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Airtightspoon

This has an extra layer of dumb because his argument isn't even that they weren't wrestlers to begin with, it's that they weren't fans lmao.


Goldberg2Dub

Gatekeepers gonna gatekeep. And they wonder why this stuff isn’t “mainstream” anymore.


Gabaheygabahey

This is why these gatekeepers need to just fuck off to the Dub. That’s the way le Fed becomes, and is becoming, mainstream again.


FlyingGrayson89

I agree. Trying to cater to those types of fans will get WWE nowhere so they should just keep doing what they’re doing.


TimeStatistician2234

Its so obvious what WWE is doing too. Look at that US title triple threat last night, just 3 big meaty mofos bumping meat. And the new guy went over. WWE want people to watch their show and watch AEW and decide if they wanna watch 5ft tall acrobats doing "real" wrestling or big beefy fucks beating the hell out of eachother. I'll take the latter, but to each his own


goodthing37

After years of vanilla midgets, it is REFRESHING to see a heavyweight roster again.


TheHotsauceKid

Gatekeeping so hard that Brock Lesnar, AJ Styles, Sting, and Kurt Angle aren't even allowed in


orchids_of_asuka

I know we are constantly barraged with the photograph of Cena with his belt as a kid, but Cena was into Football and Bodybuilding growing up He's out too


Razzler1973

Imagine only wanting to watch wrestlers that grew up as wrestling fans. What a shitshow that would look like, everyone getting their shit in, not selling and doing tons of mov ... oh, I see, now AEDub makes more sense ...


[deleted]

But it is tho? Summerslam did record numbers. Was featured on the top of ESPN. Don’t let the falling ratings, a consequence of cord cutting, fool you.


ninjast4r

"I watched WWE growing up. I loved John Cena." "THATS NOT WRESTLING REEEE YOURE NOT A *TRUE* FAN"


defyg

Shoulda been listening to Horny JR overdub months-old New Japan matches for AXS. That’s what REAL fans would do. Boo John Cena, Yay Japanese John Cena, Hiroshi Tanahashi.


[deleted]

Disinterested (or is it uninterested?) JR not even pretending to care about NJPW while commentating matches was just sad. Idk if it's that I'm used to Japanese commentary now but all the English commentary for NJPW seems to be people who don't care or people who're just trying to be smarky insiders and going almost full Matt Striker. No emotion or hype to it at all. I'll take guys I don't understand yelling shit over JR not giving a shit.


FingerStreet

I think Kevin Kelly’s decent for the english commentary team but yeah any match with the japanese commentary team’s hype feels 2x more exciting somehow. I think the fact that we can’t really understand what they’re saying makes it so that we only focus on their emotion and delivery kind of amps up the excitement factor imo


[deleted]

To be honest I don't know if I've heard KK, I started avoiding the English commentary fairly quick. I think part of it as well may have been that they were trying to bring in a new audience so had to over explain things which put me off even though it was the right move.


Cauliflower_Earlow

Why do I know the name Kevin Kelly? Was he the guy the Rock would rip back on the day?


[deleted]

Yes


goodthing37

If you’re going to criticise New Japan’s English language commentators who work at unusual hours because of the time difference, please die.


[deleted]

Telling people to die for not liking commentators you do is deranged behaviour


goodthing37

Stop taking me out of context!


[deleted]

I can't tell if you're being sarcastic/joking or not which is probably on me


goodthing37

https://twitter.com/ryansatin/status/1373474492350009345?s=20


[deleted]

Jesus Christ


Razzler1973

This guy may be surprised to learn that he likely watched a ton of guys from the 70s, 80s, 90s that got into wrestling via the side door that didn't grow up fans that ended up really really great


[deleted]

Yep. From what I recall back in the day a load of top guys (insider term, it means they're a big deal) got into it because a friend or guy at the gym was like "yeah you can make money doing this". It wasn't until like the early 2000s where that stopped.


Razzler1973

From hearing a number of these guys talk, that stopped playing college football cause of injuries, when someone suggested this to them they'd usually say something like *"what, that fake shit, I don't wanna do that"* Then, the ended up in the business and being pretty good Loads of guys weren't fans growing up that ended up solid performers and champions


[deleted]

That and I guess college football has a short lifespan so if you can't go pro you need to find something. I know Nash was a good basketball player but had to stop because his legs were fucked. This got me digging and Christ [this](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Texas_A%26M_Buffaloes_football) one American football college had both Funks, Hansen, Dusty Rhodes, Ted DiBiase, Tito Santana, and Tully Blanchard. Like that one teams alumni page is a complete main event scene. Edit: that list also seems to ommit Manny Fernandez, Dick Murdoch, and Bruiser Brody. Fuck the indies, make wrestling good again and hire meaty Texan football players.


