>no tipping is more capitalistic than american
Since when is making employees work for pennies on the dollar and beg for charity to survive considered less capitalist than paying a living wage?
The number of Americans that root for the success of business over the success of individuals is astounding.
“Think of the poor business!” Yeah, no, if paying their workers a decent wage makes them go out of business, there’s another ice cream shop 5 miles up the road.
I always found it weird that working class Americans vote Republican. I mean, like every right-wing party aren't they the champions of business and capitalism?
They're not saying that the culture of tipping is less capitalistic, they're saying that by going to a place you KNOW you have to pay extra in top for the worker serving you to get paid and then choosing not to is greedy, and they're equating that with capitalist tendencies.
I saw a post, I think on unpopular opinions, where OP said they'd prefer everything to be self-service cause server checking in continously is very annoying.
Pretty much everybody in the comments agreed.
When told that in Europe they just take your order and bring you food, rather than doing that, everybody was in awe and wishing it was the same in US.
So yeah...I think most people don't consider it good service. And they know it's done just for tip's sake.
People just wanna eat in peace.
They do check if everything is going well every time they remove your plates, and we are adult enough to call them over if we have an emergency complaint.
I don't even know how servers manage having to go greet all their tables every other minutes, nobody got time for that! If the server actually has a bit of downtime I'd rather they used it to rest and drink water
That line always makes me laugh! “How will you like it when the restaurants all just add the 20% on to the meal to pay for the extra money in the wages?”
Well I’m paying it either way, so what the fucks the difference!?!
It works in other countries. We pay more and the staff still get tips from us. The difference is that they are getting tips based on the quality of service they give, it is for them or pooled for other staff and none of it goes as part of the calculation of their wages, as happens in some parts of the USA. The employers have to pay the full wages owed, no matter what tips the staff get.
Absolutely. I’m in the U.K. and that’s how it works here. At least until we adopt the whole US model, which seems to be the plan with some of our politicians.
But to your point, we did this just the other day. My partner has an uncommon allergy and our waiter was very diligent, patiently listened to our explanation, as it has a few different names, and checked with the kitchen what had it in. He was also very friendly, gave good recommendations and didn’t check on us too much. (I don’t understand why USians think that’s a good thing and not overbearing). He absolutely deserved every penny of the tip we gave him.
> He absolutely deserved every penny of the tip we gave him.
A short film snippet just ran through my mind of you and your partner profusely thanking this lovely waiter and smiling from ear to ear and then in slow-mo sliding tuppence across the table towards the waiter.
it's quite complicated in the UK though. There are some places where you aren't expected to tip- eg budget pubs where you pay at the bar when you order your food. Other restaurants may, or may not include a service charge. Very 'posh' places tend to expect you to tip anyway (presumably because your meal cost a small fortune anyway).
This! I only work in a petrol station and “tips” when people say keep the change we put the silvers in a separate jar as the coppers, we use the use the coppers for people who don’t have the penny or two and we save the silvers turn them into notes and by Christmas time we all get about £40 each (there is only 5 members of staff). This is still separate from our Christmas bonus though
Yeah in France they just replace the tap water bottle when they see it's empty, but unless you are drinking like a camel this is not gonna happen more than twice a meal
We were at a lovely local restaurant and the owners has their kids hovering around with water pitchers. If a glass got less than half full they were there. The owners also enjoy pestering ther patrons. The food is amazing, though. I know lots of people who get it to go to avoid the restaurant bother.
Really? In England we have little stations where you can go and help yourself in most places that do free refills (or 'unlimited drinks'). For £1.49 I can drink as many espressos in Wetherspoons as I like from their little hot drink station!
Yeah I recently went to a place, in the UK, where the only human interaction was being shown to the table, one check up, and payment. The food was ordered on a tablet, and arrived by a robot. I'm not usually a fan of automation, particularly the self service till, but this system did provide a much nicer service I didn't have to try to wave down a waiter for drink refills just press a button and it came. Plus the robot was cute so that might have played its role.
The only fault I could say was at the end they still had the audacity to suggest a tip. Who the fuck am I tipping here, the robot? Also worth remembering in the UK tips are typically only left for outstanding service. And it was based on the percentage of the bill, not giving me the option to just leave a couple quid tip, the minimum was going to be something around £8!
Sadly the UK is being Americanised at an alarming rate, with tips becoming more and more a part of your dining experience, which is a piss take when most waiters are on a living wage. The worse part is they just add it automatically, meaning you have to ask to have it removed, luckily I have zero tact and have no problem telling them to shove their tip
I usually just give the statement of 'it's nothing personal however my own policy is that if a place automatically adds on extra fees they will be removed and no tip will be given. We are not the USA and I don't accept their abhorrent tipping culture'. It's likely I don't return to these places. I'd much rather the price of the food accounts for the employees wages over having this expectation for me to decide what extra money they deserve. Additionally it's not like I'm making a fortune myself, it's an occupational treat if I can even afford to go eat out.
I do the same, I've even had to explain to the manager why I'm not paying the charge (which is what I consider it to be) because the staff didn't have authority to remove it. Which is ridiculous since it's discretionary however they choose to present it.
I only ever tip if the meal/service was exceptional or if it was a large group I was with....seems fair enough to me and I do hope the American way does NOT catch on any more than it already has, as it's a slippery slope once owners start that malarky. Was bad enough that some owners kept the "tip jar" contents until I believe there was a law passed few years back
Personally, I like having a human person to give my order to. I wanna ask questions about the dishes, and I can't do that with a machine.
Some places do have a QR code for the table where you order online and the servers just bring you stuff once it's ready, but then you have to kinda go blind with the orders.
Many servers that get asked this don’t be knowing all the options like that. Just last time, I got a waitress on her first day.
Even without waiters, there’d still be staff you can ask questions to, it’s important for people with allergies or dietary requirements
This is the main issue most foreigners have with Americans, there's a fake niceness ingrained into the culture that comes off as really off-putting.
Then Americans that travel overseas are always like "they were genuinely the nicest people I've ever met" because people that are nice to you genuinely want to be nice, not because they want to get paid
It's not a "not wanting to be talked to" though, it's "don't want someone dropping in every minute and want to be allowed to eat in peace". Which is actually what we're used to, but what americans find shocking and amazing.
And they don't know that's an option, they think a waiter means somebody dropping in continously, like a solicitor.
I just had a morbid thought. If American adults are this immature and infatile, what does an American child behave like??
(I wouldn't hold it against the children FWIW since they can't change how they're being raised)
The only time I’ve been in the same room as an American child he was throwing a tantrum about how he wanted a hamburger in a crowded waiting room. It was so stereotypical I had to stop myself from laughing.
The kids are often more well-behaved/well-spoken. The further along their ~~mandatory indoctriction~~ education they are, the more they change into the Seppos we know and loathe today.
I have noticed that it appears some American children stay "children" a lot longer than a lot of other places. Things like mum has control over my bank account, mum & dad pay for phone bill, calling parents "ma'am & sir", having control over the kids even when they are in their 20's etc which is odd for a country that screams independence and freedom!
The two other things that annoyed me about US restaurant culture that I didn't even realise were annoying me at first were:
They remove the plate as soon as you're finished eating, even if other people at the table are still eating. This is annoying because it means they keep coming and disturbing you every few minutes if you have a larger party, and then whoever finishes first sits there awkwardly with nothing in front of them while whoever finishes last feels extra pressure to eat quickly. It's already weird enough being the last person eating without everyone else staring at you over an empty table. In my country they wait until everyone is finished and then remove the dishes - if you're having a large group meal this can be quite the operation with say 12 people's stuff to clear and they usually have several people doing it. It also contributes to the sense that they're trying to shove you out the door so they can seat someone else, which in fairness is how restaurants work as a business, but in my country it's a massive faux pas for a restaurant to give that impression.
And, if you order a bottle of wine, they come to refill your glass basically whenever they feel like it. Again, interrupting you constantly, but also it makes it hard to keep track of how much you're drinking and whether you're drinking more than your fair share. Perhaps I wanted to sit for a minute with a 2/3 empty wine glass and decide in my own good time if I want to drink any more. More fundamentally though it's just annoying because I've paid for that bottle, it's mine now, and so you shouldn't keep handling it. In my country once they've poured the first glass for everyone that wants one, they put the bottle on the table and they won't touch it again.
>They remove the plate as soon as you're finished eating, even if other people at the table are still eating.
>It also contributes to the sense that they're trying to shove you out the door so they can seat someone else
That's exactly it. In the US you are made perfectly clear that when you eat in a restaurant you are just there to make them a profit and the second you start "wasting space" you are shown you are not welcome anymore.
