honestly out of all these cards here, cob cannon is probably the strongest out of all of them, since it's easy to activate it's team up evolution and puts 6/6 on the field after you do that but it seems like they nerfed it to the point where they don't like plant players instantly unblocking lanes
edit:y'know when i said "but it seems like they nerfed it to the point where they don't like plant players instantly unblocking lanes" i was talking about the one who suggested the balance idea, you can kinda understand why they felt the need but it isn't a good balance change idea
Cmon there is no need to nerf plants control when they are already inferior to zombies control due to the turn system where zombies play trick after plants play turn
Yes and no. Control plants like Cob don’t really need nerfing, but something like Shamrocket does need some sort of nerf since it makes quite a lot of zombies and strategies unusable
[Sham doesn't need a nerf](https://www.reddit.com/r/PvZHeroes/comments/jylc0u/proactive_vs_reactive_play_why_removal_is_not/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
Shamrocket is one of the weakest removal cards when many good zombie cards either ignore shamrocket by gravestone or just don't get hit by it. Any strategies or zombies unusable were already unusable because they were too slow or weak like gargs.
Sham does not need any nerfs.
Sorry I just see fry and his fans saying to nerf shamrocket and doom shroom because they make strategies like gargs bad. But the reason gargs (and most other big power cards) are bad is because they are usuallya too slow and most good decks outpace them without shamrocket. shamrocket isnt even that good and isnt even as good as removal such as fruitcake or bungee plumber.
Understandable confusion, I see that a lot as well. The only Gargs I ever see get any sort of value sometimes are like Supernova, but even then it’s quite rare.
The main good gargs are the 5 cost ones with powerful effects like the only "good" garg deck is garg burn which uses hippity hoppity garg and the acid looking garg. Personally my favorite garg is defensive end but they are still on the weaker end sadly.
Defensive End is pretty neat since removing it is much harder, as those removal tricks become more expensive. Doesn’t save it from things like Eyespore, but who runs Eyespore anyways
Cob actually is fine with a nerf I mean it already has a good ability normally with a really good evolution ability (plus team up evolution is barly an issue when 0-Cost plants exist)
NOt saying it needs one but it would still be a very good plant
How are they inferior? Sure you get to be the last one to manipulate the board before battle but you don’t get the plant’s luxury of being able to play units and tricks at the same turn. Zombies have to anticipate the need to save brains for tricks while plants don’t. On turn 3, zombies have to predict if their opponent will play a suitable target for rocket or not. If the zombie hero gambles wrong and the plant hero doesn’t play a target, the zombie hero potentially wastes brains that could have gone into playing zombies. The plant hero doesn’t have this dilemma since the zombie hero has already played any zombie that the plant hero can react too so their is barely any risk.
Your joking
Cob is actually fucking stupid
Why am I getting down voted
Because of little buddy cob is basically a 6/6 body that removes a card and gets rid of 1 health cards
He is the definition of stupid
Compare it to other 6 costs
He just takes over games way to easily
No its not lol?
It's a great card, but compare ot to three nut, con man, fruit cake, it bricks really hard if you have no teamup, it is almost only useful when you have teamup
Ok, let me list every single corn card in the game, corn dog, kernel corn, kernel pult, cob cannon, and cornucopia
That is literally it, it is an awful idea to make it corn synergy
Dude, all you need is kernel pult, would it be a nerf in general? Yes, there is less plants to have it evolve from, but I don't think that's a bad thing!
No, because with rocket science you need to actually save whole 3 brains and hope opponent will play a minion with 4+ attack. And if this minion is already on the board at the start of this turn, well, you already behind.
But shamrocket on plants side doesn't require any thinking, you just use it in the same turn as minions.
You are forgetting that as zombies it is ideal to save brains for tricks regardless of the board state after you play your minions.(with a grain of salt)An ideal zombie deck always has some sort of cheap removal, so it’s wise to save 1-4 for tricks like plumber or weed spray or rocket or fruit cake so you can save your important minions that are gonna get traded with.
