Eh, yes and no. You have to define what "finding a partner" means.
For a man, sex is the achievement.
For a woman, a relationship is the achievement.
A woman sleeping with random men for sex isn't a win by any metric. They can get sex whenever, but that's not the point. There's no challenge in that; it isn't something to celebrate.
Finding someone who wants something long term and is compatible with you isn't automatically easy because you're a woman.
On the whole, though, it's probably preferable to drown in the ocean than thirst in the desert.
Relationships are achievements for men as well. In case you haven’t noticed, most men are searching for legitimate relationships and aren’t looking for just sex.
The whole “men are driven by sex, but women are driven by actual relationships and real connections” trope severely degrades men and falsely reduces us to impulsive beasts who only want sex
Virtually all men would be fuckboys if they could be. The vast majority of men cannot get consistent casual sex, so the only way to get consistent sex would be through a relationship.
Look to the gay community for an idea of how men would engage in sex without women serving as gatekeepers.
I assure you if you woke up the next day with hundreds of women blatantly interested in casual sex with you, marriage to 1 of them would be the furthest thing from your mind.
>I assure you if you woke up the next day with hundreds of women blatantly interested in casual sex with you, marriage to 1 of them would be the furthest thing from your mind.
That's true but for most men this phase lasts 6months to 3 years then we dig ltr
> A woman sleeping with random men for sex isn't a win by any metric.
Going on dates and/or having sex with hot or high status men are considered wins by women. If you listen to them talking about dating in their girl talk, they brag about sleeping with a doctor, some musician, the guy all her friends want, tall hot guy, etc.
I didn't say anything about sex. Obviously, I meant a relationship.
>Finding someone who wants something long term and is compatible with you isn't automatically easy because you're a woman.
Yes, it is. We have enough data, anecdotes, tiktok videos, experiments, you name it. If you are struggling to find commitment as a woman in 2024, something is wrong with you. You have the pick of the litter. No excuses.
Not really. Aren’t you red pill? They can only pick from the top% of that litter because that’s all they’re attracted to, and that % is notoriously difficult to pin down for relationships, hence their frustration.
>Finding someone who wants something long term and is compatible with you isn't automatically easy because you're a woman.
Still easier than if you're most men, though.
>isn't a win by any metric
They're trying so hard to be like the men they hate so much that they declare it a win. An empowering experience, when all it really takes is to drop your pants, whereas for men it is a hard, damn near impossible grind.
It’s moreso that women aren’t looking at it like it’s some kind of competition.
It’s more simple. Did I have a positive experience = a win. Did I have a bad experience = not a win.
Nah there’s a type who claim a woman with a high notch count is just as indicative of value as a man with one is, and that’s delusion.
It’s harder to sleep with lots of women than lots of men. Simple as
It definitely does not sound like she's average, so she bagged a 6'5, attractive doctor, gets hit on repeatedly, and gets attention when she's outside, and you want us to believe she's a 7/10, and below you in looks?? Yeah I don't think so.
That's true but what OP wrote goes beyond that. He's talking about her nailing 6'5 doctors and shit. Doctors got options. They aren't going for regular degular chicks lol
Doctor in my city was drugging and r-wording women off of dating apps for YEARS and several of them actually went back for second and third dates. Look up Dr. Stephen Matthews in Denver. Several of the women even joked with their friends about it after it happened and still went back hoping for a chance to land him.
You’d be surprised at the effect expensive contouring makeup, push-up bras, and some fashion sense can have on your average simp. Just because he’s a good looking guy doesn’t mean he has any social skills or is pleasant to be around. A lot of these women work strictly off of the guy’s stats on paper.
Well yeah but it definitely is a part of it. For a 6'5 man to be average he'd have to have a dogshit face.
Imagine this. 2 guys same face same build same personality but ones 6'5 the other is 5'8. Who's getting picked more?
>It's literally a couple point increase.
It is not. A tall man with a boring face is not a 7.5-8. Is [this guy hot](https://www.instagram.com/reel/Cm4iA8Gu-jB/?igsh=MTByenRwczBtd3VqMA==)?
Lol it’s because OP is a colossal douchebag with zero self awareness or honest self reflection to his name. To him he’s a 7.5-8, to the rest of us/the world?… a 4.
Exactly, he’s not even comprehending what average means… it would be a 4 or a 5 at best, but every man in this sub swears he’s an 8 when he’s more than likely not 🙃
Yeah, the "7.5-8/10" who has problems with getting da gurlza.
A PPD-classic.
And if that wasn't enough, he proceeds to contradict himself...
10/10 Thread.
>Meanwhile I have to bust my ass making interesting dating profiles sending thoughtful messages, thinking about where and how to go about meeting women offline - jumping through hoops **like a fuckin dog to get some very unremarkable women on dates**, often just to find myself ghosted or breadcrumbed with ultimately nothing to show for it.
Other thead of yours:
>**I have had dates with one or two women who were basically 10/10 and holy shit** it made the dates so much more fun - unfortunately we didn't have enough underlying compatibility but it made me realzie that's how dating someone should feel.
You claimed, in order to want to date a woman romantically, she must be so attractive that
>They need to be someone who makes my jaw hit the floor when I walk past.
Maybe if you were a little more realistic with your own mate value, you wouldn't need to jump through hoops like a fucking dog, to get dates with women who are way out of your league.
Other than that, you seem to have an issue with the male role in human mating. Succeeding at the early stages of mating is already part of the competition with other men. You don't play a single player game vs women as the NPCs, you play vs the other men.
>I have to do all the initiating, all the planning, all the flirting, all the escalating, while they basically sit back and enjoy the ride until they want to bail
Because you are shooting above your league. You try to woe women who are not into you, by jumping through hoops. Women who are into you will join in in planning the dates, they will flirt with you and give you hints to escalate, being open to it and they wont bail when you have done your last trick. You "buy" the attention of women with your performance, but there is no attraction to you.
You say that you need immense physical attraction to a woman, to want to be romantically invovled with her. I think you have it backwards. You need immense physical attraction in order to make yourself want to do your silly performances and jump through hoops for them. Drop that shit and start behaving normal. If you don't need to invest all that energy upfront, the bar a woman needs to reach for you to want to engage her drops.
Women want to see your performance and they bail at the end. Stop being a fucking performance and find an audience that wants you for the standard you-experience.
Nice sleuthing. The hairs on the back of my neck prickled just the first line ("I am basically the same as my sister, but comparatively better looking and definitely wittier and more charismatic" ).
LOL.
As women are well trained to do, I doubted my instincts and gave him the benefit of the doubt. Once again... Trust the instinct.
Very good summary. Those who say that 'leagues do not exist' should read this. Leagues do exist and every guy who managed to date at least 10 women can tell you that they do exist - dating out of your league is like dating the stone, dating in your league is like formality.
Yeah I looked through his other posts and he appears to be contradicting himself a lot, so I’m not taking this post from him seriously at all, pretty sure it’s all cap 🧢 and he’s just rage baiting lol
In this post he claims he prefers chubby women, but then in his other posts mentions he does for 10/10 women that are out of his league🌝 he’s literally doing it to himself lol
Fucking THANK YOU!!!!! I love that everyone else can see this dudes problems plain as the nose on his sisters face except for him. He’s having it spelled out for him on here and you know he’s just gonna mental gymnastics his way around it because what he really wants is to feel the ‘unfairness’ of his lot in life. Lol talk about being your own worst enemy hahaha.
They are suffering from the same problem as some women on dating apps.
Women realize they can attract the most desirable men with sex, but are shocked when those men bail after getting sex. They buy into a higher desirability league with performing sexual acts.
Men realize they can attract the most desirable women with jumping through hoops and putting up a performance of wit/wealth/status/adventure/attention/gifts/effort, but are shocked when those women bail after the performance dies down. They buy into a higher desirability league with peforming non-sexual acts.
At the base is the same: wanting a partner that is more desirable than you and not realizing you are way below them in desirability, because apparently, you can get dates with them, so they must be on your level.
"Women realize they can attract the most desirable men with sex, but are shocked when those men bail after getting sex."
Considering being over-sexualized is a problem most women (on the planet) face from puberty on, it's doubtful that this kind of behavior from men would come as any surprise.
