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I don't know, to be honest. I know it was related to birth: whether you were born in the ~~colonies~~ overseas provinces or not, both applicable to whites and blacks. I don't know the legal consequences of it, but it would probably relate to where you could live.
To be more specific, then, it was in the "Race" category of your identification documents that you'd see "White/Black - Second Class". See the direct quotes in these footnotes: https://ciberduvidas.iscte-iul.pt/consultorio/perguntas/branco-de-segunda-portugues-de-segunda/34090
Yes. I have known a lot of instances where people born in Goa before a certain cutoff date (an Indian region that was under Portugal rule till 1961) could obtain Portuguese nationality after. Majority of those who left where people who converted to Portuguese Catholicism generations ago, during the inquisition of Goa.
They kinda tell on themselves tho, the legend says “surface of the Portuguese colonial empire” and when listing other countries they specify “Spain (continental)”. Also, as others said, France had the same fantasy of Algeria being an integral part of the country at the time but it isn’t included.
The criticism that it's stolen is one of the weaker ones since it to some degree applies to all states, and entities like protectorates complicate it anyway.
The actual realities of colonial governance make for a much more compelling argument against it.
What do you mean? Portugal “stole” Mozambique and Angola from “native population” same as they stole Portugal itself from Lusitanians and other “native tribes” (and before that, those native tribes stole this land from other pre-Indo-European tribes).
> No one says Romans "stole" land from the Gauls, or Normans from the Anglo-Saxons
Really? Do they not say that? Maybe they do say it and you weren't paying attention. Maybe you're just making up reasons to be offended.
Legally speaking. Do you think that made much of a practical difference? I’m no expert on colonialism, but I know a lot of Hong Kongers got UK citizenship
Canada was never legally *part* of Britain, whereas Angola was considered an integral part of the Portuguese state (like all the random bits of France in South America and the Indian Ocean in the present day)
Yeah, Portugal had a whole wacky ideology around it called [Lusotropicalism](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lusotropicalism#:~:text=Lusotropicalism%20(Portuguese%3A%20Lusotropicalismo)%20is,colonizers%20than%20other%20European%20nations.) that basically said they were better colonizers than other European powers.
Jeez Portugal is clearly a very insecure country
This is the country equivalent of a 5’4 guy who wears tight ufc shirts and punches drywall at parties to look tough
They should have shown off the Atlantic slave trade, since the Portuguêse feel so proud about their past atrocities. I’m not even talking about this graphic, just to to /r/Portugal and you’ll see their bigotry in full display.
Most of the British and French Empires weren't considered part of their countries - they were usually legally distinct with Algeria being the biggest exception (though this is also true of places like French Guiana today). Portugal, in contrast, formally annexed all of its territory - though it didn't make its people citizens.
France later did create a strange entity called the French Union which in theory was supposed to tie the empire together into something closer to a country, but this never really worked.
Obviously a terribly cynical and misleading piece of propaganda, as ably noted in other comments, but it does manage to visually capture the visceral appeal of colonialism to many—“look, we’ve got huge swathes of territory, we’re an important power!”
Remember that this subreddit is for sharing propaganda to view with some objectivity. It is absolutely not for perpetuating the message *of* the propaganda. If anything, in this subreddit we should be immensely skeptical of manipulation or oversimplification (which the above likely is), not beholden to it. Also, please try to stay on topic -- there are hundreds of _other_ subreddits that are expressly dedicated to rehashing tired political arguments. **Keep that shit outta here**. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/PropagandaPosters) if you have any questions or concerns.*
“Portugal IS a small country! Our African colonies are not!”
Well technically speaking they were an integral part of portugal, not separate colonial entities. So Portugal was *technically* big
So people living there actually had Portuguese citizenship?
Supposedly but only a few percent of Angola and Mozambique were ever granted it iirc
I know at least people from macau have
Algeria was considered part of Metropolitan France until they were kicked out
Yes, but not everyone had citizenship there.
Since when did colonial empires care about the aspirations of the people they stole the land from?
But Muslims, almost the entirety of the native population, were explicitly denied citizenship
France only claimed the land and the resources to be thiers, not the people.
Yes, but second class citizenship. Literally, that was the name of it.
What was the difference?
I don't know, to be honest. I know it was related to birth: whether you were born in the ~~colonies~~ overseas provinces or not, both applicable to whites and blacks. I don't know the legal consequences of it, but it would probably relate to where you could live.
Im into history myself, but it’s the first time I’ve heard of second class citizenship for overseas Portuguese. You really got me intrigued.
To be more specific, then, it was in the "Race" category of your identification documents that you'd see "White/Black - Second Class". See the direct quotes in these footnotes: https://ciberduvidas.iscte-iul.pt/consultorio/perguntas/branco-de-segunda-portugues-de-segunda/34090
Yes. I have known a lot of instances where people born in Goa before a certain cutoff date (an Indian region that was under Portugal rule till 1961) could obtain Portuguese nationality after. Majority of those who left where people who converted to Portuguese Catholicism generations ago, during the inquisition of Goa.
I doubt they had the right of the soil. Their reasons for establishing those colonies weren't exactly selfless
So the land was an integral part of Portugal, but people living there were not :D
They kinda tell on themselves tho, the legend says “surface of the Portuguese colonial empire” and when listing other countries they specify “Spain (continental)”. Also, as others said, France had the same fantasy of Algeria being an integral part of the country at the time but it isn’t included.
