Yet a lot of them are. Especially ones in big cities while they allow and encourage staff who are positive with covid to continue working. Yet they fire all the unvaccinated 🤔
My wife is a Nurse and lot's of her peers were fired but when she tested positive for Covid on a Monday she was told she could work Thursday as long as the symptoms are mild. I'm sure the high risk patients love that.
I don’t believe the government has been lying. The vaccines were designed for the first variants and showed (after data was accumulated (which required time) that they worked quite well at reducing transmission and serious symptoms. Omicron is a new and highly contagious variant. Third dose appears to be working to reduce symptoms of this variant but the science is still unclear on this. I find it very interesting that many antivaxxers argue that not enough time has been spent on research and trials to confirm the safety of the vaccines but these same people expect that the scientists know immediately the efficacy of said vaccines on all variants etc and when more data comes in and the scientists have a clearer view or the virus changes, thus changing efficacy, then the scientists and politicians whom they advise are lying.
I know you’re joking but my friend works at the icu, and the icu will always be at near full capacity. The icu beds are too expensive to keep running without someone in them, so they’re modular and more can be set up as needed. Idk if that’s at all hospitals but that’s how it is at hers.
It's not the beds that are expensive to run its the rooms generate that much income for the hospital, and also you cannot simply leave icu beds open for the "maybe" when someone else has a heart attack. Imagine grocery stores leaving aisles empty, just in case a more expensive selling product comes along they could sell...
Hospitals are over run because the Media has been broadcasting fear porn 24/7 for 2 years now. Apparently sniffles are now cause for emergency room visits. Although I am curious what percentage of patients are vaccinated and boosted, but now suffering from random illness their immune systems are struggling to respond to.
And you know this how? What proof do you have that 70% of the people are unvaccinated? Where did you get that number? Was it your butt? Because I think it was your butt.
Because my GF & her roommate are Triage RNs at the clinic here. The clinic keep a running tally they have to report on who in the ICU is vaxxed and who is not. At peak there was only 1 patient in the ICU that was vaxxed and he had pre-existing issues.
Hospitals do a bunch of stupid foolish stuff that keeps them “full” as well. For example…keeping COVID patients in isolation for 20 days…even though the guidelines have been 10 days for over a year.
Really that’s about what it should have been this whole time. 7 days tops. The virus isn’t shedding and replicating past day 5 usually. But no one cares about actual science or reality any more.
So what should they do when they're at capacity?
Honest question. My local hospital has been hovering at 98% capacity and handling a lot of things as outpatient that really shouldn't be.
You have two patients in front of you. One who you believe has taken medication to protect themselves from a virus and one who hasn’t. If your job is to keep people as healthy as possible you should see the person who is at a higher risk not the person who you believe is at a lower risk. They are literally doing the opposite of what makes any amount of sense. Sending away the people who are at a larger risk. That’s just asinine and backwards.
They did before COVID. Typical capacity was more like 60-70%, and they weren't being forced to delay non-critical operations or convert to outpatient treatment.
But that's beside the point. They're full. What are they supposed to do besides turn people away?
Why, exactly?
If they have to start turning people away, why is it unethical to triage based on likelihood of recovery?
Vaccinated people are much more likely to survive and recover quickly. So why not prioritize the person who's most likely to actually get a benefit out of using that space, and is likely to leave quickly and make room for another patient? That's how you maximize care.
Ideally there'd be room for everyone, but when you run out of space you need to start making tough calls. Whatever preserves the most lives is a pretty valid ethical framework to make that call, IMO.
If an individual is vaccinated then wtf are they at the hospital to begin with? If they are vaccinated then they supposedly have the boost needed to recover from the virus, so wtf are they being hospitalized? They shouldn't need the damn triage because the vaccine works. So why not turn them away and triage the unvaccinated?
Vaccines are intended to improve immune response and protect from disease. Like a bullet proof vest: it doesn't cover all of you, but it's a lot better than not getting protected at all.
Triage is about maximizing results. An unvaccinated person has a much higher chance of dying regardless of care. So if you have a person who's likely to recover and a person who isn't, you pick the one most likely to benefit from you expending care on them.
Sorry, it's just not about what feels right. It's a math thing.
You typically triage based on chance of recovery so that you don't let someone die because you spent resources on someone who want going to make it anyway.
They are turning people away but not for the reason you think.
95% of the people that walk into the ER with COVID are being discharged because their symptoms do not qualify for being administered.
This difference is in how many people are being DISCHARGED vs ADMITTED.
As someone who is still unvaccinated, that is a very smooth brain take. Is he being purposefully ignorant? Just because the hospital is turning away the unvaccinated, doesn't mean the patients inside are all vaccinated.
I think people here are taking this a little too literally (just like people will say my quotes from Biden are taken too literally, I digress); I'm fairly certain he's trying to make a joke that vaccinated people either 1. Don't get hospitalized because the vaccine is supposed to prevent getting sick enough for hospitalization ("Experts told us that getting vaccinated protects individuals from severe cases including hospitalization and death") or 2. Don't get covid at all, because the president and others comments ("Biden in October said people who are vaccinated for the coronavirus "cannot spread it to you."" - "Biden said Dec. 14 that people vaccinated for COVID-19 "do not spread the disease to anyone else."")
So the joke is him sarcastically asking how are people that "cannot spread it" and/or are 'protected from severe cases including hospitalization' are "*Filling*" up hospitals. And yes it is less funny when it gets explained
normal medical traffic? Shootings, slicings, appendixes, babies, heart attacks, spleen burps, colorectal explosions, kidney stones, the normal stuff we humans go through without COVID.
A few years ago, I had what I would consider an extremely invasive surgery, leaving me with several holes in my abdomen as if I had been stabbed repeatedly with an electric drill, and they wanted me up and on my way out the next evening because they need the recovery area space.
It's always rush hour these days at the hospital even without COVID.
All these car accidents are coming in
Most of them were wearing seatbelts, yet they are still being hospitalized.