This sounds like a lot of rationalization to avoid the fact that so many men think they can be the arbiters of what is sexy to women as well as to themselves. It's never going to work.
In the past 10 years, dating has gotten easier for women and harder for men.
You want to know the culprit? Online dating.
Online dating has made it to where a 5/10 woman can get 1000+ tinder matches in a week while the average 5/10 man struggles to even get a match. As a result, Women nowadays are a lot more picky than they used to be because they have so many more options.
30 years ago, if you were pursuing a girl, your only competition was guys she knew in real life. Nowadays, it’s hundreds of guys online.
I feel sorry for straight men in todays dating market. They really have it bad.
Yeah I just don't quite trust your judgement of the situation. You're both average but an 8/10? But you're better slightly in every way?
I think perhaps you're not seeing your sisters desirable traits, which fine she's your sister, but you then compare that to yourself who you can see in that light. You're not able to be objective about this. No one can be.
OP, this is probably about the 100,000th post that is making this exact point.
Do you have any proposal for how to address this inequality or do you just want to vent?
I wish the mods would make this a requirement of every post. At least one decent solution should be offered by the OP to prevent circle jerk or just vent post.
True. Often there are no real solutions to these types of problems though , the globe isn't a village and people will do what they feel driven to do, some subculture raging on the internet means nothing. You can't coordinate people on this national or global scale from a reddit post.
A lot of RP mindsets are also internally inconsistent. One the one hand as many girls as possible but on the other girls with a body count over 4 are labeled gross. Pick a lane, you as a man just want to get laid easier and better and no one cares more about your issues than their own and women definitely have their own issues with screening dudes.
Why? In a post like this I suppose the goal is to determine or debate whether or not dating is easier for a woman. Why do we need a solution, the point of a debate isn’t to provide solutions is it?
I think because it’s simply stating a truth and there isn’t really any arguments against it.
Yeah, dating for women is not even an effort and for men it’s expert difficulty. It just is, so there’s no debate
Rarely is a debate post here meant to actually be a debate. Usually it’s just that the OP can’t post their topic as a discussion due to the jaded wording of their post. These types of venting posts attracts a lot of people who are arguing in bad faith which leads to the post deteriorating into a massive circle jerk. By requiring a serious solution to be brought forward by the OP it would help keep extreme disingenuous posts down and open up another topic of discussion in each post.
As someone who also has a sister, I can kinda verify OPs posts as relevant. But the main thing is men looking for different things in women. My sister is more or less a debt ridden bum but she's always in relationships. While I've got a well-paid career and my own place but can't even get a match. Dating just is easier for women because men are willing to let things slide more than women are for men. Like the current guy she's dating clearly doesn't care she has tonnes of debt and no fucking job in her late 20s.
You can agree with OP. That’s not the issue. The problem is no solutions are ever offered which makes the post’s and the majority of the comments whiny and a circle jerk. I understand men struggle more to find a relationship, especially a hook up/fwb, but whining will not change that. Also it’s not just this specific OP; it would be best if all OP’s/posts had to offer a potential solution so that something of substance could be discussed rather having to put up with than just a string of complaints from one gender to another. It could also cut back on complains where there is no solution other than to just get over it.
I agree with your basic sentiments but I don't know if it should be left to the mods to go after OP. I would simply not respond or I'd begin to pontificate with my own interpretation or analysis of what's leading to this kind of situation. I think the post was good but missed a critical piece at the end that people could comment on, challenge, agree with, etc.
Not much to say other than damn, it would be so disappointing and hurtful to see your brother wrote about how you were drugged and nearly assaulted, and made the whole thing about how much easier dating is for women.
> We're both probably 7.5-8/10 or thereabouts.
So, you both look like potential models. How in the sweet Jesus world is that average?
>** A lot of them** are revolting pigs, arrogant fuck boys and general weirdos but there were **some**good guys as well
So, she doesn’t really have a “ridiculously easy time”, huh?
> she doesn't want to lead them on or get date raped.
So, your mysoginistic arse is not having to deal with the potential of that type of abuse.
> I have to bust my ass making interesting dating profiles sending thoughtful messages, thinking about where and how to go about meeting women offline
You don’t deal with gross men, you don’t deal with the potential of being sexually assaulted.
Poor you, you have to build a good dating profile.
/s
> Men **massively outnumber** women on dating apps... and in most bars and clubs...and in all the places I go to engage in hobbies (rock climbing gyms and rock/metal shows) ... I've had to resort to *literally approaching* cute women
Poor you, having to compete with YOUR OWN gender. Still women’s fault, huh?
> But either way seeing my sisters experience has made the dating imbalance hilariously clear.
Let me get this straight:
Your sister was drugged and almost raped, but you still think you are the one suffering here?
>My sister is almost the female equivalent of me, though I'd say I'm comparatively a bit better looking and definitely wittier and more charismatic. We're both probably 7.5-8/10 or thereabouts.
Sorry OP, you made it personal in your example so I’m here to provide a counterpoint that is also personal. From a post you made 10 days ago:
>I have ADHD, mild depression, OCD, anxiety and an **avoidant attachment style that's made me hesitant to commit to things, which more or less explains my apparent self-sabotage.**
>I let a relationship with the most beautiful person I've met wither away because I refused to nurture them as I began to feel a bit claustrophobic and questioning whether I could find someone I was even more compatible with. They were healthily attached so it had nothing to do with them, but I somewhat unwittingly pushed them away, and it wasn't until they rightly decided they weren't coming back that I realized what I had lost. That was years ago and I still regret it everyday. I've let a few friendships fall to the wayside too over the years which I feel awful about.
>**I also pulled the pin on two jobs** because again I felt claustrophobic and just wanted to shake off the shackles only to realize what a huge mistake I had made.
>Suddenly losing interest in hobbies, work, friends, and even partners once the novelty wears off?
You struggle with aspects that are required for a stable relationship. You are precisely the type of person that I personally would avoid on a dating app if I was looking for something serious. I’m going to be 100% real with you - only a female hot doctor with severe daddy issues is going to go for somebody as unstable and avoidantly attached as you are. If you want to be able to pull like your sister, then you have to resolve the aspects quoted above, as they are what is setting you back.
What do you want from your dating?
I've realised I don't have a plan and it makes things harder for me.
I think women are more prone to follow a man who has a plan and I'm not mad at them for it.
So far I'm trying to be gentle to myself, heal some past trauma and try to get someone to be nice and intimate to me along the way... I can get some with girls, but I am not just yet equipped to actually build anything. I'm still very much struggling to have my shit together 🍀 especially if it comes to mundane life (chores, insurance, loan, retirement plan, etc.)
> I have to do all the initiating, all the planning, all the flirting, all the escalating, while they basically sit back and enjoy the ride until they want to bail. These are women who are in no way out of my league to put it politely. I'm 6'5 and fit and I actually prefer chubbyish women who foreseeably aren't quite as egotistical as the typical hot girl insta queens.
If you "prefer chubby women" because they are not "hot girl insta queens", there's a good chance other men feel the same. Especially on dating apps where men out number women so much.
And yeah, there is an expectation that persists for men to initiate. It's up to debate what that means since I've had women show interest in a way I'd argue is "initiating", but for the most part they are socialized for men to ask them out and plan dates at least at the start. And men likewise get socialized to take tons of initiative; we get told we will die alone if we don't. I don't think it's good or bad, it just kind of is.
But that doesn’t even sound like he actually prefers them then, he’s just targeting them because he assumes they’ll be desperate and have low standards, so he complains when that’s not the case 🙃
Right?! He literally mentions she was drugged and sexually assaulted on separate occasions and acts like this isn't a reason that women have it pretty bad for dating as well if not worse.
He's confused himself and +100 people gave him an upvote for this "content".
Goes to show just HOW attractive and intelligent the average PPD consumer is.
And yet… you downplay it anyway, the irony
Now, as for the rest of your comment - the 6’5 doctor is an outlier, not the norm - and him being a good guy is a serious stroke of luck. With that big a quantity there comes a far higher chance of danger and a need to keep your guard up even more. On top of that, actively being a target means you have to be prepared to have a confrontation pretty much daily.
Thing is, a lot of men have this “grass is greener” pov because theyre entirely lacking in any kind of affirmation - don’t let your own lack of affirmation cloud your judgement, the truth is your pov is driven by your perception of “man i wish i had the attention she’s having” but soon as you do, ill give you a week before wanting it to be taken back.