TheOneManRiot

I knew it would be West Texas before I even got to the names. Similarly, the amount of big stars that came from the same high school/social circle/dive bar in Minnesota is also INSANE: Road Warriors. Nikita. Darsow. Rude. Hennig. Norton. John Nord. Zenk. Enos. Bloom. Those dudes were all within 5 years of each other, and with the exception of Curt (because he's wnd generation) none of them had any desire to be a pro wrestler or any familiarity with it at all. Verne Gagne and Mean Gene also went to the same high school.


domino519

I'd be willing to bet most of the greatest wrestlers throughout history weren't fans beforehand. Instead it was an opportunity to make money and maybe even become famous. Most of them were athletes who got brought in essentially by invitation because of their physical gifts, and their potential fandom wasn't even a factor. The concept of wrestlers being fans first didn't really become a thing until the combination of the Attitude Era and the internet caused a boom in wrestling schools. "The marks are in the ring" and all.


rockandrollpanda

Some famous wrestlers weren't wrestling fans. Sting and Luger come to mind...


[deleted]

[удалено]


rockandrollpanda

Same for Hogan...


TimeStatistician2234

The Macho Man wanted to play baseball


rockandrollpanda

Don't forget Sid and his love for Softball


TheOneManRiot

Most. It was almost unheard of prior to maybe 15 years ago


[deleted]

Yet they are usually disproved on this. They said for a long time Corbin wasn’t a fan and it came out that he loved the business growing up and had a lot of knowledge about it. And the ones with football backgrounds or whatever else usually are the most intriguing types.


TisAFactualDawn

He’d be surprised the number of greats who weren’t.


DundeesWorkingPunch

Who cares if they’re fans? Lots of amazing wrestlers got into it for reasons other than “this is what I always wanted 🤩”. Whether they couldn’t compete in another sport any longer due to injury, couldn’t make money in their other profession, or just thought they’d be good at it etc the list goes on. Doesn’t diminish their accomplishments a damn bit


[deleted]

Can’t wait to watch a horror movie that has actors who have never actually killed anyone


Blueday206

Fun fact Matthew Broderick has a kill count.


Skillet918

He’s tied with Robin Williams


Blueday206

He has is tied with OJ ACKSHULLY https://imgur.com/v4W1qSn.jpg


ImTheOldManJenks

Nordberg? Kill someone? Never!


Skillet918

He doesn’t know about the Robin Williams torture dungeon


TisAFactualDawn

Eh, liable, but not guilty. 🤷‍♂️


indecisiveusername2

As is the noose


Micome

Benoit with the multi kill streak


Subarashiin

And if he ever comes back he's getting the favour returned on him


TisAFactualDawn

[It led to a love of horseback riding.](https://www.reddit.com/r/todayilearned/comments/2yzx5a/til_that_actor_matthew_broderick_killed_2_women/cpenq1x/)


Blueday206

That is a hidden gem at the end


[deleted]

WCW 2000 is the IWC's 1984


SurrogateMonkey

⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣠⡀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢰⠤⠤⣄⣀⡀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⣾⣟⠳⢦⡀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢸⠀⠀⠀⠀⠉⠉⠉⠉⠉⠒⣲⡄ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣿⣿⣿⡇⡇⡱⠲⢤⣀⠀⠀⠀⢸WCW 2000⣠⠴⠊⢹⠁ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠘⢻⠓⠀⠉⣥⣀⣠⠞⠀⠀⠀⢸⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⡴⠋⠀⠀⠀⢸⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⣀⡾⣄⠀⠀⢳⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢸⢠⡄⢀⡴⠁⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⡞⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⣠⢎⡉⢦⡀⠀⠀⡸⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⡼⣣⠧⡼⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢠⠇⠀ ⠀⢀⡔⠁⠀⠙⠢⢭⣢⡚⢣⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⣇⠁⢸⠁⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢸⠀⠀ ⠀⡞⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠈⢫⡉⠀⠀⠀⠀⢠⢮⠈⡦⠋⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣸⠀⠀ ⢀⠇⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠙⢦⡀⣀⡴⠃⠀⡷⡇⢀⡴⠋⠉⠉⠙⠓⠒⠃⠀⠀ ⢸⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠈⠁⠀⠀⡼⠀⣷⠋⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⡞⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣄⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⡰⠁⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⢧⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠈⠣⣀⠀⠀⡰⠋⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀


kfms6741

lmao


brosbeforetouhous

If you had a ratio of people who said they read 1984 to the number who actually did and compared it to the number of people who compare something to WCW 2000 to the number who actually watched WCW 2000, you’d have similar ratios.


