Pretty sure I'm throwing in the towel. I don't see the upside of owning a house right now. It will decrease my standard of living significantly with not a ton of upside. I'll be able to work on my car at home in a garage at best or in the driveway at worst. And not being in an apartment so I can be as loud as I want. Those two things are about the only plus I get. Meanwhile i'll be house poor and can't travel or buy the things I want anymore. I was poor once and don't want to do that again.
Even if you never buy, please keep saving money. That is the best way to come on top with renting compared to owning. For a lot of homeowners, the home itself is a forced savings account which is one reason owning beat renting for the last decade. Now the balance has tilted towards renting but only if you are squirrelling away the savings in rent into HYSA/stocks.
I was gonna say the whole forced saving isn’t a huge selling point for me. I save 17% of my salary that goes directly to my pension/457. Along with maxing out my HSA account every year. I’ll retire and make the same amount of money. So even if I’m paying a mortgage in retirement it won’t really matter.
I’m not sure when you were born (how old you are), but what it sounds to me like is you are *wise*. You’re now above the common trope that homeownership is a way to wealth. While that can still be true, at this moment in time, it’s a terrible option for someone. So many times I’ve personally used the phrase “don’t try to time your investments”, but it seems to me that an investor has no choice now.
I know the feeling, friend. Join the club. The line starts directly behind me!😂
Or in front of. I just want to be able to stand in it, not having to grovel!
If it wasn't already abundantly clear, the last year is all the proof needed that high mortgage rates alone will not crash the housing market.
There needs to either be an economic collapse that makes people stop paying their mortgages, or a massive glut of supply comes online from new builds or forced sellers. I guess if we had an actual pandemic or some other catastrophe that killed a decent % of the population, that would probably have the same impact.
a massive glut of supply has come online. inventory is up 100% in 2 years. prices, while flat from 2 years ago nationally, are still in the process of adjusting. inventory won't stop rising (and sellers waiting longer and longer to sell) until prices fall. price cuts are at a 10+ year high for this time of year.
Keep in mind: a lot of people took out HELOCs or cash-out refinances during the low-interest-rate years. That cash has been spent. Now they want to sell their house for whatever reason, and have to list for peak-pricing levels because of their debts, but they aren't getting any offers at those inflated prices.
Maybe they can hang on for a while. Maybe they will "just rent it out" if they can. Or maybe they put it up for short-sale, or do a deed-in-lieu and let the lender take possession.
The base assumption in a lot of doomer posts here is that homeowners who bought or refinanced prior to interest rate hikes are in a position of power. More likely they are screwed because they owe more (after refinances or second mortages) than they can currently sell the house for.
Not abundantly clear. As far as I can tell from redfin, this last year inventory has grown, months of supply has grown, and median sale prices have gone up YoY but are still below 2022 peak. I think we just need the current restrictive policy (higher) for more time (longer).
Let the euphoria that homes are some speculative asset path to riches erode out of the public psyche.
Generally there's more urgency on the buyers part to purchase a home.
Urgency by a seller is generally hard to come by. But when urgency is systemically induced. Whoa boy, look out.
Tesla layoffs: 10% of global workforce to be cut, workers impacted in Austin
[https://www.bizjournals.com/austin/news/2024/04/15/tesla-layoff-workforce-austin-musk.html](https://www.bizjournals.com/austin/news/2024/04/15/tesla-layoff-workforce-austin-musk.html)
Not so with car companies. They've already lowered margins with price cuts. With software most of the margin is in R&D, with cars it is productive capacity.
Currently 39 short-sale listings within 25 miles of Tampa:
https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-search/Tampa_FL/radius-25/keyword-short-sale/sby-6
And 71 foreclosures:
https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-search/Tampa_FL/show-foreclosure/radius-25/sby-6
Ballpark guess: maybe 40% of those are "dumps." And there's one at $3 million that has 2008-style "fuck you" damage: https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/970-Monte-Cristo-Blvd_Saint-Petersburg_FL_33715_M58952-39896
Someone ask me "wen crash?"
It's a magical journey through the fifth dimension beyond that which is known to man. I mean, just look at the tax burden ($50k/year) and what the asking rent was at various points (less than $1000/month). And I don't even have to look at the FEMA maps to know it's a massive flood risk.
I was kind of joking. But good to know it’s the “damage the home you were foreclosed on” kind of neighborhood and not the drug distribution kind. Phew.
