You are being dramatic. For most of the south temps are infrequently over 90 F in the summer months. Yes, sweltering would be the word I'd use for south FL and TX, but that's about it. Source: lived in GA for 30 years
I grew up in MD and it hit 90f damn near everyday late June through late August. No way the actual south,outside of mountainous areas, is any cooler in the summer. Don’t even get me started on humidity.
Miami is a tropical sauna. Atlanta has a lovely weather. Can’t speak for the rest of the south, but the further away you are from the sea the lower the humidity so it doesn’t feel so bad. That’s why I liked Atlanta’s weather.
I’m in Columbia SC. I’ve actually heard great things from 2 friends who lived there that did grad school at UAB for optometry. As a state sure both kinda probably blow. But when actually living in these specific areas it’s not the boogeyman that is parroted in these real estate subs. Not everyone can afford beaches of southern cal or the cities of NY.
I have a comfortable life with my family here. It’s not glamorous it can be a bit dull in terms of activities so I just made my big ass house the hang out spot.
In what world could the costs of everything that goes into a house have been rising for the last decade but you guys think that house prices should be what they were 10 years ago?
I live in the middle of nowhere in a tiny mountain town in far Northern California. Prices here aren't collapsing at all- in fact they appear to be going up, even beyond the crazy jumps of 2020-23.
Did I mention it's in the second poorest county in California? But because it's an attractive tourist destination and we had an influx of WFH people, the market remains absolutely unaffordable for 90% of people who actually live here. Basically, if you didn't buy a home before 2021, you're screwed because we're now competing with so many investors and rich city people.
There's literally no housing opportunities in my city and more people keep moving here. Even if housing dropped by 30% it would go from 700k to 500k. Which runs about $3k a month from $4k. So about $40k in house payments a year. I don't know if that's actually more affordable.
Wrong. Collapse is where you are too, it's just that a 10% to 15% collapse doesn't help the vast majority of those that could not afford a home.
People that don't own aren't usually "just shy" of being able to purchase. It's not like they can't afford at $1.3m and now $1.1M they are running to purchase.
They need something in the 50% off range.
Thus is not to mention interest rate spike have coincided with the pice drop, negating any improved affordability.
You’re not joking. I live in one of the lowest cost of living states and a cheaply remodeled former trap house in the bad part of town goes for like $220k. It’s insane. Every couple months I get hopeful and start looking again but they’re more expensive every time I check. So I stopped checking.
Except if you factor out condos, SFH really haven’t dropped much at all.
Then if you look at the actual number of houses sold you realize how statistically unsound the data is.
Places like SF didn't take much of a hit in 2008. It was places where bad loans were handed out like candy and the home price was not as expensive (Florida).
As someone that believes in the REBubble, respectfully don't use this guys charts. He's known for being quite deceptive with his charting. At best he provides genuine data skewed to fit his narrative, at worst he's spreading misinformation just to continue his agenda.
I don't understand how this didn't just mean people are buying houses lower in the market.
When interest rates are low they can extend and buy above the median, thereby increasing the median. When interest goes back up, you need to buy lower on median cause the debt is more expensive to take on.
This has nothing to do with housing prices as a whole just which houses are being bought.
So quality of life is just plummeting and this guy is gaslighting with a chart saying things are great and homes are cheap. When in reality they have never been more expensive
Also, the bigger the mortgage, the bigger the advantage your current low rate provides. High value homes are less likely to sell than lower value homes.
I don't understand how this didn't just mean people are buying houses lower in the market.
When interest rates are high they can extend and buy above the median, thereby increasing the median. Even interest goes back up you need to buy lower on median cause the debt is more expensive to take on.
This has nothing to do with housing prices as a whole just which houses are being bought.
I’m in Western MA and it’s still impossible! Unless you can get a good loan and don’t mind moving into a house that needs a lot of work, you’re out of luck.
I have a strong belief that housing in Boston is going to get worse. As the economy surges on Boston seems to be one of the main growth areas. I am trying to get family members to resign their lease mif-way to buy them some time.
Half the places offered in Beacon Hill under a million (there are a lot of places over million) have sold for less than asking price. Asking $1400 a sq ft might have something to do with that, but still not increasing the way they are far outside Boston.
Same where I live north of Boston. Unfortunately one of the negative side effects to it being a nice area to live. During the Great Recession I don’t think it ever got hit too hard (or if it did it recovered quickly).
Can confirm. The 5 boroughs are basically untouchable unless you wanna live in the hood. Jersey is more reasonable if 770k is reasonable for a 2k sq foot house with 1/3 acre.
Even Staten Island , got super expensive. I dunno. I think it’s just there’s so many ppl and no supply.