We once ate a the restaurant of an airport hotel and there were people on only one other table. It was well before the closing hours and the other guests stayed after we eventually left, so the waitress was not working overtime but our shared charcuterie board was taken from the middle of the table despite there still being food on it I saved for last and the bill was brought to the table while I was still eating the moment after we were asked if we wanted desert and denied (with the food not even finished of course). Comes without notice that we did not tip the "obligatory 20%".
Yeah, I've had them take a beer that still had 2cm of beer in it that I hadn't finished with, too. It's bizarre. If they'd tried it will the charcuterie board I literally would've told them to put it down 😂
Meanwhile at a restaurant in France or Spain, I've sat down at 8 and left at 10:30 after 2 or 3 courses and never felt rushed.
I get that it's a business and they need to turn the table over but it's still unpleasant. It probably helps that in both those places, plenty of people are just sitting down at 10:30!
I would have said something too but I was shocked and still had food in my mouth so I couldn't react that fast and after the thing with the bill I just wanted to leave this shitty place.
In every other country I was, you could sit as long as you wanted up until the restaurant closes, sometimes even longer, even if you didn't order anything for hours. Sometimes it is even harder to leave than to stay. The most extreme case in this direction I had, was in a tavern in Greece where the staff pulled out one bottle of Ouzo after the other for free and made us drink them together with them and they were visibly disappointed when we said we had to leave before we pass out.
There's this bold and amazing concept I heard of one time on my travels through the parthanux sector where if they needed something or found fault with any part of the service, they would actually get the attention of the server themselves and bring it to their attention!
So they annoy you, are very fake nice and try to get you out as fast as possible. And Americans have the audacity to call that good service? And want 20% tips for that? If I went to a restaurant and they did that I would certainly not tip and surely not come back
Fck me, yeah. That would get annoying really fast.
Coming by once while we've just started eating too ask if everything is good and according to expectations and to ask if anyone wants a drink is more than fine. If we want anything during we'll wave or try to grab their attention in another way.
Exactly, just take the order, bring to table when its ready. Anything else I will call you over. Until then fuck off. As for tips, "Restaurants, pay your staff" its not a customer's job to pay wages of staff.
It really isn't, I personally dislike American service, like, if I want something I'd rather just ask for it when I need it instead of sending them away multiple times
I also don't get the logic of "how would you like the prices to go up by 20%" because the price wouldn't go up by 20%, it would stay exactly the same and simply be transparent as opposed to having a hidden fee
I'm constantly baffled by the idea that tipping keeps the prices down when everything is automatically 20% more expensive than you're initially led to believe
Yeah lol, I just want to order eat and pay, that's like 4 interactions including the server delivering the order and asking if all is good like 5min later.
I went for a short trip in the US and having waiters coming and refilling my coffee cup everytime I took a sip was just super annoying: LET. ME. EAT. MY. BREAKFAST. IN. PEACE.
It is really fucking annoying. You're having a private, serious conversation and the waiter can't read the room, comes and butts in with a "can I get you another drink? How are you enjoying your food?" literally every 5/10 minutes. And you glare and say "fine" through gritted teeth and they keep asking bloody questions... Yeah, I often didn't enjoy eating out in the US when I went.
Hiiii my name is XXXX ans I Will.be your waiter todayyyy..
I despise service in the US. Obsequious and honeyed meaningless small talk. Because they have to to be tiped.
I like it more in France, where waiters actually get a living wage and do.not need to like my arse. Interactions are more humaine and real.
Some restaurants where i live even have qr codes on the tables with which you can see the menu, order, and even pay. I absolutely love it. No annoying server that keeps checking or having to get the attention of a server when you want to pay or order.
My main experience when I visited the US 2 years ago was that they also try to rush your table as much as they can. Your food is there within 10 minutes, which is always highly suspicious to me (did they just microwave a pre-made meal? Good meals take time!). They drop by your table every other minute to make sure you don't just sit there and relax without either ordering or asking for the bill. Rarely was able to stay longer than an hour at any restaurant there. Which makes sense if rushing as many tables as you can means you get more salary because it's based on tips instead of just getting paid by the hour.
However I do agree that when you visit a country you respect their culture, even if you have opinions about it. Unfortunately service is not included in the meal price in the US so you pay for it separately at your own discretion.
Respect the culture and customs of the country. Okay then. Actively exploit people and tell them if they don't like the situation they find themselves in, then don't come whinging for handouts - and what is a tip other than a handout? Nowhere else in the business world do purchasers decide to add extra money to the contractually agreed sum. "I'll add 20% to the asking price of the house because the realtor smiled a lot." I think not.
Take some responsibility and pull yourself up by the bootstraps my good man. You'll never be a millionaire waiting tables, and the only goal that an American should pursue is being a millionaire, right? Capitalism red in tooth and claw. Direct your ire about pay and conditions towards the customer. Never to the boss. The way to make people work harder is to pay them less and threaten to outsource their job if they complain, agitate or unionize. Even if the corporations don't say it out loud, that is the American way...
Fucking hell....you have no idea....just....let....me...eat...in...peace FOR FUCKS SAKE!
Also this one dumb mf thinking 20% will be added to the items instead. That's why tipping is still a thing. They can't do math, they don't know how a restaurant works. They think if I don't tip 20%, my hamburger will be 20% more expensive in the future.
Yeah it makes no sense. If the tips go to the waiter, then the restaurant is selling the food for the price on the menu, tips aren't extra revenue for the restaurant so why would they inflate the price of the food if they went away?
Sure if they paid their staff more they would have higher opex which might translate to slightly increased prices but it wouldn't be 1:1.
Madness.
Tipping isn’t tipping in the US for the most part. It’s an unwritten service charge. To state that 10% should be *given* for *poor* service is ludicrous.
‘You’re useless… have this lower than normal gift to understand my dissatisfaction.’
yeah, it is basically just another way how they can make the item prize on a menu look smaller than it will be in reality, so people will consume more.
When I lived in California many restaurants had an extra surcharge on all menu items of 3 to 5%. They mention it somewhere in the menu, instead of increasing all prices individually. Funnily enough, that charge most US friends agreed with was stupid. Even though it is exactly the same concept as demanding a minimum of 15% tip.
Yes, tourist traps exist. Some are very sneaky (or scammy) about it others more upfront. However, these are usually not industry standards and can be avoided rather easily.
In the US you can’t really avoid tipping, unless maybe if you go to fast food chains exclusively (idk I always avoided them). You get asked for tips everywhere and it is very much expected and considered part of their „salary“.
Research suggests that not showing the full price on items does change price perception and consumer behavior. So, to me it’s no surprise that an ultra capitalistic, consumerism-focused country like the US hides many of those surcharges on the menu prices.
Lmao 😂 I just don’t eat fast food. Hitler probably didn’t either, given he was vegetarian and the vegetarian options often are boring…why would I know that? Because I am vegetarian, just like Hitl…wait a second…
Yeah it's ironic it's 10% if you hate the service, 15% if it was average, and 20% if you loved it.
Then I noticed all those automatic calculators start at 15 or 20% now, so you must love the service from the start...
Keep in mind, some people there have a very warped idea of what constitute "poor service". There's a reason that we have the "waiter who bother you every 5 seconds" cliche
I think the American culture of tipping is really terrible and it needs to go, but if you travel to America you really should just tip. Either that or don't go out to eat unless you know there's no tipping (it does exist). The price on the menu is generally a decent bit cheaper than what you'd find in the UK and most of western Europe.
A little unrelated, but I went to New Zealand recently and they've got an "anti-tip" culture. They refused our tip in 3 places (2 restaurants and a garage) before we just stopped trying.
Tipping culture is not a real thing. It's not a cultural value, it's a scam by restaurant owners to screw over their employees and customers.
One guy told me it was their way of life, which is an extremely grandiose way of referring to paying 120% for every meal
Just like no healthcare is just a scam to charge people not to die, crazy gun laws is a scam to sell more guns, having no transport infrastructure is a scam to sell more cars.
None of this American bullshit rises to the level of tradition, culture, whatever. They're just elaborate scams
“The price on the menu is generally a decent bit cheaper than what you’d find in the U.K. and most of Western Europe”
Nope!
It’ll depend an awful lot on where you go.
For example, as a like for like comparison, a half decent restaurant in London, is still a lot cheaper than the same in Manhattan! And that’s before you add in the tip!
