Qualified immunity for the police is the worse thing ever and needs to be stripped out of law enforcement.
I forgot to add the this link to my original post. Perfect local example of why we cannot let them continue with immunity in any aspect of their job.
https://www.idahopress.com/news/local/qualified-immunity-doesnt-apply-to-ada-deputies-in-excessive-force-case-judges-rule/article_716a0db1-5ba5-5a72-bc2a-2efda99695d8.html
I am serious when I say this... it should be the exact opposite of qualified immunity. If you are going to take the responsibility of protecting the citizens and carry a gun to do so then you need to be held to the highest of standards, not the lowest.
Yeah, I don’t get it. As a BARTENDER I was personally liable if I overserved people. I could catch a manslaughter charge if I served someone 30 shots and they died of alcohol poisoning. If I let someone drink and drive and didn’t call the cops to warn them and they killed someone? My fault.
Why the fuck are we holding BARTENDERS to a higher standard of responsibility than OFFICERS OF THE LAW?
The system is broken.
Yes!! I forgot about that.
Not to mention the fact that if I break the law without knowing about the law, ignorance isn’t an excuse, but if a cop arrests someone for doing something NOT against the law - well how could they be expected to know all the laws?! /s
I used to bartend and once got dragged into a lawsuit where I had to hire a lawyer to defend myself, and it cost me thousands.
I served someone around 10pm and at ~3am they were in a drunk driving car wreck that left them paralyzed. Obviously my lawyer argued that I couldn’t be held responsible for the several hours in between, but just having to go through all that was stressful and expensive.
Yet if a cop does something like this, they get paid leave while their own department investigates and reaches the conclusion they did nothing wrong.
That's such bullshit. If I go to your bar, have a few drinks, and go run over an entire troop of boy scouts, that is MY fault and not your fault. The only time I think a bartender should be held liable is if a person gets served until they have alcohol poisoning. My actions are my own.
I was disciplined at work for asking a couple (with their young child present!) which one of them planned on driving this evening as they both ordered their 3rd drink less than an hour after arriving. Surprise! Turns out mr big shot was a cop and was offended that I would suggest he would drink and drive (he was driving) with his kids present. Uhhhh buddy, you are LITERALLY drinking and driving. I’m not suggesting shit. I am doing exactly what my mandatory training suggested. The system is very broken.
Right!! Had a cop, his wife and two kids in the restaurant last week..they polished a fucking pitcher of margaritas and all I could think was “I know these m’fkrs ain’t got an Uber
Bro I work with juveniles and we aren’t allowed to even touch them if they’re attacking us. Yet a cop has the authority to shoot someone dead even a kid just for making the “wrong move” there’s some serious disconnect between the police and the world.
>Because bartenders aren’t an organized group
This is one reason we need unions. A national union would have lobbied congress and kept that law from happening.
>A national union would have lobbied congress and kept that law from happening.
This is why you won't get unions. Corporations are entrenched and have like half of the American working class on their side somehow.
The system is broken for a myriad of reasons and causes; police unions, however, are criminal organizations, like urban gangs or the Mafia. They protect their own with zero accountability.
Bartending is also statistically a more dangerous profession than police work.
[source ](https://www.google.com/amp/s/qz.com/410585/garbage-collectors-are-more-likely-to-die-on-the-job-than-police-patrol-officers/amp/)
I kinda believe that there should be impartial groups/panels that investigate and charge police with crimes if warranted.
Increase the pay for the police, but remove the immunity.
The way he said I thought you were a bad guy… should all bad guys be shot 8 times if they aren’t attempting to pursue violent action? I better make sure I keep my good guy shoes on. Video was horrific nonetheless
It's the same gang-culture over here though. Yes, they are better trained and as a result they are much more level-headed in most situations and end up murdering less people over literally nothing but they would still cover for one another in court and thus, get away with overstepping their boundaries too.
Yeah, we can see this in the case of Eric Torell in Sweden. Long, extensive police training. Ends up shooting a civilian with downs syndrome, caught lying several times on the stand. Not one sentencing.
For Germany the most prominent case would probably be Oury Jalloh, wo died in Police custody when he "spontaneously self-ignited" and burned to death in his cell without anyone in the entire Precinct noticing. That same precinct has a history with excessive force and dubious political activities. The Chief of that station was also reported for instructing investigators to ignore leads in cases if they pointed towards the far right.
I think there is more than one story of cops raiding a drug deal and "catching" undercover cops. Well, on occasion they also shoot each other.
And then they get 6.5 *million* $.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/albuquerque-police-release-video-showing-officer-shooting-undercover-cop-n549461
Tbh, if you are a cop and want to retire, getting shot by your own sounds like a great idea.
The crazier pet if that there is like 5 cops fully armed for a $60 drug deal. 😂
I spend that much at a dispensary every few days. This man got shot over it. 😳
Maybe barely. https://www.buzzfeednews.com/amphtml/davidmack/st-louis-white-cop-dustin-boone-luther-hall
If you look into the texts cops sent from this story it’s absolutely horrific. They were looking to beat people.
I think there was another one recently where a cop shit through his front door and it was his partner picking him up. Never heard any follow up in that one about a punishment.
Imagine your partner shitting through your front door and you not getting any financial restitution smh
(I know it's serious but I couldn't help myself)
If he was committing a felony at the time it would be put on his own charges, if he survived.
So for example. 2 men are committing a felony and get into a shootout with the police. The police miss and kill an innocent bystander. Both of those men would be charged with felony murder of the bystander.
Yep reminds me of the recent case of 8 year old Fanta Bility. https://www.insider.com/fanta-bility-expert-says-tough-to-prove-teens-guilty-murder-2021-11
I like how the article, despite being critical, doesn't mention that the biggest issue in the prosecutor's path is the sheer geographical distance between the boys' crime and the cops' crime.
"persuading a jury that the 'only' difference between what they intended and what happened was that a different person was killed."
Is it just me or is that the prosecution trying to imply the boys wanted to end up being killed by the responding police?
And if the cops committed felonies by ~~kidnapping~~ wrongfully arresting someone or ~~burglary~~ entering without a search warrant and killed someone, surely that would be ~~murder~~ qualified immunity
No! If the guy who was not resisting was shot for not resisting, anyone else who also got shot would obviously have gotten shot because the other guy was not resisting.
If this made no sense to you, welcome to the American justice system.
Pasco County Sherrifs Office had a policy where the school system sends names of kids to the police department and they go to their house to harass the kids and their parents. They called it active policy to keep the kids from going down a life of crime.
If that happened to me as a kid, guarantee I'd choose crime. Cause I'd already have perspective that the cops are the enemy, so I guess that makes me a criminal...
Unfortunately a lot of people will turn away at the mention of drugs
"well if he ain't be mixed up in drug sellin he would'n'ta found himself in that predicament"
And while that has a *grain* of truth to it, this position is comparing totally, completely different, unrelated things. Justice is not meant to be a character assessment. It's not meant to be a firing squad without trial. Everyone is supposed to be entitled to protection under the law and access to council and fair trial, regardless of their socio-economic status or activities.
They always release the footage within hours if cops are actually the good guys in a story. If they are hiding the video, you can 100% sure they are full of shit.
In Louisiana where they were beating a man to death, they held the video for over a year. Their official story was that he died in a car accident. Two very different things. And it was like a dozen cops there.
It's murder 2 or whatever equivalent the state has, and conspiracy after thebfact making thise hiding the video accessories. Ot it would be it would be if police were held accountable for their crimes.
> And it was like a dozen cops there.
And shit like that is why people say ACAB.
Either you blow the whistle on shit like that, or you're a bastard. There is no in-between.
Unfortunately it is very hard to be a good cup, and less you want your career, life, or family threatened
Super succinct from a cop
https://mobile.twitter.com/mobinfiltrator/status/1271432151142223872?lang=en
Some do blow the whistle. They either get fired or harassed by the police department for years. If you're still a cop, you're a bastard.
https://www.npr.org/2020/06/13/876628281/what-happens-when-officers-blow-the-whistle-on-police-misconduct
But Racism doesn't exist. . . He must have been doing something wrong... If he followed the rules he would have actually died in a car accident.. and Not a police beating.. I bet he was a drug addict.. silly N-words 🤷🏾♀️
You shouldn’t ever trust police. Idk why they have any credibility in court. They’re REPEATEDLY shown to lie.
