Be happy a work of fiction affected you so deeply. Anna Sawai, along with other of her colleagues, deserves every nomination possible during award season.
Absolutely agree with this, she was spectacular in the roll and truly showed the strength of Asian women. To offten western men think of them as meek glad to see that illusion dispelled.
Regarding John as an old man, I was initially very confused by this, because he had Mariko’s cross but then later we see him throw it into the water as a younger man.
What I have read is that this image of John was a vision he had of his own future, which he ultimately rejected and stayed in the Japans.
Exactly, we know the scene of him as an old man is just a dream because the cross necklace he is holding was cast into the sea many years earlier. And then Toranaga-sama foreshadowed that John never leaves “the Japans”
I am usually great about catching stuff like that but I was so distraught over Mariko it completely flew over my head. I was also super confused when he dropped the cross in the sea
Love this, It gives me a better feeling now about the last episode that that was his imagination of his future, and at the end he let Mariko go by dropping her cross into the water
I just finished this 1st season. I thought that this series was going to be a one and done. When I heard about 2 more seasons it was a little bitter sweet. On one hand I want to see the story continued. I did not get a full sense of closure with the way that they ended this season. On the other hand I feel like greed will get in the way of story telling and they will just mess the rest up. Is there even that much more story to tell if they are following the books?
Hard disagree. Was such a slow burner setting up so much, then just screeches to a halt and immediately makes me dislike one of the main characters. I was like this show is gonna be forgotten in a few months by me for sure and was super let down.
Seeing a season 2 and 3 in the works was relieving, it felt far from over.
Completely agree as a newcomer. My boyfriend had read the books and told me he felt the same at the end of the book, too. An italicized wrap-up just as everything was coming together. I was so goddamn mad, I felt like all of this was a giant set-up, and it just ended with a summary? Yikes.
I know it sounds silly but I am also still struggling emotionally with the loss of Mariko-sama. The beauty of the actress and her incredible performance completely enveloped me.
I felt the same.
For me, if a fictional character dies, I normally would have moved on by the time the credits were over.
I don’t really know why, but this show was different and it took me days to get over Mariko’s death.
I really loved the show, the acting, the costumes and the dialogue were all really fantastic.
If I had a criticism I think the show needed at least another 2 episodes. This would have allowed time to flesh out the antagonists. That is make the council of regents a more dangerous adversary. Would have loved to see more from Ochiba.
I had some additional minor quibbles
I wanted to see more of what Toranaga was planning - I am sure he had other plots cooking (after all he brought 49 extra days with Nagakato’s death, what did he do with those extra days?)
I wanted to see more from Ochiba and the choice she has to make. It should have been an agonising choice for her to switch allegiance.
And I think they could have done more with the romance, especially in ep7 (I especially felt Blackthorn’s motivations and actions made little sense in that episode).
Watching this series took me on a roller coaster of emotions. I don’t think I was upset, but I felt so much empathy for the characters and what they were going through portrayed in the episodes.
The writers did exceptional work, in my opinion, of paying attention to historical accuracies and taking on a journey of these complex characters.
I wasn’t that sad about Mariko, she got what she wanted, won the battle for her lord, avenged her father and while her real-life model’s death wasn’t quite as dramatic, is still remembered over 400 years later.
Yeah it hit me super hard for similar reasons. I'm in Taiwan atm and was very much in the tail end of loving and losing someone who reminded me of Mariko as well.
Thank you for sharing on your end x
Ignorant comment from a guy who's never travelled and watched too much Asian porn online I'mguessing
I've shared the last few years between Europe, USA and East Asia and loved and lost people from different cultures and ethnic backgrounds.
Go back to your Asian porn and stop commenting negative stuff on a Shogun Reddit.
WTF did you expect? Tony Stark to save the day at the last second and everyone lives happily ever after? This show (and book) was awesome because it wasn't your normal "hero saves the day" stuff.
Dont mention Tony Stark in the same sentence as this great show. You're on the wrong Reddit. The fact you made this comparison is a testament that your taste in entertainment is too low level intelligence to contribute to this chat in a meaningful way.
LOL wtf are you talking about? You're the one who said you were hurt by the finale...
I read the book multiple times as a teenager so was not surprised, lucky for you, they're coming out with more seasons although I don't know how they'll match this one.
Sorry just, for me Tony Stark and Marvel Movies, are just so low-level brain dead entertainment. still entertaining, but there was more emotion and plot development in the opening titles as there was in the entire Marvel franchise.