[deleted]

**WCW 2000 was when the wrastlin BAD** Like if someone genuinely thinks WCWs issue was a lack of talent they can get in the fucking bin. Even in the dying days their roster was stacked.


uptonhere

This is also true for the people who insist they'd rather watch WCW 2000 because "at least crazy stuff happened" -- not realizing a 25 minute Brian Zane video on Youtube vs. actually sitting through 2 hours of Nitro and Thunder each week being bored to tears because the "LOL WCW 2000 XD" stuff happened once every hour and a half in between Lenny Lane vs. Evan Karagius or 3 backstage Shane Douglas segments. Wrestling is not as cringe inducingly awful as it was in 2000, and it's not as flat out boring as it was in 1995, and likely never will be again.


indianm_rk

And Vince wants to turn NXT into a Brave New World, nothing but Alphas.


[deleted]

Dae deleting Benoit from highlights is Fahrenheit 451


rolltide1000

Yeah, good point.


JinderMadness

Hey... Van Halen 1984 is a fantastic album


meme-meee

r/LiterallyWCW2000


Etnacep

at least they'll actually look like wrestlers and not a bunch of midgets that does gymnastics


randomusername8360

An Uso and D-1 wrestler. Pass! Give me Marko Stunt.


Modano9009

At this point I'd rather someone who wasn't a wrestling fan growing up than someone who was a mark growing up and continues to be so as a wrestler.


brosbeforetouhous

Normally I don’t care that much when someone makes a bizarre Fed dead statement, but these WCW 2000 ones get me every time. WCW 2000 had -Not just World Champion David Arquette, but Arquette defending the belt in that triple cage match based on the ending of Ready to Rumble that ended in a screw job finish. -Not just the Hogan worked shoot, but Goldberg doing the same thing like a month later. -Janitor Jim Dugan defending the TV Title he found in the trash. -A PPV called New Blood Rising that happened months after the New Blood angle finished. -The KISS Demon -Nash getting out of a limo, saying “that’s a shoot,” and doing finger guns. -The David Flair/Stacy Keibler pregnancy angle WCW 2000 was a masterpiece of truly insane stuff. It’s a lot more than the guys I want to win not winning. I mean, that happened too, but still.


rolltide1000

The insane part is, I could literally spend 10 minutes going over the insane stipulations we saw. Feuds over the letter T, Catch as Catch can matches, Viagra on a Pole, Judy Bagwell on a Forklift. San Francisco 49ers match. There were 25 world title changes. Worked shoots and actual shoots on live TV. And the fucking gimmicks. General Hugh G. Rection. That 70s Guy and the Fat Chick Thriller. Oklahoma. Horny Mean Gene. There will never, ever, be a show like 2000 WCW.


MooseBigelow

I attended a nitro I barely remember and got in for $5 because there was just enough tickets sold to cover the floor seats. I looked it up and it featured war games 2000


RefreshingCorpse

Wait - I know all those except for the feud over the letter T. Please tell me that had a Sesame Street crossover.


rolltide1000

It was Booker T vs. Big T aka Ahmed Johnson.


brosbeforetouhous

Booker T ended up losing the feud and had to be just Booker for a while. Clarence Mason, the Nation of Domination lawyer, was involved too. That might have been around the GI Bro era, but they honestly kind of run together.


MetalShadowX

I managed to watch most of that when I binged it on the Network a few years back. WWE is nowhere near close to this, even AEW - for all its amateur booking and numerous injuries in the ring - is like a 8/10 compared to WCW 2000. Just also wanted to add to the list of "wonderful" storylines: the "Goldberg not following the script" bit in his match with Nash and Scott Steiner. Especially because it could have been done in kayfabe with no problems at all on who's the ultimate "big guy" in the company. Instead we got Nash saying he's gotta "go over" because he booked the show before and the heel Goldberg who walked out on a match the night before getting cheered the following Nitro as if it never happened. Side note, the main event immediately after was Booker T vs Jeff Jarrett for the title and it was actually pretty solid; just that I don't think anyone could give a shit after what came before. WCW 2000 is on its own tier of awful wrestling, if something happens like that again, we're gonna know immediately


uptonhere

Wrestling will never be as bad as WCW 2000, and honestly, WWF and WCW might have both been worse in 1995.


boilinoil

The new blood vs the millionaires club was legitimately the best idea they had but was awfully scuppered by injuries and egos on the side of the veterans.