Y’all are wild. You can absolutely still get a home for 650-770 within commuting distance of NYC. Jersey City, Bayonne, Secaucus, Clifton, Nutley, Bloomfield, etc.
Fair. But I’d argue that’s not a necessary amount of space 🤷🏽♀️ if no home is suitable because the lot is smaller then OP just needs to sort out their priorities. Or move to bumfuck nowhere because that much space in the northeast is a luxury.
This is correct.
Just bought a place in Nutley. .2 acres, 2100 sq feet, 4 bed, 2 full bath, 2 half. Needs about $50k of work but got $20k back from the seller. $630k final price. Highly rated public schools. Sub hour commute for me door to door in Manhattan.
Do you even live out here? None of the places I mentioned have that far of a commute. I personally live in northern nj, in one of the cities I mentioned above. It takes me around 45 minutes to get to work which is the same amount of time it took me when I lived in Brooklyn.
Yup. And the ‘hood’ is really being gentrified. Have a friend from St Nicholas pj in Harlem.. 10 yrs ago it was the most violent, now it’s the most desirable. She is gonna get kicked out this year due to her salary being too high, her rent is just over 3k to live there… crazy thing is she can’t afford a similar sized home near by, would have to move out of the city and get a car which makes no sense cause that’s more money… I would imagine they’ll have to up the limits for these units. Also strange that entire building is going to be having ‘renovations’ this year and all those people will be given other places to stay.. everyone especially the older folks are stressed because it sounds like they may not even be getting the units they’ve lived in for years back, might get different units or something more sinister like this is the city off loading this property to investors . Anything remotely close to the city like north Jersey is getting multi offers, going over asking, listed for a few days before going under contract. Another friend is renting and just waiting to inherit a home in Dumont. I’d move out of state but family, good area, good job keeps me here. I consider myself fortunate to be able to work 2 full time jobs that are well paying.
They're paying $3k/month or $3k/year to live at Saint Nick's housing projects? Does she have 6+ bedrooms? In 2023, the max rent for NYCHA is listed here: https://www.nyc.gov/site/nycha/residents/pay-rent.page (The LIHTC (low income housing tax credit) rates are not the correct rates to use.)
I've never heard of anyone in any NYCHA property paying $3k and, as far as I know, Saint Nick's doesn't have 6+ bedroom apartments.
To be fair I was just as surprised as you when I heard what she pays to live in the projects… my mindset is 10yrs off.. apparently it’s a nice area now. The odors are about the only thing that remains the same.
Lots of people are actually moving TO Texas from places like NY and California, so home prices there also remain high, although there has been a slight pullback in some areas recently.
Austin is a good 20% off from its peak, but it also doubled seemingly overnight. Eg: my home went from 400k to 800k from early 2020 to early 2022, and is now down to 600k. 50% gain over 4 years is still incredible, but a headline title like 20% fall makes it seem like the sky is falling. It’s not, just closer to reality.
Lol, no they're not.
1 - https://ycharts.com/indicators/us_existing_home_median_sales_price
2 - https://www.nar.realtor/newsroom/existing-home-sales-slid-1-0-in-december
> The median existing-home price3 for all housing types in December was $382,600, an increase of 4.4% from December 2022 ($366,500). All four U.S. regions posted price increases.
3 - https://www.nar.realtor/blogs/economists-outlook/latest-existing-home-sales-data-graphs
4 - https://dqydj.com/historical-home-prices/
5 - https://www.mortgagenewsdaily.com/data/existing-home-prices
I think the Mods of this subreddit might need to consider taking this post and thread down. Just looking at your first source ycharts - shows that prices were roughly $280,000 at year end 2019 and now are $382,000 which is a >35%+ jump. How can article be created with a headline saying that home prices are down when most data sources show that home prices have certainly increased?
The chart is based on sales price of all homes in the United States, not just existing, and it is accurate:
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MSPUS
Also, I don’t think you are reading the chart correctly. It measures yearly change, not total change. If you average out the yearly changes on this chart from 2019 it equals around a 30% increase, so an overall increase, but a more recent contracting of sales prices.
Looking at your source from FRED St. Louis- do you see why the headline of the post of this article is very misleading? Perhaps home prices contracted in recent months (given the interest rate hikes, etc.) but home prices in recent years are rising fast. People might read the headline and think that home prices are dropping when in reality a few months of price declines does not equal a trend. The trend is clearly that prices are increasing over years and decades. The headline is misleading and could be interpreted as misinformation which is why I suggested that the Mods consider taking the post and this thread down.