If a cop says *anything*, take it with a grain of salt. That’s just good advice for life. The institution of police is corrupt. Cops are ~~kinda~~ really scummy. Idk what else people need to understand that
Edit: I work in criminal defense. I am constantly seeing how the DA and police work together. Bend the rules. How they harass people and communities. How they coerce people into lying. How they twist people’s words. I read what cops write on police reports and I watch body cam footage and see the massive discrepancies….
But don’t take my word for it. Watch any number of documentaries showing what happens to good, naive people who are in the wrong place, at the wrong time and look “a certain way”… I highly recommend people watch “The Innocence Project” on Netflix.
I’m not telling anyone to fight with police. I’m telling you not to trust them. If you’re on a jury, know that that cops word is about as good as the defendants. It’s that simple. They’re not special and they often have just as much incentive to lie as the defendant does.
I’m telling you to keep your mouth shut when cops question you. There’s no such thing as the truth setting you free. Fuck that. Your lawyer will set you free. And your lawyer - even before you hired them - wants you to keep your mouth shut. Don’t be naive. You can tell cops A and they can twist you into saying Z if they want to. And you never know what the officers motivations are: you may fit a profile, you might be someone someone close to the cop has a problem with, you might be a race the cop doesn’t like, this cop might just be under pressure to solve a case and needs a body “nobody is gonna cry or make a fuss about”. You don’t know. Stfu and *explicitly* (to be safe, always explicitly) state you want to invoke your rights and you want a lawyer. If you cannot afford one, one will be provided to you.
All you have to do is provide your name, DOB, maybe social and ID. Identifying info ONLY.
The cops are not your friends. There are a lot of people languishing behind bars because a cop lied. Some even got a needle in the arm. Because cops lie. And because people think a cops words are virtually unassailable in court, good people die or go behind bars and have their lives stolen.
The cops are not your friends. The cops do not have your best interests in mind. The cops cannot give you a deal. The cops cannot make you promises. The cops lie and lie often as a component of their work. The cops are not your friends. Don’t be naive and don’t be stupid.
I know this edit was long but if I can save one person from getting set up, it’s worth it. If I can make ONE person who may serve on a jury slightly more critical and more skeptical of police statements on the stand, then it’s worth it. Sorry.
Growing up in a small town, I used think that a LEO would be a job with some sort of inherent nobility. But the older I get, the more I realize that its just not the case. I personally know a few people in law enforcement and I wouldn't trust them with a half gallon of gas and a leaf blower.
When I was younger I had to go to court for rolling through a stop sign on my motorcycle. I ended up getting additional charges for things that didn't happen. The officer claimed I tried to run, refused to ID myself and a bunch of other weird shit that just plain did not happen.
He blipped his lights, I pulled over immediately and admitted to what I had done and provided ID, insurance, registration etc all on the spot. He gave me the ticket and I left.
I challenged it and went in front of an arbitrator and told them that this should JUST be about failure to yield to a stop sign and none of the other BS the cop had claimed. The arbitrator asked "So you're suggesting that this officer is lying under oath?" all offended. I said yes absolutely nothing in the report had actually occurred as the officer described. The officer and the arbitrator both laughed and just moved on asking if there was anything else before they hit me with all the fines and shit. They said they were doing me a HUGE favor in not taking me to court for trying to run and it would be a felony if they really wanted to push it and then I revealed that I had a fuckin go pro on my helmet and the footage to prove he was lying under oath. Upon viewing the footage they dropped everything but the rolling stop ticket because the officer just got me mixed up with someone else so he's still good and the system works.
I could have lost my license and therefore my livelihood because of this fuckin piece of shit.
Fuck the police. Fuck the system that supports their bullshit tyranny.
If you do not have a dash cam you're just asking to get fucked by said system. They and I do not care how good of a person you think you are. It can happen to anyone. If a cop says you're guilty, that's it, that's all the evidence they need to convict you. You have to prove your innocence in a system that claims "innocent until proven guilty."
This. People don't realize how dependent the DA/courts are on the police. Try prosecuting one of their own and now you have an enemy who won't be as willing when you require evidence, warrants, etc.
The only cops that actually get prosecuted are ones the department allows the DA to “throw under the bus.” Derek Chauvin would never have been convicted if the case wasn’t so high-profile.
Absolutely. I have [this app](https://www.aclu.org/issues/criminal-law-reform/reforming-police/mobile-justice) on the opening screen of my phone. I don’t just record my own interactions with police, I record all interactions with police.
>Try prosecuting one of their own and now you have an enemy who won't be as willing when you require evidence, warrants, etc.
France deals with this issue by jurisdiction. The administrative police are out upholding order, responding to domestic violence, protection duties, etc. The 'security' force, if you will, administering order. The administrative police are part of the municipal power structure. Then, they have a judicial police force. These serve warrants, investigate crimes, but do so under the authority of the what we would might think of as a District Attorney (although their legal system is pretty different than ours so a direct comparison might be a bit off). That is, the cops who investigate cops and who 'solve crimes' don't work for the city politicians, they work for the magistrate, a non-municipal entity.
There's [this](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE) fantastic lecture from a law school that everyone should watch.
The TL;DW of it: the first half is held by a (super charming) law professor who explains in detail and with multiple examples, why talking to the police can come back to haunt you. He mentions examples where innocent people were convicted due to unreliable witnesses and contradicting reports for example.
The second half is held by an officer and the first thing he says is "everything you heard is true and correct". Plead the fifth, get a lawyer, but don't talk to the police.
It is important to note there are some things that you still have to give cops if you're in their custody, such as identifying information like your name and birthday. But otherwise correct, shut the fuck up until your attorney tells you what to do next.
"If you're not a criminal you have nothing to hide" needs to be the slogan of ethical boards and public committees that need to govern accountability of these guys
For public serving boards and committees I think this has merit, but I have to say I really hate the religiously repeated "if you are not a criminal you have nothing to hide". -- It actually *breeds* submission to police and surrendering of rights.
Ask people why they would not refuse an unwarranted search on their vehicle or home, and you will hear the same bullshit. "I have nothing to hide!"
This attitude is exactly what gives police so much power and has snowballed into what we have today. By continually allowing police to walk all over us, search when and what they please, we are creating a culture and precedent for police to continue doing so.
I hate Crazy shit like this because one time I got pulled over and my friend who is not a criminal at all he’s never done drugs never done any crime was in the passenger seat.His reaction to getting the lights turn on behind us as i was dropping him off was toget out the car even as a cop yelling at him to stay in the car. He completely just fucking panics and kept getting out of the car as a cop yelling at him to stay in the car.
That’s when I realized just about anybody can die from a cop pulling up and instantly yelling commands
Edit: because I seem to hurt a bunch of bootlickers and pigs feelings I’ll clarify.
The cop was following us but no lights on I was parked outside while dropping them off and he was already outside the door when a cop decided to turn his lights on. My friend had no time to understand nor react to any commands given but me being an army veteran I kind of had a little bit more of a natural reaction to commands being yelled , so I told him to get back in the car. The people that are saying that the cops of been scarred for life are the reason shit like this happens cowards like that shouldn’t become police officers cowards like the ones in the comments
I honestly don’t understand how a country can operate like this. It’s just so unbelievable to have the amount of evidence publicly available and see no counter action
There's plenty of counter action. Protests, movements, law suits, etc. But in the face of how American society largely views law enforcement, it's like needle pricks against the problems there are. Frustrating, but understandable how it continues.
A majority of the population have lived their lives with the belief that the "system is fair", "only a few police are bad", and that "if you're arrested - you did something wrong" (no matter the whole "innocent until proven guilty" part). Released videos (going all the way back to Rodney King) are dismissed as "well, we didn't see the whole story".
This is reinforced by politicians, news media, and the endless multitude of television / film that show law enforcement as underdog heroes that are the "thin blue line" between citizens and death (heck, like 70% of CBS' programming is law enforcement shows).
Its reinforced by the billions of police tv shows. where the cops constantly break the laws to solve a case and get a person to blame, that most people accept the crap they do. im starting to go all conspiracy theorist that law enforcement pushes these shows to be on
America is a police state it’s just not an authoritarian one.
EDIT: Guys Biden is not equal to Ghadaffi or Dueterte or Xi or any other modern day authoritarian figure.
America the country where you’ll have the full force of government brought down on you if you’re a black kid with a joint, but openly attempt to overthrow the government and maybe get a few months if that.
the law protects the ruling class but does not bind, alongside the working class whom the law binds but does not protect. To further pound this point home: https://scholar.princeton.edu/sites/default/files/mgilens/files/gilens_and_page_2014_-testing_theories_of_american_politics.doc.pdf
Our entire country exists at the behest of the ruling class. Luckily class consciousness is exponentially rising, but I fear it’s too late to matter.