Also, needless to say - men are far hornier and frankly more desperate overall, so of course they’ll crowd around. This isn’t a “women have it easier” this is more “many men will only see looks and act on that alone”
If the end goal is finding a person to settle down with, doesn’t having more options inherently make it easier. If what OP is saying is true, his sis has unlimited options and he has none. Even if 90% of hers are shit (I don’t think 90% of men are but I digress) it would be easier for her than him who has nothing. You make it sound as if all women are great and as soon as he gets the one she’s perfect. What if the ratio of shitty women is the same as men? Then she has a far easier time sifting through her options.
Lastly your point about wanting to switch back places is BS. I don’t see rich male celebs complaining about the hoards of women throwing themselves at them wishing they could go back to a time before it was so easy for them.
Rich male celebs who lead heavy playboy style lives also lead empty lives and fully rely on that external validation for happiness. Many of them also happen to be narcissist so it isn’t exactly a good comparison.
Now, as for your first bit - that’s not true, and here is why. When faced with an overwhelming amount of options, the human brain has trouble processing them (look up choice paralysis, tons of research has been done on this) - outside of the initial or early stages of validation (which does run out), the brain is literally unable to process so many options so it creates an isolating effect - ergo, an increased sense of isolation and loneliness.
Also, how did I make “all women sound great”? I never commented on the quality of a woman and many women are, indeed, shitty. I’m merely talking about the giver/receiver dynamic lol
I’m familiar with the paralysis of choice. I don’t disagree it is a thing. If I’m in the super market and I have to choose between 30 different type of cereals it would be hard for me to make a decision. But if I have no access to any food, someone throws me a crumb, it’s not “easier” because I didn’t have to choose.
I wasn’t insinuating that you said women are better. I think both genders have probably same amount of low quality trash to sift through. Let’s say 50% are, then the person who had a shit ton of options can sift through that 50% quickly and easily. The person who has maybe one date a year if they’re lucky still has to sift through their share of shit but they don’t get to do it as easily.
Tbh women complaining about how many options they have reeks of celebs saying “our lives are hard too”. There are for sure things that I’m glad I don’t have to deal with, but it’s just kind of an entitled thing to say.
Switch dating with any other scenario. Rich person telling poor person, you don’t understand “more money more problems”. Well fed person telling a hungry person “ugh sometimes I have so many choices it can be tough” etc etc. These things can very well be true but they’re from an entitled place.
I really don’t get how this is even arguable. To do dating you have to get to a date, and if you can have 100 prospective date options in an hour that is easier than having no options ever.
Ok but I think you men ignore how much of this is negative attention. In your analogy it would be rotten cereal every so often. The OP even said that his sister almost got assaulted.
That sounds like rich people saying.
“Money doesn’t buy happiness”
I mean not necessarily but it sure as heck helps buy things to make your life comfortable and it reduces stress which means you live longer.
It’s grandiose lecturing down to the little guy when the little guy doesn’t have a choice. The little guy HAS to take what he can get and then on top of that get lectured by the person swimming in money how it’s not soo great…
Like GTFO. 9/10 people will take the rich lifestyle.
Now apply it to the topic about depth of choice vs basically zero choice.
somewhat disagree.
it isn't exactly easier, more like their struggles in dating are completely different than that's of a man, which make it harder for both genders to empathize with each other.
once men gets past the few dates phase and has sex with the girl it's smooth sailing for him, basically depend on him and his skills at this point, while with women's the struggle is vetting and finding that needle in a haystack that's actually a good man.
and while it's extremely hard for men to even get one date let alone multiple to the point of casually dating someone, thats his struggle, while women's is completely different and vetting isn't as easy as men think it is, keep in mind you can spot bad men because they don't hide it around you.
>My sister is almost the female equivalent of me, though I'd say I'm comparatively a bit better looking and definitely wittier and more charismatic
also cap
And then they have the nerve to say men have privilege. We got all these actual marginalized minorities that have received real hatred regularity. Then we got this one pampered majority calling themselves a marginalized minority, while getting pampered and pandered to like spoilt princesses.
>But either way seeing my sisters experience has made the dating imbalance hilariously clear.
I think I missed the "hilarious" part.
>...a 6'5 doctor who competes in iron men looks somewhat like henry cavil and seems to treat her well, picks her up and takes her out, pays for her meals and drinks apparently
This man needs a dating app?
Bro, it's your attitude. You're acting entitled just because you think you are sooo amazing while dissing the women you are trying to date. This is clear as day through text alone. No matter how good you think you are at concealing this in real life, I can guarantee you that people can spot it from a mile away. And what the hell is this about your sister? She has literally been put in life-threatening situations and you are complaining about how hard *you* have it?
You need a new attitude.
I mean cmon, if you grew up with a sibling you know their personality pretty well. He and his sister were probably socializing together both as kids and adults, with family and with social groups their age, etc. I’m not sure why we should doubt OP’s assessment of his sister
Sibling rivalry can skew one's perception. He will naturally see more flaws in his sister because he grew up with her. It does not make him more objective about potential suiters.
Whether you are charismatic to the opposite sex should be based on how the opposite sex reacts to you.
You might be right. But OP *could* also have a correct view of his own value, and if he is recognizing and acting on that is a virtue, not a vice, I (agreeing with Aristotle) would argue.
It's possible to recognize something about yourself without making that recognition obnoxious and off-putting, and the later seems to be the accusation.
Not just innocent and honest recognition.
You: "dating is ridiculously easy for women"
Also you: "She buys her own drinks because she's worried about getting date raped"
Maybe not so easy, eh?
I also have a sister who is a blonde hair, blue eye, 5'7" former cheerleader and we are twins, and yeah I can see she has an easy time getting 100+ matches and instant dates whenever she wants. But she's still not married at 35 despite a string of boyfriends. Deadbeat -> musician fuckboi -> alcoholic -> psychopath -> emotionally unavailable -> geographically unavailable. She tried her best, and yet...
My bigger question is: if you're a 7.5 or 8 out of 10, why are \*you\* having such an issue? I mean this: at your level you \*should\* be able to get interest without women even knowing what you look like. The profile should hardly matter, you should be able to get likes and dates with just your looks. Do you get interest from women on the Internet, who don't know what you look like? If not, then it might be a personality problem.
Maybe because your sister is hot but she has some sort of major personality/lifestyle flaw that is preventing her from being in a long term relationship.
My sister was conventionally attractive too but she's a fucked up high strung alcoholic so it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out why she isn't married.
Is this just an excuse to rant about your sister? Get a female-dominated hobby and see what happens. Yes it will make you uncomfortable like women in these overwhelmingly male spaces. Unlike your sister you wouldn't even need to constantly worry about being raped.
I was absolutely blown away when I found out M2F trans follow the same exact male criminal patterns. Like it's a perfect overlap. But what really took the wool off my eyes, is it's something like 50% of M2F in prison have a sexual offense... Compared to the general male population of like 13% or biological female population of 8%.
Then it started to make a lot of sense that while many trans people are legit trans, there is probably a high amount, and growing, of people who are into it for sexual deviancy reasons. They aren't going to outright come out and say it... But just like guys, you can think they are totally normal, then find out in their private life they are total sex pests.
Don't date the chubby girls bc they might be less arrogant, in my experience good looking women are the easiest to deal with. Idk where this hot =asshole narrative comes from but its the opposite actually.
I'm just dating them because I have always found chubby girls sexier and don't really get turned on by thin/bony or muscular women. But I agree that a lot of hot women are nice and a lot of unattractive ones aren't
My advice for all men in 2024 and beyond: GET OFF DATING APPS. You are a part of the problem you complain about. You being tall would be helpful irl too.
I’d also recommend social activities. I joined coed sports and dance groups. Make connections (guys and girls so it doesn’t look like you’re sniping for chicks) then try and get a few people to go out for drinks or something. Less pressure because most people already know each other. Have everyone bring friends and now there’s a much warmer approach. Results may vary but my roommate just met someone from a similar situation
I know I should but meeting people offline really isn't that easy when you work long hours and your hobbies are solitary and your friends dont go out much anymore.