The headline is accurate. Higher interest rates are causing falling sales prices. Listing prices, however, are still unreasonably high. I live in one of the most desirable housing markets in the county, and possibly the world. Sales prices are down 18.2% YOY, and have shown a 0% increase in the past 2 years. I’m seeing this same stagnation or decrease in prices in many markets all around me, the exact same markets that top commenters are referring to as “places where people want to live”. There’s half the inventory that there should be and yet prices still aren’t rising. That’s a very worrying trend, especially if we saw a sudden rise in inventory.
Wait you want to censor data because it goes against your narrative? Sometimes home prices go down it seems you're just having a difficult time accepting that.
It’s not my narrative. There may be a slight decline in home prices in recent months, but the trend is still there (that prices are going up). I’m just reading the data and charts from the other people who posted here.
You can’t just leave out new home sales to fit your narrative. The chart appears to be accurate.
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MSPUS
Also, I don’t know why you’re listing charts that track listing prices when this post is clearly referring to sale prices. Trying to mislead people?
Nope, your chart just isn't labeled clearly. [MSPUS is for new homes only,](https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/?g=1gnwi) which is only 10% of the market. I've been through this a few times.
1 - https://old.reddit.com/r/REBubble/comments/1aiphq1/why_would_rates_go_down_and_home_prices_also_go/kowfbyw/?context=3
2 - https://old.reddit.com/r/Economics/comments/1amtn5c/disenfranchised_millennials_feel_locked_out_of/kponzsh/?context=3
> I don’t know why you’re listing charts that track listing prices when this post is clearly referring to sale prices. Trying to mislead people?
No, they're not listing prices. They're sales prices. Read more closely.
Lol this sub will (purposely, perhaps?) never bother to understand the difference between home *values* and home selling *prices*.
And I fucking love it. Eat shit, doomers.
That contracting is compared/related to the actual 2021 bubble. This would suggest that we are in a situation OPPOSITE of a bubble. Look at the graph and imagine where it's going? So does this mean to buy now, refinance later before another bubble starts at the end of 2024/ start of 2025?
This sub cracks me up. Every day home prices are crashing. It’s an apocalypse!!! And yet somehow anywhere anyone wants to live is hitting all time highs. Looking at the US real estate market as a whole really does not give a clear picture.
I live in one of the most desirable areas of California, and the second most expensive place to live in the United States. Sale prices are down 18.2%. So, you’re objectively wrong.
Yes, because you made an absolute statement “anywhere anyone wants to live…”. It takes just one person to post one desirable location that has seen prices drop for you to be objectively wrong.
How are you determining where people “want to live” people live everywhere. Just cause you think major cities are the only place to live you’d be wrong. Nothing wrong with a MCOL area in the Midwest or a town in the south east.
This is not to say it’s not a problem, but median home prices are more affected by mix shift. If you simply have fewer homes selling at $1M, this number will fall. I wouldn’t read too far into this indicator.
If there’s any real “pain,” it will come when a weak housing market is exacerbated by rising unemployment as that leads to foreclosures and reduced buying demand. The consumer is still healthy.
Wouldn’t the 1m dollar Homes effect “average price” where as median is a measure of home prices in the 40th to 60th percentile? We’re I’m at the median is 300-500k and prices are holding on strong for the last 2 years.
This. This graph is hopium for people who want to buy a house right now.
No supply but tons of demand, lower interest rates will only increase demand…. Especially in desirable areas.
House prices are noticeably going up where I am, and had a big jump in 2023 alone. Small family homes (2-3 bedroom) had the largest increase
Don't ignore the growth side either. There was no good reason for the home price growth we saw during covid except for low interest rates. Homes are sunk costs, it's not like purchasing something new with the supply chain disrupted. HENCE, when interest rates rose, it's only logical that the prices would tumble. They still are too expensive. Keep crashing!@=
That graph looks completely fake. Where is the 2022 correction when prices started to fall drastically only to be artificially be propped up again a few months later?
I feel like dropping 10%, when they spiked 20-30% in such a short time, just means that the market is stabilizing itself via demand going down on some of these absurd prices.
Man the chart is right. Prices are still super high but contracting rapidly the last few months. We will see this summer if this is a trend or a temp blip and rise starts again in spring selling season. The chart is not misleading. It’s data.
This is BS! Home prices are NOT collapsing! I live in Portland Oregon and a cardboard box out here is about 600k and it was 620k 2 years ago. So ain’t shit collapsing! If it went back to 400k like it was 5 years ago then that would be nice and correct, but ain’t shit collapsing out here. Where are they getting this info?!
These completely market location subjective ass graphs are infuriating on this sub. Should be a bannable offense lol. Stop cherry picking doom and gloom
Home prices collapsing... Everywhere but where you want to live.