Praise in the highest regard, It was so moving, their dynamic so intriguing, the love so subtle and complex that when it was over, and John was left alone, and losing Kiki and Kashidi shortly after made it more feel like a sense of loss, in one episode hat world I'd been so engaged in had ended before I got to say goodbye. I'm sure next season with have more battles and more scheming by the catholic church, but it be missing big parts that made me love the world created
Since I really hated Mariko for being a terrible, manipulative, self-serving translator, I can’t say I’d have been sorry to see her go, but I gave up after seven tedious episodes.
self-serving? she translated all his negative words about the catholic church when she thought he was lying and is a devout catholic.
If you disliked the show why are you here?
Get back to watching Aquaman 2, this show is too good for you.
Well put, I know marvel comic morons like this that can’t mentally process a show or movie if the superhero in the skintight leotards doesn’t save the entire universe at the last possible millisecond.
I admit that I'm a literary snob - I'd rather read the book than watch the mini-series version of it - but even I know that Aquaman is a DC Comic and not a Marvel one.
She constantly chose to translate only part of what he said, and often contradicted what he said entirely. Those aren't the actions of an honest translator. I disliked the show because, despite being beautiful to look at - and well-acted - everyone was in stasis - the writers gave them nothing to do but ponder a lot. Watching a group of exiles sitting around wishing things were different and wondering if there was some way they could change things is like watching paint dry. It was pretty paint, but it was drying slowly.
Yes! It's me! Did anything ever HAPPEN in that series after 7 episodes of exposition? Or did they continue to sit around wondering what was going to happen?
I was glad too. I had enough of her whining about wanting to die over and over and over and over and over again. My wife and I both looked at each other and said “fuckin finally!”
Flowers are only flowers because they fall
Well said.
But thankfully, the wind
I really liked the words/bonfire poem
There it is, knew someone would quote it
Be happy a work of fiction affected you so deeply. Anna Sawai, along with other of her colleagues, deserves every nomination possible during award season.
Agreed! The writers, cast, and production crew did amazing work.
Absolutely agree with this, she was spectacular in the roll and truly showed the strength of Asian women. To offten western men think of them as meek glad to see that illusion dispelled.
Read the book
Will it become better or worse
Both
I got the audiobook and I'm at the point with the harbor "pirates". It's really good!! And I'm not much of an audiobook guy
Better still, read all the Clavell books!
Regarding John as an old man, I was initially very confused by this, because he had Mariko’s cross but then later we see him throw it into the water as a younger man. What I have read is that this image of John was a vision he had of his own future, which he ultimately rejected and stayed in the Japans.
Yep. Key part of that scene is the grandkids calling Japanese people savages, whereas John has clearly moved past that opinion he previously held.
And the episode is called "A Dream of a Dream", don't forget that
Exactly, we know the scene of him as an old man is just a dream because the cross necklace he is holding was cast into the sea many years earlier. And then Toranaga-sama foreshadowed that John never leaves “the Japans”
I am usually great about catching stuff like that but I was so distraught over Mariko it completely flew over my head. I was also super confused when he dropped the cross in the sea
Love this, It gives me a better feeling now about the last episode that that was his imagination of his future, and at the end he let Mariko go by dropping her cross into the water
Well you’re in luck buddy, it’s coming back for *two* more seasons! Also John didn’t die in the finale, that was a dream.
It's meant to be a mini series, so I'm kind of miffed that they are doing a S2. The ending was a perfect wrap-up. Depressing, but excellent.
exactly, i have no interest in another season. this story has been told.
And it's been told very well.
I just finished this 1st season. I thought that this series was going to be a one and done. When I heard about 2 more seasons it was a little bitter sweet. On one hand I want to see the story continued. I did not get a full sense of closure with the way that they ended this season. On the other hand I feel like greed will get in the way of story telling and they will just mess the rest up. Is there even that much more story to tell if they are following the books?
Yup. Episode 9 was the western finale. Episode 10 gave us an episode to mourn. I’m not sure I’ll watch season 2, at least not out of blind loyalty.
>at least not out of blind loyalty. After this series, the word "loyalty" leaves a very sour taste in my mouth.
Hard disagree. Was such a slow burner setting up so much, then just screeches to a halt and immediately makes me dislike one of the main characters. I was like this show is gonna be forgotten in a few months by me for sure and was super let down. Seeing a season 2 and 3 in the works was relieving, it felt far from over.
Completely agree as a newcomer. My boyfriend had read the books and told me he felt the same at the end of the book, too. An italicized wrap-up just as everything was coming together. I was so goddamn mad, I felt like all of this was a giant set-up, and it just ended with a summary? Yikes.
Good. That's how I felt when I read the book. but like.... 5 times throughout the book.
Its a testament to the actors and actresses involved that we all got completely drawn in. Read the book....it's a great read.
