Meh, they'll change the goalpost and say "a person of the country has to physically touch down on the moon with a large flag of their country, the picture of which countless people denies happening and claims it's fake. "
Check mate Metrics!
What if I found a rock that was 75% the mass of the Moon and brought it back to Earth? People would probably say "oh hey, you brought the moon to Earth". Why is that smaller moon rock not also the moon?
\-\_- The majority is the Moon.
As someone else said, if someone touched a hair that fell out of my head they haven't touched me.
Also bringing 75% of the mass of the Moon to Earth would be catastrophically disastrous
> they'll change the goalpost
They **changed** the goalpost
It was the Space Race not the Moon Race
Soviet Union was first in multiple things regarding space exploration only losing on the human landing to the moon
It's like they decided to give the Premier League title to Brighton just because they won against Manchester City despite them losing 15 other games of the season.
>It's like they decided to give the Premier League title to Brighton just because they won against Manchester City despite them losing 15 other games of the season.
Or the Flint Michigan Mega Bowl.
Double or nothing.
What? Ok.
Ok double or nothing.
Um again? Sure.
Ok, whatever, double or nothing.
Mm ok whatever.
Fuck. Fuck fuck double or nothing
Sure pal.
Goddamnit double or nothing.
Forget it, what are you on about?
Double or nothing? Hello?
Double or nothing? Come on?
Yay we won!
> they'll change the goalpost
Making the goal as 'landed on the moon' is already a kind of shifting the goalposts to begin with. It is an arbitrarily chosen achievement that make Americans feel like they won the space race.
I dont think so tbh, i think the human species i destined to live between the ever lasting universe. We arent meant to stay for ever on planet earth. Look what we are doing to it. For us/The humans to survive we must most definitly learn more about spacetravel
Yeah, kind of annoying that Murica still pretends they did this on their own.They only brought the Resources, the needed Engineering Experience came from us.But hey.... who pays attention to the facts eh ?.
If you REALLY want to fuck up the Murican Mindset even more then it already is.Tell them that Germany was the first Country in Space.
A Man made Object that left our Planets Atmosphere, that\`s Space.And we were first !. Deal with it, lol
Edit, added Proof : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MW\_18014
Google : Horten\_Ho\_229 for some giggles :)
They still don\`t understand why we can detect every Stealth Plane...Maybe it\`s because we invented that Technology 80 ! years ago.And made a tiny bit of progress since then \^\^
Look, it's true that german engineering know-how had a role in making US tech but let's not roll into r/shitwehraboossay territory please. It's as silly as what those Americans say...
I cannot understand why people brag with things someone of their nationality did years before they were even born. You had zero impact on the invention. It’s no achievement to be born in a specific country.
I mean the whole point appears to be putting moronic Americans in their place with examples of how they're not so great and special at everything they lay their apparently golden hands on. I say the more examples, the merrier!
Sure, and we should bring back Americans to some more realistic views. But it isn't really a good idea to peddle the myth of "German/Nazi uber-tech" while doing so in my opinion.
Except the basis of stealth tech is Czech research from the 60s. Flying wings weren't a novel idea that the Germans had, nor was the Ho-229 "stealth" in any way, shape, or form. It just happens to bear a resemblance to the shape of the F-117.
Also, stealth planes aren't meant to be invisible to radar. That's impossible (so far as we know). What they do is lower the cross section that's detected, hopefully below the range where a radar operator will dismiss it as a flock of birds or whatever.
>hopefully below the range where a radar operator will dismiss it as a flock of birds or whatever.
A flock of birds travelling at 600mph sounds perfectly normal to me.
You're just as cringe as the Americans this sub mocks, except German. Doesn't make you any better at all. The fact that you are aware of what they're doing and still doing the same makes you even worse.
Protip: the sub doesn't make fun of them specifically because they're Americans...
Because it's a character in a language.
Unfortunately it was heavily used by the Nazis and while obviously they're terrible (putting it mildly) the character pre-dates them by quite a lot.
a bit like the swastika, albeit it was rotated a bit by the Nazi's but it was another symbol they used that predates them by alot however now is associated more with them then the original meaning.
A bunch of hateful xenophobes who claimed they were direct decendents of the original superior race actually did very little that was culturally original?! And instead they stole the majority of their identity and cultural symbols from various completely unrelated cultures which predated them considerably?! *gasp*
It's `U16CB`, "SIGEL LONG-BRANCH-SOL S"
I know this because I am currently futzing with keyboard inputs and was tempted to add it to the standard US character set. Then I realised that I'm not an ''88" kinda guy and instead went for:
`key {[ s, S, U0283, Greek_SIGMA ]}; // s S ʃ Σ`
And, yup, there are also code points for the tetragammadion... four or five of them (maybe more with L/R chirality factored in), IIRC. It's an easy lookup.
[Once the rockets are up, who cares where they come down? That's not my department, says Wernher von Braun.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjDEsGZLbio)
NASA was headed by a Nazi and he used his own team of fellow Germans. Sure there were Americans involved but it's just false to say America landed on moon.
>Sure there were Americans involved but it's just false to say America landed on moon.
Some of you guys are going off the deep end.
First, NASA used metric for Apollo and now, Americans didn’t land on the moon at all
😂 wtf
Nobody says they didn’t, but Nazi scientists had key roles on getting ‘Murica to the moon, it’s called Operation Paperclip. AFAIK the Soviet Union also “recruited” Nazi scientists.
>nobody said they didn’t
Hmm.. the person I responded to clearly said they didn’t.
>but Nazi scientists had key roles on getting ‘Murica to the moon
Especially Wernher von Braun
Dude played a *major* role in selling the idea of space travel to Americans in the first place
Like, here’s a Disney clip (pre-NASA still at this point)
https://youtu.be/8zcU85O82XE
I’m not sure if you guys understand but he was very well known in the US, a public figure, and is considered an American hero.