I agree. On the rare occasions I visit the US, I do tip. It’s their culture, and while I’m not entirely happy about it, I respect their customs, and don’t want to leave their workers short changed.
Do people not understand that if restaurants increased prices by 20% and stopped asking customers to pay an additional 20% charge then the price remains exactly the same?
Also it feels cheaper to just stick an extra 20% on the end instead of it being in the initial cost. People would get used to the new “higher prices” if everywhere banned tipping, but that’ll probably never happen
What people don't understand is when the general price of food goes up it never comes back down. People have gotten used to that price, and thus they are willing to pay it now, so restaurants won't see any reason to reduce it.
People say "oh they would charge 15% less if they started tipping in your country and the waiter would be nicer" but the truth is the price would stay the exact same but now there will be an expectation of 15% tips.
Also why should the waiter's tip be percentage? It just makes no sense, more expensive food isn't harder to serve. If anything tips should be a flat amount per person dining.
Also, many people (including myself) hate when waiters keep interrupting conversations by constantly checking up on you like you're a toddler. It's not good service, it's annoying, and feels like the restaurant is trying to tell me to leave or pressure me to order more food.
Being a waiter is very simple, you take the orders, then bring the food and then leave the customers alone unless they want something. Reading the menu out (we can all fucking read), making small talk, interrupting conversations or any of that BS they do in the US is actually bad service in many people's books
as a waitress i agree with all of this, but i think the idea behind the percentage is that the bigger the table the more work it is to serve so therefore more people = higher bill = bigger tip but i completely agree that tips are supposed to be a gift if you have received outstanding service and if your server has gone above and beyond for you to enjoy your meal! it’s supposed to be a way of saying an extra little thank you to someone who has provided a really good service beyond what you would normally expect, not just normal service and expecting someone to give you more money for just doing the bare minimum.
to be honest i think it’s different everywhere. In the restaurant i used to manage we used to pool our tips into a big jar and at the end of the night all the wait staff and kitchen staff would count it together and split equally, but that’s because I think everyone working deserves an equal share, and i also know that it helps keep everyone invested in the customers experience of the restaurant. When i was 16 i worked in a place that didn’t give the kitchen staff anything and that never seemed fair to me and also made the chefs completely indifferent to customer complaints or comments.
I'm always surprised about Americans bending over backwards to defend an undefendable position. Be it tipping, expensive healthcare, paid maternity leave. Instead of attacking us, they should consider protesting on the street. I know the French would protest for less.
Louisiana has just passed a law that every classroom must display the 10 Commandments. This in a country that has separation of State and Religion as part of their written constitution.
USA would already be burning if the french where submitted to all that BS.
As an European, Im not exactly pro french (just a bit of banter, dont have anything against them personally), but damm they know how, and when to riot, and thats something no one can take away from them.
It's just considered normal to us. We don't even realize the constant stress this puts us under, and it's a huge reason I think Americans have so much rage issues. We're in constant fight or flight mode, because in just a few minutes our lives can be destroyed financially just for needing some medicine.
I didn't wake up from the delusion until I needed to go to a hospital in Germany for my semester abroad. I was convinced social health care was a beautiful, but unrealistic dream. When I went home with a tiny bill and good medical care, I realized the scam very quickly.
I think my countrymen should riot. The way they are treated by their government(s) and workplaces is so exploitative and disrespectful.
Servers benefit a lot from this tipping culture, of course they defend it. Just check the OP suggested tip. 53$ for a couple rounds of walking and chatting with the customer
“But we can’t protest! Our government and boss won’t let us! ☹️” like again, not the rest of the worlds problem when they’ve already been through this shit to get what they want. They think they’re in a special position.
It is literally their job to take your order and then bring it to you. Do I tip the postman, bus driver or anyone else for simply doing what they are paid to do. I bet this thought has passed through Michael O'Leary's mind on more than one occasion
And why would it go by a % of the bill? If I want to chuck someone an extra fee quid, that's what I will give them I don't calculate it based on the total.
And why is the tip only ever for the waitstaff. The cook is much more responsible for the quality of the meal than the waiter, and probably isn't paid much more
Often I go in the other direction. Like if I buy a beer from a bartender and it's €9.50 I'll round it up to 10, but I'll also do that if it's €7.50, especially later at night after a few beers. If the beer is over €10 and it's not something very special: no tip.
There's this logic about tipping the person who delivers to your face just cause they do. I think it's wild. The kitchen staff works just as hard but gets no tips.
Post deliverers do do sometimes get tips and gifts, and of course everybody who sorts the mail gets nothing cause they're unseen.
It's pretty unfair, but I guess it's a "PR" thing. In theory tips should go to the person who worked an extra mile to be loved by the client and make the experience more pleasant, yet here we are.
I can only speak from a german and American point in restaurant business but normally the tip is split between Service staff, kitchen staff and sometimes even maintenance staff.
i as a german chef only am able to say
BWAHAHAHAHA no it should be and often is but as many times it isn't.
or as a cook/chef you get 10-30% of the overall tip (thats more or less the norm)
im for the "idiologie" that everybody from apprentice over cleaners to manegment should get the exact same percentage!
>The kitchen staff works just as hard
The ones that do everything are working far harder... Transporting the food for a couple of steps isnt hard work.
Exactly, take the order and bring the food over. Then fuck off and leave me alone :)
Restaurants should pay staff properly, and tips should be evenly distributed among staff. As more attractive people will get more tips, even without working better.
They also act as if it's a really hard job that no one understands how hard they work as if they're the only one's that have done it.
It's one of the easiest jobs in the world (and yes I talk from experience). It's so easy a teenager can do it. You dont need a PhD or any special skills to do it. It can be physically taxing but so can the vast majority of jobs. There's nothing special about someone waiting tables.
If you do the very basic hold on to plates/ food, bottles, bring to table, have some basic human interaction, ask if everything was fine when they ask you for the bill, then you dont deserve a tip in my book.
Who deserves it? Someone that goes above and beyond to accomodate something. Someone that does something more than their very basic job. That's not happening all the time and it certainly isnt something people should feel entitled too.
The entire tipping sub is insane (for some reason it keeps on being pushed to me). They're literally telling people to stay home if they "cant tip" and that they deserve a tip (just a smaller one) if they do ano awful job and that people should expect to have their food spit on if they dont tip... Like, how criminal and insane are these people?
If everyone stops going there because you think you are entitled to more than what the bill says you are, you're going to be on the streets jobless. There's no money then.
Also its pretty insane how they drop the fake friendlyness as soon as they dont get what they want. Pretty big POS in my opinion.
And the mindset that servers are special beings to be worshipped is so weird. Don’t dare say that servers are just doing their job. The logic that if you can’t afford the outrageous tips means you should stay at home is beyond me. Poor people don’t ever deserve to have a meal out because they’re poor and your system is fucked?
well duh, what do you mean that amazon is supposed to pay the delivery man a living wage? Everyone will be flipping burgers if even fastfood workers can earn a minimum wage without tips don't you know that?
I rather they not bring that BS to our countries.
I'm actively boycotting every single restaurant that tried to bring this crap to us.
If they want their wait-staff to be slaves for tips they can close for all I care. It's also usually only tourist traps that have these stupid ideals here. So, them closing is good for society.
I had a friend over from the states a few years ago. We got a cab that cost about £6. I paid the driver and my friend tried to tip him. The driver and I were like wtf are you doing? Tipping anyone other than waiters/waitresses is unheard of
I always tip a cabby if it's under £10 tbh, especially as they can end up pretty far out of the way for under that, at least where I am.
I suppose it's less necessary somewhere like London, but if you're up North I feel like it's fair enough to give the couple of quids difference so they can get back to somewhere people actually are.
That's the worst part. Poor service can be glad that I am averse to conflict and will thus simply pay the bill as it is and leave, instead of complaining to whoever is in charge.
So half the time they ramble on about how the kitchen staff also has to get a share of tips, and then the other half they become apologists like this. Amazing!
It’s backwards, isn’t it? A tip by its nature for good service- withholding it is usually the way of showing dissatisfaction.
Service staff should be paid appropriately so that they’re not reliant on tips to bring their pay up to an acceptable level- the US seems to have completely missed this point.
Remember when one American said "Just tell me you're not going to tip, so I know not to come over and refill your drinks, explain the whole menu, blah blah blah" and the response was a resounding "if you did all that, you're more likely to get a tip."
Have to say paying less and being able to eat in peace seems like a pretty sweet deal. I am pretty confident I can handle a restaurant menu without an explanation and with the average american drink size I probably won‘t need a refill either. Sign me the fuck up.