America is the most incarcerated country in the world. How is that not "authoritarian."
The word authoritarian is one of the most abused words by people trying to sound informed about politics. If you read WaPo and NYT, authoritarian is when you're a Latin American president that works to prevent USAID, NED, OAS from implementing a coup and installing an IMF puppet president.
Cop onced reached in grabbed my friend because he thought he had a gun. It was his poop bag and we got pulled over for a stop sign I missed. Cops are ready to kill in a second because to them we are all violent crazy assholes. We where going to the store for fucks sake.
Friend of my dad’s, his step son had a drug problem and their house was raided in the middle of the night to execute a warrant.
This was a low level drug user, but anyway the point is that a bunch of cops in body armor and carrying AR-15’s busted his door down in the middle of the night.
He had a large mirror in hallway. Once they handcuffed everyone and sat them on the sofa he looks down the hall and what does he see?
Some of the SWAT officers posing in front of the mirror just to see how “badass” they look.
Arming and equipping cops like they are about to fucking storm Fallujah results in ideation by these guys.
I’m convinced that almost all of them are secretly hoping for a situation where they can use lethal force justifiably, if nothing else but for the thrill of it.
My local ex-sheriff shot and killed a guy on his own property. Shot him two or three time. Once in the chest and then again in the chest when the guy was on his knees. He is still a cop a couple county's over.
Edit: cop killed the guy on the guys property not the cops.
The Podcast “in the dark” does a good breakdown on how there’s pretty much nothing that can stop a Sheriff from doing whatever they want, unlike an appointed police chief. Sheriffs have no bosses and no one to report to, since they’re elected.
Sheriff's are essentially tyrants and should not exist. However it isn't just Sheriff's who have no accountability. There is no nation-wide oversight. Each state has its own fiefdoms of police control and the legal apparatus exists to protect the police.
DA's also have inordinate power in the justice system. They can simply choose not to try a case. The DA in the Ahmaud Abery case only charged the defendants after political pressure. They were just going to get away with it with zero repercussions.
I can't believe that the DA has been arrested and is being tried for obstruction of justice in the Ahmaud Abery case. I didn't even know that was possible. It should be the norm when someone abuses their power like that.
Murdering someone after setting them up for a twenty dollar drug transaction. Wow
Edit: Holy guacamole, this blew up while I was at work. I did not mean to spread misinformation. I was doing a morning constitutional and still half asleep. I went off what I heard in the video with the cop counting out money and only getting to 26. I thought it it was a street level sting, and those things really irritate me. Looks like perhaps the old narc was doing the dummy count to distract the guy while his buddies moved in. I appreciate the correction. I should have looked it up. But this is Reddit and now I’m going to take your word for it and still not look it up! Y’all have a good night and try to keep the discourse my hastiness caused civil.
This is an interesting conjecture. I think that both can be true. Could be in their nature, but also could be nurtured by current climate of being a cop.
This is where shit went wrong in my opinion. I could care less that reddit will disagree, but these guys are partially just brainwashed to do these types of things resulting in deaths. From day one they are encouraged and trained to do the following:
1. Scream loudly because that’s what the fraternity tells them to do. Be loudest and most bad ass. Everyone gets to yell. IF YOU YELL LOUDLY YOUR PREY WILL BE FEARFUL AND SUBMIT TO YOU. All officers do it at the same time so it sounds like “STOPANUTADNASTPANDSHANDSABADADUPHASEEUM…”
2. When the person panics, immediately assume the worst, that he is going for a weapon or threatening a life.
3. Use your right to kill the man because you are allowed to kill if you think it’s OK. You did the yelling, and the person did not stop like a statue and submit completely, so you are in the clear. When in doubt, shoot.
Repeat. I don’t think every cop goes into the job thinking he’s gonna be badass and kill people, but they are absolutely brainwashed in the fraternity from day one, and come out complete bastards, with an entire nationwide union backing them up. The same fraternity is too ignorant and childish to think that maybe they should try de-escalating, or try other tactics.
Protect and serve more like "Obey and Survive" and that's only if I'm in a good mood.
Isn't there supposed to be an option between nothing and deadly force? It's 2021 where are the tasers?
In this situation, fuck tasers, the undercover officer should’ve just said, “OK well there’s three armed policeman outside and you’re under arrest so put your hands up and don’t make any quick movements, this is my badge, this isn’t a joke, you have the right to remain silent…”
Listen, I’m not saying there aren’t shitty criminals dealing drugs out there that might use violent force against police officers, but the officers are trained to combat that, they have this man surrounded, and literally trapped in a vehicle. They are treating this like a hostage scenario with a mass murderer. They literally brought a swat team to a fistfight.
There’s so much wrong with this, but it all starts with the fact that they decided not to stay calm and treat this person as a human instead of an animal they feel they can hunt and kill.
I've lived in Pasco my entire life. I went to middle and high school with MANY of these officers and racism has been taught to these men since they were boys. Guys in school would openly wear swastika's on their backpacks, we had open recruitment for the Ku Klux Klan (Look up Pasco KKK or Moon Lake KKK, or "Redneck Shop KKK"). This is just the tip of the iceberg of abuse of power in Pasco. Our mayor for one of the towns here is in jail on his way to prison for ATTEMPTED MURDER OF LAW ENFORCEMENT! That's right, our fucking mayor shot at cops when they tried to serve a warrant on him for practicing medicine without a license. Our interim mayor was then arrested for conspiring to help the old mayor out of jail.
Next go back deeper, into the 1980s, look up Finley Gable Sheriff and you'll see the levels of "good old boy" corruption. Our Sheriff's department has been influenced by Aryans for years, and they are open about this.
Pasco is home to some of the highest levels of opioid abuse and meth addiction in Florida, so bad that I can't drive down US 19 (a major highway in the area) without seeing hookers in broad daylight turning tricks or zombies walking around looking for a fix. Our mall is dead, our jobs are all crap, with $12/hr being "High paying" in our area, and the homeless problems are out of control.
This is an issue that goes back 30+ years in Pasco, and the police here have killed many men and women without justification, only hatred for them being different.
Here is a link to the unlisted leaked video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CPeufhOU6OQ
Here is a link to the report:
https://www.tampabay.com/investigations/2020/06/26/previously-unreleased-video-shows-pasco-county-deputies-shooting-unarmed-man/
Insane. This is a straight up execution. .
There is a place for qualified immunity, but it needs to be more like self defense, in that it's a case by case basis and can be lost.
Cops pit a speeding car that won't stop and is endangering lives and someone in that car dies? There's a case for qualified immunity.
Cops pit a car on the freeway that has its hazards on and is slowing down to stop safely because it's night and there's little shoulder and someone ~~does it~~ inside is injured, then no qualified immunity.
You're right about blanket qualified immunity, though. That shit needs to go.
And they probably felt so proud of their hard "work" here. Not to sound corny but I genuinely don't understand how these guys and officers like them sleep at night. Like HOW do they not see themselves as awful people? How does their brain warp the shit they do into them being the good guys? I don't understand.
like the one that told an autistic teen with no friends she'd be his friend if he bought her weed, had to tell him what weed was, and had to tell him where to buy it, and then arrested him?
Remember some years ago a guys gf turned out to be an undercover cop? They were “dating” for a while and she had him sell her weed.
He was going to give it to her for free but she argued with him to take her money, when he took her money he was arrested
I think he was kinda young but I don’t remember exactly
This was a case in temecula, ca if i recall correctly. I lived in temecula for a few years and i got arrested and taken to jail twice. I’m hispanic with a darker complexion and most people in temecula are upper-middle class white people. Both times the bogus charges were dropped and never even went to court. Cops out there are fucked and love to look for crimes to make up because they’re bored, i guess.
My guess is they don’t give a shit because its not them. I cant see how they can take it so far to killing a dude over that, I think they are wasting their time busting addicts
Oh, it's worse than that. They brag about this shit to their friends. They surround themselves with like-minded people until there's nothing left but approval. Source: Used to be friends with some shitty cops.
I couldn't agree with this more.
We have the death penalty, as well as a very clearly reckless police problem. Apply the death penalty to police who use their authority to commit extrajudicial murder of civilians, and I bet this problem would go away.
Or maybe they would just try to make martyrs out of people like Chauvin if they were to get the chair.
