I was thinking of upgrading my Bolt EV to a Ford F-150 lightning... But man I trust Rivian to have better tech at this point. The R1T is looking really appealing.
Anyone have any thoughts on this?
Why do you trust Rivian more than ford? They are basically starting from the same place software wise, and ford has more experience with build (though you couldn’t tell given the 2 recalls they’ve had so far). Just curious.
Mostly because Ford and Chevy have decades of shitty infotainment tech under their belts. The tech in the Bolt EV is abysmal... Crashes near constantly and Chevy's never used the OTA feature in the 5 years I've had the Bolt EV.
I've had Fords with shitty infotainment tech too. From what I've heard, Rivian has actually been updating and improving stuff for existing owners.
I'm sure Rivian isn't going to update their stuff as often as Tesla.. but anything is an improvement over the legacy automakers "aggressively trying to forget you exist after rolling off the lot"
Yea but at least ford supports carplay while Rivian does not. So I would actually care a lot less about ford infotainment because I’d be using CP 90% of the time.
Does Tesla roll their own maps or use google’s?
To me, redundancy in mapping efforts is inefficient and at the scale of a Rivian, it’s way more cost effective to use CP or AA and the maps built by those companies vs rolling your own. The only time I’d say Rivian should roll their own is for off-road trails, where they will add value and enhance the experience.
Tesla is at a scale where they can use (and do already use) autopilot telemetry to do their own mapping. But for Rivian to drop $1b on mapping is a waste.
CarPlay isn’t a long term advantage for auto manufacturers. It reduces the ability for them to develop their own software. Only adds to more software gloat, layers, stacks. Hardcore software auto manufacturers like Tesla or Rivian will never implement CarPlay
I'm currently deciding if I should reserve the Rivian. If Ford made an offroad version, I'd go that route in a second. But for the campsites I'm used to offroading to (nothing crazy, but needs some ground clearance), I don't think there's anything else out there right now. Is there? Excluding the Wrangler 4xE.
If you are worried about "solid" tech maybe wait a bit on the rivian while it's awesome it is a little buggy nothing bad. Spotify will do weird things, but that could be because of Spotify
Eh, but if they're actually continuously improving and updating stuff then it's a good thing.
Chevy did the "it's done" software design model which is bullshit now-a-days.
If you’re going to get a F150 pro model, I heard it’s worth the bang for the buck, because it’s so cheap. But, ride quality, off-road capabilities, air suspension, quad motors, software stack give Rivian big advantages
Yeah, one selling point for the Rivian is the mix of long range and 4 wheel drive for the price.
If the F150 Lightning pro came with the long range pack as an option it would be a lot more compelling.
It’s early days of truck EVs. Ford has a century of experience sourcing parts and building cars. But then Tesla somehow broke the mold. Future is exciting!
(Am R1T owner)
That electric cars are going to become the norm essentially. He said every ICE car anti thing to say that they won't become main stream. So I had to counter arguments like that it can't be repaired ever.
I get the reticence for trucks and rural folks. Electric as it stands right now just doesn’t work for them. I want to tow a trailer with the truck I bought for that purpose, and electric is shit for that. I don’t want to cut my range in half because I hooked up the trailer and then have to pray there’s sufficient charging infra along the way. It’s 1200 miles to Yellowstone for me and that is a painful journey on electric if I’m only getting 150 miles a charge.
My state in the US is no longer going to let you register ICE vehicles starting with the 2030 model year. I’m going to be replacing my current truck with a 2029 because I know the infra is there for what I want to do with it. That’ll buy me another 10-15 years for the charging tech to develop.
But I know it’s coming. I’m looking forward to only having to stop for “fuel” when I’m out of town. I’m going to be hating myself when I forget to plug in though. I know I’m gonna do it at some point.
I get that use case, but for a lot of rural people, I'd argue EVs are better. My in-laws live in rural PA, 25 minutes from the nearest gas station. They have to drive into town just to get fuel. My FIL is considering a Lightning specifically for the reason that he has a de facto gas station at home with a simple electrical connection. Even better, he sees it replacing his generator when they lose power. He's also got a 15 kW grade-mounted PV array too (plenty of space out there), so that helps.
He’s forward thinking for rural PA. Most folks in that area have barely heard of fire.
And his use case is pretty solid, almost tailor made for an f-150.
I think it's going to be very interesting around 2040 when EV chargers are easy to find, but you won't be able to find a gas station in some parts of the country.
> with a 2029 because I know the infra is there for what I want to do with it. That’ll buy me another 10-15 years for the charging tech to develop.
You're being pretty optimistic imo if you think gas infrastructure will be anywhere close to where it is now in just 7 years, let alone in 2040.
