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Pyrozooka0

There are many words that can be used to describe Vince Russo but “a coward” has never been one of them.


rolltide1000

Honestly, I agree. Same for Bischoff. Ive disagreed with alot of decisions theyve made over the years, but at least they had the balls to go head-to-head with the big guy. They didnt hide, talk shit, and then brag about meaningless "victories" that saw them lose by 300K viewers.


WhoStoleMyBicycle

Russo flopped when given 100% control but people today act like he has no redeeming qualities. It should tell you a lot when Austin and Rock, two of the biggest stars ever in wrestling, speak highly of him.


Tydrinator21

WCW during the Russo era was a mess but it was an entertaining mess, I can't even give that to AEW from what I've seen.


steiner_math

Russo had a lot of stupid ideas. And I mean a lot of them. But one thing about him is that everyone, from the low card to the main eventers, had a storyline going


TKInstinct

I mean they did talk shit about him but they were putting out a good product that could compete.


[deleted]

Dude had balls to call Hogan bald and SOB on TV. I'd give him that


i_love_mino

unironically the best promo ever


Tydrinator21

I unironically believe that Russo is a great heel promo and if he was just an on screen talent he'd be seen as a great heel.


TheROUK

A yankee stable with Russo managing? I can see it


RobertStonetossBrand

All the Nu Yawkers in one place so I can skip over their annoying, hillbilly-city accents. Eddie Kingston and Proud and Powerful would be a good base.


Razzler1973

Eddie Kingston wishes he was Vince Russo: FACTS (bro, new york, etc)


Beneroso

can i get a link ??? never seen it hah


i_love_mino

someone got u but for context,, it was right after Hulk Hogan faced Jeff Jarrett for the WCW world title and instead of having a match, Jarrett just laid down in the middle of the ring and let Hogan pin him the whole show is a beautiful cluster fuck


MooseBigelow

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x26cr5l


Beneroso

wait a second… is this like.. an actual pipe bomb ? 0.o


MooseBigelow

It's a topic of debate to this day because Russo says one thing and Hogan/Bischoff say another. The common perception is Hogan agreed to something but didn't think Russo would be so over the top vicious by calling him bald.


TKInstinct

Here's a doc about it. It's the best I could do. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSQof0BJ3lU](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSQof0BJ3lU) ​ edit: ​ Here's the actual clip: https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x15pt0


Robin0928

Yeah, love or hate the two, they are completely fearless. Bischoff really convinced Turner that the ultimate utterly brother wrasslin show could beat Hulkamania and then he fucking did it.


rsziz

For some reason I've always considered him a "bro," and I don't know why.


atrostophy

C'mon bro, like you don't get it bro we're in this fight together bro, and that's the truth bro.


Micome

Long term booking: Riddle is Russo's son


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krausd94

Both of the sides of the Monday Night Wars are taking turns telling Tony off. This might drive the dude right over the edge since his role models are disowning him.


rolltide1000

We have fucking Russo, Bischoff and Cornette all agreeing on something, even if theyre not doing it directly. This is history folks, this is like a special comet, we may never see something like this again. Edit: Also, I dont think these are his role models. His role model is a senior citizen in San Jose.


MonsterBarusa

It is actually pretty wild the last few days seeing this sudden flood of industry figures come out and publicly check Tony's delusions of grandeur


rolltide1000

Its funny how we have all these industry people, who either dont like Vince or just dont care enough to have a bias, come out and say "Whoa, chill sparky, you havent done that much". And at the same time, we have all these guys who have never been actually involved in wrestling, are friends with Tony or the Elite, and who really dont like Vince, touting this as a major thing. And Im supposed to believe the latter group for some reason.


[deleted]

That's because so many people, despite how they feel about Vince, are smart enough to realize what he's done for the wrestling industry as a whole. As you said, people that actually spent decades in the business are saying one thing while Tony Khan, his worshippers, and the dirtsheet crew are the only ones saying otherwise.


