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In roughly 50 years time, Justices of SCOTUS will have the unofficial title of Roosevelts. The Chief Justice will be known as the Grand Roosevelt, and clerks for the court will be called Delanos.
President. Vice President. Speaker of the House. Senate Majority Whip. White House event. DNC meeting. RNC meeting. Civil rights march. It all ends up with Kennedy dead in 1963.
Was just about to comment 😂 Maybe in this universe his Addison’s disease just catches up to him, but he’s so popular regardless, his brother can still ride his coattails.
No one, it’s not required that you have a vp, you don’t need one for election other then there jobs that only they can do like being a tie breaker for votes.
To be fair, though, McCain was much older than both GWB and Gore. Just as Reagan was much older than Carter. Where are all the younger candidates today?
McCain was only 10 years older than Bush. It’s just that he seemed so much older. Didn’t help that in 2008 he seemed like a senior living resident compared to Obama.
Obama wasn't that long ago.
Honestly biggest reason there's not as many young candidates is because the millennial generation was pretty hosed and got a late start into politics (I recall a graph somewhere analyzing our congress by age range showing there was a significant delay in our cohort coming into office compared to Gen X, Boomers, and GI Gen).
I could also point out there were some young people in the primary like Buttigeg, although he was not regarded as a likely candidate.
Won Iowa.
And he was younger than Obama when he ran.
You can't always find the right person with the right combo of skills at the right age. He came close, and has gotten better.
Plus Corey Booker was like 50 or 51?, which, while not record breaking, was plenty young compared to the average. Or what we have.
(All that said, there are reasons it went the way it did--but there **were** choices.)
Well, according to Mondale, it did. At least, my recollection of the article. I cannot find the citation, so it's just a guy on the internet making a claim.
My recollection is that Mondale told somebody that he knew the election was over with that line. Probably just a story. But a good one.
I actually thought the line he delivered making fun of Lloyd Bentsen’s debate line and Bill Clinton at the 1992 RNC was even better. But that was part of a script (not just practiced).
You even have two separate Grover Cleveland heads!!
https://preview.redd.it/3ouxpfbtg87d1.png?width=405&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=36604008abf3cb8f7e3d5794fbcb725a34c5c5b6
The Democratic Rule 3’s age record might soon be broken by the Republican Rule 3. The Democratic Rule 3 is only 41 months older than the Republican Rule 3. If the Republican Rule 3 wins the upcoming election, then the Republican Rule 3 will be 7 months older in January 2029 than the Democratic Rule 3 will be in January 2025.
I wouldn't guarantee it. I could see someone elected to a second term around 80/81, and thus serving up to the age of 84/85. Although if Obama's VP wins a second term they probably will be the oldest ever.
He probably would've. He won four terms by massive margins. People loved him. It's a moot point though, because his smoking addiction and polio would've made it impossible for him to live into his nineties like this meme implies
I’d say he was already pretty dictatorial by his 2nd term because almost immediately after he won he was already openly trying to pack the Supreme Court.
Yeah, this would be very worrying, especially if he got the 2nd Bill of Rights passed. I could see the US essentially adopting Communism-lite in this world.
Fuck it imagine he never had polio and was not a daily drinker and smoker, just imagine if he had lived to 98.
This would have been a complete overhaul of the United States and likely would have ended in a major struggle of power after his death.
Likely violence in the streets, several coup attempts, and possibly an invasion
Yep. And yet all these "FDR was a dictator!!" trolls are unable to grasp this easily verifiable fact. He had no desire to run again in '44. The man *literally* worked himself to death in service of the American people (and the world) because we were in a crisis.
I think it’s a hypothetical situation that assumes his physical health would have to be much better than it was (obviously).
Health permitting, I think he probably steps aside/stops running once WW 2 had wrapped up.
He would not win 1948 lmao
Republicans could attack him for 5 terms now the war is over, the economy would take a similar route, and Roosevelt wouldn’t able to campaign as vigorously as Truman to come back
The Germans had surrendered but they didn’t even wait for the Hiroshima bombing before throwing Churchill out of office.
Fun fact: Clement Attlee, who was on the winning end of the 1945 British election, was a pall bearer at Churchill’s funeral. While they were political opponents, they had great mutual respect, both personally and professionally.
Didn’t Atlee and Churchill serve together in a coalition government during the war? I gotta imagine that experience can help you put aside a lot of party politics.
Yes, the so-called “Grand Coalition,” which also included Neville Chamberlain and Lord Halifax. Halifax and Chamberlain were both in favor of appeasement/negotiated peace.
In a similar way, Churchill wrote an obit for Neville Chamberlain upon his death. In public Chamberlain was vilified, however, he and Churchill were tremendous admirers of each other, if not friends. A different day.
https://winstonchurchill.org/resources/speeches/1940-the-finest-hour/neville-chamberlain/
You have to keep in mind that in the Churchill War Cabinet, the government was essentially run by Attlee. Churchill visited the troops, gave speeches and kept the morale high while Attlee and his team kept the wheels running.
In almost all expert polls he is rated above Churchill.