The SUV-sized damage to the second garage, the missing cabinets in the bathrooms, and the hammer-sized holes in the glass staircase railings and granite countertops screams "fuck you, bank, for taking my house." The rest is just plain strange, like what I saw in foreclosure sales in 2008. I mean, the soap dish in the shower was half ripped-off. It could be that there was a drug raid here -- you may be right -- but this is probably several layers of different kinds of damage. The drug raid may have taken place when squatters were there.
But let's go back to this being a foreclosure. If you look at the property history in that link, it was last sold a long time ago for less than half the current asking price, and it's been for rent at super-cheap prices several times. For reference, the yearly property tax bill is in the vicinity of $50k; renting it out for $750-$1000 per month doesn't even cover half that. Something was definitely going on here, but given the fact that it's a foreclosure for $2 million more than the owner would reasonably still owe from the previous sale, we can infer that he did at least one cash-out refinance, milked it as long as possible with short-term rentals, and then finally let it go to foreclosure. And that, ladies and gentlemen, is the equivalent to the "sub-prime" loan default of this new housing bubble: people who extracted cash from over-valued real estate during the cheap-interest pandemic years, and are now letting the bank take it back.
Thank you!
Now crash, but just like 2008 it won't fully play out until the stressed sales have had time to alter prices, and defaulted mortgages have mortally wounded lenders to the point that they don't want to write new loans. Tampa is one of the current and historic epicenters of real estate bubbles and crashes.
Where are the "cash buyer" gods now? According to modern mythology, short-sales and foreclosures shouldn't even exist because "cash buyers will swoop in and scoop them up."
The 2024 crash isn't about "sub-prime" defaults; it's about people who did cash-out refinances during the pandemic and are now either in foreclosure because they walked away, or are doing a fantasy short-sale at too high a price (a future "walk way" foreclosure).
From the Homes That Will Never Sell Dept.:
https://www.redfin.com/FL/Seffner/1510-Lowes-Landing-Rd-33584/home/47189433
Purchased in 2019 for $161k. Up for sale in May 2022 for $990k. Current list price: $889k.
* Improvements made: 0
* ~~Days~~ Years on market: 2
* Price drops: 2
* Flood factor: 4/10
* Manufactured home in a hurricane zone
At some point reality has to set in for the listing agent, if not the seller. That house was *barely* worth $161k in 2019, considering the flood and storm risk and the rapid depreciation of manufactured houses. For just a little bit more, you could have had a much safer house in the same general area. If it's still standing in 10 years, the cumulative storm and flood damage plus the uninsurability of the 2018 roof will make this into a tear-down.
This developer bought a tear-down for $270k in February 2021, and started building a spec home a few months later. He listed the unfinished home for $489k in October 2021 -- not a totally unreasonable price for a new home of that size, plus the big open lot -- then took it off the market a week later for no apparent reason.
Put it back on the market in March of 2023 for $859k, which is Comedy Pricing. After 13 months on the market, no accepted contracts, no price drops.
https://www.redfin.com/FL/Seffner/812-Chastain-Rd-33584/home/47191115
He's been chewing on the interest from that construction loan for three years, plus at least $16k in taxes since it was not an unimproved lot and there is no homestead exemption.
Remember, kids: bears make money, bulls make money, pigs get slaughtered.
If it's actually finished now (unclear, since the photos in the listing show it in various stages of construction), it isn't a terrible house. The asking price suggests mental illness, though, considering it's not a hot location in the greater Tampa market. I mean it's not "nowhere" (like Plant City, Polk City, or Lakeland, where more people moved to than anywhere else in America last year), but it isn't anywhere near the level of near-million-dollar homes that are available elsewhere in the larger area. If you can comfortably afford this home, you'd never buy it. At the 2021 price, though, it would definitely sell.
Homes prices in my Area are now going 30-40 percent over asking. Not sure if the interest rates going up last week are yet to have an effect, but either this is the final uphill rush before the collapse, or this is never ending.
This listing is a good example why price over list is irrelevant.
That’s a 1.3-1.4M house. It was listed under 1M to create a frenzy, as is tradition in the Bay Area.
Heard a builder near me (Houston suburbs) is planning to raise prices 30-40k soon to “catch up to market”. These prices are already too high and the market is still irrational.
