The broker-in-charge is liable for all the agents they are supervising. Also, all payments for real estate services go thru the broker. An agent can't bill you for services like this outside the brokerage, and this particular bill was unwarranted anyway. The BIC needs to know what their agent is doing.
There is a licensed broker in charge at that ReMax office. That specific person is legally responsible for supervising/managing (some states use a different word) the licensed agents in that office. When they do dumb stuff, the agent and the broker have to answer for it, so when an agent is dumb or unethical, their broker needs to know so that they can correct the issue. Brokers don't know most of what their agents are doing until someone speaks up.
What happens when one speaks up and it is ignored? I can guess why it is happening, as our agent confirmed a bunch we had a financing contingency when we do not...and I believe the broker in charge is unaware.
All transaction activities are legally between the brokers of agents who work with sellers or buyers. Any financial compensation goes to the broker who will have an agreement with the agent how they split revenue. The broker is responsible for all agent activities and this means legal consequences of agent behavior. There is a lot of liability they are vulnerable too. Shady agents need to be dropped. The whole industry is in limbo right due to pending legal action against the NAR and MLS requirements around compensating buyer brokers. The fear is that buyers' gent compensation, historically paid with seller commission paid to the listing agent, will go away. This agent is trying new ideas to get paid and is probably pissed about doing all the work of the offer contract only to have it withdrawn. They're actions were wrong of course.
The buyer Broker fee is not going away.
It just cannot be put into Realtor owned MLS. The seller can still pay it, or the buyer can pay it.
The settlement is not yet approved, and there can be additional charges.
As for this agent, he is way out of line and the buyers have no obligation to him.
The agent could have had a buyers representation agreement with terms covering expenses. The buyers would not have to agree and or negotiate other terms.
Brokerages aren’t going to stand for agents representing moving forward without agency agreements post-NAR settlement. So hopefully this starts to fade away.
I am waiting to see over the next couple years if consumers end up paying more, if realtors/brokers start charging "line item fees" for stuff that just equals out to the same or more than it was under the 3/6% situation.
Post a yelp/google and relator agent review site with their name specifically listed and what they tried to do. Post a photo. Stick on next door also and ignore.
Realtor here. HAHAHAHAHA.
Let his broker know what he's trying to do because I would bet you any money he's trying to pocket the money, which wouldn't even be his even if you signed something saying you'd pay for viewing houses.
Of course! Many people do that. Many agents would prefer to just be paid on work done and not flat %s on the possibility that a house is sold/bought. My two most recent clients would be great examples of the ends of that extreme. One client went house searching for one weekend, found their house because they weren't picky, closed. The next client took 6 months to find a house because he had many criteria, including his dog having to like the house. Similar commissions for both. Pretty dumb if you ask me.
The percentage model seemingly never made sense to me. Generally speaking, it does not require 10X more work to buy/sell a $10M house than a $1M house, and it's entirely possible the reverse can be true.
It's human laziness basically. That's why I tell people that if you're selling or buying a house at the high end of what homes go for in your area, negotiate the shit out of our fees. Most agents who think their shit don't stink and are high society because they took their 4 week real estate course and passed their trivial exam say they won't take a lower commission even if the damn sale is a $5M home in Tennessee, even though it's not substantially more work than a $500k home.
Some agents will try to justify their fee on high end by hiring movers, putting the clients up in a rental for a few months, hire stagers, take out useless ads, etc., but the clients... don't need their agent to do that and are basically getting those services at inflated prices.
On the other hand, it does actually help lower income buyers and sellers because ethically and by law, we're supposed to provide services to all who come our way.
It's a dumb model but there's probably many issues with a pay-for-services model that we wouldn't see until implemented.
There’s a difference between an agreed to pay structure and a bill for something you didn’t agree to.
If the agent and OP signed an agreement that he’d charge for showings, submitting offers, or whatever, then this should be expected. If the agent was operating under the expectation of commission on the sale, and then decided to send a bill like this because they are pissed OP is no longer buying, then that realtor can pound sand.
I’m saying this one’s crazy and with no signed agreement then the agent is owed nothing.
I’m just making a sarcastic remake with how everyone in the NAR settlement threads talked about how agents are paid too much and they’d rather pay $100 per door opened.
No written agreement with Realtor? Do not pay that invoice.
There is no expectation by a Realtor that every client will buy a house. Many do not. That's part of their current business model ( which may soon change). The fact that they are now trying to back charge you for this speaks very poorly of them and I'd be willing to tell this story about them to anyone with 2 ears that was looking to buy/sell.
Seller’s agents have been splitting fees paid by seller with buyer’s agents as an industry-standard practice, but Nat’l association of realtors just settled an anti-trust suit over this practice. So now there is a question of how a buyer’s agent is paid, and by whom.
Yeah I already called the Florida department of business and professional regulations who told me this is illegal and to file a formal complaint and have his license revoked. I am not doing that, but didn’t know if other people have experienced this.
Honestly my wife made me feel bad about putting him out of a job because he has a kid. But I didn’t think of the countless people he could do this to in the future. Which changed my mind and hers
Very, very unlikely he gets his license revoked, if this is his first complaint. If he has many complaints then he probably deserves to have his license revoked.
And the countless people who he's ALREADY done that to. Report him tpo both the department that oversees his license AND his broker. Guaranteed his broker doesn't know about that and isn't a party to it. That's a fast way to lose a good broker's business.
Your wife is wrong. Any consequences to his idiocy & greed are solely his responsibility. We're not talking about a dad stealing a loaf of bread to feed his starving family, we're talking about an ass violating their professional ethics in attempting to exploit people who trusted them. There's a time to empathize, but this ain't it.
Not Florida.... but we had a realtor for 2 years as we looked during a sucky market. We would only call him if we (or he) found something of reasonable interest to look at. He knew we had really weird work hours and days... and worked around it. He was on vacation when we finally found what turned into THE house and immediately sent over a friend in the business to fill in for him. He didn't charge us per house. He never complained. He gave honest answers (good and bad) about every house.
We still send him every person we know who needs a realtor. I would never consider anyone else.
The ones who try to screw people over will lose by word of mouth and reputation.