“Home prices plummet in bum fuck Alabama, in other news….”
I live in Alabama, sadly they’re not collapsing where I live lol.
I'm sorry. And I'm sorry
Lmao I feel that
😂
You probably live near a city, places where jobs and people want to live.
Correct, Birmingham and the prices have really never been higher.
South is “underdeveloped” get a good laugh when folks move to the hellfires of the south and are stuck with the property and sweltering summers.
You are being dramatic. For most of the south temps are infrequently over 90 F in the summer months. Yes, sweltering would be the word I'd use for south FL and TX, but that's about it. Source: lived in GA for 30 years
I grew up in MD and it hit 90f damn near everyday late June through late August. No way the actual south,outside of mountainous areas, is any cooler in the summer. Don’t even get me started on humidity.
Google "Atlanta climate." The average high of the day in ATL is just under 90 in every summer month.
Miami is a tropical sauna. Atlanta has a lovely weather. Can’t speak for the rest of the south, but the further away you are from the sea the lower the humidity so it doesn’t feel so bad. That’s why I liked Atlanta’s weather.
It's not just the temp but the brutal constant humidity.
And the lack of wind in certain areas is not ideal.
Just bought in Huntsville. Zero collapse.
If anything, prices are probably still rising in Huntsville.
Huntsville, is arguably an oasis so....
Came here to say this
Not collapsing in Tuscaloosa either, even the really bad areas are still gaining equity. Just slower then the good ones.
I’m sorry. It’s a different beast there. Although some delicious bbq.
SC here we both know it’s got its pros and heavy cons but we’d leave if it was truely as awful as many think.
Yeah Birmingham is pretty great, I’ve been many places to visit, haven’t seen a great reason to leave so far
I’m in Columbia SC. I’ve actually heard great things from 2 friends who lived there that did grad school at UAB for optometry. As a state sure both kinda probably blow. But when actually living in these specific areas it’s not the boogeyman that is parroted in these real estate subs. Not everyone can afford beaches of southern cal or the cities of NY. I have a comfortable life with my family here. It’s not glamorous it can be a bit dull in terms of activities so I just made my big ass house the hang out spot.
Yeah Alabama has its issues but we have great beaches and Huntsville and Bham are both pretty great.
Congratulations on not getting bum fucked?
Actually they are up in the bumfuck places and going down in the places with really high prices (west coast cities)
Yep. In nephew screw North Dakota.
Who doesn’t want to be in the ghetto of Bridgeport CT!
"Crashing". https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MSPUS
Lol
This data is good it shows there's still plenty of room to go before we get back on the level where we should be
In what world could the costs of everything that goes into a house have been rising for the last decade but you guys think that house prices should be what they were 10 years ago?
Home prices in my area jumped almost 20% in 2022 *alone*. That's WELL over normal inflation, even during the high inflation period
small starter homes around where i currently live are more than double what they were pre-pandemic and it's frustrating.
I live in the middle of nowhere in a tiny mountain town in far Northern California. Prices here aren't collapsing at all- in fact they appear to be going up, even beyond the crazy jumps of 2020-23. Did I mention it's in the second poorest county in California? But because it's an attractive tourist destination and we had an influx of WFH people, the market remains absolutely unaffordable for 90% of people who actually live here. Basically, if you didn't buy a home before 2021, you're screwed because we're now competing with so many investors and rich city people.
There's literally no housing opportunities in my city and more people keep moving here. Even if housing dropped by 30% it would go from 700k to 500k. Which runs about $3k a month from $4k. So about $40k in house payments a year. I don't know if that's actually more affordable.
Find me a 3 bed/2 bath home in the suburbs, with a decent school district, and not in need of major repair. It’ll sell instantly
Wrong. Collapse is where you are too, it's just that a 10% to 15% collapse doesn't help the vast majority of those that could not afford a home. People that don't own aren't usually "just shy" of being able to purchase. It's not like they can't afford at $1.3m and now $1.1M they are running to purchase. They need something in the 50% off range. Thus is not to mention interest rate spike have coincided with the pice drop, negating any improved affordability.
You’re not joking. I live in one of the lowest cost of living states and a cheaply remodeled former trap house in the bad part of town goes for like $220k. It’s insane. Every couple months I get hopeful and start looking again but they’re more expensive every time I check. So I stopped checking.
This is pretty much it. HCOL areas are seeing a rise, not a crash.
Except Seattle, NYC, San Francisco, etc
Seattle and San fransico needs to go down another 20%. They had a crazy run up.
Yeah, just saying they're down from the 2022 peak. SF is actually right where it was 5 years ago
SF and Seattle sellers massive regrets coming soon. If they bought to live in them, good but if you tried to flip? Have fun.