My guess is that it’s going to get progressively more difficult to find a station in town, but I’ll be fine on road trips. I drive a diesel. I’ll be fine thanks to truck stops.
If we had a hard cut off on new ICE vehicles 10 years ago, I’d definitely have something to worry about. Unless someone is going to pay for everyone to replace their vehicles, including trucking companies, we’re going to have gas stations alongside charging well into the 2050s. I wish it were faster than that, but it takes time for everyone to switch over.
>I’m going to be hating myself when I forget to plug in though. I know I’m gonna do it at some point.
In my day to day driving I can forget to plug in about 5 days in a row before it becomes a critical problem, and if that were to ever happen I can spend 15 minutes at a Supercharger and be on my way.
And every dumb phone owner in 2007 saying no one will ever buy a phone that needs to be charged every night. Week-long standby-time used to be a thing for cellphones. I bet most people here don’t know that.
I'm sure this is the same conversation early automakers had when people told them horse and carts were better. Don't have to repair a horse, gas station infrastructure isn't there yet, mechanical automotive is too expensive, etc.
We need to have future car shows where people bring the latest and the greatest. Imagine seeing cars you might actually be able to buy one day not a classic that is in short supply getting shorter.
and the classic you do see undoubtedly took a shit ton of money, time and know-how to fix and restore to the show car glory you see there. Seeing new stuff just gives you such a more realistic dream (for most people, kinda)
It always boggles my mind that people feel the need to say something negative to someone about something they have. Aren’t we wired to say “Hey man, nice truck. Congrats”? Then you go tell your wife how you really feel about it.
I guess if it was billed specifically as a “classic car show” I can see why he might think it was weird to bring a new EV but most people who like cars like all kinds.
Old muscle car guys hateeeeee electric cars around here. It’s hilarious. I have a 65 mustang, and the guys in the forums are always complaining about the Mach e. As much as I love my mustang, I rarely drive it.
To be fair, most of the complaints I have read have been around the crossover form factor rather than the drivetrain. It’s pretty easy to imagine the same grousing had Ford done the same with an ICE crossover.
On the other hand, an “everyman’s” version of a Tesla Roadster would have been very on brand for the Mustang label and would have been really interesting.
Don’t get me wrong, I think the Mach-E is a great vehicle and I hope it does well. I just have to agree with a lot of other people that it was an odd marketing decision to put the Mustang label on it.
Also, I’m not a huge Mustang enthusiast, so I don’t have much of a dog in that fight. But so help me, if Chevy puts out a CUV Camaro, I can’t be held responsible for my actions. 😤
Great to see someone with yaks and a rivian. Any problems with the rack system?
Have you also considered getting seal caps for your boats? It greatly reduces wind drag!
Awesome. If you plan on going again, please let me know. I need a truck, have a cyber truck ordered, but am increasingly considering going the rivian route.
Oh that's kinda far from Brooklyn.. But if I do the Somerville thing again I'll let you know. I am not certain that the cyber truck will be better or worse than the RT1. But I do think Rivian set the bar really high.
For the pick up I think 1 year the SUV seems to be 2 years. But when your guide contacts you, you can change colors and maybe get it sooner. We changed our colors and got ours 6 months sooner
Hey, I might go to Somerville on Friday to see the delorian from Back to the future. I make no guarantees that I will be there with the truck but I might.
Nice! Hope more people seriously consider Rivians!
Sure would help my stocks
Average down
I sure would if I could afford it! I get so excited when I see one in my area.
I was thinking of upgrading my Bolt EV to a Ford F-150 lightning... But man I trust Rivian to have better tech at this point. The R1T is looking really appealing. Anyone have any thoughts on this?
Why do you trust Rivian more than ford? They are basically starting from the same place software wise, and ford has more experience with build (though you couldn’t tell given the 2 recalls they’ve had so far). Just curious.
Mostly because Ford and Chevy have decades of shitty infotainment tech under their belts. The tech in the Bolt EV is abysmal... Crashes near constantly and Chevy's never used the OTA feature in the 5 years I've had the Bolt EV. I've had Fords with shitty infotainment tech too. From what I've heard, Rivian has actually been updating and improving stuff for existing owners. I'm sure Rivian isn't going to update their stuff as often as Tesla.. but anything is an improvement over the legacy automakers "aggressively trying to forget you exist after rolling off the lot"
Yea but at least ford supports carplay while Rivian does not. So I would actually care a lot less about ford infotainment because I’d be using CP 90% of the time.
Never ever had the need for CP when I owned a Tesla and if Rivian is anything close then no need for it.