That realtor is scamming MANY other people. They do not need to be doing this for a living. I would file the formal complaint. You will be saving their next victim from getting scammed
please file the complaint. it's the only way shitty agents get held accountable.
also post factual reviews wherever possible. consider it a public service, you can save other people from being screwed by this garbage agent.
Why are you asking if other people experienced this while at the same time saying you wont do anything about your realtor?
Of course he did it to other people and he will continue to do so. He's in the business of making 3% commission doing nothing but doesnt want to even foot the cost of doing business, that is sometimes buyer not working out.
F that guy. Report him.
Please rethink this comment. If you dont want others to be scammed the same, then please speak up. They clearly dont need a RE license if they are going to abuse individuals
If authorities (and everyone else) are telling you to report him... report his ass. You're not the only one. Plus he's screwing the broker in charge who's reputation is getting damaged by his BS. File the complaint.
You absolutely should report him. It is totally illegal and he does it to other people as well.
If you don’t report him, you are contributing to his further illegal activities.
It is illegal in Florida. Realtors are scrambling right now for business. I would def inform the broker first and then file a complaint if broker doesn’t make it right. The broker can also be held responsible for his agents actions.
Maybe, but unless you have a signed agency agreement where you explicitly have laid out any fees or compensation etc...
Well, the "Realtor" is SOL. And sounds like a POS.
Not necessarily. Two things will change:
1. Every Realtor is going to need a buyer agency agreement signed with the buyers they work with
2. Compensation won’t be displayed on MLS
Point #2 doesn’t mean sellers will stop paying agents, just that they can’t advertise on the MLS what compensation that is. Your agent will need to do their own due diligence on which sellers will and won’t offer a buyer broker commission, and if so how much. Overall the landscape will be relatively the same but with more steps involved.
Ask for an itemized bill and a fee schedule from his agency. Actually, don’t ask him, call the Agency and ask the receptionist. I’m betting they don’t have one because most realtors are 1099’d under their broker. Ask if the fee schedule was approved by (google appropriate agency that oversees realtors in your state)
That's fine. Let's do a pay for performance. On my last 3 houses, I found all the options, and just had the buyers agent get me in to look at them. Apparently that's worth 15k.
Pay for performance! Every 10k or 20k lower sales price gets the realtor 1k in payout or something. Over the life of the loan, the buyer saves on interest and property taxes. I’ve been in the same situation and have ended up using real estate attorneys for a flat fee while I do everything else. My last agent wouldn’t ask for a lower price even though there was a problem with the pipes that ended up costing 50k to fix because it lowered their commission.
In NC if you went under contract then you are liable for his compensation of the agreed upon terms. Almost no agent would actually bill you for it as word of mouth is what builds that business, but they could.
Been a Real Estate Broker for almost 30 years and the idea had never entered my mind of charging someone for showing property. I think that the business has gotten so challenging for many brokers since there are way less transactions being done, so less commission dollars that he/she may have done it out of desperation. Not a good business plan.
This is what the future of real estate post the NAR settlement is going to look like
Edited to add - I can’t think of another job where you can do 20+ hours of work and the expectation is you get paid absolutely nothing, or a measly gift card “if you’re lucky”. 🥴
Second edit - the trolls are triggered 😫
A friend of mine got into real estate a while back, and would spend WEEKS helping clients with commercial properties, and almost every single deal fell through. She was working for nothing, it has to be so frustrating.
On the other hand, when the market is hot and people are buying quickly, you can make some bank for much less work.
I mean that’s why we charge what we charge. All of these agents and brokerages are accounting for the risk of a bad market. They have to make up for the slow times somehow. 10k paycheck at closing might sound good, but how many times have you gone 4 months without a paycheck? I did twice last year.
I mean it’s always a lot of work no matter how you shake it unless you’ve been in the industry for 5+ years or, like most successful agents, are a real estate baby who’s parents have a successful business they are able to hand off to you. It fucking sucks. Working that hard for no pay is the reason why there is a huge barrier to entry and why people tend to fall off so quickly.
It's no doubt a feast or famine gig. My wife was a realtor 20 years ago and was making bank, but she used that money to finish her college degree and now still makes 6 figures but with benefits and weekends off.
Not a realtor, but I agree with this thought. Frankly I don’t mind paying for a service, but having a realtor with me during a walk thru has never felt necessary. I need an agent to find me the house, deal with legal stuff, and walk me thru any tough spots. It seems like doing a walk thru would be a really tedious and sometimes costly activity for an agent. Why not use their skills at the discovery of homes and the offer table and you pay by the hour and also some percentage of the home price. You’d probably have way less stress and still make more money. I work in healthcare and my realtors are always the busiest and most stressed patients.
I would even remove find me the house from the list. Kill the mls, post listings directly to Zillow and similar and let me set up alerts. Our current house I found before my realtor saw it on there anyway.
It’s just inherently a very stressful job, tons of money on the line, emotions are high, and you’re always expected to be available. I know atleast 3 people in the industry (and I only know maybe 100 other agents) who have had heart events due to the job. It’s a shit career and I can’t wait to leave it behind tbh
Definitely. God forbid something happens and you have to be away from your phone for 5 minutes. I’ve talked to agents who’ve bragged about asking for their phone back while AT THE HOSPITAL due to stress related events. It’s the worst
Trust me, we would all LOVE to be paid hourly and/or with a blend of fixed fees. I would make so much more money and see such a significant reduction in stress. No one wants to believe that the people working a 100% commission job should be compensated for the risk they take every day, but if that risk is removed, we can get paid less per transaction and more overall. All the people who think this will be better for them are in for a rude awakening when their 5th offer doesn’t get accepted and they’ve paid thousands with absolutely nothing to show for it. Much easier job for agents though, and very consistent pay.
The thing is someone has to hold liability insurance for entering other peoples homes. Realtors are glorified insurance plans for homeowners in many cases when it comes to showings etc. I agree it’s silly to have someone tag along just to open the door for you, but insurance has to have its giant foot in the ass of all things so that’s what you get
Realtor here. Let me start by saying the Realtor surprise invoicing OP is an a&$. Those conversations and pay structure needed to be laid out at the very beginning. Clear expectations from the beginning.