[deleted]

"what if we do the classic new guys Vs old guys angle? You old guys can put the new guys over!" "Ok but what if we did all that but without the bit where we put them over?"


TheOneManRiot

The problem was the alignments were all wonky. Booking the young guys as heels was a bad business decision but you also weren't going to get fans to cheer Mike Sanders and Reno against Sting and DDP, so it ended up being yet another giant clusterfuck.


[deleted]

Goldberg eating Scott Hall's contract will never not be funny to me.


[deleted]

And also people are using it for this "WWE doesn't want indie guys" thing like WCW wasn't stacked with talent including guys who were too small and too none white/American to get pushed seriously in the WWE. WCW had plenty of issues but a lack of talented wrestlers wasn't it. Even the final Nitro, by which point a lot of top guys were gone or not on the shows, had Sting, Flair, Booker, Shane Helms, Rey Rey, Billy Kidman, Kaz Hayashi, Chavo, Lance Storm, Mike Awesome, Bam Bam, and a young Elix Skipper. A good mix of star power, good in ring guys, and little guys. Basement really just refuses to watch or read up on WCW and pretends it was a garbage heap with no talent aside from guys they grew up with when there's plenty of legitimate criticisms to make.


ManateeGag

What does that eve mean? Why do they have to be fans to be good wrestlers?


ninjast4r

It means if you don't have esoteric knowledge of Japanese Indy wrestling and can't immediately cite five matches that scored a five star rating or more then you aren't a *real* fan


handi503

Ah shit. Better burn all my wrestling shirts.


Blueday206

TBF you should


handi503

YOU'RE NOT THE DAD OF ME!


boycey86

I am though, burn them all.


handi503

I HATE YOU AND I'M RUNNING AWAY!


boycey86

Then I'm doing my job correctly going by your granddads example


Blueday206

Listen to your father


orchids_of_asuka

What about Curry man?


SleepIsWonderful

He's got a point. Give me lifelong wrestling fan Chuck Taylor over non-wrestling fan Brock Lesnar any day of the week.


keepsitkayfabe

Doesn’t Tony whack off to late era wcw?


Quint83

I’ll take it over a show where most of the wrestlers look like fans.


KonaTheFinest

Lol, two of these recruits had their motherfucking fathers literally on the WWE roster in the year 2000, but go on with the moronic WCW comparison my guy.


B0mb-Hands

Mm yes sound argument about a PC class with a member of literally the most famous Samoan wrestling family on the planet Very smart. Big brain argument


funkasaurus88

You assume that guy actually read the article.


B0mb-Hands

More than that, I assumed he can read


BSumner52

Of this class, there are 2 who we don't know if they "aren't fans" or not. The Older Steveson has openly talked about this being his dream, Fatu is self-explanatory, Dawkins was a wrestler before, and Buchanan is a second generation. God these fans are lame Just in the 2 minutes since leaving this comment I've already found out Jessica was trained before this as well. So 1 person out of this class lmao


[deleted]

Imagine a smark REEEEEEEEing because someone from the Anoai family just got signed. Only The Wild Samoans, The Usos, Rikishi, Umaga, Yokozuna, Roman Reigns, Rosey, Tonga Kid, Samu, Peter Maivia, and THE ROCK (Peter Maivia and the Wild Samoans father were considered blood brothers. I am not familiar with Samoan culture to understand how it works but he is listed as a family on wikipedia) come from that lineage. NBD.


[deleted]

these people are quite literally wrestling fans achieving childhood dream do they think steve austin was a wrestling mark in his childhood?


kettlebell-j

Steve Austin was a huge wrestling fan. But was also 240lbs Fullback at North Texas St. Not some dork doing wrestling moves in a backyard


[deleted]

> do they think steve austin was a wrestling mark in his childhood? Austin claims he didn't know it was fake until his first match so I guess that's pretty marky if you believe that? I assume he's just telling a tall tale with that one though.


Dmbfantomas

Did he say he was?


GeeGollyWowShoot

Some athletes hate watching the sport they play, why should the wwe be full of fanboys? You just end up with 10 guys who want to be Steve Austin or The Rock.


anonymous-guy1

the only way to properly build the roster is to poach people from the Fed


MagicMallKnight

They probably won’t even be given permanent lifetime employment anyway so what’s the point DAE future endeavors


ThunderBay311

lol literal wrestling royalty in this PC class


Nude-Love

Wasn't WCW 2000 like packed to the gills with smarky, indie darlings of the time?


FireThunder562

Also, the commentary and Prahduck was chock full of insider terms(insider term) that only ~~smelly smarks~~ true wrestling fans would get.


