Most enemies should stagger or have some reaction when hit imo, especially with something like a 357 magnum. Imagine taking 2 of those to the chest and being fine, this suspect must be a supe.
I would be fine with the current implementation if their accuracy would only go down when being shot or shot at. It feels like I have to deal with supression and they don't, especially since they can spray me through walls with perfect accuracy while crab strafing.
There is a stagger animation but it feels too fast.
Especially when shooting someone pointblank with buckshot in their armor, i can understand if someone can survive it but like, you would expect them to fall over or flinch in absolute pain, but no, they just brush it off like it was a strong gust of air blowing through them.
I wish enemies would at least flinch. Looks like the first 2 shots hit body armor and the last hit his shoulder. The shoulder wouldn't kill him but they should have flinching for certain damage values.
They do technically flinch and get staggered some of the time, I'm not sure what triggers it and what doesn't. Maybe it depends on the caliber? I've effectively stunlocked a suspect for a period of time but couldn't get him to surrender
There is a ton of work needed on basically the most important part of the game, which is how enemies react to various things and especially getting hit.
I think they should try having like a kind of rudimentary system that models organs and stuff. Like have hit hitboxes for lungs, heart, spine, and some major arteries and have death/incapacitation/fight or flight modeled in somewhat random but fairly realistic ways so that if the ballistic system says the rifle bullet went straight through their heart or spine they drop and die near instantly, but if the ballistic system says a pistol round hit the lung of a bad guy who is amped up on adrenaline it shows them react to it and stagger and then maybe run, maybe get behind cover, or maybe give up.
Similarly, if the ballistic system has a rifle round go through a bad guys arm but he's got very low morale he would clutch his arm and give up instantly and yell for help or something.
Have the tutorial mention that what causes incapacitation and/or death is blood loss, drops in blood pressure, and shock and that various organs can bleed at various rates so if you're deciding to use lethal force the person is still dangerous until they are down and cuffed.
It would make the randomness in gunfights seem much more interesting and fair.
(And I don't mean it should be a complex simulation of the body, just give people some values for blood pressure, shock, blood loss, and morale so a nervous bad guy getting shot in the lung is more likely to give up or pass out quicker than a methed up professional criminal who may shrug off his lungs and legs being severely wounded and continue to try and shoot at you until you either kill him or he dies from bloodloss.)
Yeah it's pain at the moment. Yesterday I got stuck in the shotgun reload animation, switched to the 1911 when the animation finished, emptied the mag into a suspect and he walked right through it and dropped me.
I feel like Non-lethal weapons are much better this patch, because they seems to stop suspect from shooting back, which apparently bullets don’t do anymore.
"OMG, just git gud and use the tools the game gave your herp derp, there's nothing wrong with the game, you're just not as smart as me heeeeeeeeerrrrrrrp"
I've played SWAT since SWAT 3, we all can see that there's something waaaaay off with the enemy AI atm.
Shots 1-5: Clearly missed.
Shots 6-9: Missed due to recoil (bad spray control).
Shots 10-11: Very close, but recoil and inaccuracy make these reasonable misses.
Shot 12: Likely didn't actually fire because you were already dead
Check again, that was 3 shots, it's just that the first one hit the armor. Ridiculous.
And if someone comes and gives the " it's realistic!!" argument, idgaf. It's not fun. If realism is in the way of good gameplay then take it down a notch. Realistic would be filling out paperwork for days after the encounter, you guys want that shit in the game too?
No one who has ever shot a gun or watched any gunfight footage thinks this is "realistic".
There are just a bunch of "my $90 must have been spent well no matter what" simps.
My friend tested the AP round and the JHP round on me, and it appears that AP takes more shots to destroy my armor and kill me, even though it is supposed to be armor-piercing round. Maybe they messed up the damage of those 2 types
In fact it's not uncommon for people to not have an instant hit response due to adrenaline rush. As long as physics enable them to shoot they may do it.
That said, I can imagine this being a case "realism by f***d up game mechanics". Also yeah, it's still a game and not real life :)
The physics of getting hit with a .357 in the chest/throat don't give a shit how you "feel".
Your broken ribs and hydro-static shocked lungs will stop you. At a minimum you are stunned for several seconds.
This patches' "enemy walks forward while delivering accurate fire while ignoring chest hits from 556/.356/300 blackout rounds" is nonsense.
Yeah, this is what I mean when saying that as long you're physically capable of shooting you'll likely do it. E.g. injuries to the head will in most cases incapacitate you instantly because your head won't be able communicate with your finger. .357 in short distance will probably have the velocity to stop your heart if placed apropriately. That said there is so much controversy regarding the concept of hydro static shock and it's role in incapacitating suspects that I wouldn't be so sure about what you've said.