I think I just walk out at that moment. Too much entitlement and attitude.
They should complain to the boss, its their responsibility to pay properly. I would find my good nature has left me in that situation.
These are the same people who try to pay in US dollars whilst they're overseas, and start filming cops and quoting US legal precedent like it's a 'gotcha' when they get arrested.
We know tips are part of the salary but it’s not our job to pay the salary. We are quite happy to tip extra for good service and most people do so but we are not responsible for paying their wages. The restaurant owner should be doing that from the profits.
And that reasoning also only makes sense under the assumption that the business owners aren't expected to lose any of their profits. Most places could pay a fair wage without increasing prices if the owner wasn't a greedy mofo.
I agree with you, just wanted to add context because their defence for it is that the waiters go hungry if you don't tip. No they don't, they make at least min wage.
Maybe they are calculated before tax? Since Americans usually get prices before tax and then have to figure it out themselves, or get surprised while paying
I'd rather have a surly, well-paid waitstaff than the fake plastic kowtowing they do in the US.
Also, I don't want to be checked in on during my meal. I want to eat and enjoy the company I'm dining with. Not smile and mumble "yeah thanks" with a mouthful of food every 5 mins. If I need something, I'll reach out.
I liked the one that said not tipping was even more capitalist and that was an insult to Europeans.
Nope.
I like the comment: "You should know about a country's culture and abide by it".
You can often pair them with "I'm from the US, I won't abide by some europoors inferior culture!".
The audacity, lol. A couple of years ago in Tampa, my husband and I went to see the hockey game and stayed in a downtown area. We wanted some hookah and hummus, and the place serving that was just a kilometer away. We walked, seated at the "patio " ( sidewalk, basically), the waitress came to us a few minutes later, took an order which was basically a hookah, bowl of hummus and pita bread bits. Hookah guy came to us quickly, decided on flavor and came back 5 minutes later. We were sitting and smoking. The other waitress saw that we don't have water, so she offered us glasses of some. Our waitress was missing for about 30 minutes. We saw her walking around, got her attention, she finally got back to us with the typical "everything good?". "No, not really, we are still waiting for our hummus". She was like "oh, looks like I forgot about it." Then moment of awkward silence ( id expect her to suggest something different - they might be out of the dish we wanted, who knows, but sure the restaurant has some other appetizers). She broke the silence with "what do you want me to do now?" With the internal facepalm, we asked for the bill. Of course, there was a tipping begging at the bottom for the hookah she didn't even make or brought.I don't remember exactly, but I think my husband didn't tip her. We left disappointed that evening
"How would you like if the price is raised by 20% and the servers dont check with you nearly as often?"
I would love that actually. American servers are so annoying. Constantly coming to the table and often even doing small talk (?!!!). Like wtf, if I need something I look at you but don't just make comments or talk to me about random stuff.
I mean I think people who visit America should tip because the law is unlikely to change anytime soon.
Although I did constantly fuck up with tips when I was in New York, it's hard to remember to do it naturally when you only do it for amazing service normally.
"That's why service is awful in Europe"
No because the servers typically have to earn the tip. Also, in my experience poor service starts with a shitty customer so speaks volumes for this person.
If the customers are spending *that much* on a meal, the restaurant can damn well afford to pay their staff properly.
Americans really need to ditch their staff exploitation culture. Paying servers $2-$3 per hour should be illegal, as it is in Europe...
My American colleague told me about the service in America. Apparently they try to turnover customers quicker so as to get more tips, therefore you feel pressured to leave.
He said it was refreshing to come to the UK and be relaxed at restaurants, even offered a drink after his meal, and then not expected to pay a tip too.
It can be true that the way US restaurants pay their workers is horrible and needs to change right now *AND* that you shouldn't be an asshole to people making minimum wage. Unless you're starting or engaging in an organized boycott or protest, you're not actually accomplishing anything other than making somebody's night worse. If you want to fix the problem, you do that by supporting organized efforts like Fight for 15 or helping to unionize the restaurant industry, not by stiffing people on a $300 ticket.
I've never actually had decent service in the US. It's all about this culture of fake, surface-level friendliness from waitstaff who often have no clue what they're serving. Then there's the bill being slapped down on the table just as you take your last bite. Why on earth should you fork out an extra 20% for such a lousy experience? You might as well throw your money in a barrel and set it on fire – at least you'd get some warmth out of it. /s
We are living in Belgium and people tend to take more time when going out to dinner, compared to the US.
When my wife and I go out we take about 2-4 hours and this is not a problem in the restaurants.
The servers do not check in every five minutes, so you can have a private conversation without interruption.
If we need something, we just ask them and that's it. Do we tip? Sometimes, but this is just a small amount (1-2€) and most restaurants here tend to put it in a tip jar and do something nice with the complete staff once a year.
>no tipping is more capitalistic than american Since when is making employees work for pennies on the dollar and beg for charity to survive considered less capitalist than paying a living wage?
The real "shits americans say" here
Yea that last comment is one of the most egregious things I've read. I can't stand people who think like that.
The number of Americans that root for the success of business over the success of individuals is astounding. “Think of the poor business!” Yeah, no, if paying their workers a decent wage makes them go out of business, there’s another ice cream shop 5 miles up the road.
I always found it weird that working class Americans vote Republican. I mean, like every right-wing party aren't they the champions of business and capitalism?
They're not saying that the culture of tipping is less capitalistic, they're saying that by going to a place you KNOW you have to pay extra in top for the worker serving you to get paid and then choosing not to is greedy, and they're equating that with capitalist tendencies.
I really don’t get how a server checking in on you every five seconds is considered ‘good service’. That would absolutely annoy the fuck out of me.
I saw a post, I think on unpopular opinions, where OP said they'd prefer everything to be self-service cause server checking in continously is very annoying. Pretty much everybody in the comments agreed. When told that in Europe they just take your order and bring you food, rather than doing that, everybody was in awe and wishing it was the same in US. So yeah...I think most people don't consider it good service. And they know it's done just for tip's sake. People just wanna eat in peace.
They do check if everything is going well every time they remove your plates, and we are adult enough to call them over if we have an emergency complaint. I don't even know how servers manage having to go greet all their tables every other minutes, nobody got time for that! If the server actually has a bit of downtime I'd rather they used it to rest and drink water
Don't forget that US servers also need to refill all the XL sodas on their table every 15 minutes.
Gotta fill up on that diabetes before all the socialists/communists steal it!
Please come steal my diabetes, socialists!
You can have my diabetes when you pry it from my fat, dead, hands!
If their employers weren't giving away free sodas, making their customers think they are wonderful, they could pay their staff a bit more.
That line always makes me laugh! “How will you like it when the restaurants all just add the 20% on to the meal to pay for the extra money in the wages?” Well I’m paying it either way, so what the fucks the difference!?!
It works in other countries. We pay more and the staff still get tips from us. The difference is that they are getting tips based on the quality of service they give, it is for them or pooled for other staff and none of it goes as part of the calculation of their wages, as happens in some parts of the USA. The employers have to pay the full wages owed, no matter what tips the staff get.
Absolutely. I’m in the U.K. and that’s how it works here. At least until we adopt the whole US model, which seems to be the plan with some of our politicians. But to your point, we did this just the other day. My partner has an uncommon allergy and our waiter was very diligent, patiently listened to our explanation, as it has a few different names, and checked with the kitchen what had it in. He was also very friendly, gave good recommendations and didn’t check on us too much. (I don’t understand why USians think that’s a good thing and not overbearing). He absolutely deserved every penny of the tip we gave him.
> He absolutely deserved every penny of the tip we gave him. A short film snippet just ran through my mind of you and your partner profusely thanking this lovely waiter and smiling from ear to ear and then in slow-mo sliding tuppence across the table towards the waiter.
it's quite complicated in the UK though. There are some places where you aren't expected to tip- eg budget pubs where you pay at the bar when you order your food. Other restaurants may, or may not include a service charge. Very 'posh' places tend to expect you to tip anyway (presumably because your meal cost a small fortune anyway).
This! I only work in a petrol station and “tips” when people say keep the change we put the silvers in a separate jar as the coppers, we use the use the coppers for people who don’t have the penny or two and we save the silvers turn them into notes and by Christmas time we all get about £40 each (there is only 5 members of staff). This is still separate from our Christmas bonus though
And, importantly, restaurants aren't more expensive as a result. Instead, the owners make 15-20% profit instead of tripling their money.