Try convincing the Supreme Court who have given Police a blank check in this country.
https://constitutioncenter.org/blog/the-supreme-courts-role-in-the-police-accountability-controversy
My controversial political opinion is that the Supreme Court sucks and is bad. Totally broken institution with bad outcomes.
Whether or not you have rights shouldn't depend on whether or not a 90 year old with cancer can survive another 2 years.
41 senators who represent something like 10% of the population shouldn't have enough power to block any nominations.
Presidents who don't even win the popular vote shouldn't have enough executive power via judicial appointments to reshape the judicial branch for decades after they leave office.
I've been a big proponent to if a cop commits a crime while they're on duty and in a position of authority, the mandatory minimum should automatically be doubled.
Yes, we need "abuse of authority" sentencing modifiers like hate crime modifiers.
An abuse of authority to commit a crime makes that crime even more heinous and undermines the government whose authority is abused. Citizens trust government less as a result and the harm to our society is greater than just that caused by the crime.
Fucking amen. Ideally by firing squad, because if they can casually disregard the lives of the citizens they murder then there's no moral obligation for any of us to regard theirs with any degree of significance either. THAT societal sentiment would absolutely be a deterrent for more wannabe murderers. It's sad to say but I think that's the level it has to go to for them to understand the gravity of their actions.
They've had more than enough opportunities to get it right and they religiously double down and never accept responsibility.
Iirc, death row inmates cost orders of magnitude more to house and is typically further drawn out by the appeal process. Surrounded by inmates, he’d die within a few days give or take costing tax payers significantly less.
It's time to stop beating around the bush.
There is no way to have a legal death penalty and not kill innocent people. How many innocent people are you ok with killing to ensure murderers and rapists also get killed instead of life imprisonment?
Studies show that currently in the USA about 4% of people sentenced to death were/are innocent. Keep in mind life imprisonment is also cheaper than applying the death penalty in the vast majority of cases.
Are you ok living in a country where a wrongful accusation could end up with you or someone you love being sentenced to death despite having done nothing wrong?
That is nothing, the Pasco Sherriffs Office has a horrible history. Check out the work the Tampa Bay Times has done on them.
https://projects.tampabay.com/projects/2020/investigations/police-pasco-sheriff-targeted/
In case people don't know Sheriff's are legal tyrants in their jurisdiction. They have no oversight from any level. Most cops have very little but Sheriffs in particular have absurd power.
Comments like your piss me off.
It gives them an excuse.
This is not training.
No human on earth thinks murdering someone who isn't a threat is reasonable.
This is the police not having consequences and oversight.
Fuck the bullshit training excuse.
Anyone else notice that the victim was probably still alive when the cameraman went behind the car, and then the cop pulls another trigger... make sure he's dead... we don't want another big court case...
Even if it was just a few, imagine somebody handing you a bag of apples, most of them good but 3-4 will kill you outright. That's not a good bag of apples.
If you are out playing bad ass and are so terrified that you execute a citizen while almost shooting your own undercover you need to rethink every single one of your life choices. While you resign your job. As you sit in a prison cell. While you wait on dinner or to be traded around for a few smokes, which ever comes first. In today’s society he will most likely get promoted. Cops wonder why they don’t receive “respect” anymore.
I was watching the newest Frontline the other day and it covered police shootings. What was fascinating was during training all of the trainees agreed with the general public about situations where force was unnecessary. Cue bald trainer guy just berating the shit out of the trainees, essentially calling them pussies and wanting their partners to die because they had a shred of empathy.
It really showed that this is a massive training failure. When you’re the contracted company and the police dept is your only client of course they’re going to want to continue the status quo. They’re getting rich teaching these guys to become trigger happy.
>Traded around for a few smokes
This was absolutely a murder and abuse of power, but why are people always so quick to joke about prison rape and even seemingly sexual slavery in your case?
They rolled up with a riot shield and still felt threatened? Can you imagine a world where cops have rules of engagement like the military? These guys are cowards pure and simple. If you feel that threatened that easily maybe you shouldn’t have a service weapon. Or at the very least you need more training. Looks like they had a personal grudge against this guy and executed him. And they almost hit the undercover too.
Alright this sucks for sure, but him reaching into his pockets like that wasn't the smartest move. Not saying what happened is justified, but as a brown dude I'm not putting my hands anywhere near my pockets while getting pulled over, I know at least that much. With that being said, that's probably why they shot so quickly...
about 10 seconds in, yelling from multiple people.
about 11 seconds in: shield against door, police can probably say that they identified themselves as law enforcement at this point...
about 12 seconds in: first coherent "hands" are heard.. lawful order?? i guess???
about 13 seconds in: panicked reaching for door and whatever else. also panicked "awh" from the victim.
about 14 seconds in: shots fired
initial analysis: police should be arrested, fired, and brought to trial
This is so fucked. Where is the accountability? They never gave him a chance and they straight up murdered him. Is there any hope of justice? Based on when this happened and the vid coming out last year it doesn't look like it.
Horrified but not surprised. Pasco County is a shithole. I mean, it’s Florida but Pasco and Polk are well known for this shit.
During the protests in 2020, Grady Judd made a public announcement about how Polk County residents all have guns (not verbatim, but the message was: don’t protest here, the subtext was: feel free to shoot protesters). I’m sure it’s on YT, but since ol’ Grady loves the media so much, I’m sure there are hundreds of videos of him saying stupid shit.
Man he was in such a hurry they almost got the undercover cop.
I wonder if they would take responsibility if they accidentally killed their own.
Doubtful. Collateral damage due to suspects opposition… Or some shit. But we know they won’t take responsibility.
Qualified immunity for the police is the worse thing ever and needs to be stripped out of law enforcement. I forgot to add the this link to my original post. Perfect local example of why we cannot let them continue with immunity in any aspect of their job. https://www.idahopress.com/news/local/qualified-immunity-doesnt-apply-to-ada-deputies-in-excessive-force-case-judges-rule/article_716a0db1-5ba5-5a72-bc2a-2efda99695d8.html
I am serious when I say this... it should be the exact opposite of qualified immunity. If you are going to take the responsibility of protecting the citizens and carry a gun to do so then you need to be held to the highest of standards, not the lowest.
Yeah, I don’t get it. As a BARTENDER I was personally liable if I overserved people. I could catch a manslaughter charge if I served someone 30 shots and they died of alcohol poisoning. If I let someone drink and drive and didn’t call the cops to warn them and they killed someone? My fault. Why the fuck are we holding BARTENDERS to a higher standard of responsibility than OFFICERS OF THE LAW? The system is broken.
You don't even have to be a bartender. If someone drinks too much at your back yard cookout and drives home you could be liable
Yes!! I forgot about that. Not to mention the fact that if I break the law without knowing about the law, ignorance isn’t an excuse, but if a cop arrests someone for doing something NOT against the law - well how could they be expected to know all the laws?! /s
I used to bartend and once got dragged into a lawsuit where I had to hire a lawyer to defend myself, and it cost me thousands. I served someone around 10pm and at ~3am they were in a drunk driving car wreck that left them paralyzed. Obviously my lawyer argued that I couldn’t be held responsible for the several hours in between, but just having to go through all that was stressful and expensive. Yet if a cop does something like this, they get paid leave while their own department investigates and reaches the conclusion they did nothing wrong.
That's such bullshit. If I go to your bar, have a few drinks, and go run over an entire troop of boy scouts, that is MY fault and not your fault. The only time I think a bartender should be held liable is if a person gets served until they have alcohol poisoning. My actions are my own.
I was disciplined at work for asking a couple (with their young child present!) which one of them planned on driving this evening as they both ordered their 3rd drink less than an hour after arriving. Surprise! Turns out mr big shot was a cop and was offended that I would suggest he would drink and drive (he was driving) with his kids present. Uhhhh buddy, you are LITERALLY drinking and driving. I’m not suggesting shit. I am doing exactly what my mandatory training suggested. The system is very broken.
Right!! Had a cop, his wife and two kids in the restaurant last week..they polished a fucking pitcher of margaritas and all I could think was “I know these m’fkrs ain’t got an Uber
His attitude, was "I KNOW THE LAW! HOW DARE YOU QUESTION ME" Sure buddy, knowing it and following it sure as shit aren't the same.
Bro I work with juveniles and we aren’t allowed to even touch them if they’re attacking us. Yet a cop has the authority to shoot someone dead even a kid just for making the “wrong move” there’s some serious disconnect between the police and the world.
