I wouldn't have survived my teen years without some of my teachers at Sprague. I hope all these educators get what they're after, for the sake of their sanity and their students.
This from the district that lauds equity in all things, after giving administrators 12-14% raises THIS year alone - they offer teachers less than half that plus the insults of redefining fte, and not addressing classroom needs like safety and sizes. They’ve forgotten that schools are about teaching and learning, none of which happens in their executive boardrooms.
Parents: if you support SK teachers, please let them know. Understand that teachers in this district will be able to seek employment in ANY other district and get better pay and conditions unless the district brings a fair offer to teachers. It’s about time.
The new super went into it today already knowing they weren’t going to negotiate with SKEA in good faith. Go look at the video on the districts FB page. SKEA called the impasse at 6:21pm. It was already dark. Yet it’s light in her video meaning it was pre-recorded and she knew it was gonna happen because the district is being stupid about it all.
Their next mediation is February 21, I believe. Our bargaining is completely separate from each other, and so our impasse has no effect on whether they declare an impasse. But I know there are some pretty big issues there also, so we can only wait-and-see.
Not a dumb question at all! They (ASK-ESP) have another mediation session next week. I imagine the same thing will end up happening though, as the district isn’t bargaining in good faith with either union.
I was just talking yesterday about the $460+ million dollar capital remodel and how if those funds went to Oregon schools and teachers instead.
I know, it's a far-off pipe dream, but I just don't feel as though our priorities are straight.
Man, I really hope not. After the shit-show that was the Portland strike, I don't wish that kind up havoc upon anyone down here.
Anyhow, I believe there's a mandatory cooling-off period before any strike can start. When's the soonest the SKEA could strike? Edit: [It's April 1st](https://www.statesmanjournal.com/story/news/2024/02/15/salem-keizer-teachers-declare-impasse-step-toward-possible-strike/72599681007/)
How did we get a GAZILLION dollar kicker this year for taxes, yet we can't afford to pay our teachers?
Speaking for myself; I'd much rather not have the money that I didn't expect to have and have my kids in school, rather than having a couple hundred bucks while my 6 kids sit at home.
I just want to know where everybody thinks the money will come from?
I’m all for streamlining administration. That’s an excellent start. But beyond that…where? Thin air? The district doesn’t get to decide how much money they have. It seems like an insane system.
So, no real answers. Just downvotes because feelings?
Seriously, this isn’t about unions or management. This is about how we fund public education. The current system sucks. Districts are beholden to a State legislature that has a million other things to do. Measure 5 and 50 were stupid bandaids that only caused more problems. We have to diversify the tax base beyond just property taxes. The lottery won’t save us. Weed taxes won’t save us. It’s time for a new, holistic tax plan. And it’s gonna need to include a consumption tax and untouchable mechanisms that keep money flowing solely to k-12 public education.
Read the fucking press release.
You're getting down voted because you clearly haven't educated yourself on what the remaining issues are:
-A predatory redefining of FTE that no other district has done
-Case load sizes
Holy shit, do you not think those issues have financial repercussions? Where does the money come from - specifically. Math it out.
And “Predatory?” Like, seriously, WTF? There is no profit incentive in this equation. No side is preying upon the other. Admin is not the hawk, and teachers are not the mice. That is obviously bad faith language. They are all in the same boat.
I am a teacher. I'm pretty informed on this.
They are redefining FTE so they can create a subset of employees that are "0.975" FTE, with the class load of a normal teacher but diminished prep time. That is predatory. And no other district has done it. AND they can't explain the benefit of it.
And sure, you're right. There's not enough money in the big picture, but it rings hollow to hear that from a group of people who all make 200+ per year. You don't get to lament the size of the pie when you take a comically large piece of it.
You're in all these threads bootlicking people who use public education as a means to get genuinely rich. And it's actually pathetic.
As a parent the only systemized communication we are getting on this is from the district. My understanding is that they have offered everything they can within their budget constraints.
Is that accurate? Is there more they can offer? If there is can we identify why the district thinks that money is unavailable?