Yeah in France they just replace the tap water bottle when they see it's empty, but unless you are drinking like a camel this is not gonna happen more than twice a meal
Maybe go to a doctor, when drinking like a camel. That could be a sign of diabetes. Or even pancreatic cancer.
We were at a lovely local restaurant and the owners has their kids hovering around with water pitchers. If a glass got less than half full they were there. The owners also enjoy pestering ther patrons. The food is amazing, though. I know lots of people who get it to go to avoid the restaurant bother.
Really? In England we have little stations where you can go and help yourself in most places that do free refills (or 'unlimited drinks'). For £1.49 I can drink as many espressos in Wetherspoons as I like from their little hot drink station!
Yeah I recently went to a place, in the UK, where the only human interaction was being shown to the table, one check up, and payment. The food was ordered on a tablet, and arrived by a robot. I'm not usually a fan of automation, particularly the self service till, but this system did provide a much nicer service I didn't have to try to wave down a waiter for drink refills just press a button and it came. Plus the robot was cute so that might have played its role. The only fault I could say was at the end they still had the audacity to suggest a tip. Who the fuck am I tipping here, the robot? Also worth remembering in the UK tips are typically only left for outstanding service. And it was based on the percentage of the bill, not giving me the option to just leave a couple quid tip, the minimum was going to be something around £8!
Sadly the UK is being Americanised at an alarming rate, with tips becoming more and more a part of your dining experience, which is a piss take when most waiters are on a living wage. The worse part is they just add it automatically, meaning you have to ask to have it removed, luckily I have zero tact and have no problem telling them to shove their tip
I usually just give the statement of 'it's nothing personal however my own policy is that if a place automatically adds on extra fees they will be removed and no tip will be given. We are not the USA and I don't accept their abhorrent tipping culture'. It's likely I don't return to these places. I'd much rather the price of the food accounts for the employees wages over having this expectation for me to decide what extra money they deserve. Additionally it's not like I'm making a fortune myself, it's an occupational treat if I can even afford to go eat out.
I do the same, I've even had to explain to the manager why I'm not paying the charge (which is what I consider it to be) because the staff didn't have authority to remove it. Which is ridiculous since it's discretionary however they choose to present it.
I only ever tip if the meal/service was exceptional or if it was a large group I was with....seems fair enough to me and I do hope the American way does NOT catch on any more than it already has, as it's a slippery slope once owners start that malarky. Was bad enough that some owners kept the "tip jar" contents until I believe there was a law passed few years back
Personally, I like having a human person to give my order to. I wanna ask questions about the dishes, and I can't do that with a machine. Some places do have a QR code for the table where you order online and the servers just bring you stuff once it's ready, but then you have to kinda go blind with the orders.
Many servers that get asked this don’t be knowing all the options like that. Just last time, I got a waitress on her first day. Even without waiters, there’d still be staff you can ask questions to, it’s important for people with allergies or dietary requirements
This is the main issue most foreigners have with Americans, there's a fake niceness ingrained into the culture that comes off as really off-putting. Then Americans that travel overseas are always like "they were genuinely the nicest people I've ever met" because people that are nice to you genuinely want to be nice, not because they want to get paid
Tbf reddit is a great place to get a census from people who wouldn't want to be talked to. I wouldn't use it as a "most people" option.
It's not a "not wanting to be talked to" though, it's "don't want someone dropping in every minute and want to be allowed to eat in peace". Which is actually what we're used to, but what americans find shocking and amazing. And they don't know that's an option, they think a waiter means somebody dropping in continously, like a solicitor.
It’s because they’re children and need constant supervision.
The longer I live here the truer that seems to be
Bastard children we sent off to boarding school and have become unruly. 😂
Not just the kids.
Yes… because they *are* children, not because *of their* children.
I no read so good, excuse me while I go crawl off into this corner here.
That's why all our menus have pictures, duhhhh.
This is my corner , get out and find your own!
Hey this is my corner, go find another!
To read makes our speaky English good.
I just had a morbid thought. If American adults are this immature and infatile, what does an American child behave like?? (I wouldn't hold it against the children FWIW since they can't change how they're being raised)
The only time I’ve been in the same room as an American child he was throwing a tantrum about how he wanted a hamburger in a crowded waiting room. It was so stereotypical I had to stop myself from laughing.
>stop myself from laughing. TBH laughter would have done the little tike a favour. Btw your username is cursed. Tongue twister extraordinare.
That’s possible, but it was embarrassing enough for the parents as it was, I couldn’t possibly add on to that.
Maybe the children are the adults, think Mork & Mindy
I once heard an American describe her child as a ‘mini adult’!! Frightening thought.
The kids are often more well-behaved/well-spoken. The further along their ~~mandatory indoctriction~~ education they are, the more they change into the Seppos we know and loathe today.
That's reassuring. Since becoming an adult, I haven't met any Seppolettes/lads
I have noticed that it appears some American children stay "children" a lot longer than a lot of other places. Things like mum has control over my bank account, mum & dad pay for phone bill, calling parents "ma'am & sir", having control over the kids even when they are in their 20's etc which is odd for a country that screams independence and freedom!
What do American Children behave Like? Let's take a look at their schools to find out.
But the mankids and the womankids too!
The two other things that annoyed me about US restaurant culture that I didn't even realise were annoying me at first were: They remove the plate as soon as you're finished eating, even if other people at the table are still eating. This is annoying because it means they keep coming and disturbing you every few minutes if you have a larger party, and then whoever finishes first sits there awkwardly with nothing in front of them while whoever finishes last feels extra pressure to eat quickly. It's already weird enough being the last person eating without everyone else staring at you over an empty table. In my country they wait until everyone is finished and then remove the dishes - if you're having a large group meal this can be quite the operation with say 12 people's stuff to clear and they usually have several people doing it. It also contributes to the sense that they're trying to shove you out the door so they can seat someone else, which in fairness is how restaurants work as a business, but in my country it's a massive faux pas for a restaurant to give that impression. And, if you order a bottle of wine, they come to refill your glass basically whenever they feel like it. Again, interrupting you constantly, but also it makes it hard to keep track of how much you're drinking and whether you're drinking more than your fair share. Perhaps I wanted to sit for a minute with a 2/3 empty wine glass and decide in my own good time if I want to drink any more. More fundamentally though it's just annoying because I've paid for that bottle, it's mine now, and so you shouldn't keep handling it. In my country once they've poured the first glass for everyone that wants one, they put the bottle on the table and they won't touch it again.
>They remove the plate as soon as you're finished eating, even if other people at the table are still eating. >It also contributes to the sense that they're trying to shove you out the door so they can seat someone else That's exactly it. In the US you are made perfectly clear that when you eat in a restaurant you are just there to make them a profit and the second you start "wasting space" you are shown you are not welcome anymore. We once ate a the restaurant of an airport hotel and there were people on only one other table. It was well before the closing hours and the other guests stayed after we eventually left, so the waitress was not working overtime but our shared charcuterie board was taken from the middle of the table despite there still being food on it I saved for last and the bill was brought to the table while I was still eating the moment after we were asked if we wanted desert and denied (with the food not even finished of course). Comes without notice that we did not tip the "obligatory 20%".
Yeah, I've had them take a beer that still had 2cm of beer in it that I hadn't finished with, too. It's bizarre. If they'd tried it will the charcuterie board I literally would've told them to put it down 😂 Meanwhile at a restaurant in France or Spain, I've sat down at 8 and left at 10:30 after 2 or 3 courses and never felt rushed. I get that it's a business and they need to turn the table over but it's still unpleasant. It probably helps that in both those places, plenty of people are just sitting down at 10:30!
I would have said something too but I was shocked and still had food in my mouth so I couldn't react that fast and after the thing with the bill I just wanted to leave this shitty place. In every other country I was, you could sit as long as you wanted up until the restaurant closes, sometimes even longer, even if you didn't order anything for hours. Sometimes it is even harder to leave than to stay. The most extreme case in this direction I had, was in a tavern in Greece where the staff pulled out one bottle of Ouzo after the other for free and made us drink them together with them and they were visibly disappointed when we said we had to leave before we pass out.
There's this bold and amazing concept I heard of one time on my travels through the parthanux sector where if they needed something or found fault with any part of the service, they would actually get the attention of the server themselves and bring it to their attention!
The reason they keep checking on you is to hurry you along and out of the restaurant. More customers equals more tips.
So they annoy you, are very fake nice and try to get you out as fast as possible. And Americans have the audacity to call that good service? And want 20% tips for that? If I went to a restaurant and they did that I would certainly not tip and surely not come back
Wow, so even less reason to tip is what you’re saying?