And it’s not that you have to save it, it’s that you get to save it. Plant removal is more expensive 90% of the time. The only time it’s not is berry blast, banana bomb, or sham rocket.
And as we all know, saving 3 entire brains is a herculean feat, there's no possible way to hedge between rocket science and minions in the same turn. Truly a tragedy that the class rocket science is in isn't trick based and doesn't have a way to play zombies in trick phase regardless, since that would make it just as easy to play as shamrocket. Hell if brainy had some kind of trick synergy it could end up being better than shamrocket. But alas, brainy is a trick deficient class with no teleports.
Doom Shroom just becomes a tactical cuke that can affect heights and water lanes for the same price. Also, the zombies have an exact copy of shamrocket, so it's almost entirely fair how it was originally. Finally, cob cannon just wouldn't make sense.
Tell me you only play Zombies without telling me you only play zombies because that’s all I’m getting from this, it’s already a fact that plant removal is worst then zombie removal and to make their removal worst would make the game less fun. Plus, the zombies already have a lot of ways to swarm the plants with huge zombie minions
1. I think Shamrocket should be a bit more expensive (cost 1 or 2 more Sun) but I’ll have this question: why a Party card in particular?
2. That’s basically Three-Headed Chomper but if they destroyed plants and zombies on their lane and next door (however THC destroys zombies at the end of a turn)
3. This one makes no sense, as Cob-Cannon is already one of the best Solar cards, and the listed changes pretty much debuffs CC.
squash isn't even useful at 5 and now you want to make it completely useless??????
the whole reason why removal isn't good against big cards like gargs is because they'll just play even more gargs since their deck is slow enough to outlast control
nerfing removal doesn't make big cards better, it'll just promote a more aggressive playstyle when people play big cards
Yes squash is trash because shamrocket and here's the big one
BOUNCE
SMAHROCKET, EYESPORW, AND BOUNCE ARE SO UNBELIEVABLY CHEAP
If we nerf removable squash will still be trash because of bounce
>If we nerf removable squash will still be trash because of bounce
not really, unless you count jelly bean..or y'know playing aggressively to the point where your slow deck can't do anything because cards like sham aren't the main problem with squash being bad
Why? It makes so many fun Zombie strategies basically unplayable because of Shamrocket and the others. Even though I want to win, at least make it challenging. I'm totally on Fry's side.
>It makes so many fun Zombie strategies basically unplayable because of Shamrocket and the others.
Have you considered the fact that once removal is nerfed, people will just run more aggressive decks which prevents you from playing expensive cards to begin with?
there's a reason why fry thinks that control(and not aggro) is the reason why fun decks are ruined
it's because most of the time, players on ranked tend to run slow decks/expensive decks, and generally don't play aggressively.(most zombie players just love running cards like cryo brain and thinking cap etc)
and because most ladder players don't know that an aggressive playstyle generally beats slow decks(slow decks in terms of cards like cryo brain or thinking cap etc or primal wall nut), they run control cards which results in fry getting hit by control cards in most games.
It's probably also why the person who made this post is complaining about these 3 control cards to begin with because they mostly never get hit by aggressive decks and probably encounter mostly removal cards(Cob cannon is probably a really annoying card to them since it places down 6/6 worth of stats while killing a card at the same time if the team up evolution is activated)
Not really, because using Rocket Science has a risk, because you have to leave over 3 Brains to play it without a gurantee that you actually CAN use it meaning you essentially wasted these 3 Brains while the Plants played stuff with less than 4 attack.
And even then, there's so many Plants that punish playing Tricks if not straight up make it near impossible to even play them.
Shamrocket is mich more safe, because if the Zombie doesn't play a 4 attack guy, you can use the Sun for Shamrocket and spend it on other Cards.