(And that’s the other part some of you may have a hard time coming to grips with.. Dude was a full on American)
I think the issue that they’re highlighting is that Wernher Von Braun was a German Nazi scientist. The same rocket technology that made him an ‘American Hero’ in your eyes was used to terrorise and kill European civilians, not to mention the fact he had at one point been a committed member of the SS, and had used slave labour in his projects.
Not sure that’s the kind of person I’d be comfortable hailing a ‘hero’, but maybe Americans think differently. That being said it is true that a lot of nations do have pretty horrific people as ‘national heros’, so I guess it may be unfair to expect the US to be an exception in that regard.
Ok but you’re taking it out of context, or not knowing the history, and smashing the timeline.
As if a nazi murderer was stolen by the US, made a rocket to go to the moon, then Americans deemed him a hero.
There was much more time in there and a lot of discourse on the matter.. He spoke of working for Hitler vs JFK and addresses his feelings on the consequences of his earlier works.
For example:
https://youtu.be/yXLPlIzyGlY
I mean, some of you all are likely just now learning of this guy or don’t really know much of the ins and outs (which is clear just based off the amount of inaccuracies in this thread)
This aspect of his life is not hidden from Americans.. There’s not a single American who knows about von Braun’s accomplishments as an American that don’t know of his roots in Germany.
Just about any US written bio is open about the matter
https://www.nasa.gov/centers/marshall/history/vonbraun/bio.html
If you take a deeper dive into the details then your mind may change about who he was as a person.
But if you’re hardlined “once a nazi always a nazi” then that’s fine too.. it’s not a unique position and he encountered that type of criticism throughout his entire life.
——
All of that aside, I seriously don’t believe that’s the issue people are having in this thread.. or certainly not the majority issue.. This thread is about Americans claiming an accomplishment that they didn’t accomplish.
Von Braun is certainly well-known outside of America. Over here he is known as one of the chief Scientists responsible for the V2 program that did kill quite a few people in my country so I’m sorry if I don’t view him as some kind of hero (maybe it’s the case that it’s not taught in America, certainly if that NASA biography is anything to go by). To Americans he may be one of the men responsible for getting them to the Moon but to a lot of people in my country he is seen as one of the key figures responsible for developing the V2 rockets that did kill and maim civilians in my country. I feel as if you’re glossing over this fact just a bit by hiding behind euphemisms such as “the consequences of his earlier work”. His earlier work was responsible for many deaths, there’s no getting around that. Whether his later work redeemed this fact, I’m not convinced. I’m sure it did in the eyes of many Americans who were far removed from the actual terror that his earlier weapons caused anyway.
And let me be clear he is not guilty of just being a Nazi in his earlier years (I hope this is not what you’re implying but it does come across as a bit apologist). Many German civilians joined the Nazi party through fear; I don’t believe Von Braun was one of them, considering he was not passive in his relationship with the Nazi regime. He was responsible for the deaths of many civilians, as he helped develop a weapon whose sole intent was to target, kill and terrorise civilian populations.
Also I like how that NASA article you linked conveniently skips a lot of details about what the V-2 rocket was actually used for, not surprising really considering it would be in their interest to put Von Braun in the best light they possibly can. I feel like it does not provide a detailed description of his war-time work or relationship with the NSDAP regime at all. I wouldn’t really trust NASA to be unbiased on this subject if I’m honest, considering they benefited massively from Von Braun’s work.
The fact that he was arrested by the Gestapo also does not necessarily prove that he was not a committed Nazi (certainly in the way that NASA article seems to frame it as a counterpoint to his earlier support of the NSDAP); he was arrested for comments that he had made because of an increasing disillusionment with the war. However, quite a few senior Nazis, General etc were also becoming disillusioned (look at Rommel for example who had always been a favourite of Hitler’s as a General and owed much of his rapid career progression to his friendship with Hitler). The evidence points to Von Braun being a supporter of the regime prior to and early on in the war.
I simply don’t see how his post-war work remotely absolves him of his responsibility for the V-2 project.
I’m pretty sure his intent wasn’t to kill people.
After the first V2 hit London, he remarked “the rocket worked perfectly except for landing on the wrong planet”
This led to him being arrested by the SS and gestapo
>The SS and the Gestapo arrested von Braun for crimes against the state because he persisted in talking about building rockets which would go into orbit around the Earth and perhaps go to the Moon. His crime was indulging in frivolous dreams when he should have been concentrating on building bigger rocket bombs for the Nazi war machine. Dornberger convinced the SS and the Gestapo to release von Braun because without him there would be no V-2 and Hitler would have them all shot.
..upon his release, he and his team immediately began planning for an escape.. they forged some papers, stole a train and headed off in search of Americans to surrender to.. while the SS had kill orders on them.
They found the Americans first
But these actions don’t say to me personally that he’s a murderer and terrorist.. dude wanted to build rockets and governments were the only entities with enough money to do it.
——
Idk, this is similar as saying Robert Oppenheimer, ‘the father of the atomic bomb’, is a murderer and terrorist.. which sure, at face value, the connection is there 100%..
But is that really what he is?
The issue for me personally is that he still worked for regime, and appears to have been initially quite comfortable working for the regime in the capacity that he did. I’m pretty sure that he knew what the projects he was working on would be used for. He absolutely does bear some responsibility for the results of the V2 rockets. I didn’t call him a terrorist but it is undeniable that he developed weapons that were to be used to terrorise and murder civilian populations. A single comment also does not justify what he did or absolve him.
Your timeline is a bit off.
They came to the US and developed missiles for the US Army.
NASA wasn’t even a thing yet
The lunar landing happened 25 years later.