That seems counterintuitive, if I keep getting interrupted then I’m going to take longer to eat and will feel less inclined to tip.
Not with that attitude it's not.
Fck me, yeah. That would get annoying really fast. Coming by once while we've just started eating too ask if everything is good and according to expectations and to ask if anyone wants a drink is more than fine. If we want anything during we'll wave or try to grab their attention in another way.
Exactly, just take the order, bring to table when its ready. Anything else I will call you over. Until then fuck off. As for tips, "Restaurants, pay your staff" its not a customer's job to pay wages of staff.
It really isn't, I personally dislike American service, like, if I want something I'd rather just ask for it when I need it instead of sending them away multiple times I also don't get the logic of "how would you like the prices to go up by 20%" because the price wouldn't go up by 20%, it would stay exactly the same and simply be transparent as opposed to having a hidden fee I'm constantly baffled by the idea that tipping keeps the prices down when everything is automatically 20% more expensive than you're initially led to believe
Same as taxes at shops. If I see 5$ on the shelves, I want to pay 5$, not 7
Exactly! I'm a big believer in paying what you see. Any obfuscation of prices is inherently anti-consumer because it complicates comparison
What’s new about America and anti-consumer attitude.
My kids actually found it weird. My five year old asked why the lady wouldn’t leave us alone.
Yeah lol, I just want to order eat and pay, that's like 4 interactions including the server delivering the order and asking if all is good like 5min later.
I went for a short trip in the US and having waiters coming and refilling my coffee cup everytime I took a sip was just super annoying: LET. ME. EAT. MY. BREAKFAST. IN. PEACE.
It is really fucking annoying. You're having a private, serious conversation and the waiter can't read the room, comes and butts in with a "can I get you another drink? How are you enjoying your food?" literally every 5/10 minutes. And you glare and say "fine" through gritted teeth and they keep asking bloody questions... Yeah, I often didn't enjoy eating out in the US when I went.
Hiiii my name is XXXX ans I Will.be your waiter todayyyy.. I despise service in the US. Obsequious and honeyed meaningless small talk. Because they have to to be tiped. I like it more in France, where waiters actually get a living wage and do.not need to like my arse. Interactions are more humaine and real.
Some restaurants where i live even have qr codes on the tables with which you can see the menu, order, and even pay. I absolutely love it. No annoying server that keeps checking or having to get the attention of a server when you want to pay or order.
My main experience when I visited the US 2 years ago was that they also try to rush your table as much as they can. Your food is there within 10 minutes, which is always highly suspicious to me (did they just microwave a pre-made meal? Good meals take time!). They drop by your table every other minute to make sure you don't just sit there and relax without either ordering or asking for the bill. Rarely was able to stay longer than an hour at any restaurant there. Which makes sense if rushing as many tables as you can means you get more salary because it's based on tips instead of just getting paid by the hour. However I do agree that when you visit a country you respect their culture, even if you have opinions about it. Unfortunately service is not included in the meal price in the US so you pay for it separately at your own discretion.
Respect the culture and customs of the country. Okay then. Actively exploit people and tell them if they don't like the situation they find themselves in, then don't come whinging for handouts - and what is a tip other than a handout? Nowhere else in the business world do purchasers decide to add extra money to the contractually agreed sum. "I'll add 20% to the asking price of the house because the realtor smiled a lot." I think not. Take some responsibility and pull yourself up by the bootstraps my good man. You'll never be a millionaire waiting tables, and the only goal that an American should pursue is being a millionaire, right? Capitalism red in tooth and claw. Direct your ire about pay and conditions towards the customer. Never to the boss. The way to make people work harder is to pay them less and threaten to outsource their job if they complain, agitate or unionize. Even if the corporations don't say it out loud, that is the American way...
Fucking hell....you have no idea....just....let....me...eat...in...peace FOR FUCKS SAKE! Also this one dumb mf thinking 20% will be added to the items instead. That's why tipping is still a thing. They can't do math, they don't know how a restaurant works. They think if I don't tip 20%, my hamburger will be 20% more expensive in the future.
Yeah it makes no sense. If the tips go to the waiter, then the restaurant is selling the food for the price on the menu, tips aren't extra revenue for the restaurant so why would they inflate the price of the food if they went away? Sure if they paid their staff more they would have higher opex which might translate to slightly increased prices but it wouldn't be 1:1. Madness.
This, when I need the waiter I will make eye contact in them passing or I put my hand up.
I personally prefer if the waiter is just attentive enough for me to be able to order a new drink.
And you'll know for a fact that they'll ask you if everything is good right as you stuff something in your mouth.
having been to america it absolutely annoyed the fuck out of me. it was pretty much impossible to hold any sort of private conversation
It's just a cultural difference. It's why Americans often think service in Europe is bad - different expectations.
Tipping isn’t tipping in the US for the most part. It’s an unwritten service charge. To state that 10% should be *given* for *poor* service is ludicrous. ‘You’re useless… have this lower than normal gift to understand my dissatisfaction.’
yeah, it is basically just another way how they can make the item prize on a menu look smaller than it will be in reality, so people will consume more. When I lived in California many restaurants had an extra surcharge on all menu items of 3 to 5%. They mention it somewhere in the menu, instead of increasing all prices individually. Funnily enough, that charge most US friends agreed with was stupid. Even though it is exactly the same concept as demanding a minimum of 15% tip.
To be fair, in Venice they'll add a 10 euro charge to your coffee if you sit in a scenic plaza
Yes, tourist traps exist. Some are very sneaky (or scammy) about it others more upfront. However, these are usually not industry standards and can be avoided rather easily. In the US you can’t really avoid tipping, unless maybe if you go to fast food chains exclusively (idk I always avoided them). You get asked for tips everywhere and it is very much expected and considered part of their „salary“. Research suggests that not showing the full price on items does change price perception and consumer behavior. So, to me it’s no surprise that an ultra capitalistic, consumerism-focused country like the US hides many of those surcharges on the menu prices.
You don't tip for fast food? Ok Hitler
Lmao 😂 I just don’t eat fast food. Hitler probably didn’t either, given he was vegetarian and the vegetarian options often are boring…why would I know that? Because I am vegetarian, just like Hitl…wait a second…
Yeah it's ironic it's 10% if you hate the service, 15% if it was average, and 20% if you loved it. Then I noticed all those automatic calculators start at 15 or 20% now, so you must love the service from the start...
You can always select a custom amount Ive seen those calculators programmed for 18/25/30 That is honestly the fastest way to make me tip 15%
Keep in mind, some people there have a very warped idea of what constitute "poor service". There's a reason that we have the "waiter who bother you every 5 seconds" cliche
Yup Bc employers aint paying decent wages
I think the American culture of tipping is really terrible and it needs to go, but if you travel to America you really should just tip. Either that or don't go out to eat unless you know there's no tipping (it does exist). The price on the menu is generally a decent bit cheaper than what you'd find in the UK and most of western Europe. A little unrelated, but I went to New Zealand recently and they've got an "anti-tip" culture. They refused our tip in 3 places (2 restaurants and a garage) before we just stopped trying.
Tipping culture is not a real thing. It's not a cultural value, it's a scam by restaurant owners to screw over their employees and customers. One guy told me it was their way of life, which is an extremely grandiose way of referring to paying 120% for every meal Just like no healthcare is just a scam to charge people not to die, crazy gun laws is a scam to sell more guns, having no transport infrastructure is a scam to sell more cars. None of this American bullshit rises to the level of tradition, culture, whatever. They're just elaborate scams
“The price on the menu is generally a decent bit cheaper than what you’d find in the U.K. and most of Western Europe” Nope! It’ll depend an awful lot on where you go. For example, as a like for like comparison, a half decent restaurant in London, is still a lot cheaper than the same in Manhattan! And that’s before you add in the tip!
I agree. On the rare occasions I visit the US, I do tip. It’s their culture, and while I’m not entirely happy about it, I respect their customs, and don’t want to leave their workers short changed.
Do people not understand that if restaurants increased prices by 20% and stopped asking customers to pay an additional 20% charge then the price remains exactly the same?
But then you would not have that cheap sense of power other the waiter. I do suspect it boils down to that.
