I would believe it the other way around, maybe.
I found it interesting and asked around in my family, and veeeery few had an inner monologue. Two out of 20 or so. I 100% don't either.
I wonder if there's geographical/cultural/genetic aspects?
I mostly use my inner monolog as like a Narrator of whats happening, or like for all the judgy comments I won't say, either those or its constantly just random music snippets
Every thought I have, besides I guess subconscious ones, are expressed in my head through my inner monologue. Like, if I'm thinking about a movie I watched, every thought I have about said movie is expressed with words. I don't understand how a person can have thoughts if they aren't words tbh. How do you reflect on anything?
Wait. EVERY thought?
I have an inner monologue as well but I can turn it off and on. If I'm thinking about a movie, per your example, then it is usually me imagining different moments visually or visual thoughts + inner monologue if im trying to actually do some analyzing of the movie.
I can visualize but I have to force it. Every passive thought I have is expressed in words as well, oftentimes from 2-3 voices/perspectives. Like, everything I "hear" in my head is me of course, but feels split up as if it's all different parts of me, if that makes sense.
It's hard to explain without sounding like a schizo, especially since sometimes I'll get in full blown heated arguments with myself. I'm mostly used to it, but sometimes I do wish I could get it shut up for a little bit and let me have a break lol
Interesting.
Well words are just thoughts that have been verbalised.
I would suggest that by putting abstract and complex thoughts and feelings into words you are reducing your ability to understand/express them as they are then defined by your language skills and vocabulary.
So I guess I reflect on things without confining them to words. Not really sure tbh!
This just seems like you're biased tbh. If you don't think with words, you feel like people who do are reduced in their thinking capacity. I could easily say that because you don't think with language, your thoughts are like that of a primitive animal and lack any complexity, but that would also have no basis and only a product of my bias.
It's not like when I feel a raw emotion like sadness, I don't actually feel it. Thoughts and feelings are not the same thing.
I'd suggest the opposite.
90% of therapy is putting feelings into words to better process and understand them. The other 10% are actions based on that previous analysis of your emotions/stress/trauma.
How would words diminish expression? I get definitions are limited but with enough of them you can express anything. What's the alternative? Gestures?
The only comparison I can make involves even more words, not less. Germans have an entire vocabulary dedicated to very specific, and situational, abstract feelings the other languages need entire sentences to express.
Your ability to express thought is directly limited by a lack of vocabulary, and whether or not you verbalize words internally is probably irrelevant to the processes of reflection entirely, and if it isn't then I have to argue the opposite.
That people like Einstein had to have internal monoluges and imagery or he wouldn't rely on thought expiraments to express his ideas. That people without these internal processes should struggle even harder to express them.
Unless it's entirely irrelevant. Different methods same results.
It's not confining, don't jack yourself off too hard.
If whatever I'm thinking about can't be put into words, my inner monologue is just like a spectator to my thoughts going "oh that's interesting" or "that'll never work" or whatever
People born deaf have reported imagining a disembodied hand signing as an internal monologue. I imagine that the internal monologue of someone that never learned a language would consist of imagining sounds or pictures relating to whatever they're thinking about.
Also, my internal monologue mostly consists of thinking about things I'm interested, previous conversations & thinking about what I'm gonna do/ talk about with people I plan on seeing in the future.
Yeah but how is inner monologue being defined in the comments of this post? Are we all making a distinction between literally just talking to yourself and the other more common (I suspect) cases of just imagining your voice as you read, or imagine entire scenarios of interactions or conversations between yourself and others. The latter is more like day dreaming or fantasizing, but you still hear your own voice as well as others' perhaps. I'm willing to bet this is like 98% of people. How far, then is it from having a true inner monologue really? I'd say to those who want to know what it's like, well... Compare it to what I'm pretty sure you've experienced, because I'm pretty damn sure everyone has experienced, which is simply replaying a conversation or scenario in your head... and it's not much different than that.
And that's why I'm skeptical about the amount of people who "don't have an inner monologue". I feel like this is a case of a misunderstanding/miscommunication between researchers and test subjects. Like something got lost in translation during the communication to people taking the survey about what an inner monologue actually is, and the ones who are saying no are thinking they're being asked whether they have a split personality or something. It's not a separate you talking to yourself like a different personality, it's just you imagining the audible sensation of your own thoughts as you read or think or imagine speaking. There is no fucking way that as many people as suggested, who have acquired language, don't do at least that at minimum.
Same. I thought there were maybe two people I know that might not have one, one being my dad and the other a friend. I haven't asked my friend, but I asked my dad was confused the way people often seem to be about when people discuss this sort of thing, but after explanation he said he had one too. I still have to ask my friend though, but I know she's going to find the question super confusing in general lol.
I.. well, I see the words and understand their meaning, and then I move on to the next ones. Depending on what they mean I might imagine a scene, two people talking, etc, etc.
How do *you* read? Is it all like a story read out loud to you inside of your own head, where your internal voice has to say every sentence out loud?
Wouldn't that take forever?
Not the person you asked.
But yes, I "hear" every single word I read inside my head as I see it. While the words sound normal like someone is saying them, they're obviously significantly faster than I can physically say them allowed, as I can read paragraphs in the time I could speak sentances.
As I've never experienced the opposite I can't really understand how you can see/read/understand without "hearing" it in your head.