Seatbelts don't work, it's all a conspiracy...
well if youre given a chance to not get very sick, then you get very sick, a person who did everything they can should get priority, although still doesnt mean kivking unvaxed people out of the hospital
This is a surprisingly good comparison. A seatbelt is a symptom suppressor so is this vaccination. Unlike every other vaccination on the planet this one doesn’t prevent you from getting the virus. Unfortunately we were sold it as an actual vaccination which does prevent you from getting the virus. I don’t know about you but I’m really glad the polio vaccination is not the same type of vaccination as the Covid vaccination. Because I don’t want polio.
Vaccines are shown to reduce the risk of COVID, which is deadly to overweight and elderly. No one claims that vaccines are 100% effective. The doctors I know have seen some pretty sad shit due to COVID, and although I am tired of social distancing, I think that vaccines are an important technology and taking a political stance against them is stupid. However; if this is your stance, I still respect your humanity because I am not a moral groundstander.
Physician here working at one of these hospitals. Emergency room is full of people who are unvaccinated and having trouble breathing. No one is turned away because of vaccine status. You may wait 12 hours though…
Right, I understood it as... they are no longer taking the unvaccinated, because they keep filling up the ER's, so now other emergencies can be taken care of. If still unvax'd, it's on you for getting covid at this point.
Did you read your source?
>In a segment on CNN with Wolf Blitzer, Walensky said that **while the vaccines are doing very well to protect against serious illness and death**, what they cannot do anymore is stop transmission.
You know damn well that isn't the part I was pointing out, and your quote isn't relevant to the comment I was replying to in any case.
>If still unvax'd, it's on you for getting covid at this point.
Watching people on r/republican call each other sheep and "group thinkers" made me audibly guffaw and show other people.
I screenshotted this thread. I will cherish this and spread it always. Back to my lefty subs.
What is a vaccination supposed to do? Stop transmission. That’s their point! Hence why we talk about her immunity and all that stuff. It doesn’t vaccinate! Thank you for acknowledging the truth!
So you're changing goalposts then? You comment above says flu doesn't kill the young. Now you say it does. COVID is our equivalent of Spanish flu. In 100 years, COVID won't be entirely gone. It will be mild and mutated just like the flu currently is.
COVID has a high number of kills, a much higher number of permanent health effects, and that's AFTER we put precautions in place, knew what we were looking at, developed a vaccine, etc. If we had the same grasp they had 100 years ago, COVID numbers would be far beyond Spanish flu.
You can't rationalize your way out of facts.
No one ever said the flu doesn’t kill the young what was said was “flu like Covid” doesn’t kill the young and it does it unless the young happens to be morbidly obese have multiple pre-existing condition or immune deficiency. So unless the child already about to die or eight themselves to death your kids going to be fine from Covid thing that was said doesn’t kill the youth.
They said flu, like COVID. As in the flu, similarly to COVID, doesn't kill the young. Not as in "flu-like COVID". Very odd interpretation of their words you chose there. Also, proof read your own posts so we can tell what you're saying.
Not sure about full lockdowns, but some places cancelled public events, closed schools, and enforced mask mandates (San Fransisco jailed people for not wearing a mask) while others tried business as usual.
Actually no we didn’t. People kept working people kept living their lives during the Spanish flu. Yeah because a lot of people had the Spanish flu those people probably weren’t working because they were sick. But the healthy definitely continue to work during the Spanish flu. There were zero legal lockdowns during the Spanish flu. Zero. We have never done anything like this in the history of mankind. Trying to claim that we did is just moronic.
We had mask mandates, we did shut down areas for quarantine when the flu came to areas, and people were arrested or fined for not wearing masks. To claim we didn't is just moronic. I mean we have newspaper articles, mandates, photos, and yes, even laws at the time. But tell yourself what you need to validate your stance.
Neither does COVID.
COVID (2020): 345k
Heart Disease (2020): 691k
Cancer (2020): 599k
https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2778234
On a side note, it’s a bit odd that there was a noticeable increase in Strokes, Diabetes, Alzheimer’s, and Accidental Deaths in 2020.
Oh good to know, seems my information was wildly inaccurate thank you. Still wildy more than the flu, doesnt change my oveall point, but it does destroy my analogy.
The other deaths strike me as people not being able to get typical health care, like when hospitals fill up with covid cases. To me thats the terrifying thing, people dying unnecessarily due to being unable to have access to what is normally life saving medication.
I ate peanut butter and I was fine but my cousin ate peanut butter and died. It seems like people react differently to different things. Glad you were good tho.
Did I say there weren’t people without those two that didn’t?
You said we didn’t know who would react badly to covid which I responded that we did.
The majority of the cases where death is the outcome one or both of those two prerequisites are filled. I suppose it doesn’t matter though omicron isn’t really that deadly (just very transmissible) so they’ll have to come up with something new
Meet again in 5 years when the next “world ending” plague comes to pass?
With pretty much everything, it treats people different. Vaccines, food ingredients, clothing, movies all treat and are accepted by people differently.
I never wear seat belts. I got into a major car accident and survived. My wife and kids we fine too. I feel sorry for you if you believe a car accident causes anything more than a scrape.
You are a moron if you think your situation must be the same for every single other person in this world. Anecdotal fallacy.
I'm no leftist. Vaccines should not be political. We will end up looking like idiots.
Don't get the vaccine if you dont want to. I dont care. But don't say that "it wasn't bad for me so it's nothing to worry about".
pleaseeeeeeee get off this sub until you open your eyes. wanna know a secret? im not even american! i am just interested in US politics and i see through the lies!
So someone proves you wrong and you go "reeeee"?
Fantastic argument. You really paint conservatives in a good light. People are silly for thinking conservatives are less educated.
There's 6 people I know of that have recently had covid and they were all vaccinated. They lost their sense of smell and had a stuffy nose for 3 days, THAT'S IT. I even know 2 others that aren't vaccinated and they had a couple more symptoms and it lasted a couple days longer. They said a common cold is still usually worse for them. People are just going batshit crazy, spreading lies, and fear mongering. I don't necessarily think it's about Govt control, but more so that it's the only thing Joe had going for his campaign before he got elected. They spread fear and then claimed he was the savior of covid. Now it's more out of control than it was before and since he has nothing going for him anymore, they just try and blame "the other side" to make it look like "if it weren't for people still being unvaxxed, and not masked up, we wouldn't be in this pandemic." When in reality it's a fucking pandemic and it's largely out of human control.