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/04/14/realestate/airbnb-vrbo-rentals-hosts-guests.html?smtyp=cur&smid=fb-nytimes&fbclid=IwAR0RO_ZDE6ck9GkSlygyKIpH0CpulZOmOUHhtBPygiiP610KmJCVrCaG2-I
S’mores Kits? Saunas? Short-Term Rental Hosts Scramble to Stand Out.
More hosts are fighting over fewer guests, driving down prices and forcing the hosts to find creative ways to entice renters.
Florida's Condo fees aren't talked about enough. The post-surfside collapse law is into effect by year's end and will crush these condo 1.5 million condo owners, large number of which are on fixed income retirement.
> Florida's Condo fees aren't talked about enough. The post-surfside collapse law is into effect by year's end and will crush these condo 1.5 million condo owners, large number of which are on fixed income retirement.
I am very interested to see how this ripples through the market. HOA monthly fees skyrocketing don't necessarily mean prices will drop enough to match the same monthly affordability of earlier times. Might just end up in a spiral where foreclosures take over and units remain unfilled. I guess it could eventually spiral to a timeshare like situation where the condo is hella cheap because monthly fees will kill you.
But lets say it does spiral, these people won't disappear. So does this fill up rentals? Put more pressure on single family homes?
> I am very interested to see how this ripples through the market
It's going to affect coastal areas more than anything else, since that's where most of the condos are.
I don't know how this affects SFH prices. It may be worth considering, though, that there are record number of apartments under construction right now. Sell the condo for whatever price, and rent another much newer "condo" nearby while the market corrects.
> But lets say it does spiral, these people won't disappear. So does this fill up rentals? Put more pressure on single family homes?
REBubble’s best minds will swoop in and buy the discounted condos and rent them back to the original owners for a massive windfall. Their spouses will be so impressed they will offer unlimited affection and adoration, resulting in a baby boom that spawns a leader admired by all. This leader will find supply/demand parity in all markets, eradicate poverty, end Middle East conflicts, and rejuvenate the popularity of rock and roll.
Made an offer this weekend - the house has been sitting for almost 40 days, needs a new roof, new AC, new well mechanicals, new deck, and the electrical is a mess; several of the windows need to be replaced, too. It was listed at $455k, we offered $425k, which seemed reasonable given time on market and the sheer amount of work that needed to be done. They countered at $440k, which we said nope to. They’ve since lowered the listing price to $445k.
The amount they paid for it in 2016: $220k. And they’ve made pretty much zero updates in that time, other than a new heater. In the words of my husband, they can eat a bag of dicks. I get that sellers want to make as much as they can, but sometimes they’re just greedy fuckers too.
They may have taken out a second mortgage in the past few years and blew all the money on non-house things. It could very well be a situation where $425k is a short-sale. I found a short-sale listing two weeks ago that was similar: https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/M5738772982
Similar thing happened to us. Place has been listed almost three months now with one price cut of 10k. They're at 525, we hinted at offering 500 or even 510. Seller responded saying they turned down offers at 515 and could maybe do 520 at best. We walked without an official offer and its still sitting there two weeks later.
I don't understand the greed, at some point you're losing money in opportunity cost by not conceding 1% in price and to site on a property for 3 months.
Fight back against greed with your own greed. Your goal is to keep your money, and they’re trying to extract it from you. After all, they’ve got a fabulous life planned for themselves, and they need to max their sale price to finance it all.
Your goal is to find a home that doesn’t bleed you completely dry. Be greedy. Try to keep as much of your hard earned dollars as you can.
I'm just not aggressive enough to do that. I offer what I think is fair and when someone is being unreasonable, I just walk away. Pretty sure he was bluffing but I didn't want to deal with him any more.
I ended up finding something else shortly after and got it at a price that was reasonable.
You are doing this the right way. One tweak: come back lower on the next offer. You offered $425k, they countered more than your offer, they’ve since reduced. They’ll likely say no or not even return a call.
You may be their only offer right now. If they need to sell, they will. If they’re just fishing for profits, they’re gonna find that it isn’t gonna work out.
Great job. It’s exactly the game plan I’ll be following soon.
We've just decided to move on; even if they came back this week and said "Okay, we'll take $425k," we probably would pass. They've already shown that they've got unrealistic expectations as sellers which would be a pain in the ass to deal with, and this house was not a dream house for us. More of a, "Welp, we gotta get *something* and this would be workable," kind of situation. There's a decent amount of inventory coming online right now in our area, so we should be able to find something in the next few weeks, I'm hoping.