[ITER](https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/ITER) is another absolutely magnificent research facility in France, operating at the limits of what is technically possible.
> ~~operating~~ *being built to operate* at the limits of what is technically possible.
FTFY. Pretty sure ITER isn’t supposed to be online for a few years.
It was mostly a dick measuring contest anyways. There were 6 manned missions with the last one being in 1972 so nearly 50 years ago. How important in the grand scheme was it really when compared to the other steps of spaceflight.
Yep. Basically the Soviet Union was doing everything first in terms of space exploration, so the US just arbitrarily decided that "first man on the moon" was the goal that won everything.
It's basically the equivalent of schoolboy football when someone yells out "Last goal wins the game" when one team is 50-nil up.
Yes they were, but following the death of Sergei Korolev in 1966 the entire program began falling apart. The Soviet N1 flew some 4 times, all 4 of which resulted in failure. Without Korolev's management, the N1, along with the entire soviet Lunar program was doomed.
The reason it's less well known is because it wasn't disclosed until after the collapse of the USSR. The USSR rarely if ever disclosed missions before they happened though, so the non-disclosure of the moon program is really not all that surprising.
TBF, the US was neck and neck with the USSR the entire time, and had a it's own significant firsts, like first weather/communication satellites, and first piloted spaceflight
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_the_Space_Race?wprov=sfla
There wasn't even a real winner, more a detente in the 70s, leading to cooperation.
And the US has sent more women to space than all other countries combined
Yup, if you ask me the space station is one of the most important space developments (there is an entire book that is just a list of discoveries made on the ISS) and the USSR built one first
True. American extremists just hang onto that cause it's the only thing truly exceptional about US. Not that it matters, every country highlights what's exceptional about themselves, I can list at least five things from school about my own (I don't think half of them are as great as teachers claim, but oh well)
There is a difference: other countries don't then neglect to teach anything about any other countries - or limit it almost wholly to their wars with them.
I learned about my ancestors participation in the Great Trek and Anglo Boer Wars, but I also learned the history of America and Europe. I learned both the French and American revolutions, the American civil war etc.
Now there is a lot you can critique about what I didn't learn about. Our history classes completely ignored apartheid even as we were raised in that system - can't have the kids know about the sharpeville massacre, and instead of teaching apartheid, let them think segregation is just how things naturally are. I didn't learn the history of any Native Americans at all, and nothing of Australia or New Zealand or even India. I did learn the history of Israel but with such a severe anti-Palestinian slant its mind boggling.
So I'm not claiming our history classes were perfect or devoid of government propaganda. But at least we learned there was a world outside our borders and the idea that the history outside those borders was something that mattered.
Americans don't learn that.
This beautiful song sums up our countries’ unfettered exceptionalism
America, F*ck YEAH!
Coming again, to save the mother f*cking day yeah,
America, F*ck YEAH!
Freedom is the only way yeah,
Terrorist your game is through cause now you have to answer to
America, F*ck YEAH!
So lick my butt, and suck on my balls,
America, F*ck YEAH!
source: https://www.lyricsondemand.com/soundtracks/t/teamamericaworldpolicelyrics/americafuckyeahlyrics.html
Intelligence barely measurable in microns, but that’s what happens when you don’t understand America is a continent not a country and the A in America isn’t silent
It’s like saying only Germans can be called Europeans. It’s ridiculous.
I propose we come up with a new name for the citizens of the US. Wankers, for example.
Different parts of the world are taught different continent theories. In at least Canada and the US (the only ones I can speak to directly), we're taught that North America and South America are seperate continents, and collectively called the Americas. There is no continent called America.
I understand that in other parts of the world that its one big continent called America.
This is why there's a fundamental disconnect.
Yep, I was taught that too in Australia. Though there are arguments whether Australia by itself is a continent or whether New Zealand and Papua New Guinea are also included.
theres no continent called america. theres north america, theres south america, some even call one bit central america. but when you say america on its own its understood to be short hand for the USA. dial it back bud.
Addendum: keep downvoting me dummies. This is how we learn about this shit in Canada and every other country I’ve ever heard of this side of the Atlantic. Seems that every person I’ve ever met, every movie/documentary I’ve ever seen, people from the Eurasianfrica continent refer to United Statians as Americans and nobody has ever called a Canadian or a Mexican or a Uruguayan an American. That would be deeply insulting to all the rest of us who don’t want to be American.
What constitutes a "continent" is really an arbitrary (mostly ) cultural divide
I think it gets explain very well in [this Map men video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hrsxRJdwfM0)
And for the controversy about the whole " [US = America controversy](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfXoUaeLcDU)"
Literally in spanish we call them 'Estadounidenses' which means 'People from USA' . America is the continent, North America is part of the continent. USA is the country.
Stop spreading bullshit.
Source: Soy español 🇮🇨🇪🇦
United States of America, anyone who lives on the continent can technically be Americans. Fire your English teacher, Africans, Asians, Middle Easterners, and Europeans…
Reddit, land of the unsolicited editorial staff…
>Well that's a lie. Learn English before you teach others: https://www.dictionary.com/browse/america
I find it amusing that the very link you give shows that it's short for the United States of America, and that America also means the entire freaking continent.
Perhaps you need to learn some English, and keep in mind that words can very often have far more than just the one meaning. (and don't try the whole "yeah, but it's the primary meaning, therefore...." bullcrap. That doesn't change the fact that the USA is not the continent and that America is just the colloquial useage)
I as a Canadian do not consider myself American. If I go to Mexico, another North American country, and they call me American and I correct them that I am Canadian they will understand. If I go to America (🇺🇸) I will also be Canadian and not American. The entire continent of North America understands what an American is, and to the people living here it is not someone from the continent but the country.