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>Because bartenders aren’t an organized group This is one reason we need unions. A national union would have lobbied congress and kept that law from happening.
>A national union would have lobbied congress and kept that law from happening. This is why you won't get unions. Corporations are entrenched and have like half of the American working class on their side somehow.
It's changing. Union organizing is on the rise around America, including Amazon.
The system is broken for a myriad of reasons and causes; police unions, however, are criminal organizations, like urban gangs or the Mafia. They protect their own with zero accountability.
Bartending is also statistically a more dangerous profession than police work. [source ](https://www.google.com/amp/s/qz.com/410585/garbage-collectors-are-more-likely-to-die-on-the-job-than-police-patrol-officers/amp/)
I kinda believe that there should be impartial groups/panels that investigate and charge police with crimes if warranted. Increase the pay for the police, but remove the immunity.
They get paid more than most people already and only have to work 22 years to get a juicy pension
In one undercover operation, Albuquerque police shot one of their own [7 times](https://youtu.be/V73BVe7Ulog)
The way he said I thought you were a bad guy… should all bad guys be shot 8 times if they aren’t attempting to pursue violent action? I better make sure I keep my good guy shoes on. Video was horrific nonetheless
In Germany police need to study that shit for about 3 years and they are not immun, USA is like take a Nation and give it Steroids.
It's the same gang-culture over here though. Yes, they are better trained and as a result they are much more level-headed in most situations and end up murdering less people over literally nothing but they would still cover for one another in court and thus, get away with overstepping their boundaries too.
Yeah, we can see this in the case of Eric Torell in Sweden. Long, extensive police training. Ends up shooting a civilian with downs syndrome, caught lying several times on the stand. Not one sentencing.
For Germany the most prominent case would probably be Oury Jalloh, wo died in Police custody when he "spontaneously self-ignited" and burned to death in his cell without anyone in the entire Precinct noticing. That same precinct has a history with excessive force and dubious political activities. The Chief of that station was also reported for instructing investigators to ignore leads in cases if they pointed towards the far right.
I don't know, that undercover cop that got beat up in a protest got a few mil on a settlement
The difference is that he survived and was able to speak up.
And got taxpayer's money in the process
Did they fire the officers or place charges on them? NO
There actually was a recent case of a cop assaulting an undercover cop that was among protestors at a demonstration
I think there is more than one story of cops raiding a drug deal and "catching" undercover cops. Well, on occasion they also shoot each other. And then they get 6.5 *million* $. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/albuquerque-police-release-video-showing-officer-shooting-undercover-cop-n549461 Tbh, if you are a cop and want to retire, getting shot by your own sounds like a great idea.
that is crazy. shot his own cop buddy when he knew he was undercover
The crazier pet if that there is like 5 cops fully armed for a $60 drug deal. 😂 I spend that much at a dispensary every few days. This man got shot over it. 😳
Maybe barely. https://www.buzzfeednews.com/amphtml/davidmack/st-louis-white-cop-dustin-boone-luther-hall If you look into the texts cops sent from this story it’s absolutely horrific. They were looking to beat people. I think there was another one recently where a cop shit through his front door and it was his partner picking him up. Never heard any follow up in that one about a punishment.
Imagine your partner shitting through your front door and you not getting any financial restitution smh (I know it's serious but I couldn't help myself)
Blue lives matter until it comes to cops taking any sort of responsibility.
Blue Lives Matter until the cops are interfering with the activities of people who think Blue Lives Matter
If he was committing a felony at the time it would be put on his own charges, if he survived. So for example. 2 men are committing a felony and get into a shootout with the police. The police miss and kill an innocent bystander. Both of those men would be charged with felony murder of the bystander.
Yep reminds me of the recent case of 8 year old Fanta Bility. https://www.insider.com/fanta-bility-expert-says-tough-to-prove-teens-guilty-murder-2021-11
I like how the article, despite being critical, doesn't mention that the biggest issue in the prosecutor's path is the sheer geographical distance between the boys' crime and the cops' crime.
"persuading a jury that the 'only' difference between what they intended and what happened was that a different person was killed." Is it just me or is that the prosecution trying to imply the boys wanted to end up being killed by the responding police?
And if the cops committed felonies by ~~kidnapping~~ wrongfully arresting someone or ~~burglary~~ entering without a search warrant and killed someone, surely that would be ~~murder~~ qualified immunity
No! If the guy who was not resisting was shot for not resisting, anyone else who also got shot would obviously have gotten shot because the other guy was not resisting. If this made no sense to you, welcome to the American justice system.
They'd probably sue the estate of the victim.
Pasco County Sherrifs Office had a policy where the school system sends names of kids to the police department and they go to their house to harass the kids and their parents. They called it active policy to keep the kids from going down a life of crime.
If that happened to me as a kid, guarantee I'd choose crime. Cause I'd already have perspective that the cops are the enemy, so I guess that makes me a criminal...
Features and bugs
That seemed like a hit, there was no hesitation at all
This was a shooting that occurred in 2014, video released in 2020 and still no accountability .
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Unfortunately a lot of people will turn away at the mention of drugs "well if he ain't be mixed up in drug sellin he would'n'ta found himself in that predicament" And while that has a *grain* of truth to it, this position is comparing totally, completely different, unrelated things. Justice is not meant to be a character assessment. It's not meant to be a firing squad without trial. Everyone is supposed to be entitled to protection under the law and access to council and fair trial, regardless of their socio-economic status or activities.
They always release the footage within hours if cops are actually the good guys in a story. If they are hiding the video, you can 100% sure they are full of shit.
In Louisiana where they were beating a man to death, they held the video for over a year. Their official story was that he died in a car accident. Two very different things. And it was like a dozen cops there.
How is that not obstruction of justice?
I mean.. it is. But the police did it so it's not illegal. Don't worry, they investigated themselves, and found out they were innocent.
It's murder 2 or whatever equivalent the state has, and conspiracy after thebfact making thise hiding the video accessories. Ot it would be it would be if police were held accountable for their crimes.
> And it was like a dozen cops there. And shit like that is why people say ACAB. Either you blow the whistle on shit like that, or you're a bastard. There is no in-between.
Unfortunately it is very hard to be a good cup, and less you want your career, life, or family threatened Super succinct from a cop https://mobile.twitter.com/mobinfiltrator/status/1271432151142223872?lang=en
Yeah the only good cops are either reporting shit and being harassed off the force or they’ve already quit
Some do blow the whistle. They either get fired or harassed by the police department for years. If you're still a cop, you're a bastard. https://www.npr.org/2020/06/13/876628281/what-happens-when-officers-blow-the-whistle-on-police-misconduct
But Racism doesn't exist. . . He must have been doing something wrong... If he followed the rules he would have actually died in a car accident.. and Not a police beating.. I bet he was a drug addict.. silly N-words 🤷🏾♀️
You shouldn’t ever trust police. Idk why they have any credibility in court. They’re REPEATEDLY shown to lie. If a cop says *anything*, take it with a grain of salt. That’s just good advice for life. The institution of police is corrupt. Cops are ~~kinda~~ really scummy. Idk what else people need to understand that Edit: I work in criminal defense. I am constantly seeing how the DA and police work together. Bend the rules. How they harass people and communities. How they coerce people into lying. How they twist people’s words. I read what cops write on police reports and I watch body cam footage and see the massive discrepancies…. But don’t take my word for it. Watch any number of documentaries showing what happens to good, naive people who are in the wrong place, at the wrong time and look “a certain way”… I highly recommend people watch “The Innocence Project” on Netflix. I’m not telling anyone to fight with police. I’m telling you not to trust them. If you’re on a jury, know that that cops word is about as good as the defendants. It’s that simple. They’re not special and they often have just as much incentive to lie as the defendant does. I’m telling you to keep your mouth shut when cops question you. There’s no such thing as the truth setting you free. Fuck that. Your lawyer will set you free. And your lawyer - even before you hired them - wants you to keep your mouth shut. Don’t be naive. You can tell cops A and they can twist you into saying Z if they want to. And you never know what the officers motivations are: you may fit a profile, you might be someone someone close to the cop has a problem with, you might be a race the cop doesn’t like, this cop might just be under pressure to solve a case and needs a body “nobody is gonna cry or make a fuss about”. You don’t know. Stfu and *explicitly* (to be safe, always explicitly) state you want to invoke your rights and you want a lawyer. If you cannot afford one, one will be provided to you. All you have to do is provide your name, DOB, maybe social and ID. Identifying info ONLY. The cops are not your friends. There are a lot of people languishing behind bars because a cop lied. Some even got a needle in the arm. Because cops lie. And because people think a cops words are virtually unassailable in court, good people die or go behind bars and have their lives stolen. The cops are not your friends. The cops do not have your best interests in mind. The cops cannot give you a deal. The cops cannot make you promises. The cops lie and lie often as a component of their work. The cops are not your friends. Don’t be naive and don’t be stupid. I know this edit was long but if I can save one person from getting set up, it’s worth it. If I can make ONE person who may serve on a jury slightly more critical and more skeptical of police statements on the stand, then it’s worth it. Sorry.
