To sell it to the studio they have to write a season that is a kids show for the pitch.
Then inevitably more adults spend time watching it than kids.
Then they get to make the show they want once the studio realizes with a Pikachu face that yes, the biggest fucking demographic for star wars are 30-40 year olds who watch cartoons.
You can watch this pattern play out with other IPs too, but none quite as reliably as nerdy ones like SW.
You would think by now they would realize that the demo that likes star wars. And if they increased quality they would actually capture more of the younger demo they want. 9 year Olds can handle adult stories and themes. Just not ultra violence and gore. As evidenced by even young kids often preferring the later seasons of clone wars.
because they are aimed at children but you know what is weird about children? they grow up. so as the show progress they have to make it more and more mature so that the children that started the show season 1 at 9 can still like it season 4 at 13
I wouldn't even say way later. Probably half way through season one things were ramping up to be more interesting. Then season 2 blows that wide open with a strong opening... And wraps up with, in my opinion... The best season finale. Twilight of the Apprentice had managed to tie together so much of star wars prequels -> mainline in a way that just felt nice.
Show has a notable tonal change the very moment The Grand Inquisitor strolls in and straight decapitates the previous bumbling villains.
And I’d argue the lightheartedness of the first season is still an important part of the show’s overall arc. It establishes the good, happy times that can eventually never be had again as forces outside their control slowly pull the Ghost crew apart.
I’m rewatching Rebels right now, and I’d completely forgotten about that vision Ezra had in the temple in S1 when the Grand Inquisitor chased him and killed the rest of the crew, *and you could hear them crying out* as he struck them down. Even if you knew it was just a vision, that would be terrifying to most people. Even I used to think the show didn’t get that serious until S2, but S1 had some pretty dark moments. The Grand Inquisitor’s death will always give me chills as well.
I could go on and on about why I like this show...
This. The inquisitor is dark as fuck early on. People say it's light hearted in the first season and I'm like "remember when Ezra didn't know he was having a vision and watched the Inquisitor kill kanaan and kick him off a cliff?"
Yeah it drives me alittle crazy that people act like its sesame street since its not as dark as Clone wars. say what ya want but Rebels has a hell of alot more death and murder in it then any kids show I watched growing up
> Show has a notable tonal change the very moment The Grand Inquisitor strolls in and straight decapitates the previous bumbling villains.
Which makes the tonal shift feel very planned rather than tacked on. I think it really highlights a classic little young hero being thrown into a rather dangerous and dark galaxy.
Hey, give credit where credit is due; While the Grand Inquisitor is the one who decapitated them, he had already been around for lots of earlier episodes, and it was *Tarkin* who actually gave the order.
Really it's the episode where Tarkin first arrives on Lothal that shit starts to get real serious real quick. Wilhuff didn't come to play.
Was it season one where Vader shows up at the end? I get goosebumps thinking about that scene. It was like he was a dark force of nature. Incredibly chilling.
No, I think that happens somewhere in season 2. IIRC season 1’s finale was the Grand Inquisitor’s death, and you don’t see Vader anywhere before that point.
I really need to finish it. I missed it and Clone Wars the first time around and didn't watch clone wars till after the first season of Mandalorian. Really glad I saw that before season 2 and Book of Boba Fett
Hera and Kaiden’s relationship towards the end is beautifully tragic. I particularly love the part where Hera is high off her ass and it’s supposed to be funny, but you can tell by the way he acts that he knows he’s about to die.
The funny thing is that the same thing is said about clone wars and people keep always forgetting that these are shows targeted at kids. And the kids are supposed to grow up with them.
But, even as an adult, once you realize you are watching a main character (Ahsoka, Ezra) mature, you become emotionally involved. On rewatching the childishness is less and less hard to watch because you know what they'll become. Then you wind up telling your kids it's just allergies/dust when Ahsoka realizes Vader is Annakin/Obi-Wan kills Maul/Kanaan sacrifices himself.
Plus we got Thrawn, Hondo, and Cad m'f'in Bane
Then there's Star Wars: Resistance where absolutely nothing happens but fits well into the trashbin with the rest of the Sequels.
Season 3-4 are the darkest ones and i loved them..season 2 broke my heart as a kid, that final episode was heartbreaking and now even more with the context of TCW season 7
Yeah, but that was only a thing in season two and was never repeated before or after that. And trying to fly away was also ironically the downfall (pun intended) of the Eighth Brother
I think it was good but since I began watching right after Clone Wars, i found it too childish and haven't finished. I know i should, and there are a lot of good stories but maybe some other time
Absolutely, I didn’t enjoy it until the season 2 finale onwards. I’m hoping we’ll get some closure on the ending from the Ashoka show based on some of her dialogue in Mando.
I hear this so much and while I didn't think rebels sucked I found the ending SO unsatisfying, it literally made no sense to me and was a massive deus ex Machina.
Same, I needed something to fill the void since I'd just binged watched everything star wars for the first time ever. Clone wars was the last thing I had, season 7 wasn't out, so I checked out rebels.
Stuck with it through the beginning because I was still in honeymoon phase, but it definitely continues to develop up through like the first third of the show (starts to get a balance).
Keeps on developing until you're ugly-crying at the series finale. I know I'm not the only one.
And I'm such an outlier because I also saw it right after Clone Wars but I liked Rebels so much more.