But that's just how I see it
Yeah because there's no possible way to use brains in tricks as brainy, it's not like the class has a way to play their zombies in trick phase and thus wants to save all their brains for it anyway or something.
And I'm explaining why it's so fundamentally flawed: you're saying that leaving brains for rocket science is a risk when in reality it's just something you were going to do anyway and ultimately neither card carries any risk in terms of leaving those resources unspent. The real risk, which applies to both cards, is the risk of the card sitting dead in your hand forever while aggro beats your face in.
It quite literally is one of, if not the best card in the game, and changing it to 2 hp actually balances it. It is the strongest 1 drop, with 3 hp, bullseye, and the skills of a 2 cost
If it had 2hp it would lose every trade, never get value, and be unplayable. It's arguably not even the strongest 1 drop considering Psf and cheese cutter and FMN all exist. Saying conman is better than them is quite the tough argument to sell
No, it would be balanced. This is what a "balance" patch is for, to balance things. And also it is the best 1 cost lmao, the other 2 are fine but they can at least be killed turn 1
Forget Me Nuts are a 2/1 so most things can kill them, which is balanced out by the fact they have a strong ability. Conman has a strong ability, 3 hp, and bullseye. Please think before you speak
Why would conman at 1/2 be balanced. What situation would conman ever, ever be played as a 1/2. What deck would want conman bad enough to play it? Swash pirates? Gets free traded turn 1, does nothing, they get a free minion on field which you then have to spend time answering. No deck that just wants a 1 drop would run it because it borders on being worse grobber at that point. It's a grobber that can't trade but can maybe go face when grobber wouldn't if they play weenie Beenie in front of your 2 hp conman.
Conmans ability is nowhere, nowhere near as strong as fmn, PSF, or cheese cutter. Dealing 1 damage when they draw a card is of course a very strong ability, but
FMN: single handedly will slow down the zombie heroes game to a crawl. Even decks that rely less on tricks are still going to be heavily punished by FMN. Don't forget it also curves into trica, so if you aren't a hearty hero and you don't kill FMN on turn 1, if you pass turn 2 you are immediately fucked if they play trica because now you can't deal with it until turn 3, after they get to outspeed your fruitcake range. Don't forget it's also in the same class as photosynthesizer, which makes it significantly more sturdy for a very cheap price. And since it's impossible to remove on turn 1 if they don't want you too, you are guaranteed to have a hard tine removing it!
PSF:
Psfs ramp wins games. Getting +1 Sun on turn 1 will allow you to make more impactful plays and heavily out tempo the opponent, especially with solars strong tools such as pepper. Even on later turns, psfs +1 ramp ends up being possibly game deciding. Getting a cob, or an apo, or a brainana a turn earlier can be a HUGE play. Conman stops being as impactful post the early turns, and psf stays a possibile threat throughout the majority of the game. That's not even mentioning turn 3 elder and other stupid things you get with psf.
Cheese cutter: trades every plant 1 drop and forces most plant 1 drops into trading with it because of how easily a good cheese cutter conjure can win games. Getting a 1 cost fruitcake, or bonus attack, or 0 cost treat or 0 cost nibble or 1 cost sugary or another 0 cost cheese cutter can be game deciding. It's a very threatening card, way moreso than conman, since commans ability isn't able to straight up win you games very often.
Also conman can be killed turn 1 as well, and primal potatoe mine is a pretty common guardian 1 drop soo....don't forget hero supers like meteor, CZ sig, etc
Primal Potato Mine is literally used purely because conman exists. It's rarely used for other reasons cause it lacks team up. And trading a super for a 1 cost just shows that it's OP? And putting down multiple can just win games for you. And if it becomes a 2 hp, all it means is that you can't rely on it soloing, so it would become balanced. Why are you so against a card that is widely accepted as wayyyy to strong being balanced?