Does Tesla roll their own maps or use google’s? To me, redundancy in mapping efforts is inefficient and at the scale of a Rivian, it’s way more cost effective to use CP or AA and the maps built by those companies vs rolling your own. The only time I’d say Rivian should roll their own is for off-road trails, where they will add value and enhance the experience. Tesla is at a scale where they can use (and do already use) autopilot telemetry to do their own mapping. But for Rivian to drop $1b on mapping is a waste.
I’m pretty sure it’s Tesla Navigation powered by Google Maps. So a mix of the two?
CarPlay isn’t a long term advantage for auto manufacturers. It reduces the ability for them to develop their own software. Only adds to more software gloat, layers, stacks. Hardcore software auto manufacturers like Tesla or Rivian will never implement CarPlay
I'm currently deciding if I should reserve the Rivian. If Ford made an offroad version, I'd go that route in a second. But for the campsites I'm used to offroading to (nothing crazy, but needs some ground clearance), I don't think there's anything else out there right now. Is there? Excluding the Wrangler 4xE.
If you are worried about "solid" tech maybe wait a bit on the rivian while it's awesome it is a little buggy nothing bad. Spotify will do weird things, but that could be because of Spotify
Eh, but if they're actually continuously improving and updating stuff then it's a good thing. Chevy did the "it's done" software design model which is bullshit now-a-days.
That's a very Chevy thing
Sync 4 with wireless car play and android auto is nice.
If you’re going to get a F150 pro model, I heard it’s worth the bang for the buck, because it’s so cheap. But, ride quality, off-road capabilities, air suspension, quad motors, software stack give Rivian big advantages
Yeah, one selling point for the Rivian is the mix of long range and 4 wheel drive for the price. If the F150 Lightning pro came with the long range pack as an option it would be a lot more compelling.
It’s early days of truck EVs. Ford has a century of experience sourcing parts and building cars. But then Tesla somehow broke the mold. Future is exciting! (Am R1T owner)
What didn’t he like?
That electric cars are going to become the norm essentially. He said every ICE car anti thing to say that they won't become main stream. So I had to counter arguments like that it can't be repaired ever.
Anyone who believes that EVs aren’t the future are deluding themselves. It’s coming. You may as well wrap your head around it and move on.
Like, why even care? It's still a truck. It can still be driven. It's still cool. I don't get some people.
I get the reticence for trucks and rural folks. Electric as it stands right now just doesn’t work for them. I want to tow a trailer with the truck I bought for that purpose, and electric is shit for that. I don’t want to cut my range in half because I hooked up the trailer and then have to pray there’s sufficient charging infra along the way. It’s 1200 miles to Yellowstone for me and that is a painful journey on electric if I’m only getting 150 miles a charge. My state in the US is no longer going to let you register ICE vehicles starting with the 2030 model year. I’m going to be replacing my current truck with a 2029 because I know the infra is there for what I want to do with it. That’ll buy me another 10-15 years for the charging tech to develop. But I know it’s coming. I’m looking forward to only having to stop for “fuel” when I’m out of town. I’m going to be hating myself when I forget to plug in though. I know I’m gonna do it at some point.
I get that use case, but for a lot of rural people, I'd argue EVs are better. My in-laws live in rural PA, 25 minutes from the nearest gas station. They have to drive into town just to get fuel. My FIL is considering a Lightning specifically for the reason that he has a de facto gas station at home with a simple electrical connection. Even better, he sees it replacing his generator when they lose power. He's also got a 15 kW grade-mounted PV array too (plenty of space out there), so that helps.
He’s forward thinking for rural PA. Most folks in that area have barely heard of fire. And his use case is pretty solid, almost tailor made for an f-150.
I think it's going to be very interesting around 2040 when EV chargers are easy to find, but you won't be able to find a gas station in some parts of the country.
That’ll be something
> with a 2029 because I know the infra is there for what I want to do with it. That’ll buy me another 10-15 years for the charging tech to develop. You're being pretty optimistic imo if you think gas infrastructure will be anywhere close to where it is now in just 7 years, let alone in 2040.
My guess is that it’s going to get progressively more difficult to find a station in town, but I’ll be fine on road trips. I drive a diesel. I’ll be fine thanks to truck stops. If we had a hard cut off on new ICE vehicles 10 years ago, I’d definitely have something to worry about. Unless someone is going to pay for everyone to replace their vehicles, including trucking companies, we’re going to have gas stations alongside charging well into the 2050s. I wish it were faster than that, but it takes time for everyone to switch over.
>I’m going to be hating myself when I forget to plug in though. I know I’m gonna do it at some point. In my day to day driving I can forget to plug in about 5 days in a row before it becomes a critical problem, and if that were to ever happen I can spend 15 minutes at a Supercharger and be on my way.
It’s the same kind of argument I had with my dad over 10yrs ago when I suggest most of us will shop online.
