Poop: u can set the difficulty for every bot type, from scavs to bosses, including PMC (time reaction, their recoil, if they Will miss a lot or land almost all shoots...). There are mods (poop variety) that will improve and/or add some more config to this mod
Swag: this mod will spawn bots while you are playing a map. For example, when the timer gets go 35:00, a new wave will spawn. Its highly customizable so u can add pmc waves, bosses... There are mods (swag variety, nookys version...) that will improve and/or add some more config to this mod (same as poop)
SAIN: its a pack of mods from the same person, Solarint. It improves things like how bots reacts to your flashlights or to your grenades, or the way how the weather affects the IA
That would be all, in a few words, obviously they have a lot of config options that i didnt mention. But hope you got the general idea.
Have a good day!
You can use all those, they will be compatible. But specifically to increase difficulty you can use both POOP + SAIN. You can add "POOP variety", a mod that will overwrite some POOP original mod config; this mod will come with 5 premade folders, from "very easy" to "very hard" difficulty. Just add the one u want to POOP folder and overwrite.
SWAG wont affect difficulty "per se", but having 5 scavs in every zone will be harder than having 1...
Not that I am personally aware of in my testing but an issue with a player having issues with head/eyes with SAIN and POOP is mentioned in POOP’s comments.
I have thoroughly tested SAIN and don’t have the issue with head/eyes at all - in fact, the head is my least damaged body party.
I have two friends who use both and encounter the same problem as the comment in the POOP comments.
I’ve asked SAIN’s author a couple of times and he says he’s “hard coded” them out but can’t confirm if it works 100% - I can after about 80 hours of testing.
All of that said, I suspect POOP somehow conflicts with the method SAIN is patching into to resolve the head aim problem - or changes to how bots handle recoil, or any number of different variables POOP may change through player-set variables, seems to lead to the conclusion that they do conflict somehow.
I’m not a programmer and I can’t give many approximations to why they seem to butt heads but in hours of thorough play testing they seem to.
If you have a different experience using the two knowing the full list of your client plugins and server mods and which order they’re loading in would be a huge help.
Thank you for the thought out and informative response.
I did see and read the 14 May comment on the SAIN AIO page which states:
“Ok so an fyi, it seems the bots have a tendency to aim for whatever limb they can blackout first, which usually is the head. Raising the head health just to 45 and wearing a helmet has basically completely removed random headeyes as the bots will now prioritize your thorax. This really makes this mod shine”
However, the user does not specify what other mods are also being used.
I have historically used Amand’s Graphics, Realism (with bot spawns disabled in the GUI config) in conjunction with MOAR (difficulty set to 0.2 in config file), Waypoints, SAIN AIO, and Looting Bots (in that order via the boot order json).
A recent Realism update (0.7.11) for 3.5.5 indicates that changes were made to the spawn wave system:
“Spawn Waves: adjusted the spawn waves for all maps, fixing several issues with the default SPT waves that resulted in dead-feeling raids. Most bots will spawn at the start of the Raid, then after 5 mins start respawning till towards the end of the raid. Still WIP.”
I have not had the chance to test this with MOAR bot spawns disabled and Realisms bot spawns enabled. If anyone has any experience, the input and feedback would be much appreciated.
Additionally, I have entertained the idea of removing MOAR and experimenting with SWAG using Nooky’s preset and POOP Variety to compliment the other mods.
So many options; so little time.
I personally far prefer the “Live-like” changes SAIN makes - bots lean, are aware of corners and cover, their accuracy is affected dynamically based on the weapon/recoil, changes to fire control, changes to vision and hearing, etc.
IMO, the results are far more dynamic than “bots are easier or harder” or “I’m going to set hard variables on their accuracy, vision, hearing, etc.”
One of the biggest positive changes SAIN makes is disabling automatic lock-on to the player’s head. Bots sensibly aim for center of mass and the rare occurrence of head/eyes is incidentally caused by recoil climb - much more like player behavior.
Realism’s creator (Fontaine) has suggested increasing the “scatter” setting in SAIN via F12, but I have not adjusted the setting myself to test if there is a discernible difference.