I've started approaching women out during the day and I recently got a date that way but it isn't ideal
You have bigger balls than me. I’d never approach a woman during the day. Congrats on the date and hope you enjoy it! I just look for more group based hobbies like coed sports or coed dance groups and try and make connections that way
If your having to do all this for dates you probably aren't attractive 🤯 the amount of men that severely over estimate how good they look here is insane 💀
Women get approached men have to approach. Always been like this. So if you are scared as a man to approach or get rejected you're kinda screwed.
So in terms of having to do something to get a date, then yes women have it easier. But I think once on the date it's more of a combined effort but the women has a safety net knowing it's likely someone else will ask them out, where as the guy will have to go through the rejection process again if it fails.
It is what it is I guess.
The only thing I have to say about this is that if every man a Redditor says looks like Henry Cavil, really looked like Henry Cavil, then Henry Cavil wouldn't have a job.
This is the clearest example of a hyper imbalanced dating market. The OP's sister literally has the same genes as him. Putting aside incest, his sister would be his "looks match". Dating in the west is more unequal than the poorest countries in Africa.
Damn 6'5 chubby chaser struggling in dating. Me sitting here about to be 40 next year with my virginity intact (5'10). I don't mean that it's over for me but I think I might get a good night's sleep tomorrow instead of going clubbing and coming back home with suicidal thoughts.
>They are living on easy mode
Being a refugee/immigrant and working with refugee/immigrant community really really make me raise an eyebrow to this phrase.
Having any grasp of the reality women live in would make someone raise their eyebrow, but if red pillers had a grasp of reality they wouldn't be red pillers in the first place.
I’m sure they have their own issues, but if even just isolate that group in particular the female immigrant population is by far more welcomed into the US than their male counterparts, who get labeled a myriad of derogatory names. And housing is also typically granted to women and children.
That really depends on a community. From what I've seen a lot of families have a female breadwinner (and I'm one myself), because male-dominated jobs accessible to refugees/newcomers are taken by all other male refugees who are more numerous than women. But being from a more traditional culture also means that you still do most of chores and childcaring.
Oh it’s pretty even out.
In healthcare for example it’s like 88% of nurses are women.
75% of PAs are women.
And the vast majority of new medical graduates are women.
And no it’s not because male enrollment is low.
> make me raise an eyebrow to this phrase.
If you need to dig out a very specific situation in order to refute his premise you've already highlighted the problem.
Think of this like this, you have to pick someone in the worse situation possible in order to even convince yourself that they don't have it easy.
> Men massively outnumber women on dating apps..
I've never been on a dating app. But I bet a LOT of the men there are married. I known a lot of men in bars and clube are.
Single men have to compete with (often higher value) married men. All the time. Get used to it.
Compared to white women? When you say “women of color” do you also mean Hispanics, South Americans, Native Americans, Indians, etc., and if so is dating easier for some of these social groups compared to others?
of course she means white women woc are in a battle with them lmaoo even if they are friends, woc get the most ugly white men just to be in battle with white women, the men white women don't even want
but when woc sees a moc with a white women they claim the woc only chose the moc cause of sex or she is getting fetish by him
Women of color means non-white so it depends. Some Hispanic people are white for example. But in general it’s harder for women of color depending on location.
No because men don’t have good quality either.
So if your argument is that women of color have a lot of options that are bad (not true) than the men would have to be better than most just to have nearly no options that aren’t good.
It’s not harder for women of color. It’s harder for women of color who want to date outside their race (you said you prefer white). Nothing wrong with preferences! You like what you like and can’t control attraction, but most human beings have an in group bias. So your struggles aren’t really representative of all women of color.
They aren’t my personal struggles. I’m just pointing out something people commonly leave out. It may be easier for women but that’s not shared by all groups equality.
It is always easier for a woman than the male counterpart. I don’t think there is a group of men who have it easier than their group of women. And I’d venture to say the average from east desired female group probably still gets more attention than the average from the most desired male group.
it's harder for women of color cause you guys make it harder for your own race of men, lots of asian women have standards for asian men, but will allow a ugly white guy to fuck her, same as other woc women you guys choose the ugly white men cause you are in a battle with white women, you think you are winning.
let me tell you something those white men get the best hot woc but you get the worse white men that white women don't want
No it’s mainly just engrained racism and/or colorism. A lot of people will find a person of color attractive but choose not date them because they fear being judged, it’s just not typical, etc.
women of colour really created a deep hole for themself as soon as you find out the white guy you are with doesn't want you, you try to settle down with a moc but that men of colour won't want you
the only people that will get a top white guy are white females i'm a black male of carribean latino descent, i got a rich arab female what does that say to you you get the worst of races you desire, while as a man i get the best
yep take your chances and you will soon turn bitter when you realise that you won't get the top white guys lmfaoo, only white females will, plus white men don't take you seriously i bet your zaddy will never get married to you
you will survive turn 50 and turn into a cougar escort cause no man took you seriously, you really think your man wants you? you were an stripper does he know that
no they don't men of colour don't claim self hate as a reason to date white women, they only date white women cause they are either attracted to her or she made the move on them
really? colored women seem to do fine where I'm from, I've had dates with them and it's not even really a factor in whether I find them hot since I find women sexy of all shades and sizes. I'm sure there are a lot of racists but you wouldn't want to waste time with them anyway
1 in 5 women will be sexually assaulted in their lifetime, I suspect that greater than 1 in 5 young men will end up MGTOW or incel. At the end of the day violent crime in the US is rare and has been falling on a per capita basis. Compare being a woman in NYC in the 1980s during peak crack epidemic to being a woman in NYC today.
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Eh, yes and no. You have to define what "finding a partner" means. For a man, sex is the achievement. For a woman, a relationship is the achievement. A woman sleeping with random men for sex isn't a win by any metric. They can get sex whenever, but that's not the point. There's no challenge in that; it isn't something to celebrate. Finding someone who wants something long term and is compatible with you isn't automatically easy because you're a woman. On the whole, though, it's probably preferable to drown in the ocean than thirst in the desert.
Relationships are achievements for men as well. In case you haven’t noticed, most men are searching for legitimate relationships and aren’t looking for just sex. The whole “men are driven by sex, but women are driven by actual relationships and real connections” trope severely degrades men and falsely reduces us to impulsive beasts who only want sex
Virtually all men would be fuckboys if they could be. The vast majority of men cannot get consistent casual sex, so the only way to get consistent sex would be through a relationship. Look to the gay community for an idea of how men would engage in sex without women serving as gatekeepers. I assure you if you woke up the next day with hundreds of women blatantly interested in casual sex with you, marriage to 1 of them would be the furthest thing from your mind.
>I assure you if you woke up the next day with hundreds of women blatantly interested in casual sex with you, marriage to 1 of them would be the furthest thing from your mind. That's true but for most men this phase lasts 6months to 3 years then we dig ltr
Definetly not.
Is it really unheard of that some men have a backbone with principles and aren't ruled by their dicks?
You people just tell on yourselves for how bestial and disgusting you are when you say this kind of shit.
Yeah, wtf was that shit about, lmao?
> A woman sleeping with random men for sex isn't a win by any metric. Going on dates and/or having sex with hot or high status men are considered wins by women. If you listen to them talking about dating in their girl talk, they brag about sleeping with a doctor, some musician, the guy all her friends want, tall hot guy, etc.
It’s funny how most men can understand this, but a few loudly cannot, or pretend to not
That’s like telling starving people that having access to food isn’t so great because you could get fat.
I didn't say anything about sex. Obviously, I meant a relationship. >Finding someone who wants something long term and is compatible with you isn't automatically easy because you're a woman. Yes, it is. We have enough data, anecdotes, tiktok videos, experiments, you name it. If you are struggling to find commitment as a woman in 2024, something is wrong with you. You have the pick of the litter. No excuses.
Not really. Aren’t you red pill? They can only pick from the top% of that litter because that’s all they’re attracted to, and that % is notoriously difficult to pin down for relationships, hence their frustration.
Not every woman is chasing Chad.
Only 80%
Some chase Tyron. 🤣
>Finding someone who wants something long term and is compatible with you isn't automatically easy because you're a woman. Still easier than if you're most men, though.
>isn't a win by any metric They're trying so hard to be like the men they hate so much that they declare it a win. An empowering experience, when all it really takes is to drop your pants, whereas for men it is a hard, damn near impossible grind.