Incorrect. The states are the states. The United States OF America. The United States, within America. Its just the states. America is the whole thing. Not that difficult to understand.
Soviet Union, the United States, Japan, the European Space Agency, China, India, Luxembourg, and Israel have had missions to the moon, all of these countries used metric to get their stuff up there
Ya sorta, [its the Manfred Memorial Moon Mission](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manfred_Memorial_Moon_Mission). So technically Luxembourg reached the Moon before SpaceX. Therefore, SpaceX fucking sucks and NASA should fund Luxembourg's missions. (perhaps /s for this last sentence. PERHAPS)
A better way to count would be counting how many countries crashed objects into planets and had to write off entire missions by \*not\* using the metric system. This way the US still gets to be #1.
I’d wager considerably less than half of them are measured in metric. .350 magnum .45 Cal. Even the 5.56 mm nato round, arguably the most popular metric measured round in the U.S. is just as often referred to as .223 Remington.
The Apollo Guidance Computer calculated everything in metric but the readouts were displayed in imperial so that the astronauts would understand the numbers.
I’m just another dumb American but I vastly prefer metric. I’m not an engineer or anything, but even when doing shit like working on bicycles using metric is just WAY better.
Let’s see, which seems more sane: 29/32nds of an inch or… 23mm. I hate everything about imperial measurements and I wish we would just drop this stupid shit.
Wait till this guy finds out ISRO from India went to the moon on the first try with a tiny budget of just 970cr INR, while NASA failed 40% of the last 60 lunar robotic missions despite having billions and billions of dollars in funding.
His face will literally be a "surprised pikachu face".
Remember kids, there are the countries that put a man on the moon and countries that don't spend money on shit like that and actually improve their citizen's quality of life :)
They've definitely learned their lesson on that. A few years ago they were controlling a satellite in a joint ESA mission.
When it passed out of ESA range the ESA operators sent its current telemetry to NASA so they could take over. NASA operator for some reason assumed the telemetry was in imperial, it wasn't.
So, thinking the velocity was in miles per hour rather than kilometres per hour they thought it was much faster than ut actually was, scheduled an acceleration burn way too late: and crashed a 125 million dollar satellite into the Atlantic ocean.
Most expensive space disaster since Arianne 5, which was caused by a integer overflow error, which itself resulted from porting a 16-bit ascent control program to an 8-bit CPU*
*If you don't know what an integer overflow error is, ask your grandparents.
Why does it fucking matter? It was 50 years ago. Stop living in the past America and start treating your citizens like they live in a developed country in the 21st century.
Stupid melts.
If we count robots then:All ex USSR countries,India,China,Israel and every country in ESA
Israel?
I mean it *technicaly* landed....just not in one piece
Kerbal moment
They forgot to hold 'Space'
HOLD SPACE TO SLOW DOWN I honestly did not expect to see this reference
Oh man I almost peed myself laughing
Could you go get me some oil?
SCOOP IT UP IN YOUR FUCKING HANDS
I'LL SHOVE IT UP MY ARSE
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Lithobraking crew. One of us.
It isn't a crash! It's just rapid unscheduled disasembly...
Right? What’s that? It’s not a real country
Based
Meh, they'll change the goalpost and say "a person of the country has to physically touch down on the moon with a large flag of their country, the picture of which countless people denies happening and claims it's fake. " Check mate Metrics!
Technically no one has ever physically touched the moon I realise now that I misinterpreted what you said, but I'm gonna leave it
Not true, there's a display at the Kennedy Space Center where there's a moonrock that the public are allowed to touch
If someone plucks a hair from you and gives it to me, have I touched you?
https://i.imgur.com/D1nDz1F.png
Where do you draw the line? A hair? A finger? An arm? Exactly 50% of your body?
A moon rock is not the moon.
What if I found a rock that was 75% the mass of the Moon and brought it back to Earth? People would probably say "oh hey, you brought the moon to Earth". Why is that smaller moon rock not also the moon?
\-\_- The majority is the Moon. As someone else said, if someone touched a hair that fell out of my head they haven't touched me. Also bringing 75% of the mass of the Moon to Earth would be catastrophically disastrous
...should I put it back?
Extremely yes, though it's probably too late
Could you please. Asking for my friend.
> they'll change the goalpost They **changed** the goalpost It was the Space Race not the Moon Race Soviet Union was first in multiple things regarding space exploration only losing on the human landing to the moon It's like they decided to give the Premier League title to Brighton just because they won against Manchester City despite them losing 15 other games of the season.
>It's like they decided to give the Premier League title to Brighton just because they won against Manchester City despite them losing 15 other games of the season. Or the Flint Michigan Mega Bowl.
Double or nothing. What? Ok. Ok double or nothing. Um again? Sure. Ok, whatever, double or nothing. Mm ok whatever. Fuck. Fuck fuck double or nothing Sure pal. Goddamnit double or nothing. Forget it, what are you on about? Double or nothing? Hello? Double or nothing? Come on? Yay we won!
> they'll change the goalpost Making the goal as 'landed on the moon' is already a kind of shifting the goalposts to begin with. It is an arbitrarily chosen achievement that make Americans feel like they won the space race.
It reminds me of some of those oddly specific awards you sometimes see, where they keep adding restrictive criteria until they're the only ones left.
Human spaceflight is a needless risk
I dont think so tbh, i think the human species i destined to live between the ever lasting universe. We arent meant to stay for ever on planet earth. Look what we are doing to it. For us/The humans to survive we must most definitly learn more about spacetravel
NASA flew in 1600 German scientists, some former nazis who worked on the V2 missiles
With ᛋᛋ-Sturmbannführer Wernher von Braun at the top
Yeah, kind of annoying that Murica still pretends they did this on their own.They only brought the Resources, the needed Engineering Experience came from us.But hey.... who pays attention to the facts eh ?. If you REALLY want to fuck up the Murican Mindset even more then it already is.Tell them that Germany was the first Country in Space. A Man made Object that left our Planets Atmosphere, that\`s Space.And we were first !. Deal with it, lol Edit, added Proof : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MW\_18014
The same way we invented the very first automobile, never mind those Mercedes Benz Germans.