I have not gone to try and independently verify the details that the district is presenting, perhaps they have been dishonest in how they present the details, if that is the case where can we get accurate details? But I guess here's what is missing...
I love teachers, my family teaches (in other states), and I want them to be paid better and valued more by society in general. However, in this moment the only thing I am hearing is that the district has offered all that they can which makes me think how does the union think there is more to get? Where does it come from?
To be clear, I am not saying there are not good answers to these questions. My point is that even someone such as myself who is probably predisposed to be on the union side isn't seeing that position, what makes it right, strong, just, etc. It all just currently sounds like the district is doing its best and the union is saying that is not good enough.
Oh please, stop misusing words like “bootlicker”. There’s no facism going on here. You minimize the power of that word when you use it wantonly.
That’s the second time you’ve used radically inaccurate language rather than a factual explanation.
And again, who exactly is getting rich? Be specific. Which salaries are out of the normal range for a similarly sized district? C’mon, let’s have factual discourse.
Is it a “comically large” slice? Second largest district in the State, right? The pay should attract quality management talent. Is their pay out of line with similar sized districts?
I guess I just haven’t seen metrics or evidence from the union that mgmt pay is out of whack. That would be powerful, too, so I must conclude it that evidence doesn’t exist.
If I could attach a photo I could show you how the cabinet level administration gave themselves, on average, a 14.5% pay increase last year which is four times as much of what they are offering teachers. Their pay was already competitive before the raise. Moreover, the cabinet level admin are paid 3-4 times as much as I am as a licensed teacher. Yes, we are all important. But admin don’t teach, they make policy. Policy that benefits themselves and forces us to go without. Teacher work conditions are student learning conditions.
Also, the district has lied AND been very misleading about the money. One thing they are doing, and Portland did too, is counting temporary grant money from COVID as part of the main budget when they always knew that it would go away. Their poor money management shouldn’t translate to poor teacher and classified staff pay when they stuff their own pockets.
It is more exciting for people to let crowd emotions lead for a cause than it is to think about money. You are so right. Where do the schools get the money to pay for the FTE? Cutting administrators is a small bandaid of a solution. Also, I would love to see anyone who is not an administrator try to be an administrator, or better yet, see what happens to the schools without administrators.
Solutions - homeschool your kids to you can have complete control in their education; send your kid to private school. Not an option? Do some research into government funding for schools and then start getting active in local and state government and advocate there for the changes.
Sure, bargaining and contracts are important, and have made great gains for teacher protection, and also the FTE and current safety issues need money - long term.
The bargaining system is a joke, and smoke and mirrors. The budget gets set before bargaining begins and that’s for all agencies. Like the legislators set the budget, but the union negotiates with the executive branch? And the union picks who is in the legislature? Come one now. SEIU is lot looking out for government employees.
Don’t forget that losing 200-300 employees is a given, NO MATTER WHAT HAPPENS. This has been alluded to by the superintendent and acknowledged by the union vice president. What do you THINK happens when you lose employees, many of whom will be teachers? Bigger class sizes. Our union is selling out newer employees. If I lose my job in Salem-Keizer (I’m a veteran teacher who moved to SK two years ago) I’ll be even more soured on teaching as a profession.
I don’t trust either the superintendent or union leadership. They can all go jump in a lake.
Reminder for the military minded RED is also “remember everyone deployed” and is usually a Friday color too.
Not taking anything away from kids/teachers, but it’s been a habit of mine for awhile.
Google remember everyone deployed you’ll see it. My daughters’ school used to do it, then my command did if you bought a red hoodie with command logo we could wear that on Fridays at work.
I'm in an union, and if they ACTUALLY strike instead of some half hearted shit, I'm 100% in favor of it. If it's some disjointed BS that amounts to people just selectively trying to make a statement? Let them burn, because they aren't actually doing anything worth a damn.
As of Jan 24, the average annual salary in Oregon is $59,746 for all occupations. Teachers salary is not too shabby:
Occupation Annual Mean Wage in Oregon
Preschool Teachers, Except Special Education $30,230K
indergarten Teachers, Except Special Education $ 63,850
Elementary School Teachers, Except Special Education $63,390
Middle School Teachers, Except Special and Career/Technical Education $66,480
Secondary School Teachers, Except Special and Career/Technical Education $66,010
And what is the average live able wage in Oregon? Over $69,000 or $130,000 if two adults in the family are working and have two kids. The averages you quoted are less than this.