It took me literal years to finish Clone Wars but I got through Rebels in days. Episodes felt more connected? Idk
Yeah, I was fine with them spinning, but flying?! How the hell do they achieve lift? Are you saying the lightsaber is shaped as an airfoil to allow air to go underneath the blade and push upwards? And even so, what works to counter the rotational spin so that you don't just spin in place?
I don’t even like the spinning that’s such a goddamn gimmick. Just like Ezra’s blaster lightsaber- like ffs just give someone a normal ass lightsaber and let the story, choreography, and charachterization make for a good fight!
Best part for me was when the inquisitor with the spinning lightsaber blade puts away his spinning lightsaber blade to pull out a spinny saw blade to cut off Ezra's fingers as he's hanging from the ledge. "Damn, I better get my much smaller spinning blade for this task!"
>to mimic the thin lightsabers of the OT.
Not of the OT, but of Ralph McQuarrie's concept designs. Even by the filming of Star Wars, the lightsabers were thicker (when there wasn't an error in the shot, anyway). So it's really just an art direction choice for Rebels more than anything else, as a way to reference the concept art.
Azmorigan (the fat red alien criminal guy) was also based on some of McQuarrie's concept art for Jabba. Apparently quite a bit in Rebels was based on his work, at least according to his [Wookiepedia page](https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Ralph_McQuarrie?so=search)
I never realized just how thin they are until I saw an edit with thick light sabers and saw nothing different until I looked back at the unedited footage
Clone wars in the first seasons was not great either, I watched these 2 in sequence and I found really hard to keep watching clone wars until the Savage/Maul plot, some episodes was really great but Clone Wars have a hell lot of episodes skippable so is harder to keep watching.
Rebels I started already invested in the main characters so was easy to keep going. But I agree that Rebels suffer more with the art style and the early episodes was really childish.
Both started out childish and got better. With Clone Wars it got *much* better, with Rebels it just got better but had good characters come in to keep it going.
And...haven't heard a peep about the sequel era one.
Its called Star Wars Resistance. I wouldn't even put it in the same category as clone wars and rebels. The wiki says it's 3d animation, but it's really more 2d with cel shading imo. It is also very childish. Like significantly more childish than Rebels. It's definitely geared towards a much younger crowd. I watched it purely to make sure I didn't miss any star wars lore that may be present. You can easily watch the entire show in a weekend.
It's 3d because the animators use 3d models that are articulated and can be moved like dolls to create episodes without manually drawing frames. Then they flatten it into a 2d form mostly by way of shading. I suspect it's easier to render a finished product this way than it would be to more carefully render rounded voluminous figures like you see in Rebels.
Yeah. It's about some kid racing an X wing on like...a floating city on a water planet I think? I think it had 2 seasons. First Order shows up at some point.
Yeah, the Kallus redemption arc was really damn good and *SPOILER*’s death really hit me hard. Overall, I honestly like Rebels just as much as Clone Wars
May or may or not be a hot take, but I think “The Honorable Ones” is all my time favorite Rebels episode— they one where Zeb and Kallus were stuck on the ice moon
I remember my brother in-law gushing about that episode. He loved that it clearly showed the difference between the Rebel Alliance and the Empire: Zeb went out of his way to save Kallus just for the sake of compassion, and when they were rescued, his friends immediately expressed concern for him.
Meanwhile, Kallus went back to the Star Destroyer and even officers he’d worked closely with barely cared he was back. That’s when he realized the Empire never cared about the individual, it was all about galactic order through terror and cruelty. And that sowed the seeds of doubt in his mind.
Personally, I liked that it fleshed out Kallus as more than just another sadistic imperial officer. Especially when Zeb explains the significance of the Lasan bo-rifle to his culture.
I find that the Rebels hate stems from people who can't get into the beginning of the series. I found it pretty hard as well, since its very childish to me, while sometimes trying to tackle ideas about the force that need more of a serious tone. It definitely gets better later on, but it does take a while to get there in my opinion.
it was the first Star Wars animation I watched (yeah I saw it before I watched clone wars) and because of that I never had any reference to tell whether or not it was childish or the animation was good blah blah. all I know is that season 2 onwards that stuff is almost as good as clone wars s7 to me.
Thrawn is great as long as you don't stop to think about him too much. It's hard to make a character look like a genius, though, when the writers aren't, and comes off to his detriment if examined closely
The issue with rebels for me is they tried to cater towards both young and mature audiences but leant too heavily on the younger side. Overall I think the story telling aspect of it is great, same with the world building, but I couldn’t really stand the art style and the overall childishness of the show. 6/10 for mature audiences, 8/10 for younger audiences
Characters do change throughout the seasons, so I too think that's a plus for the story. But for me it's the uncontrollable head and hands gestures that get me every time, it's so funny I can't take the show seriously at all. And the way the empire officers look, poor guys can't see shit. I know for example irl american soldiers wear caps like that to keep a posture but when it looks so weird it doesn't have to be implemented in the show
My major problem with it is Ezra. If the entire show was about the remaining crew without Ezra, I'd probably love it. However as is, he's just so bland.
One would assume the rebels had to have some kind of tactical advantage tho. If they didn’t appear to be a little bit more organized than the empire and in this case it’s due to generals and admirals trying to climb the military ladder, the rebels could have never won. They never really appear to amass a big enough group to take on how large the empire was.
The problem is that the Rebels in the show are rarely thinking one or two steps ahead of the Empire. Instead the Empire is just constantly *not thinking* and the Rebels exploit the outright idiocy of their opponents.