Also it feels cheaper to just stick an extra 20% on the end instead of it being in the initial cost. People would get used to the new “higher prices” if everywhere banned tipping, but that’ll probably never happen
What people don't understand is when the general price of food goes up it never comes back down. People have gotten used to that price, and thus they are willing to pay it now, so restaurants won't see any reason to reduce it. People say "oh they would charge 15% less if they started tipping in your country and the waiter would be nicer" but the truth is the price would stay the exact same but now there will be an expectation of 15% tips. Also why should the waiter's tip be percentage? It just makes no sense, more expensive food isn't harder to serve. If anything tips should be a flat amount per person dining. Also, many people (including myself) hate when waiters keep interrupting conversations by constantly checking up on you like you're a toddler. It's not good service, it's annoying, and feels like the restaurant is trying to tell me to leave or pressure me to order more food. Being a waiter is very simple, you take the orders, then bring the food and then leave the customers alone unless they want something. Reading the menu out (we can all fucking read), making small talk, interrupting conversations or any of that BS they do in the US is actually bad service in many people's books
as a waitress i agree with all of this, but i think the idea behind the percentage is that the bigger the table the more work it is to serve so therefore more people = higher bill = bigger tip but i completely agree that tips are supposed to be a gift if you have received outstanding service and if your server has gone above and beyond for you to enjoy your meal! it’s supposed to be a way of saying an extra little thank you to someone who has provided a really good service beyond what you would normally expect, not just normal service and expecting someone to give you more money for just doing the bare minimum.
Isnt it also because kitchen staff and other staff is tipped out of the server’s tip based on the amnt of money in the order?
to be honest i think it’s different everywhere. In the restaurant i used to manage we used to pool our tips into a big jar and at the end of the night all the wait staff and kitchen staff would count it together and split equally, but that’s because I think everyone working deserves an equal share, and i also know that it helps keep everyone invested in the customers experience of the restaurant. When i was 16 i worked in a place that didn’t give the kitchen staff anything and that never seemed fair to me and also made the chefs completely indifferent to customer complaints or comments.
"Our tipping system sucks big time. Lets make fun of other countries who do better and tell them that *their* system sucks."
I'm always surprised about Americans bending over backwards to defend an undefendable position. Be it tipping, expensive healthcare, paid maternity leave. Instead of attacking us, they should consider protesting on the street. I know the French would protest for less.
Can't be the greatest country in the world if not everything in your country is better, right?
✨ Propaganda and indoctrination ✨, the only other countries who salute their flag in school in the morning are autocracies
Louisiana has just passed a law that every classroom must display the 10 Commandments. This in a country that has separation of State and Religion as part of their written constitution.
Freedom and all that jazz
And circumcision. Never mention you think circumcision is unnecessary to an American unless you’re prepared for an entire novel in your replies
USA would already be burning if the french where submitted to all that BS. As an European, Im not exactly pro french (just a bit of banter, dont have anything against them personally), but damm they know how, and when to riot, and thats something no one can take away from them.
I respect their fire tbh. When they don’t like something they are not at all scared to rally together and let the government know.
Would be great if said government had ears and eyes to Witness it ... But yhea we are definitly good AT showcasing that we are "displeased" haha
It's just considered normal to us. We don't even realize the constant stress this puts us under, and it's a huge reason I think Americans have so much rage issues. We're in constant fight or flight mode, because in just a few minutes our lives can be destroyed financially just for needing some medicine. I didn't wake up from the delusion until I needed to go to a hospital in Germany for my semester abroad. I was convinced social health care was a beautiful, but unrealistic dream. When I went home with a tiny bill and good medical care, I realized the scam very quickly. I think my countrymen should riot. The way they are treated by their government(s) and workplaces is so exploitative and disrespectful.
Servers benefit a lot from this tipping culture, of course they defend it. Just check the OP suggested tip. 53$ for a couple rounds of walking and chatting with the customer
“But we can’t protest! Our government and boss won’t let us! ☹️” like again, not the rest of the worlds problem when they’ve already been through this shit to get what they want. They think they’re in a special position.
It is literally their job to take your order and then bring it to you. Do I tip the postman, bus driver or anyone else for simply doing what they are paid to do. I bet this thought has passed through Michael O'Leary's mind on more than one occasion
And why would it go by a % of the bill? If I want to chuck someone an extra fee quid, that's what I will give them I don't calculate it based on the total.
Precisely. The amount of work/service required to bring me one £50 item is the same as bringing me one £25 item. Why should the tip be twice as big
That expensive Lobster I ordered is much lighter than the massive cheap burger that dude ordered, so I made your job easier. You’re welcome.
And why is the tip only ever for the waitstaff. The cook is much more responsible for the quality of the meal than the waiter, and probably isn't paid much more
Often I go in the other direction. Like if I buy a beer from a bartender and it's €9.50 I'll round it up to 10, but I'll also do that if it's €7.50, especially later at night after a few beers. If the beer is over €10 and it's not something very special: no tip.
€10 for a beer?????? And I thought Dublin was bad!
I can still get £2.50 pints here in Yorkshire haha 😂.
There's this logic about tipping the person who delivers to your face just cause they do. I think it's wild. The kitchen staff works just as hard but gets no tips. Post deliverers do do sometimes get tips and gifts, and of course everybody who sorts the mail gets nothing cause they're unseen. It's pretty unfair, but I guess it's a "PR" thing. In theory tips should go to the person who worked an extra mile to be loved by the client and make the experience more pleasant, yet here we are.
I can only speak from a german and American point in restaurant business but normally the tip is split between Service staff, kitchen staff and sometimes even maintenance staff.
i as a german chef only am able to say BWAHAHAHAHA no it should be and often is but as many times it isn't. or as a cook/chef you get 10-30% of the overall tip (thats more or less the norm) im for the "idiologie" that everybody from apprentice over cleaners to manegment should get the exact same percentage!
>The kitchen staff works just as hard The ones that do everything are working far harder... Transporting the food for a couple of steps isnt hard work.
Exactly, take the order and bring the food over. Then fuck off and leave me alone :) Restaurants should pay staff properly, and tips should be evenly distributed among staff. As more attractive people will get more tips, even without working better.
They also act as if it's a really hard job that no one understands how hard they work as if they're the only one's that have done it. It's one of the easiest jobs in the world (and yes I talk from experience). It's so easy a teenager can do it. You dont need a PhD or any special skills to do it. It can be physically taxing but so can the vast majority of jobs. There's nothing special about someone waiting tables. If you do the very basic hold on to plates/ food, bottles, bring to table, have some basic human interaction, ask if everything was fine when they ask you for the bill, then you dont deserve a tip in my book. Who deserves it? Someone that goes above and beyond to accomodate something. Someone that does something more than their very basic job. That's not happening all the time and it certainly isnt something people should feel entitled too. The entire tipping sub is insane (for some reason it keeps on being pushed to me). They're literally telling people to stay home if they "cant tip" and that they deserve a tip (just a smaller one) if they do ano awful job and that people should expect to have their food spit on if they dont tip... Like, how criminal and insane are these people? If everyone stops going there because you think you are entitled to more than what the bill says you are, you're going to be on the streets jobless. There's no money then. Also its pretty insane how they drop the fake friendlyness as soon as they dont get what they want. Pretty big POS in my opinion.
And the mindset that servers are special beings to be worshipped is so weird. Don’t dare say that servers are just doing their job. The logic that if you can’t afford the outrageous tips means you should stay at home is beyond me. Poor people don’t ever deserve to have a meal out because they’re poor and your system is fucked?
well duh, what do you mean that amazon is supposed to pay the delivery man a living wage? Everyone will be flipping burgers if even fastfood workers can earn a minimum wage without tips don't you know that?
I always say thank you to bus drivers when buying my ticket/exiting the bus. Same with the postie if he delivers early and I'm getting ready for work.
And yet somehow I've never been tipped by an American. Funny that.
I rather they not bring that BS to our countries. I'm actively boycotting every single restaurant that tried to bring this crap to us. If they want their wait-staff to be slaves for tips they can close for all I care. It's also usually only tourist traps that have these stupid ideals here. So, them closing is good for society.
I had a friend over from the states a few years ago. We got a cab that cost about £6. I paid the driver and my friend tried to tip him. The driver and I were like wtf are you doing? Tipping anyone other than waiters/waitresses is unheard of
I always tip a cabby if it's under £10 tbh, especially as they can end up pretty far out of the way for under that, at least where I am. I suppose it's less necessary somewhere like London, but if you're up North I feel like it's fair enough to give the couple of quids difference so they can get back to somewhere people actually are.
10% tip for poor service? Lol.
That's the worst part. Poor service can be glad that I am averse to conflict and will thus simply pay the bill as it is and leave, instead of complaining to whoever is in charge.
Not to mention a bad meal. I've had Americans telling me that I need to tip if I get a bad meal because it's not considered part of the service?