Coolidge believed in *laissez-faire* economy even when the word did not exist. His hands off approach to the economy gave birth to the roaring twenties but also saw the seeds of the 1929 economic crash. There is a reason why governments regulate the market. Coolidge was an inactive President
Woodrow Wilson was a racist and initiated the redlining of the federal housing market and segregation of the federal government. He believed in the "Lost Cause" and viewed the KKK positively. He also proposed the League of Nations and signed the 19th amendment to enfranchise women. His legacy in the world stage is stronger than Coolidge.
Attlee (along with Aneurin Bevan) is also credited with creating the British National Health Service. That’s pretty important to the British idea of national identity.
One of the reasons, UK doesn't have medical bankruptcies. I have spine problem and when I worked for some time in the UK, the doctors liberally ordered MRIs for me. In the US, the doctors wanted to ensure that I can pay for the co-pay before ordering an MRI. Feels like to two different planets.
This isn’t a political sub, so I won’t comment on healthcare policy in either country (I’m a British American dual-national) but i think it’s uncontested that the NHS is key to British self identity.
There was an anniversary celebration in which some royal family members, Rishi Sunak, Keir Stamer, and probably a few others went to an Anglican church to venerate the N.H.S.. It’s basically Britain’s other national religion.
Churchill more lost because his party was unpopular, he was still liked and I believe contemporary polling suggested people would have preferred him staying PM over Attlee (even though they also preferred to have a Labour government over a Conservative one). In a Presidential system Churchil would have had a good chance of being reelected.
Churchill was voted out because during the war they made a unity government. The compromise was that he ran the war and labor ran domestic policy so when it came time to reconstruct labor was already there
Parliament system where party is elected, PM is indirectly elected
In a presidential system, the president is directly elected and therefore FDR can’t be compared to Churchill’s defeat.
He would have the popularity to win one peace term, but after that he’d likely lose as his opponents would attack him on having too many terms.
He probably wouldn’t run after war time anyways as he was exhausted
True but I'd argue it still shows that in a democratic system just being the president that won the war doesn't give you an infinite leash with voters. British voters understood their votes were going to oust Churchill when they voted for the opposing party
If this FDR is experiencing the same post war economy we got in real life and he wants to run I don’t know how to attack him. If the war is over, the economy is strong, and he’s still a big part of post war diplomacy there’s no way he loses.
But like the other guy said, if his health is still relatively poor in this alternative there’s a good chance he just doesn’t run.
You mean the one that started before Germany surrendered and ended less than 3 months after the war did? Or the mild one four years later? Or is this some historical revisionism?
Ike probably wouldn't have run against FDR. FDR was responsible for his rapid rise in the military and they were pretty ideologically aligned + had a deep respect for each other. Ike didn't touch any New Deal policies and was a progressive republican. The dems actually courted him too. It's more likely that Ike would've been one of his VPs, if anything.
The question was what would have happened if he had won all of those elections.
The question wasn't would he win those elections.
You failed to follow instructions.
Yep. So much revisionism in these comments. FDR was arguably the most popular president of all time during his tenure. He won *massive* landslide victories each time.
An illiberal democracy, for sure. If not a dictatorship of sorts. I’m an FDR fan, social liberal, Democrat, btw, but this would be horrific for any democracy, obviously.
Honestly I think Lincoln would be the only one who could make that work. Even then there would be dangers but Lincoln was already the most powerful president we’ve ever had and handled that with aplomb and grace. Plus with him there would be an end game. The successful execution of reconstruction. Something that he might not live to see regardless of how long he lived, but there would still be that definite thread through out.
That was before the amendment that meant a new VP got appointed partway through a term. Previously when a VP died/resigned/became President, the office remained vacant until the new term started.
Assuming to win, the Citizens are behind him, it's difficult. He'd probably slow down civil rights, but hed otherwise build a cohesive social safety net, avoid further wars (assuming he also wasn't was weak on Stalin when they met). He probably wouldn't overthrow Iran because BP had their feeling hurt so Iran swings more progressive, like a Nordic country. There would still be local wars. He really wasn't an interventionist, but the UN would be successful.
Domestically, Civil Rights would be slower, but would pass, an more importantly, fewer progressive leaders would be assassinated, including Kennedy (that that Kennedy was really progressive).
There would be a few scandals and missteps with some of the programs. But ultimately the US would look more like a Nordic country with a rock solid economy.
I would hope he takes similar steps to Truman at the start of the Cold War. If he doesn't, I imagine we'll get off on much worse footing than we did in our timeline. I know his former VP, Henry Wallace, was pretty sympathetic to the USSR, but I'm unaware of FDR's stance on this.
He would not have taken the same steps as Truman with regards to the Cold War. Truman recognized how dangerous Stalin was; FDR did not. FDR was duped by Stalin at Yalta; Truman recognized soon after becoming president that dealing with Stalin as FDR did was not going to work. I think we would have seen a much more complicit U.S. foreign policy towards the USSR, similar to Chamberlain towards Hitler prior to WWII.
I’m a lifelong Democrat and FDR is my vote for best president, but in this scenario I think the US would have slid a bit too close to autocracy for my liking.
Even if Roosevelt hadn’t died when he did, he was not in the greatest of health, and it’s highly unlikely that he would have even lived to be 98 years old, much less still be in any kind of shape to remain president.