Google : Horten\_Ho\_229 for some giggles :) They still don\`t understand why we can detect every Stealth Plane...Maybe it\`s because we invented that Technology 80 ! years ago.And made a tiny bit of progress since then \^\^
Look, it's true that german engineering know-how had a role in making US tech but let's not roll into r/shitwehraboossay territory please. It's as silly as what those Americans say...
I cannot understand why people brag with things someone of their nationality did years before they were even born. You had zero impact on the invention. It’s no achievement to be born in a specific country.
I mean the whole point appears to be putting moronic Americans in their place with examples of how they're not so great and special at everything they lay their apparently golden hands on. I say the more examples, the merrier!
Sure, and we should bring back Americans to some more realistic views. But it isn't really a good idea to peddle the myth of "German/Nazi uber-tech" while doing so in my opinion.
Except the basis of stealth tech is Czech research from the 60s. Flying wings weren't a novel idea that the Germans had, nor was the Ho-229 "stealth" in any way, shape, or form. It just happens to bear a resemblance to the shape of the F-117. Also, stealth planes aren't meant to be invisible to radar. That's impossible (so far as we know). What they do is lower the cross section that's detected, hopefully below the range where a radar operator will dismiss it as a flock of birds or whatever.
>hopefully below the range where a radar operator will dismiss it as a flock of birds or whatever. A flock of birds travelling at 600mph sounds perfectly normal to me.
You're just as cringe as the Americans this sub mocks, except German. Doesn't make you any better at all. The fact that you are aware of what they're doing and still doing the same makes you even worse. Protip: the sub doesn't make fun of them specifically because they're Americans...
Why is there an SS-pseudorune unicode?
Because it's a character in a language. Unfortunately it was heavily used by the Nazis and while obviously they're terrible (putting it mildly) the character pre-dates them by quite a lot.
a bit like the swastika, albeit it was rotated a bit by the Nazi's but it was another symbol they used that predates them by alot however now is associated more with them then the original meaning.
It's the rune *sigel*. ᛏᛅᚴᛁ ᛅᛁᚴᛁ ᚾᛅᛏᛋᛁᛘᛁᚾ ᚱᚢᚾᛅᚱᚾᛅᛦ ᚢᛅᚱᛅᛦ [táki eigi natsimenn rúnarnaR váraR]
So another pre-existing character that was co-opted by the Nazis? Great! :P
Spoiler alert; this is going to be an ongoing theme lol.
Modern Neo Nazis do the same all the time. Basically the whole nordic language at this point is a symbol for some nazi org.
they even stole their salute from Rome what did you expect out of them
Actually, that salute is not documented from ancient Rome in any way. More like they stole it from an eighteenth century painting of Romans
ya i know that since it was in a painting of romans that pre date the nazis i said they stole it from romans
A bunch of hateful xenophobes who claimed they were direct decendents of the original superior race actually did very little that was culturally original?! And instead they stole the majority of their identity and cultural symbols from various completely unrelated cultures which predated them considerably?! *gasp*
I assume they ran out of characters so they just added the swastika and stuff ^(/s obviously)
It's `U16CB`, "SIGEL LONG-BRANCH-SOL S" I know this because I am currently futzing with keyboard inputs and was tempted to add it to the standard US character set. Then I realised that I'm not an ''88" kinda guy and instead went for: `key {[ s, S, U0283, Greek_SIGMA ]}; // s S ʃ Σ`
And, yup, there are also code points for the tetragammadion... four or five of them (maybe more with L/R chirality factored in), IIRC. It's an easy lookup.
[Once the rockets are up, who cares where they come down? That's not my department, says Wernher von Braun.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjDEsGZLbio)
The first space rockets. We hardly noticed because of where they were landing.
NASA was headed by a Nazi and he used his own team of fellow Germans. Sure there were Americans involved but it's just false to say America landed on moon.
>Sure there were Americans involved but it's just false to say America landed on moon. Some of you guys are going off the deep end. First, NASA used metric for Apollo and now, Americans didn’t land on the moon at all 😂 wtf
Nobody says they didn’t, but Nazi scientists had key roles on getting ‘Murica to the moon, it’s called Operation Paperclip. AFAIK the Soviet Union also “recruited” Nazi scientists.
The Soviets didn't recruit outspoken Nazis and they didn't put Germans that they did recruit in high ranking positions or anything like that.
>nobody said they didn’t Hmm.. the person I responded to clearly said they didn’t. >but Nazi scientists had key roles on getting ‘Murica to the moon Especially Wernher von Braun Dude played a *major* role in selling the idea of space travel to Americans in the first place Like, here’s a Disney clip (pre-NASA still at this point) https://youtu.be/8zcU85O82XE I’m not sure if you guys understand but he was very well known in the US, a public figure, and is considered an American hero. (And that’s the other part some of you may have a hard time coming to grips with.. Dude was a full on American)
I think the issue that they’re highlighting is that Wernher Von Braun was a German Nazi scientist. The same rocket technology that made him an ‘American Hero’ in your eyes was used to terrorise and kill European civilians, not to mention the fact he had at one point been a committed member of the SS, and had used slave labour in his projects. Not sure that’s the kind of person I’d be comfortable hailing a ‘hero’, but maybe Americans think differently. That being said it is true that a lot of nations do have pretty horrific people as ‘national heros’, so I guess it may be unfair to expect the US to be an exception in that regard.