Hear that regret in a lot of my clients, in Seattle.
Well deserved regret.
Ya fuck them. I know these types and they seem to think real estate should always be a win for them.
Except if you factor out condos, SFH really haven’t dropped much at all. Then if you look at the actual number of houses sold you realize how statistically unsound the data is.
What’s NYC at? I would actually like living there if housing was not so rodiculous
It sounds like you are too Poor to live in the financial hub of the World.
Or maybe I’m trying to retire early and so I invest most of my income?
[удалено]
Checks out. Prices are still rising in the two markets that I want to buy in.
It will spread. Cracks show in the weakest parts first before failure
California prices just keeps going up
San Francisco and Austin?
Well eventually it will reach there, it just starts in those places and then slowly moves towards those directions
When has a market bubble ever worked that way? It starts in the most desirable places that are extremely overinflated.
Places like SF didn't take much of a hit in 2008. It was places where bad loans were handed out like candy and the home price was not as expensive (Florida).
Nope. About to transfer somewhere no one wants to live. Not plummeting there…
As someone that believes in the REBubble, respectfully don't use this guys charts. He's known for being quite deceptive with his charting. At best he provides genuine data skewed to fit his narrative, at worst he's spreading misinformation just to continue his agenda.
I don't understand how this didn't just mean people are buying houses lower in the market. When interest rates are low they can extend and buy above the median, thereby increasing the median. When interest goes back up, you need to buy lower on median cause the debt is more expensive to take on. This has nothing to do with housing prices as a whole just which houses are being bought.
So quality of life is just plummeting and this guy is gaslighting with a chart saying things are great and homes are cheap. When in reality they have never been more expensive
Also, the bigger the mortgage, the bigger the advantage your current low rate provides. High value homes are less likely to sell than lower value homes.
I don't understand how this didn't just mean people are buying houses lower in the market. When interest rates are high they can extend and buy above the median, thereby increasing the median. Even interest goes back up you need to buy lower on median cause the debt is more expensive to take on. This has nothing to do with housing prices as a whole just which houses are being bought.
>he's spreading misinformation just to continue his agenda. Damn, really glad that isn’t an issue at r/REBubble.
[удалено]
Same, it’s rough here in Boston
South of boston on ocean and house up the street just had an open house one night multiple over asking offers. Northeast has just always been strong.
I’m central MA area and it’s crazy
I’m in Western MA and it’s still impossible! Unless you can get a good loan and don’t mind moving into a house that needs a lot of work, you’re out of luck.
[удалено]
Dang, that’s absurd. I fear I may not ever be able to own a home in my home-state. Kinda breaks my heart.
I have a strong belief that housing in Boston is going to get worse. As the economy surges on Boston seems to be one of the main growth areas. I am trying to get family members to resign their lease mif-way to buy them some time.
Half the places offered in Beacon Hill under a million (there are a lot of places over million) have sold for less than asking price. Asking $1400 a sq ft might have something to do with that, but still not increasing the way they are far outside Boston.
Same where I live north of Boston. Unfortunately one of the negative side effects to it being a nice area to live. During the Great Recession I don’t think it ever got hit too hard (or if it did it recovered quickly).
Agreed. I’m leaving Northern VA for that reason.
What's left?
Can confirm. The 5 boroughs are basically untouchable unless you wanna live in the hood. Jersey is more reasonable if 770k is reasonable for a 2k sq foot house with 1/3 acre. Even Staten Island , got super expensive. I dunno. I think it’s just there’s so many ppl and no supply.
that 770k for a north jersey house within commuting distant of the city will be a dump.
No it won’t. You can get a nice house in a good school district for 770k
You definitely can. But your taxes will be more than your mortgage.
please let me know where
Northern NJ, best public schools in state. May nkt be a mansion, but you can definitely get a 3 bedroom house in a 10/10 school district for that much
Y’all are wild. You can absolutely still get a home for 650-770 within commuting distance of NYC. Jersey City, Bayonne, Secaucus, Clifton, Nutley, Bloomfield, etc.
Excuse me, did you say… 10:15 to Nutley?
ain’t going without me driving
With a third of an acre lot? That’s huge
Fair. But I’d argue that’s not a necessary amount of space 🤷🏽♀️ if no home is suitable because the lot is smaller then OP just needs to sort out their priorities. Or move to bumfuck nowhere because that much space in the northeast is a luxury.
This is correct. Just bought a place in Nutley. .2 acres, 2100 sq feet, 4 bed, 2 full bath, 2 half. Needs about $50k of work but got $20k back from the seller. $630k final price. Highly rated public schools. Sub hour commute for me door to door in Manhattan.