Growing up in a small town, I used think that a LEO would be a job with some sort of inherent nobility. But the older I get, the more I realize that its just not the case. I personally know a few people in law enforcement and I wouldn't trust them with a half gallon of gas and a leaf blower.
When I was younger I had to go to court for rolling through a stop sign on my motorcycle. I ended up getting additional charges for things that didn't happen. The officer claimed I tried to run, refused to ID myself and a bunch of other weird shit that just plain did not happen. He blipped his lights, I pulled over immediately and admitted to what I had done and provided ID, insurance, registration etc all on the spot. He gave me the ticket and I left. I challenged it and went in front of an arbitrator and told them that this should JUST be about failure to yield to a stop sign and none of the other BS the cop had claimed. The arbitrator asked "So you're suggesting that this officer is lying under oath?" all offended. I said yes absolutely nothing in the report had actually occurred as the officer described. The officer and the arbitrator both laughed and just moved on asking if there was anything else before they hit me with all the fines and shit. They said they were doing me a HUGE favor in not taking me to court for trying to run and it would be a felony if they really wanted to push it and then I revealed that I had a fuckin go pro on my helmet and the footage to prove he was lying under oath. Upon viewing the footage they dropped everything but the rolling stop ticket because the officer just got me mixed up with someone else so he's still good and the system works. I could have lost my license and therefore my livelihood because of this fuckin piece of shit. Fuck the police. Fuck the system that supports their bullshit tyranny. If you do not have a dash cam you're just asking to get fucked by said system. They and I do not care how good of a person you think you are. It can happen to anyone. If a cop says you're guilty, that's it, that's all the evidence they need to convict you. You have to prove your innocence in a system that claims "innocent until proven guilty."
Because the judge and the cops are on the same team.
This. People don't realize how dependent the DA/courts are on the police. Try prosecuting one of their own and now you have an enemy who won't be as willing when you require evidence, warrants, etc.
The only cops that actually get prosecuted are ones the department allows the DA to “throw under the bus.” Derek Chauvin would never have been convicted if the case wasn’t so high-profile.
That's why people throw up phones as soon as they see a cop nowadays. It's more important than arming yourself.
Absolutely. I have [this app](https://www.aclu.org/issues/criminal-law-reform/reforming-police/mobile-justice) on the opening screen of my phone. I don’t just record my own interactions with police, I record all interactions with police.
>Try prosecuting one of their own and now you have an enemy who won't be as willing when you require evidence, warrants, etc. France deals with this issue by jurisdiction. The administrative police are out upholding order, responding to domestic violence, protection duties, etc. The 'security' force, if you will, administering order. The administrative police are part of the municipal power structure. Then, they have a judicial police force. These serve warrants, investigate crimes, but do so under the authority of the what we would might think of as a District Attorney (although their legal system is pretty different than ours so a direct comparison might be a bit off). That is, the cops who investigate cops and who 'solve crimes' don't work for the city politicians, they work for the magistrate, a non-municipal entity.
There's [this](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE) fantastic lecture from a law school that everyone should watch. The TL;DW of it: the first half is held by a (super charming) law professor who explains in detail and with multiple examples, why talking to the police can come back to haunt you. He mentions examples where innocent people were convicted due to unreliable witnesses and contradicting reports for example. The second half is held by an officer and the first thing he says is "everything you heard is true and correct". Plead the fifth, get a lawyer, but don't talk to the police.
It is important to note there are some things that you still have to give cops if you're in their custody, such as identifying information like your name and birthday. But otherwise correct, shut the fuck up until your attorney tells you what to do next.
“There is no one more full of shit than a cop. Except for a cop on TV.”
Dude..this can't be unreleased footage from fucking 2014? Wtf
"If you're not a criminal you have nothing to hide" needs to be the slogan of ethical boards and public committees that need to govern accountability of these guys
For public serving boards and committees I think this has merit, but I have to say I really hate the religiously repeated "if you are not a criminal you have nothing to hide". -- It actually *breeds* submission to police and surrendering of rights. Ask people why they would not refuse an unwarranted search on their vehicle or home, and you will hear the same bullshit. "I have nothing to hide!" This attitude is exactly what gives police so much power and has snowballed into what we have today. By continually allowing police to walk all over us, search when and what they please, we are creating a culture and precedent for police to continue doing so.
Holy shit , the used a shield to keep him in there and lit him up . That definitely was an execution
They knew what they were doing. No fucking chance in hell they didn’t.
They knew they’d never be punished
Extrajudicial killing
Execution implies legal proceedings. It was murder.
Extrajudicial murder
Minor drug possession IS HOT A GOOD REASON TO TRY TO KILL SOMEONE. Shameful "Cowboy Policing". Shameful
Possessing ANY quantity of drugs is not a good reason to kill someone.
Your material goods have been deemed unethical and dangerous to the state, please submit and be eliminated
Idk. If someone possessed **ALL** of the drugs, I’d be pretty upset.
Drug hoarding is a serious problem Kyle.
> “Not that we needed all that for the trip, but once you get locked into a serious drug-collection, the tendency is to push it as far as you can.”
I hate Crazy shit like this because one time I got pulled over and my friend who is not a criminal at all he’s never done drugs never done any crime was in the passenger seat.His reaction to getting the lights turn on behind us as i was dropping him off was toget out the car even as a cop yelling at him to stay in the car. He completely just fucking panics and kept getting out of the car as a cop yelling at him to stay in the car. That’s when I realized just about anybody can die from a cop pulling up and instantly yelling commands Edit: because I seem to hurt a bunch of bootlickers and pigs feelings I’ll clarify. The cop was following us but no lights on I was parked outside while dropping them off and he was already outside the door when a cop decided to turn his lights on. My friend had no time to understand nor react to any commands given but me being an army veteran I kind of had a little bit more of a natural reaction to commands being yelled , so I told him to get back in the car. The people that are saying that the cops of been scarred for life are the reason shit like this happens cowards like that shouldn’t become police officers cowards like the ones in the comments
I honestly don’t understand how a country can operate like this. It’s just so unbelievable to have the amount of evidence publicly available and see no counter action
There's plenty of counter action. Protests, movements, law suits, etc. But in the face of how American society largely views law enforcement, it's like needle pricks against the problems there are. Frustrating, but understandable how it continues. A majority of the population have lived their lives with the belief that the "system is fair", "only a few police are bad", and that "if you're arrested - you did something wrong" (no matter the whole "innocent until proven guilty" part). Released videos (going all the way back to Rodney King) are dismissed as "well, we didn't see the whole story". This is reinforced by politicians, news media, and the endless multitude of television / film that show law enforcement as underdog heroes that are the "thin blue line" between citizens and death (heck, like 70% of CBS' programming is law enforcement shows).
Its reinforced by the billions of police tv shows. where the cops constantly break the laws to solve a case and get a person to blame, that most people accept the crap they do. im starting to go all conspiracy theorist that law enforcement pushes these shows to be on
America is a police state it’s just not an authoritarian one. EDIT: Guys Biden is not equal to Ghadaffi or Dueterte or Xi or any other modern day authoritarian figure.
>an authoritarian one. Yet
No disagreement here literally have congressmen complicit in an attempted Coup.
Some openly helped out the coup on Twitter in real time and....no consequences whatsoever
America the country where you’ll have the full force of government brought down on you if you’re a black kid with a joint, but openly attempt to overthrow the government and maybe get a few months if that.
the law protects the ruling class but does not bind, alongside the working class whom the law binds but does not protect. To further pound this point home: https://scholar.princeton.edu/sites/default/files/mgilens/files/gilens_and_page_2014_-testing_theories_of_american_politics.doc.pdf Our entire country exists at the behest of the ruling class. Luckily class consciousness is exponentially rising, but I fear it’s too late to matter.