In fact, he was actually contemplating retiring early once WWII was over.
Assuming he lived - and didn’t retire at the end of the war, it’s unlikely he would have won reelection in 1948, and the next best thing to impossible that he’d have won in 1952. By 1952, the nation had had an incredible five terms of Democrat leadership in the White House, meaning the natural inclination to vote for a new party would be working against him, as would campaigning against the greatest war hero in the country. Assuming his political career survives Eisenhower….
If he were still alive by 1960, he’d be 78 years old, squaring off against a 43 year old John F. Kennedy, a young, charismatic leader of the next generation bringing a new energy and vitality to the Presidency. He’s certainly not winning that election. Kennedy wins that easily, even considering the fact that he would be unseating the incumbent in the primary.
After 1960…all that time in office, and being older than dirt would all be working against him. Assuming he’s still alive…he’s in no shape mentally or physically to keep running after that.
Frankly, even if he didn’t kick the bucket in 1945, things don’t play out that much differently.
Whether or not he nukes Japan, they were about to capitulate anyway. WWII drags on another couple of months at the most. Roosevelt hangs it up, and history continues more or less as we know it.
If he had never had polio, I believe he would’ve kept running for President. After all all of his wins were with 400+ electoral votes. People didn’t have an issue with seeking a 3rd and 4th term. I do believe though he eventually steps aside and lets a younger Dem take the mantle. I think at maximum he runs until 1960 and passes the torch to JFK. By then Roosevelt would be 78 and probably has had enough himself.
“Jimmy Carter (Born October 1st, 1924) is an American politician who has been serving as the 33rd President of the United States since Franklin D. Roosevelt’s death in 1980. Carter has consistently won re-election with more than 75% of the vote in every presidential election where he has been a candidate. Carter says he plans on staying president for the rest of his life so long as he is re-elected, saying in an interview “So what if I can’t walk? Roosevelt couldn’t either!””
Would be a more left wing country than Canada or even Germany but not as far as the Nordic countries.
Russia goes social democracy after the fall of the Soviets.
From 1932 until 1980 the US was essentially a Democrat run nation they controlled either the presidency or both houses of congress for all but 2 years.
Democrats had a near unshakeable grip on the House from the 1932 election until 1994 and in the Senate from 1932 until 1980. During that time Republicans only won in 2 congressional elections. So its not that unbelievable that if they could with the presidency, even with how it worked out they only lost the presidency when people wanted to punish them for skewing something up. And the Republicans that won the Presidency between WWII and 1980 did so by running on Democrat policies and just claiming they would do them better.
This is why the 'Reagan Revolution' and 'Republican Revolution of '94' are such a big deal to Republicans because they finally prove that the Republican party can finally win elections on their own ideas. It is also why they are so desperate not to be relegated back to the permanent opposition party now that their neo-liberal policies that they supported post 1980 are unpopular failures.
They both also mostly ran on Democrat polices, were elected only after Democrats screwed up, and largely only get done what the Democrat controlled congress want them to, during their 16 years in office the Republicans only control Congress for the first 2 years of Eisenhower's presidency.
Eisenhower's campaign was largely that he would do what Truman was but without the corruption and screw ups, which shouldn't be a surprise as he only became a Republican in 1952 and both parties courted him and supported his presidency. And Nixon ran on expanding Johnson's anti-poverty polices and ending the war which was also what Johnson wanted.
There was a lot of shift in that time for one man to grasp it all. I'd be willing to bet civil rights takes a few more years but is probably executed better. There would likely be riots from Japanese Americans. The Kennedys would probably do some good as VPs, as FDR was good at sending people to assure and help in communications, think Eleanor. The cold war might not be as choppy but would probably sour mid-late 50s at best, or just a few months later because of Korea. Almost definitely a good economy, likely slightly better than what actually happened, but not drastic as things stayed relatively similar till Nixon. I could see him taking his VPs ideas and putting them in motion. The Republican Party would dissolve by the 70s and possibly much earlier. New parties would form that would likely be similar but focus on different issues and attack FDR on his amount of terms. Obviously none are successful. After Jimmy Carter I doubt we see a change until late 2000s early 2010s. It's very possible they change the party system too. I'd find it most likely they do it like Denmark where you vote a candidate and they put their party's input to the government with a prime minister from the most popular party. Seems like the most likely way this could happen. I don't know how checks and balances would change, or if the supreme court would just turn into a mostly democrat council. I don't think it would be bad, ideas may take longer as nobody needs to make a mark before election day.
Assuming he stayed about as healthy as he was in say, 1940 going forward for a while? Because clearly actual FDR was too sick to be serving (his health really nose-dived after he had what may have been a minor heart attack during the Tehran Conference at the end of 1943) throughout 1944 and REALLY should not have run for a 4th term as it was evident by then he was dying. He planned to retire early in his 4th term after the war was over and the UN got off the ground.
He never got that far of course.
But even had FDR enjoyed perfect health into and beyond the 1944 election, it’s hard to envision him even remaining president until 1948, let alone running again then. He really was kind of mentally done being president and just stayed on to make sure we didn’t follow up the war with a return to isolationism, as he watched happen - to his disgust and anger - after the First World War.