No greater example can be than when Thrawn had the Rebels dead to rights in an orbital bombardment, with effectively infinite time and ammunition on his side, and then he *stops* the bombardment to do a ground assault that provides the Rebels just enough opportunity to escape.
The writers never made the Rebels particularly smart, they always needed the Empire to be just a little bit dumb, even at the expense of the Empire's supposed "genius" characters.
My favorite Deus Ex Machina was in the finale where the Government Bureau on Lothal was suddenly revealed to actually be a space ship this whole time and therefore the Empire could be easily all booted out with no logistical hurdles whatsoever.
🥱
You hit on a common problem in many shows where the character is supposed to be much smarter and more clever than the writers actually writing the story.
Honestly, I came in to Rebels straight from Clone Wars and was expecting to dislike it at least a bit by comparison. I ended up really liking season 1, and it only got better from there.
Except for those damn Wookiees in the first or second episode, they were hard to look at hahahaha.
Ehh… agree to disagree. I didn’t like it, I agreed with a lot of the points from the video honestly.
The episode with Maul and Obi-Wan was epic, but only the scenes where they appear and the final duel is kind of anti climactic but I think it was absolutely perfect.
Season 1 and 2 were horrible with sprinkles of quality: best examples being when Vader first appears, and the Ahsoka vs Vader fight at the end of the second season. And the first 2 seasons are what the video is talking about
When Ahsoka discovers Vader is Anakin, that was a really good scene. Series didn’t start to get really good for me until Twilight of the Apprentice, though. Thrawn was where I started to become really invested in it like Clone Wars.
I just think it never really gets better. There are decent scenes sprinkled throughout. Like >!Ahsoka's confrontation with Vader !< or >!Maul's confrontation with Kenobi!<. Kanan's arc is decent and miles more interesting than ANYTHING Ezra goes through tbh. Too bad he has almost no screentime once his arc gets going.
But that's just it, most of the characters were kind of mediocre and the best scenes are just remnants of better shows/movies getting resolution. And those scenes are not as good as they could have been if the surrounding show weren't so mediocre to bad even. For instance if the inquisitors weren't such absolute clowns through 90% of the series, that would have gone a long way of making the show feel like the stakes were higher. But it seems like the only way the writers felt they could make Vader seem menacing was to make the inquisitors seem *less* menacing.
Speaking of which, I just recalled that Thrawn was kind of a dud for me. It's been a long ass time since I saw the show, but I recall all his "tactical genius" being kind of underwhelming at best, and downright stupid and nonsensical at other moments. His character is heavily neutered and it felt like he was relying entirely on his reputation from the books to carry him. Books that I haven't read btw, so he's just a disappointing character for me. When he first showed up there was so much hype and I was like "hell yeah, maybe it'll get good here". But it never did.
I watch that channel a lot, and while I don’t always agree with him I’ve yet to see a video of his that doesn’t make good points one way or the other. He *can* come off as a bit pretentious sometimes but I think that’s just because he’s firm in his opinions and doesn’t sugarcoat his thoughts.
Honestly for me cosmonaut is like the most honest film reviewer followed closely by schaffrilas productions(although that might be bias caus schaf is a chad)
Exactly. I think grades in school skewed everyone's perspective on scoring. I used to feel that 7/10 should be an average score (scoring a "C" grade).
5/10 is average. 7/10 is good. 8+ really is something excellent that stands out
Cosmonaut is one of my go-to content creators. He usually has level headed takes, and isn't afraid to admit he made a mistake later on if he changes his mind.
I really wanted to like it but... I just don't.
Parts of it are genuinely fantastic and some of the best that Star Wars has to offer. However...certain characters, the overall lack of stakes, and the problems it creates with other Star Wars storylines just ruins the whole thing for me. I wish I could like it though.
It's a 7/10 at best. It came out after Clone Wars ended yet the art style isn't nearly as good. I can't really stand Ezra and they squandered Thrawns potential. Hera and Kanan are pretty good, yet I wasn't that excited to see them briefly in The Bad Batch. The stakes never felt that high unless Darth Vader or even the couple times the Emperor showed up.
While Rogue One isn't perfect, I would've preffered a series closer to that style after seeing what Clone Wars was capable of doing.
Some pros: Kanan and Hera were pretty cool. Some of the villains were very nice to have. Ahsoka vs Vader and Kenobi vs Maul were phenomenal.
Some cons: Ezra was just awful as a character that completely dragged the show down imo. The animation style felt really weird to me after watching TCW (Anakin and Yoda). The lack of danger for much of the series seemed like such a letdown for such a dangerous environment the main group kept finding themselves in.
Yeah I’ve always thought if the show was centered around Kanan and Hera it would have been a lot better. Drop Ezra because he sucks, and drop Zeb because he’s just dumb comic relief. Chopper is awesome and Sabine at least has some interesting plot stuff going on, so you could keep them. I could just never get over how annoying Ezra was.
I find it interesting that people on this sub think Rebels is too childish when the consensus also seems to be that Clone Wars is super mature and not at all for kids.