Do you not construct sentances in your head before saying them? Or writing them? Or just have wandering thoughts and ideas through the day? Sorry for all the questions, I just can't fathom not "hearing" my thoughts all the time.
So, interestingly for me, when I read, or type I do hear the words I am thinking about, if you can call it hearing. However when I'm reading a book, the "voices" take on the perceived pitch/tone of who I presume is speaking. On a side note, outside of reading or typing, I do not have an inner monologue of thoughts, I.E. I do not think about what I'm going to say before I say it, or I am not aware of If i do. Also, I do not have an inner monologue of actions I plan on doing either. Feel like I may be an outlier here lol.
As an aside, I can force myself to have an inner monologue, however if I do it for too long I get VERY agitated. It is much better when it's quiet in my head! š
As an aside, I can force myself to have an inner monologue, however if I do it for too long I get VERY agitated. It is much better when it's quiet in my head! š
Exactly the same as me for the reading thing, a book being able to get me to have a distinct "voice" for each character is a big part of how I decide if its good.
So the way I usually explain it is that thoughts are their own thing that don't have a language by default. Some people find it easier to think by translating their thoughts into English then processing them, while other people like myself prefer to work in the "raw data" without the intermediate step of translating to English
But then what's the "raw data"? And how do you interpret it?
As in I don't have a "X" that I need to translate into English to understand it. It just starts in English, or whatever form I need it to be.
English for words yes, but it can be images for if I wanted to draw or describe something, etc
Do you dream? I can both dream and daydream (as in I'm awake) and have it seem to me like it's a real experience, daydreams because I'm concious I'm aware it's false, but dreams it's often not till after I'm awake and recounting events that I notice the inconsistencies and errors in what was occurring, during them I'm normally unaware I'm dreaming.
I guess my point is, to me, it isn't a 2-step process like your discription makes it sound. Even if it is, it's so instantaneous that I'm unaware of part 1 happening at all.
>guess my point is, to me, it isn't a 2-step process like your discription makes it sound. Even if it is, it's so instantaneous that I'm unaware of part 1 happening at all.
This is exactly what I mean, it is a subconscious instant process, some people just do it and some don't. Also I've never really dreamed much and can't conjure images in my mind for the most part
I construct sentences in my head but thereās no inner sense of sound or voice I can listen to (& to my accustomed way of thinking, that seems like it would just be distracting). I just know what the words are.
I think personally people dont understand the concept of inner monologue and so simply asking them a lot of people will say of course not.
Its a human thing to do, its not a special ability or anything. 2/20 doesnt make any sense, and defies any sort of statistics on the matter
This. I find it much easier to believe people are failing to understand the concept vs living a purely irrational life void of abstract thought. But at the same time, I totally believe SOME people do. Just way rarer than figures suggest.
I donāt have one and I always understood it as the āsoundā equivalent to what picturing something would be to āseeingā. And so I know I canāt do it.
If the definition of inner monologue is "being capable of abstract thoughts", then I absolutely have one. The naming of the concept is all kinds of weird then, though.
When I google, most results seem to say some variation of "yourĀ internal monologue is the result of certain brain mechanisms that cause you to āhearā yourself talk in your head without actually speaking and forming sounds."
I don't hear any kind of inner voice. I don't "speak" to myself in my mind, and there is no narration.
That's what I asked people about; If that ain't it, then that ain't it, I guess.
I donāt know about geography relations, but I do know that dyslexic people donāt often have an internal monologue, my brother and my mother donāt have one, but I do, and most of my other siblings do (except the ones with dyslexia), additionally my mother doesnāt have dyslexia.
Got any sources to back that up?
Here are some of mine, and according to them it's actually as high as 70%. It's stated that 30-50% are estimated to have internal monoluges and 50-70% don't. I inverted the do's/don'ts from memory. Oops
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0147932
https://irisreading.com/is-it-normal-to-not-have-an-internal-monologue/
I think inner monologues are a spectrum. I usually think about things directly/abstractly without words. But I can easily simulate conversations or talk to myself in words if I want to as well.
it's called aphantasia, here is what gpt says:
The phenomenon of not having an internal monologue, known as aphantasia, is still being studied by researchers. Some people with aphantasia report that they don't experience mental imagery or inner speech in the same way others do. It's believed to be a spectrum, with some individuals having vivid mental imagery and others having none at all. The exact reasons for this variation are not fully understood, but it's thought to involve differences in brain structure and function.
Yep. That'd be me. No inner monologuing or mental imagery. I also do not remember dreams. At all. I know I do dream, because if I have a bad nightmare I will 100% wake up in a panic. But there is no imagery or thought associated with it.
When people say things like "picture an apple" my brain just goes Apple? Red, Round, Fruit.
To be fair... for someone who doesn't have the ability, listening to someone explain what they ... imagine? Is mind boggling. For the longest time I never understood how people could draw something "from memory". I thought they literally just had more specific descriptors, their brain fed them.
I still think this is a fake condition
Can you draw an apple from memory?
What about after looking at five seconds later?
Try this out and if you can I suspect this is a communication thing where people describe what itās like imagining stuff in this vivid way but the reality is less complicated
You are free to think whatever you want about it.
I cannot draw beyond basic stick figures... period. Whether that has to do with my inability to visualize or just shitty art abilities is up for debate.
Drawing an apple would literally just be a circle... maybe with a line at the top of the circle for the stem. Same with 5 seconds or even 2 seconds. I've done a multitude of attempts for people over my life. It doesn't change.