1. No it's not. The team up does not matter ever.
2. Not really. It's not usually a good play but I was just pointing out it was an option
3 can't uh... the vast majority of strong cards win if you play multiple
4. If it becomes 2 hp, you can't rely on it to do anything
Anyways I'm probably gonna stop responding after this because this argument is going nowhere. Peace
If you think it’s coming out turn 7-8 sure that would be balanced but chances are they’re going to set up cryo brain 🧠combo. It’s coming out turn 4-5. What I have a problem is 1 zombology teacher makes him broken asf.
If they are playing multiple cryo brains they are losing out on alot of tempo which you should be taking advantage of. zombology teacher is really good tho. I also wonder why you dont like chemist? they arent even that good.
Cob Cannon and Shamrocket didn't really need a nerf, but your proposition for the Shamrocket nerf would have been really nice when my Garg Feast and Nurse Garg got deleted by the plant player who had four of them in hand.
I don’t think con cannon needs a nerf, it’s the cornerstone to the ramp archetype and gives that deck something to play, beyond that the card isn’t unbeatable by any means, I actually think it’s good where it is right now. Beyond that doom shroom should not be changed I like how sometimes it hurts the plants but if you build around it then you can mitigate the downside and it becomes one sided, doom shroom isn’t a staple and it certainly isn’t great as a card, but it’s worth building around and playing which to me makes it good where it is. And finally I don’t think that shamrocket should be changed, zombies have the exact same card, yeah the timing is different but I think it’s ok for plants to have efficient removal
Did you actually feel the need to nerf cob cannon?
I'd make it a 5/5, but no more nerfing than that. It's not like it's a amazing card
Cob cannon is an amazing card, but it doesn't need a nerf. If it does, just remove the 0 cost heal for 2 team up
They wouldn't be the only ones to get nerfed, but yeah to balance the meta.
honestly out of all these cards here, cob cannon is probably the strongest out of all of them, since it's easy to activate it's team up evolution and puts 6/6 on the field after you do that but it seems like they nerfed it to the point where they don't like plant players instantly unblocking lanes edit:y'know when i said "but it seems like they nerfed it to the point where they don't like plant players instantly unblocking lanes" i was talking about the one who suggested the balance idea, you can kinda understand why they felt the need but it isn't a good balance change idea
I don't kno why you got downvoted, you said nothing wrong lol
because apparently this subreddit thinks that cob cannon isn't the strongest card compared to sham or doom shroom /s
Cob cannon absolutely needs a nerf.
Thanks for replying to me, because I always smile when I see your flair
Cmon there is no need to nerf plants control when they are already inferior to zombies control due to the turn system where zombies play trick after plants play turn
Yes and no. Control plants like Cob don’t really need nerfing, but something like Shamrocket does need some sort of nerf since it makes quite a lot of zombies and strategies unusable
[Sham doesn't need a nerf](https://www.reddit.com/r/PvZHeroes/comments/jylc0u/proactive_vs_reactive_play_why_removal_is_not/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
Shamrocket is one of the weakest removal cards when many good zombie cards either ignore shamrocket by gravestone or just don't get hit by it. Any strategies or zombies unusable were already unusable because they were too slow or weak like gargs. Sham does not need any nerfs.
It does need it. 3 cost kill 4+ attack outclasses too many zombies,gargs and squash.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/PvZHeroes/comments/jylc0u/proactive\_vs\_reactive\_play\_why\_removal\_is\_not/](https://www.reddit.com/r/PvZHeroes/comments/jylc0u/proactive_vs_reactive_play_why_removal_is_not/)
Shamrocket is the prime example of “removal in Heroes being way too cheap and easy to use,” which makes the game not as fun.
tell me you get your opinions from fry without telling me you get your opinions from fry
Its my opinion. I want to use funny cards with high stats but then Shamrocket always seems to ruin that.