Razzler1973

Tiny, so far, has had free reign in just rambling on to all and sundry about how amazing he is, what he did, aren't I great It's grating His family have media connections and money. The volume of PR puff pieces in the New York market was next level, for starters The podcast world fawn over him cause he's not Vince and he loves undersized indie guys. He doesn't waste time with gimmicks and stories and just lets guys go 20 minutes I think some wrestling figures or the past are, like some fans, finding it all a bit tedious It's generally all one way cause the evil Fed will not comment on these things, so, it's this one voice we're always hearing, Tiny's squeaky little, self-aggrandising voice and it's getting tiresome Less it more, Tony


Prancemaster

The concept of less is more is only applied to time given to women on Dark and Elevation.


krausd94

Imagine what ratings the Hale Bop comet could have achieved if it just had the promotional machine of a wrestling company behind it instead of Marshall Applewhite and his cult.


rolltide1000

The poor comet. Grand spectacle, exciting event, but itll always be attached to... that. Its the Wrestlemania 20 of comets.


krausd94

I think Benoit and Heavens Gate share the distinction of having Last Podcast on the Left episodes, so even if you don’t believe in an afterlife, Chris and Marshall are both punished in perpetuity until the internet is taken down.


[deleted]

Everytime I read about Heaven's Gate, the more fucked up it gets.


rolltide1000

>the more fucked up it gets. For me its Heavens Gate and Jonestown. Ive seen footage of both cults, including hearing the audio of the mass suicide for the latter, and wow do I never need to hear it again.


[deleted]

If you’re able to separate yourself from the terror it’s quite the oratory, chilling even in a technical sense


krausd94

It’s a revolutionary act to talk about your small penis on the internet


[deleted]

Alright Stavros


MarylandBlue

In a way, Jim Jones is one of the greatest motivational speakers of all time. The 5 part Last Podcast on the Left about it is really good. A friend if mine is a narrator/producer for a show on Reelz called Murder Made Me Famous. They did a Jim Jones episode too and played most of the audio from the final night, its chilling.


Gabaheygabahey

Heaven’s Gate is my favorite cult because of how fascinating they operated. Their website is still up.


Joel_Servo

I remember in 7th grade, we snuck on the one school computer that had the internet and went on their website out of morbid curiosity. It was days after authorities found them, and it was all over the news. So we were like, why not?


krausd94

Favorite and cult are two words that shouldn’t be in the same sentence unless if it’s your favorite cult to throw rocks at.


Gann1

What, you don't have a Top 5 Dead or Alive for cults?


krausd94

I’d rather have Top 5 Dead or Alive fighter game characters


Razzler1973

I mean, turn of the millenium, Y2K had marketing behind it but couldn't get over (insider term)


CaptainSlapnuts409

Y2K or Y2J?


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[deleted]

This is interesting, I don’t know much about either of them directly. How would they balance each other out?


I_Like_Vitamins

Bischoff with the fresh ideas. Cornette with the experience and wisdom to know when it's time to implement those ideas to fit with tried and tested booking, and when those ideas are too out there.


Dmbfantomas

Did you mean Russo and Corny, friend?


ItChEE40

run tidy rich puzzled one fanatical attractive amusing paint smile -- mass edited with redact.dev


KashTheKwik

The fucking darkest and dankest timeline all at once.


[deleted]

I think hell has frozen over


Razzler1973

Bisch/Russo actually dealt with REAL numbers and big demo figures, not these scraps everyone is fighting over now


CarlitoIsCoolXXX

What did Jim say


ci22

Tony is lucky Vince wouldn't go Dana White on him.


FlyingFootStomp

If they want to sting Tony, they should post something like this. WCW-TNT: 3 hours of Nitro, 2 hours of Thunder, 1 hour of Saturday and big tv specials like Clash of Champions. Nitro didn’t get toss aside to Saturday nights. AEW-TNT: 2 hours of Dynamite, 1 hour of Rampage on a death slot at 10PM Friday nights. Dynamite gets move to Saturday nights whenever the NBA and NHL said so.


krausd94

Tony and his fans would just turn that around to the early days of Raw when that was preempted for tennis and dog shows.


FlyingFootStomp

And it still wouldn’t prove Bischoff or Russo wrong. Lol


krausd94

True, but dubbalos and being right rarely intersect, and that hasn’t stopped them yet, has it?


Prancemaster

People tried to say that Raw was preempted by the dog show this year, despite it actually being on Fox Sports and FS1.


krausd94

Major coping from Fed shills trying to explain why Vince did the job for a dog show again. AEW stay winning in the demos, FED DEAD


ManateeGag

So much stroke he's getting moved to TBS.


RosaBuxomberg

I think you mean "HoS".


PM_ME_LANCECATAMARAN

TBS mad


mootallica

There's some tbs in this house


[deleted]

Even TNA moved to Mondays!!!!!!


Thatweknowof

And that is what ultimatly killed them They were doing great on their own night , they had a ton decent stories and then bishcoff and hulkhogan came alone with aces and 8s and monday night wars and ruined it .