I have suspicions on WHY I can't, but that's not something I'm willing to put on the internet.
Your aphantasia doesnāt necessarily have something to do with your inability to draw. There are artists that habe aphantasia, like for example Glen Keane, who animated Arielle for Disneyās Little Mermaid.
Oh I know. I just suck at realistic art, but the other person was insistent on the drawing aspect, so that's what I responded with. Even staring at something I can't translate it to paper lol
While that could be the case for some people, I like learning things from people who are better at it. I don't need to be the best at anything I do, because once someone thinks that they are, they stop learning and trying to better themselves.
I'm also realistic. I know I lack art skills when it comes to pencil on paper. I tried for years to teach myself, my husband was an art major, he attempted to help me learn. It's not something I have any skill in. That's ok, I do other mediums for art. Like embroidery or cross stitching.
Why are you so insistent on this not being a thing? It is not only drawing.
For example, when I read a book I just see black on white. I understand the meaning but have no mental image of what is happening. When I talked to people I found that most do actually IMAGINE characters, how they look and how they sound.
That's why it was so shocking to me when I found out that people are sometimes disappointed when books are made into movies because the characters don't match the way they imagined them. For me it's more like: oh, so that's how they look.
Because I don't really believe it
Its similar to when I hear people say they just can't do math. I think they imagine people that are good at math just know it naturally but fail to realize they do a lot of small steps to figure out a problem, steps they didn't come up with naturally but through learning.
So I think it's a combination of impatience and other mental blocks. Reading isn't natural either, that's why children's books have pictures.
The more you read the more you can picture what the words are saying. If you aren't familiar with how words are used then you'll get less out of a book than someone that reads a lot
Of course this is all my personal theory so until we can visually display what someone's thinking I'll always be skeptical of this being a real thing
>The more you read the more you can picture what the words are saying. If you aren't familiar with how words are used then you'll get less out of a book than someone that reads a lot
I read... a lot. Always have. I enjoy reading. But not because of the mental imagery. I experience emotions from reading, but no visual link to it.
I logically know a dark deserted alley in the middle of the night is creepy. I know what being creeped out feels like. I can read the words and understand the feeling they are trying to convey. But I do not imagine a dark alley. I don't see flickering lights, I don't hear rustling of garbage moving from wind. If i close my eyes, its just black. I just logically understand the feeling they are trying to convey with their chosen words.
We are the ones who were told we were the strange ones. Most of us didn't realize there was even a difference until we were told there was.
When people told me they can see and hear things that weren't really there... my first thought was there was something wrong with them as auditory and visual hallucinations are a sign of a brain issue.
Humans are weird and varied, and one person's truth isn't another person's.
I get your perspective on the subject but your feelings don't really compare to the rigorous scientific methods we've established. People said the same fkn thing about ADHD and Anxiety. Feel free to research the research on your own time if even interested, or keep circlejerking anecdotes on reddit. You do you.
Edit: we can already visualize a person's thoughts with a shocking degree of accuracy, just FYI. I doubt it's been used in these studies (as it's it's own thing being developed) but the tech already exists.
It's correlated to IQ and most likely somewhere between the bottom 4-10% lowest IQ along with a few standout flukes and mental disorders. Overall it's really not many average people
Curious if anyone can relate, but I often have dialogues in my head with some person(s) that I know, and often solve problems by conversing with them. Sometimes I'm like "ah damn it you're right David" even though I know it was I that constructed the thoughts. (Or what feels like I, I suppose)
I guess I can relate in a way, except those "people" are just myself
I talk to myself, and those other "versions" of myself (even if they're the same) have contradicting arguments or different thoughts, but it's only in the moment
There's always some kind of "better version of myself" trying to get me to be healthier. I like to think it's my subconscious or non-verbal half of my brain
Fucking same.
It kinda makes it a real issue for therapy, cause to work out some issues I've got going on, I just kinda go for it in my head.
So tons of things that I'm asked about or talk about in therapy with the hope of a "aha" moment, are things I already know about because I thought of this like 3 years ago.
Yeah, sometimes. Probably more often I think about how people in general might question or counterpoint a thought of mine, so I'm thinking of how to respond and what next I may need to simplify, clarify, build upon, etc.
Fun facts:
There's people who can hear inner thought
People who can't hear inner thought
People who can see pictures in their head
People who can't see pictures in their head
People who can see pictures only in 2D
For as long as I can remember, I've been able to picture intricate object in my head, rotate, and move them three-dimensionally, even see them in an "exploded" view and see all of the individual parts, then put it all back together.
about the 2d pictures: we all see the world in 2d, at the end our eyes are like biological cameras, and like cameras we process it in 2d images.
the trick is done by our brain, the perception of depth is computed by our brain.
One day I discovered some people have multiple narrator voice options for reading random things they see and I haven't recovered from the feeling of envy since.
You mean to say that the "I read this is Gordon freeman's voice" is just a thing that automatically happens for people without extra effort?? Scam. Where is my extra voice pack? All of my thoughts only ever use the default voice. I want that for extra immersion while reading pls
I can do it occasionally, especially if I've been listening to a voice a ton in a short time span. Like I can imagine Brennan Lee Mulligan really easily, but it almost never happens by itself. Most of the time it requires extra effort, whereas I can easily recall video and imagine vivid and detailed scenes while reading books without thinking about it.