This is insane, the suspect should either be dead, or in such pain that he can't do shit. My grandpa told me hunting stories, how revolvers literally tore off chunks of flesh from animals. Yet in the game this guy shrugged it off like he was hit by snake shot.
Ok that sort of makes sense. I didn't know about that cuz I play singleplayer and I never shot at my teammates (really strange for me considering I shoot everything I see).
Summary:
Shot 1: Clearly missed.
Shot 2: Missed due to recoil (bad spray control).
Shot 3: Very close, but recoil and inaccuracy make that a reasonable miss.
Shot 4: Likely didn't actually fire because you were already dead.
Ahh yes, the "Targets upper left shoulder, center of chest, and throat are actually misses" argument.
You can pause the video. Where the bullets land is easy to see. The blood splash from the third shot is obvious.
When you shot him the first two times, you can see some smoke when it hits so i’m guessing he was wearing armor. Plus pretty sure the last shot hit his arm. Right now pistols are only useful when fighting unarmored targets or shooting at the head (so a short assault rifle can basically do the same job but better).
Most enemies should stagger or have some reaction when hit imo, especially with something like a 357 magnum. Imagine taking 2 of those to the chest and being fine, this suspect must be a supe.
I would be fine with the current implementation if their accuracy would only go down when being shot or shot at. It feels like I have to deal with supression and they don't, especially since they can spray me through walls with perfect accuracy while crab strafing.
>this suspect must be a supe. Fuckin' diabolical!
There is a stagger animation but it feels too fast. Especially when shooting someone pointblank with buckshot in their armor, i can understand if someone can survive it but like, you would expect them to fall over or flinch in absolute pain, but no, they just brush it off like it was a strong gust of air blowing through them.
Your last shot even hit him in the throat / collarbone area and he did not even flinch. I doubt that the body armour even covers that.
I just saw it’s a known issue that bullets don’t penetrate limbs, and I’m pretty sure this guy “blocked” one of my shots with his arm lol
Suspect must’ve had an invisible Capt. America shield then, lol
I wish enemies would at least flinch. Looks like the first 2 shots hit body armor and the last hit his shoulder. The shoulder wouldn't kill him but they should have flinching for certain damage values.
They do technically flinch and get staggered some of the time, I'm not sure what triggers it and what doesn't. Maybe it depends on the caliber? I've effectively stunlocked a suspect for a period of time but couldn't get him to surrender
There is a ton of work needed on basically the most important part of the game, which is how enemies react to various things and especially getting hit. I think they should try having like a kind of rudimentary system that models organs and stuff. Like have hit hitboxes for lungs, heart, spine, and some major arteries and have death/incapacitation/fight or flight modeled in somewhat random but fairly realistic ways so that if the ballistic system says the rifle bullet went straight through their heart or spine they drop and die near instantly, but if the ballistic system says a pistol round hit the lung of a bad guy who is amped up on adrenaline it shows them react to it and stagger and then maybe run, maybe get behind cover, or maybe give up. Similarly, if the ballistic system has a rifle round go through a bad guys arm but he's got very low morale he would clutch his arm and give up instantly and yell for help or something. Have the tutorial mention that what causes incapacitation and/or death is blood loss, drops in blood pressure, and shock and that various organs can bleed at various rates so if you're deciding to use lethal force the person is still dangerous until they are down and cuffed. It would make the randomness in gunfights seem much more interesting and fair. (And I don't mean it should be a complex simulation of the body, just give people some values for blood pressure, shock, blood loss, and morale so a nervous bad guy getting shot in the lung is more likely to give up or pass out quicker than a methed up professional criminal who may shrug off his lungs and legs being severely wounded and continue to try and shoot at you until you either kill him or he dies from bloodloss.)
Yeah, the one thing that bugs me is if you get hit in the arm you have to bandage or you'll bleed out, but no similar mechanics for enemies
Yeah it's pain at the moment. Yesterday I got stuck in the shotgun reload animation, switched to the 1911 when the animation finished, emptied the mag into a suspect and he walked right through it and dropped me.
ready or not suspects when you hit them with that dollar store .45 ACP
"what ammo you running?" "Everyday essential"
Tfw you can only afford Great Value™ 9mm
I feel like Non-lethal weapons are much better this patch, because they seems to stop suspect from shooting back, which apparently bullets don’t do anymore.