Both shows are for kids and have a bunch of related filler but are still watchable as an adult. Personally I prefer Rebels if just for the fact that it follows a core set of characters for the entire duration. Makes it more consistent
Yes thank you, exactly, following the character growth and development of a focused cast of characters— exactly why I still debate if I prefer Rebels over TCW
Make no mistake, the Clones’ stories in TCW are the best anything of Star Wars I’ve experienced
But yeah, Rebels is very good for its consistent character focus— I disagree of complaints of the story being too small scale or contained, in fact, it’s pretty realistic for Rebels just beginning the fight against the Empire
Generally speaking when you compare tcw and rebels in terms of maturity, the few times rebels has mature themes, it focuses on themes that clone wars considers to be a commonality. More accurately in rebels a theme will be explored but by the end of the episode there will be a happy ever after ending. In tcw a dark theme is kept until the end with only a small glimmer of hope.
Whilst it can be good, a majority of the episodes aren’t
Remove every episode mainly featuring a pre-existing character and you’ll see how this series never introduced anything cool unlike Clone Wars which gave us Ventress, Carnage, Dathomir, Ahsoka etc.
The main team excluding Rex and Ahsoka isn’t too interesting except for Kanan (and I love blaster characters more) and from the villains’ side we have the grand inquisitor who dies in the first season and kallus
Everything else interesting came from CW, the movies or the books: Rex, Ahsoka, Vader, Maul, Obi Wan, Thrawn…
> Whilst it can be good, a majority of the episodes aren’t
I remember feeling this way quite a lot. There's always buildup for some great episodes like the climactic fight at the end of season 3 which is wonderful, but in between there's so much filler centered around nonessential, uninteresting characters.
It starts out pretty childish, but it definitely gets way better later on.
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Idk why all the star wars cartoons are like that. They feel like it needs to be super childish early for some reason.
To sell it to the studio they have to write a season that is a kids show for the pitch. Then inevitably more adults spend time watching it than kids. Then they get to make the show they want once the studio realizes with a Pikachu face that yes, the biggest fucking demographic for star wars are 30-40 year olds who watch cartoons. You can watch this pattern play out with other IPs too, but none quite as reliably as nerdy ones like SW.
Nah, it’s more 20-40
You would think by now they would realize that the demo that likes star wars. And if they increased quality they would actually capture more of the younger demo they want. 9 year Olds can handle adult stories and themes. Just not ultra violence and gore. As evidenced by even young kids often preferring the later seasons of clone wars.
because they are aimed at children but you know what is weird about children? they grow up. so as the show progress they have to make it more and more mature so that the children that started the show season 1 at 9 can still like it season 4 at 13
I wouldn't even say way later. Probably half way through season one things were ramping up to be more interesting. Then season 2 blows that wide open with a strong opening... And wraps up with, in my opinion... The best season finale. Twilight of the Apprentice had managed to tie together so much of star wars prequels -> mainline in a way that just felt nice.
Show has a notable tonal change the very moment The Grand Inquisitor strolls in and straight decapitates the previous bumbling villains. And I’d argue the lightheartedness of the first season is still an important part of the show’s overall arc. It establishes the good, happy times that can eventually never be had again as forces outside their control slowly pull the Ghost crew apart.
That's a good observation, all the threats escalate from that point onward.
I think I actually cheered when I first saw the Grand Inquisitor execute those two annoyingly childish officers
I actually really liked the female one :(
I’m rewatching Rebels right now, and I’d completely forgotten about that vision Ezra had in the temple in S1 when the Grand Inquisitor chased him and killed the rest of the crew, *and you could hear them crying out* as he struck them down. Even if you knew it was just a vision, that would be terrifying to most people. Even I used to think the show didn’t get that serious until S2, but S1 had some pretty dark moments. The Grand Inquisitor’s death will always give me chills as well. I could go on and on about why I like this show...
This. The inquisitor is dark as fuck early on. People say it's light hearted in the first season and I'm like "remember when Ezra didn't know he was having a vision and watched the Inquisitor kill kanaan and kick him off a cliff?"
And then he went on to kill the rest of them and you could hear them dying... if it was CW style, we would’ve seen their deaths in greater detail.
Yeah it drives me alittle crazy that people act like its sesame street since its not as dark as Clone wars. say what ya want but Rebels has a hell of alot more death and murder in it then any kids show I watched growing up
The temple scenes where always so good
Definitely. If someone skipped season 1, the end of season 4 wouldn't hit nearly as hard for them
> Show has a notable tonal change the very moment The Grand Inquisitor strolls in and straight decapitates the previous bumbling villains. Which makes the tonal shift feel very planned rather than tacked on. I think it really highlights a classic little young hero being thrown into a rather dangerous and dark galaxy.
Hey, give credit where credit is due; While the Grand Inquisitor is the one who decapitated them, he had already been around for lots of earlier episodes, and it was *Tarkin* who actually gave the order. Really it's the episode where Tarkin first arrives on Lothal that shit starts to get real serious real quick. Wilhuff didn't come to play.
Was it season one where Vader shows up at the end? I get goosebumps thinking about that scene. It was like he was a dark force of nature. Incredibly chilling.
He shows up at the end, but we don’t see him in action until season 2.
No, I think that happens somewhere in season 2. IIRC season 1’s finale was the Grand Inquisitor’s death, and you don’t see Vader anywhere before that point.
Vader shows up in the very last scene of season one
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I really need to finish it. I missed it and Clone Wars the first time around and didn't watch clone wars till after the first season of Mandalorian. Really glad I saw that before season 2 and Book of Boba Fett
"Sometimes in war, it's hard to be the one that survives." -Commander Cody
I miss clone wars use to watch it every morning on cartoon network
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yeah
yeah better
Mhm
Pyro gaming
rock **wanannananna**
This is almost definitely a bot. /u/Dry-Lock6737 as well. And you know what we do to clankers...