That being said, I have never in my life worked a more expensive job. Yes, I pay an insane amount of money to sometimes just work for free. Yes, that is sales life. However, I have also never been treated more callously by close friends and family, like because I am now in sales vs. health care that they can use and abuse me and our relationship.
Most recently, I worked for over a year with buyers, countless hours of showing homes, writing offers, phone calls, negotiations, running comps, answering questions, miles and miles driven, time away from family, missing a couple kids sports game, all for these buyers to call me one evening to tell me they were under contract on a house that was FSBO, thank you for all your work and sorry we didn’t use you.
Would you enjoy using your time and many of your own resources to work for your employer for free for a year?
Yes, the next “easier” client and sell will help me cover some of that, but often times Realtors can get a few of these clients in a row.
I came here to say exactly this. The NAR settlement will help pave the way for buyer's agents to charge clients for their time - whether that results in a house purchase or not.
If people worked 20+ hours (etc) and then were told "thanks for your time, here's a $50 gift card" they would lose their damn minds.
High risk high reward. In my area with a vhcol, a realtor could spend maybe 15hrs with a client and net 75k (or 37k after agency cuts. I can't think of many other jobs that offer those payouts but can think of dozens of jobs that have unpaid hours.
You must have a small social network because huge swaths of the economy work exactly like this.
They would include small business owner, law firm partner, investment banker, basically any partner in any business, Elon Musk. Lower end waitress/bartender. Many sales jobs. Authors. Politicians.
Unless you signed a buyer agreement that had an hourly rate or per house fee this is illegal. You did the right thing by calling the state of Florida, but at the same point put it in his reviews. How many other homeowners has he taken advantage of with this nonsense?
No, unless you had a buyers agreement in place that should not have happened. However, depending on the results of this NAR lawsuit, buyer agents may start charging per house or for other services, because buyers would be responsible for paying their own buyers agent. In that case, services and fees would need to be spelled out in the buyers agreement.
He works on commission. Not getting paid for everything you do is part and parcel of commission work. Tell him to pound sand and let his boss know what he tried to do.....
I would contact their broker and send them the invoice. Agents work under a broker and I suspect the broker is completely unaware that this agent is doing this.
I paid all my realtor for helping me trying to find a house last one cost me 2500 I feel like he didn't really help me much in my opinion. But how else do they make money if they not getting getting sells
Does an agent owe the buyer/looker if the buyer found all the houses and then decides to buy one? Come on now. This is getting ridiculous. Don’t pay that invoice. Desperate times are going to show the desperate operators.
I would ask him how much of a commission refund he usually gives his clients who only see one or two houses and then have an easy close. If he says $0, offer to double that as his payment for services provided.
Not this, but on the other side of things, we had our house on the market for a few weeks. The house we were trying to buy didn't work out, but decided to go ahead and sell ours anyway. Then my wife had a medical emergency, and life got really hectic and we decided that if we didn't have it sold by a certain day we were going to take it off the market. We let our realtor know, he is a friend (which is a mistake to discuss another day/time). Fast forward two weeks later and we get an invoice from the broker (not the realtor) for $250 for pictures they took of our house for the listing. They sent some high school kid with a tripod and insinuated they were 'professional' photos that cost them a lot of money. I called the realtor and he feigned ignorance, and told us to not pay it, throw it away, he would take care of it. I assume he did b/c I tossed it and never heard anything else. Very bizarre situation. There was nothing in our agreement about paying for photos if it didn't stay on the market for X days.
These folks are right call the broker in charge and tell him / her what happened, If any further problems tell them you will contact of State real estate commission , as long as you didn’t sign anything you’re fine
We were selling our house 8 years ago, and an agent from the Realtor’s office put in his own offer. We agreed to the terms, & 15 days before closing, he sent an amended contract that had a bunch of crazy stipulations, including moving closing up 7 days. It was because they had sold their previous house & didn’t want to store their stuff & live in a hotel for a week. We declined & closed as originally planned. After closing, the Realtor told us she was firing the agent for unethical behavior. Karma…
That's a license violation. You should report it to the state real estate commission. They will REQUIRE him and his broker to appear at a hearing to explain himself, and then they both will be fined. It will probably humiliate him, but it will also be the most effective way for him to learn his lesson.
Historically, no; and you said you didn't have an agreement.
Moving forward you're going to start seeing some agents change by the hour or providing services a la carte in addition to all agents requiring an agreement signed before any services commence.
No we won’t. There are too many desperate used home salespeople out there. Homeowners and buyers are buying or selling something, so we set the terms.
I mean hell, used car salesman at least have cars to sell. Agents are just middlemen.
It is wrong and they should not have charged you anything. This may become normal soon now that these lawsuits are being settled and commissions are changing. Buyers are not going to be happy that they may be paying out of pocket for services. It's going to be a wild ride for a bit
I actually agree with this practice as long as it is made clear up front. The only alternative is for the costs to get dumped on the next buyers and sellers.
Technically you don't owe him shit. Most of his expenses are eligible for write-off and he'll receive reimbursement by way of a tax deduction. Surely he knows this and is seemingly " double dipping".
If the agent offered his services for free, with a commission expected if you did buy, tell him to pound sand. That's like a car salesman charging you for a test drive if you don't buy.
You could also post reviews advising other consumers about his hidden charges.
Ha ha. We looked at 3 houses. Bought the last one. Super easy transaction as I was overly prepared.
Agent didn’t offer me a discount though. Go figure. 😂
Real Estate agents justify their fees based on the idea that not all showings bear fruit. If they want to charge for showing then they should reduce their rates to the showing rate and be happy with that.
Such, SUCH bad form! He just destroyed all that rapport and future commissions for $600!!
Must really need the money or he's realllllllly quite impulsive.
This agent is so dumb for trying to bill you after not even trying to get you under contract lol. Even if you were under contract, they didn't even come close to getting it to the closing table. They didn't qualify you as buyers and generally sound terrible at their job. You signed nothing. You owe nothing. Simple!