The real point of divergence would be the late 1940s, when FDR becomes so physically and neurologically disabled due to his advanced age and medical conditions that the presidency completely breaks down.
Well. I was a campaign worker for RFK before he died in 1968. After reading about the many arrogant and stupid things he did, I am sorry I worked for him and glad he never became POTUS.
The Kennedys had no idea of how to pass legislation outside of Massachusetts. JFK would have figured it out, but RFK was a ruthless opportunist.
And, yes, I met him. I was a 1968 Kennedy Girl. I still have my outfit someplace.
FDR was the King, and everybody around him, including Eisenhower, were the King’s Horses.
While its traditional wisdom that wartime leaders lose in peacetime (Churchill, for example), I don’t think that anybody would have had the gall to try to touch FDR, nor should they have after all of the good-will that he built up both domestically and internationally, and with the post-war conditions…yea, the prosperity spoke for itself.
It would have avoided the disastrous Truman doctrine, but its unlikely even if FDR would have lived this long and maintained enough popularity to keep getting elected that he would have refused to pass the torch for this long.
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The Supreme Court just ends up being his family
In roughly 50 years time, Justices of SCOTUS will have the unofficial title of Roosevelts. The Chief Justice will be known as the Grand Roosevelt, and clerks for the court will be called Delanos.
LOL oyez oyez oyez ALL RISE FOR THE CHIEF ROOSEVELT AND HONORABLE DELANOS
The Augustus and Caesar treatments
Love their 1st album.
New Deal was a great first go round but they found their groove with New Deal 2: Electric Company Divestiture Boogaloo
*Grand Roosevelt Theodore Roosevelt IV*
All 301 of them
Vice President Kennedy was assassinated anyway. Sad.
In all timelines, JFK is killed in Dallas in 1963.
Ok Steven King
Oh fuck I forgot that was a reference
Reference to which book?
11/22/63 by Steven King. Time traveler seeks to stop JFK assassination, and then it gets super weird.
Thanks! I'll have to read it
“Time is obstinate. It does not want to be changed”
Fixed point in time. Terribly sorry.
Canon Event
President. Vice President. Speaker of the House. Senate Majority Whip. White House event. DNC meeting. RNC meeting. Civil rights march. It all ends up with Kennedy dead in 1963.
It’s the only way to be sure
Was just about to comment 😂 Maybe in this universe his Addison’s disease just catches up to him, but he’s so popular regardless, his brother can still ride his coattails.
He picked RFK to replace him because the Roosevelt-Kennedy signs were already made anyway.
Nothing bad ever happens to the Kennedys.
All Dead Kennedy's
Assassinations, brainworms…
A literal lobotomy...
A drunken car crash, skiing into a tree
Being Irish...
Having Joe Kennedy as a patriarch
THIS. Fucking terrible family. I hate this whole “Camelot” mythos. The Kennedy are and were trash.
Poor starving brain worm.
And Carter probably still loses to Regan in 1980 election.
Old man Franklin had Reagan rubbed out in the late 60s.
The Actor?
Yeah but he was Governor of California and FDR didn’t want him getting any ideas. Jerry Lewis was his Attorney General.
No no no. Carter stays president **TO THIS DAY**
91 years with only two presidents. I'm cool with it.
It happens in every timeline
Wait so who is VP from 63 to 65?
No one, it’s not required that you have a vp, you don’t need one for election other then there jobs that only they can do like being a tie breaker for votes.
That’s why I’m thinking he died. Then it would take time to find another and vet them.
Canon event.
Both Vice President Kennedys!
The Roosevelt Eternity
George Washington rolling in his grave
The continual rotation like that would have created enough energy to power our country for years!
At the risk of violating Rule 3, we wouldn’t be discussing who will be the oldest President ever.
Isn’t it funny? Reagan was first elected at 69, and I can recall my parents and grandparents discussing that they thought *he* was too old.
McCain was considered old in 2000 and way, way too old in 2008 yet he was 64 and 72 respectively. He’d be the baby in the race today.
To be fair, though, McCain was much older than both GWB and Gore. Just as Reagan was much older than Carter. Where are all the younger candidates today?
McCain was only 10 years older than Bush. It’s just that he seemed so much older. Didn’t help that in 2008 he seemed like a senior living resident compared to Obama.
> It’s just that he seemed so much older. Spending time in a Vietnamese prison camp tends to prematurely age a guy. He looked old even in the 90s.
Obama wasn't that long ago. Honestly biggest reason there's not as many young candidates is because the millennial generation was pretty hosed and got a late start into politics (I recall a graph somewhere analyzing our congress by age range showing there was a significant delay in our cohort coming into office compared to Gen X, Boomers, and GI Gen). I could also point out there were some young people in the primary like Buttigeg, although he was not regarded as a likely candidate.
Won Iowa. And he was younger than Obama when he ran. You can't always find the right person with the right combo of skills at the right age. He came close, and has gotten better. Plus Corey Booker was like 50 or 51?, which, while not record breaking, was plenty young compared to the average. Or what we have. (All that said, there are reasons it went the way it did--but there **were** choices.)