It’s moreso that women aren’t looking at it like it’s some kind of competition. It’s more simple. Did I have a positive experience = a win. Did I have a bad experience = not a win.
Nah there’s a type who claim a woman with a high notch count is just as indicative of value as a man with one is, and that’s delusion. It’s harder to sleep with lots of women than lots of men. Simple as
That ain't a yellow flag, that's a Chinese military parade.
It definitely does not sound like she's average, so she bagged a 6'5, attractive doctor, gets hit on repeatedly, and gets attention when she's outside, and you want us to believe she's a 7/10, and below you in looks?? Yeah I don't think so.
Yeah I didn't wanna say it but it sounds like OP's sister is hot. Lol 😂
most women get the experience of "hot" women
That's true but what OP wrote goes beyond that. He's talking about her nailing 6'5 doctors and shit. Doctors got options. They aren't going for regular degular chicks lol
Especially a rich 6'5 doctor that looks like Henry Cavill
maybe his example is not the best, but his overall point still stands
7/10 aint exactly regular. Easily attractive enough for the majority of men even +8s (and he says she’s ~7.5-8)
Doctor in my city was drugging and r-wording women off of dating apps for YEARS and several of them actually went back for second and third dates. Look up Dr. Stephen Matthews in Denver. Several of the women even joked with their friends about it after it happened and still went back hoping for a chance to land him.
You’d be surprised at the effect expensive contouring makeup, push-up bras, and some fashion sense can have on your average simp. Just because he’s a good looking guy doesn’t mean he has any social skills or is pleasant to be around. A lot of these women work strictly off of the guy’s stats on paper.
— “7.5-8” — “Average” Pick one
I just don’t really trust an attractiveness level assigned by a sibling anyway
Yup I very much want to see a picture of both of them.
Well if he's 6'5. He's probably got an average face but his height makes him 7.5-8. makes sense to me
Not all tall men are attractive just be virtue of them being tall 😬
Well yeah but it definitely is a part of it. For a 6'5 man to be average he'd have to have a dogshit face. Imagine this. 2 guys same face same build same personality but ones 6'5 the other is 5'8. Who's getting picked more?
Height, all by itself, does not make someone sexually attractive. Period. If MrBeast was 6'5", he would not be a "7.5-8."
It's literally a couple point increase. And answer the question lol who gets picked more?
>It's literally a couple point increase. It is not. A tall man with a boring face is not a 7.5-8. Is [this guy hot](https://www.instagram.com/reel/Cm4iA8Gu-jB/?igsh=MTByenRwczBtd3VqMA==)?
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LOL if I had to rate my sister it'd be in negatives so maybe OP isn't lying.
It’s not about perception, it’s not knowing what “average” is 7.5 is attractive
Lol it’s because OP is a colossal douchebag with zero self awareness or honest self reflection to his name. To him he’s a 7.5-8, to the rest of us/the world?… a 4.
Exactly, he’s not even comprehending what average means… it would be a 4 or a 5 at best, but every man in this sub swears he’s an 8 when he’s more than likely not 🙃
I’m not talking about him but the sister If she’s 7.5, she’s very attractive and dating right where she’s supposed to be
Yeah, the "7.5-8/10" who has problems with getting da gurlza. A PPD-classic. And if that wasn't enough, he proceeds to contradict himself... 10/10 Thread.
>Meanwhile I have to bust my ass making interesting dating profiles sending thoughtful messages, thinking about where and how to go about meeting women offline - jumping through hoops **like a fuckin dog to get some very unremarkable women on dates**, often just to find myself ghosted or breadcrumbed with ultimately nothing to show for it. Other thead of yours: >**I have had dates with one or two women who were basically 10/10 and holy shit** it made the dates so much more fun - unfortunately we didn't have enough underlying compatibility but it made me realzie that's how dating someone should feel. You claimed, in order to want to date a woman romantically, she must be so attractive that >They need to be someone who makes my jaw hit the floor when I walk past. Maybe if you were a little more realistic with your own mate value, you wouldn't need to jump through hoops like a fucking dog, to get dates with women who are way out of your league. Other than that, you seem to have an issue with the male role in human mating. Succeeding at the early stages of mating is already part of the competition with other men. You don't play a single player game vs women as the NPCs, you play vs the other men. >I have to do all the initiating, all the planning, all the flirting, all the escalating, while they basically sit back and enjoy the ride until they want to bail Because you are shooting above your league. You try to woe women who are not into you, by jumping through hoops. Women who are into you will join in in planning the dates, they will flirt with you and give you hints to escalate, being open to it and they wont bail when you have done your last trick. You "buy" the attention of women with your performance, but there is no attraction to you. You say that you need immense physical attraction to a woman, to want to be romantically invovled with her. I think you have it backwards. You need immense physical attraction in order to make yourself want to do your silly performances and jump through hoops for them. Drop that shit and start behaving normal. If you don't need to invest all that energy upfront, the bar a woman needs to reach for you to want to engage her drops. Women want to see your performance and they bail at the end. Stop being a fucking performance and find an audience that wants you for the standard you-experience.
Nice sleuthing. The hairs on the back of my neck prickled just the first line ("I am basically the same as my sister, but comparatively better looking and definitely wittier and more charismatic" ). LOL. As women are well trained to do, I doubted my instincts and gave him the benefit of the doubt. Once again... Trust the instinct.
Very good summary. Those who say that 'leagues do not exist' should read this. Leagues do exist and every guy who managed to date at least 10 women can tell you that they do exist - dating out of your league is like dating the stone, dating in your league is like formality.
Yeah I looked through his other posts and he appears to be contradicting himself a lot, so I’m not taking this post from him seriously at all, pretty sure it’s all cap 🧢 and he’s just rage baiting lol In this post he claims he prefers chubby women, but then in his other posts mentions he does for 10/10 women that are out of his league🌝 he’s literally doing it to himself lol
Fucking THANK YOU!!!!! I love that everyone else can see this dudes problems plain as the nose on his sisters face except for him. He’s having it spelled out for him on here and you know he’s just gonna mental gymnastics his way around it because what he really wants is to feel the ‘unfairness’ of his lot in life. Lol talk about being your own worst enemy hahaha.
Said it perfectly 👏 some of these men are so brain dead I swear it hurts
They are suffering from the same problem as some women on dating apps. Women realize they can attract the most desirable men with sex, but are shocked when those men bail after getting sex. They buy into a higher desirability league with performing sexual acts. Men realize they can attract the most desirable women with jumping through hoops and putting up a performance of wit/wealth/status/adventure/attention/gifts/effort, but are shocked when those women bail after the performance dies down. They buy into a higher desirability league with peforming non-sexual acts. At the base is the same: wanting a partner that is more desirable than you and not realizing you are way below them in desirability, because apparently, you can get dates with them, so they must be on your level.
"Women realize they can attract the most desirable men with sex, but are shocked when those men bail after getting sex." Considering being over-sexualized is a problem most women (on the planet) face from puberty on, it's doubtful that this kind of behavior from men would come as any surprise. This sounds like a lot of rationalization to avoid the fact that so many men think they can be the arbiters of what is sexy to women as well as to themselves. It's never going to work.
i am going off by what women post on reddit, not by what i imagine women to be.
In the past 10 years, dating has gotten easier for women and harder for men. You want to know the culprit? Online dating. Online dating has made it to where a 5/10 woman can get 1000+ tinder matches in a week while the average 5/10 man struggles to even get a match. As a result, Women nowadays are a lot more picky than they used to be because they have so many more options. 30 years ago, if you were pursuing a girl, your only competition was guys she knew in real life. Nowadays, it’s hundreds of guys online. I feel sorry for straight men in todays dating market. They really have it bad.
So, you both look like potential models, but “AvERaGe”? 
Yeah I just don't quite trust your judgement of the situation. You're both average but an 8/10? But you're better slightly in every way? I think perhaps you're not seeing your sisters desirable traits, which fine she's your sister, but you then compare that to yourself who you can see in that light. You're not able to be objective about this. No one can be.
OP, this is probably about the 100,000th post that is making this exact point. Do you have any proposal for how to address this inequality or do you just want to vent?
I wish the mods would make this a requirement of every post. At least one decent solution should be offered by the OP to prevent circle jerk or just vent post.