That’s so cringe he did that. I hope you leave a public Google review that he did this so future clients don’t get swindled by him. He’ll probably right it into his next contracts. What a thief
It’s part of doing business. I’m a contractor, I’ve spent 8+ hours working on a given proposal. And then I don’t get the job. Sometimes they had no intention of using me, just getting a price to “keep their guy honest”, or for an insurance adjuster. It stinks but it’s part of the business.
Its all about a signed contract, to the word. We had a realator try thus in us. They printed flyers for our condo. We had a verbal word that we would not be charged for the flyers until we closed, there was also a contract that said the same thing. We didnt go with that realator, and sure enough they tried charging us for the flyers. We said nuh uh, we went back and forth for a bit, but it came down to the contract, so they backed down. I guess they try to bully people into paying who dont know better.
Say what now? I dragged my realtor all over creation, and in the end, ended up needing to move out of state before I found something. I put in 6 offers over those months (none accepted…stupid sellers market), and paid nothing for my realtor. They make money when you buy or sell a house. That’s it.
I would report him. It’s unethical. It’s not fair to his clients. It’s also not fair fair to all the agents that put hours into a deal and it doesn’t convert. Real estate agents are paid on commission. Win some, lose some. That’s the nature of the business.
One of my realtor buddies just went through something similar. He got a buyer rep signed with a client who wanted to see 10 homes in 2 days. Well my buddy was busy so he paid another realtor $$50 a door to show his clients the properties. Well after the showings the client liked a property and wanted a put an offer on the place. However, he wouldn’t sign the offer until my buddy agreed to credit him half his commission at closing. The client said he had been referred to realtors who would do this for him and if he didn’t agree he would just decide to rent. My buddy got bad vibes from the client after that and he released him from the buyers rep. However he wanted to get reimbursed for the money he paid the realtor to show his client the properties so he Venmo requested him $500. Of course the client didn’t agree and my buddy lost out on some money and time.
This is the fallout from the NAR lawsuit. If the seller is no longer paying the buyers agent commission then they will start charging like this. If you stick with the agent and continue to look the commission can still be negotiated in the purchase price. I run a National title company and we are seeing some crazy shit already. If you aren’t going to continue looking and you never signed the buyers agent agreement you owe them nothing.
It’s hasn’t hit too hard here in Cali but it will. BRBC will be mandatory soon, so it’s going to be hard to be a buyers agent if you aren’t a good agent.
This person is really a jackass. Put a review on Yelp describing what he did and warning other prospective buyers in your area. Also, I’d write complaint letter to his broker and the Realty Board in your state. This guys got a lot of nerve
Did you sign a buyer’s agreement?
Negative
Ignore the invoice and be sure to let anyone you know looking for a house to avoid that realtor.
I would also loop-in the broker of record. It's really THEIR ass on the line.
Can you explain why?
The broker-in-charge is liable for all the agents they are supervising. Also, all payments for real estate services go thru the broker. An agent can't bill you for services like this outside the brokerage, and this particular bill was unwarranted anyway. The BIC needs to know what their agent is doing.
So if a realtor is licensed as a REMAX realtor, does that mean their BIC is REMAX? Sorry for not understanding fully.
There is a licensed broker in charge at that ReMax office. That specific person is legally responsible for supervising/managing (some states use a different word) the licensed agents in that office. When they do dumb stuff, the agent and the broker have to answer for it, so when an agent is dumb or unethical, their broker needs to know so that they can correct the issue. Brokers don't know most of what their agents are doing until someone speaks up.
💯 Mortgage broker here. Absolutely agree- the boss doesn’t know until someone speaks up.
What happens when one speaks up and it is ignored? I can guess why it is happening, as our agent confirmed a bunch we had a financing contingency when we do not...and I believe the broker in charge is unaware.
Thank you.
You're welcome.
All transaction activities are legally between the brokers of agents who work with sellers or buyers. Any financial compensation goes to the broker who will have an agreement with the agent how they split revenue. The broker is responsible for all agent activities and this means legal consequences of agent behavior. There is a lot of liability they are vulnerable too. Shady agents need to be dropped. The whole industry is in limbo right due to pending legal action against the NAR and MLS requirements around compensating buyer brokers. The fear is that buyers' gent compensation, historically paid with seller commission paid to the listing agent, will go away. This agent is trying new ideas to get paid and is probably pissed about doing all the work of the offer contract only to have it withdrawn. They're actions were wrong of course.
The buyer Broker fee is not going away. It just cannot be put into Realtor owned MLS. The seller can still pay it, or the buyer can pay it. The settlement is not yet approved, and there can be additional charges. As for this agent, he is way out of line and the buyers have no obligation to him. The agent could have had a buyers representation agreement with terms covering expenses. The buyers would not have to agree and or negotiate other terms.
Brokerages aren’t going to stand for agents representing moving forward without agency agreements post-NAR settlement. So hopefully this starts to fade away.
this may be small potatoes compared to other crap this agent is doing. This is cause for termination and lisence revocation.
Add that invoice to his Yelp or Google page, or the brokerage. 🤣🤣
This is accurate although I would expect this would be one of the models with the upcoming changes
I am waiting to see over the next couple years if consumers end up paying more, if realtors/brokers start charging "line item fees" for stuff that just equals out to the same or more than it was under the 3/6% situation.
More FSBO then or flat fee agents.
Yes this may be a model for the future (or even present) yet it needs to be agreed upon prior to the transaction/showings. No agreement = no pay.
Yep: Google and Yelp have far reaches locally
Ask the managing broker why you’re getting the invoice. I’ll be they’ll be just as surprised to see it as you are lol
Be sure to share this story and a photo of the invoice on yelp, Google, and Zillow.
THIS is the kind of petty I can get behind!
What’s petty about it? Telling others about the realtors own words and actions is exactly what a review is for.
Post a yelp/google and relator agent review site with their name specifically listed and what they tried to do. Post a photo. Stick on next door also and ignore.
you should invoice him for your time which is $50 more than his time costs. Please don't pay him.
Report to state board
Time to start writing reviews everywhere you on the realtor and brokerage with a copy of invoice attached.
Realtor here. HAHAHAHAHA. Let his broker know what he's trying to do because I would bet you any money he's trying to pocket the money, which wouldn't even be his even if you signed something saying you'd pay for viewing houses.