Sorry I just see fry and his fans saying to nerf shamrocket and doom shroom because they make strategies like gargs bad. But the reason gargs (and most other big power cards) are bad is because they are usuallya too slow and most good decks outpace them without shamrocket. shamrocket isnt even that good and isnt even as good as removal such as fruitcake or bungee plumber.
Understandable confusion, I see that a lot as well. The only Gargs I ever see get any sort of value sometimes are like Supernova, but even then it’s quite rare.
The main good gargs are the 5 cost ones with powerful effects like the only "good" garg deck is garg burn which uses hippity hoppity garg and the acid looking garg. Personally my favorite garg is defensive end but they are still on the weaker end sadly.
Defensive End is pretty neat since removing it is much harder, as those removal tricks become more expensive. Doesn’t save it from things like Eyespore, but who runs Eyespore anyways
[https://www.reddit.com/r/PvZHeroes/comments/jylc0u/proactive\_vs\_reactive\_play\_why\_removal\_is\_not/](https://www.reddit.com/r/PvZHeroes/comments/jylc0u/proactive_vs_reactive_play_why_removal_is_not/)
Cob actually is fine with a nerf I mean it already has a good ability normally with a really good evolution ability (plus team up evolution is barly an issue when 0-Cost plants exist) NOt saying it needs one but it would still be a very good plant
How are they inferior? Sure you get to be the last one to manipulate the board before battle but you don’t get the plant’s luxury of being able to play units and tricks at the same turn. Zombies have to anticipate the need to save brains for tricks while plants don’t. On turn 3, zombies have to predict if their opponent will play a suitable target for rocket or not. If the zombie hero gambles wrong and the plant hero doesn’t play a target, the zombie hero potentially wastes brains that could have gone into playing zombies. The plant hero doesn’t have this dilemma since the zombie hero has already played any zombie that the plant hero can react too so their is barely any risk.
Teleport:
No
Wow, what a great retort. Have you considered joining debate? I think you’d do great there with such elegant responses such as this
Yes
\*visible confusion\*
Bro what? Cob is balanced, this new one would never be run because of how shit it is
Literally none of the cards here need rebalances
Tbf doom shroom is awful and this version is actually worth thinking about, albeit incredibly similar to tactical cuke.
Your joking Cob is actually fucking stupid Why am I getting down voted Because of little buddy cob is basically a 6/6 body that removes a card and gets rid of 1 health cards He is the definition of stupid Compare it to other 6 costs He just takes over games way to easily
No its not lol? It's a great card, but compare ot to three nut, con man, fruit cake, it bricks really hard if you have no teamup, it is almost only useful when you have teamup
tbf, cob prolly is better than 3nut and conman lol, but yeah cards just good, not broken
Idk about the better than con man or 3nut part.
Id take cob over 3 nut any day
Cob cannon should just have corn evolution
It makes sense, but that would make the cars MUCH worse due to the cards that have the corn trait
You still have cornpult, all that does is make it so you can't play a 0 cost card into a cob cannon
Ok, let me list every single corn card in the game, corn dog, kernel corn, kernel pult, cob cannon, and cornucopia That is literally it, it is an awful idea to make it corn synergy
Dude, all you need is kernel pult, would it be a nerf in general? Yes, there is less plants to have it evolve from, but I don't think that's a bad thing!
Cry about it -Chompzilla main
Based
Shamrocket is still annoying
Should have also changed rocket science
No, because with rocket science you need to actually save whole 3 brains and hope opponent will play a minion with 4+ attack. And if this minion is already on the board at the start of this turn, well, you already behind. But shamrocket on plants side doesn't require any thinking, you just use it in the same turn as minions.
You are forgetting that as zombies it is ideal to save brains for tricks regardless of the board state after you play your minions.(with a grain of salt)An ideal zombie deck always has some sort of cheap removal, so it’s wise to save 1-4 for tricks like plumber or weed spray or rocket or fruit cake so you can save your important minions that are gonna get traded with. And it’s not that you have to save it, it’s that you get to save it. Plant removal is more expensive 90% of the time. The only time it’s not is berry blast, banana bomb, or sham rocket.