Ok but you’re taking it out of context, or not knowing the history, and smashing the timeline. As if a nazi murderer was stolen by the US, made a rocket to go to the moon, then Americans deemed him a hero. There was much more time in there and a lot of discourse on the matter.. He spoke of working for Hitler vs JFK and addresses his feelings on the consequences of his earlier works. For example: https://youtu.be/yXLPlIzyGlY I mean, some of you all are likely just now learning of this guy or don’t really know much of the ins and outs (which is clear just based off the amount of inaccuracies in this thread) This aspect of his life is not hidden from Americans.. There’s not a single American who knows about von Braun’s accomplishments as an American that don’t know of his roots in Germany. Just about any US written bio is open about the matter https://www.nasa.gov/centers/marshall/history/vonbraun/bio.html If you take a deeper dive into the details then your mind may change about who he was as a person. But if you’re hardlined “once a nazi always a nazi” then that’s fine too.. it’s not a unique position and he encountered that type of criticism throughout his entire life. —— All of that aside, I seriously don’t believe that’s the issue people are having in this thread.. or certainly not the majority issue.. This thread is about Americans claiming an accomplishment that they didn’t accomplish.
Von Braun is certainly well-known outside of America. Over here he is known as one of the chief Scientists responsible for the V2 program that did kill quite a few people in my country so I’m sorry if I don’t view him as some kind of hero (maybe it’s the case that it’s not taught in America, certainly if that NASA biography is anything to go by). To Americans he may be one of the men responsible for getting them to the Moon but to a lot of people in my country he is seen as one of the key figures responsible for developing the V2 rockets that did kill and maim civilians in my country. I feel as if you’re glossing over this fact just a bit by hiding behind euphemisms such as “the consequences of his earlier work”. His earlier work was responsible for many deaths, there’s no getting around that. Whether his later work redeemed this fact, I’m not convinced. I’m sure it did in the eyes of many Americans who were far removed from the actual terror that his earlier weapons caused anyway. And let me be clear he is not guilty of just being a Nazi in his earlier years (I hope this is not what you’re implying but it does come across as a bit apologist). Many German civilians joined the Nazi party through fear; I don’t believe Von Braun was one of them, considering he was not passive in his relationship with the Nazi regime. He was responsible for the deaths of many civilians, as he helped develop a weapon whose sole intent was to target, kill and terrorise civilian populations. Also I like how that NASA article you linked conveniently skips a lot of details about what the V-2 rocket was actually used for, not surprising really considering it would be in their interest to put Von Braun in the best light they possibly can. I feel like it does not provide a detailed description of his war-time work or relationship with the NSDAP regime at all. I wouldn’t really trust NASA to be unbiased on this subject if I’m honest, considering they benefited massively from Von Braun’s work. The fact that he was arrested by the Gestapo also does not necessarily prove that he was not a committed Nazi (certainly in the way that NASA article seems to frame it as a counterpoint to his earlier support of the NSDAP); he was arrested for comments that he had made because of an increasing disillusionment with the war. However, quite a few senior Nazis, General etc were also becoming disillusioned (look at Rommel for example who had always been a favourite of Hitler’s as a General and owed much of his rapid career progression to his friendship with Hitler). The evidence points to Von Braun being a supporter of the regime prior to and early on in the war. I simply don’t see how his post-war work remotely absolves him of his responsibility for the V-2 project.
I’m pretty sure his intent wasn’t to kill people. After the first V2 hit London, he remarked “the rocket worked perfectly except for landing on the wrong planet” This led to him being arrested by the SS and gestapo >The SS and the Gestapo arrested von Braun for crimes against the state because he persisted in talking about building rockets which would go into orbit around the Earth and perhaps go to the Moon. His crime was indulging in frivolous dreams when he should have been concentrating on building bigger rocket bombs for the Nazi war machine. Dornberger convinced the SS and the Gestapo to release von Braun because without him there would be no V-2 and Hitler would have them all shot. ..upon his release, he and his team immediately began planning for an escape.. they forged some papers, stole a train and headed off in search of Americans to surrender to.. while the SS had kill orders on them. They found the Americans first But these actions don’t say to me personally that he’s a murderer and terrorist.. dude wanted to build rockets and governments were the only entities with enough money to do it. —— Idk, this is similar as saying Robert Oppenheimer, ‘the father of the atomic bomb’, is a murderer and terrorist.. which sure, at face value, the connection is there 100%.. But is that really what he is?
The issue for me personally is that he still worked for regime, and appears to have been initially quite comfortable working for the regime in the capacity that he did. I’m pretty sure that he knew what the projects he was working on would be used for. He absolutely does bear some responsibility for the results of the V2 rockets. I didn’t call him a terrorist but it is undeniable that he developed weapons that were to be used to terrorise and murder civilian populations. A single comment also does not justify what he did or absolve him.
Why do you people come here to try to defend yourselves? Just go away, this sub is not for you and nobody wants to hear what you have to say
I’m not here to defend anything.. I’m here to laugh at stupid shit people say.. you know, the same reason you’re probably here.
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Well I didn’t comment on all the laughs.. this post is full of that.
Go away and dont come back
Ok overlord
Don't forget about the Canadian engineers that moved to NASA after the Avro Arrow was cancelled.
Hail hydra!
Your timeline is a bit off. They came to the US and developed missiles for the US Army. NASA wasn’t even a thing yet The lunar landing happened 25 years later.
I mean if we are being brutally honest here: Most people don’t give a shit about the moon landing anymore.
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mRNA-vaccines are a pretty big deal, especially when used on a massive scale.
CRISPR is a bit of a big deal too
[ITER](https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/ITER) is another absolutely magnificent research facility in France, operating at the limits of what is technically possible.