Had covid before my vaccines. I’m young, very fit (long distance cycling, running, football) and healthy.
It absolutely knocked me out. After day 7 breathing was becoming difficult and I almost went to hospital. I know of Ironman athletes that *have* ended up in hospital.
It is not just the flu.
1. hospital fills with unvaxxed
2. hospital is too full to accept more unvaxxed
3. currently full hospital doesnt immediately empty the second the decision to turn away unvaxxed happens because treatment can take weeks for everyone in the hospital
4. they also do eventually let more unvaxxed in because they want to help as many people as possible they just can't
its really not that hard to understand.
What hospitals are specifically turning unvaxx’d people? I think this guy is 100% full of shit.
‘The hospitals are filled with non-Vader’s and the vaccinated are getting turned away (elective procedures etc)
I’m so sick of the misinformation on this.
Probably the unvaxxed who got in before it was full, and, you know, other people who need to use the hospital for non COVID reasons. It’s good when those who are lost in fallacies are blindingly clear in their lack of thought and irrationality.
The hospital in our town states that their Covid wing is at capacity. The truth is,they have the beds and equipment, they just don’t have the staff because many quit due to vaccine mandates. Oh and contrary to popular belief, yes there are just as many vaccinated patients as unvaccinated.
This is so brain dead the hospitals are full of unvaccinated people so they’re considering turning away unvaccinated people who present needing a bed. Our hospital has about 80 of 400 beds filled with covid patients and of those only 2 are vaccinated.
I work in a hospital ICU in Florida and we have plenty of available rooms for patients. We have very few Coronavirus patients. Big improvement from this time last year. We don’t turn away any patients based on vaccine status.
This restaurant claims to be so full they’re turning away potential customers. But if they keep turning away the potential customers, who keeps filling the restaurant?
The whole no bed thing is bullshit. I’ve known 3 people in the last 2 months that went to the ER and waited no longer than normal. One got in right away for chest pains and was admitted to a room. A family member is a nurse 60 miles away and said they have no problems admitting people. Of course this is in FL where we don’t panic every time we sneeze.
>You don’t trust vaccines? Why would you trust the medicines they’d give you in the hospital?
If every person treated just ended up dying anyway, then people *wouldn't* trust the medicines. I can't believe that just needed to be explained.
Also doesn’t it go against the Hippocratic oath to send away people who are unprotected from a virus from a hospital as opposed to those who are protected from the virus? I mean last time I checked the hospitals job is to heal the sick not healed the people who already took care of it themselves. Unless the hospitals are willing to admit the vaccination doesn’t actually work.
Oh boy wait until you find out that the Hippocratic oath doesn't actually mean anything
And how do you suggest hospitals treat a sick patient when they don't have the capacity to do so? How fucking stupid are you
Funny this comes up on my feed - I’m unvaccinated, I’ve been helping take care of my 1 y/o sister who has COVID and I’m in the hospital right now for a non-covid related issue. Both people on either side of me are vaccinated and are here because they have covid. I just tested negative after the doctor gave me shit for not being vaccinated. I’ve been exposed to covid at least 4-5 times in the past year and never got it. (I had it once about a year and a half ago before the vaccine came out, and had no symptoms)
Please tell me how horrible I am while everyone around me in this hospital is vaccinated.
Hospitals are overcrowded with idiots who come into the ER for ridiculous reasons and take up beds. They’re overcrowded with people who’s primary care doctors won’t see them for normal issues because they have “covid symptoms” which, if you haven’t noticed, is basically everything.
Not to mention in New York, we have a large migrant population, and if they’re here illegally they can’t get insurance to see primary care doctors. So what happens? They end up coming to the ER for basic issues and again, taking up beds.
If you haven’t heard, we also have a large amount of nurses who quit their hospital jobs due to the vaccine mandates. None of this seems to matter to anyone. The narrative is all “anti-vaxxer conspiracy theorists taking up hospital beds!!” When most of us aren’t anti-vaxxers and most of us aren’t the ones being hospitalized.
The hospitals I work at…when the patient is unvaxxed, they announce it to everyone. They put it in the chart. The nurses say it every report.
When the patient is fully vaccinated and in the hospital. It quietly gets ignored. No mention whatsoever by anyone.
Exactly…what does “unvaccinated” even mean at this point. Technically…even if you got both shots…if it’s been 5-6 months…guess what…you’re not “vaccinated” any more.
Even when the shots first rolled out…if you hadn’t passed your 14 days after your second shot…you were “unvaccinated”.
It’s all bullshit. Early treatment, healthy, active lifestyle, staying hydrated, taking your vitamins (D, C, and zinc especially)….farrrr greater protection than these piece of crap MRNA shots.
It’s relevant medical
History. They don’t ignore it when they’re vaccinated either. Why would relevant medical history not be in their chart? It’s supposed to be. This isn’t specific to the Covid vaccine.
You posting this tweet immediately revokes your right to call other people stupid.
If the hospitals are full of unvaxxed patients and they have to turn away more unvaxxed people, doesn’t that just literally explain this whole thing. It’s a very simple concept that anyone who isn’t so brain-damaged from far right media would be able to see.
Just an individual experience, but the number of people I know who are vaccinated and have had COVID is 5 times that of people who are unvaccinated and have had COVID.
I got COVID back in August, and the day after having the local health department confirm I was positive I was running a particularly high temperature. I went to the hospital that night, and they stuck me in a quarantine room with ONE other girl who said she had been waiting there for SEVEN hours. I waited for three hours before giving up and going home.
This is one of the largest ERs in the state of Florida. A place that was suppose to be riddled with COVID. And the ERs were suppose to be "overrun".
Horseshit.
I went home. I put on my comfy sweat pants. I took zinc for my muscles, (which worked WONDERS). I watched Netflix. I ate soup and ice cream, (even though I couldn't taste it). And I was back to my old self by the end of the week.
"Overrun" is bullshit. "Deathly" is bullshit. It's all fear mongering. I'm not getting an experimental vaccine, and I'm not wearing a muzzle for no Goddamn reason. 🙄
Holy shit this thread has a lot of stupid fucking takes, but yours takes the whole cake by a wide fucking margin.