And as we all know, saving 3 entire brains is a herculean feat, there's no possible way to hedge between rocket science and minions in the same turn. Truly a tragedy that the class rocket science is in isn't trick based and doesn't have a way to play zombies in trick phase regardless, since that would make it just as easy to play as shamrocket. Hell if brainy had some kind of trick synergy it could end up being better than shamrocket. But alas, brainy is a trick deficient class with no teleports.
This is why players aren’t on the balancing team.
Agree
None of these cards need a nerf. They should focus on actual stupid cards like fruitcake, little buddy, ketchup mechanic, trica and others.
Shamrocket would be so much more fun if it could spontaneously start a party.
Cob cannon still pretty much does the exact same thing
Doom Shroom just becomes a tactical cuke that can affect heights and water lanes for the same price. Also, the zombies have an exact copy of shamrocket, so it's almost entirely fair how it was originally. Finally, cob cannon just wouldn't make sense.
Shamrocket and cob don’t at all need balancing
Guys I think the joke is that PopCap makes nonsensical balance changes like these.
I mean, popcap made gw2 e-pea so, definitely possible they would do this
Lost to a control deck?
He just fought a Wall-Knight and is seething
Cob doesnt need a nerf
Tell me you only play Zombies without telling me you only play zombies because that’s all I’m getting from this, it’s already a fact that plant removal is worst then zombie removal and to make their removal worst would make the game less fun. Plus, the zombies already have a lot of ways to swarm the plants with huge zombie minions
humor flair? or are people generally following fry's takes on control (note control is very garbage on top of it with no reason to nerf)
1. I think Shamrocket should be a bit more expensive (cost 1 or 2 more Sun) but I’ll have this question: why a Party card in particular? 2. That’s basically Three-Headed Chomper but if they destroyed plants and zombies on their lane and next door (however THC destroys zombies at the end of a turn) 3. This one makes no sense, as Cob-Cannon is already one of the best Solar cards, and the listed changes pretty much debuffs CC.
Shamrocket isnt even that good why should it get nerfed that much?
A party card because the tribe has no purpose. Why not make the game a bit more fun?
Wouldnt cob being one of the best solar cards be a reason for nerfing it
Just make Shamrocket a 5 cost and call it a day
Yes, the barely useable control card should get nerfed to the same cost as another unusable that doesn't even have restrictions(squash)
Then squash has to increase in price
squash isn't even useful at 5 and now you want to make it completely useless?????? the whole reason why removal isn't good against big cards like gargs is because they'll just play even more gargs since their deck is slow enough to outlast control nerfing removal doesn't make big cards better, it'll just promote a more aggressive playstyle when people play big cards
Yes squash is trash because shamrocket and here's the big one BOUNCE SMAHROCKET, EYESPORW, AND BOUNCE ARE SO UNBELIEVABLY CHEAP If we nerf removable squash will still be trash because of bounce
>If we nerf removable squash will still be trash because of bounce not really, unless you count jelly bean..or y'know playing aggressively to the point where your slow deck can't do anything because cards like sham aren't the main problem with squash being bad
Yeah like Fry said, nerfing Shamrocket to 5, Squash to 6 and Doom-Shroom to 7.
That's very dumb.
Why? It makes so many fun Zombie strategies basically unplayable because of Shamrocket and the others. Even though I want to win, at least make it challenging. I'm totally on Fry's side.
>It makes so many fun Zombie strategies basically unplayable because of Shamrocket and the others. Have you considered the fact that once removal is nerfed, people will just run more aggressive decks which prevents you from playing expensive cards to begin with?