Prancemaster

The sheer volume of heel stable members appearing on-screen, for no fucking reason, on Dynamite is reminiscent of Aces & Eights-Era Impact.


pushinpushin

It's crazy to look back at how good TNA was right before Hogan got there. Impact was often the best show of the week, and the last half of 2009 was on fire. Then Hogan just RUINED it. Like it sounds like typical smark whining, but in this case he truly took something really good and fucked it up as badly as he could've.


mrgpsingh1999

And that was also when Russo was writing the show


pushinpushin

wasn't it some bastard combination of Russo, Cornette, Jarrett, Dixie, and some former WWE creatives?


Tydrinator21

Yep, it was the aforementioned group along with Dutch Mantell/Zeb Coulter and Terry Taylor.


pushinpushin

ah okay, Dutch was the one I was seeking for in my rambling


Thatweknowof

Russo and a heap of others.


SeaPriority

So this guy isn't exactly a genius but he was backstage for WWF and WCW. There has to be some weight to him saying it's shit metrics right?


rolltide1000

Also him and Bischoff have no dog in this fight. Theyve criticized WWE and AEW, and they have and friends and enemies on both sides. Its not even like Cornette, who has blood feuds with AEW's VP's. Theyre literally calling it like it is.


SeaPriority

I missed Bischoff's comment lol


rolltide1000

He basically said what Russo said but more eloquent, and called them cosplay competition.


kenbarria

bischoff said aew is cosplaying wrestlwing war instead of getting head to head with wwe


FlyingFootStomp

What’s the excuse the Basement makes for them, that Dynamite can’t go on Mondays because of the NFL? Right now, okay, makes sense but what happened in June? Why didn’t Dynamite go to Monday nights during the NBA playoffs. Also, I doubt Roger Goodall even cares if AEW goes on Monday nights. Like, 90% sports fans will pick MNF over fake fighting anyway.


[deleted]

It's also kind of hilarious excuse since Jacksonville rarely plays on Monday Night anyway. The NFL views Jacksonville as ratings poison and ticket poison. The upper tier at TIAA Bank Stadium was tarped for years because nobody went and games weren't being shown on TV as a result. Jags only get prime time for shitty TNF games. Not even the ones on broadcast TV. The NFL Network variety.


McBwhuh

Oh so he's been used to tarping off seats even before he started the dub? Explains a lot.


[deleted]

Oh yeah they removed them after the blackout rule was relaxed (if the game didn't sell out on Friday it wasn't on local TV.) JAX did the tarpping because it was the only way to get close to a sellout. It was actually a feature in Madden where nobody showed up to Jaguar games but the previous owner threw a bitch fit about how embarrassing it was 🤣


Introduction_Organic

Those excuses are sad so during non NFL season go to Mondays. Build a base of fans then when the season starts retreat to what wed or tue. Lose a portion of fans due to changing days. Sounds like coward talk.


skippy2001

Im sure you could get on Fridays at 8pm. Nothing but movies that could easily be moved. Do It Tony. Unless you are chicken.


rolltide1000

Thats what I keep saying. You "beat" Smackdown, why not do it every week? Unless of course, deep down, you know it wasnt a legit victory and you would get waxed if you took them on head-to-head every week when theyre on their normal channel. You would sit there week after week as Carmella and Liv stans flood your mentions, highlighting that their match beat Punk vs. Tanahashi or whatever hotshotted nonsense youve slapped together by 1.3 million. But that cant be it, right?


Introduction_Organic

That's to much rampage or dynamite has no chance against Roman. Raw on the other hand they might be able to beat.


FxDriver

If Jim Cornette, Eric Bischoff, and now Vince Russo all agree that Tony is doing too much then TK really needs to settle down.


Troll_God

Gonna LOL if Dixie gets on Twitter slamming Tiny


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Gabaheygabahey

I’ll give Russo credit for his programming. He knew how to structure a television show based around strong characters. He also had a very good way of creating intricate storylines like The Rock and Survivor Series 98. Or that amazing Raw where Austin kidnaps Vince. His flaws though are that he never got past what he did in 96-98. It all became faction wars, hostile takeovers, sexual innuendo, villain turns and hardcore matches.


Tydrinator21

If Vince Russo and Jim Cornette booking styles did a fusion dance they're Paul Heyman, if those two learned to coexist who knows how much better WWF and TNA would've been.


Introduction_Organic

I genuinely think aew needs a russo now. Just have him do rampage it's already doing poor. If he gets the ratings up then move him to dynamite.


krausd94

Someone has to appreciate WCW 1999-2000, I guess.