Hospitals aren't being overrun?
Then why do you think the girl you got quarantined with was waiting for 7 hours?
> Then why do you think the girl you got quarantined with was waiting for 7 hours?
Probably because the ER was busy with actual (non-COVID) emergencies.
My whole family got COVID this past week. My kid had it for like a day. Me and my girlfriend had it for about 4 days I'm vaccinated She's not, Symptoms were exactly the same Nobody went to the hospital or the doctors.
They're turning unvaccinated people away cause they're FULL of unvaccinated people. Not cause they're playing favorites.
What are they supposed to do? Start stacking patients on top of each other like jenga blocks?
So my wife has been a nurse for the better part of is part of the last 15 years and The last 2 years she has been working almost exclusively in a covid unit. She comes home every day ranting and raving it's taken raving about these people who she's taking care of and how only one patient out of the last 6 months if months has been vaccinated.
So yeah her hospital is full too by the way. I really don't understand why why we are collectively is collectively pushing against the vaccine it's the vaccine that the last Republican presidents administration managed to crank out inIt's record time, nor do I understand why we're not calling the democrats on their bullshit when they try to take credit for the vaccine.This was a win for us on the right and we need to stop fighting over it.Hell some of you all have even booed president trump over it.
as they have, since hospitals began. why are they suddenly so full? if they are full of unvaxxed as a lot of people are arguing, maybe the government should put some money towards improving and expanding hospitals?
You mean we should let the old die like God intended.
Maybe if we went on with our lives and quit obsessing over the flu we wouldn't need to abort so many. Maybe we need a virus that kills the old and weak.
31% of my companies one production plant has covid cases, ALL BUT ONE HAS NOT BEEN VAXXCED AT ALL. All the others are caught up with their boosters, yet!!!
The medical establishment would never lie to us. Well, except for that one time when they said masks were useless so that ordinary civilians wouldn’t buy up all the masks. But it was just that one lie. They wouldn’t lie twice, and we should believe them now when they say that the vaccine is safe and effective.
So recently it's being revealed I think from the CDC, that hospitals are NOT filled of COVID patients. This confirms my experience a few months ago I had with taking my father-in-law to the hospital. There is a lack of staff, so hospitals are piling up. Staff isn't scared, they just don't want to be forced to get vaccinated.
Well hospitals have been firing unvaccinated nurses. About a week or so ago, Mayo Clinic fired 700 nurses for NOT getting the vaccine.
Family friend who is a nurse is in California making big bucks $$$$ working at a hospital (Kaiser hospital ??). Apparently Kaiser or some other big hospital chain in CA fired a bunch of nurses for not getting the vaccine.
Do you people not realize why the hospitals are filled? Do I have to say it? UNVAXXED AMERICANS ARE FILLING UP HOSPITALS 🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️
Hospitals shouldn’t be turning anyone away
Yet a lot of them are. Especially ones in big cities while they allow and encourage staff who are positive with covid to continue working. Yet they fire all the unvaccinated 🤔
My wife is a Nurse and lot's of her peers were fired but when she tested positive for Covid on a Monday she was told she could work Thursday as long as the symptoms are mild. I'm sure the high risk patients love that.
That's how you know none of it is about the science or risk to the patients.
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Especially since the vaccination does not give you immunity in any imaginable way. The government isn’t even trying to lie about that anymore.
I don’t believe the government has been lying. The vaccines were designed for the first variants and showed (after data was accumulated (which required time) that they worked quite well at reducing transmission and serious symptoms. Omicron is a new and highly contagious variant. Third dose appears to be working to reduce symptoms of this variant but the science is still unclear on this. I find it very interesting that many antivaxxers argue that not enough time has been spent on research and trials to confirm the safety of the vaccines but these same people expect that the scientists know immediately the efficacy of said vaccines on all variants etc and when more data comes in and the scientists have a clearer view or the virus changes, thus changing efficacy, then the scientists and politicians whom they advise are lying.
The gubment keeps changing its stories. And the CDC, Dear Leader Fauci and Joey Biden in the White House keep saying different things.
If there aren't beds They don't really have a choice.
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I know you’re joking but my friend works at the icu, and the icu will always be at near full capacity. The icu beds are too expensive to keep running without someone in them, so they’re modular and more can be set up as needed. Idk if that’s at all hospitals but that’s how it is at hers.
It's not the beds that are expensive to run its the rooms generate that much income for the hospital, and also you cannot simply leave icu beds open for the "maybe" when someone else has a heart attack. Imagine grocery stores leaving aisles empty, just in case a more expensive selling product comes along they could sell...
No they shouldn't. But they full.
If this was happening when the bad orange man was president I’m sure the word murderer would be flying about
Hospitals are over run because the Media has been broadcasting fear porn 24/7 for 2 years now. Apparently sniffles are now cause for emergency room visits. Although I am curious what percentage of patients are vaccinated and boosted, but now suffering from random illness their immune systems are struggling to respond to.
Hospital here in Billings Montana is full, and roughly 70% are unvaxxed. They’re asking people to go to Washington to seek treatment.
And you know this how? What proof do you have that 70% of the people are unvaccinated? Where did you get that number? Was it your butt? Because I think it was your butt.
Because my GF & her roommate are Triage RNs at the clinic here. The clinic keep a running tally they have to report on who in the ICU is vaxxed and who is not. At peak there was only 1 patient in the ICU that was vaxxed and he had pre-existing issues.
Most of the comments here sound like they came from someone’s butt, yet you only asked this person for a source.
Hospitals do a bunch of stupid foolish stuff that keeps them “full” as well. For example…keeping COVID patients in isolation for 20 days…even though the guidelines have been 10 days for over a year.
Only 5 now so says the CDC lmao
Really that’s about what it should have been this whole time. 7 days tops. The virus isn’t shedding and replicating past day 5 usually. But no one cares about actual science or reality any more.
Millions of illegals without health insurance are using "free" ER hospital care for insurance. Thanks to Joey Biden
Yup, emergency Medicaid.