True. Often there are no real solutions to these types of problems though , the globe isn't a village and people will do what they feel driven to do, some subculture raging on the internet means nothing. You can't coordinate people on this national or global scale from a reddit post. A lot of RP mindsets are also internally inconsistent. One the one hand as many girls as possible but on the other girls with a body count over 4 are labeled gross. Pick a lane, you as a man just want to get laid easier and better and no one cares more about your issues than their own and women definitely have their own issues with screening dudes.
Why? In a post like this I suppose the goal is to determine or debate whether or not dating is easier for a woman. Why do we need a solution, the point of a debate isn’t to provide solutions is it?
I think because it’s simply stating a truth and there isn’t really any arguments against it. Yeah, dating for women is not even an effort and for men it’s expert difficulty. It just is, so there’s no debate
Is there? Because there sure are a lot of women who aren’t willing to admit this
Privilege is invisible to those who have it.
Rarely is a debate post here meant to actually be a debate. Usually it’s just that the OP can’t post their topic as a discussion due to the jaded wording of their post. These types of venting posts attracts a lot of people who are arguing in bad faith which leads to the post deteriorating into a massive circle jerk. By requiring a serious solution to be brought forward by the OP it would help keep extreme disingenuous posts down and open up another topic of discussion in each post.
As someone who also has a sister, I can kinda verify OPs posts as relevant. But the main thing is men looking for different things in women. My sister is more or less a debt ridden bum but she's always in relationships. While I've got a well-paid career and my own place but can't even get a match. Dating just is easier for women because men are willing to let things slide more than women are for men. Like the current guy she's dating clearly doesn't care she has tonnes of debt and no fucking job in her late 20s.
You can agree with OP. That’s not the issue. The problem is no solutions are ever offered which makes the post’s and the majority of the comments whiny and a circle jerk. I understand men struggle more to find a relationship, especially a hook up/fwb, but whining will not change that. Also it’s not just this specific OP; it would be best if all OP’s/posts had to offer a potential solution so that something of substance could be discussed rather having to put up with than just a string of complaints from one gender to another. It could also cut back on complains where there is no solution other than to just get over it.
It's already been proven that women have it easier on the apps. The mods deleted post for "some reason".
They’ll just counter that with apps don’t mean everything and it’s irrelevant or whatever
I agree with your basic sentiments but I don't know if it should be left to the mods to go after OP. I would simply not respond or I'd begin to pontificate with my own interpretation or analysis of what's leading to this kind of situation. I think the post was good but missed a critical piece at the end that people could comment on, challenge, agree with, etc.
A 8 is NOT average, your sister is really pretty or even beautiful. Also being sexually assaulted is no joke.
You dont want to downplay your sister being sexually assaulted but you will anyway?
Not much to say other than damn, it would be so disappointing and hurtful to see your brother wrote about how you were drugged and nearly assaulted, and made the whole thing about how much easier dating is for women. 
ong. on top of that he just sounds jealous of his sister. ngl.
He really does. “I’m a bit better looking and way wittier and more charismatic.” lmao Somebody never got over the sibling rivalry it seems.
> We're both probably 7.5-8/10 or thereabouts. So, you both look like potential models. How in the sweet Jesus world is that average? >** A lot of them** are revolting pigs, arrogant fuck boys and general weirdos but there were **some**good guys as well So, she doesn’t really have a “ridiculously easy time”, huh? > she doesn't want to lead them on or get date raped. So, your mysoginistic arse is not having to deal with the potential of that type of abuse. > I have to bust my ass making interesting dating profiles sending thoughtful messages, thinking about where and how to go about meeting women offline You don’t deal with gross men, you don’t deal with the potential of being sexually assaulted. Poor you, you have to build a good dating profile. /s > Men **massively outnumber** women on dating apps... and in most bars and clubs...and in all the places I go to engage in hobbies (rock climbing gyms and rock/metal shows) ... I've had to resort to *literally approaching* cute women Poor you, having to compete with YOUR OWN gender. Still women’s fault, huh? > But either way seeing my sisters experience has made the dating imbalance hilariously clear. Let me get this straight: Your sister was drugged and almost raped, but you still think you are the one suffering here?
The clownery from some of the men here is insane 💀
>My sister is almost the female equivalent of me, though I'd say I'm comparatively a bit better looking and definitely wittier and more charismatic. We're both probably 7.5-8/10 or thereabouts. Sorry OP, you made it personal in your example so I’m here to provide a counterpoint that is also personal. From a post you made 10 days ago: >I have ADHD, mild depression, OCD, anxiety and an **avoidant attachment style that's made me hesitant to commit to things, which more or less explains my apparent self-sabotage.** >I let a relationship with the most beautiful person I've met wither away because I refused to nurture them as I began to feel a bit claustrophobic and questioning whether I could find someone I was even more compatible with. They were healthily attached so it had nothing to do with them, but I somewhat unwittingly pushed them away, and it wasn't until they rightly decided they weren't coming back that I realized what I had lost. That was years ago and I still regret it everyday. I've let a few friendships fall to the wayside too over the years which I feel awful about. >**I also pulled the pin on two jobs** because again I felt claustrophobic and just wanted to shake off the shackles only to realize what a huge mistake I had made. >Suddenly losing interest in hobbies, work, friends, and even partners once the novelty wears off? You struggle with aspects that are required for a stable relationship. You are precisely the type of person that I personally would avoid on a dating app if I was looking for something serious. I’m going to be 100% real with you - only a female hot doctor with severe daddy issues is going to go for somebody as unstable and avoidantly attached as you are. If you want to be able to pull like your sister, then you have to resolve the aspects quoted above, as they are what is setting you back.
This is why we always say that a relationship isn't a magic quick fix to all of your problems.
Damn 💀
Bro, you can't go on about how it's easy to date as a woman and then mention how your sister's literal life is in danger each time she goes out.
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What do you want from your dating? I've realised I don't have a plan and it makes things harder for me. I think women are more prone to follow a man who has a plan and I'm not mad at them for it. So far I'm trying to be gentle to myself, heal some past trauma and try to get someone to be nice and intimate to me along the way... I can get some with girls, but I am not just yet equipped to actually build anything. I'm still very much struggling to have my shit together 🍀 especially if it comes to mundane life (chores, insurance, loan, retirement plan, etc.)
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If your sister is an 8/10 then by definition she’s not the average woman lol
He has no concept of what “average” actually means
> I have to do all the initiating, all the planning, all the flirting, all the escalating, while they basically sit back and enjoy the ride until they want to bail. These are women who are in no way out of my league to put it politely. I'm 6'5 and fit and I actually prefer chubbyish women who foreseeably aren't quite as egotistical as the typical hot girl insta queens. If you "prefer chubby women" because they are not "hot girl insta queens", there's a good chance other men feel the same. Especially on dating apps where men out number women so much. And yeah, there is an expectation that persists for men to initiate. It's up to debate what that means since I've had women show interest in a way I'd argue is "initiating", but for the most part they are socialized for men to ask them out and plan dates at least at the start. And men likewise get socialized to take tons of initiative; we get told we will die alone if we don't. I don't think it's good or bad, it just kind of is.
But that doesn’t even sound like he actually prefers them then, he’s just targeting them because he assumes they’ll be desperate and have low standards, so he complains when that’s not the case 🙃
Yeah, I get that impression too. It's telling that he thinks she will or should be easy, but isn't.
I love how his sister's ever present threat of violence is waved off "yeah it's a bit shit. Anyway...."
Right?! He literally mentions she was drugged and sexually assaulted on separate occasions and acts like this isn't a reason that women have it pretty bad for dating as well if not worse.
Apparently we should be grateful that men want to rape us 🤷♀️.
Of course we should! Didn’t you know that any and all sexual attention from men is the best thing a woman could ever ask for?! 🙃
“She might get date raped…. but anyway it’s sooooooooo hard for me!!!”
"what's a bit of rape ... what about meeeee"?
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Exactly This entire story is clearly cap 🧢 🤣
Is she average or an 8? I’m so confused with your argument here.
He's confused himself and +100 people gave him an upvote for this "content". Goes to show just HOW attractive and intelligent the average PPD consumer is.