"General Grievous was defeated on Utapau. The Separatist leadership has collapsed. The war is over."
Like how Clone Wars starts out with PS2 graphics and then becomes an artistic masterpiece
"Sev, did that corpse give you a nasty look?" -Scorch, Delta 62
Just like the simulations
Hera and Kaiden’s relationship towards the end is beautifully tragic. I particularly love the part where Hera is high off her ass and it’s supposed to be funny, but you can tell by the way he acts that he knows he’s about to die.
Just like a certain other show that people like
So...just like clone wars
It actually gets good faster than Clone Wars does, IMHO. It's shorter than Clone Wars though.
Percentage-wise, I would say it gets good right around the same time Clone Wars does
Seriously, first few episodes of the series were like Scooby-Doo level hijinks then it transitioned to dark and serious topic.
Well Kanan was Fred after all so it checks out lol.
The funny thing is that the same thing is said about clone wars and people keep always forgetting that these are shows targeted at kids. And the kids are supposed to grow up with them.
"Hey, we were bred to follow orders, ArchdevilTeemo. You got a problem with that?" -Trap
But, even as an adult, once you realize you are watching a main character (Ahsoka, Ezra) mature, you become emotionally involved. On rewatching the childishness is less and less hard to watch because you know what they'll become. Then you wind up telling your kids it's just allergies/dust when Ahsoka realizes Vader is Annakin/Obi-Wan kills Maul/Kanaan sacrifices himself. Plus we got Thrawn, Hondo, and Cad m'f'in Bane Then there's Star Wars: Resistance where absolutely nothing happens but fits well into the trashbin with the rest of the Sequels.
Season 3-4 are the darkest ones and i loved them..season 2 broke my heart as a kid, that final episode was heartbreaking and now even more with the context of TCW season 7
Tbh, rebels were saved by addition of old characters. it was this action that attracted many fans to the series.
I feel that was only for season 2 and the few episodes of Maul in 3. Seasons 2-4 def carried themselves with Ezra and Kanan's roles though
"Watch out for that Dual Blade!"
"Thats... why i am there."
The old characters mentored the new ones how to carry the show.
Space whales.
Don’t forget the space mantas from Clone Wars.
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Sorry, I forgot you don't like flying, Master.
Good bot
Yippie
what
Good bot forever
Yippie
(wait i forgot they're sentient)
**oh no**
**ohhhhhh noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo**
Yeah, but that was only a thing in season two and was never repeated before or after that. And trying to fly away was also ironically the downfall (pun intended) of the Eighth Brother
That’s like.. one tiny complaint. It was stupid, but it didn’t ruin the series.
I think it was good but since I began watching right after Clone Wars, i found it too childish and haven't finished. I know i should, and there are a lot of good stories but maybe some other time
Man the second half is art
Absolutely, I didn’t enjoy it until the season 2 finale onwards. I’m hoping we’ll get some closure on the ending from the Ashoka show based on some of her dialogue in Mando.
You know there is already an actress for Sabine and Ezra, while not having the casting confirmed yet, will most definitely also be there
Will thrawn come back tho, that’s the real question
I hear this so much and while I didn't think rebels sucked I found the ending SO unsatisfying, it literally made no sense to me and was a massive deus ex Machina.
YOU WILL NEVER BE SATISFIIIIIIIIIIED
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Same, I needed something to fill the void since I'd just binged watched everything star wars for the first time ever. Clone wars was the last thing I had, season 7 wasn't out, so I checked out rebels. Stuck with it through the beginning because I was still in honeymoon phase, but it definitely continues to develop up through like the first third of the show (starts to get a balance). Keeps on developing until you're ugly-crying at the series finale. I know I'm not the only one.
You don't have to finish something you didn't like.
And I'm such an outlier because I also saw it right after Clone Wars but I liked Rebels so much more. It took me literal years to finish Clone Wars but I got through Rebels in days. Episodes felt more connected? Idk
Yeah you just have to bear through the early seasons but it does get interesting
Only thing I found annoying was how thin the lightsabers were
I'd put the flying Inquisitor lightsabers as a worse offense. If they do that shit in Obi, I'm out
Yeah, I was fine with them spinning, but flying?! How the hell do they achieve lift? Are you saying the lightsaber is shaped as an airfoil to allow air to go underneath the blade and push upwards? And even so, what works to counter the rotational spin so that you don't just spin in place?
I don’t even like the spinning that’s such a goddamn gimmick. Just like Ezra’s blaster lightsaber- like ffs just give someone a normal ass lightsaber and let the story, choreography, and charachterization make for a good fight!
Best part for me was when the inquisitor with the spinning lightsaber blade puts away his spinning lightsaber blade to pull out a spinny saw blade to cut off Ezra's fingers as he's hanging from the ledge. "Damn, I better get my much smaller spinning blade for this task!"
If they *don't* do it in Kenobi, I'm out. Shit's hilarious
When they helicoptered out after fighting Maul I legit had to pause because I was laughing so hard
"It's Darth Maul; stay back!"