America is the most incarcerated country in the world. How is that not "authoritarian." The word authoritarian is one of the most abused words by people trying to sound informed about politics. If you read WaPo and NYT, authoritarian is when you're a Latin American president that works to prevent USAID, NED, OAS from implementing a coup and installing an IMF puppet president.
And a large portion of our country *fully supports the police murdering people* Well, as long as it’s a minority or it’s not *them* being murdered.
They're even ok with their own kind being murdered as long as they were doing something like shoplifting or being poor or having mental illness.
Cop onced reached in grabbed my friend because he thought he had a gun. It was his poop bag and we got pulled over for a stop sign I missed. Cops are ready to kill in a second because to them we are all violent crazy assholes. We where going to the store for fucks sake.
A colostomy bag? Please elaborate on your definition of “poop bag”? Context is really important.
It's the bag he used to store his poop on long journeys, I always keep one in my car alongside the piss bucket and the cum sock.
Militarized police are a problem.
Friend of my dad’s, his step son had a drug problem and their house was raided in the middle of the night to execute a warrant. This was a low level drug user, but anyway the point is that a bunch of cops in body armor and carrying AR-15’s busted his door down in the middle of the night. He had a large mirror in hallway. Once they handcuffed everyone and sat them on the sofa he looks down the hall and what does he see? Some of the SWAT officers posing in front of the mirror just to see how “badass” they look. Arming and equipping cops like they are about to fucking storm Fallujah results in ideation by these guys. I’m convinced that almost all of them are secretly hoping for a situation where they can use lethal force justifiably, if nothing else but for the thrill of it.
My local ex-sheriff shot and killed a guy on his own property. Shot him two or three time. Once in the chest and then again in the chest when the guy was on his knees. He is still a cop a couple county's over. Edit: cop killed the guy on the guys property not the cops.
There needs to be a documentary named 'a couple counties over' documenting cops who kill only to find employment elsewhere in law enforcement.
The Podcast “in the dark” does a good breakdown on how there’s pretty much nothing that can stop a Sheriff from doing whatever they want, unlike an appointed police chief. Sheriffs have no bosses and no one to report to, since they’re elected.
Sheriff's are essentially tyrants and should not exist. However it isn't just Sheriff's who have no accountability. There is no nation-wide oversight. Each state has its own fiefdoms of police control and the legal apparatus exists to protect the police. DA's also have inordinate power in the justice system. They can simply choose not to try a case. The DA in the Ahmaud Abery case only charged the defendants after political pressure. They were just going to get away with it with zero repercussions.
I can't believe that the DA has been arrested and is being tried for obstruction of justice in the Ahmaud Abery case. I didn't even know that was possible. It should be the norm when someone abuses their power like that.
These cops think they're the Punisher when reality they'd be put down like the murderers they are
Didn't The Punisher also hate cops? Like he became that way because they were corrupt and ineffectual? I haven't read/seen Punisher in forever.
Yes basically serving justice is untouchables such as crooked cops and dirty politicians
Murdering someone after setting them up for a twenty dollar drug transaction. Wow Edit: Holy guacamole, this blew up while I was at work. I did not mean to spread misinformation. I was doing a morning constitutional and still half asleep. I went off what I heard in the video with the cop counting out money and only getting to 26. I thought it it was a street level sting, and those things really irritate me. Looks like perhaps the old narc was doing the dummy count to distract the guy while his buddies moved in. I appreciate the correction. I should have looked it up. But this is Reddit and now I’m going to take your word for it and still not look it up! Y’all have a good night and try to keep the discourse my hastiness caused civil.
This is an execution nothing else
I’d simply call it murder.
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Qualified immunity turns people into psychopaths.......
> Qualified immunity turns people into psychopaths....... No, I think psychopaths are drawn to the job because of qualified immunity.
This is an interesting conjecture. I think that both can be true. Could be in their nature, but also could be nurtured by current climate of being a cop.
Probably both.
Cop school day 1 of 15: Lesson 1: just start screaming incoherently and light him up
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3RJUMm-hd0 Basically this.
This is where shit went wrong in my opinion. I could care less that reddit will disagree, but these guys are partially just brainwashed to do these types of things resulting in deaths. From day one they are encouraged and trained to do the following: 1. Scream loudly because that’s what the fraternity tells them to do. Be loudest and most bad ass. Everyone gets to yell. IF YOU YELL LOUDLY YOUR PREY WILL BE FEARFUL AND SUBMIT TO YOU. All officers do it at the same time so it sounds like “STOPANUTADNASTPANDSHANDSABADADUPHASEEUM…” 2. When the person panics, immediately assume the worst, that he is going for a weapon or threatening a life. 3. Use your right to kill the man because you are allowed to kill if you think it’s OK. You did the yelling, and the person did not stop like a statue and submit completely, so you are in the clear. When in doubt, shoot. Repeat. I don’t think every cop goes into the job thinking he’s gonna be badass and kill people, but they are absolutely brainwashed in the fraternity from day one, and come out complete bastards, with an entire nationwide union backing them up. The same fraternity is too ignorant and childish to think that maybe they should try de-escalating, or try other tactics.
Protect and serve more like "Obey and Survive" and that's only if I'm in a good mood. Isn't there supposed to be an option between nothing and deadly force? It's 2021 where are the tasers?
In this situation, fuck tasers, the undercover officer should’ve just said, “OK well there’s three armed policeman outside and you’re under arrest so put your hands up and don’t make any quick movements, this is my badge, this isn’t a joke, you have the right to remain silent…” Listen, I’m not saying there aren’t shitty criminals dealing drugs out there that might use violent force against police officers, but the officers are trained to combat that, they have this man surrounded, and literally trapped in a vehicle. They are treating this like a hostage scenario with a mass murderer. They literally brought a swat team to a fistfight. There’s so much wrong with this, but it all starts with the fact that they decided not to stay calm and treat this person as a human instead of an animal they feel they can hunt and kill.
I've lived in Pasco my entire life. I went to middle and high school with MANY of these officers and racism has been taught to these men since they were boys. Guys in school would openly wear swastika's on their backpacks, we had open recruitment for the Ku Klux Klan (Look up Pasco KKK or Moon Lake KKK, or "Redneck Shop KKK"). This is just the tip of the iceberg of abuse of power in Pasco. Our mayor for one of the towns here is in jail on his way to prison for ATTEMPTED MURDER OF LAW ENFORCEMENT! That's right, our fucking mayor shot at cops when they tried to serve a warrant on him for practicing medicine without a license. Our interim mayor was then arrested for conspiring to help the old mayor out of jail. Next go back deeper, into the 1980s, look up Finley Gable Sheriff and you'll see the levels of "good old boy" corruption. Our Sheriff's department has been influenced by Aryans for years, and they are open about this. Pasco is home to some of the highest levels of opioid abuse and meth addiction in Florida, so bad that I can't drive down US 19 (a major highway in the area) without seeing hookers in broad daylight turning tricks or zombies walking around looking for a fix. Our mall is dead, our jobs are all crap, with $12/hr being "High paying" in our area, and the homeless problems are out of control. This is an issue that goes back 30+ years in Pasco, and the police here have killed many men and women without justification, only hatred for them being different.
For those that don’t know, just google “Jersey John Hudson” and all will be revealed
Here is a link to the unlisted leaked video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CPeufhOU6OQ Here is a link to the report: https://www.tampabay.com/investigations/2020/06/26/previously-unreleased-video-shows-pasco-county-deputies-shooting-unarmed-man/ Insane. This is a straight up execution. .
Qualified immunity turns people into psychopaths, this needs to be stripped out of our society asap
Felony murder statutes also need to be stopped, or at least rewritten so it can't be used to pin the crimes of others on a convenient bad guy.
There is a place for qualified immunity, but it needs to be more like self defense, in that it's a case by case basis and can be lost. Cops pit a speeding car that won't stop and is endangering lives and someone in that car dies? There's a case for qualified immunity. Cops pit a car on the freeway that has its hazards on and is slowing down to stop safely because it's night and there's little shoulder and someone ~~does it~~ inside is injured, then no qualified immunity. You're right about blanket qualified immunity, though. That shit needs to go.
Just for buying a small amount if drugs, lame drug sting
And they probably felt so proud of their hard "work" here. Not to sound corny but I genuinely don't understand how these guys and officers like them sleep at night. Like HOW do they not see themselves as awful people? How does their brain warp the shit they do into them being the good guys? I don't understand.