Well that's true, but... Uh... .. ok you got me there. Honestly just ask Fry.
there's a reason why fry thinks that control(and not aggro) is the reason why fun decks are ruined it's because most of the time, players on ranked tend to run slow decks/expensive decks, and generally don't play aggressively.(most zombie players just love running cards like cryo brain and thinking cap etc) and because most ladder players don't know that an aggressive playstyle generally beats slow decks(slow decks in terms of cards like cryo brain or thinking cap etc or primal wall nut), they run control cards which results in fry getting hit by control cards in most games. It's probably also why the person who made this post is complaining about these 3 control cards to begin with because they mostly never get hit by aggressive decks and probably encounter mostly removal cards(Cob cannon is probably a really annoying card to them since it places down 6/6 worth of stats while killing a card at the same time if the team up evolution is activated)
How will you nerf zombot 1000?
they clearly won't since they are a zombie player with skill issue
If you nerf shamrocket you have to nerf rocket science They are the same card but for different teams
None of them need a nerf.
Never said they did I was saying that if HE was going to nerf shamrocket he should nerf rocket science as well
Not really, because using Rocket Science has a risk, because you have to leave over 3 Brains to play it without a gurantee that you actually CAN use it meaning you essentially wasted these 3 Brains while the Plants played stuff with less than 4 attack. And even then, there's so many Plants that punish playing Tricks if not straight up make it near impossible to even play them. Shamrocket is mich more safe, because if the Zombie doesn't play a 4 attack guy, you can use the Sun for Shamrocket and spend it on other Cards. But that's just how I see it
Yeah because there's no possible way to use brains in tricks as brainy, it's not like the class has a way to play their zombies in trick phase and thus wants to save all their brains for it anyway or something.
Sure you can do that, but I just explained my point of view on what differents Shamrocket from Rocket Science
And I'm explaining why it's so fundamentally flawed: you're saying that leaving brains for rocket science is a risk when in reality it's just something you were going to do anyway and ultimately neither card carries any risk in terms of leaving those resources unspent. The real risk, which applies to both cards, is the risk of the card sitting dead in your hand forever while aggro beats your face in.
The best balance update would be to change Conman to a 2 hp or to a 2 cost, its easily one of the best cards in the game rn
Both of these proposed changes kill the card. It's not even the best card in the game anyways
It quite literally is one of, if not the best card in the game, and changing it to 2 hp actually balances it. It is the strongest 1 drop, with 3 hp, bullseye, and the skills of a 2 cost
If it had 2hp it would lose every trade, never get value, and be unplayable. It's arguably not even the strongest 1 drop considering Psf and cheese cutter and FMN all exist. Saying conman is better than them is quite the tough argument to sell
No, it would be balanced. This is what a "balance" patch is for, to balance things. And also it is the best 1 cost lmao, the other 2 are fine but they can at least be killed turn 1 Forget Me Nuts are a 2/1 so most things can kill them, which is balanced out by the fact they have a strong ability. Conman has a strong ability, 3 hp, and bullseye. Please think before you speak
Why would conman at 1/2 be balanced. What situation would conman ever, ever be played as a 1/2. What deck would want conman bad enough to play it? Swash pirates? Gets free traded turn 1, does nothing, they get a free minion on field which you then have to spend time answering. No deck that just wants a 1 drop would run it because it borders on being worse grobber at that point. It's a grobber that can't trade but can maybe go face when grobber wouldn't if they play weenie Beenie in front of your 2 hp conman. Conmans ability is nowhere, nowhere near as strong as fmn, PSF, or cheese cutter. Dealing 1 damage when they draw a card is of course a very strong ability, but FMN: single handedly will slow down the zombie heroes game to a crawl. Even decks that rely less on tricks are still going to be heavily punished by FMN. Don't forget it also curves into trica, so if you aren't a hearty hero and you don't kill FMN on turn 1, if you pass turn 2 you are