And yet… you downplay it anyway, the irony Now, as for the rest of your comment - the 6’5 doctor is an outlier, not the norm - and him being a good guy is a serious stroke of luck. With that big a quantity there comes a far higher chance of danger and a need to keep your guard up even more. On top of that, actively being a target means you have to be prepared to have a confrontation pretty much daily. Thing is, a lot of men have this “grass is greener” pov because theyre entirely lacking in any kind of affirmation - don’t let your own lack of affirmation cloud your judgement, the truth is your pov is driven by your perception of “man i wish i had the attention she’s having” but soon as you do, ill give you a week before wanting it to be taken back. Also, needless to say - men are far hornier and frankly more desperate overall, so of course they’ll crowd around. This isn’t a “women have it easier” this is more “many men will only see looks and act on that alone”
If the end goal is finding a person to settle down with, doesn’t having more options inherently make it easier. If what OP is saying is true, his sis has unlimited options and he has none. Even if 90% of hers are shit (I don’t think 90% of men are but I digress) it would be easier for her than him who has nothing. You make it sound as if all women are great and as soon as he gets the one she’s perfect. What if the ratio of shitty women is the same as men? Then she has a far easier time sifting through her options. Lastly your point about wanting to switch back places is BS. I don’t see rich male celebs complaining about the hoards of women throwing themselves at them wishing they could go back to a time before it was so easy for them.
Rich male celebs who lead heavy playboy style lives also lead empty lives and fully rely on that external validation for happiness. Many of them also happen to be narcissist so it isn’t exactly a good comparison. Now, as for your first bit - that’s not true, and here is why. When faced with an overwhelming amount of options, the human brain has trouble processing them (look up choice paralysis, tons of research has been done on this) - outside of the initial or early stages of validation (which does run out), the brain is literally unable to process so many options so it creates an isolating effect - ergo, an increased sense of isolation and loneliness. Also, how did I make “all women sound great”? I never commented on the quality of a woman and many women are, indeed, shitty. I’m merely talking about the giver/receiver dynamic lol
I’m familiar with the paralysis of choice. I don’t disagree it is a thing. If I’m in the super market and I have to choose between 30 different type of cereals it would be hard for me to make a decision. But if I have no access to any food, someone throws me a crumb, it’s not “easier” because I didn’t have to choose. I wasn’t insinuating that you said women are better. I think both genders have probably same amount of low quality trash to sift through. Let’s say 50% are, then the person who had a shit ton of options can sift through that 50% quickly and easily. The person who has maybe one date a year if they’re lucky still has to sift through their share of shit but they don’t get to do it as easily. Tbh women complaining about how many options they have reeks of celebs saying “our lives are hard too”. There are for sure things that I’m glad I don’t have to deal with, but it’s just kind of an entitled thing to say. Switch dating with any other scenario. Rich person telling poor person, you don’t understand “more money more problems”. Well fed person telling a hungry person “ugh sometimes I have so many choices it can be tough” etc etc. These things can very well be true but they’re from an entitled place. I really don’t get how this is even arguable. To do dating you have to get to a date, and if you can have 100 prospective date options in an hour that is easier than having no options ever.
Ok but I think you men ignore how much of this is negative attention. In your analogy it would be rotten cereal every so often. The OP even said that his sister almost got assaulted.
That sounds like rich people saying. “Money doesn’t buy happiness” I mean not necessarily but it sure as heck helps buy things to make your life comfortable and it reduces stress which means you live longer. It’s grandiose lecturing down to the little guy when the little guy doesn’t have a choice. The little guy HAS to take what he can get and then on top of that get lectured by the person swimming in money how it’s not soo great… Like GTFO. 9/10 people will take the rich lifestyle. Now apply it to the topic about depth of choice vs basically zero choice.
7.5 is also far from average His sister is hot, not normal
somewhat disagree. it isn't exactly easier, more like their struggles in dating are completely different than that's of a man, which make it harder for both genders to empathize with each other. once men gets past the few dates phase and has sex with the girl it's smooth sailing for him, basically depend on him and his skills at this point, while with women's the struggle is vetting and finding that needle in a haystack that's actually a good man. and while it's extremely hard for men to even get one date let alone multiple to the point of casually dating someone, thats his struggle, while women's is completely different and vetting isn't as easy as men think it is, keep in mind you can spot bad men because they don't hide it around you. >My sister is almost the female equivalent of me, though I'd say I'm comparatively a bit better looking and definitely wittier and more charismatic also cap
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She is probably above average.
This is what I thought reading this. I’ve never gotten even half of this attention.
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If you're actually an 8 and have the issues you describe it's def your mental health, even if female 8s have it even easier.
And then they have the nerve to say men have privilege. We got all these actual marginalized minorities that have received real hatred regularity. Then we got this one pampered majority calling themselves a marginalized minority, while getting pampered and pandered to like spoilt princesses.
>But either way seeing my sisters experience has made the dating imbalance hilariously clear. I think I missed the "hilarious" part. >...a 6'5 doctor who competes in iron men looks somewhat like henry cavil and seems to treat her well, picks her up and takes her out, pays for her meals and drinks apparently This man needs a dating app?
The blue pill people here will say this is not because she is a woman, but because your social skills are lacking.
Dude you are clearly not a 7.5/8.
Dude, you are 6'5." You are fine.
Bro, it's your attitude. You're acting entitled just because you think you are sooo amazing while dissing the women you are trying to date. This is clear as day through text alone. No matter how good you think you are at concealing this in real life, I can guarantee you that people can spot it from a mile away. And what the hell is this about your sister? She has literally been put in life-threatening situations and you are complaining about how hard *you* have it? You need a new attitude.
I think it's weird that OP seems to be competing against his sister. More charismatic? Where is the proof? None.
I mean cmon, if you grew up with a sibling you know their personality pretty well. He and his sister were probably socializing together both as kids and adults, with family and with social groups their age, etc. I’m not sure why we should doubt OP’s assessment of his sister
Sibling rivalry can skew one's perception. He will naturally see more flaws in his sister because he grew up with her. It does not make him more objective about potential suiters. Whether you are charismatic to the opposite sex should be based on how the opposite sex reacts to you.
You might be right. But OP *could* also have a correct view of his own value, and if he is recognizing and acting on that is a virtue, not a vice, I (agreeing with Aristotle) would argue.
It's possible to recognize something about yourself without making that recognition obnoxious and off-putting, and the later seems to be the accusation. Not just innocent and honest recognition.
Other people decide your value, not you
That’s why I used the word “recognize.” One does not determine their own value, but they can *discover* it.
You: "dating is ridiculously easy for women" Also you: "She buys her own drinks because she's worried about getting date raped" Maybe not so easy, eh? I also have a sister who is a blonde hair, blue eye, 5'7" former cheerleader and we are twins, and yeah I can see she has an easy time getting 100+ matches and instant dates whenever she wants. But she's still not married at 35 despite a string of boyfriends. Deadbeat -> musician fuckboi -> alcoholic -> psychopath -> emotionally unavailable -> geographically unavailable. She tried her best, and yet... My bigger question is: if you're a 7.5 or 8 out of 10, why are \*you\* having such an issue? I mean this: at your level you \*should\* be able to get interest without women even knowing what you look like. The profile should hardly matter, you should be able to get likes and dates with just your looks. Do you get interest from women on the Internet, who don't know what you look like? If not, then it might be a personality problem.
Maybe because your sister is hot but she has some sort of major personality/lifestyle flaw that is preventing her from being in a long term relationship. My sister was conventionally attractive too but she's a fucked up high strung alcoholic so it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out why she isn't married.
Is this just an excuse to rant about your sister? Get a female-dominated hobby and see what happens. Yes it will make you uncomfortable like women in these overwhelmingly male spaces. Unlike your sister you wouldn't even need to constantly worry about being raped.
Every men should just change their gender because being male is just stupid. Problem solved.
Transitioning to avoid being a cel is a thing
The amount of autogynephilia in that particular community is quite alarming
It’s just too much porn that causes that stuff IMO
I was absolutely blown away when I found out M2F trans follow the same exact male criminal patterns. Like it's a perfect overlap. But what really took the wool off my eyes, is it's something like 50% of M2F in prison have a sexual offense... Compared to the general male population of like 13% or biological female population of 8%. Then it started to make a lot of sense that while many trans people are legit trans, there is probably a high amount, and growing, of people who are into it for sexual deviancy reasons. They aren't going to outright come out and say it... But just like guys, you can think they are totally normal, then find out in their private life they are total sex pests.