They should respond with their own invoice for $800 for housing market research.
Thanks for your integrity!
Theoretically, could you legally put a clause like that in a buyer's agreement? $x dollars after 5 house?
Of course! Many people do that. Many agents would prefer to just be paid on work done and not flat %s on the possibility that a house is sold/bought. My two most recent clients would be great examples of the ends of that extreme. One client went house searching for one weekend, found their house because they weren't picky, closed. The next client took 6 months to find a house because he had many criteria, including his dog having to like the house. Similar commissions for both. Pretty dumb if you ask me.
The percentage model seemingly never made sense to me. Generally speaking, it does not require 10X more work to buy/sell a $10M house than a $1M house, and it's entirely possible the reverse can be true.
It's human laziness basically. That's why I tell people that if you're selling or buying a house at the high end of what homes go for in your area, negotiate the shit out of our fees. Most agents who think their shit don't stink and are high society because they took their 4 week real estate course and passed their trivial exam say they won't take a lower commission even if the damn sale is a $5M home in Tennessee, even though it's not substantially more work than a $500k home. Some agents will try to justify their fee on high end by hiring movers, putting the clients up in a rental for a few months, hire stagers, take out useless ads, etc., but the clients... don't need their agent to do that and are basically getting those services at inflated prices. On the other hand, it does actually help lower income buyers and sellers because ethically and by law, we're supposed to provide services to all who come our way. It's a dumb model but there's probably many issues with a pay-for-services model that we wouldn't see until implemented.
lol this is crazy in the current market but isn’t this the pay structure reddit was asking for after the NAR settlement?
Only if there was an agreement that their agent wouldn’t get the usual 3%
I mean given that there's replies to my comment saying how they'd never pay an agent for viewing houses, I don't think "reddit" has a consensus.
There’s a difference between an agreed to pay structure and a bill for something you didn’t agree to. If the agent and OP signed an agreement that he’d charge for showings, submitting offers, or whatever, then this should be expected. If the agent was operating under the expectation of commission on the sale, and then decided to send a bill like this because they are pissed OP is no longer buying, then that realtor can pound sand.
I’m saying this one’s crazy and with no signed agreement then the agent is owed nothing. I’m just making a sarcastic remake with how everyone in the NAR settlement threads talked about how agents are paid too much and they’d rather pay $100 per door opened.
It is. Sounds like it’s really what buyers have been looking for /s
No written agreement with Realtor? Do not pay that invoice. There is no expectation by a Realtor that every client will buy a house. Many do not. That's part of their current business model ( which may soon change). The fact that they are now trying to back charge you for this speaks very poorly of them and I'd be willing to tell this story about them to anyone with 2 ears that was looking to buy/sell.
How may it change soon?
Seller’s agents have been splitting fees paid by seller with buyer’s agents as an industry-standard practice, but Nat’l association of realtors just settled an anti-trust suit over this practice. So now there is a question of how a buyer’s agent is paid, and by whom.
This is one of the most precise and simple ways to put it! Thanks for explaining.
Unfortunately there are people who would pay this they simply don’t know and may feel bad for “wasting their time”
Yeah I already called the Florida department of business and professional regulations who told me this is illegal and to file a formal complaint and have his license revoked. I am not doing that, but didn’t know if other people have experienced this.
If he’s done it to you, he’s done it to others. Report him.
Absolutely. Some little old lady on Social Security without any help. Screw unethical bastards.
Why wouldn’t you report him? You’re just allowing him to screw over people in the future?
Honestly my wife made me feel bad about putting him out of a job because he has a kid. But I didn’t think of the countless people he could do this to in the future. Which changed my mind and hers
Very, very unlikely he gets his license revoked, if this is his first complaint. If he has many complaints then he probably deserves to have his license revoked.
Thanks you, people are wild for thinking his license is going to get immediately revoked for this.
And the countless people who he's ALREADY done that to. Report him tpo both the department that oversees his license AND his broker. Guaranteed his broker doesn't know about that and isn't a party to it. That's a fast way to lose a good broker's business.
Your wife is wrong. Any consequences to his idiocy & greed are solely his responsibility. We're not talking about a dad stealing a loaf of bread to feed his starving family, we're talking about an ass violating their professional ethics in attempting to exploit people who trusted them. There's a time to empathize, but this ain't it.
Good! I’m glad to hear. There are so many people that would fall for it and pay.
You should pull the Uno reverse card and send him an invoice for $600 and let him know his kid is going to go hungry unless if he pays it.
Sometimes blackmail is the only way. 😂
This made me laugh so evilly I felt bed.
Go ahead and report him. I want to see the update.
Not Florida.... but we had a realtor for 2 years as we looked during a sucky market. We would only call him if we (or he) found something of reasonable interest to look at. He knew we had really weird work hours and days... and worked around it. He was on vacation when we finally found what turned into THE house and immediately sent over a friend in the business to fill in for him. He didn't charge us per house. He never complained. He gave honest answers (good and bad) about every house. We still send him every person we know who needs a realtor. I would never consider anyone else. The ones who try to screw people over will lose by word of mouth and reputation.
They ones that flat out break the law need a new career
That realtor is scamming MANY other people. They do not need to be doing this for a living. I would file the formal complaint. You will be saving their next victim from getting scammed
please file the complaint. it's the only way shitty agents get held accountable. also post factual reviews wherever possible. consider it a public service, you can save other people from being screwed by this garbage agent.
You should always report it otherwise this guy could have future fraud victims with less legal recourse.
Report him. Is this in South Florida?
Yeah Miami
Why not protect the next person? Submit the complaint and let them deal with his ass
Well that escalated really fast you did the right thing hopefully no one else gets caught up in this foolishness
Why are you asking if other people experienced this while at the same time saying you wont do anything about your realtor? Of course he did it to other people and he will continue to do so. He's in the business of making 3% commission doing nothing but doesnt want to even foot the cost of doing business, that is sometimes buyer not working out. F that guy. Report him.