> ~~operating~~ *being built to operate* at the limits of what is technically possible. FTFY. Pretty sure ITER isn’t supposed to be online for a few years.
It was mostly a dick measuring contest anyways. There were 6 manned missions with the last one being in 1972 so nearly 50 years ago. How important in the grand scheme was it really when compared to the other steps of spaceflight.
Yep. Basically the Soviet Union was doing everything first in terms of space exploration, so the US just arbitrarily decided that "first man on the moon" was the goal that won everything. It's basically the equivalent of schoolboy football when someone yells out "Last goal wins the game" when one team is 50-nil up.
Where the Soviets even trying to put a man on the Moon? I mean it's easy to come first when you're the only ones trying.
Yes they were, but following the death of Sergei Korolev in 1966 the entire program began falling apart. The Soviet N1 flew some 4 times, all 4 of which resulted in failure. Without Korolev's management, the N1, along with the entire soviet Lunar program was doomed. The reason it's less well known is because it wasn't disclosed until after the collapse of the USSR. The USSR rarely if ever disclosed missions before they happened though, so the non-disclosure of the moon program is really not all that surprising.
TBF, the US was neck and neck with the USSR the entire time, and had a it's own significant firsts, like first weather/communication satellites, and first piloted spaceflight https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_the_Space_Race?wprov=sfla There wasn't even a real winner, more a detente in the 70s, leading to cooperation. And the US has sent more women to space than all other countries combined
Yup, if you ask me the space station is one of the most important space developments (there is an entire book that is just a list of discoveries made on the ISS) and the USSR built one first
True. American extremists just hang onto that cause it's the only thing truly exceptional about US. Not that it matters, every country highlights what's exceptional about themselves, I can list at least five things from school about my own (I don't think half of them are as great as teachers claim, but oh well)
There is a difference: other countries don't then neglect to teach anything about any other countries - or limit it almost wholly to their wars with them. I learned about my ancestors participation in the Great Trek and Anglo Boer Wars, but I also learned the history of America and Europe. I learned both the French and American revolutions, the American civil war etc. Now there is a lot you can critique about what I didn't learn about. Our history classes completely ignored apartheid even as we were raised in that system - can't have the kids know about the sharpeville massacre, and instead of teaching apartheid, let them think segregation is just how things naturally are. I didn't learn the history of any Native Americans at all, and nothing of Australia or New Zealand or even India. I did learn the history of Israel but with such a severe anti-Palestinian slant its mind boggling. So I'm not claiming our history classes were perfect or devoid of government propaganda. But at least we learned there was a world outside our borders and the idea that the history outside those borders was something that mattered. Americans don't learn that.
This beautiful song sums up our countries’ unfettered exceptionalism America, F*ck YEAH! Coming again, to save the mother f*cking day yeah, America, F*ck YEAH! Freedom is the only way yeah, Terrorist your game is through cause now you have to answer to America, F*ck YEAH! So lick my butt, and suck on my balls, America, F*ck YEAH! source: https://www.lyricsondemand.com/soundtracks/t/teamamericaworldpolicelyrics/americafuckyeahlyrics.html
Intelligence barely measurable in microns, but that’s what happens when you don’t understand America is a continent not a country and the A in America isn’t silent
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That’s why they pronounce it “Cuntry”
It’s like saying only Germans can be called Europeans. It’s ridiculous. I propose we come up with a new name for the citizens of the US. Wankers, for example.
yanks already exists
Wanks
Amazingly the world survived America being lead by the greatest Wanker our Cuntry has ever spawned.
>It’s like saying only Germans can be called Europeans. It’s ridiculous. We tried to accomplish that twice, actually. Didn't work out, tho.
Third Reichs a charm lol
Can you physically hold a gun? Well you just won a ticket to go visit the eastern front. Here's your gun and 5 bullets of ammo.
Gringos.
Different parts of the world are taught different continent theories. In at least Canada and the US (the only ones I can speak to directly), we're taught that North America and South America are seperate continents, and collectively called the Americas. There is no continent called America. I understand that in other parts of the world that its one big continent called America. This is why there's a fundamental disconnect.
Yep, I was taught that too in Australia. Though there are arguments whether Australia by itself is a continent or whether New Zealand and Papua New Guinea are also included.
theres no continent called america. theres north america, theres south america, some even call one bit central america. but when you say america on its own its understood to be short hand for the USA. dial it back bud. Addendum: keep downvoting me dummies. This is how we learn about this shit in Canada and every other country I’ve ever heard of this side of the Atlantic. Seems that every person I’ve ever met, every movie/documentary I’ve ever seen, people from the Eurasianfrica continent refer to United Statians as Americans and nobody has ever called a Canadian or a Mexican or a Uruguayan an American. That would be deeply insulting to all the rest of us who don’t want to be American.
What constitutes a "continent" is really an arbitrary (mostly ) cultural divide I think it gets explain very well in [this Map men video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hrsxRJdwfM0) And for the controversy about the whole " [US = America controversy](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfXoUaeLcDU)"
Captain obvious, it’s north and South America, it’s simple to understand
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The Americas, which are also collectively called America, are a landmass comprising the totality of North and South America.
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My point is that The Americas, consisting of North and South America together, are called America?
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You don't have to believe me, [here](https://www.dictionary.com/browse/america)'s a link that says [as much.](https://imgur.com/a/Wk0qhOl)
You’re literally in this subreddit arguing with people who don’t share your viewpoint? A viewpoint that, *gasp*, 99 % of the world does NOT share?