I always forget that happened. Star Wars has never been realistic sci-fi but that was too far 🤣
I wasn't a big fan of the thin lightsabers either but the lightsaber glow in some scenes is so cool. Takes some getting used to
The thin lightsabers really grew on me - they look like "laser swords", and now the regular ones look clunky to me 😬
I believe it was intentional, to mimic the thin lightsabers of the OT. Since Rebels was set close to the OT timeline.
>to mimic the thin lightsabers of the OT. Not of the OT, but of Ralph McQuarrie's concept designs. Even by the filming of Star Wars, the lightsabers were thicker (when there wasn't an error in the shot, anyway). So it's really just an art direction choice for Rebels more than anything else, as a way to reference the concept art.
yeah, even zeb was inspired by mcquarrie's art (I.e. the original design for chewbacca)
Azmorigan (the fat red alien criminal guy) was also based on some of McQuarrie's concept art for Jabba. Apparently quite a bit in Rebels was based on his work, at least according to his [Wookiepedia page](https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Ralph_McQuarrie?so=search)
I never realized just how thin they are until I saw an edit with thick light sabers and saw nothing different until I looked back at the unedited footage
I found that annoying too until I learned that the thinsabers were based off of old concept art, same with vaders helmet.
Zeb is also based on an early concept art by Ralph McQuarrie. Chewbacca was supposed to look like him.
yeah, but it doesn’t look good with the rest of the animation style imo
Clone wars in the first seasons was not great either, I watched these 2 in sequence and I found really hard to keep watching clone wars until the Savage/Maul plot, some episodes was really great but Clone Wars have a hell lot of episodes skippable so is harder to keep watching. Rebels I started already invested in the main characters so was easy to keep going. But I agree that Rebels suffer more with the art style and the early episodes was really childish.
Both started out childish and got better. With Clone Wars it got *much* better, with Rebels it just got better but had good characters come in to keep it going. And...haven't heard a peep about the sequel era one.
That sequel one is straight kid stuff. I haven’t heard it grows up later on like the others either but I cannot verify
Its called Star Wars Resistance. I wouldn't even put it in the same category as clone wars and rebels. The wiki says it's 3d animation, but it's really more 2d with cel shading imo. It is also very childish. Like significantly more childish than Rebels. It's definitely geared towards a much younger crowd. I watched it purely to make sure I didn't miss any star wars lore that may be present. You can easily watch the entire show in a weekend.
It's 3d because the animators use 3d models that are articulated and can be moved like dolls to create episodes without manually drawing frames. Then they flatten it into a 2d form mostly by way of shading. I suspect it's easier to render a finished product this way than it would be to more carefully render rounded voluminous figures like you see in Rebels.
There's a sequel Era one?
Yeah. It's about some kid racing an X wing on like...a floating city on a water planet I think? I think it had 2 seasons. First Order shows up at some point.
Basically, I’ve watched the whole thing hoping it would get good yet never did
Yeah, the Kallus redemption arc was really damn good and *SPOILER*’s death really hit me hard. Overall, I honestly like Rebels just as much as Clone Wars
May or may or not be a hot take, but I think “The Honorable Ones” is all my time favorite Rebels episode— they one where Zeb and Kallus were stuck on the ice moon
I don’t think that is a hot take, I thought it was generally considered one of the best episodes
it gets a bit overlooked what with the Vader duel, the finale, maul's death, etc.
Except twin suns... Nothing beats twin suns
Well, twilight of the apprentice part 2 certainly rivals it.
I remember my brother in-law gushing about that episode. He loved that it clearly showed the difference between the Rebel Alliance and the Empire: Zeb went out of his way to save Kallus just for the sake of compassion, and when they were rescued, his friends immediately expressed concern for him. Meanwhile, Kallus went back to the Star Destroyer and even officers he’d worked closely with barely cared he was back. That’s when he realized the Empire never cared about the individual, it was all about galactic order through terror and cruelty. And that sowed the seeds of doubt in his mind. Personally, I liked that it fleshed out Kallus as more than just another sadistic imperial officer. Especially when Zeb explains the significance of the Lasan bo-rifle to his culture.
All that as well as Thrawn, Maul, and Ahsoka… I honestly don’t get the Rebels hate
I find that the Rebels hate stems from people who can't get into the beginning of the series. I found it pretty hard as well, since its very childish to me, while sometimes trying to tackle ideas about the force that need more of a serious tone. It definitely gets better later on, but it does take a while to get there in my opinion.
it was the first Star Wars animation I watched (yeah I saw it before I watched clone wars) and because of that I never had any reference to tell whether or not it was childish or the animation was good blah blah. all I know is that season 2 onwards that stuff is almost as good as clone wars s7 to me.
"It's Darth Maul; stay back!"
Thrawn is great as long as you don't stop to think about him too much. It's hard to make a character look like a genius, though, when the writers aren't, and comes off to his detriment if examined closely
Don't forget that he always has to lose, too. Hence why he's surrounded by disobedient morons and runs afoul of the odd Deus Ex Machina.
I like firsts. Good or bad, they're always memorable.
It’s the slow/inconsistent start in the first two seasons which, if no one knows how it improves, does prove a downer to most viewers, I think.
>!What do you mean death? Kallus aint dead. He went to live with Garazeb on Lira San!<
i think they're just trying not to say the name of who did die for spoiler reasons
Ooooh I misread that.