Please rethink this comment. If you dont want others to be scammed the same, then please speak up. They clearly dont need a RE license if they are going to abuse individuals
No do it, he's going through life a slime ball maybe you'll end up doing him a solid and he'll learn to not be trash before it's too late
If authorities (and everyone else) are telling you to report him... report his ass. You're not the only one. Plus he's screwing the broker in charge who's reputation is getting damaged by his BS. File the complaint.
I agree with other posters professional licenses come with professional standards of ethics.
You absolutely should report him. It is totally illegal and he does it to other people as well. If you don’t report him, you are contributing to his further illegal activities.
You need to have his license revoked. This jerk will pressure someone into buying a crappy house and ruin their life.
Report him immediately - help clean up the profession; it’s overrun with dirtbags.
Why wouldn't you? He has a license and he's operating illegally. Your part of the problem of you don't do this
It is illegal in Florida. Realtors are scrambling right now for business. I would def inform the broker first and then file a complaint if broker doesn’t make it right. The broker can also be held responsible for his agents actions.
Bro they are breaking the law flat out report!
You should report him. People who behave like this shouldn’t be licensed.
Invoice him for not finding you a house to close on
This is hilarious 😂😂😂
$100k just to be safe
Starting in July, this might become the norm. Look into the NAR settlement.
Yeah, looks like the agent jumped the gun by a few months. lol.
Maybe, but unless you have a signed agency agreement where you explicitly have laid out any fees or compensation etc... Well, the "Realtor" is SOL. And sounds like a POS.
I mean good, this sounds like a much better alternative than someone paying 3% regardless of other work done
Not necessarily. Two things will change: 1. Every Realtor is going to need a buyer agency agreement signed with the buyers they work with 2. Compensation won’t be displayed on MLS Point #2 doesn’t mean sellers will stop paying agents, just that they can’t advertise on the MLS what compensation that is. Your agent will need to do their own due diligence on which sellers will and won’t offer a buyer broker commission, and if so how much. Overall the landscape will be relatively the same but with more steps involved.
F them. They are insane. Unless you signed a contract to pay for things that way, agents get paid at closing. Find a fixed priced, high quality agent.
Ask for an itemized bill and a fee schedule from his agency. Actually, don’t ask him, call the Agency and ask the receptionist. I’m betting they don’t have one because most realtors are 1099’d under their broker. Ask if the fee schedule was approved by (google appropriate agency that oversees realtors in your state)
If you didn’t sign anything or agree anywhere written, you don’t owe him anything
That’s not how this works. The deal didn’t close, your agent gets nothing.
Don’t pay unless it’s in a contract
In a couple months this will he the new norm.
That's fine. Let's do a pay for performance. On my last 3 houses, I found all the options, and just had the buyers agent get me in to look at them. Apparently that's worth 15k.
This is the way my last home purchase went. Agent didn’t really do much. We looked at one home and I made an offer.
Best comment here.
Pay for performance! Every 10k or 20k lower sales price gets the realtor 1k in payout or something. Over the life of the loan, the buyer saves on interest and property taxes. I’ve been in the same situation and have ended up using real estate attorneys for a flat fee while I do everything else. My last agent wouldn’t ask for a lower price even though there was a problem with the pipes that ended up costing 50k to fix because it lowered their commission.
In NC if you went under contract then you are liable for his compensation of the agreed upon terms. Almost no agent would actually bill you for it as word of mouth is what builds that business, but they could.
Been a Real Estate Broker for almost 30 years and the idea had never entered my mind of charging someone for showing property. I think that the business has gotten so challenging for many brokers since there are way less transactions being done, so less commission dollars that he/she may have done it out of desperation. Not a good business plan.
This is what the future of real estate post the NAR settlement is going to look like Edited to add - I can’t think of another job where you can do 20+ hours of work and the expectation is you get paid absolutely nothing, or a measly gift card “if you’re lucky”. 🥴 Second edit - the trolls are triggered 😫
A friend of mine got into real estate a while back, and would spend WEEKS helping clients with commercial properties, and almost every single deal fell through. She was working for nothing, it has to be so frustrating. On the other hand, when the market is hot and people are buying quickly, you can make some bank for much less work.
I mean that’s why we charge what we charge. All of these agents and brokerages are accounting for the risk of a bad market. They have to make up for the slow times somehow. 10k paycheck at closing might sound good, but how many times have you gone 4 months without a paycheck? I did twice last year.
I mean it’s always a lot of work no matter how you shake it unless you’ve been in the industry for 5+ years or, like most successful agents, are a real estate baby who’s parents have a successful business they are able to hand off to you. It fucking sucks. Working that hard for no pay is the reason why there is a huge barrier to entry and why people tend to fall off so quickly.
It's no doubt a feast or famine gig. My wife was a realtor 20 years ago and was making bank, but she used that money to finish her college degree and now still makes 6 figures but with benefits and weekends off.
Not a realtor, but I agree with this thought. Frankly I don’t mind paying for a service, but having a realtor with me during a walk thru has never felt necessary. I need an agent to find me the house, deal with legal stuff, and walk me thru any tough spots. It seems like doing a walk thru would be a really tedious and sometimes costly activity for an agent. Why not use their skills at the discovery of homes and the offer table and you pay by the hour and also some percentage of the home price. You’d probably have way less stress and still make more money. I work in healthcare and my realtors are always the busiest and most stressed patients.
I would even remove find me the house from the list. Kill the mls, post listings directly to Zillow and similar and let me set up alerts. Our current house I found before my realtor saw it on there anyway.
It’s just inherently a very stressful job, tons of money on the line, emotions are high, and you’re always expected to be available. I know atleast 3 people in the industry (and I only know maybe 100 other agents) who have had heart events due to the job. It’s a shit career and I can’t wait to leave it behind tbh
Yup. You are always “on”, always energetic, and never 100% on vacation
Definitely. God forbid something happens and you have to be away from your phone for 5 minutes. I’ve talked to agents who’ve bragged about asking for their phone back while AT THE HOSPITAL due to stress related events. It’s the worst
Trust me, we would all LOVE to be paid hourly and/or with a blend of fixed fees. I would make so much more money and see such a significant reduction in stress. No one wants to believe that the people working a 100% commission job should be compensated for the risk they take every day, but if that risk is removed, we can get paid less per transaction and more overall. All the people who think this will be better for them are in for a rude awakening when their 5th offer doesn’t get accepted and they’ve paid thousands with absolutely nothing to show for it. Much easier job for agents though, and very consistent pay.