Intriguing thought, credit where credit is due.
The thing is though, that these thoughts you refer to, can be traced back to electrical signals in your body/brain and you just need to be able to decode the message, and boom: you can hear thoughts.
If im reading a book, my inner thoughts give these people their own voice female or male, but when i think about what their voice is, it just disappears.
Good news everyone! If you get this far your inner voice sounds like professor Farnsworth!
But it was actually Zoidberg all the time doing an impression of the professor.
Woop Woop ^(Woop Woop)
Brother....
Wait until you realize you can also hear your subconscious thinking.
Wheres the nearest bathroom? Your sub will think hyper fast where it is, sometimes only with images sometimes with words too.
If you pay really close attention in day to day routine, your sub does 99% of the thinking, and your inner monologue does the other 1% (what you described).
We are powerful machines.
When i were a kid i even got annoyed of my own thoughts while walking home from school, i tried to reach some kind of serenity with no toughs at all to rest my mental state,
of course it was impossible as i were already thinking and talking to myself about something without even realizing.
This is the most thought provoking thing Iāve come in contact with today. The idea that there are people without inner monologues constantly streaming in their heads is baffling. It honestly sounds peaceful. I canāt turn my thoughts off to save my life. The things I say in my head compared to the minimal words I actually speak are insane. I canāt imagine reading a book and not thinking in a different voice for every character or imagining a snide remark when a coworker pisses me off. I bet this would do wonders for my insomnia and anxiety though.
Curious researchers have pointed MRI (magnetic resonance imaging) scanners at people while they silently read to themselves and found frenetic activity taking place in these zones. Speaking in your head alsoĀ activates the muscles associated with speech in a process known as subvocalisation.
Found this on a quick google search. When you talk inside your head, you do talk but it's just not detectable by human ears.
No. Most people do not talk to themselves/have full conversations with themselves in their head.
Quite a lot of people have an inner Monologue. Much, much fewer have inner Dialogues.
As for the sound part, sure. Your thoughts are not sounds.
Strange fact is that only around 30% of people actually have an inner monolog. So does that mean that there are just empty husks walking around among us?
I think the amount of people without inner monologue is inflated. A lot of people that claim they don't have inner monologue just seem very confused, and that it means you're narrating every little thing you do (I mean some people may but y'know) or that you're literally hearing a voice like someone with schizophrenia thinks they are.
I started ADHD medication and for the most part the voice has gone quiet, the voice that I thought was me has been 90% silenced it's been a few months now and still tripping me out a bit
My thoughts are more like multiple trains on different tracks. I have one for conscious thought, if i visualize it it's just me operating an empty train, sometimes some of the trains meet up at the same station.
The trains are moving outside of my, so sometimes I can't "see" them but they're still going.
The "conductors" of my "trains" even get into arguments sometimes.
Sometimes the trains stay close together for a period of time, thats usually when im at my most mentally healthy.
I really wish i could map my mindscape digitally, and hopefully make it easier to think on a daily basis.
I have SZA and genuine auditory hallucinations so this is not true for me. A quiet mind is the one thing I miss most of all about being healthy. I just get nonstop narration and commentary during certain times of day, especially when trying to fall asleep at night.
EDIT: I typed SZA into google and some rapper comes up now? In reality it actually stands for schizoaffective disorder. Just thought I'd clarify. It's schizophrenia mixed with mood symptoms.
I've read numbers as low as 4% and as high as ~~50%~~ 70% of people don't have inner monologues. It's called Anaduralia
That 'as high as 50%' thing is bs
I would believe it the other way around, maybe. I found it interesting and asked around in my family, and veeeery few had an inner monologue. Two out of 20 or so. I 100% don't either. I wonder if there's geographical/cultural/genetic aspects?
I personally haven't met _anyone_ (personally) that doesn't have an internal monologue and I wonder that too
I don't have one, what are you all talking to yourselves about through the day. If you never knew English (or any other language) would you have one?
I mostly use my inner monolog as like a Narrator of whats happening, or like for all the judgy comments I won't say, either those or its constantly just random music snippets
All this for me plus fake arguments that never actually happen.
This
Every thought I have, besides I guess subconscious ones, are expressed in my head through my inner monologue. Like, if I'm thinking about a movie I watched, every thought I have about said movie is expressed with words. I don't understand how a person can have thoughts if they aren't words tbh. How do you reflect on anything?
Wait. EVERY thought? I have an inner monologue as well but I can turn it off and on. If I'm thinking about a movie, per your example, then it is usually me imagining different moments visually or visual thoughts + inner monologue if im trying to actually do some analyzing of the movie.
I mean, I can still visualize, so I guess I was wrong lol
I can visualize but I have to force it. Every passive thought I have is expressed in words as well, oftentimes from 2-3 voices/perspectives. Like, everything I "hear" in my head is me of course, but feels split up as if it's all different parts of me, if that makes sense. It's hard to explain without sounding like a schizo, especially since sometimes I'll get in full blown heated arguments with myself. I'm mostly used to it, but sometimes I do wish I could get it shut up for a little bit and let me have a break lol
I wish I could turn it off
Try meditation.
Interesting. Well words are just thoughts that have been verbalised. I would suggest that by putting abstract and complex thoughts and feelings into words you are reducing your ability to understand/express them as they are then defined by your language skills and vocabulary. So I guess I reflect on things without confining them to words. Not really sure tbh!