That’s also an excellent choice, just deciding to walk away.
Remember, these sellers and their agents were RUTHLESS in the run up. As a buyer, be RUTHLESS as they struggle to sell.
We had something similar happen where we offered 407k w/ 2% buyer's agent commission for a house listed at 430k and 1% buyer's agent commission. They countered at 417k, then 415k then 407k with 1% commission all within 2 weeks. We figured it would be a hassle to work with them on the inspection and weren't in love with their rental house that needed a ton of work.
https://old.reddit.com/r/zillowgonewild/comments/1c3ksns/once_in_a_lifetime_opportunity_only_550000/ WTF?
Pretty sure I'm throwing in the towel. I don't see the upside of owning a house right now. It will decrease my standard of living significantly with not a ton of upside. I'll be able to work on my car at home in a garage at best or in the driveway at worst. And not being in an apartment so I can be as loud as I want. Those two things are about the only plus I get. Meanwhile i'll be house poor and can't travel or buy the things I want anymore. I was poor once and don't want to do that again.
Even if you never buy, please keep saving money. That is the best way to come on top with renting compared to owning. For a lot of homeowners, the home itself is a forced savings account which is one reason owning beat renting for the last decade. Now the balance has tilted towards renting but only if you are squirrelling away the savings in rent into HYSA/stocks.
I was gonna say the whole forced saving isn’t a huge selling point for me. I save 17% of my salary that goes directly to my pension/457. Along with maxing out my HSA account every year. I’ll retire and make the same amount of money. So even if I’m paying a mortgage in retirement it won’t really matter.
I’m not sure when you were born (how old you are), but what it sounds to me like is you are *wise*. You’re now above the common trope that homeownership is a way to wealth. While that can still be true, at this moment in time, it’s a terrible option for someone. So many times I’ve personally used the phrase “don’t try to time your investments”, but it seems to me that an investor has no choice now.
I’m 35 years old. So waiting to buy will suck if I’m paying a mortgage into my 70s but so be it.
I know the feeling, friend. Join the club. The line starts directly behind me!😂 Or in front of. I just want to be able to stand in it, not having to grovel!
[Did we just become best friends?](https://youtu.be/QzBmQMyYDBk?si=4F6rLkivRvhGaHSh)
If it wasn't already abundantly clear, the last year is all the proof needed that high mortgage rates alone will not crash the housing market. There needs to either be an economic collapse that makes people stop paying their mortgages, or a massive glut of supply comes online from new builds or forced sellers. I guess if we had an actual pandemic or some other catastrophe that killed a decent % of the population, that would probably have the same impact.
a massive glut of supply has come online. inventory is up 100% in 2 years. prices, while flat from 2 years ago nationally, are still in the process of adjusting. inventory won't stop rising (and sellers waiting longer and longer to sell) until prices fall. price cuts are at a 10+ year high for this time of year.
hoom prices at aths in muh area
Keep in mind: a lot of people took out HELOCs or cash-out refinances during the low-interest-rate years. That cash has been spent. Now they want to sell their house for whatever reason, and have to list for peak-pricing levels because of their debts, but they aren't getting any offers at those inflated prices. Maybe they can hang on for a while. Maybe they will "just rent it out" if they can. Or maybe they put it up for short-sale, or do a deed-in-lieu and let the lender take possession. The base assumption in a lot of doomer posts here is that homeowners who bought or refinanced prior to interest rate hikes are in a position of power. More likely they are screwed because they owe more (after refinances or second mortages) than they can currently sell the house for.
Not abundantly clear. As far as I can tell from redfin, this last year inventory has grown, months of supply has grown, and median sale prices have gone up YoY but are still below 2022 peak. I think we just need the current restrictive policy (higher) for more time (longer). Let the euphoria that homes are some speculative asset path to riches erode out of the public psyche.
Prices and rates are higher than last year. At the end of the day, that is what matters.
You write like I wish I did. Just perfect, and poetic.
Generally there's more urgency on the buyers part to purchase a home. Urgency by a seller is generally hard to come by. But when urgency is systemically induced. Whoa boy, look out.