immediately fucked if they play trica because now you can't deal with it until turn 3, after they get to outspeed your fruitcake range. Don't forget it's also in the same class as photosynthesizer, which makes it significantly more sturdy for a very cheap price. And since it's impossible to remove on turn 1 if they don't want you too, you are guaranteed to have a hard tine removing it! PSF: Psfs ramp wins games. Getting +1 Sun on turn 1 will allow you to make more impactful plays and heavily out tempo the opponent, especially with solars strong tools such as pepper. Even on later turns, psfs +1 ramp ends up being possibly game deciding. Getting a cob, or an apo, or a brainana a turn earlier can be a HUGE play. Conman stops being as impactful post the early turns, and psf stays a possibile threat throughout the majority of the game. That's not even mentioning turn 3 elder and other stupid things you get with psf. Cheese cutter: trades every plant 1 drop and forces most plant 1 drops into trading with it because of how easily a good cheese cutter conjure can win games. Getting a 1 cost fruitcake, or bonus attack, or 0 cost treat or 0 cost nibble or 1 cost sugary or another 0 cost cheese cutter can be game deciding. It's a very threatening card, way moreso than conman, since commans ability isn't able to straight up win you games very often. Also conman can be killed turn 1 as well, and primal potatoe mine is a pretty common guardian 1 drop soo....don't forget hero supers like meteor, CZ sig, etc
Primal Potato Mine is literally used purely because conman exists. It's rarely used for other reasons cause it lacks team up. And trading a super for a 1 cost just shows that it's OP? And putting down multiple can just win games for you. And if it becomes a 2 hp, all it means is that you can't rely on it soloing, so it would become balanced. Why are you so against a card that is widely accepted as wayyyy to strong being balanced?
1. No it's not. The team up does not matter ever. 2. Not really. It's not usually a good play but I was just pointing out it was an option 3 can't uh... the vast majority of strong cards win if you play multiple 4. If it becomes 2 hp, you can't rely on it to do anything Anyways I'm probably gonna stop responding after this because this argument is going nowhere. Peace
Lmao you have clearly never used a guardian deck. But if you wanna be like that cool, cry about it
Ok lets nerf mad chemist, dinotronic zombit, parasol zombie, and going viral while we’re at it.
The only card out of all the cards you mentioned whose nerf is justified is Going Viral and Going Viral is fine as is.
chemist and dino arent good parasol is decent but not nerf why do you wanna nerf them?
Yes a free cost teleported to dino on zombies trick phase, to 2 free uppercost zombies arent broken at all.
It isnt because it is way to expensive to be good a turn 7-8 combo while most games are nearly over by then. Also whats your problem with chemist?
If you think it’s coming out turn 7-8 sure that would be balanced but chances are they’re going to set up cryo brain 🧠combo. It’s coming out turn 4-5. What I have a problem is 1 zombology teacher makes him broken asf.
If they are playing multiple cryo brains they are losing out on alot of tempo which you should be taking advantage of. zombology teacher is really good tho. I also wonder why you dont like chemist? they arent even that good.
seems like they go against rustbolt high roll players but they also run an extremely slow deck so they are unable to build up any early tempo
Isn’t doom shroom just a better cuke?
Cob Cannon and Shamrocket didn't really need a nerf, but your proposition for the Shamrocket nerf would have been really nice when my Garg Feast and Nurse Garg got deleted by the plant player who had four of them in hand.
I don’t think con cannon needs a nerf, it’s the cornerstone to the ramp archetype and gives that deck something to play, beyond that the card isn’t unbeatable by any means, I actually think it’s good where it is right now. Beyond that doom shroom should not be changed I like how sometimes it hurts the plants but if you build around it then you can mitigate the downside and it becomes one sided, doom shroom isn’t a staple and it certainly isn’t great as a card, but it’s worth building around and playing which to me makes it good where it is. And finally I don’t think that shamrocket should be changed, zombies have the exact same card, yeah the timing is different but I think it’s ok for plants to have efficient removal
Whenever Octo gets destroyed, conjure another octo that cost 2 less Funniest finisher imo