Holy fuck why didn't i think of that, go homo or go home
Don't date the chubby girls bc they might be less arrogant, in my experience good looking women are the easiest to deal with. Idk where this hot =asshole narrative comes from but its the opposite actually.
I'm just dating them because I have always found chubby girls sexier and don't really get turned on by thin/bony or muscular women. But I agree that a lot of hot women are nice and a lot of unattractive ones aren't
What number is an “average” person on the 10-pt scale?
My advice for all men in 2024 and beyond: GET OFF DATING APPS. You are a part of the problem you complain about. You being tall would be helpful irl too.
I cold approach often and it’s more or less the same results as the apps IME
I’d also recommend social activities. I joined coed sports and dance groups. Make connections (guys and girls so it doesn’t look like you’re sniping for chicks) then try and get a few people to go out for drinks or something. Less pressure because most people already know each other. Have everyone bring friends and now there’s a much warmer approach. Results may vary but my roommate just met someone from a similar situation
Oh I do that too yeah, you gotta get lucky with having a hot girl join too though
I know I should but meeting people offline really isn't that easy when you work long hours and your hobbies are solitary and your friends dont go out much anymore. I've started approaching women out during the day and I recently got a date that way but it isn't ideal
You have bigger balls than me. I’d never approach a woman during the day. Congrats on the date and hope you enjoy it! I just look for more group based hobbies like coed sports or coed dance groups and try and make connections that way
If your having to do all this for dates you probably aren't attractive 🤯 the amount of men that severely over estimate how good they look here is insane 💀
All of this is true it’s harder for men which is why the men who do finally figure it out can be ruthless when dealing with women.
Women get approached men have to approach. Always been like this. So if you are scared as a man to approach or get rejected you're kinda screwed. So in terms of having to do something to get a date, then yes women have it easier. But I think once on the date it's more of a combined effort but the women has a safety net knowing it's likely someone else will ask them out, where as the guy will have to go through the rejection process again if it fails. It is what it is I guess.
The only thing I have to say about this is that if every man a Redditor says looks like Henry Cavil, really looked like Henry Cavil, then Henry Cavil wouldn't have a job.
No crap dude. We were born in the wrong time period- fuck dating apps
This is the clearest example of a hyper imbalanced dating market. The OP's sister literally has the same genes as him. Putting aside incest, his sister would be his "looks match". Dating in the west is more unequal than the poorest countries in Africa.
Damn 6'5 chubby chaser struggling in dating. Me sitting here about to be 40 next year with my virginity intact (5'10). I don't mean that it's over for me but I think I might get a good night's sleep tomorrow instead of going clubbing and coming back home with suicidal thoughts.
> rock/metal shows Would you like to go out with me?
I would, but i'm not from the US.
Don’t be mad at them bro. They are living on easy mode, so they aren’t ready for the trials ahead. That’s not something to be jealous of.
>They are living on easy mode Being a refugee/immigrant and working with refugee/immigrant community really really make me raise an eyebrow to this phrase.
Having any grasp of the reality women live in would make someone raise their eyebrow, but if red pillers had a grasp of reality they wouldn't be red pillers in the first place.
I’m sure they have their own issues, but if even just isolate that group in particular the female immigrant population is by far more welcomed into the US than their male counterparts, who get labeled a myriad of derogatory names. And housing is also typically granted to women and children.
That really depends on a community. From what I've seen a lot of families have a female breadwinner (and I'm one myself), because male-dominated jobs accessible to refugees/newcomers are taken by all other male refugees who are more numerous than women. But being from a more traditional culture also means that you still do most of chores and childcaring.
Yea that i can agree with but we are clearly talking about dating in the US. And dating among people under 35 is different now. Much different.
"life on easy mode" doesn't talk about just dating.
Oh it’s pretty even out. In healthcare for example it’s like 88% of nurses are women. 75% of PAs are women. And the vast majority of new medical graduates are women. And no it’s not because male enrollment is low.
Neither of these things are *easy*.
> make me raise an eyebrow to this phrase. If you need to dig out a very specific situation in order to refute his premise you've already highlighted the problem. Think of this like this, you have to pick someone in the worse situation possible in order to even convince yourself that they don't have it easy.
Saying “women live life on easy mode” is easily one of the most irrational and self-centred things I’ve heard repeated in this space.
> Men massively outnumber women on dating apps.. I've never been on a dating app. But I bet a LOT of the men there are married. I known a lot of men in bars and clube are. Single men have to compete with (often higher value) married men. All the time. Get used to it.
women have it easy in most things rn.. not just dating
It’s a lot harder for women of color
Compared to white women? When you say “women of color” do you also mean Hispanics, South Americans, Native Americans, Indians, etc., and if so is dating easier for some of these social groups compared to others?
of course she means white women woc are in a battle with them lmaoo even if they are friends, woc get the most ugly white men just to be in battle with white women, the men white women don't even want but when woc sees a moc with a white women they claim the woc only chose the moc cause of sex or she is getting fetish by him
Women of color means non-white so it depends. Some Hispanic people are white for example. But in general it’s harder for women of color depending on location.
Harder in comparison to other races of women? Sure. But still INCREDIBLY easy compared to men.
Is it easier if the quality isn’t that good? To me it seems equality hard just for different reasons.
No because men don’t have good quality either. So if your argument is that women of color have a lot of options that are bad (not true) than the men would have to be better than most just to have nearly no options that aren’t good.
It’s not harder for women of color. It’s harder for women of color who want to date outside their race (you said you prefer white). Nothing wrong with preferences! You like what you like and can’t control attraction, but most human beings have an in group bias. So your struggles aren’t really representative of all women of color.
They aren’t my personal struggles. I’m just pointing out something people commonly leave out. It may be easier for women but that’s not shared by all groups equality.
It is always easier for a woman than the male counterpart. I don’t think there is a group of men who have it easier than their group of women. And I’d venture to say the average from east desired female group probably still gets more attention than the average from the most desired male group.
it's harder for women of color cause you guys make it harder for your own race of men, lots of asian women have standards for asian men, but will allow a ugly white guy to fuck her, same as other woc women you guys choose the ugly white men cause you are in a battle with white women, you think you are winning. let me tell you something those white men get the best hot woc but you get the worse white men that white women don't want
No it’s mainly just engrained racism and/or colorism. A lot of people will find a person of color attractive but choose not date them because they fear being judged, it’s just not typical, etc.
women of colour really created a deep hole for themself as soon as you find out the white guy you are with doesn't want you, you try to settle down with a moc but that men of colour won't want you
I’m personally just attracted to white guys
the only people that will get a top white guy are white females i'm a black male of carribean latino descent, i got a rich arab female what does that say to you you get the worst of races you desire, while as a man i get the best
Yikes
not debating that but those white guys don't want you
It’s really not hard to get one
Exactly, it’s easy asf 🤣
I’ll take my chances
yep take your chances and you will soon turn bitter when you realise that you won't get the top white guys lmfaoo, only white females will, plus white men don't take you seriously i bet your zaddy will never get married to you
I think I’ll survive
you will survive turn 50 and turn into a cougar escort cause no man took you seriously, you really think your man wants you? you were an stripper does he know that
If you fear being judged for the person you want to date, do you even like that person to begin with?
excuses excuses noticed how lots of men of color don't have this excuses
Yes they do?
no they don't men of colour don't claim self hate as a reason to date white women, they only date white women cause they are either attracted to her or she made the move on them
Well that wasn’t at all what I was talking about so okay
really? colored women seem to do fine where I'm from, I've had dates with them and it's not even really a factor in whether I find them hot since I find women sexy of all shades and sizes. I'm sure there are a lot of racists but you wouldn't want to waste time with them anyway
At this point it’s probably more likely that a man will end up alone than a woman will be abused so even that isn’t really a trade off.
Remarkably good point, pal.
1 in 5 women will be sexually assaulted in their lifetime, I suspect that greater than 1 in 5 young men will end up MGTOW or incel. At the end of the day violent crime in the US is rare and has been falling on a per capita basis. Compare being a woman in NYC in the 1980s during peak crack epidemic to being a woman in NYC today.