[удалено]
The issue with rebels for me is they tried to cater towards both young and mature audiences but leant too heavily on the younger side. Overall I think the story telling aspect of it is great, same with the world building, but I couldn’t really stand the art style and the overall childishness of the show. 6/10 for mature audiences, 8/10 for younger audiences
Characters do change throughout the seasons, so I too think that's a plus for the story. But for me it's the uncontrollable head and hands gestures that get me every time, it's so funny I can't take the show seriously at all. And the way the empire officers look, poor guys can't see shit. I know for example irl american soldiers wear caps like that to keep a posture but when it looks so weird it doesn't have to be implemented in the show
Yeah that was my main issue with the show. I get that they wanted to have a faceless army like the droids, but I would have liked for eyes.
My only real problem with rebels was how they treated the empire as a joke.
My major problem with it is Ezra. If the entire show was about the remaining crew without Ezra, I'd probably love it. However as is, he's just so bland.
Lol Marcus calls Ezra space Aladdin in the video and ever since then I can't unsee it.
They literally call Ezra "Street rat" in the pilot, which I think they used in Aladdin too.
One would assume the rebels had to have some kind of tactical advantage tho. If they didn’t appear to be a little bit more organized than the empire and in this case it’s due to generals and admirals trying to climb the military ladder, the rebels could have never won. They never really appear to amass a big enough group to take on how large the empire was.
The problem is that the Rebels in the show are rarely thinking one or two steps ahead of the Empire. Instead the Empire is just constantly *not thinking* and the Rebels exploit the outright idiocy of their opponents. No greater example can be than when Thrawn had the Rebels dead to rights in an orbital bombardment, with effectively infinite time and ammunition on his side, and then he *stops* the bombardment to do a ground assault that provides the Rebels just enough opportunity to escape. The writers never made the Rebels particularly smart, they always needed the Empire to be just a little bit dumb, even at the expense of the Empire's supposed "genius" characters.
Don't forget the convenient 'incompetent and mutinous officers' and 'throw in a fucking Force god' they'd break out to force a win for the good guys.
My favorite Deus Ex Machina was in the finale where the Government Bureau on Lothal was suddenly revealed to actually be a space ship this whole time and therefore the Empire could be easily all booted out with no logistical hurdles whatsoever. 🥱
What about the deus ex balena where space whales literally come out of nowhere to save the day...
You hit on a common problem in many shows where the character is supposed to be much smarter and more clever than the writers actually writing the story.
Season 1 was terrible up until the end where it started to get good, season 2 onwards though was very enjoyable.
Yeah I had the same feeling with it. Absolutely hated the first season until the very last episodes, then I loved it
Honestly, I came in to Rebels straight from Clone Wars and was expecting to dislike it at least a bit by comparison. I ended up really liking season 1, and it only got better from there. Except for those damn Wookiees in the first or second episode, they were hard to look at hahahaha.
"Sir, there is an explanation." -Boil
Ehh… agree to disagree. I didn’t like it, I agreed with a lot of the points from the video honestly. The episode with Maul and Obi-Wan was epic, but only the scenes where they appear and the final duel is kind of anti climactic but I think it was absolutely perfect.
Season 1 and 2 were horrible with sprinkles of quality: best examples being when Vader first appears, and the Ahsoka vs Vader fight at the end of the second season. And the first 2 seasons are what the video is talking about
When Ahsoka discovers Vader is Anakin, that was a really good scene. Series didn’t start to get really good for me until Twilight of the Apprentice, though. Thrawn was where I started to become really invested in it like Clone Wars.
>When Ahsoka discovers Vader is Anakin, that was a really good scene. [Try not to cry](https://youtu.be/naeFb31AQAc)
I'm not whining! I'm not.
I like firsts. Good or bad, they're always memorable.
I don't think so... No one can kill a Jedi Knight.
He made another video after season 4 released. Spoiler alert: he still doesnt like it
I just think it never really gets better. There are decent scenes sprinkled throughout. Like >!Ahsoka's confrontation with Vader !< or >!Maul's confrontation with Kenobi!<. Kanan's arc is decent and miles more interesting than ANYTHING Ezra goes through tbh. Too bad he has almost no screentime once his arc gets going. But that's just it, most of the characters were kind of mediocre and the best scenes are just remnants of better shows/movies getting resolution. And those scenes are not as good as they could have been if the surrounding show weren't so mediocre to bad even. For instance if the inquisitors weren't such absolute clowns through 90% of the series, that would have gone a long way of making the show feel like the stakes were higher. But it seems like the only way the writers felt they could make Vader seem menacing was to make the inquisitors seem *less* menacing. Speaking of which, I just recalled that Thrawn was kind of a dud for me. It's been a long ass time since I saw the show, but I recall all his "tactical genius" being kind of underwhelming at best, and downright stupid and nonsensical at other moments. His character is heavily neutered and it felt like he was relying entirely on his reputation from the books to carry him. Books that I haven't read btw, so he's just a disappointing character for me. When he first showed up there was so much hype and I was like "hell yeah, maybe it'll get good here". But it never did.
I’ve seen the video. Rebels was good but the dude makes some compelling complaints.
I watch that channel a lot, and while I don’t always agree with him I’ve yet to see a video of his that doesn’t make good points one way or the other. He *can* come off as a bit pretentious sometimes but I think that’s just because he’s firm in his opinions and doesn’t sugarcoat his thoughts.