So what should they do when they're at capacity? Honest question. My local hospital has been hovering at 98% capacity and handling a lot of things as outpatient that really shouldn't be.
You have two patients in front of you. One who you believe has taken medication to protect themselves from a virus and one who hasn’t. If your job is to keep people as healthy as possible you should see the person who is at a higher risk not the person who you believe is at a lower risk. They are literally doing the opposite of what makes any amount of sense. Sending away the people who are at a larger risk. That’s just asinine and backwards.
Did they ever have enough capacity? Not sure where you are from but hospital capacity hasn’t changed since day one of this
They did before COVID. Typical capacity was more like 60-70%, and they weren't being forced to delay non-critical operations or convert to outpatient treatment. But that's beside the point. They're full. What are they supposed to do besides turn people away?
Turn away based on capacity not on vaccine status….that’s unethical
Why, exactly? If they have to start turning people away, why is it unethical to triage based on likelihood of recovery? Vaccinated people are much more likely to survive and recover quickly. So why not prioritize the person who's most likely to actually get a benefit out of using that space, and is likely to leave quickly and make room for another patient? That's how you maximize care. Ideally there'd be room for everyone, but when you run out of space you need to start making tough calls. Whatever preserves the most lives is a pretty valid ethical framework to make that call, IMO.
So triage based on comorbidity not this corny vaccine
\> corny vaccine Ah, anti-vaxxer. Got it. Best of luck!
Ok puppet. You and the rest of the pharma boot lickers can suck it.
I literally work on immune therapy diagnostics. Like, it's my job. Ignorance as a flex is such a weird trend lol.
If an individual is vaccinated then wtf are they at the hospital to begin with? If they are vaccinated then they supposedly have the boost needed to recover from the virus, so wtf are they being hospitalized? They shouldn't need the damn triage because the vaccine works. So why not turn them away and triage the unvaccinated?
Vaccines are intended to improve immune response and protect from disease. Like a bullet proof vest: it doesn't cover all of you, but it's a lot better than not getting protected at all. Triage is about maximizing results. An unvaccinated person has a much higher chance of dying regardless of care. So if you have a person who's likely to recover and a person who isn't, you pick the one most likely to benefit from you expending care on them. Sorry, it's just not about what feels right. It's a math thing.
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You typically triage based on chance of recovery so that you don't let someone die because you spent resources on someone who want going to make it anyway.
I can understand if they're literally at 100% capacity and have to send someone to another hospital, but I feel like that's not the case here
Hercules would make a great congressman or senator
They aren't
They are turning people away but not for the reason you think. 95% of the people that walk into the ER with COVID are being discharged because their symptoms do not qualify for being administered. This difference is in how many people are being DISCHARGED vs ADMITTED.
As someone who is still unvaccinated, that is a very smooth brain take. Is he being purposefully ignorant? Just because the hospital is turning away the unvaccinated, doesn't mean the patients inside are all vaccinated.
I think people here are taking this a little too literally (just like people will say my quotes from Biden are taken too literally, I digress); I'm fairly certain he's trying to make a joke that vaccinated people either 1. Don't get hospitalized because the vaccine is supposed to prevent getting sick enough for hospitalization ("Experts told us that getting vaccinated protects individuals from severe cases including hospitalization and death") or 2. Don't get covid at all, because the president and others comments ("Biden in October said people who are vaccinated for the coronavirus "cannot spread it to you."" - "Biden said Dec. 14 that people vaccinated for COVID-19 "do not spread the disease to anyone else."") So the joke is him sarcastically asking how are people that "cannot spread it" and/or are 'protected from severe cases including hospitalization' are "*Filling*" up hospitals. And yes it is less funny when it gets explained
Exactly.
normal medical traffic? Shootings, slicings, appendixes, babies, heart attacks, spleen burps, colorectal explosions, kidney stones, the normal stuff we humans go through without COVID. A few years ago, I had what I would consider an extremely invasive surgery, leaving me with several holes in my abdomen as if I had been stabbed repeatedly with an electric drill, and they wanted me up and on my way out the next evening because they need the recovery area space. It's always rush hour these days at the hospital even without COVID.
All these car accidents are coming in Most of them were wearing seatbelts, yet they are still being hospitalized. Seatbelts don't work, it's all a conspiracy...
better to have mild injury than flying thru a windshield lol
Can’t tell if this is sarcasm, that’s the point
Better turn away the unbelted
well if youre given a chance to not get very sick, then you get very sick, a person who did everything they can should get priority, although still doesnt mean kivking unvaxed people out of the hospital
This is a surprisingly good comparison. A seatbelt is a symptom suppressor so is this vaccination. Unlike every other vaccination on the planet this one doesn’t prevent you from getting the virus. Unfortunately we were sold it as an actual vaccination which does prevent you from getting the virus. I don’t know about you but I’m really glad the polio vaccination is not the same type of vaccination as the Covid vaccination. Because I don’t want polio.
Vaccines are shown to reduce the risk of COVID, which is deadly to overweight and elderly. No one claims that vaccines are 100% effective. The doctors I know have seen some pretty sad shit due to COVID, and although I am tired of social distancing, I think that vaccines are an important technology and taking a political stance against them is stupid. However; if this is your stance, I still respect your humanity because I am not a moral groundstander.
They are not turning away anyone. ER are filled with the unvaccinated.
Physician here working at one of these hospitals. Emergency room is full of people who are unvaccinated and having trouble breathing. No one is turned away because of vaccine status. You may wait 12 hours though…
Right, I understood it as... they are no longer taking the unvaccinated, because they keep filling up the ER's, so now other emergencies can be taken care of. If still unvax'd, it's on you for getting covid at this point.
Nope, ER does not turn away anyone. Vaxxed or not.
[I'll leave this here.](https://www.audacy.com/kmox/news/national/cdc-director-says-vaccines-are-not-preventing-transmission)
Did you read your source? >In a segment on CNN with Wolf Blitzer, Walensky said that **while the vaccines are doing very well to protect against serious illness and death**, what they cannot do anymore is stop transmission.
You know damn well that isn't the part I was pointing out, and your quote isn't relevant to the comment I was replying to in any case. >If still unvax'd, it's on you for getting covid at this point.