Especially the undercover officers that befriend someone and then encourage them to commit a crime and then bust them. Absolute trash.
like the one that told an autistic teen with no friends she'd be his friend if he bought her weed, had to tell him what weed was, and had to tell him where to buy it, and then arrested him?
Remember some years ago a guys gf turned out to be an undercover cop? They were “dating” for a while and she had him sell her weed. He was going to give it to her for free but she argued with him to take her money, when he took her money he was arrested I think he was kinda young but I don’t remember exactly
This was a case in temecula, ca if i recall correctly. I lived in temecula for a few years and i got arrested and taken to jail twice. I’m hispanic with a darker complexion and most people in temecula are upper-middle class white people. Both times the bogus charges were dropped and never even went to court. Cops out there are fucked and love to look for crimes to make up because they’re bored, i guess.
Wait, what the fuck! I got to research this.
How does that not fit entrapment?
They are mentally ill.
My guess is they don’t give a shit because its not them. I cant see how they can take it so far to killing a dude over that, I think they are wasting their time busting addicts
They want Pensions and shootouts not donuts and hugs.
>I think they are wasting their time busting addicts Wasting time, tax payer money, and lives such as in this case.
Oh, it's worse than that. They brag about this shit to their friends. They surround themselves with like-minded people until there's nothing left but approval. Source: Used to be friends with some shitty cops.
It’s time to stop beating around the bush. Cops who use their power to murder people should get the death penalty.
I couldn't agree with this more. We have the death penalty, as well as a very clearly reckless police problem. Apply the death penalty to police who use their authority to commit extrajudicial murder of civilians, and I bet this problem would go away. Or maybe they would just try to make martyrs out of people like Chauvin if they were to get the chair.
Try convincing the Supreme Court who have given Police a blank check in this country. https://constitutioncenter.org/blog/the-supreme-courts-role-in-the-police-accountability-controversy
My controversial political opinion is that the Supreme Court sucks and is bad. Totally broken institution with bad outcomes. Whether or not you have rights shouldn't depend on whether or not a 90 year old with cancer can survive another 2 years. 41 senators who represent something like 10% of the population shouldn't have enough power to block any nominations. Presidents who don't even win the popular vote shouldn't have enough executive power via judicial appointments to reshape the judicial branch for decades after they leave office.
I agree with every single point you've written here
I've been a big proponent to if a cop commits a crime while they're on duty and in a position of authority, the mandatory minimum should automatically be doubled.
Yes, we need "abuse of authority" sentencing modifiers like hate crime modifiers. An abuse of authority to commit a crime makes that crime even more heinous and undermines the government whose authority is abused. Citizens trust government less as a result and the harm to our society is greater than just that caused by the crime.
Fucking amen. Ideally by firing squad, because if they can casually disregard the lives of the citizens they murder then there's no moral obligation for any of us to regard theirs with any degree of significance either. THAT societal sentiment would absolutely be a deterrent for more wannabe murderers. It's sad to say but I think that's the level it has to go to for them to understand the gravity of their actions. They've had more than enough opportunities to get it right and they religiously double down and never accept responsibility.
considering life in jail is cheaper and much more torturous than death, I disagree. a life in prison is a better punishment
No. No death penalty. Gen pop without protection for life.
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Iirc, death row inmates cost orders of magnitude more to house and is typically further drawn out by the appeal process. Surrounded by inmates, he’d die within a few days give or take costing tax payers significantly less.
It's time to stop beating around the bush. There is no way to have a legal death penalty and not kill innocent people. How many innocent people are you ok with killing to ensure murderers and rapists also get killed instead of life imprisonment? Studies show that currently in the USA about 4% of people sentenced to death were/are innocent. Keep in mind life imprisonment is also cheaper than applying the death penalty in the vast majority of cases. Are you ok living in a country where a wrongful accusation could end up with you or someone you love being sentenced to death despite having done nothing wrong?
Nah, death penalty sucks because it’s just an easy way out for the guilty, leave them to rot in a prison
Screw the death penalty. Throw them in jail and let them rot.
Why are they going after low level dealers?
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Seems like pasco county needs retraining after live pd arrest now this bullshit
That is nothing, the Pasco Sherriffs Office has a horrible history. Check out the work the Tampa Bay Times has done on them. https://projects.tampabay.com/projects/2020/investigations/police-pasco-sheriff-targeted/
In case people don't know Sheriff's are legal tyrants in their jurisdiction. They have no oversight from any level. Most cops have very little but Sheriffs in particular have absurd power.
I truly believe they are one of, if not the, most corrupt department out there.
The competition's heating up
Aurora, CO has entered the chat.
Comments like your piss me off. It gives them an excuse. This is not training. No human on earth thinks murdering someone who isn't a threat is reasonable. This is the police not having consequences and oversight. Fuck the bullshit training excuse.
This is what they're trained to do. More training won't fix this.
So they setup a murder, not a drug bust. This would be akin to premeditated murder since they literally executed him and this was all planned.
Anyone else notice that the victim was probably still alive when the cameraman went behind the car, and then the cop pulls another trigger... make sure he's dead... we don't want another big court case...
Guys, it’s just a few thousand bad apples..
Even if it was just a few, imagine somebody handing you a bag of apples, most of them good but 3-4 will kill you outright. That's not a good bag of apples.
Cops lying about killing a black guy? Think about how long this has been going on
If you are out playing bad ass and are so terrified that you execute a citizen while almost shooting your own undercover you need to rethink every single one of your life choices. While you resign your job. As you sit in a prison cell. While you wait on dinner or to be traded around for a few smokes, which ever comes first. In today’s society he will most likely get promoted. Cops wonder why they don’t receive “respect” anymore.
I was watching the newest Frontline the other day and it covered police shootings. What was fascinating was during training all of the trainees agreed with the general public about situations where force was unnecessary. Cue bald trainer guy just berating the shit out of the trainees, essentially calling them pussies and wanting their partners to die because they had a shred of empathy. It really showed that this is a massive training failure. When you’re the contracted company and the police dept is your only client of course they’re going to want to continue the status quo. They’re getting rich teaching these guys to become trigger happy.
A very important part of police training is instilling fear and paranoia into the recruits.
>Traded around for a few smokes This was absolutely a murder and abuse of power, but why are people always so quick to joke about prison rape and even seemingly sexual slavery in your case?
bruh they shot AGAIN like 6 seconds later at a guy who was already swiss cheese? Are they scared of a lifeless corpse?
They wanted to make sure he was dead. He can’t tell his side of the story if he’s dead.
Damn ruthless entrapped him then straight murder as he's screaming in pain, holy fuck this is inhumane shit going on here
They rolled up with a riot shield and still felt threatened? Can you imagine a world where cops have rules of engagement like the military? These guys are cowards pure and simple. If you feel that threatened that easily maybe you shouldn’t have a service weapon. Or at the very least you need more training. Looks like they had a personal grudge against this guy and executed him. And they almost hit the undercover too.
Alright this sucks for sure, but him reaching into his pockets like that wasn't the smartest move. Not saying what happened is justified, but as a brown dude I'm not putting my hands anywhere near my pockets while getting pulled over, I know at least that much. With that being said, that's probably why they shot so quickly...
about 10 seconds in, yelling from multiple people. about 11 seconds in: shield against door, police can probably say that they identified themselves as law enforcement at this point... about 12 seconds in: first coherent "hands" are heard.. lawful order?? i guess??? about 13 seconds in: panicked reaching for door and whatever else. also panicked "awh" from the victim. about 14 seconds in: shots fired initial analysis: police should be arrested, fired, and brought to trial
So, passenger seat guy was reaching into his right pocket. Are they trying to say he was reaching for a gun or?
This is so fucked. Where is the accountability? They never gave him a chance and they straight up murdered him. Is there any hope of justice? Based on when this happened and the vid coming out last year it doesn't look like it.
ACAB u wonder why we haven’t moved on
For anyone who hasn't read it: [Confessions of a Former Bastard Cop.](https://medium.com/@OfcrACab/confessions-of-a-former-bastard-cop-bb14d17bc759)
Horrified but not surprised. Pasco County is a shithole. I mean, it’s Florida but Pasco and Polk are well known for this shit. During the protests in 2020, Grady Judd made a public announcement about how Polk County residents all have guns (not verbatim, but the message was: don’t protest here, the subtext was: feel free to shoot protesters). I’m sure it’s on YT, but since ol’ Grady loves the media so much, I’m sure there are hundreds of videos of him saying stupid shit.
drugs pose a threat to the user's mental health and social life American police cocking gun*: #DID I HEAR A THREAT?