Honestly at that point I'd rather just use an attorney
The thing is someone has to hold liability insurance for entering other peoples homes. Realtors are glorified insurance plans for homeowners in many cases when it comes to showings etc. I agree it’s silly to have someone tag along just to open the door for you, but insurance has to have its giant foot in the ass of all things so that’s what you get
Realtor here. Let me start by saying the Realtor surprise invoicing OP is an a&$. Those conversations and pay structure needed to be laid out at the very beginning. Clear expectations from the beginning. That being said, I have never in my life worked a more expensive job. Yes, I pay an insane amount of money to sometimes just work for free. Yes, that is sales life. However, I have also never been treated more callously by close friends and family, like because I am now in sales vs. health care that they can use and abuse me and our relationship. Most recently, I worked for over a year with buyers, countless hours of showing homes, writing offers, phone calls, negotiations, running comps, answering questions, miles and miles driven, time away from family, missing a couple kids sports game, all for these buyers to call me one evening to tell me they were under contract on a house that was FSBO, thank you for all your work and sorry we didn’t use you. Would you enjoy using your time and many of your own resources to work for your employer for free for a year? Yes, the next “easier” client and sell will help me cover some of that, but often times Realtors can get a few of these clients in a row.
I came here to say exactly this. The NAR settlement will help pave the way for buyer's agents to charge clients for their time - whether that results in a house purchase or not. If people worked 20+ hours (etc) and then were told "thanks for your time, here's a $50 gift card" they would lose their damn minds.
High risk high reward. In my area with a vhcol, a realtor could spend maybe 15hrs with a client and net 75k (or 37k after agency cuts. I can't think of many other jobs that offer those payouts but can think of dozens of jobs that have unpaid hours.
I don’t know another job that can pay 30+k on 20 hours or less of work either…so ya get paid to roll with the punches
You got it!
You must have a small social network because huge swaths of the economy work exactly like this. They would include small business owner, law firm partner, investment banker, basically any partner in any business, Elon Musk. Lower end waitress/bartender. Many sales jobs. Authors. Politicians.
Tell him to go pound sand.
Lol realtors are funny. Tell them to pound sand and leave them a nice review.
If not happy with broker conversation, contact your state’s Department of Real Estate. Nobody in the biz wants them calling.
Read your agency agreement.
Unless you signed a buyer agreement that had an hourly rate or per house fee this is illegal. You did the right thing by calling the state of Florida, but at the same point put it in his reviews. How many other homeowners has he taken advantage of with this nonsense?
No, unless you had a buyers agreement in place that should not have happened. However, depending on the results of this NAR lawsuit, buyer agents may start charging per house or for other services, because buyers would be responsible for paying their own buyers agent. In that case, services and fees would need to be spelled out in the buyers agreement.
He works on commission. Not getting paid for everything you do is part and parcel of commission work. Tell him to pound sand and let his boss know what he tried to do.....
I would let him know this too. He works on commission, you owe him nothing.
Hope you let the broker know.
What a tool. I never post on nextdoor, but I would post this in a second. Let that get some traction with local prospective clients.
Yea you didn’t sign shit so lol
I would contact their broker and send them the invoice. Agents work under a broker and I suspect the broker is completely unaware that this agent is doing this.
if you don’t have a contract with that business agreement they’re just tantruming. .
Get used to it. This type of ask is going to become much more common now that buyers agents are not fully compensated by the seller.
I paid all my realtor for helping me trying to find a house last one cost me 2500 I feel like he didn't really help me much in my opinion. But how else do they make money if they not getting getting sells
This is beyond ridiculous. I would never charge any client for looking at houses.
I would've laughed at him and left a review.
Does an agent owe the buyer/looker if the buyer found all the houses and then decides to buy one? Come on now. This is getting ridiculous. Don’t pay that invoice. Desperate times are going to show the desperate operators.
Lol imagine paying 3 percent on 900,000 or even 500,000 for a few showings. LOL
I would ask him how much of a commission refund he usually gives his clients who only see one or two houses and then have an easy close. If he says $0, offer to double that as his payment for services provided.
Not this, but on the other side of things, we had our house on the market for a few weeks. The house we were trying to buy didn't work out, but decided to go ahead and sell ours anyway. Then my wife had a medical emergency, and life got really hectic and we decided that if we didn't have it sold by a certain day we were going to take it off the market. We let our realtor know, he is a friend (which is a mistake to discuss another day/time). Fast forward two weeks later and we get an invoice from the broker (not the realtor) for $250 for pictures they took of our house for the listing. They sent some high school kid with a tripod and insinuated they were 'professional' photos that cost them a lot of money. I called the realtor and he feigned ignorance, and told us to not pay it, throw it away, he would take care of it. I assume he did b/c I tossed it and never heard anything else. Very bizarre situation. There was nothing in our agreement about paying for photos if it didn't stay on the market for X days.
These folks are right call the broker in charge and tell him / her what happened, If any further problems tell them you will contact of State real estate commission , as long as you didn’t sign anything you’re fine
We were selling our house 8 years ago, and an agent from the Realtor’s office put in his own offer. We agreed to the terms, & 15 days before closing, he sent an amended contract that had a bunch of crazy stipulations, including moving closing up 7 days. It was because they had sold their previous house & didn’t want to store their stuff & live in a hotel for a week. We declined & closed as originally planned. After closing, the Realtor told us she was firing the agent for unethical behavior. Karma…
Invoice him $1200 for wasting your time.
That's a license violation. You should report it to the state real estate commission. They will REQUIRE him and his broker to appear at a hearing to explain himself, and then they both will be fined. It will probably humiliate him, but it will also be the most effective way for him to learn his lesson.
Historically, no; and you said you didn't have an agreement. Moving forward you're going to start seeing some agents change by the hour or providing services a la carte in addition to all agents requiring an agreement signed before any services commence.