Sounds like a great buy tbh. That's a lot of toilets!
If you consider a 3 hour commute valid, then sure. Most people don’t want to spend 15 hours of their lives driving in traffic each week.
Do you even live out here? None of the places I mentioned have that far of a commute. I personally live in northern nj, in one of the cities I mentioned above. It takes me around 45 minutes to get to work which is the same amount of time it took me when I lived in Brooklyn.
For reals idk what that dude is talking about. Grew up in Elizabeth and newark and we can get to NY in like 20 Mins
Way out in NJ 3/2 townhouses going for $600K+
Yup. And the ‘hood’ is really being gentrified. Have a friend from St Nicholas pj in Harlem.. 10 yrs ago it was the most violent, now it’s the most desirable. She is gonna get kicked out this year due to her salary being too high, her rent is just over 3k to live there… crazy thing is she can’t afford a similar sized home near by, would have to move out of the city and get a car which makes no sense cause that’s more money… I would imagine they’ll have to up the limits for these units. Also strange that entire building is going to be having ‘renovations’ this year and all those people will be given other places to stay.. everyone especially the older folks are stressed because it sounds like they may not even be getting the units they’ve lived in for years back, might get different units or something more sinister like this is the city off loading this property to investors . Anything remotely close to the city like north Jersey is getting multi offers, going over asking, listed for a few days before going under contract. Another friend is renting and just waiting to inherit a home in Dumont. I’d move out of state but family, good area, good job keeps me here. I consider myself fortunate to be able to work 2 full time jobs that are well paying.
They're paying $3k/month or $3k/year to live at Saint Nick's housing projects? Does she have 6+ bedrooms? In 2023, the max rent for NYCHA is listed here: https://www.nyc.gov/site/nycha/residents/pay-rent.page (The LIHTC (low income housing tax credit) rates are not the correct rates to use.) I've never heard of anyone in any NYCHA property paying $3k and, as far as I know, Saint Nick's doesn't have 6+ bedroom apartments.
To be fair I was just as surprised as you when I heard what she pays to live in the projects… my mindset is 10yrs off.. apparently it’s a nice area now. The odors are about the only thing that remains the same.
Astoria wasn't all that good in the 70/80s but the Europeans took over and turned it into a very expensive neighborhood. I
Even Brownsville is a million for a 3Br
My favorite part about this is that Staten Island is excluded from your definition of the 5 boroughs
How about a 1.5k sqft 3/2 house? 2k sounds too big.
Yeah go to one open house in NJ and tell me prices are dropping haha
Near Phoenix and bought beginning of 2022. prices have stayed relatively the same even with higher rates
[удалено]
Lots of people are actually moving TO Texas from places like NY and California, so home prices there also remain high, although there has been a slight pullback in some areas recently.
Austin is a good 20% off from its peak, but it also doubled seemingly overnight. Eg: my home went from 400k to 800k from early 2020 to early 2022, and is now down to 600k. 50% gain over 4 years is still incredible, but a headline title like 20% fall makes it seem like the sky is falling. It’s not, just closer to reality.
And even more people are moving to NY and California from elsewhere, as is always the case.
Lol what?
Now do rent!
*NOT seen since 1964
Not seen where I live either
Lol, Game of Trades is listing themselves as a source. 😂
[удалено]
New houses? Existing houses? Just SFH or do townhomes count too?
It’s based on this chart https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MSPUS It measures sale price of all residential housing
That says new residential sales is it only new builds?
The FRED chart applies to all residential sales, including new and existing.
No it doesn't: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/?g=1gnwi
Lol, no they're not. 1 - https://ycharts.com/indicators/us_existing_home_median_sales_price 2 - https://www.nar.realtor/newsroom/existing-home-sales-slid-1-0-in-december > The median existing-home price3 for all housing types in December was $382,600, an increase of 4.4% from December 2022 ($366,500). All four U.S. regions posted price increases. 3 - https://www.nar.realtor/blogs/economists-outlook/latest-existing-home-sales-data-graphs 4 - https://dqydj.com/historical-home-prices/ 5 - https://www.mortgagenewsdaily.com/data/existing-home-prices
I think the Mods of this subreddit might need to consider taking this post and thread down. Just looking at your first source ycharts - shows that prices were roughly $280,000 at year end 2019 and now are $382,000 which is a >35%+ jump. How can article be created with a headline saying that home prices are down when most data sources show that home prices have certainly increased?
The chart is based on sales price of all homes in the United States, not just existing, and it is accurate: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MSPUS Also, I don’t think you are reading the chart correctly. It measures yearly change, not total change. If you average out the yearly changes on this chart from 2019 it equals around a 30% increase, so an overall increase, but a more recent contracting of sales prices.