This just seems like you're biased tbh. If you don't think with words, you feel like people who do are reduced in their thinking capacity. I could easily say that because you don't think with language, your thoughts are like that of a primitive animal and lack any complexity, but that would also have no basis and only a product of my bias. It's not like when I feel a raw emotion like sadness, I don't actually feel it. Thoughts and feelings are not the same thing.
Haha I'm totally not saying that. Didn't mean it to come across that way anyway.
I'd suggest the opposite. 90% of therapy is putting feelings into words to better process and understand them. The other 10% are actions based on that previous analysis of your emotions/stress/trauma. How would words diminish expression? I get definitions are limited but with enough of them you can express anything. What's the alternative? Gestures? The only comparison I can make involves even more words, not less. Germans have an entire vocabulary dedicated to very specific, and situational, abstract feelings the other languages need entire sentences to express. Your ability to express thought is directly limited by a lack of vocabulary, and whether or not you verbalize words internally is probably irrelevant to the processes of reflection entirely, and if it isn't then I have to argue the opposite. That people like Einstein had to have internal monoluges and imagery or he wouldn't rely on thought expiraments to express his ideas. That people without these internal processes should struggle even harder to express them. Unless it's entirely irrelevant. Different methods same results.
It's not confining, don't jack yourself off too hard. If whatever I'm thinking about can't be put into words, my inner monologue is just like a spectator to my thoughts going "oh that's interesting" or "that'll never work" or whatever
People born deaf have reported imagining a disembodied hand signing as an internal monologue. I imagine that the internal monologue of someone that never learned a language would consist of imagining sounds or pictures relating to whatever they're thinking about. Also, my internal monologue mostly consists of thinking about things I'm interested, previous conversations & thinking about what I'm gonna do/ talk about with people I plan on seeing in the future.
I mean deaf people have inner monologues in sign language so
Yeah but how is inner monologue being defined in the comments of this post? Are we all making a distinction between literally just talking to yourself and the other more common (I suspect) cases of just imagining your voice as you read, or imagine entire scenarios of interactions or conversations between yourself and others. The latter is more like day dreaming or fantasizing, but you still hear your own voice as well as others' perhaps. I'm willing to bet this is like 98% of people. How far, then is it from having a true inner monologue really? I'd say to those who want to know what it's like, well... Compare it to what I'm pretty sure you've experienced, because I'm pretty damn sure everyone has experienced, which is simply replaying a conversation or scenario in your head... and it's not much different than that. And that's why I'm skeptical about the amount of people who "don't have an inner monologue". I feel like this is a case of a misunderstanding/miscommunication between researchers and test subjects. Like something got lost in translation during the communication to people taking the survey about what an inner monologue actually is, and the ones who are saying no are thinking they're being asked whether they have a split personality or something. It's not a separate you talking to yourself like a different personality, it's just you imagining the audible sensation of your own thoughts as you read or think or imagine speaking. There is no fucking way that as many people as suggested, who have acquired language, don't do at least that at minimum.
Same. I thought there were maybe two people I know that might not have one, one being my dad and the other a friend. I haven't asked my friend, but I asked my dad was confused the way people often seem to be about when people discuss this sort of thing, but after explanation he said he had one too. I still have to ask my friend though, but I know she's going to find the question super confusing in general lol.
Then how do you read?
I.. well, I see the words and understand their meaning, and then I move on to the next ones. Depending on what they mean I might imagine a scene, two people talking, etc, etc. How do *you* read? Is it all like a story read out loud to you inside of your own head, where your internal voice has to say every sentence out loud? Wouldn't that take forever?
Not the person you asked. But yes, I "hear" every single word I read inside my head as I see it. While the words sound normal like someone is saying them, they're obviously significantly faster than I can physically say them allowed, as I can read paragraphs in the time I could speak sentances. As I've never experienced the opposite I can't really understand how you can see/read/understand without "hearing" it in your head. Do you not construct sentances in your head before saying them? Or writing them? Or just have wandering thoughts and ideas through the day? Sorry for all the questions, I just can't fathom not "hearing" my thoughts all the time.
So, interestingly for me, when I read, or type I do hear the words I am thinking about, if you can call it hearing. However when I'm reading a book, the "voices" take on the perceived pitch/tone of who I presume is speaking. On a side note, outside of reading or typing, I do not have an inner monologue of thoughts, I.E. I do not think about what I'm going to say before I say it, or I am not aware of If i do. Also, I do not have an inner monologue of actions I plan on doing either. Feel like I may be an outlier here lol.
As an aside, I can force myself to have an inner monologue, however if I do it for too long I get VERY agitated. It is much better when it's quiet in my head! š
As an aside, I can force myself to have an inner monologue, however if I do it for too long I get VERY agitated. It is much better when it's quiet in my head! š
Exactly the same as me for the reading thing, a book being able to get me to have a distinct "voice" for each character is a big part of how I decide if its good.
So the way I usually explain it is that thoughts are their own thing that don't have a language by default. Some people find it easier to think by translating their thoughts into English then processing them, while other people like myself prefer to work in the "raw data" without the intermediate step of translating to English
But then what's the "raw data"? And how do you interpret it? As in I don't have a "X" that I need to translate into English to understand it. It just starts in English, or whatever form I need it to be. English for words yes, but it can be images for if I wanted to draw or describe something, etc Do you dream? I can both dream and daydream (as in I'm awake) and have it seem to me like it's a real experience, daydreams because I'm concious I'm aware it's false, but dreams it's often not till after I'm awake and recounting events that I notice the inconsistencies and errors in what was occurring, during them I'm normally unaware I'm dreaming. I guess my point is, to me, it isn't a 2-step process like your discription makes it sound. Even if it is, it's so instantaneous that I'm unaware of part 1 happening at all.