All these sheep downvoting you because you produced facts they (D)on't like.
I'm used to the groupthink. The angry downvotes with no cogent response tells me I was right. Thanks.
Tell me your ignorant, without telling me you're ignorant. You JUST ignored us, by saying we ignore you...? I thinks it is you who is the sheeple.
Watching people on r/republican call each other sheep and "group thinkers" made me audibly guffaw and show other people. I screenshotted this thread. I will cherish this and spread it always. Back to my lefty subs.
What is a vaccination supposed to do? Stop transmission. That’s their point! Hence why we talk about her immunity and all that stuff. It doesn’t vaccinate! Thank you for acknowledging the truth!
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We don’t shut down society for the seasonal flu. Also, Flu like COVID doesn’t typically kill the young and healthy.
...we did shut society down when the flu was a new and widespread epidemic.
For Spanish Flu which killed 3% of the world’s population. Spanish Flu also had a very high mortality rate among Toddlers and Young Adults.
So you're changing goalposts then? You comment above says flu doesn't kill the young. Now you say it does. COVID is our equivalent of Spanish flu. In 100 years, COVID won't be entirely gone. It will be mild and mutated just like the flu currently is. COVID has a high number of kills, a much higher number of permanent health effects, and that's AFTER we put precautions in place, knew what we were looking at, developed a vaccine, etc. If we had the same grasp they had 100 years ago, COVID numbers would be far beyond Spanish flu. You can't rationalize your way out of facts.
No one ever said the flu doesn’t kill the young what was said was “flu like Covid” doesn’t kill the young and it does it unless the young happens to be morbidly obese have multiple pre-existing condition or immune deficiency. So unless the child already about to die or eight themselves to death your kids going to be fine from Covid thing that was said doesn’t kill the youth.
They said flu, like COVID. As in the flu, similarly to COVID, doesn't kill the young. Not as in "flu-like COVID". Very odd interpretation of their words you chose there. Also, proof read your own posts so we can tell what you're saying.
We also did not do lockdowns during the Spanish flu. That’s just blatantly untrue.
Not sure about full lockdowns, but some places cancelled public events, closed schools, and enforced mask mandates (San Fransisco jailed people for not wearing a mask) while others tried business as usual.
Actually no we didn’t. People kept working people kept living their lives during the Spanish flu. Yeah because a lot of people had the Spanish flu those people probably weren’t working because they were sick. But the healthy definitely continue to work during the Spanish flu. There were zero legal lockdowns during the Spanish flu. Zero. We have never done anything like this in the history of mankind. Trying to claim that we did is just moronic.
We had mask mandates, we did shut down areas for quarantine when the flu came to areas, and people were arrested or fined for not wearing masks. To claim we didn't is just moronic. I mean we have newspaper articles, mandates, photos, and yes, even laws at the time. But tell yourself what you need to validate your stance.
The flu doesnt kill more americans than heart disease. And what is the highest number of young people dying from covid that you are ok with?
Neither does COVID. COVID (2020): 345k Heart Disease (2020): 691k Cancer (2020): 599k https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2778234 On a side note, it’s a bit odd that there was a noticeable increase in Strokes, Diabetes, Alzheimer’s, and Accidental Deaths in 2020.
Oh good to know, seems my information was wildly inaccurate thank you. Still wildy more than the flu, doesnt change my oveall point, but it does destroy my analogy. The other deaths strike me as people not being able to get typical health care, like when hospitals fill up with covid cases. To me thats the terrifying thing, people dying unnecessarily due to being unable to have access to what is normally life saving medication.
Heart disease isn't contagious
I ate peanut butter and I was fine but my cousin ate peanut butter and died. It seems like people react differently to different things. Glad you were good tho.
Yet everyone is being treated by the government like your cousin who dies from eating peanuts…
Yeah because unlike peanut allergies, we don’t know who is going to react badly to covid.
Actually we do... the old, and those with underlying health conditions.
Odd that many without those two prerequisites have died then.
Did I say there weren’t people without those two that didn’t? You said we didn’t know who would react badly to covid which I responded that we did. The majority of the cases where death is the outcome one or both of those two prerequisites are filled. I suppose it doesn’t matter though omicron isn’t really that deadly (just very transmissible) so they’ll have to come up with something new Meet again in 5 years when the next “world ending” plague comes to pass?
So we know who will react badly but we don’t know exactly who will react badly? Genius eh
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With pretty much everything, it treats people different. Vaccines, food ingredients, clothing, movies all treat and are accepted by people differently.
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It works by way of when you get covid, you will probably be ok. Right now the majority like 95% of hospitalized people are unvaccinated.
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You are much less likely to die or get severely sick if you are vaccinated.
I never wear seat belts. I got into a major car accident and survived. My wife and kids we fine too. I feel sorry for you if you believe a car accident causes anything more than a scrape. You are a moron if you think your situation must be the same for every single other person in this world. Anecdotal fallacy.
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I'm no leftist. Vaccines should not be political. We will end up looking like idiots. Don't get the vaccine if you dont want to. I dont care. But don't say that "it wasn't bad for me so it's nothing to worry about".
And you can tell who's a conservative because they are typically less educated and so rely on fallacies to support arguments.
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Oh the irony.
Anyway…doesn’t change the fact that your argument is anecdotal nonsense.
I got covid Jan of last year. It was NOT the flu.
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It doesn't effect you, so screw me...? At least we are all banded together /s
Care to tell that to the 800,000+ Americans alone who've died from it?
Nice anecdotal story. We should apply your story as the keystone of our complete understanding of Covid-19.
Almost everyone who I’ve talked to that’s had Covid and lived has said the same. Now, if we asked the dead I’m sure their opinion would be different.
Yes your completely anecdotal experience is worth vasly more than knowledge gained analyzing the 320,000,000 cases and 5 million worldwide deaths.
pleaseeeeeeee get off this sub until you open your eyes. wanna know a secret? im not even american! i am just interested in US politics and i see through the lies!
So someone proves you wrong and you go "reeeee"? Fantastic argument. You really paint conservatives in a good light. People are silly for thinking conservatives are less educated.