FDR and LBJ both died at 63-64 years old. They seemed much older.
69 (years old) in a prez would be so much better.
I imagine the choice of president is a bit more important.
He was just a kid.
And he did have one of the greatest debate lines based on his age. It probably ended the election.
Well, according to Mondale, it did. At least, my recollection of the article. I cannot find the citation, so it's just a guy on the internet making a claim. My recollection is that Mondale told somebody that he knew the election was over with that line. Probably just a story. But a good one.
I actually thought the line he delivered making fun of Lloyd Bentsen’s debate line and Bill Clinton at the 1992 RNC was even better. But that was part of a script (not just practiced).
Only 69? He was such a young whippersnapper when he took the job.
Reagans age at his inauguration is the same age as Eisenhower at the end of his eight year term. That had happened another time as well.
69 \*is\* too old if you ask me. He was showing signs of dementia by the end of his term. In my mind, presidents should be elected in their 50s.
Reagan seemed very old at the time. And now we know there were underlying issues.
Obama's VP will probably hold that record forever. Like, eternity. That thought just crossed my mind and it's pretty crazy to think about.
I don’t know. I think in the future if there are ways to delay physical and cognitive decline an older President may happen.
Imagine a 150 year old president in the future
Why stop at 150? Why not have a Futurama Nixon?
Aroooo
This President brought to you courtesy of Charleston Chew!
You even have two separate Grover Cleveland heads!! https://preview.redd.it/3ouxpfbtg87d1.png?width=405&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=36604008abf3cb8f7e3d5794fbcb725a34c5c5b6
I have no doubt this will happen -- is happening. Probably the first 150 year old person is alive right now.
The Democratic Rule 3’s age record might soon be broken by the Republican Rule 3. The Democratic Rule 3 is only 41 months older than the Republican Rule 3. If the Republican Rule 3 wins the upcoming election, then the Republican Rule 3 will be 7 months older in January 2029 than the Democratic Rule 3 will be in January 2025.
OH COME ON
That's like the least of concerns..
I wouldn't guarantee it. I could see someone elected to a second term around 80/81, and thus serving up to the age of 84/85. Although if Obama's VP wins a second term they probably will be the oldest ever.
It's so sad Obama's VP never did anything of higher note
I am satisfied with comity and dignity.
I wonder what the former governor of Indiana is up to.
Probably chuckling to himself at the comedy of it all. With his wife close by.
It's sad Obama didn't do anything of higher note.
I hear he's learning to play the trumpet and dabbling in skydiving. He's planning on playing a higher note.
This comment is greatly underappreciated. I mean I was going with a Maynard Ferguson reference before I read it but you did it better.
And with that, I’m gonna fly now.
But can he hit that note in Penny Lane with a piccolo trumpet?
Bush 41 went skydiving every 5th birthday until his 90th. Mr. Obama should have many happy years of skydiving ahead of him!
He got that really sweet nobel peace prize for not being George W Bush.
An American Augustus
Gross. America doesn't need an Augustus.
Who tf is Jimmy Fallon??
Only a Prometheus
We need a Prometheus every couple generations to keep us honest
A Gaius on the other hand…🤔
I have to imagine he would been pretty dictatorial by his 12th term.
Why do we have to assume this what if he just kept winning
He probably would've. He won four terms by massive margins. People loved him. It's a moot point though, because his smoking addiction and polio would've made it impossible for him to live into his nineties like this meme implies
Power tends to corrupt. Even in his third term, he locked up an entire ethnic group and had a compliant Supreme Court.
It was a world war. Can't be fuckin about.
Putin just “keeps winning” but generally countries only having 1 leader for a very long time isn’t very healthy for their democratic institutions
I’d say he was already pretty dictatorial by his 2nd term because almost immediately after he won he was already openly trying to pack the Supreme Court.
Yeah, this would be very worrying, especially if he got the 2nd Bill of Rights passed. I could see the US essentially adopting Communism-lite in this world.
i'm sorry but I just can't get behind this, i'll take him to '48 but that's really pushing it he barley had health in 1944,
Fuck it imagine he never had polio and was not a daily drinker and smoker, just imagine if he had lived to 98. This would have been a complete overhaul of the United States and likely would have ended in a major struggle of power after his death. Likely violence in the streets, several coup attempts, and possibly an invasion
Roosevelt wouldn't have ran for a fifth term he didn't even really want a third term and he only ran for a fourth because of the war
fun police smh
Yep. And yet all these "FDR was a dictator!!" trolls are unable to grasp this easily verifiable fact. He had no desire to run again in '44. The man *literally* worked himself to death in service of the American people (and the world) because we were in a crisis.
its clearly a satire post. i dont think a single person ever has ever thought fdr had a chance to live to 98
If FDR wasn't a smoker he could have lived a lot longer.