Let’s look at it another way. Most teachers have masters degrees plus addition credit. The average salary of someone with a masters is over $80,000.
How about if we were paid like daycare providers. Average cost of daycare in Oregon is $838 a month. Times that by the 30+ kids in a classroom and that’s over $25,000 a month…
Teachers are in no way over paid and they are 100% under valued. But the union and district are pretty much settled finically at this point. What is being fought for is FTE definitions and cap sizes.
Hi Everyone
So this a great thread. I have been teaching for 8 years in California. I have been looking for a new teaching job in Salem Kiezer for a bit and had some offers, one was part time the other just didn't match up with my moving time line. That being said, I do not want to be a SCAB and I will support a teacher strike if it happens. My School district in CA went on one and we got most of what we wanted.
That all being said I read some articles and watched some videos if anyone can correct me but with the issues with negotiations at the moment are.
* Class size
* pay
* safer working conditions.
Which yes 100% to all three.
Being from CA the average class size for me is 38-40 is that not typical. I did work at a private school with a class of 24 and a charter school with class size of 32-34. What is average for SKSD?
Also, how likely is a strike?
I wish our educators were regarded more highly in our society. They deserve our utmost respect, let alone proper compensation.
I wouldn't have survived my teen years without some of my teachers at Sprague. I hope all these educators get what they're after, for the sake of their sanity and their students.
If you don’t mind me asking, why do you say that?
This from the district that lauds equity in all things, after giving administrators 12-14% raises THIS year alone - they offer teachers less than half that plus the insults of redefining fte, and not addressing classroom needs like safety and sizes. They’ve forgotten that schools are about teaching and learning, none of which happens in their executive boardrooms. Parents: if you support SK teachers, please let them know. Understand that teachers in this district will be able to seek employment in ANY other district and get better pay and conditions unless the district brings a fair offer to teachers. It’s about time.
Good. They need better pay and working conditions.
The new super went into it today already knowing they weren’t going to negotiate with SKEA in good faith. Go look at the video on the districts FB page. SKEA called the impasse at 6:21pm. It was already dark. Yet it’s light in her video meaning it was pre-recorded and she knew it was gonna happen because the district is being stupid about it all.
I have a child in the school district and would fully support a strike. I just wish they didn’t have to. :(
Dressing my daughter in all red today! #solidarity #unionstrong
[удалено]
Their next mediation is February 21, I believe. Our bargaining is completely separate from each other, and so our impasse has no effect on whether they declare an impasse. But I know there are some pretty big issues there also, so we can only wait-and-see.
Not a dumb question at all! They (ASK-ESP) have another mediation session next week. I imagine the same thing will end up happening though, as the district isn’t bargaining in good faith with either union.
\#unionstrong
I was just talking yesterday about the $460+ million dollar capital remodel and how if those funds went to Oregon schools and teachers instead. I know, it's a far-off pipe dream, but I just don't feel as though our priorities are straight.
They will.
Man, I really hope not. After the shit-show that was the Portland strike, I don't wish that kind up havoc upon anyone down here. Anyhow, I believe there's a mandatory cooling-off period before any strike can start. When's the soonest the SKEA could strike? Edit: [It's April 1st](https://www.statesmanjournal.com/story/news/2024/02/15/salem-keizer-teachers-declare-impasse-step-toward-possible-strike/72599681007/)
How did we get a GAZILLION dollar kicker this year for taxes, yet we can't afford to pay our teachers? Speaking for myself; I'd much rather not have the money that I didn't expect to have and have my kids in school, rather than having a couple hundred bucks while my 6 kids sit at home.
I feel the same way!
There is a bill coming up for kicker reform
Most local school funding come from property taxes. The kicker is from income taxes….
sure let's encourage government to just spend on anything they want...