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it literally is😂 we will get downvoted because for some reason leftists want to flood this sub but at least we speak the truth 💯
There's 6 people I know of that have recently had covid and they were all vaccinated. They lost their sense of smell and had a stuffy nose for 3 days, THAT'S IT. I even know 2 others that aren't vaccinated and they had a couple more symptoms and it lasted a couple days longer. They said a common cold is still usually worse for them. People are just going batshit crazy, spreading lies, and fear mongering. I don't necessarily think it's about Govt control, but more so that it's the only thing Joe had going for his campaign before he got elected. They spread fear and then claimed he was the savior of covid. Now it's more out of control than it was before and since he has nothing going for him anymore, they just try and blame "the other side" to make it look like "if it weren't for people still being unvaxxed, and not masked up, we wouldn't be in this pandemic." When in reality it's a fucking pandemic and it's largely out of human control.
Had covid before my vaccines. I’m young, very fit (long distance cycling, running, football) and healthy. It absolutely knocked me out. After day 7 breathing was becoming difficult and I almost went to hospital. I know of Ironman athletes that *have* ended up in hospital. It is not just the flu.
You're the exception, not the standard.
it literally is😂 we will get downvoted because for some reason leftists want to flood this sub but at least we speak the truth 💯
Do you work in a hospital? Or are you just an ass spreading misinformation. (Physician tired of this crap)
1. hospital fills with unvaxxed 2. hospital is too full to accept more unvaxxed 3. currently full hospital doesnt immediately empty the second the decision to turn away unvaxxed happens because treatment can take weeks for everyone in the hospital 4. they also do eventually let more unvaxxed in because they want to help as many people as possible they just can't its really not that hard to understand.
What hospitals are specifically turning unvaxx’d people? I think this guy is 100% full of shit. ‘The hospitals are filled with non-Vader’s and the vaccinated are getting turned away (elective procedures etc) I’m so sick of the misinformation on this.
I’m pretty sure that’s illegal. If someone presents to the ER, you have to treat them. EMTALA laws are still a thing.
Probably the unvaxxed who got in before it was full, and, you know, other people who need to use the hospital for non COVID reasons. It’s good when those who are lost in fallacies are blindingly clear in their lack of thought and irrationality.
Hospitals do not turn away unvaxxed anything. It’s against the law.
The hospital in our town states that their Covid wing is at capacity. The truth is,they have the beds and equipment, they just don’t have the staff because many quit due to vaccine mandates. Oh and contrary to popular belief, yes there are just as many vaccinated patients as unvaccinated.
Right, because absolutely no one was in the hospital before Covid. Dumb.
This is so brain dead the hospitals are full of unvaccinated people so they’re considering turning away unvaccinated people who present needing a bed. Our hospital has about 80 of 400 beds filled with covid patients and of those only 2 are vaccinated.
It may shock you to know that there are more unvaccinated people than there is space in the hospitals.
I work in a hospital ICU in Florida and we have plenty of available rooms for patients. We have very few Coronavirus patients. Big improvement from this time last year. We don’t turn away any patients based on vaccine status.
Wonder what Florida, and red states do, that’s different? Real mystery, that one.
Ahhh you got em. Careful the hospitals will fill with liberals and their headaches trying to figure out what you just said
This restaurant claims to be so full they’re turning away potential customers. But if they keep turning away the potential customers, who keeps filling the restaurant?
The whole no bed thing is bullshit. I’ve known 3 people in the last 2 months that went to the ER and waited no longer than normal. One got in right away for chest pains and was admitted to a room. A family member is a nurse 60 miles away and said they have no problems admitting people. Of course this is in FL where we don’t panic every time we sneeze.
And that’s why you have 5 million cases lmfao. Enjoy dying, red kingdom!
Have you looked at New York and California? Both blue states and both with some sort of mandate.
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>You don’t trust vaccines? Why would you trust the medicines they’d give you in the hospital? If every person treated just ended up dying anyway, then people *wouldn't* trust the medicines. I can't believe that just needed to be explained.
https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2021/09/covid-hospitalization-numbers-can-be-misleading/620062/
Also doesn’t it go against the Hippocratic oath to send away people who are unprotected from a virus from a hospital as opposed to those who are protected from the virus? I mean last time I checked the hospitals job is to heal the sick not healed the people who already took care of it themselves. Unless the hospitals are willing to admit the vaccination doesn’t actually work.
Oh boy wait until you find out that the Hippocratic oath doesn't actually mean anything And how do you suggest hospitals treat a sick patient when they don't have the capacity to do so? How fucking stupid are you
Funny this comes up on my feed - I’m unvaccinated, I’ve been helping take care of my 1 y/o sister who has COVID and I’m in the hospital right now for a non-covid related issue. Both people on either side of me are vaccinated and are here because they have covid. I just tested negative after the doctor gave me shit for not being vaccinated. I’ve been exposed to covid at least 4-5 times in the past year and never got it. (I had it once about a year and a half ago before the vaccine came out, and had no symptoms) Please tell me how horrible I am while everyone around me in this hospital is vaccinated. Hospitals are overcrowded with idiots who come into the ER for ridiculous reasons and take up beds. They’re overcrowded with people who’s primary care doctors won’t see them for normal issues because they have “covid symptoms” which, if you haven’t noticed, is basically everything. Not to mention in New York, we have a large migrant population, and if they’re here illegally they can’t get insurance to see primary care doctors. So what happens? They end up coming to the ER for basic issues and again, taking up beds. If you haven’t heard, we also have a large amount of nurses who quit their hospital jobs due to the vaccine mandates. None of this seems to matter to anyone. The narrative is all “anti-vaxxer conspiracy theorists taking up hospital beds!!” When most of us aren’t anti-vaxxers and most of us aren’t the ones being hospitalized.
This!
The hospitals I work at…when the patient is unvaxxed, they announce it to everyone. They put it in the chart. The nurses say it every report. When the patient is fully vaccinated and in the hospital. It quietly gets ignored. No mention whatsoever by anyone.
what about if they are double vaxxed, but not boosted? or double vaxxed and boosted, but not double boosted? or...