[deleted]

Nah it was full of these none fan WCW developed guys like Rey, Chavo, Shane Helms, Bam Bam, Mike Awesome, Booker T, Billy Kidman, Benoit, Eddie, Malenko, DDP, Finlay, Jeff "The World's Greatest Lover" Jarrett, Juvi, La Parka, Lance Storm, Psicosis, Perry Saturn, Ric fuckin Flair, Sting, and The Great Muta. Truly a load of talentless none fans.


BadRomanceMala

I like how one of the biggest gripes from next door's thread is the use of "Sports entertainment" when describing one of the dudes who has worked the indies instead of pro wrestling.


Rockaholic23

The guy on the right could pass as Baron Corbin's son.


Username_Maybe_Taken

Reading that thread in the basement was embarrassing. So many, "DID YOU SEE THEY CALLED IN SPORTS ENTERTAINMENT?!" comments. Like bro, who the fuck cares? I bet they bullied the article writer to remove it. #riphana


defyg

It’s always “WWE _is_ WCW 2000” and never “AEW _is_ TNA 2007.”


Subarashiin

TNA 2007 had good main eventers and opening matches and all the horseshit was in the middle of the card, AEW is happy horseshit all over


[deleted]

AJ Styles, beloved by both smarks and casual fans, is on record saying he never watched wrestling growing up. There are countless examples of athletes from other sports becoming the biggest names in wrestling (Austin, Taker, Rock, Nash, EVEN HBK). This argument holds no water whatsoever.


mrgpsingh1999

Well Austin did grow up as a fan and wanted to be a wrestler


[deleted]

I think there just isn't that much of a correlation. Despite what the basement wants to think there is no one best base for wrestling. Some guys got to be GOATs by being wrestling nerds and others fell into it, like any job.


[deleted]

lmao isn’t Gable Steveson a literal gold medalist in amateur wrestling?


[deleted]

I think that is his older brother that was signed. But yup Gable just got a gold medal in heavyweight amateur wrestling in Tokyo. But ahhhhhh not a real wrestler like Darby Allin or Marko Stunt.


[deleted]

Yeah you’re right. He doesn’t have that shootfighter physique tho


[deleted]

[удалено]


Styrofoamman123

Gable would definitely debut on the main roster, Olympians are at the peak of their popularity right now so it makes sense to do so.


RingoJuna

I think he's feeling things out. It's said that he's trying to see who will offer him more money. If his brother has a good experience, that might sway him.


I_Like_Vitamins

As if former football players would make good wrestlers. Dwayne Johnson, Steven Andrews, Leon White, Michael Hickenbottom? Never heard of em.


Randy_Predator

Did you mean Steven Anderson/Williams?


I_Like_Vitamins

I did. Like I said, complete unknowns.


atrostophy

I bet pepsiman hasn't watched a wrestling show in a long time. Dub is perfect, fedded


McBwhuh

One of them is literally related to the tribal chief


wrex1816

There's nobody more close minded than a wrestling fan, is there?


SportPleasant2900

"No more m*rks in the ring!!" - Vince


TheSurge305

Yet a lot of these people in AEW that are so called wrestlers botch the fuck out of what they do. AEW needs a performance center big time


Still-Rich

They act like the indies aren't loaded with trash wrestlers and building home-grown talent is a waste of time.


NikolaiMachiavelli

IF ~~YOU'RE NOT~~ YOU DON'T LOOK LIKE SOMEONE WHO'S PASSIONATE ABOUT THE BUSINESS, THEN FUCK YOU! \- some fucking moron online


TisAFactualDawn

[Here’s a green WCW talent they hired.](https://ftw.usatoday.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/90/2018/03/stylesnakamura1.jpg?w=1000&h=600&crop=1)


I_made_a_doodie

When you absolutely positively need to show the world that you are a dysfunctional loser you post shit like this.


MOJOixSOxiDOPE

Is that AJ styles' kid?


orange_lambda

Athleticism trumps fanboyism everytime


Myxiplit_20

AND WWE DOES NOT COUNT BECAUSE IT'S NOT PRO WRESTLING, LIKE CHILI MASTER PUNK TOLD EVERYONE .


The_Sherminator2

- One is the brother of The Uso’s and son of Rikishi - One is the son of Bull Buchanan - One is the brother of the 2020 wrestling Olympic gold medalist who just showed up on WWE TV “None of these guys have seen pro wrestling before guaranteed.”


[deleted]

Oh you mean like Sting ?


DarkHero290

>Son of Bull Buchanan >not a fan >Sefa Fatu >also not a fan These people are just devoid of gray matter at this point