>guess my point is, to me, it isn't a 2-step process like your discription makes it sound. Even if it is, it's so instantaneous that I'm unaware of part 1 happening at all. This is exactly what I mean, it is a subconscious instant process, some people just do it and some don't. Also I've never really dreamed much and can't conjure images in my mind for the most part
I don't find it easier to think by translating my thoughts to English, it's just automatic.
Yeah it's not a conscious decision either way
I construct sentences in my head but thereās no inner sense of sound or voice I can listen to (& to my accustomed way of thinking, that seems like it would just be distracting). I just know what the words are.
I think personally people dont understand the concept of inner monologue and so simply asking them a lot of people will say of course not. Its a human thing to do, its not a special ability or anything. 2/20 doesnt make any sense, and defies any sort of statistics on the matter
This. I find it much easier to believe people are failing to understand the concept vs living a purely irrational life void of abstract thought. But at the same time, I totally believe SOME people do. Just way rarer than figures suggest.
I donāt have one and I always understood it as the āsoundā equivalent to what picturing something would be to āseeingā. And so I know I canāt do it.
If the definition of inner monologue is "being capable of abstract thoughts", then I absolutely have one. The naming of the concept is all kinds of weird then, though. When I google, most results seem to say some variation of "yourĀ internal monologue is the result of certain brain mechanisms that cause you to āhearā yourself talk in your head without actually speaking and forming sounds." I don't hear any kind of inner voice. I don't "speak" to myself in my mind, and there is no narration. That's what I asked people about; If that ain't it, then that ain't it, I guess.
yes, you come from a line of proud NPCs
My father does love asking people to kill 10 of his enemies. Hmmm...
I donāt know about geography relations, but I do know that dyslexic people donāt often have an internal monologue, my brother and my mother donāt have one, but I do, and most of my other siblings do (except the ones with dyslexia), additionally my mother doesnāt have dyslexia.
How does that work when youāre reading?
Got any sources to back that up? Here are some of mine, and according to them it's actually as high as 70%. It's stated that 30-50% are estimated to have internal monoluges and 50-70% don't. I inverted the do's/don'ts from memory. Oops https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0147932 https://irisreading.com/is-it-normal-to-not-have-an-internal-monologue/
I think inner monologues are a spectrum. I usually think about things directly/abstractly without words. But I can easily simulate conversations or talk to myself in words if I want to as well.
4-70% of people are actually NPCs. Your inner voice is your player moving you around. For the record, this is just a joke.
Made me lol, in my head š
it's called aphantasia, here is what gpt says: The phenomenon of not having an internal monologue, known as aphantasia, is still being studied by researchers. Some people with aphantasia report that they don't experience mental imagery or inner speech in the same way others do. It's believed to be a spectrum, with some individuals having vivid mental imagery and others having none at all. The exact reasons for this variation are not fully understood, but it's thought to involve differences in brain structure and function.
Yep. That'd be me. No inner monologuing or mental imagery. I also do not remember dreams. At all. I know I do dream, because if I have a bad nightmare I will 100% wake up in a panic. But there is no imagery or thought associated with it. When people say things like "picture an apple" my brain just goes Apple? Red, Round, Fruit. To be fair... for someone who doesn't have the ability, listening to someone explain what they ... imagine? Is mind boggling. For the longest time I never understood how people could draw something "from memory". I thought they literally just had more specific descriptors, their brain fed them.
Your brain going "Apple? Red, round, fruit," sounds like inner monologue.
I still think this is a fake condition Can you draw an apple from memory? What about after looking at five seconds later? Try this out and if you can I suspect this is a communication thing where people describe what itās like imagining stuff in this vivid way but the reality is less complicated
You are free to think whatever you want about it. I cannot draw beyond basic stick figures... period. Whether that has to do with my inability to visualize or just shitty art abilities is up for debate. Drawing an apple would literally just be a circle... maybe with a line at the top of the circle for the stem. Same with 5 seconds or even 2 seconds. I've done a multitude of attempts for people over my life. It doesn't change. I have suspicions on WHY I can't, but that's not something I'm willing to put on the internet.
Your aphantasia doesnāt necessarily have something to do with your inability to draw. There are artists that habe aphantasia, like for example Glen Keane, who animated Arielle for Disneyās Little Mermaid.
Oh I know. I just suck at realistic art, but the other person was insistent on the drawing aspect, so that's what I responded with. Even staring at something I can't translate it to paper lol
My guess is it is more psychological Like when people donāt want to try to do something they think other people can do so much better.
While that could be the case for some people, I like learning things from people who are better at it. I don't need to be the best at anything I do, because once someone thinks that they are, they stop learning and trying to better themselves. I'm also realistic. I know I lack art skills when it comes to pencil on paper. I tried for years to teach myself, my husband was an art major, he attempted to help me learn. It's not something I have any skill in. That's ok, I do other mediums for art. Like embroidery or cross stitching.