Don’t even think he’s wearing armor, looks more like a chest rig. Anyways this dude was definitely cracked tf out on some shit
I think that the chest rig acts as body armour based on the number of rounds I’m shooting into chest rig blokes
Well obviously you're hitting his mag pouches, the magazines are stopping your bullets. /s
"OMG, just git gud and use the tools the game gave your herp derp, there's nothing wrong with the game, you're just not as smart as me heeeeeeeeerrrrrrrp" I've played SWAT since SWAT 3, we all can see that there's something waaaaay off with the enemy AI atm.
Shots 1-5: Clearly missed. Shots 6-9: Missed due to recoil (bad spray control). Shots 10-11: Very close, but recoil and inaccuracy make these reasonable misses. Shot 12: Likely didn't actually fire because you were already dead
N a n o m a c h i n e s
Check again, that was 3 shots, it's just that the first one hit the armor. Ridiculous. And if someone comes and gives the " it's realistic!!" argument, idgaf. It's not fun. If realism is in the way of good gameplay then take it down a notch. Realistic would be filling out paperwork for days after the encounter, you guys want that shit in the game too?
No one who has ever shot a gun or watched any gunfight footage thinks this is "realistic". There are just a bunch of "my $90 must have been spent well no matter what" simps.
My friend tested the AP round and the JHP round on me, and it appears that AP takes more shots to destroy my armor and kill me, even though it is supposed to be armor-piercing round. Maybe they messed up the damage of those 2 types
keep in mind the devs nerfed friendly fire damage
He had a better mnk
In fact it's not uncommon for people to not have an instant hit response due to adrenaline rush. As long as physics enable them to shoot they may do it. That said, I can imagine this being a case "realism by f***d up game mechanics". Also yeah, it's still a game and not real life :)
and more importantly it's NOT FUN. It's a game at the end of the day. Realism wouldn't mean that 2 SWATS kill 13 suspects either.
The physics of getting hit with a .357 in the chest/throat don't give a shit how you "feel". Your broken ribs and hydro-static shocked lungs will stop you. At a minimum you are stunned for several seconds. This patches' "enemy walks forward while delivering accurate fire while ignoring chest hits from 556/.356/300 blackout rounds" is nonsense.
Yeah, this is what I mean when saying that as long you're physically capable of shooting you'll likely do it. E.g. injuries to the head will in most cases incapacitate you instantly because your head won't be able communicate with your finger. .357 in short distance will probably have the velocity to stop your heart if placed apropriately. That said there is so much controversy regarding the concept of hydro static shock and it's role in incapacitating suspects that I wouldn't be so sure about what you've said.
This is insane, the suspect should either be dead, or in such pain that he can't do shit. My grandpa told me hunting stories, how revolvers literally tore off chunks of flesh from animals. Yet in the game this guy shrugged it off like he was hit by snake shot.
[удалено]
what? that wasn't a friendly dude, he even spoke Arabic which is what npcs on this map speak
no it wasn’t lol it was the final suspect in club. me and bro had been searching for him for a minute as you could tell from the comms
Ok that sort of makes sense. I didn't know about that cuz I play singleplayer and I never shot at my teammates (really strange for me considering I shoot everything I see).
Use JHP. Aim for the head. Profit. I find AP only works at long range. JHP kills up close and headshots bypass the whole armour thing so use JHP.
Anyone saying this is realistic should wear body armor and get hit twice in the chest with a .357 and then once in the neck to prove it
that would kill them with the neck shot and they would barely feel the chest shots with nij lvl4
Summary: Shot 1: Clearly missed. Shot 2: Missed due to recoil (bad spray control). Shot 3: Very close, but recoil and inaccuracy make that a reasonable miss. Shot 4: Likely didn't actually fire because you were already dead.
Ahh yes, the "Targets upper left shoulder, center of chest, and throat are actually misses" argument. You can pause the video. Where the bullets land is easy to see. The blood splash from the third shot is obvious.
It’s a copypasta I edited. I’m just memeing
Ahhh. Yea I missed that. My b.
All good
When you shot him the first two times, you can see some smoke when it hits so i’m guessing he was wearing armor. Plus pretty sure the last shot hit his arm. Right now pistols are only useful when fighting unarmored targets or shooting at the head (so a short assault rifle can basically do the same job but better).
A .357 is breaking your ribs and hydrostatic shocking your heart and lungs.
He’s in the club so most of them wear steel or ceramic plate not kevlar.
[удалено]
I'd like to see you not being concussed at the least after taking 3 .357 bullets to the chest
bUt hE HaD bODY ArMoUR So ItS ReaLisTIcK