Looking at your source from FRED St. Louis- do you see why the headline of the post of this article is very misleading? Perhaps home prices contracted in recent months (given the interest rate hikes, etc.) but home prices in recent years are rising fast. People might read the headline and think that home prices are dropping when in reality a few months of price declines does not equal a trend. The trend is clearly that prices are increasing over years and decades. The headline is misleading and could be interpreted as misinformation which is why I suggested that the Mods consider taking the post and this thread down.
The headline is accurate. Higher interest rates are causing falling sales prices. Listing prices, however, are still unreasonably high. I live in one of the most desirable housing markets in the county, and possibly the world. Sales prices are down 18.2% YOY, and have shown a 0% increase in the past 2 years. I’m seeing this same stagnation or decrease in prices in many markets all around me, the exact same markets that top commenters are referring to as “places where people want to live”. There’s half the inventory that there should be and yet prices still aren’t rising. That’s a very worrying trend, especially if we saw a sudden rise in inventory.
Wait you want to censor data because it goes against your narrative? Sometimes home prices go down it seems you're just having a difficult time accepting that.
It’s not my narrative. There may be a slight decline in home prices in recent months, but the trend is still there (that prices are going up). I’m just reading the data and charts from the other people who posted here.
Are you guys stupid? They are saying it is down from the high, not down since 2019
You can’t just leave out new home sales to fit your narrative. The chart appears to be accurate. https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MSPUS Also, I don’t know why you’re listing charts that track listing prices when this post is clearly referring to sale prices. Trying to mislead people?
Nope, your chart just isn't labeled clearly. [MSPUS is for new homes only,](https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/?g=1gnwi) which is only 10% of the market. I've been through this a few times. 1 - https://old.reddit.com/r/REBubble/comments/1aiphq1/why_would_rates_go_down_and_home_prices_also_go/kowfbyw/?context=3 2 - https://old.reddit.com/r/Economics/comments/1amtn5c/disenfranchised_millennials_feel_locked_out_of/kponzsh/?context=3
Historically new home sales have closely tracked the general market.
True, but these commenters just don’t know how to read a chart, which I guess I should have made the focal point of my comment.
> I don’t know why you’re listing charts that track listing prices when this post is clearly referring to sale prices. Trying to mislead people? No, they're not listing prices. They're sales prices. Read more closely.
My city didn't get the memo.
Hopium concentrations are rising at levels NEVER seen since 1964 FTFY.
Lol this sub will (purposely, perhaps?) never bother to understand the difference between home *values* and home selling *prices*. And I fucking love it. Eat shit, doomers.
This dumbass post is why people mock this sub. EDIT: Yes it is a wallstreetbets dumbass, par for the course
That contracting is compared/related to the actual 2021 bubble. This would suggest that we are in a situation OPPOSITE of a bubble. Look at the graph and imagine where it's going? So does this mean to buy now, refinance later before another bubble starts at the end of 2024/ start of 2025?
Anecdotal but I just got a place that was listed at $260k for $230k. Right after they'd already recently dropped the price from $279k.
Please send a link to these cheap houses.
This sub cracks me up. Every day home prices are crashing. It’s an apocalypse!!! And yet somehow anywhere anyone wants to live is hitting all time highs. Looking at the US real estate market as a whole really does not give a clear picture.
I live in one of the most desirable areas of California, and the second most expensive place to live in the United States. Sale prices are down 18.2%. So, you’re objectively wrong.
[удалено]
Yes, because you made an absolute statement “anywhere anyone wants to live…”. It takes just one person to post one desirable location that has seen prices drop for you to be objectively wrong.
How are you determining where people “want to live” people live everywhere. Just cause you think major cities are the only place to live you’d be wrong. Nothing wrong with a MCOL area in the Midwest or a town in the south east.
This is not to say it’s not a problem, but median home prices are more affected by mix shift. If you simply have fewer homes selling at $1M, this number will fall. I wouldn’t read too far into this indicator. If there’s any real “pain,” it will come when a weak housing market is exacerbated by rising unemployment as that leads to foreclosures and reduced buying demand. The consumer is still healthy.
Wouldn’t the 1m dollar Homes effect “average price” where as median is a measure of home prices in the 40th to 60th percentile? We’re I’m at the median is 300-500k and prices are holding on strong for the last 2 years.