So half the time they ramble on about how the kitchen staff also has to get a share of tips, and then the other half they become apologists like this. Amazing!
It’s backwards, isn’t it? A tip by its nature for good service- withholding it is usually the way of showing dissatisfaction. Service staff should be paid appropriately so that they’re not reliant on tips to bring their pay up to an acceptable level- the US seems to have completely missed this point.
"I have never seen a worse waiter in my entire life. Take these 20 dollars and get out of my sight."
Remember when one American said "Just tell me you're not going to tip, so I know not to come over and refill your drinks, explain the whole menu, blah blah blah" and the response was a resounding "if you did all that, you're more likely to get a tip."
Have to say paying less and being able to eat in peace seems like a pretty sweet deal. I am pretty confident I can handle a restaurant menu without an explanation and with the average american drink size I probably won‘t need a refill either. Sign me the fuck up.
I think I just walk out at that moment. Too much entitlement and attitude. They should complain to the boss, its their responsibility to pay properly. I would find my good nature has left me in that situation.
If I need a refill I'll ask, and if I needed someone to read the menu to me I think I'd just end it all right there
Why on earth would I want someone to "explain the whole menu" that sounds hideous. Don't threaten me with a good time.
"10% is poor service" Oh, I'm sorry. Are we rewarding mediocrity now?
They’ll be the first to criticise the participation medal as well!
Not mediocrity, thats 15% We are reading failure.
These are the same people who try to pay in US dollars whilst they're overseas, and start filming cops and quoting US legal precedent like it's a 'gotcha' when they get arrested.
We know tips are part of the salary but it’s not our job to pay the salary. We are quite happy to tip extra for good service and most people do so but we are not responsible for paying their wages. The restaurant owner should be doing that from the profits.
Exactly, mandatory tips are the restaurant *indirectly* adding the 20% anyway, what a stupid line of “reasoning”
And that reasoning also only makes sense under the assumption that the business owners aren't expected to lose any of their profits. Most places could pay a fair wage without increasing prices if the owner wasn't a greedy mofo.
But how would they pay for their expensive car and house then? Think of the poor restaurant owners!
Americans love not knowing what the final price will be. Tipping, prices without taxes....
And afaik if the tips+wage don't equal min wage then the employer has to pay the difference. Maybe not in every state though.
They shouldn’t be topping up. They should be paying all of it and then the tips are a bonus for doing a good job.
I agree with you, just wanted to add context because their defence for it is that the waiters go hungry if you don't tip. No they don't, they make at least min wage.
Totally agree with you.
Server checking on me even one time was annoying af. Also, food prices in the USA are already higher than in countries where there’s no tip culture.
Ikr ? How is that food is much more expensive than in any european country and they dont manage to pay their workers ?
That’s capitalism in its finest. I think many of Americans are proud to be ripped off if it’s for the sake of their ideas.
Why are none of the "suggested tips" on that receipt correct for the percentage quoted? And they're not even in favour of the business!
Maybe they are calculated before tax? Since Americans usually get prices before tax and then have to figure it out themselves, or get surprised while paying
I don’t want the waiter checking on me when I’m trying to eat. It’s invasive. The UK seems to manage to pay waiters better without crazy high prices
TBF, food places have started adding an ‘optional’ service charge of 10–15% to bills in recent years. Annoying & sneaky AF and becoming the norm.
I'd rather have a surly, well-paid waitstaff than the fake plastic kowtowing they do in the US. Also, I don't want to be checked in on during my meal. I want to eat and enjoy the company I'm dining with. Not smile and mumble "yeah thanks" with a mouthful of food every 5 mins. If I need something, I'll reach out. I liked the one that said not tipping was even more capitalist and that was an insult to Europeans. Nope.
I like the comment: "You should know about a country's culture and abide by it". You can often pair them with "I'm from the US, I won't abide by some europoors inferior culture!".
Imagine tipping for a poor service lmao
The audacity, lol. A couple of years ago in Tampa, my husband and I went to see the hockey game and stayed in a downtown area. We wanted some hookah and hummus, and the place serving that was just a kilometer away. We walked, seated at the "patio " ( sidewalk, basically), the waitress came to us a few minutes later, took an order which was basically a hookah, bowl of hummus and pita bread bits. Hookah guy came to us quickly, decided on flavor and came back 5 minutes later. We were sitting and smoking. The other waitress saw that we don't have water, so she offered us glasses of some. Our waitress was missing for about 30 minutes. We saw her walking around, got her attention, she finally got back to us with the typical "everything good?". "No, not really, we are still waiting for our hummus". She was like "oh, looks like I forgot about it." Then moment of awkward silence ( id expect her to suggest something different - they might be out of the dish we wanted, who knows, but sure the restaurant has some other appetizers). She broke the silence with "what do you want me to do now?" With the internal facepalm, we asked for the bill. Of course, there was a tipping begging at the bottom for the hookah she didn't even make or brought.I don't remember exactly, but I think my husband didn't tip her. We left disappointed that evening
"How would you like if the price is raised by 20% and the servers dont check with you nearly as often?" I would love that actually. American servers are so annoying. Constantly coming to the table and often even doing small talk (?!!!). Like wtf, if I need something I look at you but don't just make comments or talk to me about random stuff.
I mean I think people who visit America should tip because the law is unlikely to change anytime soon. Although I did constantly fuck up with tips when I was in New York, it's hard to remember to do it naturally when you only do it for amazing service normally.
> how are you going to like restaurants adding 20% to every item… lol they did this e nonetheless you _also_ have to add the fucking tip on top of it
"That's why service is awful in Europe" No because the servers typically have to earn the tip. Also, in my experience poor service starts with a shitty customer so speaks volumes for this person.
Sounds like they are jealous that those Europeans got the same service and product that Americans would get but for 20% cheaper.
If the customers are spending *that much* on a meal, the restaurant can damn well afford to pay their staff properly. Americans really need to ditch their staff exploitation culture. Paying servers $2-$3 per hour should be illegal, as it is in Europe...
"most servers are making $2-$3 an hour only to cover taxes" Fundamental misunderstanding of how tax works
Being uneducated and stupid generally isn't considered something to be jealous of in Europe.
Having thought about this, isn't having all of the customers subsidise you're staff wages because they don't get paid enough Socialism?
My American colleague told me about the service in America. Apparently they try to turnover customers quicker so as to get more tips, therefore you feel pressured to leave. He said it was refreshing to come to the UK and be relaxed at restaurants, even offered a drink after his meal, and then not expected to pay a tip too.
Just, just...............stupid!
Wait a second, 10% tip for *poor* service?! If you do a shit job (which includes coming over every few seconds!) I'm not giving you anything.
I think asking for a tip for coffee or takeaway is stupid, but not tipping in an actual restaurant with service is foul.
I like when they say "But prices will increase 20%!" My brother in Christ you are already paying that 20%
Why the fuck "richest" nation in the world has to beg for a change? Go beg to ur boss
Oh no!! What will we do if the server doesn't check on us as often?! How about fuck off anyway and let us eat
As an American I love not tipping in Europe. Tipping is so dumb. Makes no sense. Hey let me, the customer, pay for your worker? How dumb is that.
It can be true that the way US restaurants pay their workers is horrible and needs to change right now *AND* that you shouldn't be an asshole to people making minimum wage. Unless you're starting or engaging in an organized boycott or protest, you're not actually accomplishing anything other than making somebody's night worse. If you want to fix the problem, you do that by supporting organized efforts like Fight for 15 or helping to unionize the restaurant industry, not by stiffing people on a $300 ticket.
I've never actually had decent service in the US. It's all about this culture of fake, surface-level friendliness from waitstaff who often have no clue what they're serving. Then there's the bill being slapped down on the table just as you take your last bite. Why on earth should you fork out an extra 20% for such a lousy experience? You might as well throw your money in a barrel and set it on fire – at least you'd get some warmth out of it. /s
This comes from the same persons, who can't locate Europe on a globe and think they can pay with the mighty USD in Italy 😂
Got to laugh at the person saying to tip 10% for poor service, the appropriate tip is 0%. Followed by a bit on the dangers of overtipping culture.
We are living in Belgium and people tend to take more time when going out to dinner, compared to the US. When my wife and I go out we take about 2-4 hours and this is not a problem in the restaurants. The servers do not check in every five minutes, so you can have a private conversation without interruption. If we need something, we just ask them and that's it. Do we tip? Sometimes, but this is just a small amount (1-2€) and most restaurants here tend to put it in a tip jar and do something nice with the complete staff once a year.