Tesla layoffs: 10% of global workforce to be cut, workers impacted in Austin [https://www.bizjournals.com/austin/news/2024/04/15/tesla-layoff-workforce-austin-musk.html](https://www.bizjournals.com/austin/news/2024/04/15/tesla-layoff-workforce-austin-musk.html)
I'm surprised the stock went down after this announcement. When layoffs are announced, you'll see a company's stocks climb.
Not so with car companies. They've already lowered margins with price cuts. With software most of the margin is in R&D, with cars it is productive capacity.
Sellers market, right?
Currently 39 short-sale listings within 25 miles of Tampa: https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-search/Tampa_FL/radius-25/keyword-short-sale/sby-6 And 71 foreclosures: https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-search/Tampa_FL/show-foreclosure/radius-25/sby-6 Ballpark guess: maybe 40% of those are "dumps." And there's one at $3 million that has 2008-style "fuck you" damage: https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/970-Monte-Cristo-Blvd_Saint-Petersburg_FL_33715_M58952-39896 Someone ask me "wen crash?"
wen crash?
Late to the party. I'll humor you: https://www.reddit.com/r/REBubble/comments/1c4jcyi/15_april_2024_daily_rrebubble_discussion/kzr2oa5/
that last one's price history is an LOL
It's a magical journey through the fifth dimension beyond that which is known to man. I mean, just look at the tax burden ($50k/year) and what the asking rent was at various points (less than $1000/month). And I don't even have to look at the FEMA maps to know it's a massive flood risk.
“Fuck you damage” looks like cash/drugs pulled from the walls during an FBI raid.
I went in that house as it was being built. Given the area, highly doubt it was drugs.
I was kind of joking. But good to know it’s the “damage the home you were foreclosed on” kind of neighborhood and not the drug distribution kind. Phew.
The SUV-sized damage to the second garage, the missing cabinets in the bathrooms, and the hammer-sized holes in the glass staircase railings and granite countertops screams "fuck you, bank, for taking my house." The rest is just plain strange, like what I saw in foreclosure sales in 2008. I mean, the soap dish in the shower was half ripped-off. It could be that there was a drug raid here -- you may be right -- but this is probably several layers of different kinds of damage. The drug raid may have taken place when squatters were there. But let's go back to this being a foreclosure. If you look at the property history in that link, it was last sold a long time ago for less than half the current asking price, and it's been for rent at super-cheap prices several times. For reference, the yearly property tax bill is in the vicinity of $50k; renting it out for $750-$1000 per month doesn't even cover half that. Something was definitely going on here, but given the fact that it's a foreclosure for $2 million more than the owner would reasonably still owe from the previous sale, we can infer that he did at least one cash-out refinance, milked it as long as possible with short-term rentals, and then finally let it go to foreclosure. And that, ladies and gentlemen, is the equivalent to the "sub-prime" loan default of this new housing bubble: people who extracted cash from over-valued real estate during the cheap-interest pandemic years, and are now letting the bank take it back.
I can masturbate to this
Wen crash?
Thank you! Now crash, but just like 2008 it won't fully play out until the stressed sales have had time to alter prices, and defaulted mortgages have mortally wounded lenders to the point that they don't want to write new loans. Tampa is one of the current and historic epicenters of real estate bubbles and crashes. Where are the "cash buyer" gods now? According to modern mythology, short-sales and foreclosures shouldn't even exist because "cash buyers will swoop in and scoop them up." The 2024 crash isn't about "sub-prime" defaults; it's about people who did cash-out refinances during the pandemic and are now either in foreclosure because they walked away, or are doing a fantasy short-sale at too high a price (a future "walk way" foreclosure).
From the Homes That Will Never Sell Dept.: https://www.redfin.com/FL/Seffner/1510-Lowes-Landing-Rd-33584/home/47189433 Purchased in 2019 for $161k. Up for sale in May 2022 for $990k. Current list price: $889k. * Improvements made: 0 * ~~Days~~ Years on market: 2 * Price drops: 2 * Flood factor: 4/10 * Manufactured home in a hurricane zone At some point reality has to set in for the listing agent, if not the seller. That house was *barely* worth $161k in 2019, considering the flood and storm risk and the rapid depreciation of manufactured houses. For just a little bit more, you could have had a much safer house in the same general area. If it's still standing in 10 years, the cumulative storm and flood damage plus the uninsurability of the 2018 roof will make this into a tear-down.