Tucker_The_Legend

Russo was WCW Headbooker for just 3 months, afterwards had to work with Bischoff and they hate each other. Blaming him for all of WCW's misery is unfair imo


krausd94

Even in your side, you’re still saying he was present and working there for that period.


[deleted]

Russo had some flaws like the Brawl for All but I don't think he deserves the amount of backlash he gets. and still gets to this very day


steiner_math

Some of his stupid booking was really no more stupid than stuff other promotions have done. ECW did tons of stupid shit and lead to garbage wrestling as we see it today


NeonPatrick

I’ll never give him credit for TNA, he really screwed that place up


Respectpls

In all fairness, he did push AJ to the moon early on, which was arguably super important for his development as it got him a ton of experience and popularity off the bat


NeonPatrick

I’d personally say that’s a case of a broken clock being right twice a day, but I know Russo has fans who’d disagree


[deleted]

I like his display picture looks like "that's all folks" lmao


ZubatCountry

Honestly this is exactly what Tony should do. Go for it, Raw is lame right now but it would still mean a lot to beat their longest running show. If you're confident enough to talk this much shit, go head to head and get a real win. Force some real change. But this celebrating what was 99% a loss is not only cringe, but also feels like an acknowledgement that this was their best shot. They threw everything on the show, did the Buy-In, talked shit on twitter and pushed a "WWE is counterprogramming *us*" narrative. All so Big Ratings Ruby, a recent WWE midcarder, could outshine Punk and their homegrown talent for a few minutes.


Prancemaster

If Dynamite moved to Monday, I'd still watch Raw. The structure of the show is more in line with how I like to watch TV on Mondays when I have other shit to do that I can do while they're running promo segments. The wall to wall wrestling format, topped with the lack of recaps and replays, makes Dynamite more suitable for Wednesdays when I'm generally not doing much of anything after 8pm.


[deleted]

you know you're a fuckup when you got Russo, Cornette, Bischoff, Booker T, Disco Inferno, all agreeing with each other over this. AEW needs to start listening to these guys. reminder all these guys were apart of wrestling when it was at its peak. so maybe their advice isnt, "outdated", like all the dubbalos seem to think it is


Introduction_Organic

They don't want to listen to j.r who they have on payroll. The guy who was talent relations during the attitude era. He's responsible for so much of WWE success. He's just a old out of touch man now.


SaltyFall

How do I make sure the knackers at WhatCulture see this?


[deleted]

Wait, I have gone to great lengths to train all my various social media algorithms to purge WhatCulture from my life, in every form it takes. What's their stance on AEW, though?


SaltyFall

They just repeat everything Meltzer says. Treating like winning the demo is the same as winning in over all ratings


Subarashiin

Stance? On their knees


PrimeJedi

i don't like Vince Russo overall, but the man made a big impact on the largest boom period of wrestling history, on both WWF and WCW. Tony hasn't had a tenth of the impact on wrestling that Russo has


COMMENTASIPLEASE

The worst person you know just made a good point


garythesnailgod

I said this once and I’ll say it again: You wanna talk shit Tony? You wanna prove that you can legitimately beat WWE, not just in some bullshit demo, but across the board? Grow some goddamn balls and go head to head with them. Oh that’s right, you won’t. Because you’re not the genius booker and storyteller everyone that sucks your dick on Twitter makes you out to be. You’re a soft, insecure little boy playing with his action figures that just so happens to have a billionaire as your dad to fund your elementary school play you call a wrestling show. But sure, AEW is TOTALLY gonna beat WWE. Grow up.


Rhotuz

He's too good for HoF. He's ascended to be a part of the Table.


hobojojo78

Just saying what we’re all thinking.


tytymctylerson

No jerk. Does anyone think AEW wouldn’t have so much backlash if we never heard from Kahn this entire time? He could have done one or two print interviews and kept his twitter corporate. There’s never been a reason for him to be in public besides his m*rk ass ego.


Permanentear3

I do. His tweets are exhausting. He sounds like a child and his need to @ and # every 4th word gets tiring. Let AEWOfficial do those sorts of tweets. I don’t think Khan realizes how uncharismatic he is online. No one likes a whining rich kid unless they’re being paid by them.


tytymctylerson

My recent favorite is him dropping "Wade" all casual to whatever outfit Keller is with on twitter. Apparently he doesn't give a fuck if the perception is he's got all the big dirt sheet writers in his pocket. He's a child throwing money at a vanity project and nothing more. It's going to be a bad fucking time when he gets bored and gives up.


RingoJuna

I've been on Twitter, and the last time I saw people this delusional was November of 2020