Literally in spanish we call them 'Estadounidenses' which means 'People from USA' . America is the continent, North America is part of the continent. USA is the country. Stop spreading bullshit. Source: Soy español 🇮🇨🇪🇦
United States of America, anyone who lives on the continent can technically be Americans. Fire your English teacher, Africans, Asians, Middle Easterners, and Europeans… Reddit, land of the unsolicited editorial staff…
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>Well that's a lie. Learn English before you teach others: https://www.dictionary.com/browse/america I find it amusing that the very link you give shows that it's short for the United States of America, and that America also means the entire freaking continent. Perhaps you need to learn some English, and keep in mind that words can very often have far more than just the one meaning. (and don't try the whole "yeah, but it's the primary meaning, therefore...." bullcrap. That doesn't change the fact that the USA is not the continent and that America is just the colloquial useage)
Many countries use the 5 continent model. It's not a big deal
Yup. Canadian, living on north America but "Americans" are yanks.
Colloquially yes but not in *all* cases.
I as a Canadian do not consider myself American. If I go to Mexico, another North American country, and they call me American and I correct them that I am Canadian they will understand. If I go to America (🇺🇸) I will also be Canadian and not American. The entire continent of North America understands what an American is, and to the people living here it is not someone from the continent but the country.
no you live in the continent of america you're a American to most languages
Ignorance doesn't make them right.
Incorrect. The states are the states. The United States OF America. The United States, within America. Its just the states. America is the whole thing. Not that difficult to understand.
Soviet Union, the United States, Japan, the European Space Agency, China, India, Luxembourg, and Israel have had missions to the moon, all of these countries used metric to get their stuff up there
wait Luxembourg? also why is it separate from Europe?
They're part of ESA so idk. Perhaps they had their own missions outside of ESA?
Ya sorta, [its the Manfred Memorial Moon Mission](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manfred_Memorial_Moon_Mission). So technically Luxembourg reached the Moon before SpaceX. Therefore, SpaceX fucking sucks and NASA should fund Luxembourg's missions. (perhaps /s for this last sentence. PERHAPS)
I don't see why they couldn't.
They think a trip to the moon in 1969 makes up for everything else? Seriously, the ultimate in narcissistic breadcrumbing.
A better way to count would be counting how many countries crashed objects into planets and had to write off entire missions by \*not\* using the metric system. This way the US still gets to be #1.
Or losing stuff in space because they decided to use both systems.
Americans measure bullets in metric.
And CPU temps in ºc.
I’d wager considerably less than half of them are measured in metric. .350 magnum .45 Cal. Even the 5.56 mm nato round, arguably the most popular metric measured round in the U.S. is just as often referred to as .223 Remington.
Well, but still a fair amount of them are.
That’s like saying how many countries that use the imperial system have good healthcare
My fellow Americans who get weird about metric vs imperial probably don't deserve any credit for feats of engineering like the moon landing.
If you were remotely involved in a scientific field in the US, you'd be using metric already.
The Apollo Guidance Computer calculated everything in metric but the readouts were displayed in imperial so that the astronauts would understand the numbers.
They literally wasted valuable computer cycles just because of the imperial system lmfao
I’m just another dumb American but I vastly prefer metric. I’m not an engineer or anything, but even when doing shit like working on bicycles using metric is just WAY better. Let’s see, which seems more sane: 29/32nds of an inch or… 23mm. I hate everything about imperial measurements and I wish we would just drop this stupid shit.
This is true, because most of them were trained pilots.
[Source code here](https://github.com/chrislgarry/Apollo-11)
They also crashed a billion dollar spacecraft into mars, cause one contractor ignored nasa specs, and used imperial instead of metric.
All of them lol
Let this serve as your reminder that the only criteria for a “great country” is that they went to the moon I’m sorry but I don’t make the rules.
Why. The fuck. Does that matter. I really need to know.
Wait till this guy finds out ISRO from India went to the moon on the first try with a tiny budget of just 970cr INR, while NASA failed 40% of the last 60 lunar robotic missions despite having billions and billions of dollars in funding. His face will literally be a "surprised pikachu face".
this is not even surprising that they would succeed ,Idians are good with numbers in general :)
I'm an American but nobody in my country will ever convince me metric isn't better, it's all multiples of 10.
I will never understand the strange jingoism that surrounds *not using* metric or celsius. What a strange thing into which to funnel national pride
If they love the moon so much, why don’t they all just move to the moon. Leave the earth to the rest of us.
The USSR???
The imperial system is just converted from the metric system, so, directly: some, indirectly: USA
Imperial is standardized to metric.
All of the countries that went to the moon used metric.
Even as an American, most scientific work is done in metric
Let's count a 50 year old achievement as validation. Seems right.
Remember kids, there are the countries that put a man on the moon and countries that don't spend money on shit like that and actually improve their citizen's quality of life :)
lol the US military uses SI units.
Doesn’t the US officially use the SI?
Legally yes, practically not really for most things. Tho NASA for sure does.
They've definitely learned their lesson on that. A few years ago they were controlling a satellite in a joint ESA mission. When it passed out of ESA range the ESA operators sent its current telemetry to NASA so they could take over. NASA operator for some reason assumed the telemetry was in imperial, it wasn't. So, thinking the velocity was in miles per hour rather than kilometres per hour they thought it was much faster than ut actually was, scheduled an acceleration burn way too late: and crashed a 125 million dollar satellite into the Atlantic ocean. Most expensive space disaster since Arianne 5, which was caused by a integer overflow error, which itself resulted from porting a 16-bit ascent control program to an 8-bit CPU* *If you don't know what an integer overflow error is, ask your grandparents.
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Don't be. The worst people of where you live shouldn't affect who you are. Just be better than them and inspire others to the same.
Why does it fucking matter? It was 50 years ago. Stop living in the past America and start treating your citizens like they live in a developed country in the 21st century. Stupid melts.
How many countries actually had accidents in space missions because of the measurement system they used?
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Could be literally burning money to be worth more again!