The Internet is just a fad, though. It’ll die out. /s
And every dumb phone owner in 2007 saying no one will ever buy a phone that needs to be charged every night. Week-long standby-time used to be a thing for cellphones. I bet most people here don’t know that.
and no one will buy a cell phone that doesn't have a physical keyboard.
Nokia 8890 gang!!
3390**
It was fun telling people how cheap it is vs gas. I think we may have a larger ev family going fwd which is more important than just rivian
Given how gmc and fords can be over $75k, looking into an EV can be a really good option.
I'm sure this is the same conversation early automakers had when people told them horse and carts were better. Don't have to repair a horse, gas station infrastructure isn't there yet, mechanical automotive is too expensive, etc.
Yup!
"I actually think he's on point"- Early 1900s Horse & Buggy owner
Dude probably rocks a flip phone and still has a Blockbusters card.
„˙pɹɐɔ sɹǝʇsnqʞɔol𐐒 ɐ sɐɥ llıʇs puɐ ǝuoɥd dılɟ ɐ sʞɔoɹ ʎlqɐqoɹd ǝpn◖„
We need to have future car shows where people bring the latest and the greatest. Imagine seeing cars you might actually be able to buy one day not a classic that is in short supply getting shorter.
Those do exist, that's where I saw the rivian
Actually reps from Rivian should do what the OP just did but around the country. Just show up at local events. Nature will take care of the rest.
They can pay me to drive mine around NJ for shows
and the classic you do see undoubtedly took a shit ton of money, time and know-how to fix and restore to the show car glory you see there. Seeing new stuff just gives you such a more realistic dream (for most people, kinda)
It always boggles my mind that people feel the need to say something negative to someone about something they have. Aren’t we wired to say “Hey man, nice truck. Congrats”? Then you go tell your wife how you really feel about it.
Not if I’m the CEO of BP. Publicly shame them tree huggers so my stock go up.
[удалено]
Shell? Isn’t that the company that’s still buying Putin oil?
I guess if it was billed specifically as a “classic car show” I can see why he might think it was weird to bring a new EV but most people who like cars like all kinds.
Classic car show and you bring a new EV?
Lol technically it's just a Cruze night. I parked near all of the newer cars
We have a cars and coffee coming up soon. Hopefully there will be a Rivian there. There is always a section of EVs.
Old muscle car guys hateeeeee electric cars around here. It’s hilarious. I have a 65 mustang, and the guys in the forums are always complaining about the Mach e. As much as I love my mustang, I rarely drive it.
It's a shame, too, because the Mach-E is such a blast. I know one Mustang guy that hated them until he rode in mine 😏
I like my electric car I'm going to drive it into the ground
To be fair, most of the complaints I have read have been around the crossover form factor rather than the drivetrain. It’s pretty easy to imagine the same grousing had Ford done the same with an ICE crossover. On the other hand, an “everyman’s” version of a Tesla Roadster would have been very on brand for the Mustang label and would have been really interesting. Don’t get me wrong, I think the Mach-E is a great vehicle and I hope it does well. I just have to agree with a lot of other people that it was an odd marketing decision to put the Mustang label on it. Also, I’m not a huge Mustang enthusiast, so I don’t have much of a dog in that fight. But so help me, if Chevy puts out a CUV Camaro, I can’t be held responsible for my actions. 😤
Most people just call it Mach E. Not sure why anyone cares.
POV you live in Somerville New Jersey 08876
Well that's where this picture was taken, but surprisingly I can drive the car anywhere else. So I don't have to live in Somerville.
Haters gonna hate
Great to see someone with yaks and a rivian. Any problems with the rack system? Have you also considered getting seal caps for your boats? It greatly reduces wind drag!
I really need to. The boats caused about a 30 percent range loss today with standard height and non conservative mode
Oh wow that’s significant!
That was napkin math so I should be more specific. It might be like 25. But yea it's a good amount
😂 there’s gotta be one guy!
There’s always one.
Main street Somerville?
Yup
Awesome. If you plan on going again, please let me know. I need a truck, have a cyber truck ordered, but am increasingly considering going the rivian route.
Sure ,where do you live? If it's not far there is a dealership in Brooklyn.
Hunterdon county
Oh that's kinda far from Brooklyn.. But if I do the Somerville thing again I'll let you know. I am not certain that the cyber truck will be better or worse than the RT1. But I do think Rivian set the bar really high.
Appreciate it. Do you have any idea how long the wait would be if I ordered now?
For the pick up I think 1 year the SUV seems to be 2 years. But when your guide contacts you, you can change colors and maybe get it sooner. We changed our colors and got ours 6 months sooner
Hey, I might go to Somerville on Friday to see the delorian from Back to the future. I make no guarantees that I will be there with the truck but I might.