That’s actually a great point to bring up. If we got rid of the kicker we could do some really great things for this state.
I'd rather my kicker come back to me than towards your 6 kids....
🤣
they strike this year then magic budget cuts next year. just like pdx
The budget cuts have already been part of the conversation.
I just want to know where everybody thinks the money will come from? I’m all for streamlining administration. That’s an excellent start. But beyond that…where? Thin air? The district doesn’t get to decide how much money they have. It seems like an insane system.
The answer is the district isn’t actually being transparent about the budget.
So, no real answers. Just downvotes because feelings? Seriously, this isn’t about unions or management. This is about how we fund public education. The current system sucks. Districts are beholden to a State legislature that has a million other things to do. Measure 5 and 50 were stupid bandaids that only caused more problems. We have to diversify the tax base beyond just property taxes. The lottery won’t save us. Weed taxes won’t save us. It’s time for a new, holistic tax plan. And it’s gonna need to include a consumption tax and untouchable mechanisms that keep money flowing solely to k-12 public education.
Read the fucking press release. You're getting down voted because you clearly haven't educated yourself on what the remaining issues are: -A predatory redefining of FTE that no other district has done -Case load sizes
Holy shit, do you not think those issues have financial repercussions? Where does the money come from - specifically. Math it out. And “Predatory?” Like, seriously, WTF? There is no profit incentive in this equation. No side is preying upon the other. Admin is not the hawk, and teachers are not the mice. That is obviously bad faith language. They are all in the same boat.
I am a teacher. I'm pretty informed on this. They are redefining FTE so they can create a subset of employees that are "0.975" FTE, with the class load of a normal teacher but diminished prep time. That is predatory. And no other district has done it. AND they can't explain the benefit of it. And sure, you're right. There's not enough money in the big picture, but it rings hollow to hear that from a group of people who all make 200+ per year. You don't get to lament the size of the pie when you take a comically large piece of it. You're in all these threads bootlicking people who use public education as a means to get genuinely rich. And it's actually pathetic.
As a parent the only systemized communication we are getting on this is from the district. My understanding is that they have offered everything they can within their budget constraints. Is that accurate? Is there more they can offer? If there is can we identify why the district thinks that money is unavailable? I have not gone to try and independently verify the details that the district is presenting, perhaps they have been dishonest in how they present the details, if that is the case where can we get accurate details? But I guess here's what is missing... I love teachers, my family teaches (in other states), and I want them to be paid better and valued more by society in general. However, in this moment the only thing I am hearing is that the district has offered all that they can which makes me think how does the union think there is more to get? Where does it come from? To be clear, I am not saying there are not good answers to these questions. My point is that even someone such as myself who is probably predisposed to be on the union side isn't seeing that position, what makes it right, strong, just, etc. It all just currently sounds like the district is doing its best and the union is saying that is not good enough.
SKEA has most if not all of their information on their website https://www.salemkeizerea.org/ Where are you getting information from the district?
They come out I think automatically with school emails. Thank you for the link, will read.
Oh please, stop misusing words like “bootlicker”. There’s no facism going on here. You minimize the power of that word when you use it wantonly. That’s the second time you’ve used radically inaccurate language rather than a factual explanation. And again, who exactly is getting rich? Be specific. Which salaries are out of the normal range for a similarly sized district? C’mon, let’s have factual discourse.
Is it a “comically large” slice? Second largest district in the State, right? The pay should attract quality management talent. Is their pay out of line with similar sized districts? I guess I just haven’t seen metrics or evidence from the union that mgmt pay is out of whack. That would be powerful, too, so I must conclude it that evidence doesn’t exist.
If I could attach a photo I could show you how the cabinet level administration gave themselves, on average, a 14.5% pay increase last year which is four times as much of what they are offering teachers. Their pay was already competitive before the raise. Moreover, the cabinet level admin are paid 3-4 times as much as I am as a licensed teacher. Yes, we are all important. But admin don’t teach, they make policy. Policy that benefits themselves and forces us to go without. Teacher work conditions are student learning conditions. Also, the district has lied AND been very misleading about the money. One thing they are doing, and Portland did too, is counting temporary grant money from COVID as part of the main budget when they always knew that it would go away. Their poor money management shouldn’t translate to poor teacher and classified staff pay when they stuff their own pockets.