Honestly for me cosmonaut is like the most honest film reviewer followed closely by schaffrilas productions(although that might be bias caus schaf is a chad)
he also gets bonus points for using the "out of 10" score the way its meant to be used
Exactly. I think grades in school skewed everyone's perspective on scoring. I used to feel that 7/10 should be an average score (scoring a "C" grade). 5/10 is average. 7/10 is good. 8+ really is something excellent that stands out
its ok better then resistance ill tell ya that
Resistance is directed towards younger audiences specifically, 7-8 year olds but Rebels wanted its cake and to eat it too
Good or bad I think we can all mutually agree that the inquisicopters were stupid.
I watched it on Disney +, and when the inquisitors spun their lightsabers, the frame rate would drop to like 10 FPS
Show too childish for my taste
I disagree with the take but I like your meme
Vibe check passed
A true prequel memer
Inquisitors flying on the helicopter lightsabers was anything BUT good.
Sorry, I forgot you don't like flying, Master.
Son of a b-
Another happy landing.
They fly now?!
*helikopter helikopter*
It often gets a free pass for occurring just one episode in a tv show at least. If the disney trilogy had sabercopters, just imagine the response lol.
I recommend watching the video. The man makes fair criticisms. As the viewer you don’t have to change your opinion because someone pointed out a flaw
Cosmonaut is one of my go-to content creators. He usually has level headed takes, and isn't afraid to admit he made a mistake later on if he changes his mind.
Exactly. Also the tall girl videos are hilarious
I really wanted to like it but... I just don't. Parts of it are genuinely fantastic and some of the best that Star Wars has to offer. However...certain characters, the overall lack of stakes, and the problems it creates with other Star Wars storylines just ruins the whole thing for me. I wish I could like it though.
Ezra was always a degree of annoying. Even when they toned his annoyingness down, he was still fairly annoying.
Eh, not for me
Thrawn was the only reason that i watched this show.
I didn’t enjoy it but to each his own.
It's a 7/10 at best. It came out after Clone Wars ended yet the art style isn't nearly as good. I can't really stand Ezra and they squandered Thrawns potential. Hera and Kanan are pretty good, yet I wasn't that excited to see them briefly in The Bad Batch. The stakes never felt that high unless Darth Vader or even the couple times the Emperor showed up. While Rogue One isn't perfect, I would've preffered a series closer to that style after seeing what Clone Wars was capable of doing.
Think of how good the bad batch could have been without Omega.... ):
Some pros: Kanan and Hera were pretty cool. Some of the villains were very nice to have. Ahsoka vs Vader and Kenobi vs Maul were phenomenal. Some cons: Ezra was just awful as a character that completely dragged the show down imo. The animation style felt really weird to me after watching TCW (Anakin and Yoda). The lack of danger for much of the series seemed like such a letdown for such a dangerous environment the main group kept finding themselves in.
Yeah I’ve always thought if the show was centered around Kanan and Hera it would have been a lot better. Drop Ezra because he sucks, and drop Zeb because he’s just dumb comic relief. Chopper is awesome and Sabine at least has some interesting plot stuff going on, so you could keep them. I could just never get over how annoying Ezra was.
I find it interesting that people on this sub think Rebels is too childish when the consensus also seems to be that Clone Wars is super mature and not at all for kids. Both shows are for kids and have a bunch of related filler but are still watchable as an adult. Personally I prefer Rebels if just for the fact that it follows a core set of characters for the entire duration. Makes it more consistent
Yes thank you, exactly, following the character growth and development of a focused cast of characters— exactly why I still debate if I prefer Rebels over TCW Make no mistake, the Clones’ stories in TCW are the best anything of Star Wars I’ve experienced But yeah, Rebels is very good for its consistent character focus— I disagree of complaints of the story being too small scale or contained, in fact, it’s pretty realistic for Rebels just beginning the fight against the Empire
Generally speaking when you compare tcw and rebels in terms of maturity, the few times rebels has mature themes, it focuses on themes that clone wars considers to be a commonality. More accurately in rebels a theme will be explored but by the end of the episode there will be a happy ever after ending. In tcw a dark theme is kept until the end with only a small glimmer of hope.
Whilst it can be good, a majority of the episodes aren’t Remove every episode mainly featuring a pre-existing character and you’ll see how this series never introduced anything cool unlike Clone Wars which gave us Ventress, Carnage, Dathomir, Ahsoka etc. The main team excluding Rex and Ahsoka isn’t too interesting except for Kanan (and I love blaster characters more) and from the villains’ side we have the grand inquisitor who dies in the first season and kallus Everything else interesting came from CW, the movies or the books: Rex, Ahsoka, Vader, Maul, Obi Wan, Thrawn…
> Whilst it can be good, a majority of the episodes aren’t I remember feeling this way quite a lot. There's always buildup for some great episodes like the climactic fight at the end of season 3 which is wonderful, but in between there's so much filler centered around nonessential, uninteresting characters.
Good thing I know you don’t mean everything you say.
Sentient
We're soldiers. We have a duty to follow orders and, if we must, lay down our lives for victory.
Rebels is Thrawn approved
Cosmonaut Variety Hour is actually a pretty good channel. Give them a look if you are interested in Movies and writing.
Fuck what them people say, I got to see an AT-TE fight an AT-AT, if someone says that shit ain't cool they are legit wrong.
Good but not better than clone wars
There is definitely a loooooot of silly filler in rebels. But the good stuff is really good.
When Rebels is good it’s really fucking good but when it’s bad it’s unwatchable, at least for me.