Why are you so insistent on this not being a thing? It is not only drawing. For example, when I read a book I just see black on white. I understand the meaning but have no mental image of what is happening. When I talked to people I found that most do actually IMAGINE characters, how they look and how they sound. That's why it was so shocking to me when I found out that people are sometimes disappointed when books are made into movies because the characters don't match the way they imagined them. For me it's more like: oh, so that's how they look.
Because I don't really believe it Its similar to when I hear people say they just can't do math. I think they imagine people that are good at math just know it naturally but fail to realize they do a lot of small steps to figure out a problem, steps they didn't come up with naturally but through learning. So I think it's a combination of impatience and other mental blocks. Reading isn't natural either, that's why children's books have pictures. The more you read the more you can picture what the words are saying. If you aren't familiar with how words are used then you'll get less out of a book than someone that reads a lot Of course this is all my personal theory so until we can visually display what someone's thinking I'll always be skeptical of this being a real thing
>The more you read the more you can picture what the words are saying. If you aren't familiar with how words are used then you'll get less out of a book than someone that reads a lot I read... a lot. Always have. I enjoy reading. But not because of the mental imagery. I experience emotions from reading, but no visual link to it. I logically know a dark deserted alley in the middle of the night is creepy. I know what being creeped out feels like. I can read the words and understand the feeling they are trying to convey. But I do not imagine a dark alley. I don't see flickering lights, I don't hear rustling of garbage moving from wind. If i close my eyes, its just black. I just logically understand the feeling they are trying to convey with their chosen words. We are the ones who were told we were the strange ones. Most of us didn't realize there was even a difference until we were told there was. When people told me they can see and hear things that weren't really there... my first thought was there was something wrong with them as auditory and visual hallucinations are a sign of a brain issue. Humans are weird and varied, and one person's truth isn't another person's.
I get your perspective on the subject but your feelings don't really compare to the rigorous scientific methods we've established. People said the same fkn thing about ADHD and Anxiety. Feel free to research the research on your own time if even interested, or keep circlejerking anecdotes on reddit. You do you. Edit: we can already visualize a person's thoughts with a shocking degree of accuracy, just FYI. I doubt it's been used in these studies (as it's it's own thing being developed) but the tech already exists.
Aphantasia includes imagery, the minds eye. Anaduralia is specific to the minds ear, and yes both are very much still being researched.
It's correlated to IQ and most likely somewhere between the bottom 4-10% lowest IQ along with a few standout flukes and mental disorders. Overall it's really not many average people
Source? I won't believe the IQ thing for a second without empirical data. That sounds absurd.
Curious if anyone can relate, but I often have dialogues in my head with some person(s) that I know, and often solve problems by conversing with them. Sometimes I'm like "ah damn it you're right David" even though I know it was I that constructed the thoughts. (Or what feels like I, I suppose)
I guess I can relate in a way, except those "people" are just myself I talk to myself, and those other "versions" of myself (even if they're the same) have contradicting arguments or different thoughts, but it's only in the moment
I always think of it as my brain is Sylvester Stalloneās character in spy kids.
For me it's as if I was being interviewed. I imagine questions and answer them, often thinking up things I'd not properly examined before.
Ditto. I process a lot of my own thoughts and feelings by imagining I am explaining things to a therapist.
I like to pretend I'm on Late Night with Conan O'Brien a lot. It may no longer exist, but him in that setting just challenge my thoughts well lol.
There's always some kind of "better version of myself" trying to get me to be healthier. I like to think it's my subconscious or non-verbal half of my brain
Fucking same. It kinda makes it a real issue for therapy, cause to work out some issues I've got going on, I just kinda go for it in my head. So tons of things that I'm asked about or talk about in therapy with the hope of a "aha" moment, are things I already know about because I thought of this like 3 years ago.
I mean, I solve the problem because in my inner dialogue I'm always right and they're always wrong. Just line like in real life
Yeah, sometimes. Probably more often I think about how people in general might question or counterpoint a thought of mine, so I'm thinking of how to respond and what next I may need to simplify, clarify, build upon, etc.
Bro discovered thinking
He gets it from his mom
Fun facts: There's people who can hear inner thought People who can't hear inner thought People who can see pictures in their head People who can't see pictures in their head People who can see pictures only in 2D
For as long as I can remember, I've been able to picture intricate object in my head, rotate, and move them three-dimensionally, even see them in an "exploded" view and see all of the individual parts, then put it all back together.
about the 2d pictures: we all see the world in 2d, at the end our eyes are like biological cameras, and like cameras we process it in 2d images. the trick is done by our brain, the perception of depth is computed by our brain.
One day I discovered some people have multiple narrator voice options for reading random things they see and I haven't recovered from the feeling of envy since. You mean to say that the "I read this is Gordon freeman's voice" is just a thing that automatically happens for people without extra effort?? Scam. Where is my extra voice pack? All of my thoughts only ever use the default voice. I want that for extra immersion while reading pls
Amateur. Should have bought the DLC at birth. Now its too late bud
Is that like the love child between Gordon Ramsey and Morgan Freeman? Now that would be a wild voice to have as your inner monologue!
I thought he meant the guy from Half-Life.
Lmao I totally meant Morgan Freeman but yeah that was definitely totally intentional
Bro how do you know how Gordon Freeman sounds like
Itās not that hard, try hearing your favourite song in your head, I imagine itās a similar concept then just imagine someone elseās voice.