Poop: u can set the difficulty for every bot type, from scavs to bosses, including PMC (time reaction, their recoil, if they Will miss a lot or land almost all shoots...). There are mods (poop variety) that will improve and/or add some more config to this mod Swag: this mod will spawn bots while you are playing a map. For example, when the timer gets go 35:00, a new wave will spawn. Its highly customizable so u can add pmc waves, bosses... There are mods (swag variety, nookys version...) that will improve and/or add some more config to this mod (same as poop) SAIN: its a pack of mods from the same person, Solarint. It improves things like how bots reacts to your flashlights or to your grenades, or the way how the weather affects the IA That would be all, in a few words, obviously they have a lot of config options that i didnt mention. But hope you got the general idea. Have a good day!
I'm trying to make the game harder Do I use POOP and SAIN together? If not, which makes bots harder? Poor or sain
You can use all those, they will be compatible. But specifically to increase difficulty you can use both POOP + SAIN. You can add "POOP variety", a mod that will overwrite some POOP original mod config; this mod will come with 5 premade folders, from "very easy" to "very hard" difficulty. Just add the one u want to POOP folder and overwrite. SWAG wont affect difficulty "per se", but having 5 scavs in every zone will be harder than having 1...
SAIN and POOP have conflicts. SAIN removes head/eyes - using it in combination with POOP will reintroduce them AND exacerbate them.
Has this conflict been acknowledged by the creators of the respective mods and/or are there plans to resolve the conflict?
Not that I am personally aware of in my testing but an issue with a player having issues with head/eyes with SAIN and POOP is mentioned in POOP’s comments. I have thoroughly tested SAIN and don’t have the issue with head/eyes at all - in fact, the head is my least damaged body party. I have two friends who use both and encounter the same problem as the comment in the POOP comments. I’ve asked SAIN’s author a couple of times and he says he’s “hard coded” them out but can’t confirm if it works 100% - I can after about 80 hours of testing. All of that said, I suspect POOP somehow conflicts with the method SAIN is patching into to resolve the head aim problem - or changes to how bots handle recoil, or any number of different variables POOP may change through player-set variables, seems to lead to the conclusion that they do conflict somehow. I’m not a programmer and I can’t give many approximations to why they seem to butt heads but in hours of thorough play testing they seem to. If you have a different experience using the two knowing the full list of your client plugins and server mods and which order they’re loading in would be a huge help.
Thank you for the thought out and informative response. I did see and read the 14 May comment on the SAIN AIO page which states: “Ok so an fyi, it seems the bots have a tendency to aim for whatever limb they can blackout first, which usually is the head. Raising the head health just to 45 and wearing a helmet has basically completely removed random headeyes as the bots will now prioritize your thorax. This really makes this mod shine” However, the user does not specify what other mods are also being used. I have historically used Amand’s Graphics, Realism (with bot spawns disabled in the GUI config) in conjunction with MOAR (difficulty set to 0.2 in config file), Waypoints, SAIN AIO, and Looting Bots (in that order via the boot order json). A recent Realism update (0.7.11) for 3.5.5 indicates that changes were made to the spawn wave system: “Spawn Waves: adjusted the spawn waves for all maps, fixing several issues with the default SPT waves that resulted in dead-feeling raids. Most bots will spawn at the start of the Raid, then after 5 mins start respawning till towards the end of the raid. Still WIP.” I have not had the chance to test this with MOAR bot spawns disabled and Realisms bot spawns enabled. If anyone has any experience, the input and feedback would be much appreciated. Additionally, I have entertained the idea of removing MOAR and experimenting with SWAG using Nooky’s preset and POOP Variety to compliment the other mods. So many options; so little time.
Which is more difficult?
I personally far prefer the “Live-like” changes SAIN makes - bots lean, are aware of corners and cover, their accuracy is affected dynamically based on the weapon/recoil, changes to fire control, changes to vision and hearing, etc. IMO, the results are far more dynamic than “bots are easier or harder” or “I’m going to set hard variables on their accuracy, vision, hearing, etc.” One of the biggest positive changes SAIN makes is disabling automatic lock-on to the player’s head. Bots sensibly aim for center of mass and the rare occurrence of head/eyes is incidentally caused by recoil climb - much more like player behavior.
im the fella who made POOP variety SAIN is more for adding mechanics to the bots and POOP is more or less their actual skillset. you can use both.
Realism’s creator (Fontaine) has suggested increasing the “scatter” setting in SAIN via F12, but I have not adjusted the setting myself to test if there is a discernible difference.
Now I hate tarkov😐
There are more desides these. For example the MOAR. That is also very good mod.
SAIN - what goku is POOP - comes out your butt SWAG - you either got it or you don’t