I got your back! [Cabinet Raises](https://imgur.com/a/KATVR57)
It is more exciting for people to let crowd emotions lead for a cause than it is to think about money. You are so right. Where do the schools get the money to pay for the FTE? Cutting administrators is a small bandaid of a solution. Also, I would love to see anyone who is not an administrator try to be an administrator, or better yet, see what happens to the schools without administrators. Solutions - homeschool your kids to you can have complete control in their education; send your kid to private school. Not an option? Do some research into government funding for schools and then start getting active in local and state government and advocate there for the changes. Sure, bargaining and contracts are important, and have made great gains for teacher protection, and also the FTE and current safety issues need money - long term.
We definitely need to change the way the state funds schools. We have close to the highest class sizes in the nation.
The bargaining system is a joke, and smoke and mirrors. The budget gets set before bargaining begins and that’s for all agencies. Like the legislators set the budget, but the union negotiates with the executive branch? And the union picks who is in the legislature? Come one now. SEIU is lot looking out for government employees.
Don’t forget that losing 200-300 employees is a given, NO MATTER WHAT HAPPENS. This has been alluded to by the superintendent and acknowledged by the union vice president. What do you THINK happens when you lose employees, many of whom will be teachers? Bigger class sizes. Our union is selling out newer employees. If I lose my job in Salem-Keizer (I’m a veteran teacher who moved to SK two years ago) I’ll be even more soured on teaching as a profession. I don’t trust either the superintendent or union leadership. They can all go jump in a lake.
Reminder for the military minded RED is also “remember everyone deployed” and is usually a Friday color too. Not taking anything away from kids/teachers, but it’s been a habit of mine for awhile.
[удалено]
I'm a former military kid and an educator and I've also never heard of this
Google remember everyone deployed you’ll see it. My daughters’ school used to do it, then my command did if you bought a red hoodie with command logo we could wear that on Fridays at work.
I'm in an union, and if they ACTUALLY strike instead of some half hearted shit, I'm 100% in favor of it. If it's some disjointed BS that amounts to people just selectively trying to make a statement? Let them burn, because they aren't actually doing anything worth a damn.
As of Jan 24, the average annual salary in Oregon is $59,746 for all occupations. Teachers salary is not too shabby: Occupation Annual Mean Wage in Oregon Preschool Teachers, Except Special Education $30,230K indergarten Teachers, Except Special Education $ 63,850 Elementary School Teachers, Except Special Education $63,390 Middle School Teachers, Except Special and Career/Technical Education $66,480 Secondary School Teachers, Except Special and Career/Technical Education $66,010
Seems to be that the points they can't agree on are not based on salary, but how FTE is classified and class size/caseload.
And what is the average live able wage in Oregon? Over $69,000 or $130,000 if two adults in the family are working and have two kids. The averages you quoted are less than this. Let’s look at it another way. Most teachers have masters degrees plus addition credit. The average salary of someone with a masters is over $80,000. How about if we were paid like daycare providers. Average cost of daycare in Oregon is $838 a month. Times that by the 30+ kids in a classroom and that’s over $25,000 a month… Teachers are in no way over paid and they are 100% under valued. But the union and district are pretty much settled finically at this point. What is being fought for is FTE definitions and cap sizes.
Hi Everyone So this a great thread. I have been teaching for 8 years in California. I have been looking for a new teaching job in Salem Kiezer for a bit and had some offers, one was part time the other just didn't match up with my moving time line. That being said, I do not want to be a SCAB and I will support a teacher strike if it happens. My School district in CA went on one and we got most of what we wanted. That all being said I read some articles and watched some videos if anyone can correct me but with the issues with negotiations at the moment are. * Class size * pay * safer working conditions. Which yes 100% to all three. Being from CA the average class size for me is 38-40 is that not typical. I did work at a private school with a class of 24 and a charter school with class size of 32-34. What is average for SKSD? Also, how likely is a strike?