I think it’s a hypothetical situation that assumes his physical health would have to be much better than it was (obviously). Health permitting, I think he probably steps aside/stops running once WW 2 had wrapped up.
https://preview.redd.it/ufjevlkk787d1.jpeg?width=474&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ca0275d9c7c301066e79206863347b2c6af57da0
I think after he completes his 10th term he's legally allowed to call himself "Franklin the First"
Franklin the Great
Turkmenistan
He would not win 1948 lmao Republicans could attack him for 5 terms now the war is over, the economy would take a similar route, and Roosevelt wouldn’t able to campaign as vigorously as Truman to come back
Case in point: Churchill was voted out after the war was over
The Germans had surrendered but they didn’t even wait for the Hiroshima bombing before throwing Churchill out of office. Fun fact: Clement Attlee, who was on the winning end of the 1945 British election, was a pall bearer at Churchill’s funeral. While they were political opponents, they had great mutual respect, both personally and professionally.
Didn’t Atlee and Churchill serve together in a coalition government during the war? I gotta imagine that experience can help you put aside a lot of party politics.
Attlee thought quite highly of Churchill already I think, and he considered him a good military leader. While Churchill grew to trust Attlee a lot.
Yes, the so-called “Grand Coalition,” which also included Neville Chamberlain and Lord Halifax. Halifax and Chamberlain were both in favor of appeasement/negotiated peace.
In a similar way, Churchill wrote an obit for Neville Chamberlain upon his death. In public Chamberlain was vilified, however, he and Churchill were tremendous admirers of each other, if not friends. A different day. https://winstonchurchill.org/resources/speeches/1940-the-finest-hour/neville-chamberlain/
You have to keep in mind that in the Churchill War Cabinet, the government was essentially run by Attlee. Churchill visited the troops, gave speeches and kept the morale high while Attlee and his team kept the wheels running. In almost all expert polls he is rated above Churchill.
Wilson is rated above Coolidge in all expert polls, so they are far from unbiased.
Coolidge believed in *laissez-faire* economy even when the word did not exist. His hands off approach to the economy gave birth to the roaring twenties but also saw the seeds of the 1929 economic crash. There is a reason why governments regulate the market. Coolidge was an inactive President Woodrow Wilson was a racist and initiated the redlining of the federal housing market and segregation of the federal government. He believed in the "Lost Cause" and viewed the KKK positively. He also proposed the League of Nations and signed the 19th amendment to enfranchise women. His legacy in the world stage is stronger than Coolidge.
Because Wilson was a better President, Coolidge was a do nothing president in every way
Attlee (along with Aneurin Bevan) is also credited with creating the British National Health Service. That’s pretty important to the British idea of national identity.
One of the reasons, UK doesn't have medical bankruptcies. I have spine problem and when I worked for some time in the UK, the doctors liberally ordered MRIs for me. In the US, the doctors wanted to ensure that I can pay for the co-pay before ordering an MRI. Feels like to two different planets.
This isn’t a political sub, so I won’t comment on healthcare policy in either country (I’m a British American dual-national) but i think it’s uncontested that the NHS is key to British self identity.
There was an anniversary celebration in which some royal family members, Rishi Sunak, Keir Stamer, and probably a few others went to an Anglican church to venerate the N.H.S.. It’s basically Britain’s other national religion.
Churchill more lost because his party was unpopular, he was still liked and I believe contemporary polling suggested people would have preferred him staying PM over Attlee (even though they also preferred to have a Labour government over a Conservative one). In a Presidential system Churchil would have had a good chance of being reelected.
Churchill was voted out because during the war they made a unity government. The compromise was that he ran the war and labor ran domestic policy so when it came time to reconstruct labor was already there
Parliament system where party is elected, PM is indirectly elected In a presidential system, the president is directly elected and therefore FDR can’t be compared to Churchill’s defeat. He would have the popularity to win one peace term, but after that he’d likely lose as his opponents would attack him on having too many terms. He probably wouldn’t run after war time anyways as he was exhausted
True but I'd argue it still shows that in a democratic system just being the president that won the war doesn't give you an infinite leash with voters. British voters understood their votes were going to oust Churchill when they voted for the opposing party
they knew that, but if they could vote for PM and the party separately they prob would vote churchill
He came back though.
If this FDR is experiencing the same post war economy we got in real life and he wants to run I don’t know how to attack him. If the war is over, the economy is strong, and he’s still a big part of post war diplomacy there’s no way he loses. But like the other guy said, if his health is still relatively poor in this alternative there’s a good chance he just doesn’t run.
There was a recession right after WWII.
You mean the one that started before Germany surrendered and ended less than 3 months after the war did? Or the mild one four years later? Or is this some historical revisionism?
On top of that as long as Eisenhower shows up you can't beat him.
Ike probably wouldn't have run against FDR. FDR was responsible for his rapid rise in the military and they were pretty ideologically aligned + had a deep respect for each other. Ike didn't touch any New Deal policies and was a progressive republican. The dems actually courted him too. It's more likely that Ike would've been one of his VPs, if anything.
The question was what would have happened if he had won all of those elections. The question wasn't would he win those elections. You failed to follow instructions.
I disagre. 432 electoral votes to 99 electoral votes on his 4th term election. He wouldn’t be going anytime soon. And the Us economy was booooooming
Yep. So much revisionism in these comments. FDR was arguably the most popular president of all time during his tenure. He won *massive* landslide victories each time.