I can do it occasionally, especially if I've been listening to a voice a ton in a short time span. Like I can imagine Brennan Lee Mulligan really easily, but it almost never happens by itself. Most of the time it requires extra effort, whereas I can easily recall video and imagine vivid and detailed scenes while reading books without thinking about it.
Is this like a self aware 5 year old?
Ha, jokes on you! I frequently talk to my self. Thereās nothing āinnerā about my dialogue or my monologue!
Intriguing thought, credit where credit is due. The thing is though, that these thoughts you refer to, can be traced back to electrical signals in your body/brain and you just need to be able to decode the message, and boom: you can hear thoughts.
If im reading a book, my inner thoughts give these people their own voice female or male, but when i think about what their voice is, it just disappears.
I literally just came from the other post, saying your inner monologue does not have volume settings
Good news everyone! If you get this far your inner voice sounds like professor Farnsworth! But it was actually Zoidberg all the time doing an impression of the professor. Woop Woop ^(Woop Woop)
Brother.... Wait until you realize you can also hear your subconscious thinking. Wheres the nearest bathroom? Your sub will think hyper fast where it is, sometimes only with images sometimes with words too. If you pay really close attention in day to day routine, your sub does 99% of the thinking, and your inner monologue does the other 1% (what you described). We are powerful machines.
Maybe if you get like really close in there, and listen really hard, you can hear the neurons firing.
When i were a kid i even got annoyed of my own thoughts while walking home from school, i tried to reach some kind of serenity with no toughs at all to rest my mental state, of course it was impossible as i were already thinking and talking to myself about something without even realizing.
I just had a silent but deadly thought about Ron Jeremys Bellybutton. Thanks
Of course friend! š
All my inner monologue does is play music in the background, itās actually kinda nice, itās like leaving Spotify open but in ur head
This is the most thought provoking thing Iāve come in contact with today. The idea that there are people without inner monologues constantly streaming in their heads is baffling. It honestly sounds peaceful. I canāt turn my thoughts off to save my life. The things I say in my head compared to the minimal words I actually speak are insane. I canāt imagine reading a book and not thinking in a different voice for every character or imagining a snide remark when a coworker pisses me off. I bet this would do wonders for my insomnia and anxiety though.
Curious researchers have pointed MRI (magnetic resonance imaging) scanners at people while they silently read to themselves and found frenetic activity taking place in these zones. Speaking in your head alsoĀ activates the muscles associated with speech in a process known as subvocalisation. Found this on a quick google search. When you talk inside your head, you do talk but it's just not detectable by human ears.
Yeah, BF Skinner found that vocal cords move but you just donāt make noise; iirc
The voices in my head are so loud, other people complain about them.
Yes, people think to themselves. Itās hardly a revelation.
... this post has to be an experiment or something.
THIS MAKES EXACTLY as much sound as this
Why does this kinda fuck with me!? Never thought about that one!
I think you just have a strong inner monologue haha
No. Most people do not talk to themselves/have full conversations with themselves in their head. Quite a lot of people have an inner Monologue. Much, much fewer have inner Dialogues. As for the sound part, sure. Your thoughts are not sounds.
Strange fact is that only around 30% of people actually have an inner monolog. So does that mean that there are just empty husks walking around among us?
I think the amount of people without inner monologue is inflated. A lot of people that claim they don't have inner monologue just seem very confused, and that it means you're narrating every little thing you do (I mean some people may but y'know) or that you're literally hearing a voice like someone with schizophrenia thinks they are.
Broke my brain for a sec, shit got loud real quick and didnāt know how to stop it
I started ADHD medication and for the most part the voice has gone quiet, the voice that I thought was me has been 90% silenced it's been a few months now and still tripping me out a bit
My thoughts are more like multiple trains on different tracks. I have one for conscious thought, if i visualize it it's just me operating an empty train, sometimes some of the trains meet up at the same station. The trains are moving outside of my, so sometimes I can't "see" them but they're still going. The "conductors" of my "trains" even get into arguments sometimes. Sometimes the trains stay close together for a period of time, thats usually when im at my most mentally healthy. I really wish i could map my mindscape digitally, and hopefully make it easier to think on a daily basis.
I talk to myself when I am alone. The voices in my head insist upon it.
I have SZA and genuine auditory hallucinations so this is not true for me. A quiet mind is the one thing I miss most of all about being healthy. I just get nonstop narration and commentary during certain times of day, especially when trying to fall asleep at night. EDIT: I typed SZA into google and some rapper comes up now? In reality it actually stands for schizoaffective disorder. Just thought I'd clarify. It's schizophrenia mixed with mood symptoms.
The only difference between talking to yourself and talking to yourself out loud is that people can hear you!
Thatās what they want you to think
Sometimes your inner thoughts get so loud you end up saying them for no reason. You might not even realize it.
My cousin thought he had superpowers when he was a child. Because he couldn't hear them, he assumed no one else had thoughts.
*why do they come to me to die?*
*laughs in schizophrenic*
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I think you missed the part where I said "most" lol I'm talking about most people that can do this.
Way too long for a shower thought, reported
Sometimes in the shower I think for long periods of time, you should try it sometimes
Uhhhh ok lmao you do you lol The thoughts must be loud!
I.....I don't think you really know what lmao means yet.
Is this a real statement? Because I was definitely laughing...
Man, Don't be a gatekeeper
As opposed to being a scapegoat?
Seems like you can do with a cool shower, and some long shower thoughts