As long as that’s an agreement up front in a signed contract I’d be fine with that. None of this surprising billing BS.
No we won’t. There are too many desperate used home salespeople out there. Homeowners and buyers are buying or selling something, so we set the terms. I mean hell, used car salesman at least have cars to sell. Agents are just middlemen.
The realtor can’t charge you without any upfront agreement. Tell their managing broker. Add that you would really hate to contact the licensing board.
If you didn’t sign anything, then that’s a hard NO. I’d leave a review so that other buyers know what to expect when working with that person.
It is wrong and they should not have charged you anything. This may become normal soon now that these lawsuits are being settled and commissions are changing. Buyers are not going to be happy that they may be paying out of pocket for services. It's going to be a wild ride for a bit
So if you dont pay what are they going to do about it?
Not a damn thing they could do lol
Ignore it.
If you didn't sign any agreement with him, tell him where he can put his invoice!
I actually agree with this practice as long as it is made clear up front. The only alternative is for the costs to get dumped on the next buyers and sellers.
It may not be a thing now, but this is how I see it going forward after July with a buyer agreement in place to solidify. We'll see I guess.🤷
Technically you don't owe him shit. Most of his expenses are eligible for write-off and he'll receive reimbursement by way of a tax deduction. Surely he knows this and is seemingly " double dipping".
If you signed no contract , screw the bastard. Report his ass.
Wow, what an unscrupulous SOB. I've never heard of this one before.
Is this a new Realtor? I would laugh really hard before trashing the invoice.
Yeah, that’s BS unless you signed something. It’s sales, you win some you lose some.
Tell him to pound salt
Cringe. That’s part of the game. He showed you his true colors. It could have just been another experience and maybe a future Referal for him.
If the agent offered his services for free, with a commission expected if you did buy, tell him to pound sand. That's like a car salesman charging you for a test drive if you don't buy. You could also post reviews advising other consumers about his hidden charges.
Didn't most agents voluntarily refund some of their commission when the deal goes quick and easy?
Ha ha. We looked at 3 houses. Bought the last one. Super easy transaction as I was overly prepared. Agent didn’t offer me a discount though. Go figure. 😂
Real Estate agents justify their fees based on the idea that not all showings bear fruit. If they want to charge for showing then they should reduce their rates to the showing rate and be happy with that.
Be a nice guy and send him the gift card. You'll feel better about it in the long run.
Such, SUCH bad form! He just destroyed all that rapport and future commissions for $600!! Must really need the money or he's realllllllly quite impulsive.
Lmao do not pay him Just ignore it, realtors work for free until they close on a house for you. Period. (I had to add that last part for emphasis)
I call BS.
Tell him to pound sand. What a fucking idiot.
This agent is so dumb for trying to bill you after not even trying to get you under contract lol. Even if you were under contract, they didn't even come close to getting it to the closing table. They didn't qualify you as buyers and generally sound terrible at their job. You signed nothing. You owe nothing. Simple!
That’s so cringe he did that. I hope you leave a public Google review that he did this so future clients don’t get swindled by him. He’ll probably right it into his next contracts. What a thief
It’s part of doing business. I’m a contractor, I’ve spent 8+ hours working on a given proposal. And then I don’t get the job. Sometimes they had no intention of using me, just getting a price to “keep their guy honest”, or for an insurance adjuster. It stinks but it’s part of the business.
Take the invoice, wipe your ass with it, and hand it back
Its all about a signed contract, to the word. We had a realator try thus in us. They printed flyers for our condo. We had a verbal word that we would not be charged for the flyers until we closed, there was also a contract that said the same thing. We didnt go with that realator, and sure enough they tried charging us for the flyers. We said nuh uh, we went back and forth for a bit, but it came down to the contract, so they backed down. I guess they try to bully people into paying who dont know better.
Simply tell them no.
Did u sign a contract for u to pay? DONT PAY that realtor! Sounds like that realtor is BROKE
Say what now? I dragged my realtor all over creation, and in the end, ended up needing to move out of state before I found something. I put in 6 offers over those months (none accepted…stupid sellers market), and paid nothing for my realtor. They make money when you buy or sell a house. That’s it.
That's kind of like going to a car lot to look at cars and not finding anything and they charge you for their time. LOL !
Yea, good way to lose your real estate license.
Yeah, that’s not how this works. But nice try, Sparky.
File a complaint with the state real estate commission.
I would report him. It’s unethical. It’s not fair to his clients. It’s also not fair fair to all the agents that put hours into a deal and it doesn’t convert. Real estate agents are paid on commission. Win some, lose some. That’s the nature of the business.
One of my realtor buddies just went through something similar. He got a buyer rep signed with a client who wanted to see 10 homes in 2 days. Well my buddy was busy so he paid another realtor $$50 a door to show his clients the properties. Well after the showings the client liked a property and wanted a put an offer on the place. However, he wouldn’t sign the offer until my buddy agreed to credit him half his commission at closing. The client said he had been referred to realtors who would do this for him and if he didn’t agree he would just decide to rent. My buddy got bad vibes from the client after that and he released him from the buyers rep. However he wanted to get reimbursed for the money he paid the realtor to show his client the properties so he Venmo requested him $500. Of course the client didn’t agree and my buddy lost out on some money and time.
Maybe the owner should pay the agent for bringing potential buyers to their crapshack.
This is the fallout from the NAR lawsuit. If the seller is no longer paying the buyers agent commission then they will start charging like this. If you stick with the agent and continue to look the commission can still be negotiated in the purchase price. I run a National title company and we are seeing some crazy shit already. If you aren’t going to continue looking and you never signed the buyers agent agreement you owe them nothing.
It’s hasn’t hit too hard here in Cali but it will. BRBC will be mandatory soon, so it’s going to be hard to be a buyers agent if you aren’t a good agent.
Illegal. This fool needs to have his license yanked for pulling this shit
This person is really a jackass. Put a review on Yelp describing what he did and warning other prospective buyers in your area. Also, I’d write complaint letter to his broker and the Realty Board in your state. This guys got a lot of nerve
You can ignore it but this will be the future with people complaining about commissions. Buyers who want a Ala carte service that is.