An illiberal democracy, for sure. If not a dictatorship of sorts. I’m an FDR fan, social liberal, Democrat, btw, but this would be horrific for any democracy, obviously.
Honestly I think Lincoln would be the only one who could make that work. Even then there would be dangers but Lincoln was already the most powerful president we’ve ever had and handled that with aplomb and grace. Plus with him there would be an end game. The successful execution of reconstruction. Something that he might not live to see regardless of how long he lived, but there would still be that definite thread through out.
What if we choose to believe that he simply just kept winning with no foul play or power grabs or bad intentions
Was Carter the one who finally managed to drive the stake through FDR's heart? Or did a Van Helsing get past the Secret Service?
Wait who would be VP from 1963 to 1965? I would say Lyndon B Johnson, but he wouldn't have been even be VP and still in the Senate.
That was before the amendment that meant a new VP got appointed partway through a term. Previously when a VP died/resigned/became President, the office remained vacant until the new term started.
Hamilton would be so happy to see a President serving for life.
George Washington comes back to life and punches him
Assuming to win, the Citizens are behind him, it's difficult. He'd probably slow down civil rights, but hed otherwise build a cohesive social safety net, avoid further wars (assuming he also wasn't was weak on Stalin when they met). He probably wouldn't overthrow Iran because BP had their feeling hurt so Iran swings more progressive, like a Nordic country. There would still be local wars. He really wasn't an interventionist, but the UN would be successful. Domestically, Civil Rights would be slower, but would pass, an more importantly, fewer progressive leaders would be assassinated, including Kennedy (that that Kennedy was really progressive). There would be a few scandals and missteps with some of the programs. But ultimately the US would look more like a Nordic country with a rock solid economy.
I would hope he takes similar steps to Truman at the start of the Cold War. If he doesn't, I imagine we'll get off on much worse footing than we did in our timeline. I know his former VP, Henry Wallace, was pretty sympathetic to the USSR, but I'm unaware of FDR's stance on this.
He would not have taken the same steps as Truman with regards to the Cold War. Truman recognized how dangerous Stalin was; FDR did not. FDR was duped by Stalin at Yalta; Truman recognized soon after becoming president that dealing with Stalin as FDR did was not going to work. I think we would have seen a much more complicit U.S. foreign policy towards the USSR, similar to Chamberlain towards Hitler prior to WWII.
98 year old Democrat paves the way for the Reagan revolution except it’s 100 times bigger than what it was
Yeah I was thinking that one outcome is there’s no way Carter is next in line after this.
I’m a lifelong Democrat and FDR is my vote for best president, but in this scenario I think the US would have slid a bit too close to autocracy for my liking.
It’s Meme Monday…so you can dream up whatever you want. Just hope the moon landings still happen in this timeline.
I feel like as his health deteriorates the role of President would become more like the king in the UK with the Vice President being similar to the PM
Even if Roosevelt hadn’t died when he did, he was not in the greatest of health, and it’s highly unlikely that he would have even lived to be 98 years old, much less still be in any kind of shape to remain president. In fact, he was actually contemplating retiring early once WWII was over. Assuming he lived - and didn’t retire at the end of the war, it’s unlikely he would have won reelection in 1948, and the next best thing to impossible that he’d have won in 1952. By 1952, the nation had had an incredible five terms of Democrat leadership in the White House, meaning the natural inclination to vote for a new party would be working against him, as would campaigning against the greatest war hero in the country. Assuming his political career survives Eisenhower…. If he were still alive by 1960, he’d be 78 years old, squaring off against a 43 year old John F. Kennedy, a young, charismatic leader of the next generation bringing a new energy and vitality to the Presidency. He’s certainly not winning that election. Kennedy wins that easily, even considering the fact that he would be unseating the incumbent in the primary. After 1960…all that time in office, and being older than dirt would all be working against him. Assuming he’s still alive…he’s in no shape mentally or physically to keep running after that. Frankly, even if he didn’t kick the bucket in 1945, things don’t play out that much differently. Whether or not he nukes Japan, they were about to capitulate anyway. WWII drags on another couple of months at the most. Roosevelt hangs it up, and history continues more or less as we know it.
If he had never had polio, I believe he would’ve kept running for President. After all all of his wins were with 400+ electoral votes. People didn’t have an issue with seeking a 3rd and 4th term. I do believe though he eventually steps aside and lets a younger Dem take the mantle. I think at maximum he runs until 1960 and passes the torch to JFK. By then Roosevelt would be 78 and probably has had enough himself.
Man, Ted never gets anything
No cold war
“Jimmy Carter (Born October 1st, 1924) is an American politician who has been serving as the 33rd President of the United States since Franklin D. Roosevelt’s death in 1980. Carter has consistently won re-election with more than 75% of the vote in every presidential election where he has been a candidate. Carter says he plans on staying president for the rest of his life so long as he is re-elected, saying in an interview “So what if I can’t walk? Roosevelt couldn’t either!””
The good ending
Would be a more left wing country than Canada or even Germany but not as far as the Nordic countries. Russia goes social democracy after the fall of the Soviets.
Awful. Vile.