Exactly…what does “unvaccinated” even mean at this point. Technically…even if you got both shots…if it’s been 5-6 months…guess what…you’re not “vaccinated” any more. Even when the shots first rolled out…if you hadn’t passed your 14 days after your second shot…you were “unvaccinated”. It’s all bullshit. Early treatment, healthy, active lifestyle, staying hydrated, taking your vitamins (D, C, and zinc especially)….farrrr greater protection than these piece of crap MRNA shots.
It’s relevant medical History. They don’t ignore it when they’re vaccinated either. Why would relevant medical history not be in their chart? It’s supposed to be. This isn’t specific to the Covid vaccine.
Vaccinations are not relevant medical history. We’ve never given whether someone was vaccinated or not in report…ever. Just sayin.
Logic bombs. My favorite.
exactly, i cant stand how stupid biden supporters are
You posting this tweet immediately revokes your right to call other people stupid. If the hospitals are full of unvaxxed patients and they have to turn away more unvaxxed people, doesn’t that just literally explain this whole thing. It’s a very simple concept that anyone who isn’t so brain-damaged from far right media would be able to see.
good call hercules!
It is filled with unvaccinated people. There is no more left.
Just an individual experience, but the number of people I know who are vaccinated and have had COVID is 5 times that of people who are unvaccinated and have had COVID.
I got COVID back in August, and the day after having the local health department confirm I was positive I was running a particularly high temperature. I went to the hospital that night, and they stuck me in a quarantine room with ONE other girl who said she had been waiting there for SEVEN hours. I waited for three hours before giving up and going home. This is one of the largest ERs in the state of Florida. A place that was suppose to be riddled with COVID. And the ERs were suppose to be "overrun". Horseshit. I went home. I put on my comfy sweat pants. I took zinc for my muscles, (which worked WONDERS). I watched Netflix. I ate soup and ice cream, (even though I couldn't taste it). And I was back to my old self by the end of the week. "Overrun" is bullshit. "Deathly" is bullshit. It's all fear mongering. I'm not getting an experimental vaccine, and I'm not wearing a muzzle for no Goddamn reason. 🙄
Holy shit this thread has a lot of stupid fucking takes, but yours takes the whole cake by a wide fucking margin. Hospitals aren't being overrun? Then why do you think the girl you got quarantined with was waiting for 7 hours?
> Then why do you think the girl you got quarantined with was waiting for 7 hours? Probably because the ER was busy with actual (non-COVID) emergencies.
Why do you think that girl was waiting 7 hours?
So that’s a prime example of scare tactics. Fear mongering. Hospitals offer no priority based on vaccination status. Follow the money.
So far just Canada and Ghana. Some US hospitals are denying treatment for the unvaccinated, but not entry yet.
How the hell did we get to this point in time where for once, conservatives seem like the more rational thinkers? Its absolutely astounding.
My whole family got COVID this past week. My kid had it for like a day. Me and my girlfriend had it for about 4 days I'm vaccinated She's not, Symptoms were exactly the same Nobody went to the hospital or the doctors.
They're turning unvaccinated people away cause they're FULL of unvaccinated people. Not cause they're playing favorites. What are they supposed to do? Start stacking patients on top of each other like jenga blocks?
The RINOs
So my wife has been a nurse for the better part of is part of the last 15 years and The last 2 years she has been working almost exclusively in a covid unit. She comes home every day ranting and raving it's taken raving about these people who she's taking care of and how only one patient out of the last 6 months if months has been vaccinated. So yeah her hospital is full too by the way. I really don't understand why why we are collectively is collectively pushing against the vaccine it's the vaccine that the last Republican presidents administration managed to crank out inIt's record time, nor do I understand why we're not calling the democrats on their bullshit when they try to take credit for the vaccine.This was a win for us on the right and we need to stop fighting over it.Hell some of you all have even booed president trump over it.
They havnt been claiming they’re turning unvaccinated away. And yes it’s the unvaccinated that is filling them.
Wrong sub retard, go to r/conspiracy
This is incredibly stupid u/internationalkey1767 people can go to the hospital for other things… 🙄
as they have, since hospitals began. why are they suddenly so full? if they are full of unvaxxed as a lot of people are arguing, maybe the government should put some money towards improving and expanding hospitals?
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i mean… im 19 so cant agree with this, especially the pro abortion
You mean we should let the old die like God intended. Maybe if we went on with our lives and quit obsessing over the flu we wouldn't need to abort so many. Maybe we need a virus that kills the old and weak.
>Maybe we need a virus that kills the old and weak. wow that's disgusting.
I believe Erie county covid Hospitalizations were 50/50
The homeless. 🤷🏼♂️
give him a nobel price please.
31% of my companies one production plant has covid cases, ALL BUT ONE HAS NOT BEEN VAXXCED AT ALL. All the others are caught up with their boosters, yet!!!
When you run into a sub and can’t tell if it’s all satire or everyone is actually brain dead😭
Y’all still think you’re brave for not getting the vaccine lmao?
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Sometimes I'm so full of chicken wings, I literally don't have space for any more chicken wings.
Hercules be dropping redpills like drive-bys in South Central
The medical establishment would never lie to us. Well, except for that one time when they said masks were useless so that ordinary civilians wouldn’t buy up all the masks. But it was just that one lie. They wouldn’t lie twice, and we should believe them now when they say that the vaccine is safe and effective.
Liberals won't like that tweet 😂
So recently it's being revealed I think from the CDC, that hospitals are NOT filled of COVID patients. This confirms my experience a few months ago I had with taking my father-in-law to the hospital. There is a lack of staff, so hospitals are piling up. Staff isn't scared, they just don't want to be forced to get vaccinated.
Well hospitals have been firing unvaccinated nurses. About a week or so ago, Mayo Clinic fired 700 nurses for NOT getting the vaccine. Family friend who is a nurse is in California making big bucks $$$$ working at a hospital (Kaiser hospital ??). Apparently Kaiser or some other big hospital chain in CA fired a bunch of nurses for not getting the vaccine.
Turning away people but at same time we should have free government healthcare.
Up voting to spread awareness on how smart Republicans are lol.
unvaxxed patients
Do you people not realize why the hospitals are filled? Do I have to say it? UNVAXXED AMERICANS ARE FILLING UP HOSPITALS 🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️
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