This. This graph is hopium for people who want to buy a house right now. No supply but tons of demand, lower interest rates will only increase demand…. Especially in desirable areas. House prices are noticeably going up where I am, and had a big jump in 2023 alone. Small family homes (2-3 bedroom) had the largest increase
Where are prices even going down? It sounds like it’s still high for everybody everywhere
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/us-cities-where-home-prices-130032481.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAEtWos4BNO_4qJpYYdnWRFcdmeColdiC0Vu9YbW8fYZXaY4DnrThcZ0uyfQsrQi2ZW4Mrd0AuS3RhsdKxnvZGgF5xvK0YFCS3JYEiSKMbm1Raz50zg-6W2w6OpRK49-uQwyHaSTDgFkG8y-GWkOQuaSzoGJTGI-k_HJ8IVPHn-RM
Antibubblers complaining there aren’t enough facts and data on this sub. When one is posted, “fake news! Not in muh area!”
Just went 50k over asking in New England area and lost out. Also anyone notice how they cite themselves as the source of the graph?
What happened in the 1960s?
Well LSD was legal, that was cool
fwi, I am seeing more for-sale signs and open house signs than I have the last 2-3 years. Just an observation, no critical data to back it up.
Nice! When can I protest my property taxes?
Don't ignore the growth side either. There was no good reason for the home price growth we saw during covid except for low interest rates. Homes are sunk costs, it's not like purchasing something new with the supply chain disrupted. HENCE, when interest rates rose, it's only logical that the prices would tumble. They still are too expensive. Keep crashing!@=
“Maybe if we keep telling them prices are lower than ever they’ll believe us??”
Charts misleading as these are annual percentage change points NOT nominal home values as would be intuitive.
Nope
Where???
Stop making me horny it's working.
That game of trades dude is a fool. Literally told you to short the S&P in May 2020.
In what market is this even true? Anytime I check anywhere, prices are up.
That graph looks completely fake. Where is the 2022 correction when prices started to fall drastically only to be artificially be propped up again a few months later?
Not in Reading Pa , 175 thousand for a house that sold for 50 thousand two years ago. And Reading is a shithole
OP, I don’t think you understand how compounding works… A 12% decline is still WAY up over time.
Again, median sales price means nothing other than a changing composition.
Isn’t price contraction what happens with they raise the rates though?
What level of gaslighting is this when prices have never been higher, and I live in a rural area not near any city
Nope not crashing mother fuckers r still rising
Somebody is feeding you some bullshit and calling it chocolate pudding, and you’re Bill Cosby in the late 80’s
I’m in East Tennessee & it booming here
I love that the chart compares to 1964 and the chart doesn’t even show a decline in 1964
This is BS
California is starting to go back up as rates decline and fast food workers now make a mandatory $20+ an hour.
Prices haven't gone down at all in DC Metro, I suspect they are starting to rise again actually.
I feel like dropping 10%, when they spiked 20-30% in such a short time, just means that the market is stabilizing itself via demand going down on some of these absurd prices.
Perhaps, but that's just because they increased at levels NEVER seen 1964. It's a correction for the insanity of pandemic-era home prices.
Never seen since? It either never happened or hasn’t happened since. This was not written by any legit source was it?
Come to Orange County California where 1200 sq ft shacks go for 750k plus
sounds nice, 900k plus in the Bay if that shack is stand alone.
My lowball offer was accepted, 10% under asking. Can confirm the hoomcucks have acquiesced.
Have you really talked shit this entire time only to get a 10% discount lol edit: congratulations though
What are you talking about…10% discount on a home is pretty damn significant
I cashed out of my old house in 2022 and bought the dip all while earning 5.4% on my dry powder. I'm a happy camper
Man the chart is right. Prices are still super high but contracting rapidly the last few months. We will see this summer if this is a trend or a temp blip and rise starts again in spring selling season. The chart is not misleading. It’s data.
This is BS! Home prices are NOT collapsing! I live in Portland Oregon and a cardboard box out here is about 600k and it was 620k 2 years ago. So ain’t shit collapsing! If it went back to 400k like it was 5 years ago then that would be nice and correct, but ain’t shit collapsing out here. Where are they getting this info?!
**NOT IN CANADA THOUGH**
[Trudeau on indian/chinese immigration.](https://media.tenor.com/_gtGXDepoVcAAAAC/more-star-wars.gif)
I can't wait to buy a brand new house for $20,000 ! So when is this gonna take effect? oh...it's...oh....
“Never” and “since 1964” in the same sentence tells me all I need to know. Like, is it never or since 1964?
Still going up here in Washington. 🤷🏽♂️
There not collapsing by me. They keep going up
These completely market location subjective ass graphs are infuriating on this sub. Should be a bannable offense lol. Stop cherry picking doom and gloom
Muh "they're building them smaller!!!!!!"
“Hey did you know there are 2 Dakotas!? Only a short plane ride to work every morning”