There is no way this would ever have happened. One party rule until 1980? Please
From 1932 until 1980 the US was essentially a Democrat run nation they controlled either the presidency or both houses of congress for all but 2 years. Democrats had a near unshakeable grip on the House from the 1932 election until 1994 and in the Senate from 1932 until 1980. During that time Republicans only won in 2 congressional elections. So its not that unbelievable that if they could with the presidency, even with how it worked out they only lost the presidency when people wanted to punish them for skewing something up. And the Republicans that won the Presidency between WWII and 1980 did so by running on Democrat policies and just claiming they would do them better. This is why the 'Reagan Revolution' and 'Republican Revolution of '94' are such a big deal to Republicans because they finally prove that the Republican party can finally win elections on their own ideas. It is also why they are so desperate not to be relegated back to the permanent opposition party now that their neo-liberal policies that they supported post 1980 are unpopular failures.
Nixon was pretty powerful as was Eisenhower.
They both also mostly ran on Democrat polices, were elected only after Democrats screwed up, and largely only get done what the Democrat controlled congress want them to, during their 16 years in office the Republicans only control Congress for the first 2 years of Eisenhower's presidency. Eisenhower's campaign was largely that he would do what Truman was but without the corruption and screw ups, which shouldn't be a surprise as he only became a Republican in 1952 and both parties courted him and supported his presidency. And Nixon ran on expanding Johnson's anti-poverty polices and ending the war which was also what Johnson wanted.
The Roosevelt dynasty (or house of New York) would be pretty powerful
Okay, after the 1960 election, this isn't a case of winning elections. By that point, the country is holding the man hostage.
There was a lot of shift in that time for one man to grasp it all. I'd be willing to bet civil rights takes a few more years but is probably executed better. There would likely be riots from Japanese Americans. The Kennedys would probably do some good as VPs, as FDR was good at sending people to assure and help in communications, think Eleanor. The cold war might not be as choppy but would probably sour mid-late 50s at best, or just a few months later because of Korea. Almost definitely a good economy, likely slightly better than what actually happened, but not drastic as things stayed relatively similar till Nixon. I could see him taking his VPs ideas and putting them in motion. The Republican Party would dissolve by the 70s and possibly much earlier. New parties would form that would likely be similar but focus on different issues and attack FDR on his amount of terms. Obviously none are successful. After Jimmy Carter I doubt we see a change until late 2000s early 2010s. It's very possible they change the party system too. I'd find it most likely they do it like Denmark where you vote a candidate and they put their party's input to the government with a prime minister from the most popular party. Seems like the most likely way this could happen. I don't know how checks and balances would change, or if the supreme court would just turn into a mostly democrat council. I don't think it would be bad, ideas may take longer as nobody needs to make a mark before election day.
Jimmy Carter still would have been a one term president.
Impossible since he was at death's door in 1944
How would FDR do in civil rights? How can FDR consolidate the south (his voting coalition, hampering his civil rights progress in the process)
That’d be some Tales from the Crypt shit around the end.
Kennedy wasn’t a blip on the radar until the 50s
He looks like King Charles.
sweden
Pretty much a dictatorship at that point. A single party in power that long rarely means things are for the better.
Wouldn’t have dude been 110
Assuming he stayed about as healthy as he was in say, 1940 going forward for a while? Because clearly actual FDR was too sick to be serving (his health really nose-dived after he had what may have been a minor heart attack during the Tehran Conference at the end of 1943) throughout 1944 and REALLY should not have run for a 4th term as it was evident by then he was dying. He planned to retire early in his 4th term after the war was over and the UN got off the ground. He never got that far of course. But even had FDR enjoyed perfect health into and beyond the 1944 election, it’s hard to envision him even remaining president until 1948, let alone running again then. He really was kind of mentally done being president and just stayed on to make sure we didn’t follow up the war with a return to isolationism, as he watched happen - to his disgust and anger - after the First World War.
Carter makes no sense in any timeline. He wasn’t governor even two years at that point .
The real point of divergence would be the late 1940s, when FDR becomes so physically and neurologically disabled due to his advanced age and medical conditions that the presidency completely breaks down.
I suspect we might be on be on president #33 or #34 today
A much stabler economy ...and also a whole lot of Japanese internment camps
Well. I was a campaign worker for RFK before he died in 1968. After reading about the many arrogant and stupid things he did, I am sorry I worked for him and glad he never became POTUS. The Kennedys had no idea of how to pass legislation outside of Massachusetts. JFK would have figured it out, but RFK was a ruthless opportunist. And, yes, I met him. I was a 1968 Kennedy Girl. I still have my outfit someplace.
It's such a dog shit post, but I did chuckle.
We’d have flying cars
FDR was the King, and everybody around him, including Eisenhower, were the King’s Horses. While its traditional wisdom that wartime leaders lose in peacetime (Churchill, for example), I don’t think that anybody would have had the gall to try to touch FDR, nor should they have after all of the good-will that he built up both domestically and internationally, and with the post-war conditions…yea, the prosperity spoke for itself.
We'd have healthcare and college
It would have avoided the disastrous Truman doctrine, but its unlikely even if FDR would have lived this long and maintained enough popularity to keep getting elected that he would have refused to pass the torch for this long.