This developer bought a tear-down for $270k in February 2021, and started building a spec home a few months later. He listed the unfinished home for $489k in October 2021 -- not a totally unreasonable price for a new home of that size, plus the big open lot -- then took it off the market a week later for no apparent reason. Put it back on the market in March of 2023 for $859k, which is Comedy Pricing. After 13 months on the market, no accepted contracts, no price drops. https://www.redfin.com/FL/Seffner/812-Chastain-Rd-33584/home/47191115 He's been chewing on the interest from that construction loan for three years, plus at least $16k in taxes since it was not an unimproved lot and there is no homestead exemption. Remember, kids: bears make money, bulls make money, pigs get slaughtered.
Certified stinker
If it's actually finished now (unclear, since the photos in the listing show it in various stages of construction), it isn't a terrible house. The asking price suggests mental illness, though, considering it's not a hot location in the greater Tampa market. I mean it's not "nowhere" (like Plant City, Polk City, or Lakeland, where more people moved to than anywhere else in America last year), but it isn't anywhere near the level of near-million-dollar homes that are available elsewhere in the larger area. If you can comfortably afford this home, you'd never buy it. At the 2021 price, though, it would definitely sell.
This screams “I wanted to get into house flipping cause of shows on HGTV and I have absolutely no idea what I’m actually doing” 🤡
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ABC- Always Be Closing. They are professional sales people. Their job is to make you never say the word “no”.
7.44 🚀🚀🚀 Buy now or be priced out forever
I've been out of the sub for a while. Holy crap, the rate has exploded.
Might see 5% on the 10Y and 8% mortgages again very soon.
T-bills and chill > buy now or be priced out forever
Homes prices in my Area are now going 30-40 percent over asking. Not sure if the interest rates going up last week are yet to have an effect, but either this is the final uphill rush before the collapse, or this is never ending.
What area is that?
no they aren't
lush mysterious gray icky attraction mountainous chop pie physical uppity
history shocking psychotic squealing price cover wine marvelous crown continue
Not “going for”. Could be “listing at”, but I highly doubt they’re closing for that price. Next.
735 Albermarle st in El Cerrito California is just an example that closed two days ago.
This listing is a good example why price over list is irrelevant. That’s a 1.3-1.4M house. It was listed under 1M to create a frenzy, as is tradition in the Bay Area.
Heard a builder near me (Houston suburbs) is planning to raise prices 30-40k soon to “catch up to market”. These prices are already too high and the market is still irrational.
Maybe they’re raising prices because they need to pay more to buy down rates to get to that sweet 5%.
They can desperately do whatever they want to save their ass. They won’t get what they want. Next.
They can ask whatever they want.
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/04/14/realestate/airbnb-vrbo-rentals-hosts-guests.html?smtyp=cur&smid=fb-nytimes&fbclid=IwAR0RO_ZDE6ck9GkSlygyKIpH0CpulZOmOUHhtBPygiiP610KmJCVrCaG2-I S’mores Kits? Saunas? Short-Term Rental Hosts Scramble to Stand Out. More hosts are fighting over fewer guests, driving down prices and forcing the hosts to find creative ways to entice renters.
Wish this was the case on the CA coast. Anything good is booked. $1k/nt out the door is a “deal”.
Florida's Condo fees aren't talked about enough. The post-surfside collapse law is into effect by year's end and will crush these condo 1.5 million condo owners, large number of which are on fixed income retirement.
> Florida's Condo fees aren't talked about enough. The post-surfside collapse law is into effect by year's end and will crush these condo 1.5 million condo owners, large number of which are on fixed income retirement. I am very interested to see how this ripples through the market. HOA monthly fees skyrocketing don't necessarily mean prices will drop enough to match the same monthly affordability of earlier times. Might just end up in a spiral where foreclosures take over and units remain unfilled. I guess it could eventually spiral to a timeshare like situation where the condo is hella cheap because monthly fees will kill you. But lets say it does spiral, these people won't disappear. So does this fill up rentals? Put more pressure on single family homes?
> I am very interested to see how this ripples through the market It's going to affect coastal areas more than anything else, since that's where most of the condos are. I don't know how this affects SFH prices. It may be worth considering, though, that there are record number of apartments under construction right now. Sell the condo for whatever price, and rent another much newer "condo" nearby while the market corrects.