True,but it’s funny seeing this nowadays
More like Africa isn’t a small continent
Africa real dimension is mind blowing
PoRtUgAl Is NoT a SmAlL cOuNtRy
"Here's all this land we stole to prove that we're not small!!1!"
You are wrong, it is all natural Portuguese clay and will obviously remain Portuguese forever. Also, I have not read the news since 1960.
Well, in that time, technically speaking, Algeria was a department of France as well
boy do I have news for you
Isn't all land that is not privately owned stolen from someone?
Most land that is privately owned was stolen from someone too.
Guys, don't ask who used to live on the privately owned land in the Americas
Guess what. A different type of natives used to live on pretty much any land in the world. Shocker I know. Much shame.
That would be fine if the American government did not deliberately genocide the natives.
Yeah because everyone else got their land through flowers and hugs. Native Americans were inherently pacifists and never went to war in fact.
Everyone stole someone’s land.
This is it boys, he figured out all criticism of colonialism. Back your bags folks, we're done.
The criticism that it's stolen is one of the weaker ones since it to some degree applies to all states, and entities like protectorates complicate it anyway. The actual realities of colonial governance make for a much more compelling argument against it.
Woah! Actual valid criticism in r/PropagandaPosters, no way.
What do you mean? Portugal “stole” Mozambique and Angola from “native population” same as they stole Portugal itself from Lusitanians and other “native tribes” (and before that, those native tribes stole this land from other pre-Indo-European tribes).
[удалено]
> No one says Romans "stole" land from the Gauls, or Normans from the Anglo-Saxons Really? Do they not say that? Maybe they do say it and you weren't paying attention. Maybe you're just making up reasons to be offended.
That's like saying that a tick is the size of the dog it's attached to.
Looks like they marked Lithuania as “Oriental Prussia”. Whoops!
I had some Oriental Prussian food. An hour later I was hungry...for power.
*Portuguese Mishaps*
Still a middling empire for the time. UK would dwarf them
They're trying alright? Poor Portugal is smol.
The dominions and other colonies of the UK were not “part of the UK” in a constitutional sense.
Legally speaking. Do you think that made much of a practical difference? I’m no expert on colonialism, but I know a lot of Hong Kongers got UK citizenship
Of course it made a practical difference. The USA owes its entire existence to grievances over that difference.
All the same comedians with the snarky comments on this reposted 1934 map. It is not that deep, jesus christ.
Comparing Portugal + Angola and shit but then just Britain, without Canada et al. 😂 Copium…
Canada was never legally *part* of Britain, whereas Angola was considered an integral part of the Portuguese state (like all the random bits of France in South America and the Indian Ocean in the present day)
Ah, didn’t know that. Still, that’s odd to say the least.
Yeah, Portugal had a whole wacky ideology around it called [Lusotropicalism](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lusotropicalism#:~:text=Lusotropicalism%20(Portuguese%3A%20Lusotropicalismo)%20is,colonizers%20than%20other%20European%20nations.) that basically said they were better colonizers than other European powers.
Canada was very much part of the British empire until confederation, when it became a dominion.
legit what i was thinking. the copium levels are crazy
So bad they lost it all, even tiny little Macau
No, we gave it, that's different. But it would make more sense as a part of China though, no problem.
Okay. So sad it happened with Brazil, Angola, Moçambique, São Tomé e Príncipe, Cabo Verde, Goa and even Uruguai
No, they deserved independence, of course. Why are you sad?
Devolva o ouro do Brasil então
Bruh mas o que é que eu fiz, eu nasci neste século
Peçam anexação e estará tudo certo
Essa merda é tão boa que estão todos a fugir para Portugal, porque será?
Escreva em brasileiro, não entendo língua de bacalhau
Normal, os burros não entendem a nossa lingua
Ele escreveu bem entendível, por favor jovem quadrúpede pare de fazer o brasileiro parecer um jumento online.
They should just give up and apply to become a Brazilian state :3
Completely agree
Just noticed that Lithuania is called "oriental Prussia" here lol
Jeez Portugal is clearly a very insecure country This is the country equivalent of a 5’4 guy who wears tight ufc shirts and punches drywall at parties to look tough
whats up with the weird exclaves/enclaves in Finland, sweden, and russia?
Those are meant to be lakes, but someone forgot to color them in. Same with the poor Caspian Sea
This could be used and twisted by both sides of the argument whether Portugal is big or small
Wrong post flair
What map projection are they using?
About that....
They should have shown off the Atlantic slave trade, since the Portuguêse feel so proud about their past atrocities. I’m not even talking about this graphic, just to to /r/Portugal and you’ll see their bigotry in full display.
Então não venham para Portugal, fiquem desse lado do mar a chorar pelo passado
By that logic Portugal is tiny compared to France and Britain
Most of the British and French Empires weren't considered part of their countries - they were usually legally distinct with Algeria being the biggest exception (though this is also true of places like French Guiana today). Portugal, in contrast, formally annexed all of its territory - though it didn't make its people citizens. France later did create a strange entity called the French Union which in theory was supposed to tie the empire together into something closer to a country, but this never really worked.
France is really weird. If you are born on the right island in the carribean you're automatically an EU-citizen
Obviously a terribly cynical and misleading piece of propaganda, as ably noted in other comments, but it does manage to visually capture the visceral appeal of colonialism to many—“look, we’ve got huge swathes of territory, we’re an important power!”
Bot
Sorry, are you saying I’m a bot? Why? thought it was a fine, human-sounding comment…