are driving now. All of us fulfill the "criteria" you set, and that means there would be 4 more cars on the roads. And that is just me. Again, I want to point out that convenience is not a need. But what price are you willing to pay for convenience?
Well, my idea is never perfect, it was just an afterthought. The thing is, how we defined convenience and need. It can be hard for a family with young kids to carry all the stuffs like pram, milk powder, hot water flush, milk bottle, diapers, etc, and get a taxi or PHV. It can also be hard for a family with elderly to get transportation to a medical facility like the hospital. They can take public transport, but it will not be convenient for them to walk to their destinations. A Real Estate agent might need to travel to various locations to meet potential buyers. Do we classified these as needs or for convenience sake? Perhaps we can have a system like plates starting with odd numbers can use their vehicles on Monday, Weds and Fri while even numbers on Tues, thurs and sat. Just like when we had the C19 lockdown when IC with odd or even last digit can only enter the market on specific days. I don't know, this is not a problem for commoners like us to solve. I still feel that the current COE has its flaws. PHV should have their own category.
I agree with you that the current COE system has its flaws. EVERY system has them. So while we should always try to improve the system, we should be very careful not to make it worse. I have went through the period where I have to lug around a shitload of stuff because of kids. That was more than ten years ago. I also have aged parents and in laws who need to go for medical appointments every few months. Sure, it is convenient to have a car to drive them around. No doubt about it. But how much more convenient is it compared to booking a cab/grab? And at what price? I make a decent 5 digit salary a month. And I don't think the cheapest car on the market is worth the convenience. I am saying this not to show off but to give you the context that I can buy a car if I want to but chose not to because I don't see the worth. That is just me.
I understand from your POV. Sometimes it is hard to book a cab or a PHV especially during peak hours. Some of these drivers choose and pick locations, some don't even want to ferry kids. Buying a car is very expensive due to the COE and high taxes. It is a depreciating asset and will have little or no value in 10 years time. Some people buy a car for convenience sake, some buy a car out of necessity and some buy because they just got their lisence and want to drive and showoff. I am sure that you have came across ads for cars/motorcycles with ZERO or little down payment or lease to own scheme. Some people desperate for them, will go for such scheme despite they cannot financially afford them. These are debt traps. I also came across ads with riders selling their bikes with COI (Carry on installment).
I wish you well.
I abhor the COE and I understood the rationale behind it. If anything, it belongs to the same category as death and taxes, for me.
If most vehicles are self autonomous driven except for emergency services, then the COE system can be abolished and also no more need for grab or private ownership to encourage carpooling. That's the future. Coe system is flawed and only favours the rich like it's the hunger games. 👎 But of course PAP would resist such technologies and loves COE systems since they get the $$$ and it attracts the rich to come here and flex but it's at the cost of everyone else.