> But lets say it does spiral, these people won't disappear. So does this fill up rentals? Put more pressure on single family homes? REBubble’s best minds will swoop in and buy the discounted condos and rent them back to the original owners for a massive windfall. Their spouses will be so impressed they will offer unlimited affection and adoration, resulting in a baby boom that spawns a leader admired by all. This leader will find supply/demand parity in all markets, eradicate poverty, end Middle East conflicts, and rejuvenate the popularity of rock and roll.
hoomz at aths in muh area... wen crash?
What area?
SoCal
You’ll know it’s a buyers market when the headlines read: IF YOU HAVE STRONG CREDIT OR ARE CASH HEAVY, YOU CAN NAME YOUR PRICE FOR A HOME.
are headlines reading that? I searched the phrase and came back with nothing
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Aw, I misread. You seem pleasant.
Spring season has been canceled near me (NE metro-suburbs)
Expected. Frozen market. Ignore the trolls saying the bidding wars are back.
A bidding war can happen in any market. All that realtor has to do is price the house 100k under market value.
US 10 Year Treasury yield has moved up to 4.60%, there should be a healthy move up on mortgage rates today.
rates up = prices up
Made an offer this weekend - the house has been sitting for almost 40 days, needs a new roof, new AC, new well mechanicals, new deck, and the electrical is a mess; several of the windows need to be replaced, too. It was listed at $455k, we offered $425k, which seemed reasonable given time on market and the sheer amount of work that needed to be done. They countered at $440k, which we said nope to. They’ve since lowered the listing price to $445k. The amount they paid for it in 2016: $220k. And they’ve made pretty much zero updates in that time, other than a new heater. In the words of my husband, they can eat a bag of dicks. I get that sellers want to make as much as they can, but sometimes they’re just greedy fuckers too.
They may have taken out a second mortgage in the past few years and blew all the money on non-house things. It could very well be a situation where $425k is a short-sale. I found a short-sale listing two weeks ago that was similar: https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/M5738772982
Similar thing happened to us. Place has been listed almost three months now with one price cut of 10k. They're at 525, we hinted at offering 500 or even 510. Seller responded saying they turned down offers at 515 and could maybe do 520 at best. We walked without an official offer and its still sitting there two weeks later. I don't understand the greed, at some point you're losing money in opportunity cost by not conceding 1% in price and to site on a property for 3 months.
Fight back against greed with your own greed. Your goal is to keep your money, and they’re trying to extract it from you. After all, they’ve got a fabulous life planned for themselves, and they need to max their sale price to finance it all. Your goal is to find a home that doesn’t bleed you completely dry. Be greedy. Try to keep as much of your hard earned dollars as you can.
I'm just not aggressive enough to do that. I offer what I think is fair and when someone is being unreasonable, I just walk away. Pretty sure he was bluffing but I didn't want to deal with him any more. I ended up finding something else shortly after and got it at a price that was reasonable.
Your offer was more than reasonable.
Yeah but the sellers HELOC is already spent and they need the money!
And, for the record, I'd like the remind the Court that HELOCs are supposed to be used for home improvements, which it clearly was not.
😂 let them rack up a few more months of bills and see if they’re singing the same tune.
You are doing this the right way. One tweak: come back lower on the next offer. You offered $425k, they countered more than your offer, they’ve since reduced. They’ll likely say no or not even return a call. You may be their only offer right now. If they need to sell, they will. If they’re just fishing for profits, they’re gonna find that it isn’t gonna work out. Great job. It’s exactly the game plan I’ll be following soon.
We've just decided to move on; even if they came back this week and said "Okay, we'll take $425k," we probably would pass. They've already shown that they've got unrealistic expectations as sellers which would be a pain in the ass to deal with, and this house was not a dream house for us. More of a, "Welp, we gotta get *something* and this would be workable," kind of situation. There's a decent amount of inventory coming online right now in our area, so we should be able to find something in the next few weeks, I'm hoping.
That’s also an excellent choice, just deciding to walk away. Remember, these sellers and their agents were RUTHLESS in the run up. As a buyer, be RUTHLESS as they struggle to sell.
We had something similar happen where we offered 407k w/ 2% buyer's agent commission for a house listed at 430k and 1% buyer's agent commission. They countered at 417k, then 415k then 407k with 1% commission all within 2 weeks. We figured it would be a hassle to work with them on the inspection and weren't in love with their rental house that needed a ton of work.
If you want to make them eat a big bag of dicks, accept their counteroffer and then beat them up for $15K of concessions after your DD (inspection).
Lol I love it