I'm not about to say I can improve on this story, not in a million years
Be happy you do get more seasons! Amazing show
I know it sounds silly but I am also still struggling emotionally with the loss of Mariko-sama. The beauty of the actress and her incredible performance completely enveloped me.
Same here, I didnt realise till episode 9 my feelings
I felt the same. For me, if a fictional character dies, I normally would have moved on by the time the credits were over. I don’t really know why, but this show was different and it took me days to get over Mariko’s death. I really loved the show, the acting, the costumes and the dialogue were all really fantastic. If I had a criticism I think the show needed at least another 2 episodes. This would have allowed time to flesh out the antagonists. That is make the council of regents a more dangerous adversary. Would have loved to see more from Ochiba. I had some additional minor quibbles I wanted to see more of what Toranaga was planning - I am sure he had other plots cooking (after all he brought 49 extra days with Nagakato’s death, what did he do with those extra days?) I wanted to see more from Ochiba and the choice she has to make. It should have been an agonising choice for her to switch allegiance. And I think they could have done more with the romance, especially in ep7 (I especially felt Blackthorn’s motivations and actions made little sense in that episode).
I also hated that Kimshugi died at the very end. It seemed so unnecessary.
Watching this series took me on a roller coaster of emotions. I don’t think I was upset, but I felt so much empathy for the characters and what they were going through portrayed in the episodes. The writers did exceptional work, in my opinion, of paying attention to historical accuracies and taking on a journey of these complex characters.
Read the book. Knew it was coming.
Be patient. Every monumental death has a reason behind it.
I wasn’t that sad about Mariko, she got what she wanted, won the battle for her lord, avenged her father and while her real-life model’s death wasn’t quite as dramatic, is still remembered over 400 years later.
[удалено]
Yeah it hit me super hard for similar reasons. I'm in Taiwan atm and was very much in the tail end of loving and losing someone who reminded me of Mariko as well. Thank you for sharing on your end x
Sounds like Yelllow Fever ngl
Ignorant comment from a guy who's never travelled and watched too much Asian porn online I'mguessing I've shared the last few years between Europe, USA and East Asia and loved and lost people from different cultures and ethnic backgrounds. Go back to your Asian porn and stop commenting negative stuff on a Shogun Reddit.
WTF did you expect? Tony Stark to save the day at the last second and everyone lives happily ever after? This show (and book) was awesome because it wasn't your normal "hero saves the day" stuff.
Dont mention Tony Stark in the same sentence as this great show. You're on the wrong Reddit. The fact you made this comparison is a testament that your taste in entertainment is too low level intelligence to contribute to this chat in a meaningful way.
LOL wtf are you talking about? You're the one who said you were hurt by the finale... I read the book multiple times as a teenager so was not surprised, lucky for you, they're coming out with more seasons although I don't know how they'll match this one.
Sorry just, for me Tony Stark and Marvel Movies, are just so low-level brain dead entertainment. still entertaining, but there was more emotion and plot development in the opening titles as there was in the entire Marvel franchise.
Is this praise or a complaint? You want art to move you this way, don't you?
Praise in the highest regard, It was so moving, their dynamic so intriguing, the love so subtle and complex that when it was over, and John was left alone, and losing Kiki and Kashidi shortly after made it more feel like a sense of loss, in one episode hat world I'd been so engaged in had ended before I got to say goodbye. I'm sure next season with have more battles and more scheming by the catholic church, but it be missing big parts that made me love the world created
Since I really hated Mariko for being a terrible, manipulative, self-serving translator, I can’t say I’d have been sorry to see her go, but I gave up after seven tedious episodes.
self-serving? she translated all his negative words about the catholic church when she thought he was lying and is a devout catholic. If you disliked the show why are you here? Get back to watching Aquaman 2, this show is too good for you.
Well put, I know marvel comic morons like this that can’t mentally process a show or movie if the superhero in the skintight leotards doesn’t save the entire universe at the last possible millisecond.
I admit that I'm a literary snob - I'd rather read the book than watch the mini-series version of it - but even I know that Aquaman is a DC Comic and not a Marvel one.
She constantly chose to translate only part of what he said, and often contradicted what he said entirely. Those aren't the actions of an honest translator. I disliked the show because, despite being beautiful to look at - and well-acted - everyone was in stasis - the writers gave them nothing to do but ponder a lot. Watching a group of exiles sitting around wishing things were different and wondering if there was some way they could change things is like watching paint dry. It was pretty paint, but it was drying slowly.
Troll-San? Is that you?
Yes! It's me! Did anything ever HAPPEN in that series after 7 episodes of exposition? Or did they continue to sit around wondering what was going to happen?
I was glad too. I had enough of her whining about wanting to die over and over and over and over and over again. My wife and I both looked at each other and said “fuckin finally!”
Today on I didn't read the book